Natalee Case Discussion #745 3/25 - 4/4/08

[caesu]

Dutch parliament debates MP Wilders' Fitna movie

All parties attack MP Geert Wilders and his movie

Embarrassing

Mr Wilders struggled to defend his motivations for making the film. In a particularly embarrassing moment for the right-wing populist, Justice Minister Ernst Hirsch Ballin produced notes from meetings in October and November, before news of production of the film became public.

During those meetings, Mr Wilders informed the Justice Minister, the national anti-terrorism coordinator and two other cabinet-level officials of his tentative plans for the film, including showing the Muslim holy book, the Quran, being torn up and burnt in a fireplace. The government based its security preparations for possible repercussions of the film on these meetings with Mr Wilders.

During Tuesday's debate, Mr Wilders repeatedly denied that he had informed the government in such detail about his film. Mr Wilders said,

"I'm being taken for a ride here by the Minister of Justice. The cabinet is just trying to clear itself. This is a great and unprecendented shame."

He accused the Justice Minister of lying, and said the Prime Minister only worsened the commotion around the film by talking about a crisis. Mr Wilders submitted a motion of no-confidence in the entire cabinet.

http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/080402-fitna-debate-mc

[casa]

"His mission is to stall the case until he can close it."

Guys, he did close it. He dropped his case against the three, and the Judge then released them as suspects. There is no case anymore. Nothing.

One more time:

Mos went to the Judge and said "I will not prosecute this case"
The Judge then said "If you arent going to prosecute, I will release them as suspects in the matter"
Mos then dropped his case against the three and the Judge then released them from suspision.


Can it be any clearer than that?

Then if the case is closed and they are dropped as suspects does it mean that the family and their lawyers will have access to all the files now?

casa ... this is the reason that I suspect that Aruba will never officially close the Natalee Holloway case.  Aruba will allow the disappearance of an 18 year old American citizen on Aruban soil to become a cold case ... rather than being put in the legal position that would demand that documents/evidence within the case file be handed over to to the FBI/family.

An FBI investigation would expose the Aruban investigation for what it was ... corrupt.  An fBI investigation would expose what Monkeys already know ... justice for Natalee Holloway never stood a chance.

Janet

+++++++++

Jug Twitty
On the Record w/ Greta
July 6, 2005

GEORGE "JUG" TWITTY: Well, the way the system works down here, when the case is closed, we will have all that information, and we can release it to the world.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,161705,00.html


Art Wood
DANA PRETZER
July 2, 2006 - Part 1
July 8, 2006 - Part 2

The family of Natalee needs to put pressure on the US attorney in Birmingham to push the FBI to conduct an investigation after ALE close the case. We have a treaty that allows the FBI to pursue a violation of civil rights of an American citizen there.


Art Wood
'Rita Cosby Live & Direct'
December 2, 2005

ART WOOD, FORMER SECRET SERVICE AGENT: Absolutely. Absolutely. There's a lot that Americans can do through the State Department. I want to remind everybody that Natalee Holloway was a U.S. citizen. Once the Aruban authorities are done investigating this case, the FBI can still conduct an investigation, and they could extradite these suspects to the United States. Let me point out that there's a ton of circumstantial evidence in this case to convict these kids.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10295536/


When the FBI Seeks Extradition
BILATERAL EXTRADITION TREATIES
NETHERLANDS

http://www.internationalextradition.com/netherlands_bi.htm

Thanks for your answer!  Those are my feelings exactly. So apparently they will close the case against the three but not totally close the case so no one can get their hands on the information. In my opinion if they close the case against those three then the FBI and the family should have access to the documents related to them.  Of course, when does Aruba care what anyone thinks?!

[Tamikosmom]

The 15 minute movie produced by MP Geert Wilders reveals the truth about Islam ... about the Koran ... about the global agenda and ... the politically correct democracies of the free world continue to appease those who embrace this ideology.

However ... if Islam undermines all that is sacred to American citizens on their own soil there is silence ... no outcry.  This ideology is given a free pass.

The double standard is incomprehensible.

Janet

++++++++++++

U.S. Based Revolution Muslim Website Spreading Messages of Hate
Wednesday, March 26, 2008

NEW YORK, N.Y. —  On any given day, log on to RevolutionMuslim.com and a host of startling images appear:

— The Statue of Liberty, with an ax blade cutting through her side;

— Video mocking the beheading of American journalist Daniel Pearl, entitled "Daniel Pearl I am Happy Your Dead  ";

— Video of a puppet show lampooning U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq;

— The latest speech from Sheikh Abdullah Faisal, an extremist Muslim cleric convicted in the UK and later deported for soliciting the murder of non-Muslims.

Even more surprising is that RevolutionMuslim.com isn't being maintained in some remote safe house in Pakistan. Instead, Yousef al-Khattab, the Web site creator, runs it from his home in the New York City Borough of Queens.

• Click here to view photos.

• Click here to view video mocking the beheading of American journalist Daniel Pearl.

• Click here to view puppet show lampooning U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq.

And, because al-Khattab enjoys the First Amendment right to freedom of speech, all the authorities can do is watch.

Formerly known as Joseph Cohen, al-Khattab is an American-born Jew who converted to Islam after attending an Orthodox Rabbinical school, which he later described as a “racist cult.”

The 39-year-old New York taxi driver launched RevolutionMuslim.com with the mission of “preserving Islamic culture,” “calling people to the oneness of God” and asking them to “support the beloved Sheik Abdullah Faisal, who’s preaching the religion of Islam and serving as a spiritual guide.”

In 2003 Faisal was convicted in the U.K. for spreading messages of racial hatred and urging his followers to kill Jews, Hindus and Westerners. In sermon recordings played at his trial, Faisal called on young, impressionable Muslims to use chemical weapons to “exterminate unbelievers” and “cut the throat of the Kaffars [nonbelievers] with [a] machete.”

Authorities believe Faisal’s sermons have influenced 2005 London transport bomber Germaine Lindsay and "shoe bomber" Richard Reid, who attended mosques where Faisal preached.

At times, al-Khattab's postings are farcical, such as a picture of him holding the book "Nuclear Jihad" with a wry smile on his face. Other messages call for radical Muslim rule worldwide.

Al-Khattab claims the Sept. 11 terror attacks were an “inside job,” and he blames U.S. foreign policy for spawning the terrorism that carried out the attacks.

He calls Daniel Pearl, who was kidnapped and beheaded in 2002 by Islamic extremists in Pakistan, “a convicted spy.”

“I could care less about Daniel Pearl,” al-Khattab said in an interview with FOXNews.com. “I’m happy to see that he’s gone.”

Click here to view RevolutionMuslim.com.

The content changes constantly. One reason is that the fast flow of information allows messages to spread through cyberspace quickly. Another, terrorism analysts say, is to make it difficult for law enforcement to monitor the site.

Despite his radical anti-Western views, al-Khattab says he does not support terrorism of any kind.

Yet, RevolutionMuslim.com claims to be the official site of “North American representatives” for Sheikh Faisal, and it appears dedicated to spreading his radical doctrine.

He says Faisal “never said to kill innocent people” and was unjustly imprisoned. He says the real terror organizations are the U.S. Army, the CIA, and the FBI — and the National Coast Guard, “to a lesser extent.”

According to RevolutionMuslim, Faisal — who was deported to his native Jamaica in 2007 — is now receiving donations solicited on the site, including money for a new laptop and DVD burner to spread his message.

It's not illegal to post these messages or collect money for Faisal, but it would be if Faisal were designated a terrorist by the U.S. government. He currently is not listed on any government terror list; a Department of Justice spokesman could not confirm or deny if Faisal is being investigated for any terror related activity.

RevolutionMuslim may look amateurish when compared with other extremist Web sites, but it is no less of a threat, says Mia Bloom, political science professor at the University of Georgia’s School of Public and International Affairs.

“It may lead people who become radicalized by it to turn to other, more dangerous Web sites,” such as those run by terrorist organizations, she said.

Bloom characterized al-Khattab’s message as “narrow” and “misinformed” and said he is attempting to “proselytize or radicalize people who share some of these same ideas.”

“[He] has obviously been duped or is duping others because that’s not what Islam preaches,” she said.

On his site al-Khattab appears to condemn the very democracy that guarantees him the freedom to express himself — a freedom he cites in a disclaimer on his homepage:

“We hereby declare and make absolute public declaration that revolutionmuslim.com operates under the first amendment right to freedom of religion and expression and that in no way, shape, or form do we call for war against the U.S. government or adhere to the enemies of the United States elsewhere.”

Under the law FBI spokesman Richard Kolko said it is difficult to bring criminal charges against the operators of Web sites like RevolutionMuslim.com unless specific threats are made against an individual or individuals.

Kolko while not speaking directly about RevolutionMuslim said radical sites like these are not often prosecuted.

"It's usually a First Amendment right if they don't cross the threshold of making any threats," said Kolko. "There's nothing we should or could do."

“Until the rhetoric reaches the point in which it’s no longer protected speech under the first amendment, it’s hard to stop it,” said security expert, Harvey Kushner.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,341811,00.html

[Tamikosmom]

Continued from the above post:

http://www.foxnews.com/photoessay/0,4644,3642,00.html#3_0

RevolutionMuslim's Messages of Hate

[Lala'sMom]

"His mission is to stall the case until he can close it."

Guys, he did close it. He dropped his case against the three, and the Judge then released them as suspects. There is no case anymore. Nothing.

One more time:

Mos went to the Judge and said "I will not prosecute this case"
The Judge then said "If you arent going to prosecute, I will release them as suspects in the matter"
Mos then dropped his case against the three and the Judge then released them from suspision.


Can it be any clearer than that?

Then if the case is closed and they are dropped as suspects does it mean that the family and their lawyers will have access to all the files now?

Hi Casa!!  Still standing on that ball I see...makes me tired just watching you. LOL

[Destiny]

I just called a *friend* at Diario...was told the NH case is NOT CLOSED... that Hans Mos said it is still an active investigation.

And...to their knowledge...Joran is still in *hiding* in Germany.

[Tamikosmom]

I just called a *friend* at Diario...was told the NH case is NOT CLOSED... that Hans Mos said it is still an active investigation.

And...to their knowledge...Joran is still in *hiding* in Germany.

Thanks Destiny.

On February 15, 2008 ... following the revelation of the Devries' video recording ... the official statement from the Prosecutor's Office is that the case is ongoing and ... Joran was once again declared a suspect.

There is no way that Aruba is going to declare that the the Natalee Holloway investigation is officially closed.  To avoid having to turn over the file to the FBI ... the case will be allowed to go cold.  IMO

Janet

+++++++++++


No custody for Van der Sloot
02/15/2008

The OM has no statutory remedies left against the decision. The investigation in the Holloway-case will continue with 25 detectives working on it and Van der Sloot remains the suspect. The OM will decide on further prosecution of Van der Sloot after they are done with the investigation.

http://www.amigoe.com/english/


February 15, 2008
Court of Appeal upholds lower judge’s decision not to detain J.v.d.S.
J.v.d.S remains prime suspect
Judicial investigation continues

On the pre-trial detention issue the Code of criminal procedure does not provide for further appeals. The effect of the Court decision is that J.v.d.S. cannot be (re)arrested. The investigation of the Natalee Holloway case continues. J.v.d.S. is again the prime suspect.
At the end of the investigation the Office of the Public Prosecution will decide whether to charge or not.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2605.msg350819#msg350819

[casa]

"His mission is to stall the case until he can close it."

Guys, he did close it. He dropped his case against the three, and the Judge then released them as suspects. There is no case anymore. Nothing.

One more time:

Mos went to the Judge and said "I will not prosecute this case"
The Judge then said "If you arent going to prosecute, I will release them as suspects in the matter"
Mos then dropped his case against the three and the Judge then released them from suspision.


Can it be any clearer than that?

Then if the case is closed and they are dropped as suspects does it mean that the family and their lawyers will have access to all the files now?

Hi Casa!!  Still standing on that ball I see...makes me tired just watching you. LOL

Hi Lalas! Yes, I have really missed my ball since last year! haha

[MumInOhio]

I just called a *friend* at Diario...was told the NH case is NOT CLOSED... that Hans Mos said it is still an active investigation.

And...to their knowledge...Joran is still in *hiding* in Germany.

Hi...Destiny...I was just thinking of you...everytime I see a phone number from Aruba!

Thought you were on vacation for some reason...

[Destiny]

You are very much welcome Tomikosmom...

I did ask if Joran had been released as a *suspect* in the case...and, was told NO he has not.

[jackb]

Dutch parliament debates MP Wilders' Fitna movie

All parties attack MP Geert Wilders and his movie

Embarrassing

Mr Wilders struggled to defend his motivations for making the film. In a particularly embarrassing moment for the right-wing populist, Justice Minister Ernst Hirsch Ballin produced notes from meetings in October and November, before news of production of the film became public.

During those meetings, Mr Wilders informed the Justice Minister, the national anti-terrorism coordinator and two other cabinet-level officials of his tentative plans for the film, including showing the Muslim holy book, the Quran, being torn up and burnt in a fireplace. The government based its security preparations for possible repercussions of the film on these meetings with Mr Wilders.

During Tuesday's debate, Mr Wilders repeatedly denied that he had informed the government in such detail about his film. Mr Wilders said,

"I'm being taken for a ride here by the Minister of Justice. The cabinet is just trying to clear itself. This is a great and unprecendented shame."

He accused the Justice Minister of lying, and said the Prime Minister only worsened the commotion around the film by talking about a crisis. Mr Wilders submitted a motion of no-confidence in the entire cabinet.

http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/netherlands/080402-fitna-debate-mc

Well, maybe they can get them for attempting to incite a riot.  A riot by non-muslims.  They don't even want to get the American public much madder than they have.  All bets are off.  They can take their rag-azzed heads back to the sand dunes and incite a riot there.  We are fed up.  I am not just speaking for me, but every person I have spoken with.  Somebody better cue that bunch in.  This is our coutry.   Jackb

[Destiny]

I just called a *friend* at Diario...was told the NH case is NOT CLOSED... that Hans Mos said it is still an active investigation.

And...to their knowledge...Joran is still in *hiding* in Germany.

Hi...Destiny...I was just thinking of you...everytime I see a phone number from Aruba!

Thought you were on vacation for some reason...

Hi Mum!

I own a seasonal business...this past weekend was the opening for 2008...have been very, very, busy, training new staff...getting the place all ready for a couple of thousand ppl to decend upon us like they always do...taking a breather right now...catching up with the Monkeys...and *missing* being here more...I miss you all so much!

[Destiny]

CBB.....Thank You for the new AVI.....Girl, YOU ROCK!!!

I wubs the AVI...and You too

[Tamikosmom]

You are very much welcome Tomikosmom...

I did ask if Joran had been released as a *suspect* in the case...and, was told NO he has not.

The official statement from the Prosecutor's Office implies different on February 15, 2005 ... following the revelation of the Devries' video recording ... implies that Joran is once again a suspect.

 

Janet

+++++++++++++

February 15, 2008
Court of Appeal upholds lower judge’s decision not to detain J.v.d.S.
J.v.d.S remains prime suspect
Judicial investigation continues

On the pre-trial detention issue the Code of criminal procedure does not provide for further appeals. The effect of the Court decision is that J.v.d.S. cannot be (re)arrested. The investigation of the Natalee Holloway case continues. J.v.d.S. is again the prime suspect.
At the end of the investigation the Office of the Public Prosecution will decide whether to charge or not.

[Destiny]

You are very much welcome Tomikosmom...

I did ask if Joran had been released as a *suspect* in the case...and, was told NO he has not.

The official statement from the Prosecutor's Office implies different on February 15, 2005 ... following the revelation of the Devries' video recording ... implies that Joran is once again a suspect.

 

Janet

+++++++++++++

February 15, 2008
Court of Appeal upholds lower judge’s decision not to detain J.v.d.S.
J.v.d.S remains prime suspect
Judicial investigation continues

On the pre-trial detention issue the Code of criminal procedure does not provide for further appeals. The effect of the Court decision is that J.v.d.S. cannot be (re)arrested. The investigation of the Natalee Holloway case continues. J.v.d.S. is again the prime suspect.
At the end of the investigation the Office of the Public Prosecution will decide whether to charge or not.

Yeppers....You are 100% RIGHT Tomikosmom....that is exactly what I was told just today on my phone call....*Joran is still a SUSPECT* in the NH case...under *active investigation* by Hans Mos...and Joran is *in hiding*...

[Destiny]

What does *in hiding* mean to the rest of you?   Those were the words said to me....also was told that Holland doesn't even know where the *secret place* he is being kept...yes, those words were used too...*secret place*...well...to me, it sounds like his family knows that he can be arrested...and are doing everything they can to keep that from happening....

Would like to hear your thoughts on this...I think this is part of the reason everything is so quiet right now...but this is JMOHO...

[Tamikosmom]

Destiny ... I apologize.  I did not read your post correctly and ... understood that your friend stated Joran WAS NOT a suspect.

A walk with my neighbour and our dogs is where it is at in about an hour.  Considering the coffee failed to clear the cobwebs ... maybe the fresh air will.

 

I hope you are having a good day.

Janet

[Tamikosmom]

What does *in hiding* mean to the rest of you?   Those were the words said to me....also was told that Holland doesn't even know where the *secret place* he is being kept...yes, those words were used too...*secret place*...well...to me, it sounds like his family knows that he can be arrested...and are doing everything they can to keep that from happening....

Would like to hear your thoughts on this...I think this is part of the reason everything is so quiet right now...but this is JMOHO...

Joran heard through the grapevine that Tamikosmom may be taking a trip to the Netherlands with her Dutch American daughter-in-law and mother at the beginning of July.

 

Janet

[Destiny]

What does *in hiding* mean to the rest of you?   Those were the words said to me....also was told that Holland doesn't even know where the *secret place* he is being kept...yes, those words were used too...*secret place*...well...to me, it sounds like his family knows that he can be arrested...and are doing everything they can to keep that from happening....

Would like to hear your thoughts on this...I think this is part of the reason everything is so quiet right now...but this is JMOHO...

Joran heard through the grapevine that Tamikosmom may be taking a trip to the Netherlands with her Dutch American daughter-in-law and mother at the beginning of July.

 

Janet

OMG...You crack me up...ROFLMAO!!!!!

[Destiny]

Destiny ... I apologize.  I did not read your post correctly and ... understood that your friend stated Joran WAS NOT a suspect.

A walk with my neighbour and our dogs is where it is at in about an hour.  Considering the coffee failed to clear the cobwebs ... maybe the fresh air will.

 

I hope you are having a good day.

Janet

Janet...just being here in the cage...makes it a far better day for me!