Natalee Case Discussion #725 2/6 - 2/7/08

[Destiny]

Posted on the front page of SM: 

Kloothommel wrote:


An small joke on an National radio show in the Netherlands.

Joran van de Sloot admits that he has commited suicide.

No one believes him anymore.

Good Morning Monks!!   Love this1  I heard on one of the shows this morning that the slops are worried that urine might commit suicide......awwww now that's a sympathy plea if I ever heard one.....his type kill others not themselves!!

Or, they KNOW he's a *dead man walking* and it's just a matter of when...

[oldencrabby]

Hey Monkeys,
sorry, I'm very behind, Flu on Saturday, loss internet Sunday, drug side effects last 2 days.

1. Are all our Monkeys OK in south to midwest?

2. heard this morning on local fox show Mike and Julia (NYC) that jurin is on suicide watch, and better than that jurin is the most hated person in the world!
anyone else hear this?

xoxo

Someone posted on the front page of SM that Joran confessed he committed suicide but nobody believes him any more. 

Hope he videotapes himself so we can believe him.

You realize of course, the blame will all be on the Americans!   

[Dayhiker]

Silence = Complicity.

Oduber and Croes refusing to speak, even to the populace, tells me they know the "game is over". All previous messages from those two have been to the folks of Aruba and not to us. They will not even address the very people that foolishly elected them.

Trouble ahead for the Happy Island.

Aruba is imploding and they don't know what to do. The cover-up isn't going by the script and it is all they know. The Aruba temples are crumbling at their foundations.

[Dayhiker]

Hope he videotapes himself so we can believe him.

You realize of course, the blame will all be on the Americans!   

 

[AZLady]

Silence = Complicity.

Oduber and Croes refusing to speak, even to the populace, tells me they know the "game is over". All previous messages from those two have been to the folks of Aruba and not to us. They will not even address the very people that foolishly elected them.

Trouble ahead for the Happy Island.

Aruba is imploding and they don't know what to do. The cover-up isn't going by the script and it is all they know. The Aruba temples are crumbling at their foundations.

And it's about time.  Foolish, foolish people to think they could continue with this charade. 

[msmarple]

http://www.amigoe.com/english/   02/06/2008

Couple more items from Amigoe.

Judge will go into wiretapping of suspects

ORANJESTAD – The judge will decide at the end of last week whether the information received via wiretapping can be admitted as evidence in the case Effi Tromp and A.M. Bruin, who are both being suspected of having been doing business with the criminal organization that was round up last year in September and was supposedly under the leadership of businessmen Luis Mansur and Rafa Mercado Ochoa.

Mansur and Ochoa are the main suspects in this large-scale and international case of drug smuggling.  Operation domino was among others the preparation and exportation of an unknown amount of drug transportation that was taking place since May of 2005 until the 11 gang members were arrested.  Mansur is not only suspected of drug transportation to Aruba, but also of organizing transportation from Venezuela to the Dominican Republic and/or from South-America to Europe and the United States.

The gang is also suspected of extortion, money laundering, and illegal possession of firearms.  In addition to the hard core, Justice is also bringing a great amount of people before the judge that had a business relation with the criminal organization.  An estimate of more than 20 persons, including the hard core, is being suspected of involvement in the Domino-case.

WIRETAPPING

The hearing of the first four suspects was last Friday.  The four are the suspected pilot Effi Tromp, A.M. Bruin, Y.J.S.M, and F.R.A.  In the case against Tromp and Bruin, it appears that justice has placed bugging devices in the car of main suspect Ochoa.  This car was purchased with the proceeds from cocaine smuggling and according to the prosecutor, Ochoa had been doing business all day long from his car.  It appears from the tapping that Tromp was constantly seeking contact with people that smuggled drugs.

Justice’s direct wiretapping of the suspects or the use of Recording Private Communication (OVC) started in 2006.  For almost year and a half, Justice has listened in to conversations in Ochoa’s car and also the telephones were tapped.  Lawyer Chris Lejeuz that defends Tromp and also Bruin says that the OM has invaded the privacy of the suspects.  There is indeed no legislation for this in Aruba, but that doesn’t mean that this method of criminal investigation can be used and for such a long time.  He referred to the Netherlands where the use of OVC is regulated and that the examining magistrate must give permission for this.  Secretly listening to conversations in a car is an offence in the Netherlands, because it invades the privacy, indicated the Dutch lawyer Gerard Spong already after the recent ‘confession’ of Joran van der Sloot in the Holloway-case.  In the Tromp- as well as the Bruin-case, the judge is now going to check whether the evidence was legally obtained and can be admitted and will give a verdict on February 15.   

The prosecutor demanded three years jail against the two suspects.  Tromp is suspected of possession of cocaine and firearms and Mansur has also accused min of drug smuggling.  He said that he knows Tromp from the beginning of operation Domino.  He also said that Ochoa knew that Tromp was related to drugs.  Ochoa had also given Tromp money to sent drugs to the Netherlands.  Tromp has supposedly used his money on champagne and women.

According to the prosecutor, there are more indications that Tromp possessed a great amount of drugs and illegal firearms.  The former pilot admitted to the latter.  A passenger left the firearms in an airplane and Tromp has kept them for his collection.

Bruin that works for CMB as information specialist, appealed to his right to remain silent.  But the OM says that from the conversations in the car and declarations, there is sufficient evidence that Bruin is guilty of smuggling and selling drugs.  The prosecutor has also demanded three years jail against the suspect F.R.A. for the smuggling, selling, and possession of drugs.  Y.J.S.M is meanwhile convicted to 16 months jail for selling, exporting, and transporting cocaine from June 15 till 22 inclusive in 2007. 

* * *

Kalpoe brothers can continue with their lawsuit against Dr. Phil

ORANJESTAD/LOS ANGELES – The American media reported that a judge in Los Angeles had decided that the Surinam brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe that in 2005 were interrogated after the disappearance of Natalee Holloway in Aruba, can continue with their lawsuit against the famous American TV-psychologist Dr. Phil McGraw.  McGraw and the network CBS Television wanted to stop the lawsuit.

The Kalpoe brothers that were friends of Joran van der Sloot, accuse McGraw of slander.  In one of his programmes, McGraw played the recording of a conversation between Deepak and a private detective.  With this, McGraw has created the impression that the brothers were criminally involved with the disappearance of Natalee.

* * * 

[Dayhiker]

I just had to snicker at this. Joran's private myspace. Last log in 2/6/08. Mood: Pissed off!

Too funny!  When I read earlier that Anita is worried her precious sporter may commit suicide I said "no way" he's too cocky.  Being pissed off is EXACTLY the emotion Joran would emit.

He's already put himself on trial and convicted himself of murder. All that's left is for him to sentence himself.

[Spock]

These timelines on the last page do not seem right. As I recall, C&C closed at 12:15, they were in the car by 12:30, they were at the beach by 12:45, and the Kalpoes logged in the computer about 2:15.

Klass, what the word on the timeline?

[oldencrabby]

Silence = Complicity.

Oduber and Croes refusing to speak, even to the populace, tells me they know the "game is over". All previous messages from those two have been to the folks of Aruba and not to us. They will not even address the very people that foolishly elected them.

Trouble ahead for the Happy Island.

Aruba is imploding and they don't know what to do. The cover-up isn't going by the script and it is all they know. The Aruba temples are crumbling at their foundations.

I think it is causing the earth to quake around the area:
http://earthquake.usgs.gov/eqcenter/recenteqsww/Maps/region/N_America.php

    

[klaasend]

These timelines on the last page do not seem right. As I recall, C&C closed at 12:15, they were in the car by 12:30, they were at the beach by 12:45, and the Kalpoes logged in the computer about 2:15.

Klass, what the word on the timeline?

Spock - I haven't had time to review the timeline again.  Someone else will have to take a look.

[Rob]

These timelines on the last page do not seem right. As I recall, C&C closed at 12:15, they were in the car by 12:30, they were at the beach by 12:45, and the Kalpoes logged in the computer about 2:15.

Klass, what the word on the timeline?

IIRC, they were in front of the MB kids at the bus stop, in Deepak's Honda, at West Straat and LG Smith @ 1:08 am.

[NM]

Hey Monkeys,
sorry, I'm very behind, Flu on Saturday, loss internet Sunday, drug side effects last 2 days.

1. Are all our Monkeys OK in south to midwest?

2. heard this morning on local fox show Mike and Julia (NYC) that jurin is on suicide watch, and better than that jurin is the most hated person in the world!
anyone else hear this?

xoxo

Someone posted on the front page of SM that Joran confessed he committed suicide but nobody believes him any more. 

OK, that was worth the coughing fit cough cough cough
thx Klaas!!!!!

[Destiny]

Joran said in his "confession" that he bought Natalee a shot of 151 and she slammed it down. Does anyone know how long before they left C&C' s that happened? I am speculating that was the drink w/the date rape drug was in. Any thoughts on this anyone?

Joran arrived at C & C's at 12:30 AM.  Natalee was dancing.  Then they did the jelly shot thing.  Then, they walked to a different bar area and he bought her the 151 shot.  The bar closed at 1 AM.  I have to assume the shot was consumed about 12:45 to 12:50 AM.  GHB takes only 15 to 20 minutes to take effect.  Shortly after 1 AM (about 1:15 AM) another student saw Natalee being helped out of the bar by Deepak.  She was most likely incapacitated by then.

edit - wrong post commented to

[Lala'sMom]

Justice Officer=Jan van der Straaten
Jan van der Straaten + paulus van der Sloot
Jan and Paulus....dear friends..

Shango Says: June 27th, 2005 at 9:51 pm
DirtyHand walks with the Babylons, the Arawaks and is consort to the fallen elder
The gods are talking


con·sort      /n. ˈkɒnsɔrt, v. kənˈsɔrt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[n. kon-sawrt, v. kuhn-sawrt] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
   a companion, associate, or partner: a confidant and consort of heads of state.




Diario 02/06/2008:

Three years ago the Justice Officer who was in charge of the case discussed the case a few times with Joran’s father, which public opinion finds isn't right. At that time the young man was able to be set free.

But the Public Ministry has another function and it is not to inform the accused or his family of what is going to happen to him and has to remain distant from the accused because at the moment it is too close to the accused and gives information as to what is going to happen, this institution is no longer independent!


Finally, it could be observed that many viewers were very disappointed and they felt from the beginning that the case was not dealt with adequately and that the Public Ministry did not remain neutral and reiterated that the O.M. should not have been in contact with the parents, especially the father of Joran van der Sloot.


Full article can be found http://getagripmonkey.blogspot.com/2008/02/diario-column-aruban-community-cannot.html

[Rob]

These timelines on the last page do not seem right. As I recall, C&C closed at 12:15, they were in the car by 12:30, they were at the beach by 12:45, and the Kalpoes logged in the computer about 2:15.

Klass, what the word on the timeline?

IIRC, they were in front of the MB kids at the bus stop, in Deepak's Honda, at West Straat and LG Smith @ 1:08 am.

also, Spock - CnC closed at 1 am.

[Dayhiker]

http://www.ad.nl/holloway/weblog/article2033548.ece

Dutch article translated through google:

donderdag 07 februari 2008

'Correct people should behind bars'
By MAAIKE RUEPERT

[WEBLOG ARUBA] Few Arubans are to this day engaged in searching for Natalee Holloway. Businessman Eduardo Mansur is one such exception.
 
Natalee Holloway on the beach of Aruba.
  He helps the family Holloway where he can. He acts as a broker between the Aruban contacts there, and American zoekteams or private detectives acting on behalf of the Holloways Aruba calling.

Mansur hold office in his bar in Palm Beach, where everything and everyone together. As he tells us about the early days nearly three years ago. The days when any tip could be the golden tip. When he reached three times around the whole island has walked.

One of the most memorable tips came from a man who lived of the tip. , "He explained that he had seen people something rolled up in a carpet were dumped at the landfill. He had blond hair and was seen to be sure that it was Natalee.''After thirty days dig dirt, the carpet was Mansur, which includes up a palm tree. ,, The man had palmbladeren for Natalee's hair since. He was probably under the influence of drugs.''

Also Mansur can still recall that there is an arm aanspoelde in Punto Fijo, the Venezuelan place closest to the West Indies. ,, They sent the arm to the lab in Caracas. When we heard nothing more, I check call. What was found? Did they arm in Caracas discarded because it would have been a pelikanenpoot.''The businessman is there to this day convinced that it was an arm. ,, I have seen a picture, and although the quality was bad, it was clearly an arm.''

The Arubaan has grey hairs of the case. Why is he anyway? ,, I want to see the past. The family this tragedy can be closed. I want them their daughter back. And I want the right people behind bars controversy: Joran, his father, the genius behind this cover-up, and some dirty cops.

Way to go Jossy. COVER-UP!!!

The Arubaan has grey hairs of the case. Why is he anyway? ,, I want to see the past. The family this tragedy can be closed. I want them their daughter back. And I want the right people behind bars controversy: Joran, his father, the genius behind this cover-up, and some dirty cops.

[Spock]

These timelines on the last page do not seem right. As I recall, C&C closed at 12:15, they were in the car by 12:30, they were at the beach by 12:45, and the Kalpoes logged in the computer about 2:15.

Klass, what the word on the timeline?

IIRC, they were in front of the MB kids at the bus stop, in Deepak's Honda, at West Straat and LG Smith @ 1:08 am.

I dont recall that timestamp Rob, I had the spotting at 12:30 or so. Its been awhile since I researched it.

[blah]

Joran said in his "confession" that he bought Natalee a shot of 151 and she slammed it down. Does anyone know how long before they left C&C' s that happened? I am speculating that was the drink w/the date rape drug was in. Any thoughts on this anyone?

Joran go there about 1/2 hour before they closed so it couldnt have been any longer than that.

[klaasend]

Posted by MF at RU:

While we know that Mos is on vacation en route to the Netherlands, there is also 3 investigators send there.

Howeve this article says that no interview has taken place yet as to few moments ago:

Through google translator since MF posted in Dutch without a link (of course):

(Novum) - Joran van der Sloot, in conversation with the public prosecutor in Aruba. This can also go through judicial or police in the Netherlands. This is Paul van Vugt, spokesman and kantoorgenoot of Van der Sloots lawyer Netherlands Bert de Rooij said Thursday. "A call goes in each case."

Dop Kruimel of the PPS on Aruba late Thursday at the end of the afternoon that no talks have taken place. She points out that the assistance can be invoked from the PPS in the Netherlands, through an assistance. Van der Sloot would be arrested and overgevlogen to Aruba. If and when a scheduled call would not say Kruimel.
The defence of the Arnhemmer has asked for the location and time of the interview secret. "It should be a place where things calmed down, not on the Dam in Amsterdam," says Van Vugt. He can imagine that Van der Sloot via a satellite will speak with representatives of the PPS on Aruba, or by phone. "But that should you lospeuteren to the PPS. It is in any case willing to talk." Kruimel conclude that the interview will take place by telephone.
Actualiteitenrubriek Nova reported Tuesday that Van der Sloot expected to be interrogated Thursday in the Netherlands. The program is based on it are Aruban lawyer Ariean de Bie. For Van der Sloots Dutch lawyer Bert de Rooij was this news, his spokesman said.
According to Van Vugt, Van der Sloot concerned by all the media attention. "He has had better weeks." When asked whether he still resides in the Netherlands, Van Vugt replied: "Go from there, but not in Drachten." Dozens of people gathered there after rumors that Van der Sloot in an apartment in Drachten ended.
About the various lawyers who exhaust themselves in the media about the case says Van Vugt: "There are lawyers who have a bad week if they are not on TV have been. Then they can retrieve their hearts." The lawyers of Van der Sloot have jointly agreed to a "media" for an indefinite period in order to assure no new rumors nourishing, says Van Vugt.

[Peaches]

DeVries slams Tacopina on Good Morning America, LOL!

"Maybe he is the same like his client and made some things up."


Van der Sloot's attorney, Joe Tacopina, says there's evidence to suggest the pay phone call never happened. Tacopina says the Aruban Coast Guard checked the pay phone that Joran talked about on the tape and found no such call, which would apparently give credence to van der Sloot's claim that the story he told on the tape was a lie.

"The Aruban Coast Guard has already looked at that pay phone. There is no such call," said Tacopina.

But De Vries said Aruban investigators have told him it was not possible to for them to determine if the call was placed.

"I don't know how [Tacopina] knows this, because I had a telephone call a couple of months ago … saying it's impossible to say," De Vries said. "Maybe he is the same like his client and made some things up."

maybe the pay phone call never did happen, AND IS COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT BECAUSE JORAN COULD HAVE (A) USED A FRIEND'S PHONE OR (B) COULD HAVE JUST ASKED HIS DAURY IN PERSON, WHILE AT HIS HOUSE.

Betcha if they find Natalee in the ocean search, they find Sanders' phone in close proximity.