Natalee Case Discussion #752 5/15 - 5/20/08

[MumInOhio]

I think the hand and eye has to do with Shaminism.

Sorry always 1...I had to google...not familiar with this at all. Can you give a quick summary, so I can try and follow? TIA

[bleachedblack]

Jack, after seeing the aerial view of the sloot compound  , I don't see where there could be a kiln. I thought they are built a reasonable distance from the living quarters but I really don't know, only speculating. I do know that when our house burned, we never did see the remains of the cat.

The kilns do not have to be outside.  The only ones I ever saw were inside and huge, inside block buildings and I never saw smoke coming out even when they were operating.  These were commercial.  It was something like a tour.  I saw different types.  One was making a type of ceramic used for space ship tiles and technical end-products and the other  for something to do with wood products.  I do not have much knowledge of kilns themselves.  The ones doing the ceramics used sand and heated it to such an extreme hight degree the sand melted into and could be etched upon, etc.  Anyway these were many and in enclosed buildings.  How they heated the kilns would not have been with anything noticable that smoked, but the smell was obvious.  It smelled like BO to me.  Like someone who failed to take a bath.  Maybe that is one reason Palus smells is the kiln smells have seeped into his system along with his rotten hygiene (lol.)  It would seem that the heat for that day would show up on some type of GS thermal videos in that area, but that would be if they have those shots from that time period.  Perhaps the Sloots would want her "gone" to Holland if she was the Kiln operator at home and no one knew  how to do this as well as her.  They would make sure Anita was conveniently "out of town" and not there destroying evidence.  What a huge speculation this is.  Heat from a cermatory would show up on satelite, and most likely the heat from a hot spot home kiln.  According to how all that works as well.   Jackb

Many artists kilns are infact small, such as these http://www.clay-king.com/largekilns.htm
If you are a clay artist professionally I would imagine a larger kiln and space would be in order. Many kilns are close to the size of a crockpot.

This model for example :http://www.clay-king.com/itemviking24.htm  Which retails for $3,000, reaches  maximum temperature of  1287C. Temperatures needed to cremate a body completely are between 645OC and 1200OC.

http://tinyurl.com/5c3cbt

[Pita]

I think the hand and eye has to do with Shaminism.

Eye in Hand

What does it mean? The pancultural Eye-in-Hand icon manifests the integral and interactive bond between two essential human functions: sensing/observation (the Eye) and doing/acting (the Hand). Together these two abilities represent the most effective symbolic condensation of the ideals of human existence - omniscience (all-knowing) and omnipotence (all-powerful) - in a very simple two-part icon: the Eye in the Hand.

"Originating in the Middle East the Hand represents God's "Protective-Hand," and the blue Eye on it shields its owner from the curse of the Evil Eye. The Hand's positive energy draws happiness, riches and health. A talisman charms against the Evil Eye take different forms in each culture where the belief is common. In Turkey and adjacent areas of Greece (eastern Mediterranean and Aegean), the 'evil Eye' is conceived of as blue, Thus, in order to repel or prevent the effect of 'evil Eye', a reflective "Eye" of blue glass is used."

Eye     sensing     knowledge     omniscience   
Hand  doing power omnipotence

http://www.darkfiber.com/eyeinhand/

[Destiny]

I think the hand and eye has to do with Shaminism.

Correct...

[always 1]

to MumInOhio see http://www.sandplay.org/symbols/eye.htm re eye in hand and Shaminism

[jackb]

I believe that "Poppin Fresh" will be as tall as his brothers.
Wasn't he only 8 in 1995?
He is at what we call the goslin stage.
He looks more like Val than like Joran.....thank goodness!

He is now tall as they are if you roll him on his side.  Also I think I know where Joran is:
The kid and his mama ate the SOB.   jackb

[bleachedblack]

El Ojo en la mano

http://www.darkfiber.com/eyeinhand/

[MumInOhio]

to MumInOhio see http://www.sandplay.org/symbols/eye.htm re eye in hand and Shaminism

Thanks everyone...will take a look later...

[caesu]

US official: Navy plane may have crossed Venezuelan airspace

Monday, May 19, 2008

By LOLITA C. BALDOR, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON —  A U.S. Navy plane apparently accidentally crossed into Venezuela's airspace Saturday night, triggering protests from that country, according to a U.S. defense official familiar with the report.

The S-3 Viking aircraft, based in Curacao, was on a training mission in international airspace near Los Roques Island, Venezuela, and experienced "intermittent navigational problems," said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the issue.

The aircraft is used for counter-narcotics missions. Navy crew on the S-3 reported they had a brief radio conversation with air traffic control personnel in Maiquetia, and believed that they had mistakenly flown into Venezuelan airspace, the official said.

Navy officials are investigating the incident to determine exactly what happened.

According to the defense official, the S-3 crew was under the air control of Curacao, but was told to switch frequencies to Maiquetia. Based on the "agitated" tone of the conversation with traffic controllers in Maiquetia, the official said the crew realized the likely error.

The official said the crew had some language problems during the three-minute radio conversation with Maiquetia personnel.

"They promptly responded and identified themselves as U.S. Navy, on a training mission in international airspace, and that a navigational error had possibly occurred," said the official.

The S-3 aircraft were originally used for anti-submarine warfare and maritime surveillance, but are now used largely for counter-narcotics activities. The S-3 involved in the incident provides support for the Joint Interagency Task Force South, based in Key West, Fla.

Venezuela will summon the U.S. ambassador to explain the violation of its airspace by a U.S. military plane, the country's foreign minister said Monday.

Foreign Minister Nicolas Maduro said U.S. Ambassador Patrick Duddy will be called in to discuss the matter. "We will ask for an explanation," Maduro said.

Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2008May19/0,4670,USVenezuela,00.html

[Destiny]

to MumInOhio see http://www.sandplay.org/symbols/eye.htm re eye in hand and Shaminism

Always...Thanks Great Read....eye in hand...also plays a huge roll in Masonic Lore and Ritual...

[jackb]

US official: Navy plane may have crossed Venezuelan airspace

Monday, May 19, 2008

By LOLITA C. BALDOR, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON —  A U.S. Navy plane apparently accidentally crossed into Venezuela's airspace Saturday night, triggering protests from that country, according to a U.S. defense official familiar with the report.

The S-3 Viking aircraft, based in Curacao, was on a training mission in international airspace near Los Roques Island, Venezuela, and experienced "intermittent navigational problems," said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because of the sensitivity of the issue.

The aircraft is used for counter-narcotics missions. Navy crew on the S-3 reported they had a brief radio conversation with air traffic control personnel in Maiquetia, and believed that they had mistakenly flown into Venezuelan airspace, the official said.

Navy officials are investigating the incident to determine exactly what happened.

According to the defense official, the S-3 crew was under the air control of Curacao, but was told to switch frequencies to Maiquetia. Based on the "agitated" tone of the conversation with traffic controllers in Maiquetia, the official said the crew realized the likely error.

The official said the crew had some language problems during the three-minute radio conversation with Maiquetia personnel.

"They promptly responded and identified themselves as U.S. Navy, on a training mission in international airspace, and that a navigational error had possibly occurred," said the official.

The S-3 aircraft were originally used for anti-submarine warfare and maritime surveillance, but are now used largely for counter-narcotics activities. The S-3 involved in the incident provides support for the Joint Interagency Task Force South, based in Key West, Fla.

Venezuela will summon the U.S. ambassador to explain the violation of its airspace by a U.S. military plane, the country's foreign minister said Monday.

Foreign Minister Nicolas Maduro said U.S. Ambassador Patrick Duddy will be called in to discuss the matter. "We will ask for an explanation," Maduro said.

Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

http://www.foxnews.com/wires/2008May19/0,4670,USVenezuela,00.html

...and the little dude came running out saying, all excited; "...De pla in, De pa, in.  Bad Pal in,
sit pla in sit....  They were just trying to find a toilet to pizz in would be my guess.   Jackb

[carpe noctem]

DIARIO today


Warning graphic:

http://tinyurl.com/5duwdb

http://tinyurl.com/5oynb8

[jackb]

That guy looks a lot like Jan Van Der Straten...Wouldnt suprise me if that is his brother..

I think it looks like him because it his him. 

I agree VMS, that's the piece 'o shit!

Yeah, that is the POS with his "humble, meek and mild" face on.  Quiet a change from Mr. Hot Shot on the VDS property giving orders and throwing what appears a temper tantrum.
They are all schizoid, or at least shit zoid.  jackb

[klaasend]

[finngirl]

... Thought I recalled early posts saying van der Straten didn’t have a son!  Must have been mistaken …

IIRC, when Gilliam (or something like that) was being discussed as a son of Jan, Arubagirl was the one who posted that Jan had no son.

AG posted that Gilliam vdS did not exist ...
but that was specifically referring only to the name Gilliam

in another post she said that vdS' son
was her classmate (at Colegio Arubano, IIRC)

I have the post somewhere ...
unless someone beats me to it I'll try to find it tonight

[SS]

Klaas -  Destiny wants to contact me.  You can send her my email address.
Thanks a bunch.

I sent YOU her email address yesterday when it was requested.

Thank you, you're a sweetie. 

[texasmom]

Klaas, please check your hotmail when you get a chance.
Thanks in advance!
tm   

[Blonde]

... Thought I recalled early posts saying van der Straten didn’t have a son!  Must have been mistaken …

IIRC, when Gilliam (or something like that) was being discussed as a son of Jan, Arubagirl was the one who posted that Jan had no son.

AG posted that Gilliam vdS did not exist ...
but that was specifically referring only to the name Gilliam

in another post she said that vdS' son
was her classmate (at Colegio Arubano, IIRC)

I have the post somewhere ...
unless someone beats me to it I'll try to find it tonight

Is this him

[bleachedblack]

Sorry for the O/T but this has just made me so MAD! Wasn't sure whether to post it in News of the Day or Unsolved Crimes but it is truely a crime. Sorry for the rant....but if this dip Prof had gone ahead and started
CPR maybe this poor girl would have had a chance ....sorry , thanks for listening.

Listen to 911 call

http://www.abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=4872140&page=1
 

[texasmom]

... Thought I recalled early posts saying van der Straten didn’t have a son!  Must have been mistaken …

IIRC, when Gilliam (or something like that) was being discussed as a son of Jan, Arubagirl was the one who posted that Jan had no son.

AG posted that Gilliam vdS did not exist ...
but that was specifically referring only to the name Gilliam

in another post she said that vdS' son
was her classmate (at Colegio Arubano, IIRC)

I have the post somewhere ...
unless someone beats me to it I'll try to find it tonight

Is this him

Hi Blonde,
That's the picture I've seen in reference to him for a while now.