Natalee Case Discussion #728 2/10 - 2/11/08

[caesu]

Snipped from Caesu's post:

Many institutions, official bodies, lawyers, journalists, and psychologists are asking themselves how to handle the outpouring of Joran van der Sloot before the hidden camera.   According to law psychologist Albert Wagenaar, there is not even a confession in the revealing reportage.  There is no solving of the case and it is no confession of a criminal act, ’because none is indicated’, said the psychologist.


What is this turdball smoking? Disposing of a human being that may be alive is nor a crime?

is saw another psychiatrist http://www.brambakker.com/
he said on dutch talk tv network Het Gesprek last tuesday something along the lines:

"wether it is a crime or not by law he couldn't say but Joran is sick in his head. he will never recover. should be put away forever in mental hospital. he has no conscience and is self-obsessed."

[Tamikosmom]

Bump KJ was waiting for a video from Holland before she arrested JK2? No evidence against the two innocent men but there were still arrested and detained for 10 days?

Thank you *******.

Do you have any idea how this memo became public?  I think it is huge.

Janet

[Dayhiker]

If necessary, the OM will also protect the suspect Joran van der Sloot.  The OM is also of the opinion that yesterday’s words of Justice-minister Rudy Croes were premature.  Croes wants to declare Joran van der Sloot persona non grate.

“The boy is not convicted yet; besides, there are a whole lot of judicial hurdles ahead, before he can be refused admission to Aruba. He is legally admitted anyway”, was the reaction of the OM.
 

Houston, we've got a problem.

yes they are fighting behing the scenes big time.
must be.
aruban OM, dutch OM.
justice ministers croes and hirsch ballin taking hits at eachother with bull shit statements who don't even make sense.

friday i posted this earlier. 4 ! statements contradicted eachtother.

balkie just doesn't know where to look and what to say.

sorry for repeating but i think the the big word is timeline.
peter r. de vries knew about the antillen/aruba visit.
that's why he had to stop the undercovernig operation with patrick - he could have gotten more - but peter r. thought: this should do it. and it did!!!

bang big media hype never seen this before. some people think it is not that big because balkie or hirsch ballin are not sending out dramatic statements, well, the don't even know what to say - that's how bad it is!

the political and judicial system is caught with their pants down full view of the whole world.
i even think even your Mukasey had jaw dropping while watching tv.

i hope i am reading the messages right. might be a little premature.

Yeppers Caesu, I believe time being spent isn't about how to arrest the bastard but how to spin not prosecuting him without making the Dutch system look corrupt.

If there is one thing that has been pervasive throughout this entire investigation it is the Dutch system has no backbone. Zero, zip, nada. It takes an atricious murder like Theo van Gogh for them to get the nerve to even prosecute, and of course he is one of their own elite. Only 28 life sentences given out to convicted murderers in Holland in the last 67 years?

Does an American victim even stand a chance?

[sb]

Having this case and the new developments happen at the time of an election in NL is probably a positive thing, the case has become a part of the debate there and is having an effect on the political scene. GOOOOOOD!

Politicians always work SO MUCH BETTER when it's election time and they have to put up or shut up!

This will HELP the case, IMO.

[Ono]

Why does this sh*t always happen to me?  How many times?  Do you remember?

How many people have a gold mine dropped into their laps?  How many reap millions and millions for the lies from their mouths?

How many would choose to live obscure lives and hope that people would forget?  How many go on TV and present themselves in an arrogant manner?

No disrespect intended here, but your repitious questioning is making me crazy.  What is your point?

Ono - I think she's offline right now but I think she's referring to Joran. 

Thank you Klaas.....I apologize....I know I was rude. Excuse me please.  It's just that poster's style....I am sorry.

[caesu]

i want him arrested ASAP just because i don't like the feeling he is sitting there near rotterdam smoking weed as we speak. or maybe even surfing on the web trying to figure out how to spin everything.

what is going to happen after that. i don't know.
but i think in a week from now we now a lot more.

i even don't know this but apart from his lawyer can he speak to paul vds also confidential while he is in jail?
of course his lawyer can pas things on.

and then also when he is in jail i don't want him watching tv...
i don't want him watching his own face on tv.

Caesu, IMO after Peter deVries expose and the loud public outburst from holland, the US and Arubas the Dutch system will have egg all over their face, no make that shit all over their face, if they don't send him to trial. Thoughts?

i didn't get the bold line

but yes, by keeping silent balkenende proofed it think he didn't have plan to fix this, he was hoping it would just go away.
so i think the cabinet is in its last days. or the most cooked up some weird plan.
but i am cautious because i am not pretending to know how the trainwreck is going get pulled out that ditch.

hypothetically:

when the cabinet-falls, Balkie (that's his nickname is use) has to call elections in 90 or 60? days i think and he will stay on as a care-taker government to handle daily affairs.
but it can even be worse. but i don't remeber that ever occuring (i am 29).
then balkie has to step down all together and wouter bos vice-PM is care-take PM till the elections.
the next vice-PM is Andre Rouvout - he is from a christian party - if wouter bos has to go to.
but if it is that bad, then i don't even want to think about.

but with the election one party will win for sure.
the is the PVV - the only party to speak out about Natalee and crime/corruption/drugs in Aruba/Antilles.
the PVV got attacked for doing that on all sides.

Deze week vroeg mijn fractiegenoot Raymond de Roon om een spoeddebat naar aanleiding van de opzienbarende ontwikkelingen rond de verdwijning van Natalee Holloway. Het verzoek werd door de andere partijen afgewezen. Heel Nederland praat erover, maar de Tweede Kamer zwijgt. Weer een schoolvoorbeeld van de enorme kloof tussen de burgers en de Haagse politiek.

These week my fellow MP Raymond the Roon requested an emergency debate as a result of the resounding developments around the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. The request was rejected by the other parties. The entire Netherlands talks, but the parlaiment is silent. A clear example of the enormous gap between the citizens and The Hague politician.

this party is doing very well in the polls, although i don't agree with this party on a lot of issues.
but natalee and the whole mess is way more important than all of them.
http://www.geertwilders.nl/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogsection&id=5&Itemid=103

i think it might be interesting to see, because balkenende is out of the country on the antilles/aruba
difficult to influence media back here. maybe he has given up already or is going to try for some major bull shit speech in aruba bit he is not very good at that. no charisma.

i am speculation but it might be interesting, maybe nothing happens at all that's also possibe.

but the ditch will still smell like hell.

i ment: i didn't get this line:

"no make that shit all over their face"

 

i am still way back in thread making comments 

[Dayhiker]

Snipped from Caesu's post:

Many institutions, official bodies, lawyers, journalists, and psychologists are asking themselves how to handle the outpouring of Joran van der Sloot before the hidden camera.   According to law psychologist Albert Wagenaar, there is not even a confession in the revealing reportage.  There is no solving of the case and it is no confession of a criminal act, ’because none is indicated’, said the psychologist.


What is this turdball smoking? Disposing of a human being that may be alive is nor a crime?

is saw another psychiatrist http://www.brambakker.com/
he said on dutch talk tv network Het Gesprek last tuesday something along the lines:

"wether it is a crime or not by law he couldn't say but Joran is sick in his head. he will never recover. should be put away forever in mental hospital. he has no conscience and is self-obsessed."

That's more like it although I think a mental institution is too good for him. Forever would be nice though.

[Observer]

Bump KJ was waiting for a video from Holland before she arrested JK2? No evidence against the two innocent men but there were still arrested and detained for 10 days?

Thank you *******.

Do you have any idea how this memo became public?  I think it is huge.

Janet

YW Janet It was in response to a letter written to her from a Aruban man that owns a cafe in Aruba. He was very critical of the Investigation and has documented some things on his website that are very interesting.

http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html

[Bearlyhere]

Geraldo on, talking about primaries right now, has interview with Peter coming up.

i am still catching up but i hope i can watch that on youtube.

I thought you wrote~Geraldo on, talking about primates right now~

A primate is any member of the biological order Primates, the group that contains all the species commonly related to the lemurs, monkeys, and apes, with the last category including humans. Primates are found all over the world. A few species exist on the website http://scaredmonkeys.net/ ~LOL
 

I resemble that remark and proud of the resemblance, too.

[klaasend]

Why does this sh*t always happen to me?  How many times?  Do you remember?

How many people have a gold mine dropped into their laps?  How many reap millions and millions for the lies from their mouths?

How many would choose to live obscure lives and hope that people would forget?  How many go on TV and present themselves in an arrogant manner?

No disrespect intended here, but your repitious questioning is making me crazy.  What is your point?

Ono - I think she's offline right now but I think she's referring to Joran. 

Thank you Klaas.....I apologize....I know I was rude. Excuse me please.  It's just that poster's style....I am sorry.

Ono - don't worry about it, took me a while to figure out who she was talking about too!

[Ono]

Translation

No Joran on Aruba during Balkenende visit.

No MSM spectacle.

We have to put this thing off.

Ahhhh.....probably right.  I see, said the blind man. Ah, so.  Hmm. Makes sense.

[Rob]

Translation

No Joran on Aruba during Balkenende visit.

No MSM spectacle.

We have to put this thing off.

what is this? where does this come from?

That's how I translate the events of the day caesu. 

I take typical Aruban bullshit and decipher it into a easy to read format. LOL

[Destiny]

Urine's new theme song...open in a new window...enjoy listening while you read...

Song: KARMA by Jessica Andrews

http://youtube.com/watch?v=eqIItQtA9Xs

[texasmom]

I am new and have been reading the forum about Natalie because your membership has been able to give information  from Aruba and the Netherlands.  Your humor is teriffic..I like your robots very much too.  SOme of you get really down on Joran's mother...did you ever think that she has been abused by Joran?   I am afraid to think what her life is with Paulus Maximus let alone her dear son, Joran.  Did anyone else get the sense that Joran abuses her?   Only further indicates his  sick nature.   I do think we will get the truth.   

Welcome, "for Natalie"!  Robots is one of my favorites also, but unfortunately he is away for a break right now.  We miss him terribly!  As far as Joran abusing his mother...You reap what you sow as far as I'm concerned.  I have no sympathy for her in relation to any treatment she receives from her son or his father.  She has enabled them both to do everything that they do, and has protected them both at the expense of other completely innocent people in this case.  I believe she has known the truth from the beginning and has played a major role in the coverup and disinformation campaign.  She still has two younger sons that she is setting an example for so I have a feeling her strife will not end when this case is resolved.  Just my opinion, of course.   

[Tamikosmom]

Just another example of the huge conflict of interest in Aruba.

Michael Dompig: (Dompigs Son)Told Dave Holloway that PVDS borrowed Koen Gottenbo's boat to dispose of Natalee on 5-31-05. It was reported in the Media he overheard 3 people saying they used a boat to dispose of Natalee. When he was questioned by the ALE his father resigned from the Natalee case as Commissioner.

Buuti Naar: Dompigs Brother In law who implicated the two innocent security guards in the case saying they were in Natalee's room and stealing from the MB kids. Also said he saw Natalee with cocaine. Two flat out lies.

Dinesh Pitbull Djoegan: X Brother In law of Gerald Dompig. He was found on/in Guadirikiri cave on 04/05/2006 -His head was bashed in,legs cut off and set on fire. It was ruled a suicide and many many suspicious events surround his death. He worked for choose-a-name bar as a bouncer that burned down shortly after his death. David Kock slipped in a interview that JK2 stopped at another bar after C&C and it is rumored that it was this bar

K2 Brothers: Are rumored to be Dompigs cousins
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
<snipped>

Thanks *******

Yes ... personal, family and professional conflicts of interests abounded since day one within the Natalee Holloway investigation.  Justice ... that the 18 year old American citizen was entitled to under Dutch law ... never stood a chance.

Janet

+++++++++++

Beth Twitty
'Rita Cosby Live & Direct'
April 6, 2006

COSBY: What do you make of the fact that it‘s so strange that here‘s this guy who‘s his brother-in-law, Gerold Dompig? Isn‘t that weird to you, too, just that strange connection? And the fact—it was interesting. When we were down there, the authorities were sort of, like, Well, we can‘t really focus on him because of, basically, who he‘s connected to.

TWITTY:  … they‘re all very connected on that island. It‘s hard to find someone who‘s not a relative or a cousin

[for natalie]

I am new and have been reading the forum about Natalie because your membership has been able to give information  from Aruba and the Netherlands.  Your humor is teriffic..I like your robots very much too.  SOme of you get really down on Joran's mother...did you ever think that she has been abused by Joran?   I am afraid to think what her life is with Paulus Maximus let alone her dear son, Joran.  Did anyone else get the sense that Joran abuses her?   Only further indicates his  sick nature.   I do think we will get the truth.   

Welcome! 

If Joran abuses her it's because she allows it.  Joran has been allowed to get away with bad behaviour all his life IMO and that's probably why we are all here right now.

Welcome forNatalee.

I have a differing opinion on this...I think that Juron is afraid of his mother...just like Paulus is afraid of her...

I think she has been pulling strings and pushing the Sloot agenda from the get go...Anita craves money and power...she is very concious of social standing...and fights and claws her way to the top. anyway she can...I think she is EVIL...

     Interesting observation,   Destiny,  You probably have some info about her background...does she have the wealth in the family?   

[caesu]

My comments in red

The OM mentioned as an example the media hunt on an accomplice that Van der Sloot mentioned.  After this person (Daury Rodriguez) had declared that he has nothing to do with the case, all eyes focused on a next person (Lorenzo van Rijn). 

Its not Joran's fault, but the media!

“The cameras were all around his house”, informed district attorney Dop Kruimel.  “He had to take on a lawyer for the contact with us.”

Hey A-hole, that usually happens when your linked to a heinous crime by name on world wide television!

If necessary, the OM will also protect the suspect Joran van der Sloot.  The OM is also of the opinion that yesterday’s words of Justice-minister Rudy Croes were premature.  Croes wants to declare Joran van der Sloot persona non grate.

Tell us something we don't know already! Of course Croes was premature, he went off script!

“The boy is not convicted yet; besides, there are a whole lot of judicial hurdles ahead, before he can be refused admission to Aruba. He is legally admitted anyway”, was the reaction of the OM. 

"Believe me, we know all about THE HURDLES."

Many institutions, official bodies, lawyers, journalists, and psychologists are asking themselves how to handle the outpouring of Joran van der Sloot before the hidden camera.   According to law psychologist Albert Wagenaar, there is not even a confession in the revealing reportage.  There is no solving of the case and it is no confession of a criminal act, ’because none is indicated’, said the psychologist.

Using a so called "expert" to refute the obvious--must be getting some good tips from Taco!

The ombudsman of NOS, Tom van Bussel is of the opinion that the NOS should have been more reserved in reporting Peter R. de Vries’ claim that he had solved the Holloway disappearance-case.  After the coverage of SBS6 on Sunday evening it appeared that De Vries’ promise is not fulfilled.  “What we know now is that Joran is a confused guy.  Like a source of the OM phrased it: ‘We thought that we would get a solution, but what we got was another of the so-many stories”, states the ombudsman on his NOS-website.
 
OK, I've had enough, this hold thing beyond comprehension at this point!

you know what:

all judicial and political statements since peter r. announced on thursday his program are all void and can be ignored.
most of them don't make sense or contradict or are just plain wrong. especially the statement made friday.

but the statements made by the people cannot be ignored.

FYI: NOS is funded directly by the state.

SBS6 is commercial channel.
there are two major under-cover/sting scandals. but the second got overshadowed.
i posted it a few threads back.

on thursday 7th (exactly one week after peter r. announced his program) crime-journalist Alberto Stegeman a collega crime-reporter of Peter R. (same network) announced he was going to broadcast a program sunday (today) how he managed to smuggle fake-bombs and drugs on airplanes on the schiphol amsterdam airport tarmac without being checked or with fake ID. this program was shown last night, i didn't even watch it because of posting here at SM.

drugssmuggling <> aruba

major scandal - maybe hirsch ballin (justice) was happy with this scandal so he didn't have to look silly being silent about Van Der Sloot but could talk about something else.



http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/article2041368.ece
http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/article2031960.ece
http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/article2030344.ece


http://www.ad.nl/binnenland/article2041368.ece

[Ono]

Why does this sh*t always happen to me?  How many times?  Do you remember?

How many people have a gold mine dropped into their laps?  How many reap millions and millions for the lies from their mouths?

How many would choose to live obscure lives and hope that people would forget?  How many go on TV and present themselves in an arrogant manner?

No disrespect intended here, but your repitious questioning is making me crazy.  What is your point?

Ono - I think she's offline right now but I think she's referring to Joran. 

Thank you Klaas.....I apologize....I know I was rude. Excuse me please.  It's just that poster's style....I am sorry.

Ono - don't worry about it, took me a while to figure out who she was talking about too!

Thank you.

[caesu]

Geraldo, when I'm hearing those words "you need to go to school tomorrow' 'act normal' "I'm going to take this person's name to my grave with me" obvioiusly Joran's not in his grave yet, so I'm not sure if we've gotten to the bottom of just who came to help Joran to dispose of Natalee's body. Sounds like to me it could be a parent, who knows, maybe his father.

Freudian slip



P: "Joran shouldn't you be in jail?" "I mean in school."

J: "Laten we geen oude koeien uit de Sloot halen"

funniest thing ever seen on SM imo 

[Observer]

Janet:   

Rene Van Nie writes in Dutch so it's easy to translate and some interesting reading. Look at this!

COVER UP!
Of the 10 mails I receive, it certainly talked about an 8 COVER UP.
The people no longer believe. And that's not good for the credibility of our rights system. People are Saturday. They can not imagine that being fair to Aruba. I do not know anymore. But that development is certainly dangerous. Because if there is a 'cover up' is that there are those people responsible for a marked decline in our tourist industry certainly about 20%. Plus, the criminal is what they do.
There is also a very clear theory to my readers tips on the 100 registered in the Netherlands have come after the broadcast within a trace. "On Aruba people do not dare to make a call, they trust it is not" and "they do not believe that something will be done with their tips." And "why did they have to call Netherlands. This is not dangerous and then there are what is done with their tips. "
In short, wrong bunch!

CONCERNED AMERIKANEN HAVE AL FROM THE START OF A COVER UP SPEAK. THAT IS THEIR BIGGEST PROBLEM WITH ARUBA.
AND IF THAT IS NOT SO THAN THE AUTHORITIES TO ARUBA IN ANY CASE VERY VERY MISSPELLED ENTERED TO OUTSIDE. AND STILL DOING THAT.

FROM THE AMIGOE:
Van Cromvoirt is employed at the Visibility Team. His father has a bewakingsbedrijf, VCB, which for a few big hotels. The Public Attorney's Office (OM) has confirmed that the arrest was carried out. Of which he suspected was not disclosed. It would therefore be that he has withheld information, but it could be possible that he has been seen with the girl on the night of her disappearance. Whether the arrest is a result of a tip following the broadcast of Investigation requested, last week, wanted the PPS not confirm.
FROM THE PRESS INTERNATIONAL
Vriendje commissariszoon

The reason why Geoffrey has previously not been arrested, it is whispered in
Oranjestad, is the fact that he is good friends with the son of the
Aruban Police Gerold Dompig.

Dompig was leader of the team that investigates
To the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. Dompig Was the second of the research team. He Followed by Jan van der Straten, who retired.

Geoffrey has some problems. He is hyperactive. There is a name for that disease but who am I even lost. This makes it clear why he cries continuously during their interrogations.



http://www.renevannie.com/inhoud/kritisch/_kritisch2005.html