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Author Topic: SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #4  (Read 625728 times)
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COLOMBO
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« Reply #1120 on: August 03, 2008, 04:09:50 PM »

Lala's:

see a post from a short time ago-re: DH/poison house

he's the link between the pimps and 'Babalu's officials' and he 'holds the real key'


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truthseeker2
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« Reply #1121 on: August 03, 2008, 04:13:32 PM »

DirtyHand is not an arawak

The arawaks hold the singing cards
arawaks can't let babylonian card (DirtyHand=babylonian) sing
because hand holding it dirty too (polis=dirty hand)
(DirtyHand not polis)

Arawaks often play in the small houses of babylon with offspring of the elders (hands dirty)

Shango Says: June 28th, 2005 at 12:23 am
Follow the notes ($)
to the poison house
where the children of the babylonians (pimps)
and the arawak nation (Babalu's officials corps)
meet, under cover of delusion.
In the maze
the lions which play
shall be found.
The gamblers also took note.
Tell the cowboys!

DirtyHand is the link (between pimps and Babalu's official corps)
He holds the real key (to the poison house)

Let's look at some of the theories of who is Dirty Hand:

van der Straten...yep he fits, he definitely left the island as was told. He was accused of calling Paulus on a regular basis in the early days.

Ben Vocking...he fits also, he was there at the house when they came to search it, he lived there at some point. He walked with Paulus.

Frans Duetekom...Caps insists that this is the guy that is dirty hand. He made a compelling argument.  My only caveat is that those he was talking to about dirty hand could not have been any posters outside of the Aruban culture because they would not know about this guy.  Would Shango being in Florida know this too? 

Rudy Croes...he would fit also and Tylergal believed it to him. She made a compelling argument also.  I think Rudy fits other characters in Shango, but that is just me.

There are others that would fit also, depending on the context of the post. Colombo feel free to jump in here and give us your ideas about who dirty hand is also.  I want to hear them all.


you mention all arawaks......see first sentence

I suppose that would depend on your definition of Arawak.  Mine must be different from yours.  I do not see Van Der Straaten as an Arawak.  I see him as a Babylonian.  Someone placed in that position to protect the Dutch on the island.
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #1122 on: August 03, 2008, 04:14:28 PM »


Oh you are getting to the touchy part here...not very many of us can agree on who Dirty Hand is.  Without some agreement there can be no movement forward.  That has been one of the stumbling blocks to this whole thing.  If you go with Straten, then so many other theories are trampled on and that is when the war starts....keep talking. We may need to take each view one at a time and see what fits with Dirty Hand. Remember, Shango tells us that Dirty Hand was discovered.  Every time  I mention that fact it's glossed over for some reason.

Yes, I know.  But here is are the posts that clinch it for me:

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:28 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 4:00 am
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his 12:30 posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:12 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting
If the cowboys do not find the loot today, it will not be found

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:26 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting
Simian your Doppleganger is with us

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:28 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 9:44 pm
Babalu opened a window looking into babylon on his 12:31 A.M. Post
DirtyHand is alive

Shango on June 27th, 2005 9:48 pm
Babalu knew who dirty hand was at half past 12

drax on June 27th, 2005 10:57 pm
DirtyHand has walked through the maze:…is DirtyHand Poppa VDS?

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:01 pm
The Drax asks a question for which he already provided an answer.

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:04 pm
Babalu opened a window looking onto Babylon with his 12:30 A.M. post

drax on June 27th, 2005 11:08 pm
Shango says: The Drax asks a question for which he already provided an answer.
I don’t understand, Shango.

Babalú on June 27th, 2005 11:10 pm
He’s talking about Dirty Hands identity, please refer to my post of yesterday 12:30 AM. He is JVDS, and not Joran.

Lucy on June 27th, 2005 10:56 pm
Someone said last night that Dirty Hand was somebody in the police.

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:13 pm
Lucy spoke at 10:56

watcher on June 30th, 2005 2:29 am
I think Subdude is on the right track about the media putting pressure on WHY the polis chief is leaving.


Shango on June 30th, 2005 2:31 am
Watcher opened a window looking onto babylon at 2:29.
He holds the key to the ONLY door which opens the door to the lions den


I agree.  But Shango never comes out and says "Yes, Dirty Hand is Straten."  He only says that Babalu opened a window.  That could easily mean "You are getting warmer Babalu."   There are too many others that will dispute the fact that Babalu was merely trying to guess what Shango meant.  If Babalu had indeed told us who Dirty Hand was, why did Shango later say:

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:58 pm
Arawaks want to make cowboys happy
Babylonians want to maintain integrity of Great House
Gods of the cowboys know there was a game in the great house,
and so DirtyHand was discovered
But the sacrifice will be offered before dirty hand sings
He will return to babylon, broken but anonymous 
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #1123 on: August 03, 2008, 04:16:34 PM »

Lala's:

see a post from a short time ago-re: DH/poison house

he's the link between the pimps and 'Babalu's officials' and he 'holds the real key'




You have lost me again. LOL  More details...simple language I am dumb. Thanks.
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truthseeker2
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« Reply #1124 on: August 03, 2008, 04:17:54 PM »


Oh you are getting to the touchy part here...not very many of us can agree on who Dirty Hand is.  Without some agreement there can be no movement forward.  That has been one of the stumbling blocks to this whole thing.  If you go with Straten, then so many other theories are trampled on and that is when the war starts....keep talking. We may need to take each view one at a time and see what fits with Dirty Hand. Remember, Shango tells us that Dirty Hand was discovered.  Every time  I mention that fact it's glossed over for some reason.

Yes, I know.  But here is are the posts that clinch it for me:

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:28 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 4:00 am
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his 12:30 posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:12 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting
If the cowboys do not find the loot today, it will not be found

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:26 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting
Simian your Doppleganger is with us

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:28 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 9:44 pm
Babalu opened a window looking into babylon on his 12:31 A.M. Post
DirtyHand is alive

Shango on June 27th, 2005 9:48 pm
Babalu knew who dirty hand was at half past 12

drax on June 27th, 2005 10:57 pm
DirtyHand has walked through the maze:…is DirtyHand Poppa VDS?

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:01 pm
The Drax asks a question for which he already provided an answer.

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:04 pm
Babalu opened a window looking onto Babylon with his 12:30 A.M. post

drax on June 27th, 2005 11:08 pm
Shango says: The Drax asks a question for which he already provided an answer.
I don’t understand, Shango.

Babalú on June 27th, 2005 11:10 pm
He’s talking about Dirty Hands identity, please refer to my post of yesterday 12:30 AM. He is JVDS, and not Joran.

Lucy on June 27th, 2005 10:56 pm
Someone said last night that Dirty Hand was somebody in the police.

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:13 pm
Lucy spoke at 10:56

watcher on June 30th, 2005 2:29 am
I think Subdude is on the right track about the media putting pressure on WHY the polis chief is leaving.


Shango on June 30th, 2005 2:31 am
Watcher opened a window looking onto babylon at 2:29.
He holds the key to the ONLY door which opens the door to the lions den


I agree.  But Shango never comes out and says "Yes, Dirty Hand is Straten."  He only says that Babalu opened a window.  That could easily mean "You are getting warmer Babalu."   There are too many others that will dispute the fact that Babalu was merely trying to guess what Shango meant.  If Babalu had indeed told us who Dirty Hand was, why did Shango later say:

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:58 pm
Arawaks want to make cowboys happy
Babylonians want to maintain integrity of Great House
Gods of the cowboys know there was a game in the great house,
and so DirtyHand was discovered
But the sacrifice will be offered before dirty hand sings
He will return to babylon, broken but anonymous 


I see the confirmation here:

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:01 pm
The Drax asks a question for which he already provided an answer.

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:04 pm
Babalu opened a window looking onto Babylon with his 12:30 A.M. post



And here:

watcher on June 30th, 2005 2:29 am
I think Subdude is on the right track about the media putting pressure on WHY the polis chief is leaving.


Shango on June 30th, 2005 2:31 am
Watcher opened a window looking onto babylon at 2:29.
He holds the key to the ONLY door which opens the door to the lions den


Who else was reported to be leaving at this critical point in the investigation?
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #1125 on: August 03, 2008, 04:19:39 PM »

It also depends on one's definition of Babylonian.

Babylonian=Dutch
Babylonian=Casino owners

Arawaks=ALE
Arawaks=Reporters (per Caps)
Arawaks=Arubans

It can get confusing.   
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« Reply #1126 on: August 03, 2008, 04:21:35 PM »

If Simian makes his living on tourism in Aruba, then he could be as credible, but more likely to withold any details which would be damaging.......i.e. DirtyHand.......so, in the context posted earlier by somebody else:

quote:   "Shango=FBI playing cat and mouse with Mansur"

the scenerio makes alot of sense

Don’t want to interrupt the great discussions but I wanted to bring these posts forward mainly in regard to the FBI. Both Paulus and Joran allude to the FBI in their PVs.

Great to see you Truthseeker…always enjoyed your posts…FWIW…I agree with van der Straten. I also believe it he is Joran’s godfather. That came from Fox and Fox got a lot of things right early in this case.

Carry on….


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2733.340

Reply #351 on: March 28, 2008, 07:52:06 PM » JE
   
 Anyone have any ideas what the third act maybe?

59.   Name: Simian | E-mail: xx | IP: xx

The elder agreed to speak, but he he loves the boy too much. The knows the passages of the palace too well. So the Babylonians must make sure the check mate is iron-clad.Something rotten from The Hague will have to make the third act play out.Posted Jun 26, 10:52 PM | Edit Comment | Delete Comment | Edit Post “Natalee Holloway; Breaking Aruba News .... Croes Released ... Now Paul Van der Sloot” | View Post

This is mentioned in both simians and merians posts at a time DNA evidence is being examined or results of DNA investigation are comming in.

In Siminans post he is refering to (I believe) Dna results coming back from the hague (from the june 15th sloot house search.

In Merians post:

Merian Ernest Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:53 pm Post subject: Phidippides

The question is if there will be end to the journey? Her fate is no worse than the secret contained in Richard Drew marvel.Third acts have no upside.

Also DNA results of the duct tape and the blond hairs (Richard Drew was a guy working for the 3M company and he invented adhesive tape)

Also: any ideas who the "her" as in "her fate is no worse than the secret .... etc" is? This is a weird statement as the DNA results could not have been known to anyone at that date.

From SM frontpage july 21:

For the Duct tape and possibly other evidence to reach as fast as possible to the State Laboratory, … it was decided that the sealed evidence will be transported by the Head Prosecutor Mrs. Karin Jansen who boarded the flight to the Netherlands

Third act suggests a play (could be Hamlet "something rotten in the state of Denmark" or maybe just a conviction?)TIA


Reply #352 on: March 28, 2008, 08:58:14 PM » Buckeye

Mum had mentioned something about duct tape and a witness (as told in Juron's book).  I posted a reply on pg. 13 of the Lively.  Iwill repost but it might get screwed up.  This is from a June 20. 2005 post on the amigoe forum??? Same time frame

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #745 3/25
« Reply #241 on: Today at 04:33:09 PM » 

Quote from: MumInOhio on Today at 09:45:35 AM
Rob...you reminded me of a post I made in the Shango thread yesterday. Do you recall anything about this? The protected witness, I mean?...TIA

Reply #158 on: March 26, 2008, 08:42:52 AM » Quote  

Find something new every time I read that book translation...

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=1097.0

P332 Also, an FBI "protected witness", an American called "Mr X", meets Deepak in July 2005 in the Internet café wehre Deepak works. Deepak tells X: “I see what’s going on and I know much more. I’m certain that Natalee is no longer on the island.” He also says something that contradicts that: “When they find the duct-tape with Natalee’s hair on it, then I’ll go to jail", which is strange because they did find hair with duct tape but it wasn't Natalee's
Mum

I don't remember seeing that, in the book.  I did save a post from an old amigoe.com/forum.  Now I wonder if the duct tape did have evidence that got put in a "hidey hole".   

Posted by Carlton June 20, 2005

Beste mensen,

Van betrouwbare bronnen heb ik begrepen dat er op die tape de volgende dingen te vinden waren:

3 blonde haren (volgens DNA van Holloway)
7 zwarte haren(sluik haar, 2 verschillende eigenaren, eogenaren onbekend)
2 blonde haren (onbekend)
6 spermacellen (vooralsnog onbekend)
restanten van wat "lichaamsvocht" zou zijn geweest (bevestigd Holloway)
1 fragment roest (waarschijnlijk van een anker)
1 stukje vis
1 onderlegger met de text: "Ca....s & .har...s"
wat zand

Op basis hiervan denkt de politie de verdwijning spoedig te kunnen oplossen.

Google translation:

Dear people,

From reliable sources, I understand that in this tape the following things to be found were:

3 blonde hair (according DNA of Holloway)
7 black hair (sluik hair, 2 different owners, eogenaren unknown)
2 blonde hair (unknown)
6 sperm (currently unknown)
Remnants of what "body fluid" would have been (confirmed Holloway)
1 fragment rust (probably an anchor)
1 piece of fish
1 onderlegger with the text: "Ca .... s &. Har ... s"
What sand

On this basis the police believe the disappearance soon to be resolved.
http://www.amigoe.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=002050;p=29




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truthseeker2
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« Reply #1127 on: August 03, 2008, 04:23:08 PM »


I agree.  But Shango never comes out and says "Yes, Dirty Hand is Straten."  He only says that Babalu opened a window.  That could easily mean "You are getting warmer Babalu."   There are too many others that will dispute the fact that Babalu was merely trying to guess what Shango meant.  If Babalu had indeed told us who Dirty Hand was, why did Shango later say:

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:58 pm
Arawaks want to make cowboys happy
Babylonians want to maintain integrity of Great House
Gods of the cowboys know there was a game in the great house,
and so DirtyHand was discovered
But the sacrifice will be offered before dirty hand sings
He will return to babylon, broken but anonymous 


I believe Dirty Hand was discovered by The Hague and maybe the FBI.  Not by ALE because they already knew what his role was.  That is why the integrity of the Great House must be maintained now.  This would refelct on them now, especially if the Govenor General (appointed by the Quessn) had been looking the other way all this time.  They are letting him go right in the middle of the investigation.  Dirty Hand covered for all the Dutch on Aruba.  That was part of his 'job'.
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« Reply #1128 on: August 03, 2008, 04:27:37 PM »

Truth
There were several that left at a critical time.  We were just discussing that a few weeks ago in the main Natalee thread.  Mum will have those answers when she checks in.  She is a gold mine of reference for those like me.

I think even minor players left also...such as the bartender and Guido.  I agree that the person that Shango is talking about would have to be Straten.  He retired and went to wherever to continue his reign in law enforcement. There is just as much confirmation as there is contradiction here on this particular subject.  I won't argue with you, but there are many others that simply say it was not Straten.  It was Frans Deutekom.  I didn't know diddly about that guy until Caps arrived.  I think he said once that Deutekom was in the other car.  I know that there are many that are convinced that Ben Vocking fits this description because he left the island also. It is a matter of interpretation.  I will agree that Straten is confirmed by Shango for the time being.  Carry on, you are doing great.
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« Reply #1129 on: August 03, 2008, 04:33:40 PM »


Don’t want to interrupt the great discussions but I wanted to bring these posts forward mainly in regard to the FBI. Both Paulus and Joran allude to the FBI in their PVs.

Great to see you Truthseeker…always enjoyed your posts…FWIW…I agree with van der Straten. I also believe it he is Joran’s godfather. That came from Fox and Fox got a lot of things right early in this case.

Carry on….


http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2733.340

Reply #351 on: March 28, 2008, 07:52:06 PM » JE
   
 Anyone have any ideas what the third act maybe?

59.   Name: Simian | E-mail: xx | IP: xx

The elder agreed to speak, but he he loves the boy too much. The knows the passages of the palace too well. So the Babylonians must make sure the check mate is iron-clad.Something rotten from The Hague will have to make the third act play out.Posted Jun 26, 10:52 PM | Edit Comment | Delete Comment | Edit Post “Natalee Holloway; Breaking Aruba News .... Croes Released ... Now Paul Van der Sloot” | View Post





Thanks Mum.

The way I see this has to do with forming an overall opinion of Simian.  He made many references in his posts such as "lugubrious game" which refers to a painting by Dali and this painting used many sexual references to portray confusion.  Simian liked to present himself as "an educated individual".  So...with that in mind I liken his reference of the "third act" to have a slant toward the three steps (acts) of a magic act where a magician will make something disappear.  The third 'act' is to make the object reappear.  jmho.
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« Reply #1130 on: August 03, 2008, 04:38:25 PM »

Truth
There were several that left at a critical time.  We were just discussing that a few weeks ago in the main Natalee thread.  Mum will have those answers when she checks in.  She is a gold mine of reference for those like me.

I think even minor players left also...such as the bartender and Guido.  I agree that the person that Shango is talking about would have to be Straten.  He retired and went to wherever to continue his reign in law enforcement. There is just as much confirmation as there is contradiction here on this particular subject.  I won't argue with you, but there are many others that simply say it was not Straten.  It was Frans Deutekom.  I didn't know diddly about that guy until Caps arrived.  I think he said once that Deutekom was in the other car.  I know that there are many that are convinced that Ben Vocking fits this description because he left the island also. It is a matter of interpretation.  I will agree that Straten is confirmed by Shango for the time being.  Carry on, you are doing great.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 4:42 pm
Arawaks hold singing card from babylon
There is also a trio. One Babylonian. 2 Shivas.
Arawaks can’t let babylonian Card sing because hand holding it dirty too.


Frans Deutekom???
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« Reply #1131 on: August 03, 2008, 04:50:59 PM »

Truth
There were several that left at a critical time.  We were just discussing that a few weeks ago in the main Natalee thread.  Mum will have those answers when she checks in.  She is a gold mine of reference for those like me.

I think even minor players left also...such as the bartender and Guido.  I agree that the person that Shango is talking about would have to be Straten.  He retired and went to wherever to continue his reign in law enforcement. There is just as much confirmation as there is contradiction here on this particular subject.  I won't argue with you, but there are many others that simply say it was not Straten.  It was Frans Deutekom.  I didn't know diddly about that guy until Caps arrived.  I think he said once that Deutekom was in the other car.  I know that there are many that are convinced that Ben Vocking fits this description because he left the island also. It is a matter of interpretation.  I will agree that Straten is confirmed by Shango for the time being.  Carry on, you are doing great.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 4:42 pm
Arawaks hold singing card from babylon
There is also a trio. One Babylonian. 2 Shivas.
Arawaks can’t let babylonian Card sing because hand holding it dirty too.


Frans Deutekom???

I am just relaying info...don't shoot the messenger. LOL

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« Reply #1132 on: August 03, 2008, 04:54:37 PM »

Truth
There were several that left at a critical time.  We were just discussing that a few weeks ago in the main Natalee thread.  Mum will have those answers when she checks in.  She is a gold mine of reference for those like me.

I think even minor players left also...such as the bartender and Guido.  I agree that the person that Shango is talking about would have to be Straten.  He retired and went to wherever to continue his reign in law enforcement. There is just as much confirmation as there is contradiction here on this particular subject.  I won't argue with you, but there are many others that simply say it was not Straten.  It was Frans Deutekom.  I didn't know diddly about that guy until Caps arrived.  I think he said once that Deutekom was in the other car.  I know that there are many that are convinced that Ben Vocking fits this description because he left the island also. It is a matter of interpretation.  I will agree that Straten is confirmed by Shango for the time being.  Carry on, you are doing great.

Sorry Lala's...sun got to me today and will need to read back on the discussions!....Will check on it tomorrow as I have to leave in a little while!
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« Reply #1133 on: August 03, 2008, 05:02:48 PM »

Carrying on...

Simian does not yet respond to Shango.  Shango makes his next post:

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:14 pm
Simian, The Sumerians do not like the Babylonian intrusion.
The Babylonian card may be tossed from the table and crushed under Sumerian feet (or feat)….


No mention of Arawaks by either poster yet and I believe Shango uses Sumerians to refer to the native people on Aruba...basically the people that no longer have control of the island.  Simian has already used the term Babylonians.

Simian Says: June 25th, 2005 at 8:21 pm
The Simian knows the Babylonians. They need to plan the legal checkmate perfectly. They know
that the elder knows his way around the palace. All gates need to be shut.


Historically speaking the Babylonians conquered and ruled the Sumerians.  This is why I think the term Sumerians was used by Shango, but Simian never used that term at all.  Simian seemed to prefer the term Arawak as in the early indian tribes that settled on Aruba.  Either term would apply to those who were there first being overtaken, if you will, by another culture or group.

Around 1900 B.C. Semitic-speaking invaders from the Arabian Desert entered southern Mesopotamia and captured the city-state of Babylon. About 1790 B.C., led by their king, Hammurabi, they conquered the other city-states in the Tigris-Euphrates valley and formed the Babylonian Empire. The Babylonians adopted and built upon the prevailing Sumerian culture.

http://home.cfl.rr.com/crossland/AncientCivilizations/Middle_East_Civilizations/Babylonians/babylonians.html
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« Reply #1134 on: August 03, 2008, 05:03:11 PM »

Thanks Mum. I know you will find it all later.  I need to get off here for a bit too.  Keep going Truth, it has been a good day in here for a change.
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« Reply #1135 on: August 03, 2008, 05:04:16 PM »

Truth
There were several that left at a critical time.  We were just discussing that a few weeks ago in the main Natalee thread.  Mum will have those answers when she checks in.  She is a gold mine of reference for those like me.

I think even minor players left also...such as the bartender and Guido.  I agree that the person that Shango is talking about would have to be Straten.  He retired and went to wherever to continue his reign in law enforcement. There is just as much confirmation as there is contradiction here on this particular subject.  I won't argue with you, but there are many others that simply say it was not Straten.  It was Frans Deutekom.  I didn't know diddly about that guy until Caps arrived.  I think he said once that Deutekom was in the other car.  I know that there are many that are convinced that Ben Vocking fits this description because he left the island also. It is a matter of interpretation.  I will agree that Straten is confirmed by Shango for the time being.  Carry on, you are doing great.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 4:42 pm
Arawaks hold singing card from babylon
There is also a trio. One Babylonian. 2 Shivas.
Arawaks can’t let babylonian Card sing because hand holding it dirty too.


Frans Deutekom???

I am just relaying info...don't shoot the messenger. LOL



haha.  Would never shoot the messenger.  I know it is a 'sensitive' topic and hope that no one gets too offended.
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« Reply #1136 on: August 03, 2008, 05:11:26 PM »


Oh you are getting to the touchy part here...not very many of us can agree on who Dirty Hand is.  Without some agreement there can be no movement forward.  That has been one of the stumbling blocks to this whole thing.  If you go with Straten, then so many other theories are trampled on and that is when the war starts....keep talking. We may need to take each view one at a time and see what fits with Dirty Hand. Remember, Shango tells us that Dirty Hand was discovered.  Every time  I mention that fact it's glossed over for some reason.

Yes, I know.  But here is are the posts that clinch it for me:

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:28 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 4:00 am
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his 12:30 posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:12 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting
If the cowboys do not find the loot today, it will not be found

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:26 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting
Simian your Doppleganger is with us

Shango on June 27th, 2005 12:28 pm
Babalu finally opened a window with a view into the house of Babylon with his
12:30 AM posting

Shango on June 27th, 2005 9:44 pm
Babalu opened a window looking into babylon on his 12:31 A.M. Post
DirtyHand is alive

Shango on June 27th, 2005 9:48 pm
Babalu knew who dirty hand was at half past 12

drax on June 27th, 2005 10:57 pm
DirtyHand has walked through the maze:…is DirtyHand Poppa VDS?

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:01 pm
The Drax asks a question for which he already provided an answer.

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:04 pm
Babalu opened a window looking onto Babylon with his 12:30 A.M. post

drax on June 27th, 2005 11:08 pm
Shango says: The Drax asks a question for which he already provided an answer.
I don’t understand, Shango.

Babalú on June 27th, 2005 11:10 pm
He’s talking about Dirty Hands identity, please refer to my post of yesterday 12:30 AM. He is JVDS, and not Joran.

Lucy on June 27th, 2005 10:56 pm
Someone said last night that Dirty Hand was somebody in the police.

Shango on June 27th, 2005 11:13 pm
Lucy spoke at 10:56

watcher on June 30th, 2005 2:29 am
I think Subdude is on the right track about the media putting pressure on WHY the polis chief is leaving.


Shango on June 30th, 2005 2:31 am
Watcher opened a window looking onto babylon at 2:29.
He holds the key to the ONLY door which opens the door to the lions den


I agree.  But Shango never comes out and says "Yes, Dirty Hand is Straten."  He only says that Babalu opened a window.  That could easily mean "You are getting warmer Babalu."   There are too many others that will dispute the fact that Babalu was merely trying to guess what Shango meant.  If Babalu had indeed told us who Dirty Hand was, why did Shango later say:

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 5:58 pm
Arawaks want to make cowboys happy
Babylonians want to maintain integrity of Great House
Gods of the cowboys know there was a game in the great house,
and so DirtyHand was discovered
But the sacrifice will be offered before dirty hand sings
He will return to babylon, broken but anonymous 



the game pg 4
http://www.ca11.uscourts.gov/opinions/ops/200214306.pdf
(by Gods of the Cowboys)

DirtyHand is link to polis-sacrifice needed to spare polis, teepees
Arawaks often go to play in the small houses of babylon with offspring of the elders

all in there: rules, polis, game, players, etc, etc
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« Reply #1137 on: August 03, 2008, 05:12:09 PM »

Shango has now made three posts directed at Simian, with no response.  His fourth post is a question:

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 3:18 pm
Simian, why was the key from the Babylons Palace not used to open the Sumerians Door ?
They have become famished and Eden is beckoning….


Simian has been posting about a package from the Hague.  Shango is baiting Simian because he seems to know that nothing will be revealed about evidence from the Hague.  He implies that this lack of information from the 'package' Simian tells everyone will come is now hurting the locals on Aruba.  I believe Shango uses Eden as a reference to the "Garden of Paradise"...One Happy Island.  This whole thing has been bad for the island and Simian is not helping matters.
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« Reply #1138 on: August 03, 2008, 05:13:24 PM »

Truth
There were several that left at a critical time.  We were just discussing that a few weeks ago in the main Natalee thread.  Mum will have those answers when she checks in.  She is a gold mine of reference for those like me.

I think even minor players left also...such as the bartender and Guido.  I agree that the person that Shango is talking about would have to be Straten.  He retired and went to wherever to continue his reign in law enforcement. There is just as much confirmation as there is contradiction here on this particular subject.  I won't argue with you, but there are many others that simply say it was not Straten.  It was Frans Deutekom.  I didn't know diddly about that guy until Caps arrived.  I think he said once that Deutekom was in the other car.  I know that there are many that are convinced that Ben Vocking fits this description because he left the island also. It is a matter of interpretation.  I will agree that Straten is confirmed by Shango for the time being.  Carry on, you are doing great.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 4:42 pm
Arawaks hold singing card from babylon
There is also a trio. One Babylonian. 2 Shivas.
Arawaks can’t let babylonian Card sing because hand holding it dirty too.


Frans Deutekom???

I am just relaying info...don't shoot the messenger. LOL



haha.  Would never shoot the messenger.  I know it is a 'sensitive' topic and hope that no one gets too offended.


Arawaks often go to play in small houses of babylon with offspring of the elders
sacrifice needed to spare polis, teepees (marriages)
sacrifice will be made before DirtyHand sings

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« Reply #1139 on: August 03, 2008, 05:19:01 PM »

Arawaks often go to play in small houses of babylon with offspring of the elders=

dirty hand

Babalu's "official corps".......DirtyHand is link, has long reach.....to "long arm"
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