Natalee Case Discussion #748 4/17 - 4/24/08

[LilPuma]

Forgive my manners.  Good morning Monkeys! 




One of the reasons I popped in this morning is to post this story, or a link to it.  I just posted it over in Becca McEvoy's thread.  It's a story about Three Trees that reminds us that God does things his way, not our way, and sometimes His way is better.     I know some of you will understand and appreciate this, for Natalee, for yourselves and so many others.  I need to remind myself of it often and this story always helps. 

http://pushih.com/threetrees.html

LilPuma ... thank you.

I speculate (I wish I could comprehend the ways of God) that Joran will ultimately be the used by God to reveal the truth regarding the events encompassing the morning when Natalee Holloway went missing and ... the coverup which followed.  Joran was the  participant who knows all ...

I believe that the truth will not be revealed while Joran is drugged ... through deception or ... through force.  The truth will be revealed through "genuine" repentence ... "genuine" desire to turn it life around by make right the wrongs.

Think about the video recording.  It is so obvious Joran is spinning out of control.  I believe the breaking point is not far off.

Janet

I agree the breaking point isn't far off, but I don't see spirituality as something Joran would turn to.  It's not something he's been exposed to in any area of his life.  I do think this guy is playing with fire.  Drugs, drug dealers, money laundering, big time criminals, not his little group of pimps.  I think he's going to get burned as he tries to play his small time pimp games with the big boys.  He's either going to rip off the wrong person, say too much about the wrong person, or lie to the wrong person.  He'll either end up on a slab or in protective custody in The Hague spilling his guts. 

[GBMW]

Here are the chats we got on camera (the interview doesn't give extra info except the fact it seems Joran has another debt in a casino (Hong Kong)...)….the translations are loose because Joran uses slang a bit so I’ve interpreted the meaning sometimes because otherwise, with a literal translation, it wouldn’t make sense.

??? mean I couldn’t read it so words / sentences are missing

Joran:
Hey man how’s it going?
I will pay you back, next month, I promise



Another:
Yeah look, what I’ve done is not ok but I had no other choice and by putting it online you’ve put me in danger.
Are you on several blogs? Because I’ve heard it from several people. So you don’t keep things between us a secret. And I believed you.

Martin:

I’m really sorry & I won’t do it again. Whatever happens. You told me I was your only FRIEND and I would like to keep it that way. I want to stay your friend….that we can fix things between us…you and me.

Nooo man, I only posted a message on your Hyves..certainly not on the internet / blogs or whatever. I’ve never talked to anyone about anything. I have no….???

Joran:

I hope so man
I would like to stay friends, really, but I do have stories my friend
They were in my room with guns and everything
I felt awful
Now everybody is finally gone…I’m 100% safe now
And I’ve got my passport back

Martin:
I hope Joran, that we can stay friends….I never judged you or asked you questions about Natalee…???? I hope our problems can be solved and we can start over just like in the beginning. The whole world is angry with you and I won’t partipate in that…You know that buddy!

Joran:

Yes I know, and I believed you….I can understand you were angry with me but you’ve said some nasty things about me.

Martin:

I know and I’m really sorry. I wasn’t myself and I’m really sorry. Can you forgive me? I’m really sorry.

Joran:
Of course I can forgive you.
Can you forgive me?


Chatsession 20-04-2008

Joran:
Hey dude

Martin:
Hello

Joran:
How’s it going?

Martin:
Well, not that good, swa

Joran:
Tell me, what’s wrong

Yeah, sorry man, but had no choice…had to pay those people off otherwise I was screwed…I will pay you back as soon as I’ve got the money

Martin:
I feel used. I thought I had a good friend who I could trust for a 100%.

Really Joran? You will pay back everything? A promise made from one friend to another?

Joran:
Yes, I still look at you as a friend.

There was a gun pointed at me so I didn’t think ???

I would still like to meet you if that’s possible.
But I will understand if you don’t want to.

Good Morning GBMW

Would you please provide the source (link) pertaining to this dialogue.  Where was it exposed?

GBMW ... considering the the dialogue implies that Mart and Joran have never met ... do you think it is possible that Joran never left the Netherlands ... he was in the institution all along?  Could he have been scamming a lonely man into thinking ther could be a relationship ... friendship?

Janet

Hiya! This dialogue wasn't exposed in the press...I've got it from the raw footage we have of the interview with Mart. Mart has kept a lot of chatsessions in a map and he showed a couple....I typed them out.
Mart said they had never met indeed; it was chatting, e-mail and phonecontact. So it could be that Joran hasn't been in Thailand. But because of our sources & Peter R. de Vries / Kees van der Spek claiming this....I am inclined to believe he might have been there...don't know when or for how long but it does look like it. If it were only Mart saying it...yeah then it would say: probably Joran decieved him...but I'm having doubts myself because it isn't only Mart....

Mart did press charges (on april the 12th) so if Joran got the money in Thailand....he must have gotten money out of his account somewhere there; could be easily checked according to me. Mart has even gotten himself a lawyer BTW.

Ah well...Thailand / Den Dolder...doesn't matter really...the bottom line: Joran has shown what a piece of shit he is once again.

I didn't have time for the old Peter R. de Vries show today...sorry! But it would be in Dutch...would you prefer it if I translated the voice over  - quotes from that judge / warrant thing? Let me know!

[LilPuma]

Hi everyone --

O/T --

Fox News report -- Carnival Cruise line looking for 44-year-old man on Cozumel cruise; wife reported him missing

I don't think I'll EVER go on a cruise ...

I used to think that cruises were safer than resort areas, since it's a "closed' environment, like an all-inclusive.  But after hearing about Amy Bradley, George Smith and a huge drug bust on the same ship that George disappeared from, I've changed my opinion. 

[caesu]

I just heard our reporters have paid a visit in Den Dolder....Joran was there (at least) until 2 weeks ago. This is not an official quote of course

So it seems Joran has stolen money from Mart....but not from Thailand...just from around the corner so to speak

Of course it could be he left Thailand and went to Den Dolder quickly afterwards 

 

Joran was conning Mart.  Joran always lies so likely he was in Den Dolder while telling Mart he was in Thailand.

he could have stayed some time at Den Dolder - maybe just daytime treatment.

and also a some time in Thailand and HK.
Peter R. confirms he was in Thailand.
also on SBS6 they checked (the internet connections?) to confirm he was in Thailand.

and i've got someone who confirmed Joran was at Den Dolder.
so has Johan555 and GBMW.

i hope some photos emerge from Den Dolder or Thailand.

caesu ... I believe you.  However ... when did Devries confirm that the internet dialogue did not take place in the Netherlands.

Is there a transcript or video that I could be linked to?

Thank you.

Janet

http://www.hartvannederland.nl/item/8031/Joran_van_der_Sloot_beschuldigd_van_oplichting

here at 00:55 Martin says he checked with Kees (van der Spek - the assistent of Peter R.) that Joran was indeed in Thailand and is now in HK.

[johan555]

who are they ?

[LilPuma]

His money for his travels is coming from................. 

He's never had an actual job.  Mommy and Daddy aren't rich. 

[Lala'sMom]

Could someone tell me if this is the pervert Marten that I read so much about that not only was my head spinning around but I was vomiting violently from some of his writings? Please tell me this is not that guy.  Someone?

[CapsLockWizard]

I just heard our reporters have paid a visit in Den Dolder....Joran was there (at least) until 2 weeks ago. This is not an official quote of course

So it seems Joran has stolen money from Mart....but not from Thailand...just from around the corner so to speak

Of course it could be he left Thailand and went to Den Dolder quickly afterwards 

 

Joran was conning Mart.  Joran always lies so likely he was in Den Dolder while telling Mart he was in Thailand.

he could have stayed some time at Den Dolder - maybe just daytime treatment.

and also a some time in Thailand and HK.
Peter R. confirms he was in Thailand.
also on SBS6 they checked (the internet connections?) to confirm he was in Thailand.

and i've got someone who confirmed Joran was at Den Dolder.
so has Johan555 and GBMW.

i hope some photos emerge from Den Dolder or Thailand.

caesu ... I believe you.  However ... when did Devries confirm that the internet dialogue did not take place in the Netherlands.

Is there a transcript or video that I could be linked to?

Thank you.

Janet

http://www.hartvannederland.nl/item/8031/Joran_van_der_Sloot_beschuldigd_van_oplichting

here at 00:55 Martin says he checked with Kees (van der Spek - the assistent of Peter R.) that Joran was indeed in Thailand and is now in HK.

from the Radio today, that Joran got himsel arrested in Thailand with Heroine. Now I do think that if that is the case, this a a ploy to make him desapear.

Intel should follow him... don't let it be another Dutch Bin Laden. Never to be found. te other ting is to take him in custody/ Arrest him in Internacional countries. He dare to travel outside the ptotected cage? I wonder if this is true or is another smoke screen to deviate what will be comming.

[bleachedblack]

Could someone tell me if this is the pervert Marten that I read so much about that not only was my head spinning around but I was vomiting violently from some of his writings? Please tell me this is not that guy.  Someone?

Not the guy.....

[johan555]

[bleachedblack]

Could someone tell me if this is the pervert Marten that I read so much about that not only was my head spinning around but I was vomiting violently from some of his writings? Please tell me this is not that guy.  Someone?

Not the guy.....

[bleachedblack]

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showuser=5946

http://welcome.icq.com/people/about_me.php?uin=168089832

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showuser=20497

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/lofiversion/index.php/t75033.html

http://www.thailandqa.com/forum/showthread.php?t=9785

[Tamikosmom]

Weird ... Sad ...

 

[Tamikosmom]

I just heard our reporters have paid a visit in Den Dolder....Joran was there (at least) until 2 weeks ago. This is not an official quote of course

So it seems Joran has stolen money from Mart....but not from Thailand...just from around the corner so to speak

Of course it could be he left Thailand and went to Den Dolder quickly afterwards 

 

Joran was conning Mart.  Joran always lies so likely he was in Den Dolder while telling Mart he was in Thailand.

he could have stayed some time at Den Dolder - maybe just daytime treatment.

and also a some time in Thailand and HK.
Peter R. confirms he was in Thailand.
also on SBS6 they checked (the internet connections?) to confirm he was in Thailand.

and i've got someone who confirmed Joran was at Den Dolder.
so has Johan555 and GBMW.

i hope some photos emerge from Den Dolder or Thailand.

caesu ... I believe you.  However ... when did Devries confirm that the internet dialogue did not take place in the Netherlands.

Is there a transcript or video that I could be linked to?

Thank you.

Janet

http://www.hartvannederland.nl/item/8031/Joran_van_der_Sloot_beschuldigd_van_oplichting

here at 00:55 Martin says he checked with Kees (van der Spek - the assistent of Peter R.) that Joran was indeed in Thailand and is now in HK.

Thank you caesu.

I wonder where Devries is getting all this info from.

Janet

[Tamikosmom]

 

Is there some photocropping (?) going on here?

Janet

[briany]

Renee Gielen writes today on the Dutch NWO block that it is weird that their are so little foto's from the students who were in Aruba on the Internet. In other words: those students have no right to decide wheather they want to have their pictures on the Internet or not.
She also claims it is weird that there is only one picture of Natalee in her bikini on the Internet.

This woman does not have any manners. She has no respect for the privacy of the students who went to Aruba. She wrote in the past that the declarations of the students should come on the Internet.
Well Renee Gielen, maybe those students want to keep some privacy. What do you think?

So this "lady" thinks that Natalee, her mother and the students who went to Aruba have no right on private-statements (their is also private information of couse in the statements).
The students have no right so say: "I don't want my picture on the Internet" if it is up to "lady" Renee Gielen.

This woman has no respect for other people.

[johan555]

Is there some photocropping (?) going on here?

Janet

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Janet i think so this is not Joran on this pic

[caesu]

Is there some photocropping (?) going on here?

Janet

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Janet i think so this is not Joran on this pic

of course it is Joran.

photo by Patricia Cronie

[MumInOhio]

Renee Gielen writes today on the Dutch NWO block that it is weird that their are so little foto's from the students who were in Aruba on the Internet. In other words: those students have no right to decide wheather they want to have their pictures on the Internet or not.
She also claims it is weird that there is only one picture of Natalee in her bikini on the Internet.

This woman does not have any manners. She has no respect for the privacy of the students who went to Aruba. She wrote in the past that the declarations of the students should come on the Internet.
Well Renee Gielen, maybe those students want to keep some privacy. What do you think?

So this "lady" thinks that Natalee, her mother and the students who went to Aruba have no right on private-statements (their is also private information of couse in the statements).
The students have no right so say: "I don't want my picture on the Internet" if it is up to "lady" Renee Gielen.

This woman has no respect for other people.

Hi Briany....I agree she has no respect.

Has she been saying that J2Ks and Freddy's statements should be on the internet as well. Freddy's, not as told by Joran in his book, would be a real eye-opener! IMO

[klaasend]