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Author Topic: SHANGO/SIMIAN - who are they and what did they know? #4  (Read 634775 times)
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truthseeker2
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« Reply #1320 on: August 09, 2008, 09:19:25 PM »

Ts2:

sorry 'bout that post-this was left out-

Do you believe that Beth was the first to mention Lorenzo on Greta? Is this your interpretation of my post?

My interpretation of your post is that you believe the discussions about Lorenzo moved into high gear after Beth mentioned him on Greta's show.  During that time Beth was receiving a lot of B/S information from people on Aruba.  By the time the posts from Simian and Shango hit the internet the cover up was in full swing with mis-informers posting rampantly all over the place. 

I just don't see anything linking Joran to Lorenzo other than a rumor that Lorenzo was Paulus illegit son.  As far as I know that has never been proven by anyone.


your interpretation is not correct.......the statement was long after the discussion had begun, and the response from officials in Aruba was terse. After all of her statements using words like "drugged" and "raped" why officials in Aruba would make comments to the effect "she's hindering the investigation" when she used the word "Lorenzo" was quite strange-particularly given Dennis Jacobs remark that he had nothing to do with the investigation.

Do you find this at all peculiar???

Whatever dude.  I won't waste my time chasing Lorenzo anymore.  Or reading disjointed posts.
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Poochy
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« Reply #1321 on: August 09, 2008, 10:40:01 PM »

I found some old notes - and am posting them here for you all to read:

"... Do you know Lorenzo o's last name?  I knew about Claudia, and how the HI guy transfered from Jamaica to Aruba, then out of Aruba - wonder where he went next? I didn't know Claudia mentioned she wanted to see the "great house."

So there was a game in the great house - YA KNOW, I ALWAYS FELT SOME OF THOSE ONLINE GAMES WERE LITERALLY PLAYED IN REAL LIFE. MAYBE THERE WAS SOME SORT OF DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS GAME OR LIKE THAT IN TODAY'S TERMS (CANNIB.) THAT IS PLAYED IN THE GREAT HOUSE OR A HOUSE LIKE IT IN ARUBA. (just tossin' it out there!)   Here's also something interesting..for what it's worth! that dream i had the other night - after I dropped my kid off at the bus stop I detoured around to find that house - and it sits on a street called South Hill Road. The side street is Highland Avenue, but then the street turns into Washington Ave, which is parallel to Lincoln Ave, parallel to McKinley! (maybe I had masons prez's on my mind)  But the house next door where my hubby pulled into the driveway (in my dream) was the only house ont he block decorated with halloweenie stuff - front yard had tons of gravestones, ghosts flying all over (sheets) etc. found it ironic.... 

"xxxxx" wrote:
The Lorenzo whose last name began with "O"
worked in food service both in Jamaica and Aruba
Believe he was there when Claudia went missing.

Working in the area of The Great House near Kingston 
I believe that Claudia went to this place as she had mentioned wanting to.

The Great House was owned by notorious VooDoo Queen
Case is remarkably similar to Natalee's


"zzzz wrote"...
i woke up thinking jeffry dahmer may have had a 'david' who got out alive - but googled and that wasn't the case. interesting - perhasp this is the lorenzo - maybe all he got was a cut off hand...and was then moved off the island. i recall googling and this guy was in jamaica when the reporter went missing.  there was also a 'david' who befriended a woman and her young kid at the holiday inn - only he came back alive from a jet ski incident - they never found the boy....and they thruew wreaths into the water like they did to natalee - before ever searching for the kids body. always wondered if this was the kid they found in the dunes - his body parts.

"xxxx wrote xxx":
Lorenzo David Wever
only David left the den alive?

"zzz wrote"
found another 'lorenzo' - worth checking out. a while ago i recall googling this guy and found he was in jamaica - when that lady reporter went missing....(I think it was him.)  http://bfnbackup.16.forumer.com/a/hiram-vrolijk-friend-of-joran_post77-30.html  Scorpio38-I Sting- 05-27-2006
Guido Wever, is the punk kid arrested, and a blackjack dealer at the Excelsior Casino. Lorenzo David Wever, is the long gone Casino Manager, who departed Aruba within days of Natalee going missing, as did, Michael Posner, owner of the HI and the Excelsior Casino, and Paul "Mr. Pink" Brough, who allegedly is a brothel and porn operator in the Caribbean region.
 isn't this guy 'pantyboy'?   del sol - sunworship...'mansion' - interesting choice of words. WHERE IS Tierra Del Sol Mansion  IS IT A 'WHITE HOUSE'?? opus2- 05-28-2006Re: Hiram Vrolijk friend of Joran
does anyone know Hiram Vrolijk? he is pictured in the Venzeula picture with Joran...I found a Vrolijk that works at Setar (the place CCroes works)...also I found Hiram at his birthday party at "Tierra Del Sol Mansion"...does anyone know of this mansion? is it in Aruba? who owns it? http://www.guiafashion.com/fashion/internacional/11-06-05 happybirthhiram/index.htm http://www.consumer.att.com/global/english/consumer_information/ cc_aruba.html These links do not open for me...I'd be interested in a photo of HIRAM... Epecially at this BDay Party at a Tierra del Sol Mansion. TIA! Scorpio: Thanks for the info about Lorenzo David Wever/Casino Mgr.   who is Johan Stellingwerf??? Rammstein68- 05-28-2006
You Americans can better help find this Johan Stellingwerf, a real bad guy, instead of going crazy on an innocent boy. first of all, although Joran is innocent until proven other wise does not make him innocent. He has made himself look very suspicious by lying on numerous occasions. secondly, if the dutch police and dutch public aren't able to find Johan Stellingwerf (and yes, I know it is not usual for dutch suspects to be fully named and identified in the press but in this case that was done due to the dangerous nature of this individual and the need to find him ASAP) then the american public or police will be equally unable. let's get back to the topic please, and if either you want to discuss Johan Stellingwerf you can open a thread in the "Off Topic section".
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truthseeker2
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« Reply #1322 on: August 09, 2008, 11:03:24 PM »

Do you know if anyone was ever able to detemine if there was a Lorenzo David Wever?
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texasmom
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #1323 on: August 09, 2008, 11:45:26 PM »

Do you know if anyone was ever able to detemine if there was a Lorenzo David Wever?

I know I probably have some information saved about him, finding it is the problem....
this is a link where he was discussed before.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2733.1140
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
MumInOhio
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« Reply #1324 on: August 10, 2008, 07:08:57 AM »

OK. OK. Lorenzo was a red herring.  I won't even mention what Beth told me at a book signing concerning Lorenzo since she is the one that brought it up first.  I don't care what anyone thinks, Lorenzo was the first person mentioned in this mess.  He was on the locals radar from the beginning because of his reputation.  He had wild parties that involved drugs and porn videos.  He was known by that stuff.  That is why he was mentioned...he seemed likely to be the person that would "know" something or be in a position to help Joran.  He was rumored to be the "supplier" of all things on the island.  He used others to sell his wares and keep him out of the loop.  His place was a fortress.  He was not a celebrity so why did he need security guards and such?  Even Simian probably played a gig at some of his parties. Everyone thought Lorenzo was a bad guy. 

A few things we need to remember about Lorenzo and then I will let it go.

1. He lived in an area that it is reported that a phone call originated from Joran's cell phone the next morning around 6 AM.  Don't anyone ask me for the info, I have no idea how to find it...it's in the Natalee threads and not in Shango.

2. He has been rumored and widely so, to be Paulus relative. This was from several in Aruba. Not just Bondia/Glenda/Julia.

3. He was arrested for drug possession later on and was out in no time flat.  A little talk with the judge and it was over. 

4. He was questioned at least once on the Dr. Phils documents, but I have seen places where others have found him reported to have been questioned from the beginning.  Just because Jacobs says he's not involved does not make it so in my book.  Jacobs was as dirty a hand as you can get in all this.

That's all I am saying on Lorenzo any more.  Let's move on.



I won't even mention what Beth told me at a book signing concerning Lorenzo since she is the one that brought it up first.

Pretty Please Lala's...
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MumInOhio
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« Reply #1325 on: August 10, 2008, 07:11:10 AM »

Do you know if anyone was ever able to detemine if there was a Lorenzo David Wever?


Truthseeker…I recall finding an obit for this guy…he died the day before Jacobs interviewed Audreyselda Wever?  There is further on him somewhere in Shango1…will see if I can find it later…

Quote…
 Jacobus Lorenzo ‘David’ Wever that died at age 69, jackb said he left for Holland, may have been the manager at the HI casino

Name: Audreyselda Wever
Date: 16 March 2006/11:10
Pages: 2
Writer/initiator: Dennis Jacobs
Description: witness statement
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MumInOhio
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« Reply #1326 on: August 10, 2008, 08:03:37 AM »

I’m not ready to give Lorenzo a free pass either…My path to Freddy made sense…Lala’s, Poochy and COLOMBO’s path to Lorenzo makes sense…

Guido was questioned on 6/3, or so they say. Also on 6/7 and 6/8. He went to Holland, but we have been told that some-one else left for Holland immediately after Natalee disappeared. I thought I read that Lorenzo went, anyone? Also David Wever and Max Arendz.
"a" Lorenzo, not "the" Lorenzo
if you believe Titodidshenotaskforit Lacle

he was doing a Q/A session at SM
and when asked about Lorenzo/meaning LvR
he came off w/ Lorenzo Wever

who, after some research, turned into Guido Wever

 Rolling Eyes

When were the first mentions of Lorenzo and his blue van? Was it SM or somewhere else?  FP or forum? TIA
SM was my only hangout

IIRC, mentioned in the FP before the forum
cuz the FP existed before forum was created:
blue van/crazy painted van


Darn need to choose a path and stick with it???
what? and make the rest of us look bad? LOL


also this, to GinoX from a poster
at the aruba speed shop forum/early june 2005
and translated from papi

aruba speed shop owner/Maxito Arendsz
speed shop forum webmaster/Andry Lopez aka Peeps
(who brought us LvR-in-crazy-painted-van photo)

I know you meant L and his deceased father of VW. I am straight to the point.
 
You mean the american chick that was seen holding hands with Lorenzo? Where did this come from?

Was it not the story that she went out and got into a car with a dutchboy and 2 surinamese?

Now I don't now if I am getting paranoid or crazy but the beginning of last week my neighbor told me they have detained Lorenzo and he was involved in the case. I was shocked when they said a dutch person was involved and this makes me think it is him.

Couple of days later they released the name of Joran then I thought oh, it is not Lorenzo who I thought initially.

What puzzled me was when I read a couple of days ago that they searched Joran's at his house.

But this house looks a lot like Lorenzo's house in Jaraweg/Sav.


Then I thought what is happening? Am I paranoid or what?

What is the connection of Lorenzo and Joran in this case?

And if it is so, why is Lorenzo's name not mentioned in the media?

And what made me put this post on GinoX?

Gino could you or someone else clear this thing up please!





Finngirl…

There is another post either on the FP or at RWV that says this same thing?  It is referring to the arrest/non arrest of June 11th. The poster said that it was the same house as one of the other suspects was arrested at.

I am reading 6/11 FP now and if I don’t see it there I will check at RWV. Remember the rumors that Joran was staying at Lorenzo’s?…picked up for school on the way to his house?
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« Reply #1327 on: August 10, 2008, 09:03:16 AM »

I’m not ready to give Lorenzo a free pass either…My path to Freddy made sense…Lala’s, Poochy and COLOMBO’s path to Lorenzo makes sense…

Guido was questioned on 6/3, or so they say. Also on 6/7 and 6/8. He went to Holland, but we have been told that some-one else left for Holland immediately after Natalee disappeared. I thought I read that Lorenzo went, anyone? Also David Wever and Max Arendz.
"a" Lorenzo, not "the" Lorenzo
if you believe Titodidshenotaskforit Lacle

he was doing a Q/A session at SM
and when asked about Lorenzo/meaning LvR
he came off w/ Lorenzo Wever

who, after some research, turned into Guido Wever

 Rolling Eyes

When were the first mentions of Lorenzo and his blue van? Was it SM or somewhere else?  FP or forum? TIA
SM was my only hangout

IIRC, mentioned in the FP before the forum
cuz the FP existed before forum was created:
blue van/crazy painted van


Darn need to choose a path and stick with it???
what? and make the rest of us look bad? LOL


also this, to GinoX from a poster
at the aruba speed shop forum/early june 2005
and translated from papi

aruba speed shop owner/Maxito Arendsz
speed shop forum webmaster/Andry Lopez aka Peeps
(who brought us LvR-in-crazy-painted-van photo)

I know you meant L and his deceased father of VW. I am straight to the point.
 
You mean the american chick that was seen holding hands with Lorenzo? Where did this come from?

Was it not the story that she went out and got into a car with a dutchboy and 2 surinamese?

Now I don't now if I am getting paranoid or crazy but the beginning of last week my neighbor told me they have detained Lorenzo and he was involved in the case. I was shocked when they said a dutch person was involved and this makes me think it is him.

Couple of days later they released the name of Joran then I thought oh, it is not Lorenzo who I thought initially.

What puzzled me was when I read a couple of days ago that they searched Joran's at his house.

But this house looks a lot like Lorenzo's house in Jaraweg/Sav.


Then I thought what is happening? Am I paranoid or what?

What is the connection of Lorenzo and Joran in this case?

And if it is so, why is Lorenzo's name not mentioned in the media?

And what made me put this post on GinoX?

Gino could you or someone else clear this thing up please!





Finngirl…

There is another post either on the FP or at RWV that says this same thing?  It is referring to the arrest/non arrest of June 11th. The poster said that it was the same house as one of the other suspects was arrested at.

I am reading 6/11 FP now and if I don’t see it there I will check at RWV. Remember the rumors that Joran was staying at Lorenzo’s?…picked up for school on the way to his house?




Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 9:48 pm
The boy told the Hindus that he didn’t need their help anymore. This was in the small hours.
The confrontation was brutal.  So who heeded his call? Who switched places?
People…the bloodied, swollen tongue. The boy’s fear runs deep.
They accuse him to be Bifrons.


Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:04 pm
Are the children of the elders there, or did they flee to Babylon?
DirtyHand knows, this is his Power
there will be 46 sacrifices
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Lala'sMom
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« Reply #1328 on: August 10, 2008, 10:55:11 AM »

OK. OK. Lorenzo was a red herring.  I won't even mention what Beth told me at a book signing concerning Lorenzo since she is the one that brought it up first.  I don't care what anyone thinks, Lorenzo was the first person mentioned in this mess.  He was on the locals radar from the beginning because of his reputation.  He had wild parties that involved drugs and porn videos.  He was known by that stuff.  That is why he was mentioned...he seemed likely to be the person that would "know" something or be in a position to help Joran.  He was rumored to be the "supplier" of all things on the island.  He used others to sell his wares and keep him out of the loop.  His place was a fortress.  He was not a celebrity so why did he need security guards and such?  Even Simian probably played a gig at some of his parties. Everyone thought Lorenzo was a bad guy. 

A few things we need to remember about Lorenzo and then I will let it go.

1. He lived in an area that it is reported that a phone call originated from Joran's cell phone the next morning around 6 AM.  Don't anyone ask me for the info, I have no idea how to find it...it's in the Natalee threads and not in Shango.

2. He has been rumored and widely so, to be Paulus relative. This was from several in Aruba. Not just Bondia/Glenda/Julia.

3. He was arrested for drug possession later on and was out in no time flat.  A little talk with the judge and it was over. 

4. He was questioned at least once on the Dr. Phils documents, but I have seen places where others have found him reported to have been questioned from the beginning.  Just because Jacobs says he's not involved does not make it so in my book.  Jacobs was as dirty a hand as you can get in all this.

That's all I am saying on Lorenzo any more.  Let's move on.



I won't even mention what Beth told me at a book signing concerning Lorenzo since she is the one that brought it up first.

Pretty Please Lala's...

Let's just say he was on everyone's radar from the beginning...for supplying drugs to the other lower minions to sell or use for their pleasure.  He was the first person that was mentioned as the place that Joran would take someone to a party.  The FP posters were not the first persons to think about Lorenzo and his being involved...it was ALE.  That is all I am saying.
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« Reply #1329 on: August 10, 2008, 12:30:28 PM »

"Rumors are that Paulus van der Sloot before he was married to
Anita, had an affair with Van Rijn's mother and the result
was Lorenzo van Rijjn.

Kermit's NOTE: THAT WAS CONFIRMED BY JOSSY


Another Aruban blogger from another site wrote that some of Natalee's
belongings were found at Van Rijn's house."
http://coffeepotghost.com/NATALEE_HOLLOWAY_CASE_LORENZO_LARRY_VAN_RIJN.html



Lorenezo Van Rijn was brought in for questioning and owns a van.
Source: http://www.majorwager.com/fusetalk/messageview.cfm?
catid=22&threadid=133972&FTVAR_MSGDBTABLE=&STARTPAGE=3



LORENZO van Riijn:
http://photo.tickle.com/image/2/4/6/P7/2462781P7063382009.jpg
http://photos17.flickr.com/19750689_d40429047b_0.jpg (it has been removed)



Van Rijn Lorenzo and Max Arendzs were detained and questioned on Friday
Max Arrends gave alibi for Lorenzo:
http://forums.go.com/abc/thread?threadID=454720&forumStart=0

Lorenzo Van Rijn's country house is in Seroe Alejandro
van Rijks(1981) fathers(r.i.p.) was the owner of VW dealership. he comitted suicide a couple of yrs ago.. Rumours say his wife killed him and pretended it was a suicide. God forgive me if I heard wrong info.
Huge house in Savaneta, on main road to San Nicolaas.
Jaraweg is in San Nicolaas area.


kermits NOTE: SAN NICOLAAS IS WHERE THE SECURITY GUARDS LIVED AND ALSO WHERE THE FIRST SEARCHES WERE DONE
BY JUDY HASSELL - ARUBA POLIS



Ge0rge
In the early hours of May 31 when Natalee's parents, friends, Charles C. and some police men went over to the VDS home at about 3 a.m.... would they have noticed this monkey? In the middle of the night? Making lots of noice? Or not?NO.
Was Lorenzo, Max.. seen on the tape of the surveillance camera of the casino at the Holiday Inn, talking to Natalee?Unconfirmed reports have it that she had a dinner with Lorenzo on May 27 or/and 29.
LovelyPigeon
Here's some of what BHT said to Greta, from transcript of show that aired June 15 http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159779,00.html



Per AmericaninAruba:
The Lorenzo guy who was questioned yesterday is known for having
underground parties at one of his houses. The house is rather isolated
and surrounded by lots of brush & cactus.
Supposedly one of them was painted really crazy.



“Island Hopper
“Rumors have it that…Van Rijn’s mother had an affair with Paul Van Der Sloot (before he was married to his current wife) and the result was Lorenzo Van Rijn (23). - no I’m not making this up. Lorenzo is close friends with Joran (his half brother?) Natalee was being kept at Van Rijn’s house and is still alive. Police found some of Natalee’s belongings at Van Rijn’s house, but she has been moved to another house..” found on another site


Checkme wrote above: new girl, you know, small society, extended families, no secrets, family knows everything. this guy has a bad profile, father into drugs, himself dealing, driving expensive cars, crashing them, not working, father killing himself because of a drug/alcohol induced depression. in short, no solid upbringing, wrong connections, careless, living above the law. somehow not getting caught. Bad boy waiting on the wall to hit him?



new girl Says:
June 29th, 2005 at 12:23 am

I also think it is POSSIBLE that there was a setup of sorts and Lorenzo actually left his house to meet up with Joran at the beach somewhere, hence the lack of witnesses to whatever happened to Natalee. However, Shango was indicating that the XTC “maze” music thing was the atmosphere, hence his clue that “Babylonians don’t make sandcastles” i.e. they don’t mess around in the sand. Especially when they have privacy available and mean to cause harm to someone.


subdude Says:
June 29th, 2005 at 12:34 am

newgirl: Shango seemed to suggest that police chief had dirty hands and new about these raves and what went on.

Police chief complicit in drug trade is not much of a stretch. Aruba is small and a “trampoline” for drug trade. Would not be unusual for police to know the flow.

To be clear, I am not knocking Aruba — same thing goes on in US, right here in Miami. Not necessarily police chief, but small number of cops are dirty — that is reality.


A dirty cop would not point the finger at the dealer who could expose him. He would lead investigation away from rave at drug dealer’s house.

new girl Says:
June 29th, 2005 at 12:35 am
Subdude, back to Shango’s clues:

DirtyHand the polis chief has been to the maze and walks through all houses. INCLUDING this one. But he does not go there to seek pleasures.

So why does he go? To collect his $$ for allowing these raves to go on and on while everyone else’s are busted? Or is it more sinister? Does it involve drug trade or something sexually inappropriate?

Shango also suggested that the children of “Babylonian” government officials / important people hang out at these rave parties. Why don’t they come forward?

Maybe they are scared that if Lorenzo is crazy and murders dogs and gang-rapes and kills innocent tourists, he might hurt them too. Especially if the police are somehow complicit in this.

And what of their parents, the ruling Dutch officials? Are they also complicit in some way? Is this a house of cards the kids don’t want to bring down?


clevfan
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06/23/2005 9:51 PM    
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It is widely suspected on the island that the girl was kidnapped, it is believed that others are involved in this, namely the son (Lorenzo Van Rijn) of a VW auto dealer that hung himself a couple yrs ago. Apparently the son is heavily into the drug trade and other things as well and is quite wealthy but kinda off his rocker, he's feared by many on the island due to the fact that so many find him so sinister. His home is one of the only homes on the island which has a basement and the rumors are flying that he connects to Natalee's disappearance.


clevfan
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07/03/2005 0:30 AM    
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these are suspect sites:

www.mrpinkproductions.com

www.guide2paradise.com


both are run by a guy orginally from michigan by the name of paul brough. he is good friends with lorenzo van rijn

old sites are: www.getlegalhookers.com and www.metronightlife.com



arubagirl wrote:
I know that right now I'm being an information tease, but it's just ridiculous that I'm afraid that I'm going to be howled out of the message board.
Deep sigh Here goes:
According to neighbours of van Rijn's mom, this lady had an affair with v/d Sloot before he was married to his current wife, and the result was Lorenzo van Rijn. Natalee was held at Lorenzo's house (who lives alone), since he has a basement (not many houses here have a basement). Natalee has been moved from house to house belonging to those that are in the plan (don't know what plan that is). They are afraid to kill her what with everybody focusing on the case.
Look, I KNOW. I KNOW. It's sounds to utterly fantastic and ridiculous. Please don't kill me, troll me, flame me. Not for this. I WANT it to be true, that she is still alive.
An Aruban blogger from another site wrote that some of Natalee's belongings were found at Van Rijn's house...
I've also seen it posted by Claire on 6/19 3:28pm on RWV



omega
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 9:02 pm    Post subject:    Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote
Riehl World View: Fourth Man
Lorenzo is the son of the deceased VW car dealer, seems to be very much related to ... Financial Bank on Aruba is represented by the law-firm Croes & Wever...
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/06/fourth_man.html - 92k -


IamTito wrote:
Lorenzo Wever  was sent to Holland soon after the event.. he was a casino person.. his father currently leads a political party on the island..


erin_go_bragh:
Tito, are you aware of any Lorenzo’s involving the case? There is an alleged Lorenzo from Holland (now lives in Aruba) that might have eaten dinner with Natalee during her trip to Aruba. Allegedly, he's around 27 and might have something to do with drugs...

TITO: HE LEFT FOR HOLLAND.. IF HIS NAME IS WEVER, THAT IS..

As far as Lorenzo... dont have a picture

as far as the misleading theory.. hmmmm
IamTito




IamTito
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 9:17 pm    Post subject:    Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote
Lorenzo Wever was sent to Holland soon after the event.. he was a casino person.. his father currently leads a political party on the island..







It has been rumored that there is a cell phone record from 6:20AM the morning Natalee went missing from Steve Croes to Joran.


kermit NOTE: TITO SAID LORENZO WAS SENT to Holland
Kermit NOTE: that area Santa Lucia is where Steve Croes lives and ALSO DAIRO JARISON (not sure if that is the correct spelling and on on lazy sunday time.




Compananzi
Monkey Junkey
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2005 1:04 am

Local Casino Dealer mysteriously skipped town to Holland...Interrogation also occurring in Holland in the Natalee case.

ORANJESTAD: Information has been circulating for a couple of days that a local Casino Dealer, male, who was working in the one of the Highrise Hotel Casino, right after the dissapearanc eof Natalee, skipped town and went to Holland.

After the Dealer went on his flight, rumors started that this young man also knows the 3 suspects, Joran van der Sloot and also know the bros. Deepak, and Satish Kalpoe.

This important detail, clearly has reached the ears of the local authorities, about the sudden trip of this Dealer, whose in Holland currently.


Sources indicate, and new information that Diario has made available points to the Dealer in question, whose trip went to Holland, was interrogated on more then 2 occasions by Aruban and Dutch authorities relating to the Natalee case.

It appears that the Dealer W confirms that he knows Joran, but we could not determine if during the interrogation if he brought forward that he knows the bros. Kapoes or not.

Up to now in this 2 months long Natalee case, information are still circulating that this Dealer in question might know something about this case

To prevent rumors, Diario has confirmation from the local authorities, whose during the interrogation also were mentioning the high tailing of this dealer., which they were able to get Dutch counterparts to interrogate this youth with Initials W, whilst he was in Holland. All details of this interrogation will be sent back to Aruba.
_________________
Various wever info:

Aliansa - (Aliansa Democratico Arubano)
Aruban Democratic Alliance

Party color: Purple Description and meaning of the Logo: - Ideology: Founded: May 19, 2001
Current data of the Party: Party leader - Wever; Robert F. Chairman - Wever; Ricardo R. Treasurer - Janga; Raymundo Secretary - Werleman; Eugenia I. Members of committee - - Angela; Karen - van de Linden; Olivia URL - http://www.aliansaaruba.org/ History & Other data: click here to see the statute. (Dutch) Further updates soon! Participation in Elections: Date of Election: September 23, 2005 Party leader - Wever; Robert Frederick
Date of Election: September 28, 2001 Party leader conducting campaign - Wever; Robert Frederick
Acquired seats in the Staten of Aruba - 0 Cabinet - Oduber III Period - 2001 - present
http://www.aliansaaruba.org/


6/16/05-----Lorenzo Van Rijn was brought in by Aruban police for questioning but was not held. According to Tito, he was considered a possible suspect at that time.
6/16/05-----Max Arendsz was brought in by Aruban police for questioning. It has been stated that he was the “alibi” for LVR.


Jun 29, 2005 1:09 PM

My little spunky monkey... yes, I concur, I too, had the bestest time with you at Warped! From jammin' out together with Brittnie, Dutch & Lorenzo, to seein' Sammy Haggar/Puck at Bennegins, to posin' like a Victoria's Secret model for you & Dutch, to my Touretts gettin' the best of me... all in a Tuesday's fun! Love ya girl! Talk to you later on!
http://www.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=7892828&Mytoken=20050203010636



*******, I personally know Lorenzo very well and since he (to my knowledge) isn't guilty or plays a part in the NH case I'd rather refrain from giving out personal info.

What is known (was in the papers), the police (way in the beginning) got an anonimous tip by phone, and went (without a searchwarrant and were allowed)to search his house and question him. Nothing was found, he also had an alibi and that settled it.
Him being PdvS son is a rumour that started during the NH case. I think because Lorenzo's dad's name was Paul too, they are both Dutch etc. that rumour started. But there is no truth to it.

More I can't tell you about him. Lorenzo is a guy who luckily does not hang out on the Internet (so he will not read some of the ludicrous things posted about him) and has no pictures online. Non of the pictures you've seen online claiming to be him, is him.

Posted by: Dolores | Aug 31, 2005 9:33:45 AM
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/08/natalee_hollowa_75.html




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MumInOhio
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« Reply #1330 on: August 10, 2008, 12:59:38 PM »

Thanks Kermit...According to Joran's book he was transferred from Noord to KIA on 6/20. Was Jacobs at Noord? Is this where most of the witnesses were questioned?
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #1331 on: August 10, 2008, 02:11:23 PM »

http://www.mementomori.net/06069.html
Jacobus Lorenzo Wever Obit

I thought he was part of the Croes Wever Tchong Law Office...if I saved that information I can't find it...and it's no longer on the website.
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #1332 on: August 10, 2008, 02:23:18 PM »

About Beth's Book signing...and the Lorenzo question.  I was looking for something else this morning and ended up there....

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2269.160
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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« Reply #1333 on: August 10, 2008, 04:02:10 PM »

http://www.mementomori.net/06069.html
Jacobus Lorenzo Wever Obit

I thought he was part of the Croes Wever Tchong Law Office...if I saved that information I can't find it...and it's no longer on the website.

Thanks Texasmom for both links...It is still there...

Rudolf M. Wever
 
Aruba, * January 24, 1943 - † Aruba, February 7, 2007

http://www.lawyersaruba.com/modules/sections/index.php?op=viewarticle&artid=11

I don't have any more on the other one in my notes or I just can't find it either. Not sure where I got the day before from, but will try and find the original post on him, as I thought I posted before on him. I remember seeing the "David" in his name...need to keep everything I guess...call name as I think Caps refers to it.
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« Reply #1334 on: August 10, 2008, 04:11:24 PM »

http://www.mementomori.net/06069.html
Jacobus Lorenzo Wever Obit

I thought he was part of the Croes Wever Tchong Law Office...if I saved that information I can't find it...and it's no longer on the website.

STICHTING DERDENGELDEN CROES WEVER TCHONG 
 
Business address SEROE PITA 22, PARADERA 
Legal form  FOUNDATION 
Name of the STICHTING DERDENGELDEN CROES WEVER TCHONG 
company/foundation/association:
Statutory seat  ARUBA 
Date of 20 DECEMBER 2006 
incorporation/commencement:
     
   
BOARD MEMBERS/AUTHORIZED PERSONS  
 
CROES, HENDRIK SEFERINO
Residing in  SEROE PITA 22, PARADERA, ARUBA 
Born in  ARUBA on 8 JANUARY 1942 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  PRESIDENT 
Effective  20 DECEMBER 2006 
Authority  FULL 
   
WEVER, RUDOLF MARCOLINO
Residing in  SPAANS LAGOENWEG 21, SAVANETA, ARUBA 
Born in  ARUBA on 24 JANUARY 1943 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  SECRETARY 
Effective  20 DECEMBER 2006 
Authority  FULL 
   
TCHONG, PETRUS JOANNES
Residing in  BYRONSTRAAT 13, ORANJESTAD, ARUBA 
Born in  ARUBA on 26 DECEMBER 1944 
Nationality  DUTCH 
Position  TREASURER 
Effective  20 DECEMBER 2006 
Authority  FULL 
   
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« Reply #1335 on: August 10, 2008, 05:01:18 PM »

Since some have implied that I have changed my story about Lorenzo...please note that what I have said about Lorenzo being the drug dealer is the same as I said when this post was made.  This is something I have said all along.  Lorenzo was a curious character that is my favorite subject but brings out the wolves on any given day to defend him when he is accused of being the drug supplier and famous party guy. I have yet to understand that.  Also it would be wise to keep in mind that I was told several things at that book signing that I was asked to keep to myself.  One of which was about Natalee and my own daughter.  So for everyone that has told everyone else I have changed my story...thanks TM for posting that. I appreciate it. So, if everyone reads more into what I said and thinks whatever that is fine with me. Our one and only Bondia avoided the subject as well.  She did however jump at the chance to get a photo of Vadir van Loon...that is same person that Beth talks about in her book.  The one Jacobs didn't seem to want anything to do with. Everyone that could be named was dragged through the dirt in Aruba except Lorenzo. Yet, he was arrested for growing marijuana on his property and walks away free and clear.  What kind of leverage is that?  Was Lorenzo working undercover for someone?   Was that why Babalu said "he could not be touched"?  I will maintain from things I have been told by those close to this case that Lorenzo was the "pimps" big time dealer. 




Lala'sMom

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #687 10/22 -
« Reply #166 on: October 23, 2007, 10:57:24 AM »
   
Shortly after, Beth began signing books so everyone got in line to wait.  I was on a mission to get a book signed for a very special person.  So I walked to the back of the line and waited.  I did not see any monkeys, but I am sure SB was in the crowd.  I do remember several people that were in front of me that could have been SB. I saw Charlierat sitting in a chair near the front. I knew it was him immediately, but I just kept quiet, there were a lot of people there. I did take his photo as I was standing in line.  I waited patiently to get to the front and as I walked up to Beth I told her I was Lala'smom from Sacred Monkeys.  She smiled really big. I mentioned the name of the person I was getting the book for and she and I began talking. I told her I would like to ask her a question concerning a person mentioned many times on SM and that was Lorenzo.  Her eyes perked up and she said...Lorenzo was first mentioned to her by Karen Janssen in one of their meetings very early on as being the local ecstasy supplier on the island. That was all she ever really learned about him other than he was reported to be related to the Sloots.  She said the monkeys knew more about Lorenzo than she did.  KJ never told her any more than he was questioned and suspected as being the drug supplier or involved only peripherally as using his connections in some way to help the Sloots.  So we are no closer to learning anything there.


She was so amazed at how the monkeys seemed to have their finger on anything that relates to this case.  I then asked her about the PHONE CALL.
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« Reply #1336 on: August 10, 2008, 05:32:02 PM »

Lala's

I have no issues with whatever your thoughts are regarding Lorenzo.  I have mine and others disagree.  No problem.

My interest in now on Shango.  Shango stopped posting on June 30th, as best I can tell.  Simian chose to take on other nicknames and continue his posting.  Do you know of any other nicknames Shango may have used after June 30th?  If so, do you know if the posts were saved anywhere?
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"Character is doing the right thing even when no one is looking"..J.C. Watts
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #1337 on: August 10, 2008, 05:32:49 PM »

I think I had my Wever's confused... ::MonkeyConfused::imagine that!

Sorry about that.....
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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« Reply #1338 on: August 10, 2008, 07:37:18 PM »

Texasmom...we are supposed to be confused...that was there plan...I wish I had saved that with the "David" in it...I wonder whose Grandfather he might have been?

Truthseeker...one reason I started rereading the FP posts is to see if any posters morphed into some-one else...not sure if I will be able to tell though...

Going to post some in Finngirl's Forget/Remember thread, hopefully tomorrow!  Now if I could only remember the name of that thread...
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Poochy
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« Reply #1339 on: August 10, 2008, 07:42:43 PM »

"Rumors are that Paulus van der Sloot before he was married to
Anita, had an affair with Van Rijn's mother and the result
was Lorenzo van Rijjn.

Kermit's NOTE: THAT WAS CONFIRMED BY JOSSY

Another Aruban blogger from another site wrote that some of Natalee's
belongings were found at Van Rijn's house."
http://coffeepotghost.com/NATALEE_HOLLOWAY_CASE_LORENZO_LARRY_VAN_RIJN.html


Lorenezo Van Rijn was brought in for questioning and owns a van.
Source: http://www.majorwager.com/fusetalk/messageview.cfm?
catid=22&threadid=133972&FTVAR_MSGDBTABLE=&STARTPAGE=3



LORENZO van Riijn:
http://photo.tickle.com/image/2/4/6/P7/2462781P7063382009.jpg
http://photos17.flickr.com/19750689_d40429047b_0.jpg (it has been removed)



Van Rijn Lorenzo and Max Arendzs were detained and questioned on Friday
Max Arrends gave alibi for Lorenzo:
http://forums.go.com/abc/thread?threadID=454720&forumStart=0

Lorenzo Van Rijn's country house is in Seroe Alejandro
van Rijks(1981) fathers(r.i.p.) was the owner of VW dealership. he comitted suicide a couple of yrs ago.. Rumours say his wife killed him and pretended it was a suicide. God forgive me if I heard wrong info.
Huge house in Savaneta, on main road to San Nicolaas.
Jaraweg is in San Nicolaas area.


kermits NOTE: SAN NICOLAAS IS WHERE THE SECURITY GUARDS LIVED AND ALSO WHERE THE FIRST SEARCHES WERE DONE
BY JUDY HASSELL - ARUBA POLIS



Ge0rge
In the early hours of May 31 when Natalee's parents, friends, Charles C. and some police men went over to the VDS home at about 3 a.m.... would they have noticed this monkey? In the middle of the night? Making lots of noice? Or not?NO.
Was Lorenzo, Max.. seen on the tape of the surveillance camera of the casino at the Holiday Inn, talking to Natalee?Unconfirmed reports have it that she had a dinner with Lorenzo on May 27 or/and 29.
LovelyPigeon
Here's some of what BHT said to Greta, from transcript of show that aired June 15 http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159779,00.html



Per AmericaninAruba:
The Lorenzo guy who was questioned yesterday is known for having
underground parties at one of his houses. The house is rather isolated
and surrounded by lots of brush & cactus.
Supposedly one of them was painted really crazy.



“Island Hopper
“Rumors have it that…Van Rijn’s mother had an affair with Paul Van Der Sloot (before he was married to his current wife) and the result was Lorenzo Van Rijn (23). - no I’m not making this up. Lorenzo is close friends with Joran (his half brother?) Natalee was being kept at Van Rijn’s house and is still alive. Police found some of Natalee’s belongings at Van Rijn’s house, but she has been moved to another house..” found on another site


Checkme wrote above: new girl, you know, small society, extended families, no secrets, family knows everything. this guy has a bad profile, father into drugs, himself dealing, driving expensive cars, crashing them, not working, father killing himself because of a drug/alcohol induced depression. in short, no solid upbringing, wrong connections, careless, living above the law. somehow not getting caught. Bad boy waiting on the wall to hit him?



new girl Says:
June 29th, 2005 at 12:23 am

I also think it is POSSIBLE that there was a setup of sorts and Lorenzo actually left his house to meet up with Joran at the beach somewhere, hence the lack of witnesses to whatever happened to Natalee. However, Shango was indicating that the XTC “maze” music thing was the atmosphere, hence his clue that “Babylonians don’t make sandcastles” i.e. they don’t mess around in the sand. Especially when they have privacy available and mean to cause harm to someone.


subdude Says:
June 29th, 2005 at 12:34 am

newgirl: Shango seemed to suggest that police chief had dirty hands and new about these raves and what went on.

Police chief complicit in drug trade is not much of a stretch. Aruba is small and a “trampoline” for drug trade. Would not be unusual for police to know the flow.

To be clear, I am not knocking Aruba — same thing goes on in US, right here in Miami. Not necessarily police chief, but small number of cops are dirty — that is reality.


A dirty cop would not point the finger at the dealer who could expose him. He would lead investigation away from rave at drug dealer’s house.

new girl Says:
June 29th, 2005 at 12:35 am
Subdude, back to Shango’s clues:

DirtyHand the polis chief has been to the maze and walks through all houses. INCLUDING this one. But he does not go there to seek pleasures.

So why does he go? To collect his $$ for allowing these raves to go on and on while everyone else’s are busted? Or is it more sinister? Does it involve drug trade or something sexually inappropriate?

Shango also suggested that the children of “Babylonian” government officials / important people hang out at these rave parties. Why don’t they come forward?

Maybe they are scared that if Lorenzo is crazy and murders dogs and gang-rapes and kills innocent tourists, he might hurt them too. Especially if the police are somehow complicit in this.

And what of their parents, the ruling Dutch officials? Are they also complicit in some way? Is this a house of cards the kids don’t want to bring down?


clevfan
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06/23/2005 9:51 PM    
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It is widely suspected on the island that the girl was kidnapped, it is believed that others are involved in this, namely the son (Lorenzo Van Rijn) of a VW auto dealer that hung himself a couple yrs ago. Apparently the son is heavily into the drug trade and other things as well and is quite wealthy but kinda off his rocker, he's feared by many on the island due to the fact that so many find him so sinister. His home is one of the only homes on the island which has a basement and the rumors are flying that he connects to Natalee's disappearance.


clevfan
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07/03/2005 0:30 AM    
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these are suspect sites:

www.mrpinkproductions.com

www.guide2paradise.com


both are run by a guy orginally from michigan by the name of paul brough. he is good friends with lorenzo van rijn

old sites are: www.getlegalhookers.com and www.metronightlife.com



arubagirl wrote:
I know that right now I'm being an information tease, but it's just ridiculous that I'm afraid that I'm going to be howled out of the message board.
Deep sigh Here goes:
According to neighbours of van Rijn's mom, this lady had an affair with v/d Sloot before he was married to his current wife, and the result was Lorenzo van Rijn. Natalee was held at Lorenzo's house (who lives alone), since he has a basement (not many houses here have a basement). Natalee has been moved from house to house belonging to those that are in the plan (don't know what plan that is). They are afraid to kill her what with everybody focusing on the case.
Look, I KNOW. I KNOW. It's sounds to utterly fantastic and ridiculous. Please don't kill me, troll me, flame me. Not for this. I WANT it to be true, that she is still alive.
An Aruban blogger from another site wrote that some of Natalee's belongings were found at Van Rijn's house...
I've also seen it posted by Claire on 6/19 3:28pm on RWV



omega
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Joined: 31 Jul 2005

PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 9:02 pm    Post subject:    Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote
Riehl World View: Fourth Man
Lorenzo is the son of the deceased VW car dealer, seems to be very much related to ... Financial Bank on Aruba is represented by the law-firm Croes & Wever...
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/06/fourth_man.html - 92k -


IamTito wrote:
Lorenzo Wever  was sent to Holland soon after the event.. he was a casino person.. his father currently leads a political party on the island..


erin_go_bragh:
Tito, are you aware of any Lorenzo’s involving the case? There is an alleged Lorenzo from Holland (now lives in Aruba) that might have eaten dinner with Natalee during her trip to Aruba. Allegedly, he's around 27 and might have something to do with drugs...

TITO: HE LEFT FOR HOLLAND.. IF HIS NAME IS WEVER, THAT IS..

As far as Lorenzo... dont have a picture

as far as the misleading theory.. hmmmm
IamTito




IamTito
Joined: 10 Aug 2005
Location: aruba
   
PostPosted: Fri Aug 12, 2005 9:17 pm    Post subject:    Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote
Lorenzo Wever was sent to Holland soon after the event.. he was a casino person.. his father currently leads a political party on the island..







It has been rumored that there is a cell phone record from 6:20AM the morning Natalee went missing from Steve Croes to Joran.


kermit NOTE: TITO SAID LORENZO WAS SENT to Holland
Kermit NOTE: that area Santa Lucia is where Steve Croes lives and ALSO DAIRO JARISON (not sure if that is the correct spelling and on on lazy sunday time.

Compananzi
Monkey Junkey
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2005 1:04 am

Local Casino Dealer mysteriously skipped town to Holland...Interrogation also occurring in Holland in the Natalee case.

ORANJESTAD: Information has been circulating for a couple of days that a local Casino Dealer, male, who was working in the one of the Highrise Hotel Casino, right after the dissapearanc eof Natalee, skipped town and went to Holland.

After the Dealer went on his flight, rumors started that this young man also knows the 3 suspects, Joran van der Sloot and also know the bros. Deepak, and Satish Kalpoe.

This important detail, clearly has reached the ears of the local authorities, about the sudden trip of this Dealer, whose in Holland currently.


Sources indicate, and new information that Diario has made available points to the Dealer in question, whose trip went to Holland, was interrogated on more then 2 occasions by Aruban and Dutch authorities relating to the Natalee case.

It appears that the Dealer W confirms that he knows Joran, but we could not determine if during the interrogation if he brought forward that he knows the bros. Kapoes or not.

Up to now in this 2 months long Natalee case, information are still circulating that this Dealer in question might know something about this case

To prevent rumors, Diario has confirmation from the local authorities, whose during the interrogation also were mentioning the high tailing of this dealer., which they were able to get Dutch counterparts to interrogate this youth with Initials W, whilst he was in Holland. All details of this interrogation will be sent back to Aruba.
_________________
Various wever info:

Aliansa - (Aliansa Democratico Arubano)
Aruban Democratic Alliance

Party color: Purple Description and meaning of the Logo: - Ideology: Founded: May 19, 2001
Current data of the Party: Party leader - Wever; Robert F. Chairman - Wever; Ricardo R. Treasurer - Janga; Raymundo Secretary - Werleman; Eugenia I. Members of committee - - Angela; Karen - van de Linden; Olivia URL - http://www.aliansaaruba.org/ History & Other data: click here to see the statute. (Dutch) Further updates soon! Participation in Elections: Date of Election: September 23, 2005 Party leader - Wever; Robert Frederick
Date of Election: September 28, 2001 Party leader conducting campaign - Wever; Robert Frederick
Acquired seats in the Staten of Aruba - 0 Cabinet - Oduber III Period - 2001 - present
http://www.aliansaaruba.org/


6/16/05-----Lorenzo Van Rijn was brought in by Aruban police for questioning but was not held. According to Tito, he was considered a possible suspect at that time.
6/16/05-----Max Arendsz was brought in by Aruban police for questioning. It has been stated that he was the “alibi” for LVR.


Jun 29, 2005 1:09 PM

My little spunky monkey... yes, I concur, I too, had the bestest time with you at Warped! From jammin' out together with Brittnie, Dutch & Lorenzo, to seein' Sammy Haggar/Puck at Bennegins, to posin' like a Victoria's Secret model for you & Dutch, to my Touretts gettin' the best of me... all in a Tuesday's fun! Love ya girl! Talk to you later on!
http://www.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=7892828&Mytoken=20050203010636



*******, I personally know Lorenzo very well and since he (to my knowledge) isn't guilty or plays a part in the NH case I'd rather refrain from giving out personal info.

What is known (was in the papers), the police (way in the beginning) got an anonimous tip by phone, and went (without a searchwarrant and were allowed)to search his house and question him. Nothing was found, he also had an alibi and that settled it.
Him being PdvS son is a rumour that started during the NH case. I think because Lorenzo's dad's name was Paul too, they are both Dutch etc. that rumour started. But there is no truth to it.

More I can't tell you about him. Lorenzo is a guy who luckily does not hang out on the Internet (so he will not read some of the ludicrous things posted about him) and has no pictures online. Non of the pictures you've seen online claiming to be him, is him.

Posted by: Dolores | Aug 31, 2005 9:33:45 AM
http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/08/natalee_hollowa_75.html



Thanks for posting all of this Kermit! I think I get it now. Let me know your thoughts on this 'theory' based on codetalker info- and also does anybody know where we can get the full video of Natalee sitting at the table inside the ca$ino? Posnr was ticked off that it was played on MSM... maybe there's a pic of DirtyHand walking in/out.

Perhaps the person/perp (DirtyHand) we are looking for was at the H.I. ca$ino tables during the week and/or that night, and sat specifically at "Wever's" table (Guido or Lorenzo or both). Guido was said to be a croupier so the table is either craps or roulette. Maybe Natalee and/or one of her friends (that look like her) was at the same table before moving over to the blackjack table. And then Joran who is now sitting at the same blackjack table as Natalee and girls, were told about how they owed someone $. Maybe it wasn't "daddy's" money but the person/perp from whom she borrowed earlier in the week.  Maybe the MB girls, naive to gambling and consequences, didn't take the amount of $ owed to this person/perp very seriously, but this person/perp did. Joran was hired to get the $ back.

Remember - ALL THE GAMBLERS KNEW WHAT WAS WRITTEN DOWN.

"W", a ca$ino worker, was 'SENT' to Netherlands. Guido Wever or this Lorenzo David Wever. (Larry is a nickname for Lorenzo). Basically was 'sent' but literally 'flee' off Aruba. This is DirtyHand's power. THEY SAW, AND WERE SENT AWAY TO SHUT THEM UP.
 
5/16/06 the grey whisper said...
texan, the answer lies at the roulette table.

5/16/06 the grey whisper said...
who's really to say, texan.. like your old amusing friend Koko, they are all really just someone's wind-up toy, aren't they? whose purse was covering the spread at the tables that night? you never win when your opponent has three black aces up his sleeve (IN RESPONSE TO DAN IN TX: So Shango and Simian don't know what they're talking about?)
 
Simian Says: June 26th, 2005 at 9:36 pm
All that the gamblers knew was written down. They knew the girl. She spent her nights at their tables.

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:33 pm
Why did the girl owe money?

Shango Says: June 26th, 2005 at 10:04 pm
Are the children of the elders there, or did they flee to Babylon?
DirtyHand knows, this is his Power. there will be 46 sacrifices
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