Natalee Case Discussion #729 2/11 - 2/13/08

[AVA]

Thumbs up to that! A belated Monkey welcome AVA!

thank you for your welcome!

and to know that the police were with Jug when he first approached the Van der Sloots yet, not one officer there that night has stepped forward to say "You are lying Joran"

I don't get it....why are they protecting the Van der Sloots?  Why are the Van der Sloots in any postion of power?

It is such a small island with everyone connected by business and family ties, AVA. You can't slap one of them without the other saying "ouch!". Paulus worked with and had friendships with the judges, prosecutors and police. This is what Beth and Dave were up against, the willingness of people in power to cover up crimes for their friends and relatives.

what a tight little political circle they must have when not one person speaks the truth besides Joran sometimes.....

[bleachedblack]

Wasn't Booshi Wever the one who was allegedly caught in the strip club in Venezuela?

[klaasend]

Wasn't Booshi Wever the one who was allegedly caught in the strip club in Venezuela?

Yes

[Tylergal]

I noticed when Joran was bragging about suing Aruba that it almost seemed like someone had promised/bribed him. Would that be his lawyer telling him that, or Daury?

Why would he be so excited and who would have to sell him on the idea? Almost as a way of appeasing all the "stress" Joran was going through.

His father is bribing him to keep quiet. It's all about Paulus.

The same ones who bribed K2 into suing Dr. Phil, someone who wants to keep this all VDS family victims of the big arm of the Americans.  Notice the lie about Natalee knowing Bush.

[Rob]

[ala_gunslinger]

That's just it, they do not know she was dead when he had her body disposed of so you have to assume she was alive just as she left with Joran. There is no other way to interpret it. You have to fall to the victim's side because she was alive when last seen.

That being said we have always seen the Dutch judges protect Joran so we shouldn't look for honesty or integrity from them. There is no reason to have any faith in their judicial system whatsoever.

Agree, this sytem is a complete farce and a disgrace to mankind. The modus operandi of the cover up co-conspirators is so fking obvious its jaw dropping. There needs to be an investigation de novo first and foremost before any justice can be served in this case. Investigate the investigators, for they are the ones complicit in the murder coverup. Forget about Joran and Paulus, they are cooked, its the others that need to be brought to justice. Until that happens, Aruba will always remain an island of disgrace.

Holland judiciary needs to bring the hammer down on those judges like Wit and Smid who have made such unbelievably senseless rulings in the case. Both were friends of Paulus, they should have never been able to make rulings.

Let's not forget van der straateen and karen janseen. They are in this as well!

[Tamikosmom]

RUDY OOMAN, ATTORNEY FOR DEEPAK KALPOE: Usually, in cases like this, is that, the longer you detain somebody, the stronger your evidence should be. But, in this case, in my client's case, it was the other way around. The longer they stayed in detention, the more proof came out that they didn't have to do anything with the disappearance itself.

http://tinyurl.com/ysay2h

(http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/05/pzn.01.html)
________


THREE TIMES a judge agreed with the Aruban prosecutor that there were strong/serious suspicions that warranted Deepak and Satish's detentions.

Janet

++++++++++++

JUNE, 2005

Deepak Kalpoe:   Suspicion of murder and kidnapping as well as being an accessory to murder.

Satish Kalpoe:  Suspicion of murder and kidnapping as well as being an accessory to murder.


AUGUST, 2005

Deepak Kalpoe:  Suspected of the primary criminal act of together with other people committing premeditated murder, alternately together with other people murdering somebody, more alternately rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences and even more alternately, raping somebody and new suspicions.

Satish Kalpoe:  Suspected of the primary criminal act of together with other people committing premeditated murder, alternately together with other people murdering somebody, more alternately rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences and even more alternately, raping somebody and new suspicions.


NOVEMBER, 2007

Satish Kalpoe -  Suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily hare that result in death.

Deepak Kalpoe - Suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily hare that result in death.


++++++++++

DUTCH LAW - STRONG/SERIOUS SUSPICIONS JUSTIFY DETAINMENT

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0507/14/ng.01.html

Arlene Ellis-Schipper
NANCY GRACE
July 20, 2005

ARLENE ELLIS-SCHIPPER, ARUBAN ATTORNEY: There is no grand jury in Aruba. It`s a different system.  You are arrested based on suspicion, on strong suspicion.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8079019/

Noraina Pietersz - Defence Attorney
Associated Press
June 9, 2005

Under Aruban law, only serious suspicion from investigators — not solid evidence — is needed for a judge to rule that suspects can be held, Pietersz said.

[Tylergal]

  The emperor has no clothes....

[caesu]

many a times when high ranked people are sent abroad it is an indication they did no good work ver here. they get weggepromoveerd, i do not know the english word for that.

exactly!

http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/article9234541.ece

and then on Aruba Karin Janssen screwed up big time. 

[Frank]

and point man Jacobs.

In looking back 2 years, I wrote that Natalee was in the landfill. First instincts are powerful.

We have heard from both Mickey John and Joran that the police are fools.

Fools, are we too?

The beach is a complete distraction. If you eliminate the beach from this story, it's very interesting what you have.

I remember thinking Paulus would dispose of Natalee alone as to not have potential witnesses.

With millions in reward money and all this pressure, nobody is talking?

It is very possible that Paulus is the only one who knows where Natalee is buried.

[klaasend]

and point man Jacobs.

In looking back 2 years, I wrote that Natalee was in the landfill. First instincts are powerful.

We have heard from both Mickey John and Joran that the police are fools.

Fools, are we too?

The beach is a complete distraction. If you eliminate the beach from this story, it's very interesting what you have.

I remember thinking Paulus would dispose of Natalee alone as to not have potential witnesses.

With millions in reward money and all this pressure, nobody is talking?

It is very possible that Paulus is the only one who knows where Natalee is buried.

Very possible

[Port Valerie]

and point man Jacobs.

In looking back 2 years, I wrote that Natalee was in the landfill. First instincts are powerful.

We have heard from both Mickey John and Joran that the police are fools.

Fools, are we too?

The beach is a complete distraction. If you eliminate the beach from this story, it's very interesting what you have.

I remember thinking Paulus would dispose of Natalee alone as to not have potential witnesses.

With millions in reward money and all this pressure, nobody is talking?

It is very possible that Paulus is the only one who knows where Natalee is buried.

Interesting point. "I would do anything for my son." You could be right.

[imnoangel]

thanks for the link on KJ, caesu!

[Bearlyhere]

In my opinion, Joran has confessed to murder in the DeVries tapes.

He stresses that he does not know if Natalee is alive or dead. And since Natalee is not here to determine if she did have a seizure, one must conclude that he hid the body (based on his words on the tape) to conceal something.

EX-
If I take a live person and hurl them off a bridge - that's murder should the person die. Attempted murder at a minimum. The height used to place the person in the water is irrelevant. Bridge vs. over the side of a boat. The person is in the water. In the case where the person is slipped over the edge of the boat, it could be argued that the only reasonable conclusion is concealment.

Same thing here.

Joran has admitted taking a person, one he is not sure is alive or dead, and made them disappear. The person has not been seen in 32 months. It's only logical that the person is no longer alive and Joran is indeed the last person to be seen with that missing person.

That's murder in my book folks, and I could easily convict someone if I were seated on a jury.

I agree wholeheartedly Rob. She was a live healthy girl when she left with him. He was the last to be seen with her. He is not qualified to make a determination of whether she was dead or not, therefore he can't say she was dead when he had her dumped in the ocean.

JORAN MURDERED HER.

Dave is right on, the Kalpoes are involved. No reason for them not to be cooperating with police if not.

Kalpoes facilitated the drugging and kidnapping of Natalee at the very least. "How is the girl?" "If they find that shit you'll get 15 years." The last time around the judge even said there were high suspicions of kidnapping and disposal on the Kalpoes, part.

What kind of a place accepts the word of a teen-aged stoner that someone is deceased???

They claim they have to do everything legally and by the book yet are taking Joran's word for it that Natalee was dead???

Who appointed him coroner?  What are his qualifications?  See Bobby Cutts weeping and wailing on the witness stand right now about how it victim was accidental.  Let's see how that flies.

No reason to dump at sea any body that died by means other than extreme foul play.

Come to Aruba where teen punks stoned out of their gourds can declare you dead and dump you in the ocean and all the Prosecutor will threaten them with is the disposal of your corpse!

There is a new tourism slogan for them to replace One Happy Island.

Anna, even if you are in a room full of doctors at a code and the code is called, someone in that room has to declare the person dead and sign the death cerificate.  "We were all there and decided he was dead, no need for a death certificate" just doesn't fly. 

Wait until the HMOs get wind of this.  Anything to save a buck.

[Port Valerie]

To add to Frank's point: I think it's also possible that Paulus was hyped up on cocaine that night. Remember, he had just returned from a transatlantic flight but did not seem to have jet lag; instead, he was hanging out at a casino. Anita was away. When the call came from Joran, Paulus might have had extraordinary physical energy to use in the situation.

[Bladerunner]

and point man Jacobs.

In looking back 2 years, I wrote that Natalee was in the landfill. First instincts are powerful.

We have heard from both Mickey John and Joran that the police are fools.

Fools, are we too?

The beach is a complete distraction. If you eliminate the beach from this story, it's very interesting what you have.

I remember thinking Paulus would dispose of Natalee alone as to not have potential witnesses.

With millions in reward money and all this pressure, nobody is talking?

It is very possible that Paulus is the only one who knows where Natalee is buried.

Joran words "its a big ocean out there you know" have always struck me as being the ultimate red herring. He wanted to impress upon Patrick and also appease himself that Natalee will never be found because the ocean is too big, when in actuality, he knows this not to be true, and that she very well CAN be found elsewhere.

[Debra]

Sad...how no one is mentioning the innocent Kalpoe brothers....
They admiited they lied about the actual drop off place.
Deepak tries to tell the "truth" in the interviews:
* White car rental following them that turns off at Holiday Inn
* At the "lighthouse" 2 cars that match GVC and Guido
* Taking a pee at Arashi Beach
* We drove S-W where there are no cameras
* Deepak goes online to cover for Joran...if "anything happens"

Would the actual crime scene be S-W...Colony Beach/Baby Beach?

[imnoangel]

when i went on vacation to islands in earlier years, (not Aruba!) there always was a place where the restaurants dumped their leftovers in the ocean each day, in order to feed the sharks, so the sharks would not be all over the tourists.
is there such a place on Aruba, and if so, where?
i cant imagine there isnt such a place to be honest.
if natalees body was dumped in the sea, which i do not think, it seems very possible to me that the body was dumped there.

[Frank]

Dompig's words need to be analyzed also for the parts that are true.

He maintains that her body was moved several times.

Several times? From where to where?

If you eliminate the ocean, and consider the first place the KLPD searched when they took over the case is? The VDS House!

Legally restricted, as was the landfill. We need to follow our instincts of the corrupt, they shielded the house and the landfill would have taken extraordinary measures to be searched, not to mention equipment.

Paulus had a 10 day jump to put this together, that's alot of time.

Think about it, which is safer to dispose of evidence, the dump or the ocean?

Which would keep you up at night?

[Debra]

Joran words "its a big ocean out there you know" have always struck me as being the ultimate red herring. He wanted to impress upon Patrick and also appease himself that Natalee will never be found because the ocean is too big, when in actuality, he knows this not to be true, and that she very well CAN be found elsewhere.

I agree...it didn't seem right...
If Natalee was in the ocean she COULD be found.
My impression was he is describing a place on Aruba that is off limits to searchers.