Natalee Case Discussion #731 2/14 /08 - 2/15/08

[Rob]

This is rumored to be Paulus's brother -



Marco

VVF party.

On Dana's show of 12/14/2006, Jossy mentioned Marco as Paulus' brother and said he is involved with the government in the NL, specifically with economic policy.

in dutch that's VVD.
liberal party. but in europa that's different from america.
because liberal is here on the right of political spectrum.

Kermit has all of this individual's information.

[blah]

This is rumored to be Paulus's brother -



Marco

VVF party.

On Dana's show of 12/14/2006, Jossy mentioned Marco as Paulus' brother and said he is involved with the government in the NL, specifically with economic policy.

OK....that's the photo I remember...Thanks to all...I really thought I was losing my mind  ...for some reason I could not connect the name Marco w/ that face. TY!

this guy looks like a f**!

[Frijole]

Earlier you were discussing having an investigation of the investigation.

THAT WAS ALREADY DONE!!!

Remember?

I can't even remember when but quite a while ago.  A female from Curacao came over.  She was to spend time reviewing all of the documentation and to report on the investigation.

WHAT DID SHE FIND?  I don't remember ever hearing a report, do you?

This is all such bullshit.  A 5 year old could figure out there is pure corruption going on.  I can't believe they have the cojones to announce this.

We need to keep this thing alive while there is momentum.

[Frank]

...with us this evening is Jossy Mansur Diario.

"Jossy what do make of the news that Joran will not be arrested?"

"The OM does not see any grounds for a new arrest of Van der Sloot in the broadcasting and things that were stated afterwards."

As always thanks again Jossy, very informative.

[caesu]

sorry for ramble / rant / not fully thought through

i think i get what you mean.

like it is impossible to have an entire judicial system (actually two) working against you.
but i am just so sickened by all of this.

i am really thinking about how to put those forces in some sort of collision course so the cover-up can't continue.
i mean because of peter r. de vries there is a momentum now. i see opportunities.
you hardly see a dutchie who doesn't think it stinks. and if i speak to one and i ask about his opinion and she doesn't see it -  it just give one or two clues - and the coin drops.
maybe the momentum is a one time event. maybe peter r. next program won't cause such a media-hype as we have seen now.

and then yesterday our foreign minister opens a new building in the hague and he says: "As you know, the reputation of The Hague as the judicial capital of the world 'goes to my heart'" (meaning: is very very important). really that almost made me puke.

in the hague:
    * International Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia, (ICTY)
    * Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons, (OPCW)
    * International Court of Justice, located in the Peace Palace.
    * International Criminal Court, (ICC).
    * European Police Office, (Europol)
    * Hague Academy of International Law, center for high-level education in both public and private international law.
    * Permanent Court of Arbitration, the oldest institution for international dispute resolution.
    * Hague Conference on Private International Law, (HCCH), the oldest and preeminent private international law harmonization institution.
    * Iran-United States Claims Tribunal
    * Eurojust, European Union body composed of national prosecutors.
    * European Patent Office
    * The European Library

i mean come on. and they send bad prosecutors, judges to aruba.
for the netherlands it is hugely important to be seen as the most lawfull righteous country in the universe.

and then i think. what if a mother lost her child on aruba or somewhere else - and she didn't have good communicational skills, didn't know how to say the right words on camera, more children to take care of, just enough money to pay the bills, i mean i could go on and on. if you then face a judicial system. you stand no chance at all in the world.
so i think if this thing gets exposed, other countries will see that at the end they won't get away with denying a mother to know what happened to her child. like a big warning. don't ever mess those things up because all involved will be the shame of the world.

so that's way i keep searching for ways.
but who am i? what can i do?

aruban parliament won't do it. usa won't get involved in dutch / aruban judicial issues.
i've read some other american blogs and they think it's just a digusting media-hype.
and they are right! this joran-tape played over and over again made me sick after one day already.
so they look away, or try to make a really funny parody; and that's how they miss what's behind it: how corrupt aruba is.

boycot won't work. dutch will bail aruba out. and most dutch trade is intra-european.
i think hero brinkman is the only chance to get the word out in the dutch parliament at he moment.
because of his stance on aruba / antilles but also because of the jan van der straten-coincident

but i've got a few more scenario's in my head.

caesu - ramble away...

We have three justice systems working against us and Natalee and her family. Then throw in all the other interests. Columbia, Venezuela, North Korea, Cuba... etc. It's an uphill battle. That's reason enough not to travel to Aruba.

As for all of the international judicial bodies you listed - we have all written to them before and are very familiar with the letter writing campaign.

I do agree there is some momentum, but we had momentum before only to have the corrupt Wit and Smid free the suspects. There's always tomorrow.

In the bizarro world of Aruba, nothing works like you might think it should or could. It's like the fifth dimension. Everyone dies of natural causes with one hand in their pocket at age 38. Totally normal.

In my opinion, someone needs to remove everyone in power and replace them with an intermittent government until a free election can be held.

caesu - the deeper you dig, the worse it looks. Everyday reveals a new scheme and the player involved.

i know too much at stake.
just one girl. don't want to start a war about it.
WWI started by an act of one man.
WWII also really, by a dutchie - reichstag fire - enabling act - dictatorship.
maybe it's already been decided not to fix this.
or the governments keep a special trick card in their pockets for in case they need it.

but now joran is free to go, that's something else to worry about.

[Tamikosmom]

The myth that Paulus "knows too much" is annoying. That essentially immunizes almost every Dutch person working on that island. What's he going to do?

He and his family are liars, let him sing whatever he wants, just throw him in jail and let him tell his stories to the wall, nobody will care.

To me, this has more to do with what's left of Aruba's "image."

Their brand has been badly damaged and the truth about what a few people did, if it comes out now, will be fatal.

Frank ... I believe that Aruba never anticipated the media attention that Natalee's mother would dictate.

I think it all started out very simple ... Paulus covered up for the wrongdoing of Joran which had resulted in the unintentional death of Natalee Holloway.

Then it got more complicated.  As a favor to a collegue ... Dennis Jacobs, Jan vander Straaten and Karin Janssen as well as certain judges ... in the investigative process ... took measures to distance Paulus, Joran, the Kalpoes and the sons of the elite.

By the time that the "powers that be" in the Aruban investigation realized that the disappearance of an 18 year old American citizen was not going to go away ... that Beth and Jug were forces to be reckoned with ... it was too late to turn back.

It was no longer just about Joran, the Kalpoes, the sons of the elite and Paulus' participation in the events of that fateful morning ... it was now about exposing those within the Aruban Law Enforcement, Prosecutor's Office, Aruban/Dutch Governments as well as the Judicary ... who were involved in or aware of the coverup.  It was about exposing Aruba's underground economy ... drugs, prostitution, gambling, money laundering ...

I suspect that the media attention which has been focused on the Natalee Holloway case is the saving grace that has spared the lives of Joran, Paulus, Deepak and Satish.  These four are Aruba's biggest liability.

Janet





Janet

[cubbeegirl]

Even though we knew this was going to happen I am sick......
There never was any thought given to re-arresting URINE......
I am sick to think about having to see Joe Taco running his mouth about URINE's
innocence......
I am sick to think of how Beth,Dave and the rest of Natalee's family have to feel about this......


I stand with the girl!

[blah]

Someone over there in the Netehrlands needs to start up a riot in the streets and then they need to lynch that mother Fer

[Nut44x4]

  so.......back to square 1?? The Golden Boy always gets a free pass. Makes me sick...but I just felt this is what would be ... I will say more later...I am mad and sad and.....well, you all know

[Frank]

Yes Janet, of course.

Wondering when the media will focus on this, Joran is a waste of time in solving this case.

[blah]

Jansen goes on vacation Joran walks

Mos goes on vacation Joran walks

Lynch all 3 of these corrupt assholes

[Frank]

Who's giving up?

I feel refreshed, if we could FOCUS ON THE ADULTS NOW?

[cubbeegirl]

Earlier you were discussing having an investigation of the investigation.

THAT WAS ALREADY DONE!!!

Remember?

I can't even remember when but quite a while ago.  A female from Curacao came over.  She was to spend time reviewing all of the documentation and to report on the investigation.

WHAT DID SHE FIND?  I don't remember ever hearing a report, do you?

This is all such bullshit.  A 5 year old could figure out there is pure corruption going on.  I can't believe they have the cojones to announce this.

We need to keep this thing alive while there is momentum.

Yes, we do and I for one intend to bombard every member of MSM that I can to try to keep this alive....

[Tylergal]

It was about covering up crime on DSI which is what they have always done.  There is really no telling how many murders are perpetrated there each and every year and it was not until Beth & Jug went there that all lid was about to blow off the pressure cooker, which DSI still is, a pressure cooker about to erupt. It will come and all the DSE will be exposed.  The emperor and all his cronies will stand barren before the world, no planes will travel to and fro once this is exposed, the hotels will be boarded up, the golf courses will appear torched from lack of water, the man-made beaches will fall into disrepair and the fish will start dying, the stench will be worse than anyone has ever smelled.  It's coming.  It takes time. 

[Nut44x4]

Earlier you were discussing having an investigation of the investigation.

THAT WAS ALREADY DONE!!!

Remember?

I can't even remember when but quite a while ago.  A female from Curacao came over.  She was to spend time reviewing all of the documentation and to report on the investigation.

WHAT DID SHE FIND?  I don't remember ever hearing a report, do you?

This is all such bullshit.  A 5 year old could figure out there is pure corruption going on.  I can't believe they have the cojones to announce this.

We need to keep this thing alive while there is momentum.

Yes.....I remember. In fact, I posted something not long ago at BFN re: this...I will look for it.

[Nut44x4]

Earlier you were discussing having an investigation of the investigation.

THAT WAS ALREADY DONE!!!

Remember?

I can't even remember when but quite a while ago.  A female from Curacao came over.  She was to spend time reviewing all of the documentation and to report on the investigation.

WHAT DID SHE FIND?  I don't remember ever hearing a report, do you?

This is all such bullshit.  A 5 year old could figure out there is pure corruption going on.  I can't believe they have the cojones to announce this.

We need to keep this thing alive while there is momentum.

This is a report on the investigation of the investigators
from Amigoe Spring of 2006


ORANJESTAD – An investigation report on the efficiency of the Police Corps of Aruba (KPA) regarding integrity, states that the control on work procedure is poorly; promotional transfers take place, while there is a disciplinary investigation going; and there is no correct follow up after irregularities within the corps are signaled.

Forensic Services Caribbean in Curaçao did the investigation by order of Justice-minister Rudy Croes (MEP). Amigoe learned this from documents that the paper received for perusal. The report was already given to the then chief of police Ronny Bernadina on April 3rd of this year. The investigation took place in 2005 and based on the findings, Forensic Services Caribbean advices to draw up a master plan to deal with the integrity risks. Based on conversations with some key-officials within the KPA and external partners of the corps, like the Security Service, the Public Prosecutor, and the Coastguard, they have mapped nine risks. They have also analyzed summaries of integrity rules violations within the corps. They first noticed that many rules regarding work procedures and work processes are established, but that these are not univocal and not conveniently arranged. The procedures differ per (police-, editor) district and are implemented or interpreted differently.” Besides, several regulations are not complete. Not everybody is familiar with the procedures, they are difficult of access, and several of the versions used are outdated. Several procedures are too complex and have therefore lost their powers. “They have become dead letters”, states the report. There is lack of control on the observance of the procedures in all sectors of the organization. This has to do with not having qualitatively good employees on managerial positions. Another reason is that there is lack of open culture, in which employees dare to talk to each other. In order to restrict this risk, the bureau advices to further specify the career policy and to organize trainings that would provoke a culture change within the police corps. A third risk that can cause the integrity of the corps to come into play is the lack of confidence when it comes to exchange information. Confidential information is leaked to third parties and nobody knows what to do with the information or that the information can be used against you. “This lack of confidence has consequences for the internal- and external communication”, states the report. It also forms a hindrance for working effectively and efficiently. Their advice is again a culture chance in order to create confidence.
~~~~~~~~~~~

[blah]

[caesu]

i didn't expect this.
i know you guys did. but that shows how long you guys are on the case.
i don't know what's going to happen.
maybe they hope for a suicide or lynching.
he won't be able to go anywhere.
even if they show a million years of joran singin christmas carols on all tv networks.
everybody hates his guts.

do you think the news networks are going to call peter r. de vries now?

i hope the networks are noticing that balkenende is in aruba tomorrow.
to get a nice mugshot of him together with rudy croes.

[Rob]

i know too much at stake.
just one girl. don't want to start a war about it.
WWI started by an act of one man.
WWII also really, by a dutchie - reichstag fire - enabling act - dictatorship.
maybe it's already been decided not to fix this.
or the governments keep a special trick card in their pockets for in case they need it.

but now joran is free to go, that's something else to worry about.

you're right about a lot being at stake. There really is.
no one is going to havw a war over it, although some do want the Sloots dead. I'm not one of them. I just prefer suffering.

But the Dutch did not burn down the Reichtag . . .  the Nazi's did it themselves and blamed the Russian Communists. IIRC and I think I do.

Right . . joran is 10 clicks from you my friend. That is a worry.

[Tamikosmom]

Posted by Lazlo at RU with full translation by Lazlo:

Full translation:

15 Februari 2008 01:07

Van der Sloot niet opnieuw opgepakt
Joran van der Sloot wordt niet opnieuw opgepakt voor de verdwijning van Natalee Holloway op Aruba. Dat heeft de Nederlandse advocaat van Van der Sloot te horen gekregen van het OM op Aruba.

Het OM deed nieuw onderzoek na het programma van Peter R. de Vries waarin Van der Sloot werd gefilmd met een verborgen camera. Tegen een infiltrant zei hij dat hij voor de verdwijning van het Amerikaanse meisje verantwoordelijk was. Later noemde hij dat verzinsels.

Het OM ziet in de uitzending en de uitspraken daarna geen grond voor een nieuwe aanhouding van Van der Sloot.

Van der Sloot not to be arrested again.
Joran van der Sloot will not be arrested again for the disappearance of Natalee Holloway on Aruba. That is what his Dutch lawyer was told by the OM on Aruba.

The OM performed a new investigation after the show of Peter R. de Vries in which Van Der Sloot was filmed with a hidden camera. To an infiltrant he said that he was responsible for the disappearance of the American girl. Later he said he had made that up.

The OM does not see any grounds for a new arrest of Van der Sloot in the broadcasting and things that were stated afterwards.

http://www.nos.nl/nos/artikelen/2008/02/art000001C86F632DF5E142.html

My understand of the above is that Hans Mos withdrew his appeal of the judge's ruling of last week which deemed there was not sufficient evidence to again arrest Joran van der Sloot.  It appears that Hans Mos ... after reconsidering ... came to the same conclusion as the Judge.

I could be wrong but ... the implication is that the three judge panel were not involved in the latest decision.

I am done!!!

Janet