Natalee Holloway (in the rebound) DUTCH & English

[briany]

@ Sharon,

This is not about anonymous stories. There are also a lot of anonymous stories about Natalee.

It is about the official documents and not about what just everybody writes down.


If we start to believe the gossips about one person than we have to believe the gossips about the other person as well, don't you think?

How do you decide which story is true and which one is not true?

[sharon]

@ Sharon,

This is not about anonymous stories. There are also a lot of anonymous stories about Natalee.

It is about the official documents and not about what just everybody writes down.


If we start to believe the gossips about one person than we have to believe the gossips about the other person as well, don't you think?

How do you decide which story is true and which one is not true?

 

That's my point, briany. It is nearly impossible to decide which story is true and which is not.

But I put a higher belief in what was reported during the first few days of June than I do anything else.

And I believe Natalee's mother.

And I don't need to listen to the 'anonymous stories' about Natalee -- because I hear the truth from her family. And friends.

But then there is Anita who told us her son was a real sporter and didn't drink or do drugs    And Nadira -- who told us that 'all big people lie'. So when Nadira said her sons arrived home around 4:00 AM -- NOT 1:30 -- was she truthing or lieing?

I don't believe in the official statements. Specifically the ones taken by Dennsi Jacobs, as I believe Dennis Jacobs 'rewrote' several of them -- at least the ones that he didn't disappear.

I think the majority of the official statements were orchestrated -- to provide detailed and ambiguous lies to cover the truth.

As I said -- I am not a detective, or a law enforcer, or an author. But I am a very logical person and I make my living by analyzing and logically solving complex business problems.

And I believe in Occam's razor 

Did you know that 95% of all people who disappear, disappear at the hands of the LAST PERSON KNOWN TO BE WITH THEM??

Natalee got into Deepak's car with Joran, Deepak and Satish and was never heard from again.

I am trying to help out the newer posters that did not follow the case in the very early days. Before all the lieing began.

Before Natalee died her hair black and ran away -- before Natalee sailed away with a blue eyed Dutch boy -- before Natalee met up with her boyfriend from Alabama and slipped back to the states to have her baby and avoid her family -- before Beth became Hitler's sister -- before Natalee became pregnant with Jug's baby -- before all those stints in rehab that Natalee went thru -- before aliens came down to earth and whisked Natalee away.

Before all those lies. And all the rest of the lies.

All I want is justice for the innocent teen, Natalee Holloway.
And peace for her familiy and loved ones.

[Buckeye]

Post from July 2005.  JustinT was on the trip and knew Natalee.

To: truthluva

Here some more setting people straight by MB students at SM

"I know you directed this to MB however, I thought I would answer it anyway. FIRST for about the 100th time Natalee doesn't do drugs.

Second no its not true that they told her not to get into the car. That was started by a so called email that one of the brothers wrote. anther one of his lies.--Justin"

"Did Natalie kiss or dance suggestively with Joran at Carlos & Charlies? Did Sean or Natalie's cousin Twitty or anyone else actually get in an argument with Joran earlier in the week? "

"Did Natalie hook up with any other guys earlier in the week?

"Someone posted on another board that earlier in the week Natalie had asked a worker at a watersports booth where she could find drugs. Any truth to that one?"

"Did Natalie do drugs that night?"

"Did you know of her to smoke weed or do any other drugs before?"

"Certainly not blaming her or suggesting she deserved anything. She certainly didn't. Just trying to judge what shape she was in to reject any unwanted advances if any came her way. I understand if you are not comfortable responding to some of these questions and if that is the case, feel free to answer some and avoid others. Thanks for any info you can give. Just trying to help figure this whole thing out."

"Here are your answers:"

"NO not at all"

" No not the cousins but someone else and it was very minor."

"No she ABSOLUTELY did not hook up with anyone else that week."

"Natalee did not do drugs does not do drugs and if she had any it was without her knowledge." Justin


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1933.0

[Observer]

Excellent post Sharon!!

[briany]

And I believe in Occam's razor 

Occam's razor had two sides.

[briany]

Second no its not true that they told her not to get into the car. That was started by a so called email that one of the brothers wrote. anther one of his lies.--Justin"

The later statements of the brothers agree with eachother on the most important things. These are facts and there is nothing you can do about, whether you like it or not.

Does you story fall apart, when it appears the brothers are not involved?

Why doe people start to blame Peter R and Patrick? Because they do not have anything else to do?

Do you want to tell us this time that Natalee did not got in the car by herself?
She was in a disco in the company of all her friends,  but nobody saw her leaving?

Stay realistic.

[Buckeye]

Second no its not true that they told her not to get into the car. That was started by a so called email that one of the brothers wrote. anther one of his lies.--Justin"

The later statements of the brothers agree with eachother on the most important things. These are facts and there is nothing you can do about, whether you like it or not.

Does you story fall apart, when it appears the brothers are not involved?

Why doe people start to blame Peter R and Patrick? Because they do not have anything else to do?

Do you want to tell us this time that Natalee did not got in the car by herself?
She was in a disco in the company of all her friends,  but nobody saw her leaving?

Stay realistic.

The early statements of the brothers and Joran all agreed.  That did not make them true or factual.  It did fool the police, for awhile.

I can live with the Kalpos (one or two) being involved or not.  It is the same story.  Natalee left with the three and has not been seen since. Enough lies from ALL of them ("to throw off the investigation"), to keep me thinking there is more to the story.

I think Peter R. is doing a good job.  He may not have access to the Alabama kids that were there.  They posted early on.  Their words are also important to consider.

Justin is saying that they did not tell her to get out of the car.  He was there. JK2 wanted it to look like Natalee consented to all the activities of the night.  I believe she thought she was getting a ride back to the HI with a "friend".  When that didn't happen, it became kidnapping.  That charge alone, is enough for K2 to have a backup plan (they had 10 days to see their situation decline and come up with a story for themselves)....."It'll be our word against his......" IMO

[briany]

GBMW,

Op RU zag ik bericht over de haaien. Ik weet niet of het nodig is om onder invloed van drugs te zijn om te denken dat je op Aruba 's avonds haaien kan zien zwemmen. Zo gek is dat niet voor een meisje dat niet van Aruba komt.
De Kalpoe's schrijven dit erover:

Deepak 11-06-2005:

After that I drove in the direction of the "Renaissance Hotel". There I turned onto L.G. SMITH Boulevard. I proceeded to drive in a Westerly direction. I drove on until we got to the intersection where I had last seen her friends. When we arrived there I saw that they were no longer there. I asked Joran what were were going to do now. The girl said at some point something about "Sharks" and "Lighthouse". That is what I had heard. Joran then said "Lighthouse". I knew at that moment that I had to drive to the "Lighthouse". I rolled up the windows and put the air conditioning on and drove towards the "Lighthouse".

Satish 11-06-2005:

When we got close to the Sonesta Hotel he turned right and drove towards the hotels. When we got to the intersection west of Royal Plaza, we saw that the people where no longer standing at the intersection. We drove on in a westerly direction. We were driving on the boulevard where the gas station is when the girl said she wanted to go see the sharks in the vicinity of the "lighthouse". Joran told the girl that there were no shark in the vicinity of the "lighthouse". Then the girl said that the "lighthouse" was the only place on Aruba that she had not yet seen. The girl said that she wanted to see the "lighthouse". Joran then told my brother to drive to the "lighthouse" if the girl wanted to go and see the "lighthouse". My brother then drove towards the "lighthouse".

Ik begrijp eigenlijk niet wat er zo raar aan is, als Natalee had gedacht dat ze even naar het strand gingen voordat ze naar het HI zouden terugrijden of na de lift naar het strand, samen terug zouden lopen naar het hotel.
Joran had gezegd dat hij daar ook logeerde, dus zo bijzonder is het allemaal niet.
Of ze nou ging om naar haaien te kijken of om naar het strand te gaan en vandaar naar het hotel terug te lopen.
Zoiets zal het wel geweest zijn. Ze had begreep ik tegen vrienden iets van: "ik zie je later" of zoiets gezegd.

[Buckeye]

If Kalpoes are so innocent, why this??

If they told the truth, in the June statements, what are they worried about?  I would think they would want the FBI to clear their name and help them.  What were they trying to hide?

Name/Title: Complaint by Satish Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5 August 2005
File #: p-2005/03533
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Aruban Court
Responsive to Request 32

Name/Title: Complaint By Deepak Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5t August 2005
File #: p-2005103532
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator.. Aruban Court (Gerecht In Eerste Aanleg)

[briany]

If Kalpoes are so innocent, why this??

If they told the truth, in the June statements, what are they worried about?  I would think they would want the FBI to clear their name and help them.  What were they trying to hide?

Name/Title: Complaint by Satish Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5 August 2005
File #: p-2005/03533
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Aruban Court
Responsive to Request 32

Name/Title: Complaint By Deepak Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5t August 2005
File #: p-2005103532
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator.. Aruban Court (Gerecht In Eerste Aanleg)

As far as I can read, this is een complaint from Deepak regarding and FBI assistant.

Correct me if I am wrong.

Does a complaint from Deepak regarding an FBI assistant implicates Deepak is guilty?

That is new for me.

[sharon]

If Kalpoes are so innocent, why this??

If they told the truth, in the June statements, what are they worried about?  I would think they would want the FBI to clear their name and help them.  What were they trying to hide?

Name/Title: Complaint by Satish Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5 August 2005
File #: p-2005/03533
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Aruban Court
Responsive to Request 32

Name/Title: Complaint By Deepak Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5t August 2005
File #: p-2005103532
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator.. Aruban Court (Gerecht In Eerste Aanleg)

As far as I can read, this is een complaint from Deepak regarding and FBI assistant.

Correct me if I am wrong.

Does a complaint from Deepak regarding an FBI assistant implicates Deepak is guilty?

That is new for me.

Not if you're a relative or his defense attorney 

But in the world of the 'human' court -- if you have nothing to hide, you hide nothing.
 
Especially if you're amongst the last persons to be seen with a girl who has disappeared and believed to be dead. Right after you were seen with her. And you want to prove your innocence.

Just my logical mind.

With a legal mind looking at it for a defense position? Probably doesn't implicate him -- on it's own. Added to a lot more 'circumstantial evidence'? I'd say maybe.

[Buckeye]

If Kalpoes are so innocent, why this??

If they told the truth, in the June statements, what are they worried about?  I would think they would want the FBI to clear their name and help them.  What were they trying to hide?

Name/Title: Complaint by Satish Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5 August 2005
File #: p-2005/03533
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Aruban Court
Responsive to Request 32

Name/Title: Complaint By Deepak Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5t August 2005
File #: p-2005103532
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator.. Aruban Court (Gerecht In Eerste Aanleg)

As far as I can read, this is een complaint from Deepak regarding and FBI assistant.

Correct me if I am wrong.

Does a complaint from Deepak regarding an FBI assistant implicates Deepak is guilty?

That is new for me.

Just to be clear, they were not complaining about a particular FBI assistant.  They were complaining about the help/involvement of the FBI.  Odd to do that, if one is innocent and being framed.

[Buckeye]

If Kalpoes are so innocent, why this??

If they told the truth, in the June statements, what are they worried about?  I would think they would want the FBI to clear their name and help them.  What were they trying to hide?

Name/Title: Complaint by Satish Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5 August 2005
File #: p-2005/03533
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Aruban Court
Responsive to Request 32

Name/Title: Complaint By Deepak Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5t August 2005
File #: p-2005103532
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator.. Aruban Court (Gerecht In Eerste Aanleg)

As far as I can read, this is een complaint from Deepak regarding and FBI assistant.

Correct me if I am wrong.

Does a complaint from Deepak regarding an FBI assistant implicates Deepak is guilty?

That is new for me.

Sorry, screwed up quote:

Just to be clear, they were not complaining about a particular FBI assistant.  They were complaining about the help/involvement of the FBI.  Odd to do that, if one is innocent and being framed.

[briany]

If Kalpoes are so innocent, why this??

If they told the truth, in the June statements, what are they worried about?  I would think they would want the FBI to clear their name and help them.  What were they trying to hide?

Name/Title: Complaint by Satish Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5 August 2005
File #: p-2005/03533
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator: Aruban Court
Responsive to Request 32

Name/Title: Complaint By Deepak Kalpoe regarding FBI assistance
Date: 5t August 2005
File #: p-2005103532
Pages: 3
Writer/Initiator.. Aruban Court (Gerecht In Eerste Aanleg)

As far as I can read, this is een complaint from Deepak regarding and FBI assistant.

Correct me if I am wrong.

Does a complaint from Deepak regarding an FBI assistant implicates Deepak is guilty?

That is new for me.

Sorry, screwed up quote:

Just to be clear, they were not complaining about a particular FBI assistant.  They were complaining about the help/involvement of the FBI.  Odd to do that, if one is innocent and being framed.

I do not know what it in the complaint and I do not know who asked for help from the FBI.

[briany]

Quotes from Deepak

10 juni 2005

To your question as to how often I have been in contact with Joran over the phone over the past two weeks, I can state the following. We had contact over the telephone about three to four times a day.
To your question about what we spoke when we were contact over the telephone, I can state the following. We talked about that what had happened and whether his father had information for us about about the matter.

To your question as to why we talked so much about what had occurred, I can state the following. After we were heard as witnesses, we felt involved in what had occurred, and also because Joran's father was a judge and he knows a lot of laws, and because he thought we could yet be considered suspects and arrested.
To your question as to how Joran's father came to the conclusion I just mentioned, I can state the following. We had told him about the interview, so about the manner we were interviewed.
To your question that if I know that I am innocent, I have nothing to worry about, I can state the following. I am innocent and still I was arrested.
To your question whether we had talked to Joran's father that night, I can state the following. We had spoken to him, because he sat down with us.You are telling me that I made a statement about a Steve yesterday, and now you are asking me who Steve is. Steve is a customer who comes to my place of work to use the Internet.

To your question as to what exactly Steve had told me, I can state the following. I was talking to someone on the phone about what had happened, and when I hung up the phone Steve said to me that I should not worry because he had seen us dropping off the girl at the hotel, he even saw that she had fallen down and that Joran had helped her up.
To your question as to where Steve was to have been able to see to see all of this, I can state the following. I didn't ask him where he was in order to have seen all of this. He also told me that he had not been to work that day.  Instead he had been at "Carlos & Charlies" and because of that he was of two minds about going to the police because he feared losing his job.

To your question as to how I got hold of his mobile phone number, I can state the following. I had asked him for his number and had told him that I would give it to the police if I got in trouble so that they could call him.
To your question as to how it is possible that I state that Steve was not sure whether he should go to the police, because he was afraid to lose his job, but that on the night in question, he did go to a public place like "Carlos & Charlies" and on top of that gave me his phone number so that he now can be sent for to testify, I can state the following. You should ask him.

To your question whether Steve knows Joran, I can state the following. Steve does not know Joran.
To your question whether I have spoken to my brother about Steve, I can state the following. I have spoken to everybody about Steve, with my mother, Satish, Joran and Joran's parents.
To your question whether I gave all of them Steve's mobile phone number, I can state the following. No, I kept the number to myself.
To your question as to why I quickly had an attorney, I can state the following. After we were heard as witnesses, Joran's father said that there would be chance that we were going to be arrested, and that we had to prepare for that eventuality.

To you question as to how we prepared ourselves, I can state the following. By preparing I just meant looking for an attorney.

To your question whether I had spoken to my attorney prior to my arrest, I can state the following. Both families had a meeting with the attorneys. So my parents with me and my brother, and Joran with his parents.
To your question as to when that took place, I can state the following. That took place last Saturday.

In this part one can read that Deepak (at the time this interview took place,) still trusted Joran.

In the other statements you can read that the brothers, when Joran and Natalee started kissing, they thought this was weird because Joran had a nice girlfriend. The boys sound respectful to girls. I find that a very positive point. They do not talk bad about Natalee in the statements.If I read this statement it would not surprise me that the Kalpoe brothers felt intimidated by the VanderSloots. It sounds like: “you’re in trouble”. Not “Joran is in trouble”.
Why would Pa vdS tell the boys that “they were in trouble” if he really believed they dropped Natalee at the HI?

How did Joran's father knew they were going to be arrested? 

No,they don't talk bad about Natalee in the statements but Briany,what do you think of deepak kalpoe when he said in the Jamie Skeeter's tape"Natalee dressed like a slut,Natalee acted like a slut"?Do you think that was very respectful of deepak kalpoe?

I do not know whether he sayd that but if he told that, it was much later. In the meantime we has accused by the Americans and started to hate the fact that he was followed around, while he could not tell more that what he told already. If Deepak is really innocent and really can tell nothing more than that he dropped off Joran and his "girlfriend" in that street, but people insist in telling that he lies and rapes, it is not so strange that he start telling nasty things about Natalee. I myself, do understand Natalee's mother was (and is) very upset and I can understand her reactions, but I was not accused by lots of American people. Their lives were ruined. Maybe he was very angry at Beth Holloway.

Try to imagine how it feels when, after you finally tell the truth and a while later you realise you've been trapped, but people keep accusing you from murder and rape.

If Deepak really told this, it was his opinion but I do not believe this was his real opinion. It is very well possible that he told this because people kept telling he was a rapist and murderer and he wanted so say something back. But still those words do not make him a rapist.

Deepak told there was nothing wrong with Natalee when she left with Joran, Deepak and Satish told they were kissing.
Big deal, two 18 year olds kissing. Or? That does not make Natalee a slut. Come on!

 

[Observer]

Added: May 06, 2008 (More info)
RTL Boulevard may 6 2008

Joran`s passport
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB8UZ0jswVU

[Observer]

tromp13carlos
Age: 55
Country: Netherlands

Aruba ( open brief aan koningin Beatrix deel 1)
Aruba Injustice
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUetHXp8aRc

Aruba ( open brief aan koningin Beatrix deel 2)
Aruba Injustice
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CzN1DnEjidM

Aruba ( open brief aan koningin Beatrix deel 3)
Aruba Injustice
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmhbT3MCBoM

[Observer]

Mijn open brief aan Beth Twitty

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWo6YeytdNE

http://www.koninginnlwatismensenrechten.com/

[briany]

Who are telling the most lies?
Joran and his two friends or Joran and his two parents?

Since I came to post on this board I have seen the theories about Peter and Patrick. Imo the theories about Peter and Patrick are absurd, but in Holland there are people who write the same kind of things about Peter and Patrick. The writers and journalist who try to claim this are working in cooperation with Renee Gielen and the VanderSloots.

I think it is weird to doubt a complete tape with voice and face from Joran, were you can clearly see that Joran, amongst other things, tells that Natalee does not come back over and over again. Instead of the Joran tape, those people prefer to believe a very dubious tape from Deepak and the story of the Gardener, who showed up weeks later and besides that tells a nearly unbelievable story. The timeline of the Gardener is not very correct and I do not believe someone is able to recognize three faces in the middle of the night in a flash. If that was the case, he would have gone to the police earlier. It is about a disappeared girl. So the reasons the gardener did not go to the police immediately, are unbelievable to me.
Weather Deepak panicked or not I do not know, but I can imagine he did.

Beth believes Deepak was at the house of VanderSloot the first time she arrived there. The statements of Deepak and Dos Santos tell a different story without any conflict in the statements. Beth can also be mistaken. She did not catch any sleep and was very upset.

How is it possible the statements of Dos Santos and Deepak are not in conflict with eachother?

Was Dos Santos also in the complot?

You think I want to separate the Kalpoes and think I have something to do with Aruba. The fact that you start writing things like that about me, give me the impression that you refuse to look into another direction. I do not want to separate the brothers, If they are in this, they are it this.  As I told you before, it would not surprise me if it appearedthey are dragged into this by VanderSloot and his powerfull friends to separate VanderSloot. The statement of a bartender does not mean much to me. Joran is wellknown with the people working in C&C, so that is not a big surprise to be.


Think about it and read the official statements. Hearsay does not help much.

[briany]

So Hans Mos is going to work with Fortunetellers. 

Did the snifferdogs not arrive yet? 



I think the snifferdogs can do a better job on the island than fortunetellers.