Natalee Case Discussion #742 3/10 - 3/14/08

[San]

I must with Dave that the Sloot residence played an important role.  What's the consensus here...

To what extent was the VDS residence used in NH's dissapearance?

Short and to the point.  Natalee was raped and murdered at the Sloots.

[Pita]

i didn't surprise me on the one hand, but i was surprised it never really came out. also, earlier you posted something about the dog incident and it mentioned a merryweather. i suspect this may be sidney merryweather. similar age, wonder if we can somehow verify the dog thing.

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=107036794

Well the entire Van Der Sloot and Hugen Family has been quiet,we don't even know which ones are paul's brothers or why him and his son are so protected. They know the names of all of Dave's kids,every MB student and everything about Natalee and her Family. Very little has come out for obvious reasons as we know years ago Van Der Straten use to work for PVDS,the more thats unraveled the more disgusted we will all be by how well he knows everyone that was involved. It is probably true with the two Judges Wit and Smit as well. It would not suprise me if other Fathers of the pimps influenced the Investigation in Aruba also.

Peter De Vries also reported about Joran killing his own dog in his first show and I take it as a fact. He killed his own pet dumped it in the Moko pond and tried to blame it on this kid. However there probably is no police record of that thanks to Van Der Straten and Pauls friends in the ALE. We saw a similar thing from the reports of the 3 girls who said they were drugged and assaulted by Joran,they went to the police and nothing was done. They came forward again after Natalee dissapeared but then  stepped back after Dennis Jacobs talked to them. When the KLPD looked into this,her Psychiatrist said that she was drugged and abused by Joran,but Dennis Jacobs said she was not willing to come forward because she was still in love with Joran 

Arubagirl first told us about Joran killing his dog.  The Merrywether mother had told
Arubagirl's mother the story.  Some sort of relative as I recall.  Hubie Merrywether was
the father of the boy.

On July 12, 2005 identity “clevfan” of “Major Wager.com” reported: I know this is hearsay, but interesting story from a girl in Aruba regarding Joran:

Anyway, remember John Merryweather, evil incarnate and my mom's cousin? He has a son, named Herbert (Herbie) Merryweather. Herbert is married and has a son, but I don't know his name.

The mother of this son came to talk to my mom day before yesterday and it turns out that her son is a classmate of Joran's. So, got it, grandson Merryweather is Joran's classmate.

Turns out that that grandson and mom had a major clash with Joran some time before, because Joran accused grandson of killing Joran's dog and throwing it in Moko Dam (place where TX ES also searched), however, the mother threatened to go the cops to make a complaint against Joran,

and the Joran confessed to killing his own dog.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=188.20

[Blue Moon]

I must with Dave that the Sloot residence played an important role.  What's the consensus here...

To what extent was the VDS residence used in NH's dissapearance?

The newly poured concrete right at the height of the disappearance is extremely suspect. I cannot imagine ANYONE suspected of murder, kidnapping, rape etc. in the U.S. being allowed to pour new concrete or having new furniture delivered to their home without being investigated and having the concrete dug up or the old furniture inspected and tested.  Guess I believe this is where it all started and it ended up at the beach with disposal in the ocean.

[bleachedblack]

Dutchlady wrote:
If a person who takes someone has a home he takes that person to be isolated for his intentions. In all the cases of abductions of persons at nightclubs and at open places there is a foreplay of games as bait.

It also makes sense as sex is not an off- on switch with two in tow, it is a game set out before hand with more than one.

It is also the case that the beach was a later alibi as was the lighthouse one, as distancing from the home of Joran who had unlimited access. No kids shits on the beach if he has a bog at home. To graphic, then listen to kids of that age in school. No man or boy of over 16 would think of peeing in a gutter or laying in a tourism place as an alternative to his own drink parlour and bog. Yes, the words come as easily as other predators I have listened too, and what they do is tell a good story in their mind and regurtitate it. It takes a snake to catch a snake. The snake is not Joran, yes he has in my opinion lashed out at Natalee for some reason, but the duality of this is the repetition and stage management so that has to be a more older adult. He is procuring for someone else and simple bragging because he joins in on the action as a forensic cue from his own photos on the web.

I would like the person who dangles the web picture on Jorans site to again contact me, he is not wanting money, so it must be revenge. That person is trying to be a friend of the Holloways but is not. I urge that person to send me the website before Paulus took it down. That is the key to all this and why it had to be taken down as the pictures were going to be uploaded there untill something went drastically wrong in this roleplay is my making on the content and conditions of the actors behaviours exposed.

[bleachedblack]

Maritza wrote 6/21;
I am a behavioural profiler who has and is tracing five missing persons, and in the past with language codes found the keys in television interviews of persons. These relayed to authorities may have, and were found to be accurate in the persons having these set patterns in conflict to the words stated.

In the case of Joran Van Der Sloot and what has been written. The following is revealed.

Joran Van Der Sloot at an age before 17, made a tape of a 14 year old girl being gang raped on the island with other members of this 'club on the island - that island was Aruba. The circulation is unknown, and not known if free circulation via his internet site, or the site of the internet cafe. Investigative agencies have a copy of those and that edition one would suppose, and the name of the victim.

Joran Van Der Sloot is credited with having anger management therapy. He is quoted by mothers as being a bully. He shows little respect for those lesser than him in size, parental wealth/status and more academic progress. He is not an 'arts' person, but a game player. His adrenalin high is on winning, and competative sports. He has to win, and having the parentage he has he is set to win at any cost. His money for gambling in casino's therefore is from 'where'?

His 'friends' on weblogs say he had sold the film of the gang rape, not given it. This if true is a crime, and one that if the parents knew is a crime he can be charged with as the hardcopy is on the drive of his computer, but more likely the internet cafe computer as parents can 'look down' at email messages on their computer as can police. Erased messages also can be taken by internet security consultants and also photographs.

Joran Van Der Sloot, his age is nearer to 18 as he says he is a LEO. So he will be 18 soon.Most of his male friends seem older than him, and not a racial bias. He has older friends with the same assets and lifestyle. His webpage shows many spelling errors as in ARNHEM, and wonder of his lucidity in making this page. Common words in neurological function of language can be affected by Wernicke-Korsakoffe confabulation, that is half truth/half fiction. Something that is prevalent in most deviants and sadists found who have personality disorders. It is also a condition in severe alcohol ingestion over time, and of course stroke, brain injury persons in the non alcoholic kind.

Joran Van Der Sloot's home page is his identity. The pages of the photos selected as his own cognitive state show how he wants to be seen. The devils horns and bar behind are scenes above his own age of 17 and status those he wishes to impress. These are girls, and he has to impress those older than him, not younger. Therefore in behavioural traits he is being narcissistic, egotistical, AOD and other drugs dependant in some form, and has to be central to all images of him as the 'sensation seeker' in his own mind. I wonder then of the phenomena of 'folie a deux' as in more than one as Master and apprentice, and if one is ellevated past this?

In the homepages in Holland it is said they think he is being framed. Rubbish, serial killers who have been sent the image of Joran with the neckstrap round the puny boys neck will comment if allowed on the mind of the person doing this. But without that reply I am saying that the photograph shows in body language his full frame as covering the photo and his shirt chosen for its association and his neural firing of AOD pupil reaction. The boy in this is acutely victimised shown by the eyes screwed up, palour and side view as sadism is shown, not playful sex bondage. He exhibits strangulation signs. Of all else, Joran shows no gay attributes, this shown is a victim, not a play act. The facial expression and loss of shirt expose the punyness and lack of identity in contrast to Joran's.

This person will and can be a witness, and I would speculate is from a none skilled, low socio economic family where he takes his bullying tendancies and anger pool from.

I would say abandonment rage is a symptom he displays and he has a rage in the home that is known as outbursts. He engages with his dad, and tests him to the limits. His mother is the least aggressive and passive of the whole lot. She is the calmer of the unit. Joran's own statements as to Natalee have been dissociative. He has sought to distance as has his father from the outside media. Natalee's parents on speaking to the father in the early days may as reported have found him to be condescending, arrogant - as stated and above the law. He is however a trainee judge on the island. The judge in the case is an impartial highly qualified judge who is from another island. He is above Joran's father and most people on the island. He will use behavioral assessments, medical records, and all past behaviour to form an opinion on what Joran and the family have as issues on deviant behaviour already exhibited.

Locals are invaluable in message boards as both devils advocate and as insights into the island and of the person in both supporting and non supporting roles to a behavioural profiler.

The issue of the lighthouse as distancing, there is one other near the International School at the extreme south of the Island.

I do not think this was an impromtu event, due to the fight with the lads of Natalees school and the planning element of cognitive minds in three predators shown to be so by locals on the island and his mode of humiliating girls in groups. He is most likely to have taken her in equal matches of power between the two brothers using the safety key of his fathers position. This is a tool for his authority and credibility.

I have to assume to implicate the guards at her hotel he had to have passed in the car and seen this walkie talkie at some time, or that evening to be able to finger these as suspects to allow his release and those of the other two. Hence he, or the two brothers passed that hotel around that time. I would therefore say for the plan to work, if she is dead, she will have been there in some construction area site to make this stick.

In later retractions and distancing she is now said to be in a lighthouse, which one? Why this lead to the extreme North, she is then said to be on a beach, all of which is past her hotel. She is said to be left on that or a beach with Joran. No it does not cognitively fit. They were all together for some period of time, what time we do not know. It is therefore imperative that the findings are in secret from media in order for the search of what looks like her remains to happen, or cloths/DNA. If she is alive, the reward will allow that person to post on messages that will lead to her finding, for she is still on the land on the island. Not in my view off the island, in the sea, and would look inland as behavioural environmental psychology at the familiarity of the suspects and easy access in a car. My professional insights follow this process.

[Dayhiker]

I must with Dave that the Sloot residence played an important role.  What's the consensus here...

To what extent was the VDS residence used in NH's dissapearance?

Hard to say as to what extent OE..But since Karin Janssen,Judge Wit and Gerald Dompig are all caught lying why they blocked the search of the home and refused to let it be searched..One has to wonder why? They had a full search warrant 16 days after Natalee dissapeared but still blocked the search the day of the search..Why would they do that? Why would the Judge say they never asked to search that property anymore then Jorans Apt but the Chief Prosecuter and Deputy commissioner say they were denied,they said they were also denied when Paul Van Der Sloot was arrested for Pre-Meditated Murder and Kidnapping..Why would the Judge say Dompig obstructed Justice and didn't want that house searched so PVDS could have his privacy? Since when do Murder and Kidnapping suspects get immunity from having there house searched? We know they tried to frame two innocent men and they immediately searched there house! What was Peter R reporting that something happened in the garden in 2006? Yet in 2007 that is exactly where the KLPD forensic team focused there search on.

They didn't search the Van der Sloot house after Paulus was arrested for conspiracy to commit murder either. I believe Jannsen, Van der Straten, Jacobs, Vocking and Judge Wit knew damn well Natalee was murdered at the Van der Sloot house and that's why it was never searched the residence until two years later.

[Observer]

The Persistence is completing its last leg of the journey home.  It should arrive some time on Wed.  Incredibly, the Persistence never saw anything over 4ft seas the entire way from Aruba to Mexico with 2kt currents and the wind at its stern - it made awesome time.  It had to spend a few days in Mexico where it refueled until the Gulf calmed down, but it's good to go now.  Thanks for all the prayers. 

Thats great news OE  I hope someone gets the chance to check out those targets that you all worked so hard to locate! It would be terrible to always wonder if you found her but just never got the chance to make that dive to locate her and bring her home....Where she belongs...

[JE]

Anyone else think its weird that in the PRDV tapes joran says as to why he called Daury:

Then I panicked.
I think, nobody even knows I am out of the house, I just left the house, you know, so I'm thinking, what do I have to do? What do I have to do?

But the next day as Beth and company went to the Sloot house at 2.00 or 3.00 am, he was not in his appartement again but gambling at the Windham

Hard to believe that seemingly structural behaviour would make him panic

[oceanexploration]

Question:
Why would multiple legal professionals jeopardize their careers, livelihood, and freedom to cover for the VDSs?

-All very close friends?
- PvdS has dirt on them all and willing to use it as leverage?
- Blackmail?
 

[blah]

This is WAY off topic but I just received this in an e-mail and just have to share it with all of you monkeys.

If you have the time, watch the whole thing, it is really something....

http://video.stumbleupon.com/#p=ithct48cqw

[Dayhiker]

The Persistence is completing its last leg of the journey home.  It should arrive some time on Wed.  Incredibly, the Persistence never saw anything over 4ft seas the entire way from Aruba to Mexico with 2kt currents and the wind at its stern - it made awesome time.  It had to spend a few days in Mexico where it refueled until the Gulf calmed down, but it's good to go now.  Thanks for all the prayers. 

Thats great news OE  I hope someone gets the chance to check out those targets that you all worked so hard to locate! It would be terrible to always wonder if you found her but just never got the chance to make that dive to locate her and bring her home....Where she belongs...

Glad Persistence is having a safe voyage back. Something evil about the waters of Aruba, very reflective of the government, law enforcement. tourism authority and judicial system, pure evil.

[KarmaRoundUp]

Interesting to look at the islands yearbooks..Such a small class but yet so many with the same last name..Kock,Arendsz,Arends,Maduro..Croes..and yes Wever 

That is interesting.Lot of them look unhappy,mainly the girls.Wonder if we can find one with Lorenzo in it?

[Dayhiker]

Question:
Why would multiple legal professionals jeopardize their careers, livelihood, and freedom to cover for the VDSs?

-All very close friends?
- PvdS has dirt on them all and willing to use it as leverage?
- Blackmail?
 

ALL OF THE ABOVE and probably a few more. Add The Mafia and its storefront tourism organizations ATA/AHATA in there. Paulus probably has some connections there, his business partner Antonio Carlo, Joran's lawyer, sits on the board of AHATA and they are the ones who attacked Natalee and Beth in the media.

[KarmaRoundUp]

I must with Dave that the Sloot residence played an important role.  What's the consensus here...

To what extent was the VDS residence used in NH's dissapearance?

Hi Ocean,good to see you all made it back home safe.

Considering that the van der sloots decided it was a GOOD thing to give their wayward,sicko,out of control son a line of credit at the casinos and carlos&Charlies bar,and his own little private party pad at the age of 15.....I'd say joran used his little apartment for sex parties,and that he took Natalee there(like he took all of his girls there,with his parents approval),Natalee was raped and over drugged and died there.Then they possibly moved her around the dirty little island a couple of times then out to sea.

[Observer]

Anyone else think its weird that in the PRDV tapes joran says as to why he called Daury:

Then I panicked.
I think, nobody even knows I am out of the house, I just left the house, you know, so I'm thinking, what do I have to do? What do I have to do?

But the next day as Beth and company went to the Sloot house at 2.00 or 3.00 am, he was not in his appartement again but gambling at the Windham

Hard to believe that seemingly structural behaviour would make him panic

Yes and even harder to believe that Patrick left it the way it was without answering any questions..She goes into convulsions and he calls for help and they dump her in the ocean not knowing if she was alive or dead..Certainly Patrick knew that was all BS,He is way to street smart and after months with Joran surely knew what the motive was that night.Even after 10 confessions with him he asked nothing really important like why the hell she was dying just 1 hours after getting in that car,or why she was unconscious..etc. I will not be buying his book either as something is very fishy!

Remember Joran was home when the Family arrived on the island,as Deepak's car was spotted but when they arrived at the house it was gone and so was Joran. Plus he was sweaty,not wearing the right clothes and lied where he was gambling at. They were not out gambling on the night of the 30th..

When he was speaking of Daury,I am absolutely convinced he was speaking of his Father and his friend/half brother who helped. Also convinced they immediately dumped her in the ocean..It all seemed staged and 95% of it was BS!..IMO

[oceanexploration]

The Persistence is completing its last leg of the journey home.  It should arrive some time on Wed.  Incredibly, the Persistence never saw anything over 4ft seas the entire way from Aruba to Mexico with 2kt currents and the wind at its stern - it made awesome time.  It had to spend a few days in Mexico where it refueled until the Gulf calmed down, but it's good to go now.  Thanks for all the prayers. 

Thats great news OE  I hope someone gets the chance to check out those targets that you all worked so hard to locate! It would be terrible to always wonder if you found her but just never got the chance to make that dive to locate her and bring her home....Where she belongs...

Perhaps I can clarify things a bit.  The press always seems to word things so they sound worse than they are. 

The search was not flat out "called-off".  The side scan sonar search is complete.  We covered all of the planned area (and other non-planned areas) with 200% coverage.  This means every inch of seabed was covered twice on average over about 50 sq miles. Many sonar targets were identified and explored with the first round of ROV dives between Dec 29th to about the 7th of January.  What has not been completed is the ROV dives on sonar targets found after about the 2nd week of January through the end of the sonar search.  These targets (as well as the first dive series picks) were picked under the assumption that any type of containment of human remains should be explored, rather than just fish traps.  This method makes no guesses as to what we "know" or "don't know" about the case, rather it leaves no stone unturned. Once adequate funding is procured a dedicated ROV vessel and crew will complete the dives.  A ROV boat is more efficient and economical at conducting the ROV dives than the Persistence with it's extra equipment and personnel.
In this case it's best to return to the site with exactly the right equipment to do the job.  The remotely operated vehicle (ROV) that is eventually sent to Aruba will be better suited for the deepest dive sites.  It will also come equipped with better recovery capabilities if necessary.  For working in the deepest portions of the search area, the SeaEye Falcon ROV had potentially insufficient tether and therefore may not have been able to reach the deepest targets. 
I look at this as a retreat.  By retreat, I mean a temporary strategic withdrawal from battle, work, or operations. It is best to return home to re-tool, plan, and procure funding rather than pressing forward beyond financial, technical, and physical limits.

[bleachedblack]

Question:
Why would multiple legal professionals jeopardize their careers, livelihood, and freedom to cover for the VDSs?

-All very close friends?
- PvdS has dirt on them all and willing to use it as leverage?
- Blackmail?
 

ALL OF THE ABOVE and probably a few more. Add The Mafia and its storefront tourism organizations ATA/AHATA in there. Paulus probably has some connections there, his business partner Antonio Carlo, Joran's lawyer, sits on the board of AHATA and they are the ones who attacked Natalee and Beth in the media.

...add to the mix the credo that NOTHING should mar the reputation of Aruba as an "idyllic" tourist destination......and you have legals, politicos, and common folks alike willing to do anything it takes to maintain that image.

[Dayhiker]

I must with Dave that the Sloot residence played an important role.  What's the consensus here...

To what extent was the VDS residence used in NH's dissapearance?

Hi Ocean,good to see you all made it back home safe.

Considering that the van der sloots decided it was a GOOD thing to give their wayward,sicko,out of control son a line of credit at the casinos and carlos&Charlies bar,and his own little private party pad at the age of 15.....I'd say joran used his little apartment for sex parties,and that he took Natalee there(like he took all of his girls there,with his parents approval),Natalee was raped and over drugged and died there.Then they possibly moved her around the dirty little island a couple of times then out to sea.

Yep.

[Dayhiker]

Question:
Why would multiple legal professionals jeopardize their careers, livelihood, and freedom to cover for the VDSs?

-All very close friends?
- PvdS has dirt on them all and willing to use it as leverage?
- Blackmail?
 

ALL OF THE ABOVE and probably a few more. Add The Mafia and its storefront tourism organizations ATA/AHATA in there. Paulus probably has some connections there, his business partner Antonio Carlo, Joran's lawyer, sits on the board of AHATA and they are the ones who attacked Natalee and Beth in the media.

...add to the mix the credo that NOTHING should mar the reputation of Aruba as an "idyllic" tourist destination......and you have legals, politicos, and common folks alike willing to do anything it takes to maintain that image.

Add to that the Aruba journalists who deliberately put lies out in the media and on internet sites to try to sway the investigation away from the Van der Sloots.

[JE]

This is WAY off topic but I just received this in an e-mail and just have to share it with all of you monkeys.

If you have the time, watch the whole thing, it is really something....

http://video.stumbleupon.com/#p=ithct48cqw

Wow amazing man, very impressive, very true