Natalee Case Discussion #730 2/13 - 2/14/08

[Anna]

I wonder if Joran ever thought about some gangs and crime figures would not like the concept of drugging and raping girls.  Some would even beat the crap out of him for that.  Guess he doesn't know nearly as much about crime figures as he thinks he does.

[Observer]

Frankly, I think she was burned in the incinerator after being moved once or twice, and the Rene guy was killed as he was the only non Dutch who knew. The Aruban policement, even Dompig, did not know that Rudy was being blackmailed by the Dutch COP, and prosecutors, and they kept solving the case, only to have Rudy be forced to clean up the evidence.

I hope you are wrong about that PI! I wonder if Yesenia Castillo is even prison anymore? In her trial she said she didn't kill him and that it was a colombian and a child of corsow. What does child of corsow mean,anyone know?

[Destiny]

Who had access to professional body bags?

All of this is why I have never been able to establish a theory and stick to just one line of thought.

Just not enough known to know what the heck they were doing.

.

Two thoughts come to mind Anna...the beach patrol would have acess to body bags...and the hospital, of which PVD is/was on the committee.board of directors
Oh, and the coroners office too.

[Anna]

In this country, the VOLUNTARY ingestion of drugs or alcohol are NOT an excuse under the law. 

Is the Dutch law totally different on that?

.

[imnoangel]

hi monkeys,
i hope you all had a good nights sleep.


i was wondering: why not email the minister of justice, Hirsch Ballin and ask for a re-investigation and ask for an inquiry as to the roles dompig, van der straaten and karin janssen played? from 15 to 19 februari he will be on aruba and curacao.

any news from aruba yet?

[Anna]

Who had access to professional body bags?

All of this is why I have never been able to establish a theory and stick to just one line of thought.

Just not enough known to know what the heck they were doing.

.

Two thoughts come to mind Anna...the beach patrol would have acess to body bags...and the hospital, of which PVD is/was on the committee.board of directors
Oh, and the coroners office too.

You mean they have a coroner's office?  I thought Joran was allowed to assume that position.  (sarcasm on)

I would think the police would also have body bags especially given the high number of auto accidents.  Victims are supposed to be put into one for transportation from a crime scene, right?

Something was amiss for Joran to be pounding his fists on the car in that video.  I think she was not where he thought she would be as someone had moved the remains.  My guess is Paulus and Uncle Jan.

.

[Anna]

Come to think of it, has anyone ever seen a victim in a body bag in Aruba?

Seems usually they just chuck them into the back of a pick up truck with some rag or other wrapped around them.

.

[caesu]

In this country, the VOLUNTARY ingestion of drugs or alcohol are NOT an excuse under the law. 

Is the Dutch law totally different on that?

.

you mean one person feeding another person drugs/alcohol?
i don't know. but i think with consent that's legal.

only weed is legal by the way.
heavier drugs are illegal but not often prosecuted - only the dealing/trade is (sometimes...) prosecuted, not the consuming (depends of course on the situation/location/circumstances)

[klaasend]

Posted by ElaineS at RU - she is in Aruba right now for a month:

Being here on island for the last two weeks, I can honestly tell you that whether or not Joran is tried in a court of law or not, he has already been tried in the court of public opinion by the locals. They do not want him to come back here, and the operative words they've used in describing him is a "bad punk."

I've had the opportunity to speak to lots of locals, and haven't had to read what's happening here on island second or third hand.

Anyone who thinks that people here are looking the other way, or think that those here feel Joran isn't involved in some fashion are only kidding themselves. Where the talk before was only that of Beth, it's now only that of Joran.. It is what it is.

[Bladerunner]

Who had access to professional body bags?

All of this is why I have never been able to establish a theory and stick to just one line of thought.

Just not enough known to know what the heck they were doing.

.

Two thoughts come to mind Anna...the beach patrol would have acess to body bags...and the hospital, of which PVD is/was on the committee.board of directors
Oh, and the coroners office too.

NOT ONLY DOES THIS GUY HAVE ACCESS TO THEM, THERE IS ONE IN THE PICTURE IMO:

[Frank]

body bags, coroner's office?

Didn't we just learn that Paulus sits on the board of the hospital?

Gee, another coincidence?

[cubbeegirl]

cubeegirl,

My teenager and I argued about this, he was trashing the trainer, defending Clemens before the hearing. I tried to explain to him the consequences of not being truthful.

He didn't get it.

Which brings me to anyone who's been around teenagers knows you can smell the lies before the walk in the door.

So how does anyone believe Joran is solely responsible for this "unsolved" crime?

They arrested the security guards on "the word of Joran van der sloot?"

If that isn't enough to understand the corruption, we will never see justice.

I would think that those security guards should be the ones who are entitled to the big fat compensation that URINE was so smug about his family receiving....

And yes, teenagers can be a challenge....Anita and Paulus have failed terribly with their children, most especially with URINE because they will take every inch given to them and stretch it to a mile..... I always tell mine that is why God has given them parents , to keep them in line.....

[caesu]

hi monkeys,
i hope you all had a good nights sleep.


i was wondering: why not email the minister of justice, Hirsch Ballin and ask for a re-investigation and ask for an inquiry as to the roles dompig, van der straaten and karin janssen played? from 15 to 19 februari he will be on aruba and curacao.

any news from aruba yet?

look what i found:

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2600.msg349427#msg349427

on fok! i am starting a campaign in my signature.

i don't agree with the PVV on a lot of things.
but if the can bring the corruption / cover-up to the public eye...
other parties have just let me down big time.

[Destiny]

Who had access to professional body bags?

All of this is why I have never been able to establish a theory and stick to just one line of thought.

Just not enough known to know what the heck they were doing.

.

Two thoughts come to mind Anna...the beach patrol would have acess to body bags...and the hospital, of which PVD is/was on the committee.board of directors
Oh, and the coroners office too.

NOT ONLY DOES THIS GUY HAVE ACCESS TO THEM, THERE IS ONE IN THE PICTURE IMO:

This is what I was trying to point out the other day when these photos were posted, I think by Klaas, or Rob...

[MumInOhio]

Thanks again Buckeye...Private Eye can probably tell me where to find it...I know he has posted about it.

LOL...I should have refreshed before I posted...Thank You..Have a great day as well!

I don't know which interview you are looking for, but I was with Beth's Mom when Beth called her and told her that the FBI had come to Beth's hotel room, and told her that the boys were "arguing or blaming each other" for who caused "something bad to happen," but that essentially Natalee was dead, and that the interrogators would sort out the who done it in short order. Paul was flying back to Houston when this occurred, and by the time he woke up Saturday, the methodically slow but steady recanting of the confession began. It started off that they could not confirm or deny, and in increments it eventually became that it was never even made. But Beth had called her Mom that Friday, and her Mom had called everybody in the family and they started arriving Saturday morning. Part of the release was that Joran was going to take the police to the fisherman's hut to show them where the body was buried, next week, and he did either Momday-Tuesday, there was film coverage of him showing them where she was supposed to be buried, complete with footage of him obviously frustrated as he slammed his fists on the hood of the police car, but they could find no body. This is the same fisherman's hut where a crab trap and knife had been stolen and the hut broken into. What I found odd, besides the recanting of a confession corroborated by the FBI, was the fact that they did not immediately go search for Natalee's body, nor did they seal off the crime scene, and it was at least 3 days before they went to search. Now if that isn't obviously a chance to execute a coverup I don't know what is. Especially since they later did indeed release the confession, only he would refused to sign it after being allowed to be visited and comforted by his parents while the confession was being typed. Now what sane person would during the confession allow a suspects parents to comfort him, one being an attorney? After that visit, he refused to sign the confession. But it was witnessed by Dompig, the FBI, etc. That is why I think the body was moved several times. Joran seemingly believed that body was buried there. He seemed tired of the whole affair and was ready to end it. The Kalpoe brothers didn't seemingly dispute it either in the taped police car.

Frankly, I think she was burned in the incinerator after being moved once or twice, and the Rene guy was killed as he was the only non Dutch who knew. The Aruban policement, even Dompig, did not know that Rudy was being blackmailed by the Dutch COP, and prosecutors, and they kept solving the case, only to have Rudy be forced to clean up the evidence.

Thank you Private Eye...that is what I recalled. All I am finding, other than blog posts about 'breaking news' reporting this, and one from Paul which didn't go to as much detail, are the 'it didn't happen' and retractions articles. I'm sure there is an interview with Paul Reynolds about the family being called and assembling, but just wanted confirmation.

This was the blog entry that peeked my interest as I had never heard anything like it. I recall 'the after hours' excuse, but nothing on this. Mr T. appeared to be doing a lot of backpeddling in the CNN interview that I found.

Interesting thoughts on Dompig. Thanks!


Not according to Mr. Trappenberg, spokes person for Aruba. He just just shared some information on FOX denying the confession but not vehemently denying that "something bad happened". He was tacitly implying that a confession could have been made but that the manner in which the information was deceminated-to the media-might have been a breach of protocol.
Posted by: Ali G | Saturday, June 11, 2005 at 09:05 AM

[Rob]

Those bio-suits look like what I saw in that missing Aru-Bay Video.

I know I have said that a thousand times....but I swear that's what the looks like.

[Tamikosmom]

Van der Straten knows the details, he said so himself. He offered Joran a plea bargain, illegal in their system. When people don't cooperate and you know first hand they were involved you arrest them and send them to trial.

Jan Van der Straten, as Beth said, is rotten to the very core of his being.

Jan van der Straaten know the truth!  He was willing to manipulate Dutch law when he offered Joran a plea deal.

I cannot comprehend why the words in Joran's book cannot be considered evidence by the two prosecutors that have been assigned to the Natalee Holloway case.

Janet

+++++++++

NO PLEA BARGAINING UNDER DUTCH LAW???

Joran van der Sloot
Joran's Book
June 13, 2005

Page 156
Jan van der Straaten, head commissar of the police, talked to me after lunch around 1 pm, informally at the police station in Oranjestad. He said: Joran, I have known your father for years. I only want to help you. I am going to see to it that you can go to Holland. That you will not have to go to jail, but that you will be committed in a mental institution. You only will have to tell the truth.
Translator - Johanna (BFN)

[Anna]

It looks like a gurney in that photo but not sure about body bag.

Too bad that fence is in the way.

Sure looks like something was up.

[klaasend]

Posted by ElaineS at RU - she is in Aruba right now for a month:

Being here on island for the last two weeks, I can honestly tell you that whether or not Joran is tried in a court of law or not, he has already been tried in the court of public opinion by the locals. They do not want him to come back here, and the operative words they've used in describing him is a "bad punk."

I've had the opportunity to speak to lots of locals, and haven't had to read what's happening here on island second or third hand.

Anyone who thinks that people here are looking the other way, or think that those here feel Joran isn't involved in some fashion are only kidding themselves. Where the talk before was only that of Beth, it's now only that of Joran.. It is what it is.

Another post by ElaineS when asked about PVDS:

Paul is talked about in whispers... but nothing definitive. It's kinda like the "Dutch kid's father is protecting him and always has."

I still have another two weeks here, and am quite anxious to see what's going to happen.

[Destiny]

Who had access to professional body bags?

All of this is why I have never been able to establish a theory and stick to just one line of thought.

Just not enough known to know what the heck they were doing.

.

Two thoughts come to mind Anna...the beach patrol would have acess to body bags...and the hospital, of which PVD is/was on the committee.board of directors
Oh, and the coroners office too.

NOT ONLY DOES THIS GUY HAVE ACCESS TO THEM, THERE IS ONE IN THE PICTURE IMO:

This is what I was trying to point out the other day when these photos were posted, I think by Klaas, or Rob...

Can some Monkey higher up the intellegence chain, please re-post the full photo of the stretcher?