Natalee Case Discussion #749 4/24/08 - 5/02/08

[Tamikosmom]

In February, 2008 ... Beth Holloway's position regarding Jossy Mansur and Jan Van der Straaten leaves no doubt that she is one perceptive woman.

Janet

+++++++++++++

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2600.msg349370;topicseen#msg349370

Quote from: klaasend on February 14, 2008, 01:11:08 AM

Scared Monkeys Radio
Dana Pretzer
February 13, 2008

<snipped>

Dana: I'm going to throw out some names to you, I'm curious what you have to say .. Jossy Mansur

Beth:  Absolutely heroic, what a man, my goodness, what a businessman he is, full of integrity, I stand by Jossy b/c he's an individual who stands for human rights and justice, gosh, what he did for me is take such a burden off of me going after these perpetrators, I felt like I had no other ally, he went out on a limb for no reason except doing the right thing, he has integrity and respect for human life,

Dana: van der Stratten

Beth: He's corrupt to the core of his existence.  He just doesn't deserve any more words.

[San]

Flight discussion:

Quote from: "wreck"
Quote from: "WidgetTheMidget"
Quote from: "justinsmama"
Quote from: "WidgetTheMidget"
Quote from: "justinsmama"
Widget~ Hey! Can you clarify exactly what info you gleaned about Anita's flight back to Aruba in June 2005?


Hey Justins .......

3 Vander Sloots Landed In Aruba On June 1st .................

 Rolling Eyes
 You got actual confirmation that it was 3 vds?


Yes And I Also Heard It Was Passed On To The FBI

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1173.msg171129#msg171129

Yes I remember this and I always believed Widget.

Me too San, and I also believe Anidac.  Was Valentijn ever questioned?

More on this from the archives:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=251.820
 Natalee Holloway / LCD Archive / Lively Case Discussion #515 8/21 - 8/24/2006  on: August 23, 2006, 11:19:51 PM 
Quote from: "anidac"
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "anidac"
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "Carnut"
Just like Karr can be shown to be a lier if proof can be found he was home on Dec 25th, PVDS could be shown to be a lier if proof could be found that the munchkins were in Holland with momma.


Good point Carnut!


Just butting in to shore my 2 cents here....  Prior to 9/11 one could find passanger lists online.  Those days are gone.

Widget claims he was able to and that Anita and 2 other Sloots returned on June 2nd, or was it June 1st.  Anyway..that's what he said.


Now that you mention it I believe I had some luck finding partial information back when we where looking for flight schedules but if my memory serves me correctly I was only able to find ticket numbers without names.


Oops assigned seats where also included.

To my knowlege Valentijn was never questioned.  They could not make him give a statement if in fact he was in Holland.  It always bugged me that they questioned Sander who was the same age but never questioned Valentijn.

Recently it was said fathead Anita escorted him to the station for questioning.  I don't believe that.

[texasmom]

Thanks San!  I didn't recall his ever being questioned either.

[NM]

Flight discussion:

Quote from: "wreck"
Quote from: "WidgetTheMidget"
Quote from: "justinsmama"
Quote from: "WidgetTheMidget"
Quote from: "justinsmama"
Widget~ Hey! Can you clarify exactly what info you gleaned about Anita's flight back to Aruba in June 2005?


Hey Justins .......

3 Vander Sloots Landed In Aruba On June 1st .................

 Rolling Eyes
 You got actual confirmation that it was 3 vds?


Yes And I Also Heard It Was Passed On To The FBI

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1173.msg171129#msg171129

Yes I remember this and I always believed Widget.

Me too San, and I also believe Anidac.  Was Valentijn ever questioned?

More on this from the archives:
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=251.820
 Natalee Holloway / LCD Archive / Lively Case Discussion #515 8/21 - 8/24/2006  on: August 23, 2006, 11:19:51 PM 
Quote from: "anidac"
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "anidac"
Quote from: "klaasend"
Quote from: "Carnut"
Just like Karr can be shown to be a lier if proof can be found he was home on Dec 25th, PVDS could be shown to be a lier if proof could be found that the munchkins were in Holland with momma.


Good point Carnut!


Just butting in to shore my 2 cents here....  Prior to 9/11 one could find passanger lists online.  Those days are gone.

Widget claims he was able to and that Anita and 2 other Sloots returned on June 2nd, or was it June 1st.  Anyway..that's what he said.


Now that you mention it I believe I had some luck finding partial information back when we where looking for flight schedules but if my memory serves me correctly I was only able to find ticket numbers without names.


Oops assigned seats where also included.

The posts above from Widget just made me realize that Widget's info may have been found out by personal in the aruba airport, and not just KLM flight records.  We all know there are many locals working at the airport and one of those workers said it is a small island and they all know of each other. Some of those workers post/posted here and other sites about Natalee's case.  Surely, sloots would have been recognized at that airport.

[Tamikosmom]

THE SECOND BOOK - THE EVIDENCE

Beth Holloway
Dana Pretzer
October 15, 2007

Dana: I am assuming that there was lots you could have put in the book but didn’t.

Beth:  Lots could not go in the book.  So much evidence was  collected that was conveyed to us.  I told Sunny the second book needs to be “The Evidence”.

http://scaredmonkeysradio.com/2007/10/15/the-dana-pretzer-show-on-scared-monkeys-radio-listen-live-monday-october-15-at-9pm-eastern-guests-include-beth-holloway-twitty-and-ladonna-meredith-2/

[dennisintn]

I have no doubts regarding Paulus's culpability.

What had happened to Natalee, that both the Kalpoes assumed she did not make her plane?  Why would Satish ask Deepak how "the girl" is?....why even be concerned, if it was a simple drop off at "the beach".  They both know something bad happened and they both know what it is.  They may or may not know the final outcome....but they know it was FINAL for Natalee.  What happened?

I agree Buckeye.  The both Kalpoes know exactly what happened to Natalee.  In my opinion they were present when Joran beat her.  Why would they say Joran was crazy when they were in the car.  If my memory serves me right one of the Kalpoes were getting upset.  It leaves me to believe Natalee was fighting as soon as she got in that car and saw she was going in the wrong direction.  She was helpless.

i agree, san.  not a single statement or part of a statement any of them have made about what happened or why it happened makes any sense at all. that includes jvds' "confession" to patrick.  the only truth in that "confession" is that jvds was in her hands when she died, most likely trying to escape their clutches.
dennisintn

[briany]

Does anybody know more about the famous "belly shot"?

Was this a speciality of the bar or what?

[2NJSons_Mom]

NM,

Widget was posting from Costa Rica, as far as I know.  He never divulged his source with regard to the KLM flight info.  FWIW, I believed him and wonder where he's been. 

San,

I agree about Val....also thought about documentation that his email was logged into during the early hours of 5/30...wouldn't this be something to question?  Did he or didn't he? 

[San]

I have no doubts regarding Paulus's culpability.

What had happened to Natalee, that both the Kalpoes assumed she did not make her plane?  Why would Satish ask Deepak how "the girl" is?....why even be concerned, if it was a simple drop off at "the beach".  They both know something bad happened and they both know what it is.  They may or may not know the final outcome....but they know it was FINAL for Natalee.  What happened?

I agree Buckeye.  The both Kalpoes know exactly what happened to Natalee.  In my opinion they were present when Joran beat her.  Why would they say Joran was crazy when they were in the car.  If my memory serves me right one of the Kalpoes were getting upset.  It leaves me to believe Natalee was fighting as soon as she got in that car and saw she was going in the wrong direction.  She was helpless.

i agree, san.  not a single statement or part of a statement any of them have made about what happened or why it happened makes any sense at all. that includes jvds' "confession" to patrick.  the only truth in that "confession" is that jvds was in her hands when she died, most likely trying to escape their clutches.
dennisintn

I agree.  Joran showed the world what everyone has been saying all along that she was with him when she died at his hands.  He tried to change it by saying he wasn't sure if she was dead but in fact she was dead.

[San]

NM,

Widget was posting from Costa Rica, as far as I know.  He never divulged his source with regard to the KLM flight info.  FWIW, I believed him and wonder where he's been. 

San,

I agree about Val....also thought about documentation that his email was logged into during the early hours of 5/30...wouldn't this be something to question?  Did he or didn't he? 

For that alone he should have been brougt in for questioning.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Does anybody know more about the famous "belly shot"?

Was this a speciality of the bar or what?

That story came out of Joran's mouth, if I'm not mistaken, and I do not know if it was corroborated by any of her companions......can't say if it was a specialty of the bar...

[Tamikosmom]

“NO MAN HAS A GOOD ENOUGH MEMORY TO MAKE A SUCCESSFUL LIAR.”Abraham Lincoln

Paulus van der Sloot
Witness Statement
June 18, 2005

Between 17.00 hours and 18.30 hours, I dropped off Joran in front of the entrance of the Aruba Raquet Club with my Suzuki so that he could take tennis lessons and go to the gym. He probably had his carrying bag with tennis necessities with him. I saw him enter the building. He had told me that he would afterwards be going to the Wyndham Hotel because a “Free Carribean Stud Tournament” would be held. I immediately went home, had dinner with the other boys and after that I went to bed.


Paulus van der Sloot
Suspect Statement
June 25, 2005

We spoke last time about that Monday night when Joran was at the "Raquet Club", that I only took the bag with me. I am remembering that it was around 08:00pm when I took the bag to Joran at the “Raquet Club”, this was when Joran was walking in the direction of the Marriott and made the announcement that he was going to participate in the “Free Tournament” at the Wyndham that this came up. In my view I even grumbled (expressed concern) on Joran and then went on to pick up Sebastian at the ZEOLA family.

[San]

Does anybody know more about the famous "belly shot"?

Was this a speciality of the bar or what?

That story came out of Joran's mouth, if I'm not mistaken, and I do not know if it was corroborated by any of her companions......can't say if it was a specialty of the bar...

The first time I heard about a belly shot was from the Kalpoes Lawyer.  He mentioned it one night on Greta.

[briany]

2:26-2:34 am: Joran calls Deepak from his cell phone (DZNH)
2:34 am: Joran's younger brother Valentijn on van der Sloot computer (CRD)
2:38 am: Young woman resembling Natalee is captured on ATM video coming out of the bathroom opposite HI casino. To be seen exiting the bathroom but not entering, she must have passed through the pool area. She is dressed similarly to how Natalee was dressed at CnCs, but is wearing a different top (Renfro e-mail)

Deepak sends Joran a message telling him that he is waiting for him to get home and go online, and after that he will go to sleep (D 6/11)

Joran sends Deepak a message saying when he gets home he will go online (D 6/11)

2:46 am: Deepak sends Joran a message: "When you get home, miscall me" (DZNH)

Deepak goes back to chatting on the computer with Croes. He tells Croes that Joran is walking home and he is waiting up for him. (D 6/11)

2:45-2:50 am: 10-15 minutes after Joran's call to Deepak, he hears Deepak's car arrive. Natalee refuses a ride back to her hotel, so Joran leaves her on the beach (OTR, DZNH)

The younger brother was on the computer in the middle of the night?
Everybody was all of the sudden very busy with computers and phones?

Why?

Because Joran has been on the beach with Natalee en forgotten his shoes?

[Silverfox]

Does anybody know more about the famous "belly shot"?

Was this a speciality of the bar or what?

That story came out of Joran's mouth, if I'm not mistaken, and I do not know if it was corroborated by any of her companions......can't say if it was a specialty of the bar...

There was never any evidence from anyone other that Joran that this occured.  Not from MB Students, not even from the Kalpoe Brothers...funny thing, right? 

It is easy to make an accusation of an event if the person of the event cannot talk to protect herself...Joran knew this so this is one of his many lies... No body, no crime...no life, no rebuttal...

[texasmom]

Does anybody know more about the famous "belly shot"?

Was this a speciality of the bar or what?

Briany, this is a transcript from early in the case.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0509/26/ng.01.html
NANCY GRACE

Gulf States Struggle to Make Comeback

Aired September 26, 2005 - 20:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

snipped

GRACE: Welcome back everybody. I`m Nancy Grace. Thank you for being with us.

Apparently a complete about face by crime suspects in the Natalee Holloway disappearance, Joran Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son.

Take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JORAN VAN DER SLOOT, SUSPECT: She had a lot to drink and at Carlos and Charlie`s she grabbed my hand and took me with her, for me to take jelly shots off of her, and afterwards she asked me to buy a shot for her, buy her something to drink, which I did, and that`s all I saw that she drank. I didn`t see her drink anything else, but from earlier, when I was with her friends at the Excelsior Casino, at the Holiday Inn, the whole group was already drinking, from 5:00 in the afternoon, and I didn`t really see her at that moment. I didn`t even really notice her at that moment, but I guess they came here to have a good time, to celebrate their graduation, also, and they might have all gone a little too far. I don`t know.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you mean, jelly shots, you mean off of her body?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yeah.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How does that work, can you tell me?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don`t know. I never did it myself before. ( ) She grabbed my hand and took me with her and asked me if I wanted to take jelly shots off her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But how does it work, I don`t understand.

VAN DER SLOOT: She climbed on the bar, she laid down on the bar, and she called over the bartender by name, and he got a jelly shot for her and I took a jelly shot off her.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don`t understand. Is it on her belly? Is it on her --

VAN DER SLOOT: On her belly, yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On her belly button?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And then what do you do?

VAN DER SLOOT: Then you basically lick it off.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: OK, maybe I`m getting a disconnect, but how did she get from the bar to disappeared? You know, he kind of left that part out.

That was our first look at Joran Van Der Sloot since his release from prison. He was a suspect and many believe is a suspect in the disappearance of 18-year-old Natalee Holloway.

He spoke to Jerry Wexler (ph), a reporter with "Current Affair." And joining us right now is Harris Faulkner, with "Current Affair."

Harris, what can you tell me?

HARRIS FAULKNER, "CURRENT AFFAIR": Well, Nancy, first of all, it`s good to be talking with you this evening.

I can tell you that Joran Van Der Sloot got worn down by us. We have been after him, to talk with him, really, since the very week on the island that Natalee Holloway disappeared. I went to his home as early as June 2, so to reach the new family home and his new college campus, in Holland, with our producer, Jerry Ratchel (ph), was just a whole lot of work and a whole lot of wrangling. He knew it.

At one point in the interview, which, by the way, goes more than 30 minutes, he puts his backpack on the ground and says you know what, there is no need for me to run, let me just talk.

Some of the things that happened during that interview, and you know, because you`re an attorney, you know, you`ve been around the block, Nancy, one of the things that happened during this interview is a glimpse of what investigators must have been seeing all along in this case. Do you know that this kid on camera contradicts himself several times about some really important stuff --
GRACE: Let me go to Dave --

FAULKNER: -- like did you have sex with Natalee or did you not have sex with Natalee.

GRACE: Did he answer?

FAULKNER: The first answer we get, it`s none of your business. Second answer we get, I did not have sex with her. The other two guys, Satish and Kalpoe, suspects, also did not have sex with her. Third answer, it`s none of your business.

GRACE: I`m going to go to Natalee`s father. Dave Holloway is with us.

Dave, what is your reaction to Joran Van Der Sloot`s additional statement, basically saying outright that he lied to police?

DAVE HOLLOWAY, FATHER OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: Well, apparently he has lied a number of times and, you know, when you lie, it`s really hard to remember what you lied about, so it is apparent that, you know, he`s lying again.

So what good was the statement? I don`t know. I read through it myself. There was one question, what do you have to say to the American people. And he said, I don`t have anything to say to the American people, you know, which tells me that he`s all in it for himself and trying to cover up for the Deepak and Kalpoe brothers.

GRACE: Well, you know, from what I read of it, he seems to be blaming Natalee, like it was her fault that she had too much to drink and then somehow went missing, with him.

HOLLOWAY: Well, I`ve read about criminal pasts and this type stuff, and part of the process is to belittle your victim, demean their reputation and all that kind of stuff, so that doesn`t surprise me. You know, Deepak and Satish did the exact same thing.

GRACE: To Courtney Anderson, defense attorney. Courtney, I know it is hard for you to take off that defense attorney hat, but you know, will this guy ever break down and tell us what happened to Natalee? You know good and well the three of them did not have sex with her and then leave her alone out on the beach and, what, then somebody else can and kidnapped or killed her? That doesn`t make any sense.

COURTNEY ANDERSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, your first question is, is he ever going to break down and tell the truth, and honestly I think we can see -- typically, if somebody has committed a crime, over time they do eventually get caught. They do eventually have so many contradictions and leave some trail behind or some evidence where they do get caught, and I think if there is some solace for her parents, it should be that the people who have done wrong will be caught at some point.

GRACE: And to you, Daniel Horowitz, this latest statement. Do you think Aruban officials will do anything about the fact, he admits he lied to police?

HOROWITZ: You know, Nancy, you called it. You were the first person on national television to say they`re lying, or words to that effect, when they fingered those security guards who did nothing wrong. At that time, they should have been arrested and charged with the crime of impeding an investigation. They should be locked up right now for that crime alone.

So I don`t think the Aruban officials ever intended to go hard after these guys. It looks bad for them, and now they`re happy. They just want us to go away. But, Dave, don`t let it go away. I know, Nancy, you won`t.

GRACE: And, Dave, do you think -- the fact that this guy has admitted he lied to police about your girl, will that make any impact on the Aruban government? Will they do anything about it?

HOLLOWAY: I don`t know. I went down there about 10 days ago and spent five days talking to my attorney, the prosecutor and the police, and the police were genuine in the fact that they were continuing the investigation and wanted to get to the bottom of it. So I have renewed hope that things have died down a little bit, and they were hopeful that they could come up with something.

GRACE: Stay with us, Mr. Holloway. We`ll all be right back, everyone, but very quickly, to tonight`s all points bulletin. FBI and law enforcement across the country on the lookout for this man, Juan Carlos Martinez, wanted in connection with the `99 murder of 37-year-old Marlon Strain (ph) in Alabama. Martinez, 26, 5`6", 135 pounds, black hair, brown eyes.

If you have any information on Martinez, call the FBI, 205-326-6166.

Local news next for some of you, but we`ll all be right back. And remember, live coverage of a road rage murder case, 3:00 to 5:00 Eastern, Court TV.

Please stay with us as we remember Specialist Scott P. McLaughlin, 29, an American hero.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Natalee Holloway disappeared seemingly into thin air, but three young men admit they were with her late into the evening the night she disappeared off her high school senior trip.

We are not forgetting Natalee Holloway.

Dr. Robi, it just seems to me that here you see Joran Van Der Sloot attacking Natalee Holloway`s reputation. Even in her death, that she`s somehow the bad girl because she had some shots.

LUDWIG: Right. He`s saying she`s bad, so don`t feel so badly for her that she is missing, and I`m a good guy, I was just going along with the flow. She was partying all night. And, of course, that`s not the way it works, but you can see how his mind is working. I`m good, she`s bad. There is a split, good/bad. I`m deserving of freedom. And perhaps that`s why he lied. He felt whatever happened --

GRACE: Well, right there he`s lying, Dave Holloway, telling me on national TV he`s never had a shot or whatever, a Jello shot, he`s talking about. He was at that bar all the time and at casinos until 1:00 and 2:00 in the morning. Jello shot my foot! This guy probably lived off Jello shots.

HOLLOWAY: He did. In fact, I understand he was in a bar the next weekend, right after, doing the same things, according to a private source that indicated so.GRACE: Well, what was upsetting to me was that he seemed to, in the accounts I read of his statements, attack not only Americans but Natalee`s mother for caring and raising a stink about her child`s disappearance. I mean, he seemed to point out and lash at everybody except himself -- Dave.

HOLLOWAY: That`s true. I read the statement, and he indicated that he didn`t want to give a statement to the American people nor did he want to talk about any of the investigation. When they got close to asking him some of the key questions, he put up a wall and said he didn`t want to talk about it and gave kind of the same answers that his father gave. You know, we`re still in an investigation, we can`t talk about it. As soon as the investigation is over with, I`ll say something.

So, you know, what is he hiding? We`re going to get to the bottom of it.

GRACE: You`re so right. With someone who refuses to talk, refuses to give explanation, their story changes every time they open their mouth, but I don`t think Aruban authorities will do a thing about it.

snipped

[2NJSons_Mom]

From Joran's 6/9/05 PV....

.....She grabbed my hand and asked me if I would go to the bar with her. On the way there she said to me that I had to drink a Jellyshots (handwritten with an arrow pointing to this section of the statement, it says "or body shot") off of her. I at that moment in time did know what a Jellyshot was but I did not know that she went and laid down on the bar and that I had to drink the Jellyshot from her belly button.
 
When we arrived at the bar Natalee asked for a Jellyshot. Natalee then went and laid on top of the metal bar. The bartender handed me a small plastic container/cup in which was the Jellyshot that I placed on her belly button. After I had done that I sucked the Jellyshot from her belly button. Jellyshot is a jello with alcohol in it. I do not know what kind of alcohol is in it. When Natalee got onto the bar I thought that she was drunk. I could clearly tell that Natalee had been drinking. I could smell this from the smell that came out of Natalee's mouth. I also have to say that when I saw Natalee dancing I also noticed that she had been drinking. While I was talking to Natalee Satish stood beside me the entire time.
 
Then Natalee said that she also wanted to drink a Jellyshot but the bartender told me that that bar was closed. After that Natalee and me walked to another bar that was still open at that time. I asked the bartender two shots of Bacardi 151. I still had the whisky coke in my hand. Natalee asked me if she should drink the Bacardi 151 in one go. I answered her affirmatively and she answered me that she would do it in two. Natalee said to me that she needed a "chaser" in order to drink the Bacardi. Natalee drank my whisky coke as a "chaser" and then she drank the Bacardi 151 in two goes. I payed for the two shots of Bacardi 151. I do not know where Deepak stood at that moment but according to me Satish was still standing beside me. I did not ask for another kind of alcoholic beverage because I always drink Bacardi 151. Bacardi 151 is 151 proof and that means that it is 75.5% alcohol. I payed U.S. $ 20,- for the two shots of Bacardi 151...........

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=160.0

[texasmom]

2:26-2:34 am: Joran calls Deepak from his cell phone (DZNH)
2:34 am: Joran's younger brother Valentijn on van der Sloot computer (CRD)
2:38 am: Young woman resembling Natalee is captured on ATM video coming out of the bathroom opposite HI casino. To be seen exiting the bathroom but not entering, she must have passed through the pool area. She is dressed similarly to how Natalee was dressed at CnCs, but is wearing a different top (Renfro e-mail)

Deepak sends Joran a message telling him that he is waiting for him to get home and go online, and after that he will go to sleep (D 6/11)

Joran sends Deepak a message saying when he gets home he will go online (D 6/11)

2:46 am: Deepak sends Joran a message: "When you get home, miscall me" (DZNH)

Deepak goes back to chatting on the computer with Croes. He tells Croes that Joran is walking home and he is waiting up for him. (D 6/11)

2:45-2:50 am: 10-15 minutes after Joran's call to Deepak, he hears Deepak's car arrive. Natalee refuses a ride back to her hotel, so Joran leaves her on the beach (OTR, DZNH)

The younger brother was on the computer in the middle of the night?
Everybody was all of the sudden very busy with computers and phones?

Why?

Because Joran has been on the beach with Natalee en forgotten his shoes?

Briany,
One of the rules for the internet in our home from the time we got our first computer is that I have the log-in information for both of my sons.  I can sign on right now as either one and no one would know the difference.  In my opinion it is very likely that someone else could have been logged in to the VDS computer as Valentijn. 

[Lala'sMom]

Does anybody know more about the famous "belly shot"?

Was this a speciality of the bar or what?

That story came out of Joran's mouth, if I'm not mistaken, and I do not know if it was corroborated by any of her companions......can't say if it was a specialty of the bar...

There was never any evidence from anyone other that Joran that this occured.  Not from MB Students, not even from the Kalpoe Brothers...funny thing, right? 

It is easy to make an accusation of an event if the person of the event cannot talk to protect herself...Joran knew this so this is one of his many lies... No body, no crime...no life, no rebuttal...

I can't figure out how to copy and paste this document here...but Lee Broughton's 302 indicates body shots were being done at CnC that night by the MB teens. Here is the link:
http://www.hollowaycase.com/

[briany]

VAN DER SLOOT: She climbed on the bar, she laid down on the bar, and she called over the bartender by name, and he got a jelly shot for her and I took a jelly shot off her.

Why did the bartender give Natalee a "jelly shot"? Is it normal for bartenders to give "jelly shots"?

This bartender seemed to be familair with giving "jelly shots".