Natalee Case Discussion #745 3/25 - 4/4/08

[WhiskeyGirl]

just my own humble opinion, but i don't think the world losing the likes of natalee ann holloway could  be offset by anything the happy island's likely to learn about, or change their ways over.
dennisintn

I hope that the happy island sets some boundaries for the behavior of everyone.  IIRC, they tell the chollars not to hurt the tourists.  Isn't that a message for everyone?  Treat others as you would want to be treated? 

Is it better to allow people to lie (over and over and over) or expect them to tell the truth?  Perhaps they should be allowed to remain silent rather than lie and mislead?

Twenty souls before Natalee got away with their lives.  I wonder if they read about Natalee and feel grateful to have their life.  Do they even make that association?   

Perhaps there are others that targeted tourists on the island?  How many of these tourists were lucky to wake up and catch their planes?

Natalee didn't leave and was disappeared.  mo

Did she die and no one notice on Aruba?  Business as usual?

[Lala'sMom]

MBOX-="You've got mail"

I was speaking Caps language. Sorry for the confusion...no deep dark secrets at all.

[dennisintn]

just my own humble opinion, but i don't think the world losing the likes of natalee ann holloway could  be offset by anything the happy island's likely to learn about, or change their ways over.
dennisintn

I hope that the happy island sets some boundaries for the behavior of everyone.  IIRC, they tell the chollars not to hurt the tourists.  Isn't that a message for everyone?  Treat others as you would want to be treated? 

Is it better to allow people to lie (over and over and over) or expect them to tell the truth?  Perhaps they should be allowed to remain silent rather than lie and mislead?

Twenty souls before Natalee got away with their lives.  I wonder if they read about Natalee and feel grateful to have their life.  Do they even make that association?   

Perhaps there are others that targeted tourists on the island?  How many of these tourists were lucky to wake up and catch their planes?

Natalee didn't leave and was disappeared.  mo

Did she die and no one notice on Aruba?  Business as usual?
[/quote

oh, aruba noticed all right.  the cover up started immediately. 
dennisintn

[WhiskeyGirl]

just my own humble opinion, but i don't think the world losing the likes of natalee ann holloway could  be offset by anything the happy island's likely to learn about, or change their ways over.
dennisintn

I hope that the happy island sets some boundaries for the behavior of everyone.  IIRC, they tell the chollars not to hurt the tourists.  Isn't that a message for everyone?  Treat others as you would want to be treated? 

Is it better to allow people to lie (over and over and over) or expect them to tell the truth?  Perhaps they should be allowed to remain silent rather than lie and mislead?

Twenty souls before Natalee got away with their lives.  I wonder if they read about Natalee and feel grateful to have their life.  Do they even make that association?   

Perhaps there are others that targeted tourists on the island?  How many of these tourists were lucky to wake up and catch their planes?

Natalee didn't leave and was disappeared.  mo

Did she die and no one notice on Aruba?  Business as usual?

oh, aruba noticed all right.  the cover up started immediately. 
dennisintn

(I fixed the quote stack above)

What I've always wondered about - how and why did C&C call in marketing/public/media relations for the crisis situation when Natalee disappeared?

Why would they need help?  IIRC, the crisis company (name escapes me now) was on Aruba before J2K were arrested.  Why?

Why would they need such heavy duty help?  What did C&C know that the rest of the world didn't?

Who else on Aruba call for media specialists/crisis managers?

Why would anyone think there was a crisis?

[klaasend]

http://www.tuscaloosanews.com/article/20080329/WVUA01/555255209/-1/WVUA

Article published Mar 29, 2008
Massive Search for Lisa Ann Green

Diana Moorer

An organization known for helping distraught families was there to help. It has been 8 months since Lisa Ann Green was last seen on the 4800 block of Cypress Creek Avenue.

Texas EquuSearch was contacted 3 months ago by the woman’s father and the search still continues. Since EquuSearch was founded in 2000, over 780 searches have been conducted with a tremendous amount of success.

The organization helped search for Natalie Holloway. Natalie’s mother, Beth Holloway Twitty, volunteered Saturday in the search for Green. People of all walks of life participated in the search also.

The five teams combed the thick wooded landscape with the help of eyes in the sky. More manpower and volunteers are still needed. If you’d like to join the search for Lisa Ann Green you can join the searchers at the parking lot of Randall-Riley Publishing on Rice Mine Road Sunday morning at 8:30 a.m.

[texasmom]

http://www.tuscaloosanews.com/article/20080329/WVUA01/555255209/-1/WVUA

Article published Mar 29, 2008
Massive Search for Lisa Ann Green

Diana Moorer

An organization known for helping distraught families was there to help. It has been 8 months since Lisa Ann Green was last seen on the 4800 block of Cypress Creek Avenue.

Texas EquuSearch was contacted 3 months ago by the woman’s father and the search still continues. Since EquuSearch was founded in 2000, over 780 searches have been conducted with a tremendous amount of success.

The organization helped search for Natalie Holloway. Natalie’s mother, Beth Holloway Twitty, volunteered Saturday in the search for Green. People of all walks of life participated in the search also.

The five teams combed the thick wooded landscape with the help of eyes in the sky. More manpower and volunteers are still needed. If you’d like to join the search for Lisa Ann Green you can join the searchers at the parking lot of Randall-Riley Publishing on Rice Mine Road Sunday morning at 8:30 a.m.

Thanks Klaas!  God bless Beth, she is amazing!

[CapsLockWizard]

klaasend: LALA: TM:

MBOX

[texasmom]

Klaas, when you have a minute would you please verify the information in my last post in the Shango/Simian thread.  I think there may be an error on one individual in the Aruban Who's Who information.  Thanks in advance!

[Tamikosmom]

I would assume that Hans Mos is conducting an investigation in Paulus' possible role in obtaining a cell phone for his son while detained.

Janet

++++++++++++

Anita van der Sloot
On the Record w/ Greta
June 23, 2005

ANITA VAN DER SLOOT: No. The first days, when he was at the police office, I could go in sometimes in the morning, see him for five or ten minutes, sometimes at night, and I could hold him. I couldn't talk about the case or anything, just about love from this and this person, friends from Holland called, people who wrote e-mails. So I spoke with him about these things and just told him to stay strong and to tell the truth.
And yesterday, he got transported to the Kia, the correction institute, Kia — that's how we call the prison here — and I could visit him a little bit longer. My husband, Paul, gets no access to him at all, and they refuse his lawyer to get any access to him during interrogation. He could tell me a little bit about his interrogations that were really, really tough. A lot of pressure on him, extreme pressure.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,160471,00.html


Joran van der Sloot
20/20: Peter Devries/Patrick vander Eem Video Recording
February 4, 2008

j:   So I said, Dad, I need some thing here.  I feel very badly, and so on, you know, I need a phone.
 
He said: Well, we can't do that.

Then I told him, I really need one here, otherwise I'll get into trouble here.  Maybe people will beat me up in here, all those kind of things.
 
Then my dad said, If I arrange that for you, I will be there with the boy, who takes care of all of that.  So I'll be with him, I will stand with him, because nobody can get a phone in there.
 
And yes, he did it. So, then I had contact, of course, and do you know how often, I had so little calling time.......
 
My father is so stupid..... He buys a phone, and does not add any f***ing calling time.  So, there was only 5 or 10 guilders worth of calling time on there.

Translated by Marco at RU 

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2576.0

[Tamikosmom]

Dennis Jacob knew the truth regarding Natalee's demise on May 31, 2005 and ... in an effort to distance Joran and Paulus ... he has put the family through a H--- on Earth for almost three years.

Despicable!

Janet

+++++++++

Beth Holloway
On the Record w/ Greta
February 7, 2008

HOLLOWAY: Well, when I met him, he told — you know, we initially met at the airport, and within the first 10 minutes, he began to convey to me what he had. And he began telling me some of the things that Joran had admitted to during this taped session with Patrick.

And you know, when you're hearing it, some of the things that I was hearing — of course, the first thing that struck me when Peter was telling me — and there were some camera crews around. And Peter began to disclose to me how Joran described Natalee's condition, the shaking. And I tell you, Greta, I mean, I had to ask everyone to leave the room. I wanted everyone out.

I couldn't believe it because, I mean, it was so stunning, it was so stunning that I was hearing these words that Joran was saying because two- and-a-half years ago, gosh, Greta, within 48 hours of Natalee's disappearance — 48 hours — the lead detective, Dennis Jacobs, came to me in the Bubali (ph) police station and says, Does Natalee have a history of epilepsy or seizures? And I thought, No, why are you asking that? And he did it — they did it repeatedly to Jug. And when I was hearing that, it just — it just felt like it brought everything full circle of what we had been fighting for.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you think, if the Aruban police asked that question within 48 hours of Natalee disappearing, and now we hear it on the tape with Joran two-and-a-half or three-and-a-half years later, whatever it is by now — do you think the Aruban police heard him say that? Do you think he told that to the Aruban police that night when they talked to him?

HOLLOWAY: I have absolutely no doubt that the only reason why that question was asked of us was they had a confession or an admission of this from Joran Van Der Sloot himself. So definitely. There is no way that we can tie what Joran said — you know, no way that we cannot tie when Joran said during that taped interview to what was asked of us from Dennis Jacobs not — within 48 hours. Absolutely. Absolutely, they knew.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,329348,00.html


John Kelly
On the Record w/ Greta
February 20, 2008

KELLY:  Let me throw one more thing in on that Greta.  On May 31st, Joran was the first person interviewed by Jacobs when he's taking statements. Every police report subsequent to that, the statements made by Deepak, made by Satish, made by Beth that day, we have them all, there is no statement from Joran until June 9th.
Unofficial Transcript

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Twi7-8OqS4


Joran van der Sloot
De Zaak Natalee Holloway
Page 161

After Freddy's second statement on June 13th at 18:30, in which he keeps insisting that I told him the first story already on May 30th, the police confront us as best friends with each other.  Some further statements follow after that.  In the end Freddy states in his 6th and 7th statements that I have told him that Natalee went unconscious several times and did not regain consciousness at a certain moment, that I tried to wake her up by shaking her but that but this also did not work.Unofficial Engish translation

[JusticeforNatalee]

http://arubanboycott.blogspot.com/

[Kiwi]

So its been a few months since the phone in jail confession, and where is the evidence? Where are the phone records from that phone in Kia? Is the phone they found by the light house the same phone as the one used in prison by Joran? Maybe its part of the 10YR plan to collect a few tons of evidence before going to trial. I forgot there is zero... now. Interesting there are as many confessions as phones used by Joran and associates. With all the phone data on hard drives at phone companies its also interesting that none of the phone records survived.

[Tamikosmom]

n November, 2007 ... how did ten prosecution lawyers ... who concurred with the prosecutor deem that there was suffient new evidence to reopen the Natalee Holloway case ... get it so wrong.  Even John Q. Kelly ... for the first time ... had the same mindset as the defence and ... ulitmately the judge ... THERE WAS NO NEW EVIDENCE!

Either it is believed that Hans Mos is on the side of justice for Natalee Holloway or ... he is not.  Tamikosmom has concluded that the prosecutor IS NOT on the side of justice for Natalee Holloway ... he is part of the coverup.

I contend that the purpose of the rearrest of Joran, Deepak and Satish in November, 2007 was what John Kelly claimed ... NOTHING BUT A DOG AND PONY SHOW!

Janet

++++++++++++

NOVEMBER, 2007 DETAINMENT - EVIDENCE
 
Hans Mos
ABC NEWS
November 26, 2007

Hans Mos, Aruba's chief prosecutor, told ABC News he believes the the new evidence makes the case against the three men stronger than it was two years.

"We are convinced if we had had this evidence we have now they would not have been released by the court at that time," Mos said.

http://sendtofriend.abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=3912737


Hans Mos
On the Record with Greta
November 27, 2007

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: Breaking news from Aruba, Joran van der Sloot ordered to stay behind bars for at least eight more days. Now, the Kalpoe brothers already got the same news last week. Now, all three suspects were re-arrested. Why? The prosecutor has now charged all three with voluntary manslaughter of Natalee Holloway.

MOS: And this decision to re-arrest these three suspects was a decision taken by 10 lawyers, by 10 lawyers sitting around a table (INAUDIBLE) whole afternoon, being presented the new material.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,313168,00.html


Hans Mos
CNN
November 30, 2007

Mos has told CNN he believes authorities have enough evidence to prove Holloway is dead, even if her body is never found. He has suggested her death was an accident.

The new evidence against the three men was gathered from advanced techniques used to re-examine existing information, including cell phone records and text messages exchanged the night Holloway disappeared, Mos has said.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/americas/11/30/aruba.holloway/index.html


Hans Mos
The Associated Press
Nov 24, 2007

Mos told CNN on Saturday that authorities are working under the assumption that the American teen is no longer alive.

"I think we have enough evidence to be able prove she is dead," Mos said. "Whether that will be proved beyond a reasonable doubt ... it's very hard to assess what a judge will say about this. But we have evidence that she is dead ."

http://cbs5.com/national/joran.van.der.2.594763.html


Judge Approves Transfer for Suspect in Natalee Holloway Disappearance Case
Thursday, November 22, 2007

THE HAGUE, Netherlands —  A Dutch judge on Thursday approved the transfer to Aruba of a student suspected in the 2005 disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway on the Caribbean resort island, a prosecutor said.

Joran van der Sloot, 20, was arrested Wednesday in the central city of Arnhem on suspicion of involvement in voluntary manslaughter and causing serious bodily harm that resulted in Holloway's death.

Two other suspects, Surinamese brothers Satish and Deepak Kalpoe, were arrested in Aruba.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,312568,00.html


NOVEMEBER, 2007 DETAINMENT - NEW EVIDENCE FAILS TO MATERIALIZE.

Aruban defense attorneys dispute alleged evidence in Holloway case
The Associated Press Published: December 21, 2007

ORANJESTAD, Aruba: A suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway never mentioned her death in an online chat, his lawyer said Friday, contradicting Aruban prosecutors who called the comment key new evidence in the case.

The chat log fell far short of justifying the arrest of Deepak Kalpoe, one of three men seen with the American teen the night of her disappearance, said attorney Ronald Wix.

A court in the Dutch Caribbean island agreed and quickly released Kalpoe, along with brother Satish and a third suspect, Joran van der Sloot. Now, authorities should leave the three men alone, Wix told reporters.

"If they as much as look at our clients too long, we'll take them to court," said Wix, who also represents Satish Kalpoe.

The three suspects were seen leaving a bar with Holloway on the final night of her high school graduation trip to the island.

Aruban prosecutors detailed the chat log for the first time Thursday, saying it was a key clue that they hoped would break open the long-stalled investigation. The men did not speak with investigators while detained and a judge ordered their release for lack of evidence.

Upon their release, authorities said they had reached a dead end after two years of pursuing fruitless searches and leads, though they could still prosecute the men if they uncover evidence.

In discussing the online chat, prosecutor Hans Mos told reporters that one of the suspects — he did not disclose which — wrote that Holloway, 18 at the time of disappearance, was dead. He also said Internet messages among two suspects discussed meeting drunk American girls in Aruba.

Wix said the prosecution misinterpreted Deepak Kalpoe's Internet chats.

The 24-year-old native of Suriname in fact told a friend he was upset and thought it was stupid of him to let Holloway, whom he called a drunk stranger, get into his car, the attorney said.

Kalpoe then commented on the death of a tennis teacher who drowned in Aruba almost three years ago. When prosecutors translated his writing from Papiamento to Dutch, they substituted 'the death' to 'her death,' and assumed he was talking about Holloway, Wix said. Most Arubans speak Papiamento, a Creole language that has absorbed words from Spanish, Dutch, English and Portuguese.

Mos was on vacation Friday and could not be reached for a response. Another prosecutor, Dop Kruimel, did not immediately return phone calls seeking comment.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/12/21/news/CB-GEN-Aruba-Missing-Teen.php


John Q. Kelly
On the Record w/ Greta
December 4, 2007

KELLY: Well, in their press release and even in conversations. I had a long discussion with him Thanksgiving morning after the arrests, and you know, he indicated that they were very confident, this new evidence they had, this incriminating evidence. And it turns out, quite frankly, that it is nothing new ...

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So you can say with 100 percent certainly there's nothing new, right?

KELLY: I can say it with 99 percent.

<snipped>

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY ATTORNEY: Disappointing, Greta. I think it was disappointing to me and actually extraordinarily painful and almost cruel for Beth and Dave after being down there.

They'd like to get some answers and they'd like to see some progress made. And it's not fair to bring them down there with the false promises, with raised expectations, sort of a dog and pony show down there with no substance.

And it was — it just really took whatever spirit, almost, that Beth and Dave had left, went through that this weekend. It was really — it was terribly painful, for lack of a better expression.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,314966,00.html
 

Jug Twitty
DANA PRETZER
December 21, 2007

TWITTY: ... She (Beth) said that the prosecutor lied to them when he told them that there was new evidence.
Transcript - Heli (RU)


Joe Tacopina - Defense Attorney
THE LINEUP
December 2, 2007

There's no new evidence, look we're here in December now, they accept their own deadline for December 31. I've seen the 14 pages, there's no new evidence and there's certainly no new incriminating evidence ...
Transcript - Heli (RU)


Ronald Wix
Associated Press
December 20, 2007

Ronald Wix, an attorney for the Kalpoe brothers, denied that prosecutors had new evidence.

"All they did was recycle old evidence and claim it was new evidence," Wix said ...

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22345541/

[Tamikosmom]

Good Night Monkeys

Janet
9:31 PM

[MumInOhio]

I know there was discussion recently about one of the MB students/friends leaving the island early.  I'm thinking the discussion was about Virginia Page.  But on the American Who's Who it says Virginia was in C & C's with Natalee the night that she disappeared.  Do I have the wrong girl leaving the island early, or is there a mistake on the who's who page?

Thanks in advance!

texasmom...here is the link to the original discussion on this.  I read around some other forums at the time this was posted and all that I can say is that there is conflicting information.

here's the link...

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2539.180

[GBMW]

GBMW

After reading other boards, this morning, I have a little info for you.  As far as the "funds" go, it is my understanding that there were Trust funds set up, two I believe at AmSouth Bank (? now Regions).  Trust funds are not savings accounts.  They are legal entities with rules.  These funds were not managed by the family but by the bank trustee (at the time, I think a Baker Crow).  Families cannot withdraw at whim. Reward funds (one of the trusts) are usually tied to insurance products with rules for dispersement.

All of this came about because all the stalling, disinformation and slandering did not stop Natalee's family.  Misuse of funds became the next angle to attempt to sway public opinion.  Geesh...you would think that Beth has all the money in a dresser drawer and uses it for shopping sprees.  Trust funds are not so easy to abuse.

Now, the question is, what did Joran use his book money for and what plans does Anita have for the funds from the book she is writing?  The people profiting from blood money, is not Natalee's family.

Hi Buckeye,

thanks for the information. I had figured as much...it makes more sense. But couldn't reply to the information that was given to me at the forum because I didn't know anything about it....wanted to check it out.

Is Anita writing a book in defense of Joran? She will have to tell a hell of a story to make that believable....
Anyway...I'm way more looking forward to Patricks book....have more faith that this book will be truthful .

When Joran was interviewed about his book in de 'Panorama' the reporter asked him if he thought it was appropriate to make money out of this case. His reply: "wat een kutvraag"...meaning "what a horrible (it's not literally translated; he said in a rude manner) question". It was the final question in the interview....but probably the reporter asked it when he was finished with his other questions anyway

[snoopy]

Good Morning Everybody.  What a dreary day in St. Louis.

May this be the week that Natalee receives justice.

Rock On!!   

[MumInOhio]

Good Morning Everybody.  What a dreary day in St. Louis.

May this be the week that Natalee receives justice.

Rock On!!   

Good Morning Snoopy and Everyone...A little dreary here, but it's Opening Day and supposed to be close to 60.

It is way too quiet...no news at all!

[sandy leiva]

Good Morning Everybody.  What a dreary day in St. Louis.

May this be the week that Natalee receives justice.

Rock On!!   

  hope so Monkeys, Was reading todays diario and cant copy article but Pullmansurnan cruises are no longer going to aruba. Paper states this additional cruise lines loss of buissness is hurting aruba and its people are starving from lack of jobs and money. The article also chastises the Ahata and tourism boards for falsely claiming in the news that tourism is up when in fact cruise buissness is down 20% or more. I guess boycott news is spreading rapidly and working. Article also stated that hotel buissness is down and in fact the only place where buissness has increased slightly is in timeshares.  Seems those that are going are elderly and those renting out thier timeshares to others .  just an fyi sandy l

[MumInOhio]

Good Morning Everybody.  What a dreary day in St. Louis.

May this be the week that Natalee receives justice.

Rock On!!   

  hope so Monkeys, Was reading todays diario and cant copy article but Pullmansurnan cruises are no longer going to aruba. Paper states this additional cruise lines loss of buissness is hurting aruba and its people are starving from lack of jobs and money. The article also chastises the Ahata and tourism boards for falsely claiming in the news that tourism is up when in fact cruise buissness is down 20% or more. I guess boycott news is spreading rapidly and working. Article also stated that hotel buissness is down and in fact the only place where buissness has increased slightly is in timeshares.  Seems those that are going are elderly and those renting out thier timeshares to others .  just an fyi sandy l

Thanks sandy...for sharing the info.