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Author Topic: SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #3  (Read 606132 times)
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Observer
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« Reply #1080 on: April 26, 2008, 09:51:09 PM »

Steve Ceos has a new MySpace site.  He goes by Steve Gregg.

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=20567795

Steve Croes claimed not to know Joran and the pimps, but there are some common people on Steve's site and the site of Max Arends.  The girl is GW and the boy is Ian Molina.  They communicate with Steve and Max regularly.


Im steve croes bitches and im back on the road
Interesting that he is in so many pics with cheremy croes,is that his little brother?

« Last Edit: April 26, 2008, 10:03:41 PM by Observer » Logged

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« Reply #1081 on: April 26, 2008, 10:06:58 PM »

I also no longer have any of my links because of a computer crash and a new computer.

Does anyone remember the supposed runaway letter that was sent to PVDS. ?
Who was the supposed authors first name?
I believe it was david
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finngirl
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« Reply #1082 on: April 27, 2008, 02:56:08 AM »


haven't posted much lately

had major gomboo which affected my brain
and AFAIK my provider has the gomboo as well ...
as my access has been hit/miss

this thread reflects a lot of good thinking/research ...
not downplaying that at all ...
but I'm really lost/confused sometimes

seems like it goes in a gazillion directions
but I don't see many wrap-ups/tie-ins

then again, could be my gomboo'd brain, LOL ...
I'll keep reading even tho I may not have much to offer

someone asked about the Peeps posts ...
they're in the "things we forgot we knew" thread,
which is only 2 pages ... and IIRC Peeps is on page 1

I'm lost re Freddy not being on our radar until august 2005 ... ???
... as many threadsurfers were interested in him/Jaime by mid-june

there are some FP posts in the "forgot we knew" thread
mentioning early MSM reports that bodily fluids were found in a car trunk,
not in the passenger seating area

which is heartbreaking ...
in light of Jug saying that, if he could do it over again,
he would've looked in the trunk of Deepak's car that first night

reminds me of the Polly Klaas murder in NoCal:
Richard Davis had kidnapped her/had her in his car,
attempted a turn-around on a road in the boonies/got the car stuck

he led Polly not very far way/sat her near a tree
while he worked at getting the vehicle unstuck,
warning her to remain quiet/threatening her family

LE happened by, chatted w/ Davis re his situation/drove off

Polly never said a word, as she was a frightened/obedient child ...
even tho she was thatclose to rescue/resolution

not saying that Natalee was inside the trunk that night ...
but who's to say what evidence a peek might have revealed?


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MumInOhio
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« Reply #1083 on: April 27, 2008, 08:25:03 AM »

I also no longer have any of my links because of a computer crash and a new computer.

Does anyone remember the supposed runaway letter that was sent to PVDS. ?
Who was the supposed authors first name?
I believe it was david


Posted by Tamikosmom..

+++++++++++

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=212.msg33814;topicseen#msg33814

August 1, 2005

To whom it may concern,

The problems for the people of Aruba has gone on long enough.

Natalee is alive, well and safe from Jug. We are staying with my family where Mrs. Holloway cannot find her and she is protected from Jug's sexual advances.

First Natalee and I would like to apologize to the people of Aruba for the troubles that they have endured, we did not believe that Mrs. Holloway and her husband would carry things this far just to get attention for themselves.

We sent a letter to Mrs. Holloway before leaving to explain what we were doing and why.

We believe that she must have received the letter shortly before Natalee was reported as missing since she made such a quick trip to Aruba and started looking for some one to blame right away, to take the responsibility away from Jug.

We are certain that you will understand why Natalee had to do this when Mrs. Holloway and Jug finally admit to truth and allow it to come out to the public.

We are requesting that the reward for Natalee's safe return be given to the people of Aruba when Natalee comes back. But several things will need to take place and change before that happens.

We had this planned for several weeks, but did not believe it would work this well.

It most likely would not have if the boys had not mistakenly claimed that they had picked Natalee up in the morning of her disappearance and Mrs. Holloway had not jumped on too that and held on like a bulldog, sending the police and other search teams off in the wrong direction.

Natalee got into a car with me and the two persons that aided us in getting off Aruba after leaving Carlos and Charlie's. We apparently succeeded in not being seen together before we left, although we were seeing each other almost every day to complete our plans and make final preparations.

Natalee did not want to spoil the trip for the rest of her classmates by leaving any sooner although we were ready earlier.

You can try to locate us if you want. But we are sending these letters through five different friends in different areas in sealed, preaddressed and prepaid packages with instructions for each to send the next package of envelopes to the next person, so only the first person will know where the original was mailed from and no one will know if he/she was the first. The final person will then send the individual letters to Aruba, Holland and the United States.

Since three persons have suffered the most at the hands of Mrs. Holloway and her husband we want to reward the information of Natalee's location to go to these persons.

Joran and the two other boys made a mistake by saying that Natalee was the person that they were with. At the time that they were describing as being with Natalee we were completely off Aruba and on our way home, although their mistaken identity and Mrs. Holoway and her husband's persecution of innocent boys definitely helped as we were held up for eighteen days trying to get out of the country we went to, we were afraid that we would be found at any time.

Except for Mrs. Holloway's persistence to cover the fact that Natalee had left on her own that led the police in the wrong direction the police would have been able to find when, where and how we left Aruba and we would have most likely been located before we got back into the United States, and then to our present location.

We were very glad to see that two of the boys were released and hope that the third boy will be released soon.

If any of the reports of statements alleged to have been made by Joran are true Aruba has a problem with Joran but it does not involve Natalee.

If you will pay attention to Natalee's friends and classmates you might get the message that Joran and the two other boys are not involved in Natalee's disappearance. In every interview that they have taken part in they have all said that they have not seen Natalee and Joran together, only that Natalee left in a car with three persons.

Please advise if these conditions are acceptable to Mrs. Holloway and her husband.

When Natalee is ready to let you know where she is we will send another letter, although is will most likely be after she delivers what she believes to be Jug's baby by rape.

The baby is due in mid December. Natalee is doing well and has a good doctor.

To assure authenticity you will find Natalee's finger prints and a sample of her DNA on some if not all of the twenty letters we sent. We know for certain that the letters to the police labs in the United States and Holland contain these items.

David & Natalee
 
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2523.msg329313#msg329313

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« Reply #1084 on: April 27, 2008, 08:29:26 AM »


haven't posted much lately

had major gomboo which affected my brain
and AFAIK my provider has the gomboo as well ...
as my access has been hit/miss

this thread reflects a lot of good thinking/research ...
not downplaying that at all ...
but I'm really lost/confused sometimes

seems like it goes in a gazillion directions
but I don't see many wrap-ups/tie-ins

then again, could be my gomboo'd brain, LOL ...
I'll keep reading even tho I may not have much to offer

someone asked about the Peeps posts ...
they're in the "things we forgot we knew" thread,
which is only 2 pages ... and IIRC Peeps is on page 1

I'm lost re Freddy not being on our radar until august 2005 ... ???
... as many threadsurfers were interested in him/Jaime by mid-june

there are some FP posts in the "forgot we knew" thread
mentioning early MSM reports that bodily fluids were found in a car trunk,
not in the passenger seating area

which is heartbreaking ...
in light of Jug saying that, if he could do it over again,
he would've looked in the trunk of Deepak's car that first night

reminds me of the Polly Klaas murder in NoCal:
Richard Davis had kidnapped her/had her in his car,
attempted a turn-around on a road in the boonies/got the car stuck

he led Polly not very far way/sat her near a tree
while he worked at getting the vehicle unstuck,
warning her to remain quiet/threatening her family

LE happened by, chatted w/ Davis re his situation/drove off

Polly never said a word, as she was a frightened/obedient child ...
even tho she was thatclose to rescue/resolution

not saying that Natalee was inside the trunk that night ...
but who's to say what evidence a peek might have revealed?




Hi Finn...vms set me straight on Freddy...that great memory doesn't have anything on Jossy's cousin working in Customs, does it? TIA
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« Reply #1085 on: April 27, 2008, 09:21:10 AM »

Good morning, all.

finngirl,

Glad to see you back.
I agree about the thread going in a gazillion directions. Things get buried, forgotten, and never carried to completion.

Sorry, I did not realize you had the Peeps posts in the We Forgot We Knew thread. Embarassed
Hopefully Klaas will read and delete mine. 
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« Reply #1086 on: April 27, 2008, 09:34:38 AM »

This was all I can find on the  blood in the trunk.

ABC News:
BLOOD WAS FOUND IN THE TRUNK OF THE CAR.

Diario Newspaper
human blood sample found in a car at the residence of one of the teens in custody

Prime Minster Oduber
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Absolutely. That`s what I would love to know. On June 11, he states on international media in front of me -- I had no idea what he was about to disclose -- that there was blood in the Kalpoes` vehicle, there was DNA, there was blood. Where is that? Even (INAUDIBLE) went so far to cut interior portions from the car -- the back seat, the ceiling. You know, what happened with that?

FBI and Several Aruban Police officers
FBI: Told the Family there was Blood was all over the Kalpoe car.
Art Wood, a retired Secret Service agent helping the Holloway family investigate the case, said: "That blood was sent to Holland and it came back as being cleaning fluid and chocolate. That's what the test results show. But an Aruban police officer who worked on the investigation told me there was definitely blood in that car. I think the wrong sample was deliberately sent to Holland.


http://tinyurl.com/6yah77
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« Reply #1087 on: April 27, 2008, 10:40:35 AM »

This was all I can find on the  blood in the trunk.

ABC News:
BLOOD WAS FOUND IN THE TRUNK OF THE CAR.

Diario Newspaper
human blood sample found in a car at the residence of one of the teens in custody

Prime Minster Oduber
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Absolutely. That`s what I would love to know. On June 11, he states on international media in front of me -- I had no idea what he was about to disclose -- that there was blood in the Kalpoes` vehicle, there was DNA, there was blood. Where is that? Even (INAUDIBLE) went so far to cut interior portions from the car -- the back seat, the ceiling. You know, what happened with that?

FBI and Several Aruban Police officers
FBI: Told the Family there was Blood was all over the Kalpoe car.
Art Wood, a retired Secret Service agent helping the Holloway family investigate the case, said: "That blood was sent to Holland and it came back as being cleaning fluid and chocolate. That's what the test results show. But an Aruban police officer who worked on the investigation told me there was definitely blood in that car. I think the wrong sample was deliberately sent to Holland.


http://tinyurl.com/6yah77


Hi Blonde, hey good point, but why would the Kalpoes be driving around with visible blood in their car for 10 days? We know from the neighbor of the Kalpoes that they cleaned the car at 3 - 3:30 am on the night in question, and it seems it was three people cleaning the car. So, my question or thought is this - we now know that Beth gave the blood sample on 6-10-2005 wouldn't it have been possible that the blood was planted after the car was confiscated by the ALE? Couldn't that be Beth's blood? They already had her sample. We need to look at the times and see if there was a possibility that Papito planted the blood.

I seriously doubt that there was visible blood, the Kalpoes would have cleaned that. There is no way they are driving around Aruba for 10 days with that much blood in the car. The following day, they went to the van der Sloots and had the pool side chat. That would have had to have seen anything they missed that morning when day broke.

Oduber is on the record on 6-11-2005 stating there was blood. A day earlier they had Beth's sample. I wonder if this was going to be the next frame job and then Joran admitted he was last seem with Natalee by his own admission... that would have shot framing the Kalpoes alone down the toilet.
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« Reply #1088 on: April 27, 2008, 01:36:25 PM »




Magna…the Racquet Club is his second home!

http://www.xs4all.nl/~dugo/dy.html


Name: Magda Hilaria Frans
Date: 21 June 2005 / 11:20
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Giovanni Heyliger
Description: witness statement by a Racquet Club employee
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« Reply #1089 on: April 27, 2008, 05:29:51 PM »




Magna…the Racquet Club is his second home!

http://www.xs4all.nl/~dugo/dy.html


Name: Magda Hilaria Frans
Date: 21 June 2005 / 11:20
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Giovanni Heyliger
Description: witness statement by a Racquet Club employee


Mum,
I remember reading this. 
Another thing Magda brings up is the idea of village, where everyone knows everyone.  And the American girls who arrive weekly, and the boys waiting for them.  Seems to be saying easy pickins!!!  IMO.  And this was early on.  Thanks for posting it.

CHATA
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« Reply #1090 on: April 27, 2008, 06:33:34 PM »

A few updates for the photo album.

Satish, Michael Anthony (Dompig who calims to be married, but there's no evidence of a wife), Kawish, Deepak, Michael and possibly his wife, Michael and Satish, Kawish and Michael.
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« Reply #1091 on: April 27, 2008, 08:04:07 PM »

******* and Mom in Ohio , thanks for your response.

David was the name I was thinking of as well on the letter but I also keep thinking of Shango's line "Only David left the den alive."

Was David set  up to be a scapegoat?  Or was he somehow involved? Since Joran mentions a David in his book it just makes me wonder. JMHO
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« Reply #1092 on: April 27, 2008, 11:07:13 PM »

******* and Mom in Ohio , thanks for your response.

David was the name I was thinking of as well on the letter but I also keep thinking of Shango's line "Only David left the den alive."

Was David set  up to be a scapegoat?  Or was he somehow involved? Since Joran mentions a David in his book it just makes me wonder. JMHO

Sam,

I had similar thoughts earlier, but didn't know how to connect them, besides what you have mentioned....Shango mentioned David on 6/28/05 and the letter was dated later...I think 8/1, iirc......
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« Reply #1093 on: April 28, 2008, 02:03:30 AM »

Hi Monkeys,

I need help this man, any photos. **** Important ******

Lawyer Langerak, Paul D inAruba. All Info special picture.

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« Reply #1094 on: April 28, 2008, 02:40:27 AM »

This was all I can find on the  blood in the trunk.

ABC News:
BLOOD WAS FOUND IN THE TRUNK OF THE CAR.

Diario Newspaper
human blood sample found in a car at the residence of one of the teens in custody

Prime Minster Oduber
BETH HOLLOWAY TWITTY: Absolutely. That`s what I would love to know. On June 11, he states on international media in front of me -- I had no idea what he was about to disclose -- that there was blood in the Kalpoes` vehicle, there was DNA, there was blood. Where is that? Even (INAUDIBLE) went so far to cut interior portions from the car -- the back seat, the ceiling. You know, what happened with that?

FBI and Several Aruban Police officers
FBI: Told the Family there was Blood was all over the Kalpoe car.
Art Wood, a retired Secret Service agent helping the Holloway family investigate the case, said: "That blood was sent to Holland and it came back as being cleaning fluid and chocolate. That's what the test results show. But an Aruban police officer who worked on the investigation told me there was definitely blood in that car. I think the wrong sample was deliberately sent to Holland.

http://tinyurl.com/6yah77


Hi Blonde, hey good point, but why would the Kalpoes be driving around with visible blood in their car for 10 days?

I seriously doubt that there was visible blood, the Kalpoes would have cleaned that. There is no way they are driving around Aruba for 10 days with that much blood in the car.

Oduber is on the record on 6-11-2005 stating there was blood. A day earlier they had Beth's sample. I wonder if this was going to be the next frame job and then Joran admitted he was last seem with Natalee by his own admission... that would have shot framing the Kalpoes alone down the toilet.

I can't assume that it was blood/that it was visible,
but I know the following was being reported
right after the weekend of confession/no confession

(including references to verbal rather than website MSM reports)

serenity2000 on June 12th, 2005 4:38 pm
Per Karl Penhaul of CNN: The sample of “blood” that was sent to VA is NOT BLOOD. No word on what it is though. This was just broadcasted on CNN…..they may retract it soon but anyway that’s the latest.

serenity2000 on June 12th, 2005 4:41 pm
Kat, CNN just announced that it is NOT blood that was found in the car but that there is no word on what it is.

KerinTX on June 12th, 2005 4:45 pm
That would be strange since there are initial tests you do to confirm “blood” evidence prior to sending it off for testing.

Catriana on June 12th, 2005 4:56 pm
Fox news is now reporting that blood taken from the car was not blood, that it could have been saliva, but that it was NOT blood.

Whodeenie on June 12th, 2005 4:57 pm
FOX, News Alert. Substance found in car, not blood.

MissyRose on June 12th, 2005 4:57 pm
It is definitley not blood. Could be saliva but it is not an issue because the boys admitted she was in the car. FOXNEWS

DT on June 12th, 2005 4:58 pm
HOW do you confuse blood and saliva. Also if it was saliva found was it still in the trunk or was that wrong as well.

Kat on June 12th, 2005 4:58 pm
Jesus, this whole thing is a freak show…

Tila_Bean on June 12th, 2005 5:01 pm
I agree Kat, it is a freak show. To confuse blood from saliva is, I don’t even have the words. Mind you a whole day has passed.

Aruban Authorities Investigate Blood in Car
Sunday, June 12, 2005
ORANJESTAD, Aruba - Authorities investigating the disappearance of Alabama honors student Natalee Holloway were seeking clues on the source of blood found in the car used to transport the missing teen to the beach nearly two weeks ago, Aruban Justice Minister Rudy Croes said.

owen2u on June 12th, 2005 5:14 pm
It was intersting to me that your prime minister practically guaranteed it would be solved in 24 hours on Geraldo last night..made me wonder if they’d found her and were moving her back onto the Island..thats why I have started thinkin this way recently

DT on June 12th, 2005 5:16 pm
Any word yet if the substance was found in trunk like previous reports stated?

KerinTX on June 12th, 2005 5:51 pm
Scared…I have one TV on Fox news and one on CNN and another laptop on Fox News online and I don’t see a thing about the blood not being blood.

ScaredBlackGuy on June 12th, 2005 5:52 pm
My findings too KerinTX.

serenity2000 on June 12th, 2005 6:00 pm
# DT Says:
June 12th, 2005 at 5:51 pm
Why does it have to be on the website? Myself, and several others have seen it reported on Fox NEws Channel clearly and plainly.

**LOL** I’ve already heard it twice on CNN myself. People may just have to tune into CNN or Fox and hear it with their own ears (I can be that way myself sometimes).

KerinTX on June 12th, 2005 6:01 pm
Scared…Ok FOX News just said it is not blood in the car.

Dallas Also on June 12th, 2005 6:02 pm
Fox and CNN have apparently made the decision that breaking news will be delivered only verbally, not posted on their websites.

Kipster on June 12th, 2005 6:06 pm
Good catch Dallas. CNN & FOX don’t want anymore f-ups in Google’s cache. “Confession Made”, “Body Found…idiots.

arubagirl on June 12th, 2005 6:57 pm
Wow, Top 95 was doing so well, and now they’ve gone to the deep end…

Kipster on June 12th, 2005 7:07 pm
What are Top95 saying? Hearing a lot of “Natalee”.

arubagirl on June 12th, 2005 7:08 pm
Talking about the blood, whose it is, who said what, etc.

DT on June 12th, 2005 7:10 pm
Has there been any news since the whole “blood isn’t really blood” thing?

mustiquemama on June 12th, 2005 7:11 pm
arubagirl, I’d love to be updated on the “facts” of the blood. Was it blood or other fluid, which car, whose car, seat or trunk, etc. Some of the things published and reported today seem to be fabrications rather than facts.

--- on June 12th, 2005 7:12 pm
wait, what is going on with the “blood” ordeal?

DT on June 12th, 2005 7:13 pm
Fox is reporting that it was not blood found, but something else, for those asking.

arubagirl on June 12th, 2005 7:13 pm
mustique, nothing official yet. The radio station says that according to them, it wasn’t her blood. But nothing from cops/FBI/prosecutor.

--- on June 12th, 2005 7:13 pm
What was it then?

MissyRose on June 12th, 2005 7:14 pm
It wasn’t blood, possibly saliva. But because the boys say she was in the car, it gives no lead.

mustiquemama on June 12th, 2005 7:19 pm
Arubagirl, did Top95 say anything about the substance not being blood? Has anyone besides Fox said it was not blood? Has anyone besides Fox said it was found in the trunk and not the seat as we first heard? And always, thank you.

Rick on June 12th, 2005 7:30 pm
The PM yesterday on Geraldo *promised* there’d be some conclusion to this case by today. He’s set to give a speech in a few minutes. If he rambles on about how he and his island are doing all they can, but there’s nothing to report - I expect you will see a shitstorm of criticism heaped upon him and his law enforcement people.

Let’s see what happens.. Apart from that and today’s excavation at the lighthouse which revealed nothing - I dont think there’s anything to report. The fact that they did do an excavation tells me they have no idea where the body may be, despite having the 3 kids in custody and subjecting them to interrogation..

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2768.20

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All Prayers Will Be Answered in Time!


« Reply #1095 on: April 28, 2008, 03:02:22 AM »

Hi Monkeys,

I need help this man, any photos. **** Important ******

Lawyer Langerak, Paul D inAruba. All Info special picture.


Hey Caps...Here's an article tht mentions Him at this link...
http://solodipueblo.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_view&gid=101
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Prayers Will Bring Natalee Home!
May 2010 Bring Natalee Home to Rest In Peace!
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« Reply #1096 on: April 28, 2008, 03:09:57 AM »

Hi Monkeys,

I need help this man, any photos. **** Important ******

Lawyer Langerak, Paul D inAruba. All Info special picture.


Hey Caps...Here's an article tht mentions Him at this link...
http://solodipueblo.com/index.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_view&gid=101


we need to compare his picture to statish


I
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« Reply #1097 on: April 28, 2008, 04:53:39 AM »




Magna…the Racquet Club is his second home!

http://www.xs4all.nl/~dugo/dy.html


Name: Magda Hilaria Frans
Date: 21 June 2005 / 11:20
Pages: 2
Writer/Initiator: Giovanni Heyliger
Description: witness statement by a Racquet Club employee


Mum,
I remember reading this. 
Another thing Magda brings up is the idea of village, where everyone knows everyone.  And the American girls who arrive weekly, and the boys waiting for them.  Seems to be saying easy pickins!!!  IMO.  And this was early on.  Thanks for posting it.

CHATA


Hi Chata...I didn't post any quotes from the link as I found it really hard to work out just what Magna was saying and what Melody was saying! I need to go back and read it again, but it seemed to me yesterday that Magna and Melody knew each other!

IIRC Melody lived near the hotels somewhere and Joran knew a quick way to his house. Would the Racquet Club be considered near the hotels?
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« Reply #1098 on: April 28, 2008, 05:53:03 AM »

******* and Mom in Ohio , thanks for your response.

David was the name I was thinking of as well on the letter but I also keep thinking of Shango's line "Only David left the den alive."

Was David set  up to be a scapegoat?  Or was he somehow involved? Since Joran mentions a David in his book it just makes me wonder. JMHO

Sam,

I had similar thoughts earlier, but didn't know how to connect them, besides what you have mentioned....Shango mentioned David on 6/28/05 and the letter was dated later...I think 8/1, iirc......



Hi Sam and 2NJSons…

Only David left the den alive is why David Fisiitalia caught my attention. Also tried checking on David Wever, who may be Guido's older brother.

In this chapter from Joran's book, Joran only mentions Sander one more time, and then it is all about Koen and David. There isn’t any more about Freddy or Jaime either in this little story! No mention of David being there initially, but then he is all over the place!

IIRC, Sander was seen in a lot of pics with Karen, we have one if I recall correctly. Maybe ‘David’ is a Marco thing and ‘David’ is really Sander Gottenbos!

Just another ‘out of the box’ thought….did they rent a hotel room on Memorial Day weekend as well? With so many American kids at ISA, did they even have school that Monday? ISA is partially funded by the US State Department…just thinking out loud…


CHAPTER 5 – GIRLFRIENDS

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1117.0

page 2:

- Joran met Melody together with her friend Abi in a hotel during Easter break.Koen, Sander, Jaime, Freddy and myself had rented a room there. A lot of locals do this during this vacation. Then you can party without interruption from your parents. Play a lot of loud music, booze up, chill and go out and relax. Nobody would bother looking at how late you got in.

page 6:

- Soon after splitting with Melody I got a new girlfriend and dumped Karen proper, she then went on to be David's girlfriend
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MumInOhio
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« Reply #1099 on: April 28, 2008, 05:56:29 AM »

SS...Good Morning!...Were the links for those pictures the ones posted on NAH yesterday? I haven't opened them all yet, so thought you could steer me to where the group pic of Michael came from. TIA
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