Natalee Case Discussion #736 2/27 - 2/29/08

[Rob]

[klaasend]

Translation posted at BFN:

ORANJESTAD - Joran van der Sloot has spend the past week internally in a psychiatric Institute in the Netherlands. This was confirmed recently by his close family.

The motive of this was because Joran had flipped and wasn't himself anymore. It therefore was necessary that he spend time internally and was given treatment necessary for a better health. This news did not come as a surprise here, to see the inner state van der Sloot was in and the way he was acting by which he involved himself in the case of Natalee Holloway.

A youngster of his age, getting so much negative attention will crack any minute. Comments one can hear on the news here, that this did not come as a surprise. In the past his family wanted to give psychiatric attention because of his bothersome actions within the family. There have been several attempts to have him undergoing treatment of a psychiatrist.

But in all instances Joran denied this and said he did not feel he needed a psychiatrist to help him with his alleged problems.

He answered that to do that he had decided to write a 351 pages counting book, titled "De zaak Holloway", which he produced with the help of a female Dutch journalist. For Joran van der Sloot, the motive for this was it being a form of therapy, to make it possible for him to deal with all the things that had happened inside since the day since he met with Natalee Holloway 3 years ago.

[private eye]

Just had an interesting thought in terms of the timing of this announcement of gagging Joran by putting him in a nice cushioned round room without contact to the outside world.

The Boston tradeshow.

Once the tradeshow team returned home I am certain they where debriefed as to the temperature of the American public.  Asked to gauge the level of improvement or decline in the American travellers attitude toward the Island.  From what it sounds like, the Monkeys did their job.  It is called gorilla marketing in some circles.  Basically a very successful anit-Aruba marketing campaign has been targeted directly on all their efforts to lure travellers back to the island.  

Their report had to be very negative.  It had to be a huge red flag to the powers that be that the situation is bad now and quickly getting worse.  They may have been annoyed with our showing at previous tradeshows but I am certain that they never anticipated that a small group of citizens could be so persistant and dedicated.

They may have had a little powwow and decided that the only way to save their little island was to find a way to end this with as little damage as possible.  The easiest way is to offer up a sacrificial lamb that has been silenced and cannot be believed no matter what he says.  First because he has a self inflicted prooven record as a lier.  Second, because he is a mental patient who is either not in his right mind any longer and doesn't know what he is saying or too medicated structure complete sentences.  In either case, they have the perfect set up to say he is not fit to take the stand and at the same time find a way to try the case in court and find closure.  They will find him guilty without his participation.  Then they will close the case and hope that the world accepts their actions and wait for time to pass and memories to become foggy.

Just my prediction...Nothing more.

I know that I was proud of our monkeys. There was nothing scared about them monkeys in Boston. Over her, over there, armed with the truth, standing with the girl.

[Dayhiker]

My gut tells me...someone has let the cat out of the bag....can't stuff it back in...gums are flapping'...Aruba is in the final moment before the fall...Natalee is coming home...

All it takes is ohe one right pissed off person to say enough is enough. Aruba has been holding its breath for two and a half years waiting for it to go away. Maybe they just can't hold it any longer. One worthless kid and his father have wrecked their island to the tune of a half billion dollars and incalculable sums in its image to the rest of the world. It all stops when Natalee comes home and Joran goes to prison. Then they can have their sleazy island back.

[San]

  Ok, so I've been so frustrated at the lack of progress with the procecution of this case and "if" the ALE don't think JVDS is and K2 are "innocent" then where is the investigation going otherwise??  (No where as it is they know who is guilty and who they have to cover for)...  Our hope at this point is the Persistence finding evidence, but if they don't...what then?  The three stooges go free and there is never justice for Natalee. 

I was looking at photos of the crab trap on line.  It started me thinking - when I was at an ocenographic institue they had this huge crab there picking at empty shells.  They told me that they'll eat the shells - basically making "sand" out of shells.  I was astounded.  I had no idea they'd pick shells apart so much as to leave nothing but grains of leftover shell.  Well, that got me thinking about Natalee.  Could crabs have gotten in and reduced her bones to grains of bone?  Apparently this crab in the aquarium I saw reduced bare shells to grains in a weeks time (or there abouts)... hmm. 

I also wanted to ask about the area of the island that some island natives said would be the 'perfect place" to ditch a corpse - weren't there divers that dove in that area and turned up nothing?  Or was that a different area?  If they didn't search that area, why hasn't any diving team ever gone there to see if they ditched her body over that ledge into he sea? 

Yes, I think JVDS called Daddy.  I think Daddy went out, got money and paid someone off for some reason.  I'm not sure it's to ditch a body - but likely.  Perhaps he was buying silence.  Or, perhaps he's just a gambling addict and found himself short and needed more to feed that addiction...or another...drugs (unlikely...but possible)...or hookers or dancers...common with men that age....needing a thrill, bored in their marriage. 

The last thing that I want to discuss is a more gutteral probability - Joran was into drugs.  Who are the known drug dealers on the island?   How did he get his date rape drugs ("probably")?  Where did he get his pot?  I would bet there was cocaine in his history, too.  Where did he get his ready supply?  Wouldn't they be likely people for him to call in time of need?  Then, he'd call Daddy for money to pay these people off.  Has that line of thinking ever been fully explored?  I'd follow the drug money. 

There was rumor that Joran would film his "trips" with girls - perhaps there was a video ring...  Who would profit from JVDS "innocence" ???  Who would need him to keep going? 

I don't know...just some thoughts.....

I believe Joran's main drug supplier is Lorenzo.

I will bet everything I have that Joran is into cocaine also and not just pot.

[private eye]

Translation posted at BFN:

ORANJESTAD - Joran van der Sloot has spend the past week internally in a psychiatric Institute in the Netherlands. This was confirmed recently by his close family.

The motive of this was because Joran had flipped and wasn't himself anymore. It therefore was necessary that he spend time internally and was given treatment necessary for a better health. This news did not come as a surprise here, to see the inner state van der Sloot was in and the way he was acting by which he involved himself in the case of Natalee Holloway.

A youngster of his age, getting so much negative attention will crack any minute. Comments one can hear on the news here, that this did not come as a surprise. In the past his family wanted to give psychiatric attention because of his bothersome actions within the family. There have been several attempts to have him undergoing treatment of a psychiatrist.

But in all instances Joran denied this and said he did not feel he needed a psychiatrist to help him with his alleged problems.

He answered that to do that he had decided to write a 351 pages counting book, titled "De zaak Holloway", which he produced with the help of a female Dutch journalist. For Joran van der Sloot, the motive for this was it being a form of therapy, to make it possible for him to deal with all the things that had happened inside since the day since he met with Natalee Holloway 3 years ago.

He involved himself by doing the deed, not talking to Patrick. And only the truth will get rid of his demons and gain him a second chance in the court of public opinion.

[Rob]

[ala_gunslinger]

How often does fate give out second chances?

The search by Persistence is a second chance for Aruba.

Aruba can spend millions on advertising.  Everything looks good.  Then JVDS opens his mouth, or texts something, and it ends

up on television.  Not just in the U.S. but all over the world.

It's not the good, it's the bad and the ugly.  Repeated on youtube 50,000+ times, year after year.

The tv special with Persistence showed something good happening for this case.  I didn't see anything ugly in that program,

just hope.  A chance to bring Natalee home. 

Persistence is a positive note.  One ship and crew have the ability to show 100+ items of interest up close, surrounded by

the beauty and wonder of the water.

Persistence is a second chance for Aruba.  No one can change the past, but Aruba has the opportunity to help write the final

chapter in this story.

Persistence is a second chance.  Second chances are priceless.


jmho

WhiskeyGirl, I could not have said it better!  You RAWK!!! (insert rockin icon here!).

If they don't get this we may have to spell it out for them. 

Don't think we won't do everything in our power to expose everything.  We dropped the bomb, twice!  We will not allow you to cover this up anymore.  We will fund this research until we finally find something that gets someones nerve just a little to much.  Then your 'house of cards' will burn so fast, you won't see the flame!

Ya'll need to fix this before we do.

[Dayhiker]

Translation posted at BFN:

ORANJESTAD - Joran van der Sloot has spend the past week internally in a psychiatric Institute in the Netherlands. This was confirmed recently by his close family.

The motive of this was because Joran had flipped and wasn't himself anymore. It therefore was necessary that he spend time internally and was given treatment necessary for a better health. This news did not come as a surprise here, to see the inner state van der Sloot was in and the way he was acting by which he involved himself in the case of Natalee Holloway.

A youngster of his age, getting so much negative attention will crack any minute. Comments one can hear on the news here, that this did not come as a surprise. In the past his family wanted to give psychiatric attention because of his bothersome actions within the family. There have been several attempts to have him undergoing treatment of a psychiatrist.

But in all instances Joran denied this and said he did not feel he needed a psychiatrist to help him with his alleged problems.

He answered that to do that he had decided to write a 351 pages counting book, titled "De zaak Holloway", which he produced with the help of a female Dutch journalist. For Joran van der Sloot, the motive for this was it being a form of therapy, to make it possible for him to deal with all the things that had happened inside since the day since he met with Natalee Holloway 3 years ago.

Po po thang. Joran's only problem is that he's exposed himself as a murderer. That's what he can't handle.

[Magnolia]

  Ok, so I've been so frustrated at the lack of progress with the procecution of this case and "if" the ALE don't think JVDS is and K2 are "innocent" then where is the investigation going otherwise??  (No where as it is they know who is guilty and who they have to cover for)...  Our hope at this point is the Persistence finding evidence, but if they don't...what then?  The three stooges go free and there is never justice for Natalee. 

I was looking at photos of the crab trap on line.  It started me thinking - when I was at an ocenographic institue they had this huge crab there picking at empty shells.  They told me that they'll eat the shells - basically making "sand" out of shells.  I was astounded.  I had no idea they'd pick shells apart so much as to leave nothing but grains of leftover shell.  Well, that got me thinking about Natalee.  Could crabs have gotten in and reduced her bones to grains of bone?  Apparently this crab in the aquarium I saw reduced bare shells to grains in a weeks time (or there abouts)... hmm. 

I also wanted to ask about the area of the island that some island natives said would be the 'perfect place" to ditch a corpse - weren't there divers that dove in that area and turned up nothing?  Or was that a different area?  If they didn't search that area, why hasn't any diving team ever gone there to see if they ditched her body over that ledge into he sea? 

Yes, I think JVDS called Daddy.  I think Daddy went out, got money and paid someone off for some reason.  I'm not sure it's to ditch a body - but likely.  Perhaps he was buying silence.  Or, perhaps he's just a gambling addict and found himself short and needed more to feed that addiction...or another...drugs (unlikely...but possible)...or hookers or dancers...common with men that age....needing a thrill, bored in their marriage. 

The last thing that I want to discuss is a more gutteral probability - Joran was into drugs.  Who are the known drug dealers on the island?   How did he get his date rape drugs ("probably")?  Where did he get his pot?  I would bet there was cocaine in his history, too.  Where did he get his ready supply?  Wouldn't they be likely people for him to call in time of need?  Then, he'd call Daddy for money to pay these people off.  Has that line of thinking ever been fully explored?  I'd follow the drug money. 

There was rumor that Joran would film his "trips" with girls - perhaps there was a video ring...  Who would profit from JVDS "innocence" ???  Who would need him to keep going? 

I don't know...just some thoughts.....

I believe Joran's main drug supplier is Lorenzo.

I will bet everything I have that Joran is into cocaine also and not just pot.

San,  Bet the farm!  I think so also.

[private eye]

  Ok, so I've been so frustrated at the lack of progress with the procecution of this case and "if" the ALE don't think JVDS is and K2 are "innocent" then where is the investigation going otherwise??  (No where as it is they know who is guilty and who they have to cover for)...  Our hope at this point is the Persistence finding evidence, but if they don't...what then?  The three stooges go free and there is never justice for Natalee. 

I was looking at photos of the crab trap on line.  It started me thinking - when I was at an ocenographic institue they had this huge crab there picking at empty shells.  They told me that they'll eat the shells - basically making "sand" out of shells.  I was astounded.  I had no idea they'd pick shells apart so much as to leave nothing but grains of leftover shell.  Well, that got me thinking about Natalee.  Could crabs have gotten in and reduced her bones to grains of bone?  Apparently this crab in the aquarium I saw reduced bare shells to grains in a weeks time (or there abouts)... hmm. 

I also wanted to ask about the area of the island that some island natives said would be the 'perfect place" to ditch a corpse - weren't there divers that dove in that area and turned up nothing?  Or was that a different area?  If they didn't search that area, why hasn't any diving team ever gone there to see if they ditched her body over that ledge into he sea? 

Yes, I think JVDS called Daddy.  I think Daddy went out, got money and paid someone off for some reason.  I'm not sure it's to ditch a body - but likely.  Perhaps he was buying silence.  Or, perhaps he's just a gambling addict and found himself short and needed more to feed that addiction...or another...drugs (unlikely...but possible)...or hookers or dancers...common with men that age....needing a thrill, bored in their marriage. 

The last thing that I want to discuss is a more gutteral probability - Joran was into drugs.  Who are the known drug dealers on the island?   How did he get his date rape drugs ("probably")?  Where did he get his pot?  I would bet there was cocaine in his history, too.  Where did he get his ready supply?  Wouldn't they be likely people for him to call in time of need?  Then, he'd call Daddy for money to pay these people off.  Has that line of thinking ever been fully explored?  I'd follow the drug money. 

There was rumor that Joran would film his "trips" with girls - perhaps there was a video ring...  Who would profit from JVDS "innocence" ???  Who would need him to keep going? 

I don't know...just some thoughts.....

I believe Joran's main drug supplier is Lorenzo.

I will bet everything I have that Joran is into cocaine also and not just pot.

Freud proved early on that cocaine can create some bizarre sexual cravings and a sense of hypersexuality, mostly in the mind of the abuser, after possibly a few amazing initial responses. The fantasies get further out, the thought processes more and more demented, and the ability to perform declines as usage continues, which pushes the user further out of the stream of normalacy as the user tries to get his body to react sexual situations. Anger and violence often accompany the frustration and the need to force the participation of the non user in the role playing.

So I think I agree:)

[jackb]

I got stuck in the last thread, so I'll post this again...

Klass:  That needs OTHER than posting.  Too much for now.  I am sure you are aware of that, however.  Thanks   blue

[ShinkinMonk]

   Wow, I had no idea that JVDS was inpatient for mental health.  My guess is that he's cracking under the pressure - freaking out that so many people are  no buying his bull anymore and feeling cornered.  I bet he's getting a bit scared not sure how to spindoctor his crap anymore.  HOWEVER, that said, I'd bed this is also VERY political - the family trying to "save" him.  "Oh, he has mental health issues, that's why he let Natalee die."  Yeah, ok...then we'll have to have a lot of time processing his malingering allegations of mental health issues.  No doubt he has a narcissitic personality and antisocial tendencies, but I'm not going to buy his "stress" or "depression" or "bipolar" disorder as reason for his substance abuse and irradic behavior.  UGHH.  I hear so much of that crap I get sick of it.  Wah, wah...I'm not responsible - get a set and take responsibility for what you did!! 

As far as the drug money, I don't recall Lorenzo... I'd have to dig and I'm drained...can anyone fill me in (again, please)???  Has that line ever really been followed?  I'd bet the drug gangs there are pretty tight and no one really wants to mess with them.  The ALE probably answer to the higher ups in the drug cartel on the island.

[private eye]

How often does fate give out second chances?

The search by Persistence is a second chance for Aruba.

Aruba can spend millions on advertising.  Everything looks good.  Then JVDS opens his mouth, or texts something, and it ends

up on television.  Not just in the U.S. but all over the world.

It's not the good, it's the bad and the ugly.  Repeated on youtube 50,000+ times, year after year.

The tv special with Persistence showed something good happening for this case.  I didn't see anything ugly in that program,

just hope.  A chance to bring Natalee home. 

Persistence is a positive note.  One ship and crew have the ability to show 100+ items of interest up close, surrounded by

the beauty and wonder of the water.

Persistence is a second chance for Aruba.  No one can change the past, but Aruba has the opportunity to help write the final

chapter in this story.

Persistence is a second chance.  Second chances are priceless.


jmho

WhiskeyGirl, I could not have said it better!  You RAWK!!! (insert rockin icon here!).

If they don't get this we may have to spell it out for them. 

Don't think we won't do everything in our power to expose everything.  We dropped the bomb, twice!  We will not allow you to cover this up anymore.  We will fund this research until we finally find something that gets someones nerve just a little to much.  Then your 'house of cards' will burn so fast, you won't see the flame!

Ya'll need to fix this before we do.

As another said, Aruba needs to become a part of the solution

[Destiny]

My gut tells me...someone has let the cat out of the bag....can't stuff it back in...gums are flapping'...Aruba is in the final moment before the fall...Natalee is coming home...

The timing is a bit curious with new searches/info and Joran being admitted to a psychiatric hospital.

"Nothing bad can ever happen to a tourist in Aruba"
Maybe they are finally seeing that this plan is killing there country? Are we seeing the first faze of Tamikosmom's theory on the Aruban ending?

I Hope So!!!  I just now called KIA...as soon as I said I was calling from US...woman on phone...said...no no no no....you must call back in morning ask for ******...she  now handles the press....I told her I was not with press...she said they are*forbidden* to talk with *anyone* about anything dealing with Natalee Holloway...she was very quick to remind me that Aruba is doing fine...said that Jorin is NOT in hospital when I slipped it in real fast....same old...same old...

[Kat_Gram]

The motive of this was because Joran had flipped and wasn't himself
Now that is a strange thing to think about...
When was he ever " himself " ?  I am all for people getting help but this just sounds like a PR move. Sure, this can't be pleasant for him, ppl waiting for him in the streets, his name being spoken in an unkind way, on his home turf, Peter DeVries on him like white on rice, but when he comes out, it's just more of the same for him. He would have been out by now and all reahab'd up if he had told the truth three years ago. He was a juvenile in 2005 after all and the courts are lenient on first offenders in most places. I am assuming what he told Patrick was correct. 

[anidac]

Translation posted at BFN:

ORANJESTAD - Joran van der Sloot has spend the past week internally in a psychiatric Institute in the Netherlands. This was confirmed recently by his close family.

The motive of this was because Joran had flipped and wasn't himself anymore. It therefore was necessary that he spend time internally and was given treatment necessary for a better health. This news did not come as a surprise here, to see the inner state van der Sloot was in and the way he was acting by which he involved himself in the case of Natalee Holloway.

A youngster of his age, getting so much negative attention will crack any minute. Comments one can hear on the news here, that this did not come as a surprise. In the past his family wanted to give psychiatric attention because of his bothersome actions within the family. There have been several attempts to have him undergoing treatment of a psychiatrist.

But in all instances Joran denied this and said he did not feel he needed a psychiatrist to help him with his alleged problems.

He answered that to do that he had decided to write a 351 pages counting book, titled "De zaak Holloway", which he produced with the help of a female Dutch journalist. For Joran van der Sloot, the motive for this was it being a form of therapy, to make it possible for him to deal with all the things that had happened inside since the day since he met with Natalee Holloway 3 years ago.

And this is Paulus and his family distancing them selves from Joran and the ticking time bomb that is about to explod.  They must know he will tried and convicted.  The goal now is to now get any mud splashed on them in the process.  In their minds this is probably the gentlist way they can "Disappear" their own son before he implicates them.

[Observer]

It was devastating for the Arubans in Boston that I assure you and it was witnessed first hand by Ceo of AHATA Rob Smith. They will get a second dosing of more of the same this saturday in NYC. With the recent media coverage and all that has happened the last few months this is something the Aruban Govt can never combat with there misinformation campaigns and documentary's. There is no answer for it except to do whats right or some type of resolution.

The writing is on the wall and they would have to be blind to ignore it. Rob Smith told us he was confident this would be solved soon. When I asked why he would not answer but he hoped we would help build up Aruba's image again when this is over. I hope he is right and he knows something that we do not.

[jackb]

My gut tells me...someone has let the cat out of the bag....can't stuff it back in...gums are flapping'...Aruba is in the final moment before the fall...Natalee is coming home...

All it takes is ohe one right pissed off person to say enough is enough. Aruba has been holding its breath for two and a half years waiting for it to go away. Maybe they just can't hold it any longer. One worthless kid and his father have wrecked their island to the tune of a half billion dollars and incalculable sums in its image to the rest of the world. It all stops when Natalee comes home and Joran goes to prison. Then they can have their sleazy island back.

They are making Joran out of be a bigger liar than he is so WHEN he spills the beans of the other 46 or 47, they can say:  "Who can believe that liar."
So, guess we will just have to get the rest of 'em.  Someone better fess up and get off better because US (we) are comin fer ye.  What ARE you going to do when they come for you, bad boys.      Jack blue

[Magnolia]

Is Joe Tacopina going to be on Greta to spin the Joran story?