Natalee Case Discussion #714 1/20 - 1/25/08

[Nut44x4]

I know nothing about Charles Croes, other than the info posted in the media.
He owns a cell phone company that services the island.
He met with Beth upon arriving on the island, at a gas station.
Etc...

My personal opinion is that he is not completely above board.  There is something about him that leads me to believe that he (a) is shady, (b) made sure he stayed out of the limelight at all times, (c) has more information than he is willing to acknowledge, and (d) is a double agent for sloots and has always placed their interest over that of family looking for their daughter.

Does anyone else feel the same way OR am I way off base with these thoughts???

             

Yes....he is in this up to his eyeballs. He is one of the disinformants.

[Tamikosmom]

I don't get this.
No surprise that Aruban LE didn't do their job and interview Eric Williams.
They didn't do a lot of things they  should have.

But what became of Eric Williams?, Why didn't he stand up with Beth?
He was there. Why wait to be asked?

Starr ... I ask myself the very same questions.

Jug and Beth's contentions regarding what what was said and done that morning were disputed by Paulus van der Sloot ... were disputed in the statements of ALE police who were present at the VDS' that morning and ... were undermine by the internet trolls.

Starr ... a statement from an FBI DEA would have upheld the words of the mother and stepfather of Natalee Holloway and ... saved them so much anguish ... so much frustration.

Eric Williams?  Something is not right!

Janet

+++++++++


Beth Holloway
LOVING NATALEE

Page 55
Last night's meeting with the DEA agent would be the last time we would see him.


Beth Holloway
LOVING NATLEE

Page 188
Earlier we learned from the prosecutor that the statements from the two uniformed officers who were with us in the van der Sloot front yard that morning don't mention the sexual encounters described by Joran between Natalee and him.  No mention of his sexual contact with her as she was falling asleep and waking up.  No mention of his description of her underwear and genitalia.  So the judge never heard about all that.  There's no way a police officer could stand there that morning, hear what Joran was sayng, and fail to include these details in a statement.  No way.  In my opinion ths information must have been deleted for the officers.


Paulus van der Sloot
NOVA - JEROEN PAUW
June 28, 2005

VAN DER SLOOT: … During the apprehension I was told that I was suspected of complicity to murder manslaughter and usurpatory freedom spoliation (kidnapping). During the session with the judge, it was told that the suspicion originated, because that Monday night, when so many people were standing there in front of the door, I allegedly declared that at four o'clock, I picked up Joran. And someone else, allegedly declared that I picked up Joran and Natalee, while my own declaration was, directed at police officers, that I picked up Joran at eleven o'clock at the McDonald's. That is, of course remarkable that the public prosecutor's office adds two witness statements of people who were standing somewhere in the back, and not the witness declaration from the police officers, where I direct myself to, and directed myself to, as much as possible.


Beth Twitty, The News-Circus And The Natalee Holloway Case
By Peter van der Vliet
Oct. 12, 2005
http://www.useless-knowledge.com/1234/oct/article161.html

But my biggest disbelieve is the story they are telling about the first night, she and her husband Jug claim that Joran took Jug to the side that first night and told him all about what he and Natalee had done the night before, even about the sex etc. Now I may have some faith in some of her claims but this one is totally unbelievable in my eyes. Why would Joran take the father (stepfather but who cares) to the side and confess things he didn't even confess too in hours of intense questioning by gangs of police officers in 12 or 13 hour sessions of questioning?? I am sorry but what Beth, Jug and their friends are claiming was said during that first night, I don't put much stock in their stories/ declarations.http://www.useless-knowledge.com/1234/oct/article161.html

[Anna]

I need to just look through all the articles at Freebirds.  They always seem a compilation of what all of us have gleaned.  May have missed other important ones.  Very good site for resource on this investigation and its failure.

I urge everyone to check out this site often and also their archives for some of the best coverage of this tragedy.

http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/

.

Anna - FYI, all of the Freebirds posts are posted X3 here at SM.  I post them in this thread, in this forum in a Corruption and Collusion thread and in the Important Case Document area in the Corruption and Collusion thread. 

Well, sorry Klaas.  Believe it or not, I still manage to miss an article on occassion.  Was just putting in a plug for the Freebirds and the fine job I think they do and also for all the new posters to find their archives.

Please feel free to delete my post.

.

[dennisintn]

Beth Twitty, The News-Circus And The Natalee Holloway Case
By Peter van der Vliet
Oct. 12, 2005
http://www.useless-knowledge.com/1234/oct/article161.html

But my biggest disbelieve is the story they are telling about the first night, she and her husband Jug claim that Joran took Jug to the side that first night and told him all about what he and Natalee had done the night before, even about the sex etc. Now I may have some faith in some of her claims but this one is totally unbelievable in my eyes. Why would Joran take the father (stepfather but who cares) to the side and confess things he didn't even confess too in hours of intense questioning by gangs of police officers in 12 or 13 hour sessions of questioning?? I am sorry but what Beth, Jug and their friends are claiming was said during that first night, I don't put much stock in their stories/ declarations.http://www.useless-knowledge.com/1234/oct/article161.html

[/quote]
i don't have time to look it up, but i don't remember it being jug that jvds took aside and told this stuff to.
dennisintn

[Starr]

Am I correct in remembering that Beth did not get out of the car at Sloots house?

Its been far too long, I just can't  remember everything  anymore

[klaasend]

I need to just look through all the articles at Freebirds.  They always seem a compilation of what all of us have gleaned.  May have missed other important ones.  Very good site for resource on this investigation and its failure.

I urge everyone to check out this site often and also their archives for some of the best coverage of this tragedy.

http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/

.

Anna - FYI, all of the Freebirds posts are posted X3 here at SM.  I post them in this thread, in this forum in a Corruption and Collusion thread and in the Important Case Document area in the Corruption and Collusion thread. 

Well, sorry Klaas.  Believe it or not, I still manage to miss an article on occassion.  Was just putting in a plug for the Freebirds and the fine job I think they do and also for all the new posters to find their archives.

Please feel free to delete my post.

.

Don't be sorry.  I agree with you that Freebirds do an excellent job and that's why I post it so many times here at SM.  That's also why I've created a couple of videos using their publications.  Actually, if I can find the right music I may do a video for this most recent Freebird post as well.

Freebirds ROCK!

[klaasend]

Am I correct in remembering that Beth did not get out of the car at Sloots house?

Its been far too long, I just can't  remember everything  anymore

From what I understand she was TOLD to stay in the car.

[Starr]

Am I correct in remembering that Beth did not get out of the car at Sloots house?

Its been far too long, I just can't  remember everything  anymore

From what I understand she was TOLD to stay in the car.

Thats how i remember it. TY

[Tamikosmom]

I know nothing about Charles Croes, other than the info posted in the media.
He owns a cell phone company that services the island.
He met with Beth upon arriving on the island, at a gas station.
Etc...

My personal opinion is that he is not completely above board.  There is something about him that leads me to believe that he (a) is shady, (b) made sure he stayed out of the limelight at all times, (c) has more information than he is willing to acknowledge, and (d) is a double agent for sloots and has always placed their interest over that of family looking for their daughter.

Does anyone else feel the same way OR am I way off base with these thoughts???

Charles Croes?

I speculate that it was Eric Williams who contacted Charles Croes of Aruba Phones after Beth shared with him the message left on the cell of one of the MB students that sounded like Natalee.

My contention is that the professional thing to do would have been to hand over this cell the next day to the ALE as evidence in regards to the missing American tourist.  Instead ... a 1:30 AM meeting was arranged at a gas station.

I suspect that Eric Williams was either an informant for the ALE or ... the van der Sloots.

IMO.  This wannabe detective could be wrong.

Janet

++++++++++++   


Charles Croes
On the Record w/ Greta
June 30, 2005

CHARLES CROES, TALKED TO DUTCH SUSPECT: A major friend of mine called me up. He was working with Natalee's mom to help them find Natalee.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why would he call you? What is your occupation that would be a reason he would call you?

C. CROES: Well, I have a sail (cell) rental company. And there was apparently a phone call made. And he was calling me betting or hoping that the phone call was made from one of our phones, and so that's why he called me.

VAN SUSTEREN: About what time did he call you?

C. CROES: He called me at 11:30.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did he say to you?

C. CROES: He told me that he needed my help. And I asked him what it was about. And he told me that it had to do something with a cell phone. And I didn't relate it to anything but work at that point.

<snipped>

C. CROES: ... And then he said, "There is a possibility that a phone call was made using one of our phones." And I said, "OK." And he said, "It's very, very important."  I said, "Fine," and I asked him to go into further details, and he did. And then I made arrangements to go see him.http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161233,00.html


Beth Holloway
LOVING NATALEE
 
Page 41
The DEA agent asks for Natalee's cell phone and passport. …The agent looks at Natalee's things a few moments, then gives them back to me.
 
 
Page 41
When I return to the lobby the DEA agent suggest we go to Carlos 'n Charlie's to as questions and show her picture around. So we load up and head back to the shipyard area.
 

Page 42
Making their way inside the bar the men dodge a couple of fistfights and dope-smoking patrons to try to find someone with information.  They don't learn anything, so we all load up again and drive to a nearby gas station, where the DEA agent wants to introduce us to someone associated with the island cell-phone company to help us get phones and set up communications among our group.

[SunnyinTX]

Am I correct in remembering that Beth did not get out of the car at Sloots house?

Its been far too long, I just can't  remember everything  anymore

From what I understand she was TOLD to stay in the car.

Loving Natalee page 47...(back at the sloots home after going to the Wyndham) 'the aruban police, Paulus, Jug, Jodi, Mat, Ruffner, the coach and I wait for the DEA agent to arrive. The DEA agent tells everyone to remain in their vehicles until he gets there. And suggests that the women not get out of  their cars at all. Jodi stays in the van, and I stay in the rental car o the phone with Natalee's friends. The are on speaker phone guiding me with information.

jump to page 49....(joran telling 'what happened')... But joran siad she wanted to ride around. then before he continues he asks if anyone in the group is related to Natalee. Jug steps forward and identifies himself as her step-father, and joran asks him to walk away, so that he can finish telling about his encounter with her.  As Jug leaves the encircled group and comes over to the car, joran resumes his story.....

[BUCKSHOT]

Wonder if the FBI/DEA have spoken to Eric Williams about what he knows??

Eric Williams needs to step forward...unless he has been coverted to the other side during his stay/residency on the island.

He may lend some additional information to this whole chirade.

[Kermit]

1. Also, most of those people from Aruba that appear on TV DO get paid for it-maybe not a lot-Jossy, Tito-those that appear as "guest consultants" get about $150 a pop-so why shouldn't Deepak try to get some help with all the legal costs-is that so terrible?
Posted by: scubajap | Oct 5, 2005 9:32:35 PM


Julia Renfro appears on TV a lot in spite of her denying she wanted to


"Some of our friends are members of “Friends of Aruba” and were closely involved with the search of the girl.
(Paulus VDS Witness Statement 06/18/05)

IFA:
* Mark Purcell worked at Marriott Hotel and posts online as MIP6, he and Julia Renfro belong to IFA (International Friends of Aruba).

Mark Purcell and his wife are part of the IFA
Julia Renfro and Patrick Boset are part of IFA
Mark Purcell's wife, Marlene Purcell along with Antonio Carlos are involved in the AHATAboard as well.


JULIA RENFRO'S LIES ABOUT THE BLUE-EYED DUTCH BOY

 From VF:

According to Dompig, Beth Twitty had contact with her daughter while she was in Aruba. Dompig tells Burrough he has taken two statements from journalist Julia Renfro, as well as a worker at the Holiday Inn, and both claim Beth Twitty told them she had gotten a call from Natalee, who said she was in love with a tall, blue-eyed Dutch teenager. "We need to know the truth," says Dompig. "Joran did not have blue eyes, so who was this boy?" Beth strenuously denies making any such statements, or having talked with Natalee while she was away.
http://ceetveerefugees.11.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=779




TWITTY: You know, I haven't had a chance to speak with them about that. But you know, I think there were some rumors circulating earlier on, maybe in the fall, about Natalee had met someone — a blue-eyed Dutch national — and it's just simply not true. There just was no truth to the rumors that were coming out of Aruba that Natalee had met him.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,192141,00.html

[Altruist]

http://www.amigoe.com/english/    01/23/2008

Timeline Beth does not tally 

WILLEMSTAD/ORANJESTAD – Mother of Natalee Holloway, Beth has given incorrect information on the time she arrived in Aruba with a private jet on May 30, 2005.  This was not around 23:00, as she had said up till now – also in her book published late last year – but already at 19:45, says Alberto G. before the camera of the Curacao TV-producer Renée Gielen,  who is working on a documentary on the disappearance of the American teenage girl, and interviewed G. on this subject this morning. 

At that time, Alberto G. (Amigoe knows his name but he wants to stay anonymous out of precaution) worked on the part of the airport of Aruba where private airplanes park.  He was the first person that met Beth Twitty at the bottom of the aircraft steps, after he had piloted the aircraft in.   After that, he became the family’s guide for some time. 

He now says that he will change his earlier declaration before the police and give a new one.  He was mistaken.  Last week’s statements of the Americans Dan Young and Kelly Castillo, who call themselves ‘investigators’, made him decide to check some things again.   

Later that evening on May 30, 2005, he punched out a little after 22:00.  He thinks that that must have been the reason why he was wrong about the time.  He confirms the authenticity of Young and Castillo’s computer printout that show that Beth had already arrived at 19:45.

It is not clear why Beth had lied about her arrival time.  Whether the police have realized that the indicated arrival time does not tally, is not known.  Former chief of police Gerold Dompig told the newspaper earlier that the police had indeed investigated the timeline at that time – flight data and air movements – and that the air traffic control in Curacao had also sent them information. 

This proofs the soundness of Beth’s insinuations: “She must have known more”, says Gielen.  This would also appear from another declaration of Alberto G., who repeats what Young and Castillo said, namely that at first, Beth had posters with her, saying: ‘Please call me, hootie. I miss you and love you. Mom is here on Aruba and I really want to talk to you. Please call me on my local cell.’  The poster was signed with ‘Big hootie’.  Gielen says that this puts things in a different light.  “Beth’s timeline does not tally and she knew more.”

It's not JUST the Americans these criminals holding office are concerned about, they have reason to be CONCERNED ABOUT THE NATIVES.  They just like an administration in the USA that was lying (won't mention any names) got re elected based on their lies.  Remember these criminals holding office in LieRuba have to give their PERMISSION for citizens on LieRuba to possess guns & they are now aware that MANY BLACKMARKET GUNS are present on LieRuba.  It isn't only the USA THEY SPREAD THEIR PROPOGANDA FOR, THEY LIE MOSTLY TO THEIR OWN CITIZENS, somebody's got to do the work, don't you know?  Those are the peons that aren't on their GOVERNMENT PAYROLLS.

Seems the Liars don't want a REVOLUTION. 

They scurry like rats to cover their criminal asses.  These rats are in the government & the businesses.  Unethical skanks is about the height they have the ability to attain ONLY THROUGH DECEPTION & OUTRIGHT LIES.  Pay no attention to the criminals behind the curtains, pretend everything is alright, we are right to HATE THE AMERICANS.

No different than Hitler did to Germany, all to line cronies pockets & save themselves at the peons expense.  In order to unite stupid people you give them all one entity to HATE, the worst of human nature takes care of the rest.

Disgusting skanks.

[Kermit]

JULIA RENFRO’S OTHER INTERESTS:
Julia Renfro has a variety of interests in Aruba besides being the editor-in-chief of Aruba Today News Magazine and the Photo Journalists for it's sister newpaper Bon Dia.

It seems she is the contact for Windsurfing competition on Aruba.
She is connected to Aruba Travel Guide.
World-wide Travel Guide
Island Temptations.
Aruba Rentals
Sailing
And the ARS Group.
http://arubansecrets.blogspot.com/2005/07/does-julia-renfro-have-vested-interest.html

[Dayhiker]

JULIA RENFRO'S LIES ABOUT THE BLUE-EYED DUTCH BOY

 From VF:

According to Dompig, Beth Twitty had contact with her daughter while she was in Aruba. Dompig tells Burrough he has taken two statements from journalist Julia Renfro, as well as a worker at the Holiday Inn, and both claim Beth Twitty told them she had gotten a call from Natalee, who said she was in love with a tall, blue-eyed Dutch teenager. "We need to know the truth," says Dompig. "Joran did not have blue eyes, so who was this boy?" Beth strenuously denies making any such statements, or having talked with Natalee while she was away.
http://ceetveerefugees.11.forumer.com/viewtopic.php?t=779

Wasn't Renfro denying this just yesterday? She needs to call her buddy Gerold the Pig and get on the same page. The problem with telling lies is you always have to remember your old ones.

[Dayhiker]

It's not JUST the Americans these criminals holding office are concerned about, they have reason to be CONCERNED ABOUT THE NATIVES.  They just like an administration in the USA that was lying (won't mention any names) got re elected based on their lies.  Remember these criminals holding office in LieRuba have to give their PERMISSION for citizens on LieRuba to possess guns & they are now aware that MANY BLACKMARKET GUNS are present on LieRuba.  It isn't only the USA THEY SPREAD THEIR PROPOGANDA FOR, THEY LIE MOSTLY TO THEIR OWN CITIZENS, somebody's got to do the work, don't you know?  Those are the peons that aren't on their GOVERNMENT PAYROLLS.

Seems the Liars don't want a REVOLUTION. 

They scurry like rats to cover their criminal asses.  These rats are in the government & the businesses.  Unethical skanks is about the height they have the ability to attain ONLY THROUGH DECEPTION & OUTRIGHT LIES.  Pay no attention to the criminals behind the curtains, pretend everything is alright, we are right to HATE THE AMERICANS.

No different than Hitler did to Germany, all to line cronies pockets & save themselves at the peons expense.  In order to unite stupid people you give them all one entity to HATE, the worst of human nature takes care of the rest.

Disgusting skanks.

The ALE and Dutch investigated this for 30 months all told, and they don't know when Beth arrived? Horse shit.

These fools get a bag boy to change his story and it is supposed to be gospel. More horse shit.

[Kermit]

Race coordinator Julie Renfro had an admittedly uphill battle to get the Pro-Am in gear, but pulled it off beautifully, with the assistance of her sister Angela Emory (wife of Sierra, future owners of Emory Boards and voted most adorable couple of the World Cup by yours truly).

Her sisters picture:

[Kermit]

dang it Kermit.....you nearly made me spit my coffee all over the place...don't skeer me this early in the morning   early morning SKANK is not my cuppa!!

Heh Heh

[Dayhiker]

I remember a while back reading that Rene G. was the girlfriend of somebody
in the Aruban govenment?  Can anybody remember who it was?

Never heard this Magnolia, but we need to find out. Anybody know anything about this?

[Kermit]

Remember the DEA agent is the one that drove to that gas station tomeet with Charles Croes...why the gas station?  Why not the lobby of the hotel?  He is also the one that asked Beth to remain in the car at the Sloots.

Maybe it was Charles Croes who insisted they meet at the gas station.
One needs to wonder after he met with Beth at the gas station he was gone from approx 12:45 until he meets up with them to go to van der Sloots house at 2:30-3:00.

Where was Charlie for 1 1/2? Hmmmm - could it be he was at his friends house Paulus (Paulus said his IFA member's were friends helping him). the beach from the gas station is only 5 minutes away.