Natalee Case Discussion #740 3/5 - 3/7/08

[Anna]

Maybe there was only one Swiss K in the Lost and Found at the Racquet Club was why Joran only had one shoe Size 14.

How hard is it to measure a kid's foot?

But I suppose first one would have to want to know and besides, it's easier to blame the American media for failure to perform at even the most minimal of universally accepted standards.

Things like that require bending over and stretching which interferes with the Frosted Flakes agenda.

moo

[Observer]

I thought this post would interest some of you..lol I would imagine that Johan grabbed this from one of the posters at Rene'e Gielens blog that she post's at... I seriously doubt SandraK is Astrid VR but the part about Lorenzo's GF may be true as Glenda refused to answer that question from HannieC 

de moeder van Lorenzo

De moeder van Lorenzo, Astrid van Rijn, actief is als poster op een aantal websites (als SandraK en Keywest). Zij gaf onlangs aan dat ze op goede voet staat met Robin Holloway, de vrouw van Dave Holloway. Dit is natuurlijk pikant, nu de ex vriendin van Lorenzo van Rijn zijn alibi op 30 mei 2005 intrekt

(Translation)
The mother of Lorenzo, Astrid van Rijn, operates as a poster on a number of websites (as SandraK and Keywest). She said recently that she is on good footing with Robin Holloway, the wife of Dave Holloway. Of course, this is spicy, now that the former girlfriend of Lorenzo van Rijn withdrew his alibi on May 30, 2005

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2669.100

[Tamikosmom]

THE JOGGER

Jossy Mansur
NANCY GRACE
August 23, 2005

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0508/23/ng.01.html

ANASTASIYA BOLTON, WBMA-TV: ... Also, the jogger, the latest witness that police are talking about -- this is supposedly the man who called police from a public phone several days after Natalee Holloway disappeared, saying that he saw the car with the Kalpoe brothers and Joran by the racquet club the night that she disappeared. Police are still looking for him. They`re not able to find him because the man, again, called from a public phone and did not leave his name -- Nancy.

GRACE: You know, that was a question we had last night, Jossy, as to why the Aruban police could not trace that phone call from a jogger, a jogger escaping the heat on the island of Aruba the night Natalee went missing. That`s the apparent explanation of why he was out jogging at that time of the night. Jossy, if this is true and he called from a public phone, true, police cannot trace who he is, but it would also give credence. Was that public phone near where Natalee Holloway disappeared?

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, "DIARIO": That`s what I understand, that this jogger also saw the same car parked at the same spot by the racquet club. However, he did call from a public telephone, and I don`t know whether the police can trace it or not. But according to information I have, they cannot.

GRACE: Well, they already know it`s from a public phone. They know where it was. Take a listen to this.

<snipped>

... Jossy, I want to get everything I can from you that you know about this jogger. Could you just tell me, what night is it the jogger calls police about what he saw?

MANSUR: I think it was two or three nights after Natalee disappeared. I don`t know. I don`t have any of the answers to that. I don`t know any of the facts involved. I know that the police have put out a call for him. They`ve requested us to publish it, where we did publish a request for this man to come forward. And they`ve been on the radio and everywhere else, asking for this jogger to show up, to give his testimony.

[Shell]

I hate to be so cynical, but at some point it almost seems as if Joran will say he was never on the beach with Natalee... and everyone will say WTF!!!

I hate to be cynical too, but I feel like Joran could confess over and over and tell as many lies and say anything he wants. He seems to be immune from prosecution.

[JE]

I hate to be so cynical, but at some point it almost seems as if Joran will say he was never on the beach with Natalee... and everyone will say WTF!!!

I hate to be cynical too, but I feel like Joran could confess over and over and tell as many lies and say anything he wants. He seems to be immune from prosecution.

No one is immune from prosecution except maybe god i doubt that JVDS is god

[Tamikosmom]

Deepak Kalpoe attempts to get somebody to establish an alibi for him after the gardener testifies.

Janet

+++++++++++++++

Beth Twitty
CNN LARRY KING LIVE
February 23, 2007

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0602/23/lkl.01.html

BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: I know one thing that Deepak Kalpoe did in August was, when the gardener came before the judge of instruction to give sworn testimony of witnessing those three suspects together in the Kalpoe brothers' car that night at the pond, across the street from the Marriott, it was in front of the prosecutor, in front of the defense, the judge of instruction, Deepak and Satish Kalpoe, Joran Van Der Sloot.

Deepak panicked. He panicked when the gardener gave that testimony. That very afternoon, he called an Aruban girl to help him establish an alibi. She, in turn, panicked. She called FBI. She dialed the 1-877-NATALEE number and told them that she did not want to be involved in this.

[Observer]

roflmfao, rudy has elevated the status of the psycho psychics to detective?  why does that not surprise me at all.  sounds like he inhaled some of his tooth powder this morning before going to work.
dennisintn

Yup,He said that after they gave there press conference on TV and Radio,Probably so people would take them seriously and let them spread there BS all over Holland and Aruba. The next day he kind of backed off a bit after the whole shenanigan backfired and no one thought they were credible with anything.

[Bearlyhere]

******* do you know the date when they were looking for it and where they found the bloody/muddy shoe?

In the beginning of the case they were looking for one shoe only. They had another shoe with mud or blood on it,I forget which one it was. However when they did the pond search  in July,Dompig announced to everyone it was a pair of shoes they were looking for,so I did a double take and many others did at RWV as well. We never heard anything from the initial reports until the search at the Pond.

Somewhere deep in the archives you will see the initial reports of looking for one shoe,I am positive of that! They were trying to find the missing shoe is what we were told in the beginning.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong (although I realize this is like asking a starving mouse to eat a piece of cheese if he sees one ),

In the tapes with Patrick, didn't Joran say something like the shoes were just a setup of some kind (I was thinking to send people chasing after nothing).  He really seems to get his jollies sending people off chasing clouds and screwing with the investigation, one day he may accidently tell the truth not recognizing it for what it is.

[Blonde]

This Picture of Beth brakes my heart

[jackb]

FRAMING is not a word, I believe Patrick had in mind for Joran.  Tricking him into a confession of truth as to what happened would be what, in my estimation he was doing.  Whoever used the word FRAMING is either using the wrong word or they are trying to FRAME Patrick.     Jack blue

perhaps more like putting him in the frame...gotta be one those translation problems!

Why is the picture (avatar) showing its azz?   jackblue

[bleachedblack]

I thought this post would interest some of you..lol I would imagine that Johan grabbed this from one of the posters at Rene'e Gielens blog that she post's at... I seriously doubt SandraK is Astrid VR but the part about Lorenzo's GF may be true as Glenda refused to answer that question from HannieC 

de moeder van Lorenzo

De moeder van Lorenzo, Astrid van Rijn, actief is als poster op een aantal websites (als SandraK en Keywest). Zij gaf onlangs aan dat ze op goede voet staat met Robin Holloway, de vrouw van Dave Holloway. Dit is natuurlijk pikant, nu de ex vriendin van Lorenzo van Rijn zijn alibi op 30 mei 2005 intrekt

(Translation)
The mother of Lorenzo, Astrid van Rijn, operates as a poster on a number of websites (as SandraK and Keywest). She said recently that she is on good footing with Robin Holloway, the wife of Dave Holloway. Of course, this is spicy, now that the former girlfriend of Lorenzo van Rijn withdrew his alibi on May 30, 2005

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2669.100

That is very interesting. I do recall it being said early on that Lvr's alibi for that night was that he was having a small private party at his house and that he even had his girlfriend there. Sure wish she would come and chat.....

[Anna]

I hate to be so cynical, but at some point it almost seems as if Joran will say he was never on the beach with Natalee... and everyone will say WTF!!!

I hate to be cynical too, but I feel like Joran could confess over and over and tell as many lies and say anything he wants. He seems to be immune from prosecution.

We have said many times that even if they had Joran committing this crime itself on video, he would never go to trial.  There would be some excuse or other to prevent his ever being charged with anything.  After all, he has the power to declare people living or dead, ya know.  And at only 17 with no medical training whatsoever.

.

[Observer]

That is very interesting. I do recall it being said early on that Lvr's alibi for that night was that he was having a small private party at his house and that he even had his girlfriend there. Sure wish she would come and chat.....

Yup and Max Arendsz was questioned and provided him with the alibi,I guess for all night and obviously the morning.

If it's true she must have told someone or posted it on the Dutch Blogs somewhere. I wonder where that initial post is coming from?

[Anna]

Thanks again for all the translations of the Dutch programs.

I am going to try to think of something important enough to contact Hero Brinkman about and ask for his assistance if I can come up with anything.

Off to watch CSI. . . .

[Magnolia]

Thanks again for all the translations of the Dutch programs.

I am going to try to think of something important enough to contact Hero Brinkman about and ask for his assistance if I can come up with anything.

Off to watch CSI. . . .

Send him the Freebirds information on the Corrupt Judges....that is as
good as it gets.

[jackb]

Karma, I agree with ya totally.

RenHo has so many miles on her they call her retread rollback Renho.

She has had to have that thing retreaded after she got rolled back.    Jackb

[ocgirl]

Hey OE,

Anything new to report?

 

[jackb]

Hey OE,

Anything new to report?

 

Just that Aruba is going to go broke for giving RenHo the money to get a splif unlift.       jackb

[Tamikosmom]

Thank you Carpe.

+++++++++


JENSEN

BETH NATALEE HOLLOWAY ARUBA SEG 1 march 4 2008

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-R9XMu-aXro


2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNqYvjZCNt0

3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exh1VcZT6eQ

4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A1V8pMlevac

5
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Om4bQfbg0iw

[suisse71]

Pauw & Witteman Show - Bram Moszkowicz is one of 3 guests

-Short clip of Beth talking about filing criminal and civil lawsuit against Joran (just a very short introduction video, recorded in Bram's office)
-(other guests... yaddayaddayadda... blahblahblah... ticktock ticktock...)
-a middleman contacted Bram on Beth's behalf, to investigate whether they can file a civil lawsuit
-Beth on tape, wants that Joran will be prosecuted, wants Joran behing bars, if that doesn't happen then civil action, there may be other young females on his path
-Bram says he's investigating civil suit: 85-90% chance that he will do it
-he needs to see if he has a true chance to win, Beth couldn't handle it if even the civil suit should be lost
-he says what Joran did in the tapes was confess, even if some people (OM Aruba) say he didn't, there's no doubt about it
-civil suit will be: 1)claim for shock damage 2)claim because of Joran's constant lying he was enabling others to put the blame on Beth (as in Beth was a "suspect" for a while)
-shock damage has to be confirmed by a psychiatrist, he has to determine that Beth suffered psychological damage
-What else do they want in Aruba? They have all they need!, says Bram
-They didn't have enough evidence without the confession tapes, and now even with the confession tapes they don't have enough evidence, Bram says that is simply unbelievable
-Beth on tape: imitating seizure, that's the part that's most difficult to watch
-Bram says he's extra motivated to do this case, he really feels for Beth
-Bram will file a complaint should the case be closed again in Aruba and Joran doesn't get arrested
-Bram promised Beth he will let her know whether he will file the civil suit within 2 weeks

My eyes and ears are spinning, this was a very hard conversation to follow even in Dutch, all these legal terms...

I'm off to bed now!!

Thanks again Jo-An for your update. GOOD TO SEE BRAM TRASHING THE POS PROSECUTOR!!! Can Peter be far behind with an investigation of the whole sordid bunch? I am sure Beth has much to tell them both.

Many thanks!  I so hope Bram can file the civil suit. Get Joran off the streets!!  I'm not a lawyer but I hope he will be able to delve into all of these missing statements, evidence, etc.  Where the hell is Joran's statement from May 31 '05? Was it actually Paulus making 2 ATM w/d  in the wee hours or was it Joran using daddy's card?  My questions are endless, I'll try not to drive you all nuts.  As for the shoes, why can't Joran answer this simple question?
Even in his Greta interview he made such a point about his KSwiss sneakers, "yes Greta these are the same ones.  Well not the exact same ones that are missing, but they look exactly like these ones..." something to that effect.     

Someone else here posted on an earlier thread, may have been Destiny or *******, so sorry I don't recall, about "Thou dost protest too much...."  Anybody help me here?  I thought that line of thinking was really interesting and made sense.  I agree, Joran had sex (raped) Natalee without a condom and he & Paulus had to get rid of the body.  Also, I do believe Beth that Natalee was a virgin and Joran realized that during the rape. So imagine evidence - Paulus being an attorney of course would say "What have you done?!" 

Forgive me for being graphic, but I'd like to peel the skin of his face too...
Joran raped a virgin & possibly K2 raped her as well
Natalee's blood w/ Joran's semem, vomit w/ GHB & Joran's semen, her DNA all over K2 car (Liquid Ecstasy is often cut w/ herion, which makes the person vomit while slipping in and out of consciousness & GHB causes victim to black out)
Natalee has seizures, overdosing, blacked out, or went into a coma. Paulus researching affects of drugs & alcohol. 
Joran DNA, his semem inside of her and on her person.  Even if they find my semen in her = rape w/ no condom
Joran said in the Dutch version of Devries tape, to Beth & Greta, to Jug & friends on that first night, in his June 24th statement [even here he decribes the same sexual acts in details about another girl & also that 12 year old girl] and Joran and Anita describe in detail her underwear and what Joran did sexuallly with Natalee, etc....(Sorry guys this makes me cringe to even write this.) "I fingered her, I wanted her to give me a blow job, I french kissed her, I f**cked her, I'll just f**ck her.... "
Natalee DNA under Joran's fingernails, on him, his clothes, on & in his shoes....
Natalee fought back, I have to believe that, bit him, scratched, hit him and Joran assaulted her to make her stop.  JK2 put too much emphasis on "her hitting her head..."
Natalee in coma or died or murder
All that evidence would get Joran 15 years to say the least. Obviously there was zero proof of consensual sex.   If all or any of the above is not motivation for Paulus & Joran to get rid of the body, "the body of evidence" then what is?
No body, no crime
I believe Beth, Natalee was at VDS home. 
Paulus w/ help of Van der Stratten buried the body and moved the body more than once.  VDS home, then landfill, then??? Pond?  or Ocean? 
Perhaps some evidence was thrown in the pond, just like Joran did with his dead dog. 
And some thrown in the ocean.
Find body, solve crime.
Solve numerous criminal acts.

Again sorry guys!! but I really want to see the POS behind bars forever along with Paulus who the locals refer to as a "womanizer & gambler".  Like father like son.  Joran is a sociopath to say the least.

With the Aruba follow up piece back on tomorrow, I am curious to know what Patrick said about the pond and review again what CAPS said in his summary. Any news from OE about the scan they did of the pond? 


j4n!!!