Natalee Case Discussion #762 6/30 - 7/6/08

[Rob]

Why Rob????

I'm just saying not to take the first offer. Let a few come in and then you'll have your pick of a new home. 

[bleachedblack]

[always 1]

Thank you Bleachedblack, that is so funny.  Now can you make her whine........

[mariloo]

Does anyone know if there is still an active investigation going on in Aruba at this time?

[always 1]

Mariloo, the last we heard from CAPS, someone from the "state" was supposed to be there. But Klassend can probably telll you more.

[mariloo]

Thanks always, I haven't been here in a long time and I don;t get to blog nearly as much as I did previously.  I have to take care of my Mother.  I appreciate the response.  It is so much nicer here than before.  There used to be so much arguing back and forth all the time.

[always 1]

!Youre welcome

[mariloo]

Klaas, have ya'll ever thought about putting the school bus on a t-shirt before?  I sure would like to see all the old farts together again.   

[Blonde]

Still looking for a Dutch poster that has a copy of Joran's book.  I need some info that is supposedly contained in the book.  Please if anyone has a copy and is willing to help me find the information email me.  TIA  cindoal@yahoo.com   

Why ,don't you think it's all full of lies anyway

[klaasend]

Klaas, have ya'll ever thought about putting the school bus on a t-shirt before?  I sure would like to see all the old farts together again.   

I think it was on a t-shirt back then.  I'll have to check. 

As far as active investigation in Aruba, they claim there still is one but who really knows for sure?

[caesu]

Dutch police force support Curaçao possible

(Novum) - With new riots against the Dutch on Curaçao the police force may use the support of Dutch police officers. That said Ank Bijleveld (CDA), State Secretary of kingdom relations Tuesday in reply to parliament questions. The CDA wanted to know whether the State Secretary can guarantee the security of the Dutch on Curaçao.

CDA stated the question to Bijleveld as a result of reports in the media that during a racial riot on Curaçao whites were beaten up. The violence followed on a political demonstration against Dutch intervention with the islands. The Antilles came Thursday under financial trusteeship of the Netherlands.

After a protest, the demonstrators focussed their attention to Dutch interns who work in the hotels on the island. According to Bijleveld no Dutch victims fell during riots. However, a person from Curaçao with a light skin was wounded.

Bijleveld stated that there was an adequate reaction by the Antillean authorities. They denounced the riot directly after it had taken place. Bijleveld said Tuesday that she believes that it remains at this incident. When necessary, support can be given there if there must be acted on a large scale, said Bijleveld. She doesn't count on this to be necessary.

The suggestion of the PVV to send Dutch marines to the islands was dismissed because the Antilles are an independent country.

http://www.trouw.nl/laatstenieuws/laatstenieuws/article1027596.ece

[GBMW]

Still looking for a Dutch poster that has a copy of Joran's book.  I need some info that is supposedly contained in the book.  Please if anyone has a copy and is willing to help me find the information email me.  TIA  cindoal@yahoo.com   

I have it; but my father is reading it at the moment so I don't have the copy at home right now. What are you looking for? I'll ask my dad to look for it.

[caesu]

Investigation into riots has high priority
30 Jun, 2008, 18:18 (GMT -04:00)

WILLEMSTAD – The investigation into the riots of last Thursday evening has high priority for the Public Prosecutor (OM), declares spokesperson Giselle.

That priority also applies to the robbery with murder of entrepreneur Nanik Daryanani of the internet café in Punda and Pim Timmermans of restaurant Larousse. Veen-Jonkhout denies this morning’s article in the Extra that there will be some arrests today in the destruction- and violence case of last Thursday, when a local young man was hit by one of the rocks or tiles that were thrown in the Nieuwestraat near café De Nachtwacht.

Cars were damaged and one car was overturned. The anger, hatred, and frustration of a small group of people were aimed at Dutch European citizens.

All Veen-Jonkhout wanted to say this morning is that the investigation is in full swing. The manifestation was put on tape all day long. There were a lot of people at the café that can give testimony. The occurrence was also filmed with mobile telephones.

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_43975.php

reason given for these riots:

In other incidents at other locations, cars were overturned and stones were thrown. One person, a white resident of Curaçao, was seriously injured. The violence followed a day of angry demonstrations against increased Dutch influence on the island's finances.

In exchange for wiping out debts of 2.2 billion euros owned by the Netherlands Antilles, the Dutch government is demanding that it be given more of a say in judicial matters and the maintenance of law and order. It wants to do this to guarantee reliable, open government and to reduce corruption and political favouritism.

http://www.radionetherlands.nl/currentaffairs/region/southamerica/080630-curacao-finances-mc

simular scenes could take place on Aruba of the Dutch would interfere there.
same ingredients for interference are in place.

Aruba is more affected by the economic slowdown due to their dependence on tourism.
and also on Aruba corruption, political favourtism got attention thanks to Nico Jörg (and Brinkman - and even Bijleveld).

Aruba brags about being the only island not needing financial aid anymore starting in 2009.
but this might change due to economic slow down / oil prices.

Aruba would be even more upset if the Dutch would interfere because of their 'status aparte' since 1986.
only look at how much fuss Aruba made about the Plant / Mariott complex sale.

[bleachedblack]

>>>SNIP

Aruba is more affected by the economic slowdown due to their dependence on tourism.
and also on Aruba corruption, political favourtism got attention thanks to Nico Jörg (and Brinkman - and even Bijleveld). 

[Lala'sMom]

Still looking for a Dutch poster that has a copy of Joran's book.  I need some info that is supposedly contained in the book.  Please if anyone has a copy and is willing to help me find the information email me.  TIA  cindoal@yahoo.com   

Why ,don't you think it's all full of lies anyway

Most likely, but I want to know about something very specific that only someone with the book can tell me.

[Lala'sMom]

Still looking for a Dutch poster that has a copy of Joran's book.  I need some info that is supposedly contained in the book.  Please if anyone has a copy and is willing to help me find the information email me.  TIA  cindoal@yahoo.com   

I have it; but my father is reading it at the moment so I don't have the copy at home right now. What are you looking for? I'll ask my dad to look for it.

Please email me if you are serious about helping me.  I am looking for something specific that is supposed to be mentioned in there.  I can't elaborate on the forum at this time. I promised I would not make it public. Thanks.

[Observer]

Still looking for a Dutch poster that has a copy of Joran's book.  I need some info that is supposedly contained in the book.  Please if anyone has a copy and is willing to help me find the information email me.  TIA  cindoal@yahoo.com   

I have it; but my father is reading it at the moment so I don't have the copy at home right now. What are you looking for? I'll ask my dad to look for it.

Please email me if you are serious about helping me.  I am looking for something specific that is supposed to be mentioned in there.  I can't elaborate on the forum at this time. I promised I would not make it public. Thanks.

Lala..Email me what you are looking for..I know someone with the book who would probably like to help.

[Observer]

Some Daurystuff from the book...


And Joran being protective of girls: read it carefully because it's about the only nice thing he says about females. Ah no...his mother is sweet (and at the moment I'm not sure whether he actually said that or confirmed Patricks comment about that). The rest: it's all whores, bitches...how he uses them, chats them up, how he fucks & screws around with girls (mostly met online). Patrick mentions in his book the only woman he talks about with respect is his grandmother.
Sorry for the language....but I'm only using Jorans words so I hope I'm forgiven.

Page 177, part of  3rd ride 15-01

……. (there is a part before this)

J: But he doesn’t live on Aruba anymore. He’s not on Aruba at the moment.
P: He lives in the Netherlands?
J: Yes.
P: That’s only easier, man. You have to tell me. I want to see him.
J: Yes.
P: I want to know who he is. I don’t have to talk to him about this, but if I see him, then I know if he will be able to use this against us.
J: Yeah, one would see that right away.
P: I can see that, you know. Then I can tell you how I feel. But I think it’s dangerous for him to be walking around with this and certainly for later on, when there is a lot of money involved and he sees we’ve got lots of money, you know?
J: Yes.
P: I give him one chance and then he’ll get a bullet.
J: Yeah, I agree with you, but…
P: But was he there then? (GBMW: I have no idea what Patrick is talking about; can’t figure that out…if Daury disposed of Natalee…he should have been there right? Maybe this is about something else)
J: No, Patrick, of course not.
P: Oh.
J: Of course not, of course not. It all happened so quickly, so quickly.

…….. (there is a part here I haven’t translated)


J: In only 2,5 hours together you can’t someone…
P: No, no, no, no.
J: …kill & do something. Everyone knows that, that can’t happen! Or you have to be a professional, uhmmm, thing. But, Patrick, I know him, I’ve lived on Aruba for 18 years aw well, you know.
P: Yeah, of course, you know people. But what you’re asking of this person….Joran..
J: I didn’t ask.
P: You didn’t ask?
J: I didn’t ask, Patrick.
P: He offered?
J: He offered.
P: Unbelievable.
J: He saw me there…
P: Yeah, all those emotions, devastated.
J: …and he knew as well…I was going to the US and…
P: Yeah, he wanted to save you.
J: And he thought like…and he couldn’t have known it would be this big. I’ve talked to him about this later on, Patrick. We’ve talked for nights with a whiskeybottle…
P: And how old is he?…about your age?
J: No, 25.
P: 25! But be carefull he? If they drink: I’ll get that pendeo (that bastard). I want to see him, Joran. You’ve got to…I want to see him, yeah? I just want to see him once.
J: Once is ok.
P: Once I want to see him, you know, no more.
J: Yeah, that’s ok.
P: Yeah? Call him, we’ll go and see him tomorrow. I want to see him, just see him once, you know. You don’t have to say anything. Just say: “Hey, a friend of mine from Arnhem…good friend…cool car…have fun you know.”
J: Yeah, I’ll just tell him, let’s have a drink, have lunch.
P: Yeah, right? Eat a bit, we’ll have some dinner, talk a bit, you know.
J: No, he’ll likes that as well.
P: Yeah, he would?
J: Yeah.
P: Of course, man, we’ll mention nothing, and we’ll blow a bit and…it’s cool. And when he’s gone, then I’ll talk to you & I’ll give you my view about that boy, because I can read people, you know. I look at those people and how they act.
J: Yeah but he has, he has done a atrako (robbery) once.
P: Yeah, but that’s something different than this..
J: Yeah, of course.
P: You understand? And I don’t like it if people have something against you and they can use it.
J: No, ok. But yeah, I think he has shown that he would do that for me and then without talking…but do you know what’s the most bizarre?
P: But they’ve never arrested him in that case?
J: It’s so bizar. Through anything, you know, all my friends… But hey…I played it very well..in the beginning. Because in the beginning I thought, boy, I can tell them whatever they want, you know, because if they can’t get evidence against me, heck…
P: Yeah, then it’s like, then it’s like…
J: ….they won’t screw me.
P: No.
J: They can’t do anything and eventually they’ve got nothing. But hey, they even haven’t questioned him. Of all my girlfriends, all my friends everything! They’ve got files. They have questioned 15 girls! Exactly. The wanted to know in which positions I fucked them, Patrick! Can you imagine for those girls? Those girls even told me: ‘Joraaan, the police have guts’ you know.
P: Whahaha
J: My father and my mother…my father reads these things as well, you know. My father is a lawyer as well. Cono, man.
P: Unbelievable isn’t it?
J: They did everything, but this boy, it’s just….really…
P: But wh….
J: I’ve really been lucky.
P: Yeah, but how far did he take her, man. He must have done a really good job, you know?
J: Yeah, but this boy knows how….
P: But how far has he…Does he sail often? He knows a lot about boats, he knows a lot about the ocean right?
J: Yeah, he’s got his own sail…licence…thing.
P: Sailevidence, yeah. That boy knows what he’s doing then, yeah. Has he made her heavier to make her sink?
J: No, I don’t think so.
P: You don’t know?
J: No.
P: He never told you how he’s done that?
J: Yeah, of course he did, he has….
P: How has he done that?
J: He just went into the ocean, far, and then he threw her in.
P: Just threw her off?
Joran nodds
P: Like that?
Joran nodds again.
P: Then you were really lucky, man.
J: Yeah.
P: I swear, you were really lucky.
J: I was.
P: Then you were really lucky. If he was that stupid that he’s done it like that, you know? Then you’ve got a big guardian angel hanging over you.
J: I could sleep just fine you know, that night. I went home that night and I could just…I just..
P: But you really didn’t hurt her, right, Joran?
J: Patrick, I swear.
P: The day I find out you hurt her I’ll kill you, right!
J: Yeah, you’ll kill me.
P: Then I could live with it as well, you know.
J: Patrick, then you will kill me. Patrick, you should see me with girls. I’m so sweet as can be!
P: No, I don’t know you, I don’t believe that, that you f*** her and that you f*** her in the ass.
J: Of course, of course.
P: Ok, but I do that as well. 100%.
J: 100%.
P: And slap her on the bum, well, she sure can get that!
J: Yeah.
P: And pull the hair a bit, that can be done as well, you know.
J: Yeah. I would never hurt a girl! Before…when I see a guy… hitting a f***ing girl…then I’ll get that guy..
P: Then he’ll get two…yeah, I agree.
J: What do you think?
P: Then he can get some as well right?
J: Yeah.
P: Because that doesn’t even have to be your own girlfriend.
J: Then I, I don’t even have to know her.
P: Once in a while I do see, you know, then I see those guys being so awful towards their bitch.
J: You can’t do that!
P: No, man. But…you can speak up, but then you’ll get a mouth full of that bitch even.
J: Yeah.
P: You know?
J: Yeah, do you understand that thing of me, Patrick? It’s very difficult for me as well.
P: But Joran, I know for sure, it must be a relieve you’re able to tell your story.
J: Oh Patrick, you have no idea how I felt yesterday.
P: And I’ll tell you, I’ve given your story a place, man. And the first time you wanted to tell me….I knew I wanted you too but I couldn’t place it yet. Now the case is done, yeah, it’s also more easy for me. But I don’t want you to go on television anymore, Joran.
J: I won’t do that anymore.
P: I don’t want you to do that..
J: No, we’re done with that.
P: It’s not good for yourself, you know?
J: Yeah, I only did it because I got 5000 Euro for it.
P: Yeah, of course….easy money. Money is money, man.

Joran has mentioned the name he said he would take to the grave by now (mentioned; I’m not skipping anything from the book here).

P: But I want to, I want to meet that guy, you have to call him & tomorrow all of us we’ll ride up there, man.
J: Ok.
P: We’ll take William with us, we’ll make it a nice day, you know. Then he’ll say, oh fun…fight, you know!
J: I can call him now.
P: Yeah…just call him, make an appointment with him for tomorrow, we’ll go there, man.
J: Ahhh, I don’t have his number in this phone, I’ve got it in the old phone.
P: Ok, all right. That’s no problem, right?
J: I’ll give him a call tonight.

[bleachedblack]

I think this part Patrick is asking was Daury there then then=when Natalee (presumably) died.

J: Yeah, I agree with you, but…
P: But was he there then? (GBMW: I have no idea what Patrick is talking about; can’t figure that out…if Daury disposed of Natalee…he should have been there right? Maybe this is about something else)
J: No, Patrick, of course not.
P: Oh.
J: Of course not, of course not. It all happened so quickly, so quickly.

[bleachedblack]

Lie right her....hesitated regarding sail....makes no sense. No a sail boat IMO

J: Yeah, he’s got his own sail…licence…thing.
P: Sailevidence, yeah. That boy knows what he’s doing then, yeah. Has he made her heavier to make her sink?