Natalee Case Discussion #740 3/5 - 3/7/08

[Jo-An]

Robert Jensen Show with Beth Holloway - Peter R de Vries - Patrick van der Eem - Bram Moszkowicz

-Beth: Patrick is a great man, a great father, he's my hero
-Patrick talking about how he wanted to frame Joran, that was his only goal
-Patrick says he has a criminal past but changed drastically after he was about 21 years old, he started selling heroin at the age of 15, he's been in jail twice, drugsrelated
-Patrick talking again about meeting Joran for the first time in the Dutch casino and working towards the confession tapes, getting Joran to trust him
-Patrick says Joran told him he didn't respect his parents, didn't listen to them but that's nothing special for a 20-year old

No new info so far.

Beth was just sitting there the hold time, Robert and Patrick only spoke Dutch.

*commercial break*

[bleachedblack]

This is an interesting bit of info I don't recall hearing about before. Sure hope ALE followed up on this.......
 
>>>>SNIP

Three weeks ago, a tourist from North Carolina called me to ask me how to get in touch with police. She and her husband had been out exploring the island, and they came across a sneaker.

They knew investigators were looking for a pair of sneakers that belonged to van der Sloot. And, they knew the sneaker they spotted probably was just something someone left behind, but they couldn't let it go. She wanted to let police know about it.

http://tinyurl.com/3bkhpb

[Jo-An]

Robert Jensen Show with Beth Holloway - Peter R de Vries - Patrick van der Eem - Bram Moszkowicz

-Beth: Patrick is a great man, a great father, he's my hero
-Patrick talking about how he wanted to frame Joran, that was his only goal
-Patrick says he has a criminal past but changed drastically after he was about 21 years old, he started selling heroin at the age of 15, he's been in jail twice, drugsrelated
-Patrick talking again about meeting Joran for the first time in the Dutch casino and working towards the confession tapes, getting Joran to trust him
-Patrick says Joran told him he didn't respect his parents, didn't listen to them but that's nothing special for a 20-year old

No new info so far.

Beth was just sitting there the hold whole time, Robert and Patrick only spoke Dutch.

*commercial break*

Self-edit: whole

[Dayhiker]

I have to agree with Buckshot's terrific post in the last thread. Nice Post Buckshot!!!

In my heart of hearts I believe Joran will have to be dealt with in another fashion. The criminal justice system is not for Joran. He would continue to make a total mockery out of it with his corrupt father and crooked mother. Also, in my opinion, the case is too screwed up for an idiot like Hans Mos to arrive 2 years later and reel it all in. That will not happen. The people before him made sure of that. Even if Mos was on the up and up, he does not have the balls it takes to take down everyone. Without the "house of cards", it does not really matter. The stragglers will get away. We all know who the stragglers are.

I have held out hope that the case would be prosecuted and even to this day I still have a determination to justice served one way or the other. Justice is not always wrapped up nice and tight with a pretty bow and delivered by FTD. It's a down and dirty business that only some truly recognize and appreciate - i.e. Godfather Peter R. He knew what it took to bring in that wretched human debris. Godfather Peter R hand delivered Joran van der Sloot and Mos said "no thank you"...that should tell you a lot right there.

The whole of Aruba is bankrupt. Not just segments of it. That is why you see no outrage from anyone on Aruba. It takes time to get to that low level. Like decades. Aruba didn't just arrive where they are through a magic port-hole. No one was tele-ported through the ages like those on Aruba in recorded history.

We have all been following the case very intently for almost three years (pat yourselves on the back, Justice means something important to you and you're a good person to stand up for someone you most likely do not know) and we are no closer to seeing Joran behind bars than we were on day one. That's repulsive and challenges my belief system. AND I DON'T LIKE IT.

I would love to see one person stand up and do the right thing. One person beside Patrick. Someone with a set of nuts to slam the door on Paulus and Joran. It shouldn't be that hard to find someone in a position of Authority to do what's right.

Sure, we know a lot more than we did and we have seen it all. But there is one thing we have not seen or are likely to see, and that's Joran van der Sloot tried and convicted.

I'm going to pray extra hard tonight that Joran gets "dealt with".

Superior post, Rob. You're right on about Hans Less having no balls. Those don't exist on Aruba. They are too low a form of life to have developed testicles.

Spot on about everyone down there being corrupt, and it doesn't take long for them to get that way. Any hammer that comes down will have to come from Holland and if they say they don't have the power to do it they have no balls either. They hold the purse strings on Aruba and as we well know that is all they have been concerned about in the first place, money.

[Magnolia]

The date on wich they found the shoe and when they searched for it interests me beacuse he always as far as i know stuck to the leaving shoes on the beach story. What would be the point if the police had one of the shoes in their posession. Also in his june 9th statement he doesn t really know if he wore white shoes or creme coloured boots. Then on june 14th he has a brain wave (must have hurt) and says he wore kswiss white and blue coloured size 14 and bought in the USA. I d really like to know where the police found the shoe and when.
[/quote]
=====================================================================

They found the shoe the day they had the search warrant to search the vd/Sloot
residence and only searched Joran's quarters.

[Dayhiker]

i think there is a good chance that if after the september 2009 aruba elections the AVP gets in the government and the MEP looses there will be whistle blowers and of scandals of the previous government (current Oduber) will come out.
or crown witnesess who testify to save their asses about other scandals.
still now there are court cases against officials from before 2001 (AVP).

in the meantime peter r., beth en bram mosko will keep the pressure on.
and the pressure will get higher when peter r. next broadcast comes out.

also the dutch political party bringing up the corruption (PVV) is bound to win in an next dutch election.
that election might be soon. that also puts pressure on aruba.

and the antilles (though specifically aruba) will be a lot in the news because of the upcoming changes regarding their status in the kingdom decemer 2008.

so a lot of factor at play. only to bring these together at the right time.

that's how i see things. and i don't think i am the only one.
it only the pace it goes is frustrating, but the ball is unstoppable i think.

mos is not important, he will be gone in 2009 anyway. he is playing a delaying game i think.
nobody wants to be there when the shit hits the fan.

Hope you are right about the politics changing Caesu because this has played a major role in the corruption. Karin Jannsen was owned lock stock and barrel by somebody higher than she was, somebody told her to put the case in reverse and she obliged. Like Van der Straten she fled the island after she had sufficiently botched the case and that's why we are where we are today.

Jannsen and Straten need to have their asses drug in and questioned.

[Observer]

Didn't someone claim Yoran passed their house covered in mud from waist down in the wee hours of the morning?Shoe stuck in the mud?

I have never seen a credible report that said that. Truth is the Gardner witness messes up most theories,as it was only a hour after C&C. He says that Joran was in the drivers seat,Deepak in the front and someone in the back leaned the other way across the seat. My question is where was Natalee? Was the person in back covering her or was she somewhere else?

I know when they searched the Pond area they would not allow the Family to be there. So much mis-information it's hard to tell what is true. Dompig wanted everyone to be on the lookout for these pair of K-Swiss shoes and thought they may find them in the Pond.
Many people's theories center around the FH area and the 500 yards to the Raquet Club/Pond area seen here.

[Keepthefaith]

One of the authors has an interesting website that has a survey about Aruba's parks, oh and low and behold he used to work for guess who????

http://earneylasten.com/


EXPERIENCE


Strategic Analyst Manager 2004-2005
Aruba Tourism Authority, Oranjestad, Aruba
Responsible for International Marketing Consultancy


Information System Manager 1997-2004
Aruba Tourism Authority, Oranjestad, Aruba
Responsible for network, web design, and other technology projects


Public Relations/Data Processor 1989-1996
Aruba Tourism Authority, Oranjestad, Aruba
Participated in tourism trade shows, global meetings


Accountant 1986-1989
Lasten Accounting Services, N.V., Oranjestad, Aruba
Worked with overall accounting activities


Food Service Manager 1985-1986
Alken Exploitatie N.V., Oranjestad, Aruba
Worked with overall management activities

Contact info - why are they all tied to Florida?

In United States Home
Earney F. Lasten
8775 Sartori Street #203

Orlando, FL 32829

Keep your money diversified.They probably all have money in different countries due to the laundry everyone on Aruba does.Would love to know in which countries the VDS family has Bank Accounts and which banks????Who those banks are tied to and why???Would be telling i think.May have already been gone over but just a thought.What Businesses do the VDS family own and which countries.Yes.Aunts,Uncles,Parents,grandparents.Follow the money it leads somewhere.....Just thoughts...Beautiful sunny day in Seattle


Keepthefaith

[Dayhiker]

What i never could figure out is why he started this story about the shoes in the first place. Leaving his shoes at the beach or dumping them in a sewer or whatever only makes him look suspicious. Why did he not just get ridd of the shoes and simply not mention em to anyone. What's the big deal with these shoes. There is also the size 14 versus size 10 issue. It would have been so much easier just not to mention the shoes. Also if there was blood on his shoes that wouldn t that be on his clothes to? Cant imagine he walked home naked

There is only one reason I can think of that he'd change shoe size, JE, and that is to frame someone else. I think his shoes had blood/vomit DNA evidence on them and he had to get rid of them, but to switch sizes would mean he needed to deflect suspicion to somebody else with a different shoe size in case his were found.

[jackb]

******* do you know the date when they were looking for it and where they found the bloody/muddy shoe?

In the beginning of the case they were looking for one shoe only. They had another shoe with mud or blood on it,I forget which one it was. However when they did the pond search  in July,Dompig announced to everyone it was a pair of shoes they were looking for,so I did a double take and many others did at RWV as well. We never heard anything from the initial reports until the search at the Pond.

Somewhere deep in the archives you will see the initial reports of looking for one shoe,I am positive of that! They were trying to find the missing shoe is what we were told in the beginning.

He seems like is wanting to say:"someone stole my shoes so if you find them and find DNA on them, they stole them and then killed NH."  The ALE already reported finding one shoe at JVs home early in the case with blood, said it was JVs, etc.  They were not going to let that slip until they saw that the other shoe might be found and have DNA on it as well and could be found and turned over to FBI, etc.  They get rid of the one shoe and now Joran can say both his shoes are missing and in case one is found someone used them both and threw them away separately.  He has it "covered" since the ALE friends are disappearing evidence.  They took a ball bat out of that apartment as well.  Have not head mention of it since.  Some were trying to do their job, no knowing Vandderstratten and his flunkies were destroying evidence as fast as it was produced. Some of the evidence most likely is hidden and will be used over Joran and Palus and Vanderstrattens head as long as they live (and then some) if people who are using the justice system and ALE to further their criminal activities have an say over it.  Posner has videos and his bosses have them by now.  They will use this, at least, over Aruba's head until they clean out that nest of vipers so they can get fresh waters of Truth flowing into Aruba.  Those thugs certainly have bittered the waters of Aruba.  They need flushing out.  That little place has no business being an independent country, non of them do if they cannot control their LE and justice system.  It, at that size is too easy to corrupt.     Jack b

[bleachedblack]

Early in the case Tito Lacle a reporter said during his interview with Greta that his sources tell him that authorities are looking for a shoe that Joran lost, possibly in the pond area, and that Joran tried to buy another one to match the shoe he lost. Greta commented that it would have been difficult for Joran to walk home the night of Natalee's disappearance with only one shoe

This is exactly what I recall. There have been various reports though. One at RWV stated that the sneaker found in Jorans closet had mud on it. But what I remember is that ALE found one sneaker with a spot of blood on it in Jorans closet. Never did hear anything about DNA testing yhat might have been done.

++++++++++++++

Natalee Holloway Update: Missing Shoe
I've been informed that at a press conference today investigators have asked anyone that may have information as regards a sneaker - K-SWISS (White and Blue) size 14 possibly seen or found near the Marriott or the Fisherman's Hut area to please contact the Police.
Earlier reports have suggested that a search at the home of Joran Va der Sloot turned up a shoe which may have been covered with mud, or muck. The shoe had no match. The last bit of information hasn't been independently confirmed.
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/07/natalee_hollowa_91.html


On 12-6 BETH told “FoxNews” that early in the investigation, the family was told by the ARUBAN police investigators that blood was found inside a 5-29/30-worn “K-Swiss” brand, size 14, tennis shoe that is predominantly white with some blue trim that belongs to Principal Suspect J. SLOOT that was taken into evidence (the other 5-29/30-worn “K-Swiss” brand, size 14 tennis shoe has--according to the ARUBAN police authorities--has never been found). The ARUBAN police investigators told the family that the found blood inside the tennis shoe taken into evidence would be forensically tested, but, to date, BETH said she does not recall for sure if the ARUBAN police investigators have ever reported about the results of any blood tests, nor have the DUTCH nor the ARUBANS even said if the blood tests have ever been completed on the shoe.

http://members.aol.com/worldJOURNIER/NATALEE/NATALEEtimeline.html

[Dayhiker]

Robert Jensen Show with Beth Holloway - Peter R de Vries - Patrick van der Eem - Bram Moszkowicz

-Beth: Patrick is a great man, a great father, he's my hero
-Patrick talking about how he wanted to frame Joran, that was his only goal
-Patrick says he has a criminal past but changed drastically after he was about 21 years old, he started selling heroin at the age of 15, he's been in jail twice, drugsrelated
-Patrick talking again about meeting Joran for the first time in the Dutch casino and working towards the confession tapes, getting Joran to trust him
-Patrick says Joran told him he didn't respect his parents, didn't listen to them but that's nothing special for a 20-year old

No new info so far.

Beth was just sitting there the hold whole time, Robert and Patrick only spoke Dutch.

*commercial break*

Self-edit: whole

Thank you, Jo-An. No telephone call from Jensen to the Pimp today? He may be saving that for when Peter is sitting there.

[Observer]

What i never could figure out is why he started this story about the shoes in the first place. Leaving his shoes at the beach or dumping them in a sewer or whatever only makes him look suspicious. Why did he not just get ridd of the shoes and simply not mention em to anyone. What's the big deal with these shoes. There is also the size 14 versus size 10 issue. It would have been so much easier just not to mention the shoes. Also if there was blood on his shoes that wouldn t that be on his clothes to? Cant imagine he walked home naked

There is only one reason I can think of that he'd change shoe size, JE, and that is to frame someone else. I think his shoes had blood/vomit DNA evidence on them and he had to get rid of them, but to switch sizes would mean he needed to deflect suspicion to somebody else with a different shoe size in case his were found.

But it wouldn't be Joran acting alone trying to frame someone else,because they knew darn well what size she he wears. As of right now they are caught in this lie as well.

[Jo-An]

Robert Jensen Show with Beth Holloway - Peter R de Vries - Patrick van der Eem - Bram Moszkowicz - Part 2

-Joran texted Patrick even after the confession tapes, Joran texted: "you're even sicker than I am"
-Patrick still has 126 text-messages left on his cell that Joran sent him, about 10 of them after the PRDV-show
-Patrick gives Robert his cellphone, Robert shows one of the messages, it was about drugs
-Robert asks, "can I call Joran?"
-Robert calls Joran, Joran answers but that's all he says, Patrick says Joran usually doesn't answer the phone, lets it go to voicemail
-Patrick doesn't know where Joran is, is not even interested in knowing where he is
-Robert applauding Beth for staying strong throughout this whole time
-enter Peter
-Beth is saying that she always felt that Peter had to be the one that could help her, and he did
-Robert asks what Peter thinks is the most important thing in the tapes: Peter says it's when Joran imitates Natalee's shaking, he did that more than once, in more than one recording,
Peter says that that was really real, that was not a lie
-Peter says Patrick's past is not important at all, what's important is what Joran said
-enter Bram
-Bram is here to talk to Beth after the show, he will be back on the show next week
-Patrick calls Beth a supermom

So no new info, no new developments.

[Dayhiker]

There is only one reason I can think of that he'd change shoe size, JE, and that is to frame someone else. I think his shoes had blood/vomit DNA evidence on them and he had to get rid of them, but to switch sizes would mean he needed to deflect suspicion to somebody else with a different shoe size in case his were found.

But it wouldn't be Joran acting alone trying to frame someone else,because they knew darn well what size she he wears. As of right now they are caught in this lie as well.

The shoes must mean something or Joran wouldn't have told Patrick he threw them in a gutter after months of having claimed he left them on the beach. It would have been a non-story, nothing to lie about, if they weren't pertinent to the story.

[mojo]

Thanks Jo-An

[Dayhiker]

Robert Jensen Show with Beth Holloway - Peter R de Vries - Patrick van der Eem - Bram Moszkowicz - Part 2

-Joran texted Patrick even after the confession tapes, Joran texted: "you're even sicker than I am"
-Patrick still has 126 text-messages left on his cell that Joran sent him, about 10 of them after the PRDV-show
-Patrick gives Robert his cellphone, Robert shows one of the messages, it was about drugs
-Robert asks, "can I call Joran?"
-Robert calls Joran, Joran answers but that's all he says, Patrick says Joran usually doesn't answer the phone, lets it go to voicemail
-Patrick doesn't know where Joran is, is not even interested in knowing where he is
-Robert applauding Beth for staying strong throughout this whole time
-enter Peter
-Beth is saying that she always felt that Peter had to be the one that could help her, and he did
-Robert asks what Peter thinks is the most important thing in the tapes: Peter says it's when Joran imitates Natalee's shaking, he did that more than once, in more than one recording,
Peter says that that was really real, that was not a lie
-Peter says Patrick's past is not important at all, what's important is what Joran said
-enter Bram
-Bram is here to talk to Beth after the show, he will be back on the show next week
-Patrick calls Beth a supermom

So no new info, no new developments.

Nothing new but I am glad they are keeping the story alive. It just reinforces what a criminal Joran is. Thanks Jo-An!

[jackb]

Robert Jensen Show with Beth Holloway - Peter R de Vries - Patrick van der Eem - Bram Moszkowicz

-Beth: Patrick is a great man, a great father, he's my hero
-Patrick talking about how he wanted to frame Joran, that was his only goal
-Patrick says he has a criminal past but changed drastically after he was about 21 years old, he started selling heroin at the age of 15, he's been in jail twice, drugsrelated
-Patrick talking again about meeting Joran for the first time in the Dutch casino and working towards the confession tapes, getting Joran to trust him
-Patrick says Joran told him he didn't respect his parents, didn't listen to them but that's nothing special for a 20-year old

No new info so far.

Beth was just sitting there the hold whole time, Robert and Patrick only spoke Dutch.

*commercial break*

Self-edit: whole

Thank you, Jo-An. No telephone call from Jensen to the Pimp today? He may be saving that for when Peter is sitting there.

  FRAMING is not a word, I believe Patrick had in mind for Joran.  Tricking him into a confession of truth as to what happened would be what, in my estimation he was doing.  Whoever used the word FRAMING is either using the wrong word or they are trying to FRAME Patrick.     Jack blue

[katrien]

Bram Moszkowicz will be in the Jensen show next week again. He is going to be Mrs. Holloways laywer in the emotional damage. 

Oooow Rene Gielen.

[jackb]

This is an interesting bit of info I don't recall hearing about before. Sure hope ALE followed up on this.......
 
>>>>SNIP

Three weeks ago, a tourist from North Carolina called me to ask me how to get in touch with police. She and her husband had been out exploring the island, and they came across a sneaker.

They knew investigators were looking for a pair of sneakers that belonged to van der Sloot. And, they knew the sneaker they spotted probably was just something someone left behind, but they couldn't let it go. She wanted to let police know about it.

http://tinyurl.com/3bkhpb

There was also a woman in North Carolina who started talking about Joran's mother saying NH hit her head and drowned and later recanted saying this.  If it is the same woman.  Arrest her.        jack b