Natalee Case Discussion #730 2/13 - 2/14/08

[the big hammer]

Deepak Aruban Lawyer Oman In Contempt?

Whose "property" are the files which deepak's Aruban attorney refuses to turn over to Dr Phil's legal team, as ordered by US court in kalpoe action?

These files are certainly not the property of lawyer Oman, that's for sure.

Why does Oman resist this legitimate, valid and legally appropriate request?

After all, Oman works for deepak.  Right?

So why are these early witness statements being witheld and under whose authority? 

.

[imnoangel]

caesu, het is juist voorpaginanieuws in de volkskrant

caesu, it is on the frontpage of the volkskrant

[Tamikosmom]

Yesterday, someone asked me to give my assessment of Urine as that I am a psychotherapist.  I can't really do that since I've never examined him.  I can only comment on some of the things I've read.  I know that he promotes himself as a player, a ladies man (so to speak).  He seems to be narcisstic - feeling priveleged, feeling that only "special" people are worthy of his company and others are beneath him.  He also seems to have a disregard for social mores - at 17/18 finds it fine to gamble, smoke pot, drink, have promiscusous sex, taking part in the whole drug culture, calling himself "pimp" (indicating control over women and sex upon command).  I would bet his "confession" was not a confession, really.  Offenders who "confess" will often conceal critical pieces of evidence or truth so as to clear them (if those statements ever come out).  Urine appears to manipulate everyone around him.  He seems to feel very powerful and untouchable (classic narcissist).   I wonder if there is any evidence of conduct disorder in his youth.  I'd like to see his school records to know if he was opposional-defiant.  Do you think that information would be public record?  Did he go to private school all his life?  If not, I don't know what the laws are, but perhaps his education records might reveal something.  Is there anyone from his past that has spoken to his temperment, personality, moods??  Not recent, but from elementary or middle school?  That might give some indications.

Just some side thoughts.
Shrinking Monk

Fred Maduro seemed to have a handle on Joran's "youth".

Buckeye ... you are correct.  The prison warden ... Fred Maduro and the VDS' have a relationship that goes back a long way.

Could Paulus connection with Fred ... along with Jacobs and Van Straaten ... account for Joran being allowed a cell phone while in prison?

The conflicts of interest that abound in the Natalee Holloway case never cease. 

Janet

+++++++++

http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/2008/01/you-be-judge.html
YOU BE THE JUDGE!

[Bladerunner]

This is a picture I found that most closely resembles the orientation of the shark in the bag. To me the underside of the shark is white and is clearly seen in the bag. You can also see its eye. The movement of its head in the video as it opens its mouth is quick and jerky, as one would expect with a fish out of water.

[imnoangel]

http://www.ad.nl/holloway/
algemeen dagblad (dutch newspaper:): the case natalee holloway
drug experts weigh jorans words

[dennisintn]

Deepak Aruban Lawyer Oman In Contempt?

Whose "property" are the files which deepak's Aruban attorney refuses to turn over to Dr Phil's legal team, as ordered by US court in kalpoe action?

These files are certainly not the property of lawyer Oman, that's for sure.

Why does Oman resist this legitimate, valid and legally appropriate request?

After all, Oman works for deepak.  Right?

So why are these early witness statements being witheld and under whose authority? 

.

somewhere i read that deepak still owes oman money, and that's why he won't release the files.  i do not have a clue whether it's correct or not.  i don't even remember where i read it.
dennisintn

[Observer]

I have also seen the rock painting screen shots where a few think there was a shark there also. Just adding that for the discussion. 

[ospainter]

Hi OS,
The drainage ditch is roughly 4' from outside the cement on one side to outside the cement on the other. The inner opening , between the inner cement protrusions is just about 2', very small opening to fit even a small adult. But hey, I don't know what the videographer is trying to show us .......he seems to frequently pan the video back to view the mangroves and rest of mud and pond area.

HI BB,

Indeed very small opening, and like you, don't know what he/she is trying to show.

But I am confident that is not Natalee in the bag, you can't make straight hair curly imo. or does hair change from straight to curly after death. Doesn't even look like her profile imo. But

what do I know.

nice seeing you,

MOO

OS

[caesu]

Mos' Appeal Ruling Due Today

Isn't today "vision" day -- the day the 3-judge panel rules on prosecutor Mos's appeal of previous decision to not arrest jvds?

So when?  It's nearly 4:00pm -- EST.

Let me guess: statement will be released after business hours.  What's the hoped-for news event for tomorrow that will overshadow the pending news from Aruba?



.

Hammer - they gave Joran's American attorney more time to file objections.  Don't ask me how JoeT can do this.  I don't think a decision is expected until tomorrow or Friday at the earliest.  Probably Friday.

do you know this.
do CNN, FOX News, ABC have a correspondent and a satellite link up on Aruba at all times?
or do they send someone over there if there is major news.
this is important because if there is news friday they can confront or at least cover the summit balkenende-oduber.

dutch media is downplaying/ignoring his antilles/aruba trip shamelessly

Not sure about CNN or ABC but I know FOX has a correspondent there.  If they don't have satellite link up they do email Greta right away when there is breaking news.  Greta will usually post on her blog right away when that happens. 

those guys might me so calculating that they break news as soon as his plane takes off back to the hague.

Aan het eind van de dag vertrekt minister-president Balkenende weer naar Nederland en is er een afsluitende persconferentie op de luchthaven. 

"end of the day MP leaves and there is a concluding press conference at the airport"

balkie used to have an excellent spin doctor (Jack de Vries), but he works now at the defence department.
but i am sure they are in close contact.

[ospainter]

Alive Natalee below

Thanks,

I agree to disagree, imho it is not Natalee and I respect that you think it is.

MOO

OS

[MumInOhio]

Dennisintn...I have posted that often...it is in the Dr Phil court docs...that is what David Kock has said...Deepak owes Ooman money...

[caesu]

caesu, het is juist voorpaginanieuws in de volkskrant

caesu, it is on the frontpage of the volkskrant

do you mean tomorrow mornings paper?
or todays - i don't read it on their website...

[imnoangel]

todays... i saw it in the shop just 2 hours ago

[Buckeye]

http://www.ad.nl/holloway/
algemeen dagblad (dutch newspaper:): the case natalee holloway
drug experts weigh jorans words

imnoangel

I put this through the translator but I still can't decipher her conclusion.   

http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/dossiers/hollowaydossier/car20080206_BEA.html 

[Bladerunner]

I have also seen the rock painting screen shots where a few think there was a shark there also. Just adding that for the discussion. 

I thought of that too, but I am not sure if that shark was dead or alive. It could have been similar in size. I'm sure that someone with far greater image editing skills than I could rip a clearer image from the video and reveal what I and others see.

I find when looking at the bag photos, orientation is key, which is why I posted the dead shark photo. I strongly believe that the shark in that bag was a relatively fresh catch and was put in there as a means to attract larger sharks once the bag was "slipped" into the ocean. It is also likely that it was not long after that video was shot that the bag was moved to a boat, as you would have wanted the "bait fish" to be alive and causing vibrations in the water.

Also, the black bag is likely clothing, shoes, etc from the crime scene/scenes.

[Sue]

Deepak Aruban Lawyer Oman In Contempt?

Whose "property" are the files which deepak's Aruban attorney refuses to turn over to Dr Phil's legal team, as ordered by US court in kalpoe action?

These files are certainly not the property of lawyer Oman, that's for sure.

Why does Oman resist this legitimate, valid and legally appropriate request?

After all, Oman works for deepak.  Right?

So why are these early witness statements being witheld and under whose authority? 

.

somewhere i read that deepak still owes oman money, and that's why he won't release the files.  i do not have a clue whether it's correct or not.  i don't even remember where i read it.
dennisintn

to me that doesnt make sense this guy holding files cause Deepak owes money.. If Deepak gets his payout from this case he could pay him back plus interest

[imnoangel]

buckeye, she is a specialist on body language. i could try to translate the article, but all she says is if...if.....if....cant be sure. there is no real conclusion to what she says, same thing they all say... he seems to want to tell the story... but am not sure how to tanslate his bodylanguage... so far the expert. regarding this and other comments, we dont do so bad at SM do we? 

[private eye]

Yesterday, someone asked me to give my assessment of Urine as that I am a psychotherapist.  I can't really do that since I've never examined him.  I can only comment on some of the things I've read.  I know that he promotes himself as a player, a ladies man (so to speak).  He seems to be narcissistic - feeling privileged, feeling that only "special" people are worthy of his company and others are beneath him.  He also seems to have a disregard for social mores - at 17/18 finds it fine to gamble, smoke pot, drink, have promiscuous sex, taking part in the whole drug culture, calling himself "pimp" (indicating control over women and sex upon command).  I would bet his "confession" was not a confession, really.  Offenders who "confess" will often conceal critical pieces of evidence or truth so as to clear them (if those statements ever come out).  Urine appears to manipulate everyone around him.  He seems to feel very powerful and untouchable (classic narcissist).   I wonder if there is any evidence of conduct disorder in his youth.  I'd like to see his school records to know if he was opposional-defiant.  Do you think that information would be public record?  Did he go to private school all his life?  If not, I don't know what the laws are, but perhaps his education records might reveal something.  Is there anyone from his past that has spoken to his temperament, personality, moods??  Not recent, but from elementary or middle school?  That might give some indications.

Just some side thoughts.
Shrinking Monk

Fred Maduro seemed to have a handle on Joran's "youth".

Buckeye ... you are correct.  The prison warden ... Fred Maduro and the VDS' have a relationship that goes back a long way.

Could Paulus connection with Fred ... along with Jacobs and Van Straaten ... account for Joran being allowed a cell phone while in prison?

The conflicts of interest that abound in the Natalee Holloway case never cease. 

Janet

+++++++++

http://nataleesfreebirds.blogspot.com/2008/01/you-be-judge.html
YOU BE THE JUDGE!

The prison warden when interviewed was not surprised to see Joran as an inmate because of his explosive temper that he has had child a young child, and his size. However when questioned about the ass whooping Joran received while in prison given by a smaller man, the warden said that Joran was not a street fighter. I took that to mean he was a punk.

I too have diagnosed Joran after careful and exhaustive study and I have diagnosed him as having severe assholeinitis, to be a sexually confused pervert, a bully, and a murder in the first degree:) I have a PHD from the United States School Of HardKnocks and I have been confronted by many similarly genetically damaged thugs. I attribute his genetic shortcomings as resulting from mutations after birth caused from nursing on those "Toxic Titties" of that wretch he calls a momma. Udder van Der Sloot is a horrible excuse for a mother and should have her 2 remaining children removed from her for forcing them to be a part of this spectacle which is surely harming them irreparably each and every day.

ANITA SAVE YOUR YOUNGER TWO CHILDREN. YOU NEVER DO THE WRONG THING BY DOING THE RIGHT THING. THEIR BROTHER DESPARATELY NEEDS HELP, HE NEEDS CONFESSION TO SAVE HIS SOUL. HE KNOWS IT AND HE IS HURTING SOOOOO BAD THAT HE HAS ALREADY DONE IT TWICE, ONLY TO HAVE YOU TAKE THE HELP HE IS SCREAMING IN PAIN FOR AWAY. THAT IS CHILD ABUSE, AND YOU NEED TO STOP IT. LET JORAN TELL THE TRUTH, ACCEPT HIS CONSEQUENCE, AND HAVE A CHANCE TO LEAD A NORMAL LIFE AFTER HIS PUNISHMENT IS COMPLETE. DID YOU NOT SEE HIM APPLYING ON TAPE TO BE A MOBSTER? THAT IS WHAT THIS PATH IS GOING TO BRING HIM, OR WORSE. THIS IS THE PATH YOU HAVE SENT HIM DOWN.

[Buckeye]

buckeye, she is a specialist on body language. i could try to translate the article, but all she says is if...if.....if....cant be sure. there is no real conclusion to what she says, same thing they all say... he seems to want to tell the story... but am not sure how to tanslate his bodylanguage... so far the expert. regarding this and other comments, we dont do so bad at SM do we? 

Well, if you don't get it and I don't get it...it must be her...thanks.

[caesu]

todays... i saw it in the shop just 2 hours ago

http://xs224.xs.to/xs224/08073/ss010734.png

indeed, i see it now.
but they should cover it a lot more imo.
it hasn't been on the NOS Journaals or RTL Nieuws afaik.
so there is no tv-crew travelling with him.
maybe just a few writing press. i hope they will send a tv-crew to aruba friday.