Natalee Case Discussion #737 2/29 - 3/1/08

[sharon]

Thanks, San.

[Bearlyhere]

anidac   I am quite relieved to hear your daughter is going to be okay.  I feel proud to know her through you.

Klaas  You rock, I am sorry you and the other monkeys are there when one of the monkeys goes rabid.

New York Monkeys  As you begin your protest, let God be with you and speak through you to say the right words
                       to counteract the dark side and turn hearts to the truth.


I see the cage is quite fragrant this morning and there is no need to call the exorcist.  Have a great day and stay warm New York!

[sharon]

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

 

I pray that understanding is incorrect.

But I can underrstand how that might be a real possibility 

[Kermit]

In the letter, Minister Croes promised that the Dutch agents will get all the cooperation from the investigating-team and the management. Also in the letter it appears that the Minister also made an official request to the Interpol to review the dossier. "As requested by the PG, the Interpol is asked to try to get hold of the not yet released informations by the FBI", wrote the Minister.

FBI know the truth
They don't lie
You can count on it.

[texasmom]

I apologize if someone has already posted this, I am difficulties with some pages loading this morning.  But I did find what I was looking for re: the cage being outside of Fisherman's Huts

http://forensicthoughtprints.com/aruba/default.htmlFrom Hodges

snipped
Aruba Journal

The Cage
The fisherman also noticed that a large fishing cage stored behind the first of the three Fisherman's Huts at the southern-most corner was missing. The cage had been there approximately a month since about Good Friday, March 25, 2005. The cage belonged to another fisherman who kept his boat next to these four huts. The boat was still there. But the cage was missing.

The fisherman described the cage as made of 3/8-inch iron (such as that used in concrete reinforcing—"rebar") with a frame size approximately 5 ½ feet by 4 feet by 17 inches. He described it as a large fishing cage with its frame wrapped in chicken wire with its familiar hexagonal openings but with an opening in one panel which allowed them to trap fish. He believed that, given its size and weight, it would take two men to manage the cage. Once aboard, it would lay low on the floor of the nearby fishing boat.

The day the cage went missing, the fisherman observed an iron stain in the grass on the south side of the huts. Only sometime the next day, Tuesday, May 31, did the fisherman learn of Natalee's disappearance. Slowly he began to consider possible connections between the case of the missing American girl and the missing knife and cage. His suspicions rose when a rumor made its way around the island that Natalee had been disposed of in a container. (In retrospect, the missing knife could be explained by the suspects' need to cut a larger flap in the cage in order to fit the body into it.)

All the suspects would have needed was a gas tank, the fishermen there had suggested as they discussed the case among themselves. The suspects could easily have "borrowed" one of several fishing boats anchored nearby. (Although I don't believe the suspects used one of these boats.) The fisherman and his friends always left their boats anchored a short distance off shore.

[CapsLockWizard]

Right, Private Eye,

I think the size of the trap goes more to the size of boat needed to maneuver it and the amount of planning and time required to engage such a vessel.

Blah just doesn't understand.  

I guess I dont understand.  Are you saying the boat that was used has been identified and the size of this trap is too big to fit on the boat that was used?

No, I am not saying anything except a little boat could be used for a little trap but a huge trap would require a much larger boat.  The size of the trap would likely reflect the size of the boat used for placing it.  It wouldn't fit on a really small boat.

.

In my opinion a trap that size was not in the fishermans huts.  So now where was the trap.

Steve Croes got fired from the Tatoo.  Could he have used the Tatoo boat for a trap like that.  Could a trap like that be tied to a boat and be pulled out to sea.  Just thinking here.

Why could it not have been at the fishermans huts?  It could have been kept outside.

I was just thinking because they said the huts were broken into.  The huts are small.

{Edited to add a picture of the huts:}

Fisherman’s Huts – Area of beach just north of the Marriott called Hadicuri beach where there are several small huts with individual doors and overhanging roofs.  This is where Joran alleges he called Deepak to pick him up and where Joran claims he left Natalee.

That trap was already in the water in 2005, and it has a story....

Question is how long does a peace of clothing last in Salt water before it is completly desolved.

remember the ocean is like a washing machine..2.5 yrs gone and it is still there?????

hmmmm

The story about that cage is a temporary drop point packages.

back to work

[Tamikosmom]

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

 

[Kermit]

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

Faith my man - faith.

[sharon]

That trap was already in the water in 2005, and it has a story....

Question is how long does a peace of clothing last in Salt water before it is completly desolved.

remember the ocean is like a washing machine..2.5 yrs gone and it is still there?????

hmmmm

The story about that cage is a temporary drop point packages.

back to work

Very interesting CapsLockWizard.

That would explain some of the suspects associated with the disposal.

[private eye]

I also hope Cheney is not meeting with Rudy Croes if it is not about Natalee. Rudy Croes is a common criminal, who was recently caught with 3 sex slaves of his own. It is pretty sad listening to why our Prseident can't meet with Castro, Iran government, etc for the way they run their countries, only to have to sit here and watch him socializing with the man who is directly responsible for allowing Natalee to be raped, murdered, and made to disappear, the man who owned 3 sex slaves, the man who somehow made enough money to build a $65,000,000 project on a civil servants salary.

 But as someone said earlier, I certainly don't know how countries are run and presidents act, and that is true. But I am not so stupid that I don't know right from wrong, and I know enough history to know that every covert action the US has tried as resulted in egg on our face. Wed Tech, Iran Contr. Our covert forces always seem to like the cocaine trade for raising the secret money needed to perform our tasks.

Personally, I believe in the need and support the cause, but think the US or us should just give them money they don't have to explain rather than resort to getting in bed with drug lords.

[private eye]

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

Faith my man - faith.

Well, I have absolute faith that the Arubans will sabotage any investigation involving this and I have faith that it is an absolute mistake to put them in the situation where they can make or break the case. I'll bet there is not one supporter of Beth's that feels as if they can trust the Aruban authorities with anything involved in this case.

[private eye]

In the letter, Minister Croes promised that the Dutch agents will get all the cooperation from the investigating-team and the management. Also in the letter it appears that the Minister also made an official request to the Interpol to review the dossier. "As requested by the PG, the Interpol is asked to try to get hold of the not yet released informations by the FBI", wrote the Minister.

FBI know the truth
They don't lie
You can count on it.

I would not trust Rudy Croes alone with his own daughter or mother.

[Tamikosmom]

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

 

oceanexploration
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #715 1/25 -
« Reply #103 on: January 26, 2008, 12:38:25 PM »

Thought you all may find this interesting if you're willing to accept it-

To date, the Aruban police and dive team has been a tremendous help.  They've honestly done a great job. Over the last month we've established a very good working relationship based on openness and trust.  Most of the relationship success was due to getting the media out of the way and working together shoulder to shoulder over time.  We've helped each other however and whenever we can.  They've treated us with decency and respect and we have treated them as friends and allies, which they are. Most of the police and divers are new since this case started and both eager and careful to do things right.  I wish we had a month ahead of the project just to establish the relationships and trust. I know many of you would likely doubt this view, but it's based on the experiences in the field of the entire search team. I too was extremely worried, paranoid, and suspecting in the beginning.  Now, it's clear we're all working towards a common goal.

[San]

In the letter, Minister Croes promised that the Dutch agents will get all the cooperation from the investigating-team and the management. Also in the letter it appears that the Minister also made an official request to the Interpol to review the dossier. "As requested by the PG, the Interpol is asked to try to get hold of the not yet released informations by the FBI", wrote the Minister.

FBI know the truth
They don't lie
You can count on it.

Thanks Kermit.  Aruba has been dying to get their hands on the information the FBI has.

[wreck]

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

Faith my man - faith.

Well, I have absolute faith that the Arubans will sabotage any investigation involving this and I have faith that it is an absolute mistake to put them in the situation where they can make or break the case. I'll bet there is not one supporter of Beth's that feels as if they can trust the Aruban authorities with anything involved in this case.

well, I have ZERO faith in the Arubans -- but I have 100% faith in Kermit (and any assurances he gives you!!! I haven't figured out who he is -- but I'm quite sure he is "in-the-know"))

[AZSunny]

In the letter, Minister Croes promised that the Dutch agents will get all the cooperation from the investigating-team and the management. Also in the letter it appears that the Minister also made an official request to the Interpol to review the dossier. "As requested by the PG, the Interpol is asked to try to get hold of the not yet released informations by the FBI", wrote the Minister.

FBI know the truth
They don't lie
You can count on it.

Kermit, when was this letter from Croes sent?  Was this recently done??

Thanks Kermit.  Aruba has been dying to get their hands on the information the FBI has.

[AZSunny]

In the letter, Minister Croes promised that the Dutch agents will get all the cooperation from the investigating-team and the management. Also in the letter it appears that the Minister also made an official request to the Interpol to review the dossier. "As requested by the PG, the Interpol is asked to try to get hold of the not yet released informations by the FBI", wrote the Minister.

FBI know the truth
They don't lie
You can count on it.

Thanks Kermit.  Aruba has been dying to get their hands on the information the FBI has.

Kermit, when was this letter from Croes sent?  Was this recently done??

(try this again...sorry)

[Bearlyhere]

Tamikosmom Do you think you can come to my home and organize my life?  If I could pull out what I needed with the speed you do, I would certainly become a high paid organizer.  You are so talented.

To all the monkeys  Sometimes the days are long and the nights are longer.  Thanks for being there for Natalee, her family, the rest of us monkeys, and anyone who wants to see justice done.  It is beautiful to see how the monkeys carry each other when one of our members is down or hving trouble.  There have been so many heartaches for those in the cage and I'm afraid if I mention some, I will be leaving others out.  You know who you are.

Helping is hard for some, but for the residents of the cage, it is all in a days work.

Some ideas may seem impossible to others but that might just be the idea that triggers another idea in someone else and then triggers another idea in someone else and then triggers the answer that is needed. 

The only idea that is not of any help is the one that is kept inside.

Sometimes I giggle when someone asks a question and the answer is misunderstood and takes on a life of it's own.  It reminds me of that 'Country Time' commercial (Time it's half past).  Every time someone misunderstands the original poster, they come up with a fact that someone else might not know.  This in turn triggers another piece of the puzzle clicking into place for other monkeys or monkey watchers.

If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything.  Monkeys stand tall, always.

Do you guys rock or what???????????

[Anna]

Just Posted by LegallyLex at BFN:





    Re: The Search for Natalee Holloway Blogspot
« Reply #859 on: Today at 12:30:54 PM »   

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It is with sadness that I am reporting to everyone that the Persistence leaves Aruba tomorrow heading for home.  As you are aware, the side scan sonar search is complete.  There are many many targets for the ROV to look at.  Sadly, this will not happen with the Persistence.  The main reason is the lack of funding.  This combined with the winter rough weather makes it difficult.  John and the crew thank all of your for your help and many blessings and prayers you have provided.  Please continue these prayers until the Persistence makes it back to port in New Iberia.

Thanks everyone! You are the best!

.

[CapsLockWizard]

I hope that the Persistence has not done all of this work and gone to all of this expense only to have gotten itself into an arrangement whereby Aruban divers are the ones who actually verify the targets and are the first ones to physically retrieve evidence, with no American divers physically with them. If so, all I can say is I just can't believe this has happened. But surely I am wrong.

Faith my man - faith.

Well, I have absolute faith that the Arubans will sabotage any investigation involving this and I have faith that it is an absolute mistake to put them in the situation where they can make or break the case. I'll bet there is not one supporter of Beth's that feels as if they can trust the Aruban authorities with anything involved in this case.

well, I have ZERO faith in the Arubans -- but I have 100% faith in Kermit (and any assurances he gives you!!! I haven't figured out who he is -- but I'm quite sure he is "in-the-know"))

Well, I hope Kermit knows where the Interpol office is located in Aruba. Noting against him, but just for the referance.

Only the aircondition man knows.