Natalee Case Discussion #763 7/6 - 7/11

[Lala'sMom]

Hi, Lala's, LDStLou, Mum in Ohio, et al.  Yes, Simian was indeed a government employee.  She was and also is a very smart person with a good pedigree which extends to the homeland. 

Um...er...actually Simian was a guy.

lol...still not resolved I take it!!!

I think it is resolved. LOL  At least to my satisfaction.  Shango is another story. LOL

[Lala'sMom]

Doesn't Julia hang with the crowd that knows everything?

[dennisintn]

LTSTLOU

Renfro was never on Beth's side.  Remember "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer."  She was merely schmoozing up to Beth to try and get any information out of her that she could use against her.  She was never Beth's friend and she always knew that Natalee would not be found.  She was not operating from a vacuum.  It was not until Jug figured her out that she let it be known that her intentions were not honorable.  I think Jug probably had clues all along but until the final confrontation and her leading them to the court house, perhaps Beth, in her desire and shock to want something, anything, felt she could trust a mother near her own age whose children could fall prey to such, but Julia was NEVER, NEVER, NEVER Beth's friend.  I think that Jug figured this out when he did is exemplary of good old American analytical thinking. I just wish that the wolves had not come out so early before the good guys had a chance to get their bearings.  That Beth was there so early on is to her credit but her desire to believe Julia was there to help her was based on her grief and shock.  I think she can probably, in retrospect, see that Julia was "sleeping with the enemy" all along.

if you go back to the beginning and watch every one of renfro's interviews, her attention and focus was always her "crimeless and beautiful aruba" and natalee and the search for her was 4th or 5th place in her thoughts.  natalee was just a vehicle for her aruba advertisements.
dennisintn

[Lala'sMom]

Hey, did you guys know we are unsupervised at the moment?  Where are my pencils when I need them?  I bet Klaas has run to the store again and forgot to take her car. 

[dennisintn]

Doesn't Julia hang with the crowd that knows everything?

her business ventures cater to and depend on tourists.  her papers depend on tourist business advertisements including the prostitution and sex businesses as well as restaurants and bars.  the articles in the papers all look like they came out of a house organ belonging to the hotels.  there is almost never anything like real news in them.
dennisintn

[ldstlou]

Hey, did you guys know we are unsupervised at the moment?  Where are my pencils when I need them?  I bet Klaas has run to the store again and forgot to take her car. 

too funny!!!

I DID notice we were unsupervised!!!

Bring out the booze!!!! lol

[truthseeker2]

Doesn't Julia hang with the crowd that knows everything?

her business ventures cater to and depend on tourists.  her papers depend on tourist business advertisements including the prostitution and sex businesses as well as restaurants and bars.  the articles in the papers all look like they came out of a house organ belonging to the hotels.  there is almost never anything like real news in them.
dennisintn

Julia may even be a 'Madam'.  Her "newspaper" is full of ads promoting 'escorts' and the like.  People need to take a very long and close look at Julia Renfro..imo.

[ldstlou]

Doesn't Julia hang with the crowd that knows everything?

her business ventures cater to and depend on tourists.  her papers depend on tourist business advertisements including the prostitution and sex businesses as well as restaurants and bars.  the articles in the papers all look like they came out of a house organ belonging to the hotels.  there is almost never anything like real news in them.
dennisintn

Julia may even be a 'Madam'.  Her "newspaper" is full of ads promoting 'escorts' and the like.  People need to take a very long and close look at Julia Renfro..imo.

not so sure about the madam bit...seems she is open to giving it out free.

I DID NOT JUST SAY THAT!!!

[ldstlou]

since I found the sitemeter again...lol...I have become fascinated with it!!! Amazing the people from all places on the globe that visit!! Blows me away!!!

By the way..Someone in Aruba is watching...could it be renho??!!

 [<<]  [>>]
Domain Name   setardsl.aw ? (Aruba)
IP Address   199.0.86.# (SLBH/SETAR ARUBA)
ISP   Sprint
Location   Continent  :  South America
Country  :  Aruba  (Facts)
City  :  Oranjestad
Lat/Long  :  12.5167, -70.0333 (Map)
 
Language   English (U.S.)
en-us
Operating System   Microsoft WinXP
Browser   Internet Explorer 7.0
Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322; InfoPath.1)
Javascript   version 1.3
Monitor   Resolution  :  1024 x 768
Color Depth  :  32 bits 
 
Time of Visit   Jul 9 2008 3:43:41 pm
Last Page View   Jul 9 2008 3:43:41 pm
Visit Length   0 seconds
Page Views   1
Referring URL   
Visit Entry Page   http://scaredmonkeys.com/
Visit Exit Page   http://scaredmonkeys.com/
Out Click     
Time Zone   UTC-5:00
Visitor's Time   Jul 9 2008 3:43:41 pm
Visit Number   12,052,283

[johan555]

site meter freak ldstlou  ?

[KarmaRoundUp]

Speaking of renho and her agenda....

lot of talk at RU about DEA agent Williams again. Man that guy is an enigma to me!!! We never have figured his role out!!! 

So renho is saying he is a consulate now. renhos mom saying leave the guy alone. Elaine saying she has known him for years? So if Elaine has known him for years...he must live in Aruba correct?

He may have been interviewed for the "crockermentary"

Who in heck is this guy???!!!! Why does he keep coming up and what was his role?

I think ElaineS was talking about knowing Charles Croes for years, not Eric Williams.  Also you are aware that ElaineS does not live in Aruba, she lives in the US.

I agree, we need to find out more about Eric Williams.  Pita posted yesterday that an Eric Williams was a spokesperson for the DEA back in 2001.  We need to find out more and what ties he has to Renfro.

I would also like to know(from Beth or Jug)if anyone actually saw an ID card for Eric Williams.

I asked Jug back in Nov/Dec...no, never saw an ID...The family did NOT know this guy prior to that night and Jug doesn't know to this day if he is a good guy or bad guy.

Thank you Lisa
So Eric could have just been another"American"plant planted there by whoever pulls the strings on aruba.

[2NJSons_Mom]

since I found the sitemeter again...lol...I have become fascinated with it!!! Amazing the people from all places on the globe that visit!! Blows me away!!!

By the way..Someone in Aruba is watching...could it be renho??!!

 [<<]  [>>]
Domain Name   setardsl.aw ? (Aruba)
IP Address   199.0.86.# (SLBH/SETAR ARUBA)
ISP   Sprint
Location   Continent  :  South America
Country  :  Aruba  (Facts)
City  :  Oranjestad
Lat/Long  :  12.5167, -70.0333 (Map)
 
Language   English (U.S.)
en-us
Operating System   Microsoft WinXP
Browser   Internet Explorer 7.0
Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 7.0; Windows NT 5.1; .NET CLR 1.1.4322; InfoPath.1)
Javascript   version 1.3
Monitor   Resolution  :  1024 x 768
Color Depth  :  32 bits 
 
Time of Visit   Jul 9 2008 3:43:41 pm
Last Page View   Jul 9 2008 3:43:41 pm
Visit Length   0 seconds
Page Views   1
Referring URL   
Visit Entry Page   http://scaredmonkeys.com/
Visit Exit Page   http://scaredmonkeys.com/
Out Click     
Time Zone   UTC-5:00
Visitor's Time   Jul 9 2008 3:43:41 pm
Visit Number   12,052,283

Looks like this person was reading the front page....

[Tylergal]

Hi, Lala's, LDStLou, Mum in Ohio, et al.  Yes, Simian was indeed a government employee.  She was and also is a very smart person with a good pedigree which extends to the homeland. 

Um...er...actually Simian was a guy.

Well, for the most part.  But, I still think we have a female and you know who I think but for unity, I will veer off that street.   

[Tylergal]

[

I think we have to look at renho better too. It is obvious now she has an agenda. That agenda is that Natalee is alive now...why? Why is she working so darned hard to sell her agenda. Guilt? What did she do those first weeks she has to justify? Could it be they were close to finding Natalee when she sent them running to the courthouse because they had Natalee's body? Had they found her and decided it was best to keep that fact hidden? Was she in on the decision and the conspiracy to hide Natalee forever? Why? What did they discover when and if they found Natalee's body? We know at the time that the forces that be were desparately trying to "save face"....their safe and happy island was being destroyed..in their opinion.

aruba's greatest feat would be to convince the world that natalee is still alive somewhere, anywhere, in the world.  it would get aruba and jp2k off the hook and salvage their tourist oriented "safe island" theme that they've got millions of dollars and countless lies invested in.
dennisintn

Just like many campaigns for people and organized thinking, they hire a mouth piece who can spew the message and direct it in the way they want it to be heard.  For instance, Julia Renfro, who had the connections with the newspaper also understood the American think and she understood how easily led are not only Arubans but Americans.  In collusion with public policy and campaign offices, marketers on the East Coast, USA, she quickly turned her campaign into something international, like any campaign, i.e., "returning to the ice age," in the 1980s to the "global warming" of today, which are designed with the thought in mind that the bellwether can  make you believe what they are saying with the right platform and message in order to advance their campaign which was definitely to discredit Beth, Natalee and thereby enhance investment and tourism on third-world Aruba.  If advanced by the correct people, the sheep will fall in line.  I think Julia Renfro was bellwether for this campaign against Natalee and Beth, and at some point, even the least suspecting Americans and obviously the Arubans will buy into it.  It is like a ball rolling downhill.  The faster it goes, the faster it goes, the more it gathers along the way. 

Julia Renfro was the castrated sheep (goat in her case), (a term describing the bellwether),  who passively and actively can get a sense to describe events, social, political or geographic in microcosms which can spread to a wider demographic.  So the constituency or citizen Aruba/American thinking would come to mirror Julia Renfro, the bellwether.

People begin to believe it and they begin to think anyone against it is either stupid or ill educated and can point to a million events to prove what they believe.  Of course, not taken into consideration is that 10,000,000 other items can also disprove that but before the 10,000,000 get out of bed the 1,000,000 have marched across the globe spewing propaganda. 

Aruba used Julia and its government employees each morning to come to the various blogs and/or speak with the various hosts of TV programs to become the mantra for the campaign against Beth and Natalee, to prevent any belief that Natalee had done anything but runaway from the evil Beth and Jug.

makes sense Tyler. And I understand why they would pick reho, she had established a relationship with Beth, was in the media, was American...but what was in it for renho? What was her motivation? Why did she turn so quickly on Beth...when it truely appeared at the beginning that she sympathized with Beth...especially as a mother. So what is her motive for the dis-information campaign and why is she still so deeply invested over 3 years later?

Who was the other reporter? That was related to kalpoes I think? Began with an s...ooohhhh....you know who I mean...she eventually moved on...so why is renho still in the thick of it? Who or what is keeping her so deeply invested in the case?
[/quote]

Are you talking about Scubajap who we assumed might be related since she was Jewish and a big defender of the Kalpoes, who later on were said to have some connections to them through marriage, etc.  Otherwise, I am lost on that one.  I was thinking it was Dompig's kid that was somewhat related by blood or marriage, to Scubajap but inasmuch as the K2 had kinsmanship with Dompig, perhaps it was that end of the gene pool from whence they all swam.

[Tylergal]

LTSTLOU

Renfro was never on Beth's side.  Remember "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer."  She was merely schmoozing up to Beth to try and get any information out of her that she could use against her.  She was never Beth's friend and she always knew that Natalee would not be found.  She was not operating from a vacuum.  It was not until Jug figured her out that she let it be known that her intentions were not honorable.  I think Jug probably had clues all along but until the final confrontation and her leading them to the court house, perhaps Beth, in her desire and shock to want something, anything, felt she could trust a mother near her own age whose children could fall prey to such, but Julia was NEVER, NEVER, NEVER Beth's friend.  I think that Jug figured this out when he did is exemplary of good old American analytical thinking. I just wish that the wolves had not come out so early before the good guys had a chance to get their bearings.  That Beth was there so early on is to her credit but her desire to believe Julia was there to help her was based on her grief and shock.  I think she can probably, in retrospect, see that Julia was "sleeping with the enemy" all along.

hmmm

When I say "friend at first" I was referring to the 2st day or two!! lol Not much longer after that!!!

But I can see your point. May not have been even the 1st day or 2...but I still think maybe so. For instance, she did out vander straaten right away for not allowing Beth to say "kidnapped" on the posters...some other comment also against van der straaten. If she were sincere the first couple of days...didn't take her long to turn on Beth that is for sure.

Bear in mind, Renfro wanted those posters to say "Kidnapped," so that it would look as though Joran had nothing to do with it.  That was a perfect ruse for them all.  Maybe Jan VDS was smarter than we thought, as it seems he knew Natalee was not kidnapped.  Thus, why would Beth put "kidnapped" on posters.  Beth was coming from an environment where American workers had been kidnapped by Hugo's thugs, to include the FARC people who were recently released after all these years.  She knew kidnappings occurred in that area since Jug had a round-about knowledge of Drummond Oil.  I think Beth was honest in her thinking of "kidnap" and it had probably been discussed that some of the girls on the trip could be targets of FARC.  However, Julia knew all along that kidnapping would be the best way to divert away from Joran murdering Natalee. 

[Lala'sMom]

Hi, Lala's, LDStLou, Mum in Ohio, et al.  Yes, Simian was indeed a government employee.  She was and also is a very smart person with a good pedigree which extends to the homeland. 

Um...er...actually Simian was a guy.

Well, for the most part.  But, I still think we have a female and you know who I think but for unity, I will veer off that street.   

I agree. Let's venture elsewhere time's a wasting. 

[Lala'sMom]

I have often regretted Greta walking up to Jan VDS that day.  If she had just stayed her distance we might have heard more things that would have been of interest.  Alas, that moment is lost forever.

[truthseeker2]

Bear in mind, Renfro wanted those posters to say "Kidnapped," so that it would look as though Joran had nothing to do with it.  That was a perfect ruse for them all.  Maybe Jan VDS was smarter than we thought, as it seems he knew Natalee was not kidnapped.  Thus, why would Beth put "kidnapped" on posters.  Beth was coming from an environment where American workers had been kidnapped by Hugo's thugs, to include the FARC people who were recently released after all these years.  She knew kidnappings occurred in that area since Jug had a round-about knowledge of Drummond Oil.  I think Beth was honest in her thinking of "kidnap" and it had probably been discussed that some of the girls on the trip could be targets of FARC.  However, Julia knew all along that kidnapping would be the best way to divert away from Joran murdering Natalee. 

Wasn't it Julia's phone number on the poster?  Seems like I remember something about that from Beth's book.  I'll have to go back and read that again, but I think the two numbers on the poster were Julia's and her friend's numbers. 

[Tylergal]

Bear in mind, Renfro wanted those posters to say "Kidnapped," so that it would look as though Joran had nothing to do with it.  That was a perfect ruse for them all.  Maybe Jan VDS was smarter than we thought, as it seems he knew Natalee was not kidnapped.  Thus, why would Beth put "kidnapped" on posters.  Beth was coming from an environment where American workers had been kidnapped by Hugo's thugs, to include the FARC people who were recently released after all these years.  She knew kidnappings occurred in that area since Jug had a round-about knowledge of Drummond Oil.  I think Beth was honest in her thinking of "kidnap" and it had probably been discussed that some of the girls on the trip could be targets of FARC.  However, Julia knew all along that kidnapping would be the best way to divert away from Joran murdering Natalee. 

Wasn't it Julia's phone number on the poster?  Seems like I remember something about that from Beth's book.  I'll have to go back and read that again, but I think the two numbers on the poster were Julia's and her friend's numbers. 

Of course and in that way, she could circumvent any information that might have helped Beth in the process.  Never forget that when people start biting the hand of the Ugly American, they are soon found out and exposed for the POS they are (Yes, I did call Renfro a POS). 

[Tylergal]

I think the best way to get any information about Natalee and what happened to her is to waterboard Julia.