Natalee Case Discussion #735 2/24/08 -2/27/08

[jackb]

"journalistic investigations harm the criminal investigation, said justice. "


I believe that journalistic investigations are the only reason this case is still alive.

Journalistic investigations are the only reason there is any evidence in this case.

Scared Monkeys keep them ALL in check!!!

  My question is:  What Investigation.  The only investigation they have had is to find evidence so it can be covered up and destroyed.    Jack Blue

[jackb]

Wonder if one of urin's thug friends was named daury ??? or if they where involved ???

It is doubtful "daury" would be running to his car with his big azz showing 45 feet after everything else is visable and leaving a trail of sweat to his car (with the hunk of DNA evidence cut out.)           Jack Blue

[Tamikosmom]

In November, 2007 ... how did ten prosecution lawyers ... who concurred with the prosecutor deem that there was suffient new evidence to reopen the Natalee Holloway case ... get it so wrong.  Even John Q. Kelly ... for the first time ... had the same mindset as the defence and ... ulitmately the judge ... THERE WAS NO NEW EVIDENCE!

I contend that the November, 2007 detentions of Joran, Deepak and Satish were part of an elaborate deception ... a means to detained so that an Aruba plan could be collaborated in regards to the impending SEGMENT FIVE Peter Devries video recording that Hans Mos was aware of.

Either it is believed that Hans Mos is on the side of justice for Natalee Holloway or ... he is not.  Logic implies if the prosecution is not on the side of justice for Natalee Holloway ... he is part of the coverup and chances are ... JORAN WAS FORWARNED ABOUT THE FIFTH SEGMENT OF THE PETER DEVRIES VIDEO RECORDING.

Janet

+++++++++++++


NOVEMBER, 2007 DETAINMENT - EVIDENCE
 
Hans Mos
ABC NEWS
November 26, 2007

Hans Mos, Aruba's chief prosecutor, told ABC News he believes the the new evidence makes the case against the three men stronger than it was two years.

"We are convinced if we had had this evidence we have now they would not have been released by the court at that time," Mos said.
tp://sendtofriend.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3912737


Hans Mos
On the Record with Greta
November 27, 2007

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: Breaking news from Aruba, Joran van der Sloot ordered to stay behind bars for at least eight more days. Now, the Kalpoe brothers already got the same news last week. Now, all three suspects were re-arrested. Why? The prosecutor has now charged all three with voluntary manslaughter of Natalee Holloway.

MOS: And this decision to re-arrest these three suspects was a decision taken by 10 lawyers, by 10 lawyers sitting around a table (INAUDIBLE) whole afternoon, being presented the new material.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,313168,00.html


Hans Mos
CNN
November 30, 2007

Mos has told CNN he believes authorities have enough evidence to prove Holloway is dead, even if her body is never found. He has suggested her death was an accident.

The new evidence against the three men was gathered from advanced techniques used to re-examine existing information, including cell phone records and text messages exchanged the night Holloway disappeared, Mos has said.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/30/aruba.holloway/index.html


Judge Approves Transfer for Suspect in Natalee Holloway Disappearance Case
Thursday, November 22, 2007

THE HAGUE, Netherlands —  A Dutch judge on Thursday approved the transfer to Aruba of a student suspected in the 2005 disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway on the Caribbean resort island, a prosecutor said.

Joran van der Sloot, 20, was arrested Wednesday in the central city of Arnhem on suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily harm that resulted in Holloway's death.

Two other suspects, Surinamese brothers Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, were arrested in Aruba.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,312568,00.html


NOVEMEBER, 2007 DETAINMENT - NEW EVIDENCE FAILS TO MATERIALIZE.

Aruban defense attorneys dispute alleged evidence in Holloway case
The Associated Press Published: December 21, 2007

ORANJESTAD, Aruba: A suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway never mentioned her death in an online chat, his lawyer said Friday, contradicting Aruban prosecutors who called the comment key new evidence in the case.

The chat log fell far short of justifying the arrest of Deepak Kalpoe, one of three men seen with the American teen the night of her disappearance, said attorney Ronald Wix.

A court in the Dutch Caribbean island agreed and quickly released Kalpoe, along with brother Satish and a third suspect, Joran van der Sloot. Now, authorities should leave the three men alone, Wix told reporters.

"If they as much as look at our clients too long, we'll take them to court," said Wix, who also represents Satish Kalpoe.

The three suspects were seen leaving a bar with Holloway on the final night of her high school graduation trip to the island.

Aruban prosecutors detailed the chat log for the first time Thursday, saying it was a key clue that they hoped would break open the long-stalled investigation. The men did not speak with investigators while detained and a judge ordered their release for lack of evidence.

Upon their release, authorities said they had reached a dead end after two years of pursuing fruitless searches and leads, though they could still prosecute the men if they uncover evidence.

In discussing the online chat, prosecutor Hans Mos told reporters that one of the suspects — he did not disclose which — wrote that Holloway, 18 at the time of disappearance, was dead. He also said Internet messages among two suspects discussed meeting drunk American girls in Aruba.

Wix said the prosecution misinterpreted Deepak Kalpoe's Internet chats.

The 24-year-old native of Suriname in fact told a friend he was upset and thought it was stupid of him to let Holloway, whom he called a drunk stranger, get into his car, the attorney said.

Kalpoe then commented on the death of a tennis teacher who drowned in Aruba almost three years ago. When prosecutors translated his writing from Papiamento to Dutch, they substituted 'the death' to 'her death,' and assumed he was talking about Holloway, Wix said. Most Arubans speak Papiamento, a Creole language that has absorbed words from Spanish, Dutch, English and Portuguese.

Mos was on vacation Friday and could not be reached for a response. Another prosecutor, Dop Kruimel, did not immediately return phone calls seeking comment.
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/12/21/news/CB-GEN-Aruba-Missing-Teen.php


John Q. Kelly
On the Record w/ Greta
December 4, 2007

KELLY: Well, in their press release and even in conversations. I had a long discussion with him Thanksgiving morning after the arrests, and you know, he indicated that they were very confident, this new evidence they had, this incriminating evidence. And it turns out, quite frankly, that it is nothing new ...

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So you can say with 100 percent certainly there's nothing new, right?

KELLY: I can say it with 99 percent.

<snipped>

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY ATTORNEY: Disappointing, Greta. I think it was disappointing to me and actually extraordinarily painful and almost cruel for Beth and Dave after being down there.

They'd like to get some answers and they'd like to see some progress made. And it's not fair to bring them down there with the false promises, with raised expectations, sort of a dog and pony show down there with no substance.

And it was — it just really took whatever spirit, almost, that Beth and Dave had left, went through that this weekend. It was really — it was terribly painful, for lack of a better expression.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,314966,00.html
 

Jug Twitty
DANA PRETZER
December 21, 2007

TWITTY: ... she (Beth) said that the prosecutor lied to them when he told them that there was new evidence.
Transcript - Heli (RU)


Joe Tacopina - Defense Attorney
THE LINEUP
December 2, 2007

There's no new evidence, look we're here in December now, they accept their own deadline for December 31. I've seen the 14 pages, there's no new evidence and there's certainly no new incriminating evidence ...
Transcript - Heli (RU)


Ronald Wix
Associated Press
December 20, 2007

Ronald Wix, an attorney for the Kalpoe brothers, denied that prosecutors had new evidence.

"All they did was recycle old evidence and claim it was new evidence," Wix said ...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22345541/

[Jo-An]

Thanks GBNW. 

I think the inflection of the voice of Jordan is off in the tape that was played in the US. too.  When you hear it in Dutch, in Joran's inflection, it sounds nastier.  The man who did the voice over did not match it, imo.

Also very, very important imo:
when "Daury" comes to help get rid of the body, Joran says what "Daury" said:
"Joran, what happened." He says in with a very strong Aruban accent.
So my conclusion is that "Daury" is a native local, more a "Freddy" than a "Daddy".
Especially the way he says the name "Joran", like Joráááán.

Here's the clip, at about 0'58/0'59 seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV_D9qnuX2E

Jo-An good observation but the way he says JORAAN is also the same way his father says it
Actually this "Daury" says: Joraan what have you done? Normally one would expect someone to ask what happened unless there was visual indication that something truely bad happened.

Yes, you're right, the first time he says "Joráán, what have you done?" Only a bit later he says "What happened?"
I just think that the way that Joran pronounces his own name (as the way that "Daury" says it) has a very strong Aruban accent.
A bit high-pitched...

[Bladerunner]

In November, 2007 ... how did ten prosecution lawyers ... who concurred with the prosecutor deem that there was suffient new evidence to reopen the Natalee Holloway case ... get it so wrong.  Even John Q. Kelly ... for the first time ... had the same mindset as the defence and ... ulitmately the judge ... THERE WAS NO NEW EVIDENCE!

I contend that the November, 2007 detentions of Joran, Deepak and Satish were part of an elaborate deception ... a means to detained so that an Aruba plan could be collaborated in regards to the impending SEGMENT FIVE Peter Devries video recording that Hans Mos was aware of.

Either it is believed that Hans Mos is on the side of justice for Natalee Holloway or ... he is not.  Logic implies if the prosecution is not on the side of justice for Natalee Holloway ... he is part of the coverup and chances are ... JORAN WAS FORWARNED ABOUT THE FIFTH SEGMENT OF THE PETER DEVRIES VIDEO RECORDING.

Janet

+++++++++++++


NOVEMBER, 2007 DETAINMENT - EVIDENCE
 
Hans Mos
ABC NEWS
November 26, 2007

Hans Mos, Aruba's chief prosecutor, told ABC News he believes the the new evidence makes the case against the three men stronger than it was two years.

"We are convinced if we had had this evidence we have now they would not have been released by the court at that time," Mos said.
tp://sendtofriend.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3912737


Hans Mos
On the Record with Greta
November 27, 2007

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: Breaking news from Aruba, Joran van der Sloot ordered to stay behind bars for at least eight more days. Now, the Kalpoe brothers already got the same news last week. Now, all three suspects were re-arrested. Why? The prosecutor has now charged all three with voluntary manslaughter of Natalee Holloway.

MOS: And this decision to re-arrest these three suspects was a decision taken by 10 lawyers, by 10 lawyers sitting around a table (INAUDIBLE) whole afternoon, being presented the new material.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,313168,00.html


Hans Mos
CNN
November 30, 2007

Mos has told CNN he believes authorities have enough evidence to prove Holloway is dead, even if her body is never found. He has suggested her death was an accident.

The new evidence against the three men was gathered from advanced techniques used to re-examine existing information, including cell phone records and text messages exchanged the night Holloway disappeared, Mos has said.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/30/aruba.holloway/index.html


Judge Approves Transfer for Suspect in Natalee Holloway Disappearance Case
Thursday, November 22, 2007

THE HAGUE, Netherlands —  A Dutch judge on Thursday approved the transfer to Aruba of a student suspected in the 2005 disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway on the Caribbean resort island, a prosecutor said.

Joran van der Sloot, 20, was arrested Wednesday in the central city of Arnhem on suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily harm that resulted in Holloway's death.

Two other suspects, Surinamese brothers Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, were arrested in Aruba.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,312568,00.html


NOVEMEBER, 2007 DETAINMENT - NEW EVIDENCE FAILS TO MATERIALIZE.

Aruban defense attorneys dispute alleged evidence in Holloway case
The Associated Press Published: December 21, 2007

ORANJESTAD, Aruba: A suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway never mentioned her death in an online chat, his lawyer said Friday, contradicting Aruban prosecutors who called the comment key new evidence in the case.

The chat log fell far short of justifying the arrest of Deepak Kalpoe, one of three men seen with the American teen the night of her disappearance, said attorney Ronald Wix.

A court in the Dutch Caribbean island agreed and quickly released Kalpoe, along with brother Satish and a third suspect, Joran van der Sloot. Now, authorities should leave the three men alone, Wix told reporters.

"If they as much as look at our clients too long, we'll take them to court," said Wix, who also represents Satish Kalpoe.

The three suspects were seen leaving a bar with Holloway on the final night of her high school graduation trip to the island.

Aruban prosecutors detailed the chat log for the first time Thursday, saying it was a key clue that they hoped would break open the long-stalled investigation. The men did not speak with investigators while detained and a judge ordered their release for lack of evidence.

Upon their release, authorities said they had reached a dead end after two years of pursuing fruitless searches and leads, though they could still prosecute the men if they uncover evidence.

In discussing the online chat, prosecutor Hans Mos told reporters that one of the suspects — he did not disclose which — wrote that Holloway, 18 at the time of disappearance, was dead. He also said Internet messages among two suspects discussed meeting drunk American girls in Aruba.

Wix said the prosecution misinterpreted Deepak Kalpoe's Internet chats.

The 24-year-old native of Suriname in fact told a friend he was upset and thought it was stupid of him to let Holloway, whom he called a drunk stranger, get into his car, the attorney said.

Kalpoe then commented on the death of a tennis teacher who drowned in Aruba almost three years ago. When prosecutors translated his writing from Papiamento to Dutch, they substituted 'the death' to 'her death,' and assumed he was talking about Holloway, Wix said. Most Arubans speak Papiamento, a Creole language that has absorbed words from Spanish, Dutch, English and Portuguese.

Mos was on vacation Friday and could not be reached for a response. Another prosecutor, Dop Kruimel, did not immediately return phone calls seeking comment.
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/12/21/news/CB-GEN-Aruba-Missing-Teen.php


John Q. Kelly
On the Record w/ Greta
December 4, 2007

KELLY: Well, in their press release and even in conversations. I had a long discussion with him Thanksgiving morning after the arrests, and you know, he indicated that they were very confident, this new evidence they had, this incriminating evidence. And it turns out, quite frankly, that it is nothing new ...

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So you can say with 100 percent certainly there's nothing new, right?

KELLY: I can say it with 99 percent.

<snipped>

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY ATTORNEY: Disappointing, Greta. I think it was disappointing to me and actually extraordinarily painful and almost cruel for Beth and Dave after being down there.

They'd like to get some answers and they'd like to see some progress made. And it's not fair to bring them down there with the false promises, with raised expectations, sort of a dog and pony show down there with no substance.

And it was — it just really took whatever spirit, almost, that Beth and Dave had left, went through that this weekend. It was really — it was terribly painful, for lack of a better expression.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,314966,00.html
 

Jug Twitty
DANA PRETZER
December 21, 2007

TWITTY: ... she (Beth) said that the prosecutor lied to them when he told them that there was new evidence.
Transcript - Heli (RU)


Joe Tacopina - Defense Attorney
THE LINEUP
December 2, 2007

There's no new evidence, look we're here in December now, they accept their own deadline for December 31. I've seen the 14 pages, there's no new evidence and there's certainly no new incriminating evidence ...
Transcript - Heli (RU)


Ronald Wix
Associated Press
December 20, 2007

Ronald Wix, an attorney for the Kalpoe brothers, denied that prosecutors had new evidence.

"All they did was recycle old evidence and claim it was new evidence," Wix said ...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22345541/

Hans Mos is a POS, what a pathetic character in this whole saga!

Hans "the spineless jellyfish" Mos please do us a favor and puke on yourself!

[jackb]

good nite all - ******* maybe their playing 21 instead. I agree what can so many detectives be doing to be so unproductive for so long?

  Covering up evidence as it comes forward.  It takes a long time to make sure all bases are covered, I am sure.      Jack Blue

[blah]

was Mos also responsible for the failed search of the Van Der Sloot compund where they didnt even do the obvious thing - tear up the freshly poured concrete?

He was most likely there to make sure there were no bugs or forensic evidence left behind that could ever be found.

It was a forensic "clean up" mission

[JE]

Thanks GBNW. 

I think the inflection of the voice of Jordan is off in the tape that was played in the US. too.  When you hear it in Dutch, in Joran's inflection, it sounds nastier.  The man who did the voice over did not match it, imo.

Also very, very important imo:
when "Daury" comes to help get rid of the body, Joran says what "Daury" said:
"Joran, what happened." He says in with a very strong Aruban accent.
So my conclusion is that "Daury" is a native local, more a "Freddy" than a "Daddy".
Especially the way he says the name "Joran", like Joráááán.

Here's the clip, at about 0'58/0'59 seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV_D9qnuX2E

Jo-An good observation but the way he says JORAAN is also the same way his father says it
Actually this "Daury" says: Joraan what have you done? Normally one would expect someone to ask what happened unless there was visual indication that something truely bad happened.

Yes, you're right, the first time he says "Joráán, what have you done?" Only a bit later he says "What happened?"
I just think that the way that Joran pronounces his own name (as the way that "Daury" says it) has a very strong Aruban accent.
A bit high-pitched...

On the Pauw&Witteman show the one with the wine throwing incident, his dad also pronounces his sons name like that
i thought it was weird at the time.

[vms]

MF Posted: Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:27 pm     

The earlier report that the Persistance has found something has now been confirmed.
Human remains were found and these sent to the FBI lab in Quantico. 

[vms]

MF added:

The report came back this morning stating that the tests exclude Natalee Holloway.

The OM will release a statement later today.

Last edited by MF on Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:30 pm; edited 1 time in total

[Observer]

MF added:

The report came back this morning stating that the tests exclude Natalee Holloway.

The OM will release a statement later today.

Last edited by MF on Tue Feb 26, 2008 12:30 pm; edited 1 time in total

Thanks VMS! Maybe it is another missing American?

I also wanted to thank the dutch posters for catching the Joraan pronunciation,we would have never caught that and I think it's important.

[Jerry from Ohio]

I don't approve of Patrick being beaten, but I did think that he was a little more streetwise then to keep staying around in Aruba sort of asking for problems  .
  If he had to stay for the inquisition still then for Gods sake man be smart enough to send your wife and kids home for their safety  remember that once they are harmed, then the DAMAGE is done and not much will help you then .
  Please be smart and take them to a safe place to relax and recreate  unless he has something that is unknown that Aruba has to offer him to be there  (Hint Hint ) ?
  I am in support of Patrick, but not impressed  of his good judgement on the streets .

[martini]

comments on fokkinel~

February 18, 2008:
DIJKHOFF, Ruth – Spoke to Paulus on 5-30-05, at approximately 3:30PM at the Caribbean Mercantile Bank in Noord. It is unclear whether she is employed at the CMB

this lady has died, so have many people that were involved, or in the know of things.

February 18, 2008:
Renee Van Huginan (sp) columbian neck tie to him. He was the runner of the valero incinerator!

February 18, 2008:
Paulus Van Der Sloot got the creamatorium to the Island of Aruba for the Wevers funeral home.

February 18, 2008:
Paulus helped Ben Voking (King) in the Matthew case, King states he will now help Paulus with Natalees case. Cover-up?

Info, February 25, 2008:
1. There is no crematorium in Aruba.
2. Wever’s Funeral only has the permit, but no crematorium on their premises or any other place on the island.
3. Renee van Hunigen was no runner at the Valero.
4. 800 person died every year in Aruba, they all are in the know of things.
5. This list is 25% of the people interviewed by the ALE and FBI.

http://www.fokkinel.com/2008/02/the-aruban-connection-or-whos-who-in-the-natalee-case/#comment-672

[jackb]

Thanks GBNW. 

I think the inflection of the voice of Jordan is off in the tape that was played in the US. too.  When you hear it in Dutch, in Joran's inflection, it sounds nastier.  The man who did the voice over did not match it, imo.

Also very, very important imo:
when "Daury" comes to help get rid of the body, Joran says what "Daury" said:
"Joran, what happened." He says in with a very strong Aruban accent.
So my conclusion is that "Daury" is a native local, more a "Freddy" than a "Daddy".
Especially the way he says the name "Joran", like Joráááán.

Here's the clip, at about 0'58/0'59 seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV_D9qnuX2E

I

[greeneyedlady]

I had thoughts that if they ever did this ocean search they might find other human remains there in the water. I wonder who did the DNA test that excluded Natalee? I didn't think Aruba had any place there like Quantico or NFI to do forensic testing?

[jackb]

Thanks GBNW. 

I think the inflection of the voice of Jordan is off in the tape that was played in the US. too.  When you hear it in Dutch, in Joran's inflection, it sounds nastier.  The man who did the voice over did not match it, imo.

Also very, very important imo:


when "Daury" comes to help get rid of the body, Joran says what "Daury" said:
"Joran, what happened." He says in with a very strong Aruban accent.
So my conclusion is that "Daury" is a native local, more a "Freddy" than a "Daddy".
Especially the way he says the name "Joran", like Joráááán.

Here's the clip, at about 0'58/0'59 seconds.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV_D9qnuX2E

  It is also very important to realize the first words were:  Joran what did you do.  Someone knew Joran well enough to know HE did something and/or the victim was in such a state that she appeared to have had something DONE to her.
  Jack blue

[klaasend]

I had thoughts that if they ever did this ocean search they might find other human remains there in the water. I wonder who did the DNA test that excluded Natalee? I didn't think Aruba had any place there like Quantico or NFI to do forensic testing?

MF edited the post:

The earlier report that the Persistance has found something has now been confirmed.
Human remains were found and these sent to the FBI lab in Quantico.

The report came back this morning stating that the tests exclude Natalee Holloway.

The OM will release a statement later today.

[greeneyedlady]

Klaas Thanks, I misunderstood the post.   

[blah]

I had thoughts that if they ever did this ocean search they might find other human remains there in the water. I wonder who did the DNA test that excluded Natalee? I didn't think Aruba had any place there like Quantico or NFI to do forensic testing?

MF edited the post:

The earlier report that the Persistance has found something has now been confirmed.
Human remains were found and these sent to the FBI lab in Quantico.

The report came back this morning stating that the tests exclude Natalee Holloway.

The OM will release a statement later today.

why didnt he or she just say that in the first place?

Sounds like they dont know WTF they are talking about

[klaasend]

Klaas Thanks, I misunderstood the post.   

It will be interresting to see the full press release.