Natalee Case Discussion #765 7/15 - 7/22

[Destiny]

O/T...but something that might resonate with some of you....Sorry Klaas, please remove if innappropriate.  Klaas...I like your idea of a *FEELINGS* thread...

Destiny 


Read this and found aspects of it helpful.

http://hubpages.com/hub/Psychism--7-Signs-Youre-an-Empath



"Before I continue, let me just say Empath is not simply another name for a Clairsentient, though many Clairsentients are indeed Empaths. I’ll get into this more later. (Update: Click here to read my tips for Empaths.) That said, if you feel you’re a clairsentient looking for similar information on whether or not you are one, most of these signs will apply to you as well – but be aware those born into clairsentience (as opposed to those born as Empaths, who later harness it and become clairsentient) often can discern what others are feeling but do not actually SUFFER – which is a good way of telling which you are.

So let’s begin:

When in public, do you constantly feel overwhelmed with inexplicable emotions for which you can’t determine the reason?
Example. You drop by the mall one Saturday morning. You feel great. You get into the mall, walk past a crowd of people, and start feeling a bit strangely. It can be anything – you can feel very down, very angry, very sad, very excitable – the key word here is VERY. And you won’t have any explanation for it, you just feel it.

In other words, you’ve suddenly gone Bi-Polar without actually having the biological deficiency that causes it. And what’s worse, you can’t turn it off. You can carry on, trying to ignore it, but eventually it will be overwhelming to the point you just want to go home and be alone.
This is the reality of an Empath – one who hasn’t yet learned how to block other people’s emotions out. Being around other people is such a harrowing experience, most of them prefer to keep their own company, living the life of a hermit. And they usually find it very much worth it.

Do you experience other people's physical ailments?

This is most common with those you have an emotional connection, but can occur with anyone. A very good example of this would be suddenly feeling very lethargic and fatiqued, for no reason, and having to remain in bed for a day or two. You’re not sick – not really. You’re not ill. Yet, you feel that you are, profoundly. You later find out that your “illness” coincided with a lover’s or family member’s sudden fatigue (resulting from legitimate illness)– even though they were in another country at the time and you had no idea until after the fact. Symptoms can also manifest in the form of chest pains, cramps, migraines, etc – you basically experience it all, without contracting the actual illness.

Do you feel overwhelmed when watching something horrible in real life or even on television?

This one sounds silly, but viewing the news or depressing commercials designed to induce sympathy and open wallets, can debilitate an Empath for several hours. While most people get upset over homeless dogs and cats, an Empath will often feel like their hearts have been lanced. That’s a literal definition, by the way. It’s not something as shallow as sympathy or even regular empathy. It’s a feeling of guilt and moral empathy that cannot be easily assuaged. Crying is very common – and not just during that time of month when all the emotions are out of whack!

Do you ALWAYS know what someone really means?

In other words, can you always, always, always tell what it is someone meant to say to you? More importantly, can you tell why they didn’t? If an Empath is in person with someone and they’ve just been lied to, they will know. And they will know why. They will know if the other person is trying to spare feelings, they will know if malice was involved – in other words, they will know the intent. You cannot lie in the face of an Empath and not be caught out. While they will not usually be able to tell the specifics of what you’re hiding, they will know if you mean them well or not – no exceptions. This is more than good intuition. This isn’t a hunch, this is knowing.

Do you feel compelled to care for anyone in pain, no matter who they are and what they’ve done to you?

A true Empath cannot walk past someone suffering and not feel a need to stop and help that person. Homeless people can be particularly difficult, as they are everywhere and little can be done to help them unless the Empath has an occupation related to this. A true Empath feels compelled to go to anyone they feel pain from, be it angst or something physical. And a true Empath's compassion will usually be accepted on the spot – people in pain, no matter how they would normally react to strangers, will receive an Empath with open arms. They know, instinctively, that their pain matters to them.

Do people open up to you – even if you don’t want them to?

Some Empaths are the new-agey peace loving types – but many just want to be alone, because they have difficulty processing everything they absorb from other people. (This is usually because they have yet to realize their abilities and haven’t learned to deal with it yet.) For an Empath, however, putting on a grumpy face doesn't keep people they barely know drawing near and seeking compassion and empathy from them. The ill, the suffering, the weak – they are all drawn to the unconditional understanding and compassion an Empath emits. And Empaths emit it whether they want to or not.

That’s not to say Empaths can’t be mean and nasty people. They surely can be. But it’s usually those Empaths with the most profound sensitivity who have simply broken down inside and have no other way of keeping other’s emotions at bay. Again, these are Empaths who don’t know of their abilities.


Can you heal?

Most Empaths have the ability to heal. Yes, that means physically. This isn’t about Reiki or any other alternative modality – though they may seem similar in concept. An Empath heals instinctively, usually by drawing the pain or ailment out and accepting it into their own bodies. For obvious reasons, this is not recommended for anyone who doesn’t know how to keep from becoming ill in the process.

In today’s day and age, everyone seems to want to be psychic to some degree. That’s probably due our evolution as human beings. Assuming we’re evolving, and not regressing.. Therefore, many people reading this will likely think themselves Empathic. I cannot stress the following enough – there is nothing fun about being an Empath. It’s often a very draining and miserable existence in which you feel like you have to be entirely alone in order to survive. It is not glamorous, it is not exciting, it is painful more often than not.

My point here is this is not something one aspires to. If you’re an Empath, you will know this is you, you will not be saying “hmm.. maybe… hmm…” If you feel (without hesitation!) these apply to you as I’ve just described, then also know there are ways of coping, and I’ll get into them in future articles. With a little self-awareness you can turn your curse into gift, especially when it comes to being able to ease the emotional and physical pain of others.

[carpe noctem]

CBB, good job!!! And Carpe, love the pictures.  You seem like the nicest guy, and you are so darn funny.  Want to run away with me???  If the answers yes,  Ill be waiting on the corner with my "going to Grandmas bag , at 71st and Sheridan.

Thank you, Always. Sure thing! I warn you: I am a little directionally impaired though,
so be on the lookout for me... I will be at 59th & Washington for roughly an hour and
half looking like the guy who just lost something.

[Destiny]

CBB, good job!!! And Carpe, love the pictures.  You seem like the nicest guy, and you are so darn funny.  Want to run away with me???  If the answers yes,  Ill be waiting on the corner with my "going to Grandmas bag , at 71st and Sheridan.

Thank you, Always. Sure thing! I warn you: I am a little directionally impaired though,
so be on the lookout for me... I will be at 59th & Washington for roughly an hour and
half looking like the guy who just lost something.

Well....since you 2 are hooking up...do you Folks need a live-in gourmet chef...and interior decorator....I do windows too!

I'll be waiting on the corner of...Walk..and..Don't Walk...'till you pick me up...I'll be wearing a Chef's Hat and French Maid outfit.......

Des...

[always 1]

Giggle, Ok, Ill be looking for you both.  French Maid costume.  woo woo!

[Bearlyhere]

On a dutch blog   also the blog were "gielen " is 

It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up

Posted  by mr drs BOU.

Since the last broadcast of PR de Vries about the Holloway case is Joran van der Sloot vogelvrij fully explained. Doodsbedreigingen against him are on the Internet, the population of the Netherlands and environs has Joran guilty to the disappearance of the sweet, innocent, blond Natalee Holloway and Joran his life is no longer certain.

Why is not detained Joran? Why do not they close? Because his father is right, surely? Corruption in the judiciary! Vriendjespolitiek!

The truth is sometimes more complicated than we think. It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up, while the true culprits should be sought in the immediate vicinity of Natalee: Beth mother and her (now ex-) husband Jug Twitty. This stepfather of Natalee has relationships in the highest echelons of the government in Washington.

Beth and Jug Twitty, Natalee after the disappearance of two American privedetectives taken in the arm: Dan Young and Kelly Castillo. How reliable are these people, I do not know, but they tell a very different story about the disappearance of Natalee. On January 16, 2008, just before the broadcast of PR de Vries in which the criminal Patrick van der Eem his "boyfriend" Joran a beautiful story in the mouth explained, were Dan and Kelly to score on a talk show on Tele-Aruba. Not only do they say that Natalee two weeks after her disappearance was still alive, but they also have evidence of the lies that Beth says.

After Joran for the second time was arrested and released, they have that evidence presented to the Aruban police. The story of Dan and Kelly show that Joran is innocent, that Natalee wanted to run away from home because they Jug by her stepfather and that she was raped two weeks after her disappearance died of an overdose. If Dan and Kelly speak the truth, then Joran the victim of a smear campaign!

http://www.nwo-info.nl/2008/02/19/waarom-joran-niet-wordt-aangehouden/?cp=5

Joran is the victim of a pap smear?

[hotping]

On a dutch blog   also the blog were "gielen " is 

It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up

Posted  by mr drs BOU.

Since the last broadcast of PR de Vries about the Holloway case is Joran van der Sloot vogelvrij fully explained. Doodsbedreigingen against him are on the Internet, the population of the Netherlands and environs has Joran guilty to the disappearance of the sweet, innocent, blond Natalee Holloway and Joran his life is no longer certain.

Why is not detained Joran? Why do not they close? Because his father is right, surely? Corruption in the judiciary! Vriendjespolitiek!

The truth is sometimes more complicated than we think. It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up, while the true culprits should be sought in the immediate vicinity of Natalee: Beth mother and her (now ex-) husband Jug Twitty. This stepfather of Natalee has relationships in the highest echelons of the government in Washington.

Beth and Jug Twitty, Natalee after the disappearance of two American privedetectives taken in the arm: Dan Young and Kelly Castillo. How reliable are these people, I do not know, but they tell a very different story about the disappearance of Natalee. On January 16, 2008, just before the broadcast of PR de Vries in which the criminal Patrick van der Eem his "boyfriend" Joran a beautiful story in the mouth explained, were Dan and Kelly to score on a talk show on Tele-Aruba. Not only do they say that Natalee two weeks after her disappearance was still alive, but they also have evidence of the lies that Beth says.

After Joran for the second time was arrested and released, they have that evidence presented to the Aruban police. The story of Dan and Kelly show that Joran is innocent, that Natalee wanted to run away from home because they Jug by her stepfather and that she was raped two weeks after her disappearance died of an overdose. If Dan and Kelly speak the truth, then Joran the victim of a smear campaign!

http://www.nwo-info.nl/2008/02/19/waarom-joran-niet-wordt-aangehouden/?cp=5

Joran is the victim of a pap smear?

LMAO! 

[KYcat]

Good morning Monkeys
I stole this from the last thread(is there a easier way to bring a post over from the last thread?)

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Quote from: San on July 15, 2008, 11:00:47 PM
Quote from: LilPuma on July 15, 2008, 10:52:07 PM
Quote from: San on July 15, 2008, 09:52:34 PM
Quote from: klaasend on July 15, 2008, 09:51:19 PM
Quote from: Blonde on July 15, 2008, 09:45:32 PM
I don't know where she is but JMO she's in that bag. I just know it. 


I've always felt that Natalee could have been put in crypt, either someone that had already died or someone that died in the first week of June 2005.  It would require alot of approvals to even search a crypt let alone guessing which one to search.  Would be the perfect place to hide a body.


I agree.


It occurred to me more than once that maybe even Joran doesn't know where Natalee's remains are.  Could be someone told him they'd take care of it so there'd be no body and no case.  Go home, go to school.  Don't worry about this. 


I think they have her body and this is part of the reason that Paulus hasn't moved from that island.  He may think he has Aruba by the you know what but it is Aruba that has Paulus by the you know what.

KYKat:
Can't move.  VDS compound needs to be taken apart.  Evidence is still there. IMO

I think they are not quite stupid enough to keep her body right there on the van der sloot compound.I think the cemetary would be a perfect place to hide a body,IF her body is found in the cemetary,the van der sloots can STILL claim innocence.....something they wouldn't be able to do if she is found in thier garden IMO.

Karma:  to clarify - I did not say body - I said evidence - and yes IMO there is evidence there that will never be found because Aruba and the Dutch will never let it come out.  This is my opinion and my opinion only.  Didn't mean to offend you.   /color]

[WhiskeyGirl]

On a dutch blog   also the blog were "gielen " is 

It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up

Posted  by mr drs BOU.

Since the last broadcast of PR de Vries about the Holloway case is Joran van der Sloot vogelvrij fully explained. Doodsbedreigingen against him are on the Internet, the population of the Netherlands and environs has Joran guilty to the disappearance of the sweet, innocent, blond Natalee Holloway and Joran his life is no longer certain.

Why is not detained Joran? Why do not they close? Because his father is right, surely? Corruption in the judiciary! Vriendjespolitiek!

The truth is sometimes more complicated than we think. It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up, while the true culprits should be sought in the immediate vicinity of Natalee: Beth mother and her (now ex-) husband Jug Twitty. This stepfather of Natalee has relationships in the highest echelons of the government in Washington.

Beth and Jug Twitty, Natalee after the disappearance of two American privedetectives taken in the arm: Dan Young and Kelly Castillo. How reliable are these people, I do not know, but they tell a very different story about the disappearance of Natalee. On January 16, 2008, just before the broadcast of PR de Vries in which the criminal Patrick van der Eem his "boyfriend" Joran a beautiful story in the mouth explained, were Dan and Kelly to score on a talk show on Tele-Aruba. Not only do they say that Natalee two weeks after her disappearance was still alive, but they also have evidence of the lies that Beth says.

After Joran for the second time was arrested and released, they have that evidence presented to the Aruban police. The story of Dan and Kelly show that Joran is innocent, that Natalee wanted to run away from home because they Jug by her stepfather and that she was raped two weeks after her disappearance died of an overdose. If Dan and Kelly speak the truth, then Joran the victim of a smear campaign!

http://www.nwo-info.nl/2008/02/19/waarom-joran-niet-wordt-aangehouden/?cp=5

Joran is the victim of a pap smear?

I was thinking it makes Jug sound like "secret agent man".

[KYcat]

O/T...but something that might resonate with some of you....Sorry Klaas, please remove if innappropriate.  Klaas...I like your idea of a *FEELINGS* thread...

Destiny 


Read this and found aspects of it helpful.

http://hubpages.com/hub/Psychism--7-Signs-Youre-an-Empath



"Before I continue, let me just say Empath is not simply another name for a Clairsentient, though many Clairsentients are indeed Empaths. I’ll get into this more later. (Update: Click here to read my tips for Empaths.) That said, if you feel you’re a clairsentient looking for similar information on whether or not you are one, most of these signs will apply to you as well – but be aware those born into clairsentience (as opposed to those born as Empaths, who later harness it and become clairsentient) often can discern what others are feeling but do not actually SUFFER – which is a good way of telling which you are.

So let’s begin:

When in public, do you constantly feel overwhelmed with inexplicable emotions for which you can’t determine the reason?
Example. You drop by the mall one Saturday morning. You feel great. You get into the mall, walk past a crowd of people, and start feeling a bit strangely. It can be anything – you can feel very down, very angry, very sad, very excitable – the key word here is VERY. And you won’t have any explanation for it, you just feel it.

In other words, you’ve suddenly gone Bi-Polar without actually having the biological deficiency that causes it. And what’s worse, you can’t turn it off. You can carry on, trying to ignore it, but eventually it will be overwhelming to the point you just want to go home and be alone.
This is the reality of an Empath – one who hasn’t yet learned how to block other people’s emotions out. Being around other people is such a harrowing experience, most of them prefer to keep their own company, living the life of a hermit. And they usually find it very much worth it.

Do you experience other people's physical ailments?

This is most common with those you have an emotional connection, but can occur with anyone. A very good example of this would be suddenly feeling very lethargic and fatiqued, for no reason, and having to remain in bed for a day or two. You’re not sick – not really. You’re not ill. Yet, you feel that you are, profoundly. You later find out that your “illness” coincided with a lover’s or family member’s sudden fatigue (resulting from legitimate illness)– even though they were in another country at the time and you had no idea until after the fact. Symptoms can also manifest in the form of chest pains, cramps, migraines, etc – you basically experience it all, without contracting the actual illness.

Do you feel overwhelmed when watching something horrible in real life or even on television?

This one sounds silly, but viewing the news or depressing commercials designed to induce sympathy and open wallets, can debilitate an Empath for several hours. While most people get upset over homeless dogs and cats, an Empath will often feel like their hearts have been lanced. That’s a literal definition, by the way. It’s not something as shallow as sympathy or even regular empathy. It’s a feeling of guilt and moral empathy that cannot be easily assuaged. Crying is very common – and not just during that time of month when all the emotions are out of whack!

Do you ALWAYS know what someone really means?

In other words, can you always, always, always tell what it is someone meant to say to you? More importantly, can you tell why they didn’t? If an Empath is in person with someone and they’ve just been lied to, they will know. And they will know why. They will know if the other person is trying to spare feelings, they will know if malice was involved – in other words, they will know the intent. You cannot lie in the face of an Empath and not be caught out. While they will not usually be able to tell the specifics of what you’re hiding, they will know if you mean them well or not – no exceptions. This is more than good intuition. This isn’t a hunch, this is knowing.

Do you feel compelled to care for anyone in pain, no matter who they are and what they’ve done to you?

A true Empath cannot walk past someone suffering and not feel a need to stop and help that person. Homeless people can be particularly difficult, as they are everywhere and little can be done to help them unless the Empath has an occupation related to this. A true Empath feels compelled to go to anyone they feel pain from, be it angst or something physical. And a true Empath's compassion will usually be accepted on the spot – people in pain, no matter how they would normally react to strangers, will receive an Empath with open arms. They know, instinctively, that their pain matters to them.

Do people open up to you – even if you don’t want them to?

Some Empaths are the new-agey peace loving types – but many just want to be alone, because they have difficulty processing everything they absorb from other people. (This is usually because they have yet to realize their abilities and haven’t learned to deal with it yet.) For an Empath, however, putting on a grumpy face doesn't keep people they barely know drawing near and seeking compassion and empathy from them. The ill, the suffering, the weak – they are all drawn to the unconditional understanding and compassion an Empath emits. And Empaths emit it whether they want to or not.

That’s not to say Empaths can’t be mean and nasty people. They surely can be. But it’s usually those Empaths with the most profound sensitivity who have simply broken down inside and have no other way of keeping other’s emotions at bay. Again, these are Empaths who don’t know of their abilities.


Can you heal?

Most Empaths have the ability to heal. Yes, that means physically. This isn’t about Reiki or any other alternative modality – though they may seem similar in concept. An Empath heals instinctively, usually by drawing the pain or ailment out and accepting it into their own bodies. For obvious reasons, this is not recommended for anyone who doesn’t know how to keep from becoming ill in the process.

In today’s day and age, everyone seems to want to be psychic to some degree. That’s probably due our evolution as human beings. Assuming we’re evolving, and not regressing.. Therefore, many people reading this will likely think themselves Empathic. I cannot stress the following enough – there is nothing fun about being an Empath. It’s often a very draining and miserable existence in which you feel like you have to be entirely alone in order to survive. It is not glamorous, it is not exciting, it is painful more often than not.

My point here is this is not something one aspires to. If you’re an Empath, you will know this is you, you will not be saying “hmm.. maybe… hmm…” If you feel (without hesitation!) these apply to you as I’ve just described, then also know there are ways of coping, and I’ll get into them in future articles. With a little self-awareness you can turn your curse into gift, especially when it comes to being able to ease the emotional and physical pain of others.

Destiny, would you email me.  Klass, please give Destiny my email address.  I would like to discuss with you.  Thanks

[Destiny]

Sure KYcat....Look forward to your email...Destiny

[KYcat]

Okay, Klass is not here right now so I will ask again later.  In the meantime, I have some thoughts I would like to share.  I have not posted much because frankly I don't feel comfortable doing so.  My reason for reading and posting at this site is strictly for Natalee.  I do not have a hidden agenda and I am not a troll.  I want justice for Natalee and I want her brought home.  It's that simple.  I know I don't bring a lot of knowledge about the case to the board but I enjoy the discussions and the information that I learn from everyone.  It is about having something in common with someone.  That "someone" being the Monkeys because I have the same desires, agenda, goals, or whatever you want to label it.  I "felt" something 3 years ago when I learned of Natalee's fate.  Something happened to me and I can't explain it but I feel such a connection.  I know that is how the Monkeys feel so that is why I feel such a connection to this site.

I am rambling, so I will get to my final point.  When I have posted here, there are some who make you feel welcome and some who don't.  Nothing obvious, just that feeling.  Some people are welcomed with open arms and others are kept at a distance or not acknowledged.  I don't know if this is because some are leary of trolls which I totally understand.  Whatever the reasons, I have felt this way since I joined and I guess I finally just had to say something. 

So i guess there is really no point to this post.  Just had to get some things off my chest.

Thanks for listening.  I will continue to just read.

[Destiny]

Okay, Klass is not here right now so I will ask again later.  In the meantime, I have some thoughts I would like to share.  I have not posted much because frankly I don't feel comfortable doing so.  My reason for reading and posting at this site is strictly for Natalee.  I do not have a hidden agenda and I am not a troll.  I want justice for Natalee and I want her brought home.  It's that simple.  I know I don't bring a lot of knowledge about the case to the board but I enjoy the discussions and the information that I learn from everyone.  It is about having something in common with someone.  That "someone" being the Monkeys because I have the same desires, agenda, goals, or whatever you want to label it.  I "felt" something 3 years ago when I learned of Natalee's fate.  Something happened to me and I can't explain it but I feel such a connection.  I know that is how the Monkeys feel so that is why I feel such a connection to this site.

I am rambling, so I will get to my final point.  When I have posted here, there are some who make you feel welcome and some who don't.  Nothing obvious, just that feeling.  Some people are welcomed with open arms and others are kept at a distance or not acknowledged.  I don't know if this is because some are leary of trolls which I totally understand.  Whatever the reasons, I have felt this way since I joined and I guess I finally just had to say something. 

So i guess there is really no point to this post.  Just had to get some things off my chest.

Thanks for listening.  I will continue to just read.

(((((((((((((KYcat)))))))))))))))

Sending you Positive Energy....what you just posted took a Great amount of Strength!

Please keep posting...it's *real* posts like yours...that is the *glue* that keeps us all together for Natalee.

Realize how brave you are in sharing a very real part of yourSELF!

I really....really look forward to more of your posts...anyone online now that can send my email addy to KY?...if so...please do so...TIA

Destiny

[Blue Moon]

Okay, Klass is not here right now so I will ask again later.  In the meantime, I have some thoughts I would like to share.  I have not posted much because frankly I don't feel comfortable doing so.  My reason for reading and posting at this site is strictly for Natalee.  I do not have a hidden agenda and I am not a troll.  I want justice for Natalee and I want her brought home.  It's that simple.  I know I don't bring a lot of knowledge about the case to the board but I enjoy the discussions and the information that I learn from everyone.  It is about having something in common with someone.  That "someone" being the Monkeys because I have the same desires, agenda, goals, or whatever you want to label it.  I "felt" something 3 years ago when I learned of Natalee's fate.  Something happened to me and I can't explain it but I feel such a connection.  I know that is how the Monkeys feel so that is why I feel such a connection to this site.

I am rambling, so I will get to my final point.  When I have posted here, there are some who make you feel welcome and some who don't.  Nothing obvious, just that feeling.  Some people are welcomed with open arms and others are kept at a distance or not acknowledged.  I don't know if this is because some are leary of trolls which I totally understand.  Whatever the reasons, I have felt this way since I joined and I guess I finally just had to say something. 

So i guess there is really no point to this post.  Just had to get some things off my chest.

Thanks for listening.  I will continue to just read.

Hang in there (from one Kentuckian to another).  Look at the number of posts I do.  I just keep on keeping on because I have the same desire as everyone else here--BRING Natalee home and see the perps brought to justice AND the Ale, Ahata etc held accountable for what they have done to this family.  I sometimes have the same feelings but what the hay-I read, I post and ignore the petty part of blogging.  I have gone to a couple different blogs and believe me this one is for me.  So hang in there and post.  It makes a difference for Natalee and here family.

[Blonde]

FEELING'S Thread here
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=3106.msg399591#msg399591

[Destiny]

FEELING'S Thread here
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=3106.msg399591#msg399591

Thank You Blonde!!!...

Destiny

[carpe noctem]

On a dutch blog   also the blog were "gielen " is 

It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up

Posted  by mr drs BOU.

Since the last broadcast of PR de Vries about the Holloway case is Joran van der Sloot vogelvrij fully explained. Doodsbedreigingen against him are on the Internet, the population of the Netherlands and environs has Joran guilty to the disappearance of the sweet, innocent, blond Natalee Holloway and Joran his life is no longer certain.

Why is not detained Joran? Why do not they close? Because his father is right, surely? Corruption in the judiciary! Vriendjespolitiek!

The truth is sometimes more complicated than we think. It might be that Joran the victim of a U.S. cover-up, while the true culprits should be sought in the immediate vicinity of Natalee: Beth mother and her (now ex-) husband Jug Twitty. This stepfather of Natalee has relationships in the highest echelons of the government in Washington.

Beth and Jug Twitty, Natalee after the disappearance of two American privedetectives taken in the arm: Dan Young and Kelly Castillo. How reliable are these people, I do not know, but they tell a very different story about the disappearance of Natalee. On January 16, 2008, just before the broadcast of PR de Vries in which the criminal Patrick van der Eem his "boyfriend" Joran a beautiful story in the mouth explained, were Dan and Kelly to score on a talk show on Tele-Aruba. Not only do they say that Natalee two weeks after her disappearance was still alive, but they also have evidence of the lies that Beth says.

After Joran for the second time was arrested and released, they have that evidence presented to the Aruban police. The story of Dan and Kelly show that Joran is innocent, that Natalee wanted to run away from home because they Jug by her stepfather and that she was raped two weeks after her disappearance died of an overdose. If Dan and Kelly speak the truth, then Joran the victim of a smear campaign!

http://www.nwo-info.nl/2008/02/19/waarom-joran-niet-wordt-aangehouden/?cp=5

Joran is the victim of a pap smear?

I was thinking it makes Jug sound like "secret agent man".

I am embarrassed to admit, I used to expend actual energy
(wasted) getting mad at that dumb Rene Gielen.

NOT ANYMORE.

Someone needs to confront that bi*** and tell her what a ludicrous,
bizarre, wacko, nut-job she is.


That person will not be me. I have actual stuff to do!


She is a floating unsavory unmentionable > in a punch bowl.

THAT IS YOU, RENE. Stick with being a VET you hooker, because Steven

Spielberg you AIN'T.

[Blonde]

Do you want me to try to move these threads to  the feelings thread

San I don't know how to move this page to feelings HELPPPPPPPP

[carpe noctem]

I am not an "Empath" like Destiny. I really don't know what has gripped me for 3+ years. I have STRONG feelings about this case that I can't explain in "Earthly" terms. I just feel that the family of Natalee is at more peace than we are now. 

I think you can include Natalee in those peaceful sentiments, Wreck. It's my own personal faith and I don't wish to impose it on anyone else, but Christian scripture teaches that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord. Natalee is home. We are the ones who are away from home for a time.

The compelling thing about this case, for me, is the injustice that surrounds those who have committed this crime and the pain that it has brought to those who Natalee left behind. Beth's courage, strength, and determination has been gut wrenching and inspirational. Dave's disappointments, patience, and valiant efforts tug at my heart. The venom of the attack on Natalee's character continues to make me rage and the contrast between who Natalee was and who those bastards are that killed her, is so stark it's blinding. The madness of knowing enough sure evidence, as all of us who have been here and followed the case do, while no one is held accountable, makes it so hard to let it go. The whole thing screams at our sense of right and wrong, beautiful and ugly, tragedy and mockery.

So we stay and we stand. We stand with the girl, because as long as we are here, the final chapter isn't written. We refuse to let it end like this and as long as we are here we collectively hold back the current circumstances as an epitaph. This forum is made up of good hearted, caring people. It's right that we are keepers of this noble and right cause. I think we feel the sense of responsibility. We can hold on without being destroyed by it. I'm not sure it was meant for the family to never emotionally seek closure. Maybe in order to live with and honor Natalee's memory, they have had to find some place within themselves to not be eaten away by it.

I will never, ever, forget the night that Joran's "confession" was being heard, transcribed and posted on this forum. It came in pieces and it was in the light of Beth's video reacting to what was being unveiled to us in pieces. I was posting the translations, as were others, through tears. It was a corner, I believe, for the family. It was a corner even for a faithful monkey named Robots! I felt a sense of validation, and incredible sadness. Even though we all knew we weren't hearing the whole truth, we were witnessing Joran's acknowledgement of Natalee and her death. We saw Joran expose a glimpse of his true nature and we knew the world was watching it as well. The family so desperately needed exactly what Joran was handing them. The family will never give up on Justice and will always pursue it passionately, but we were watching the seed of healing being planted by the only one who possessed it.

Most of us need a different seed for closure. I believe we will witness it one day, and we and the family will end up at the same place when it's harvest time.

Natalee is everybody's girl.

She strikes a chord in all of us.

Nat could be your cousin, niece, sister, daughter,

grandaughter, or your sweetheart.

The worst part about losing her is the being lied to about it!

It leaves your mind wondering about
all of the different possible scenarios
of what could have happened to her that night.

In doing that, the suspects dug their own graves. They deserve
what they are getting, a lot worse actually.

If you ever want to write a book about how lies
can destroy lives, look no further than every
move Aruba has made in this catastrophic event
they have THE NERVE to call a "CASE."

The people who made it a CASE, do not live in Aruba.

ALE was apparently trying to investigate
a Joran Van der sloot bicycle theft,
not a Natalee Holloway rape/murder case.

They are a joke. They continue on being a joke.

One day, when the movie is made about it,

Aruba will be watching it with MAXIMUM EMBARRASSMENT.

I hope the whole island gets burned right into the ground over it.

I could care less. Yes, I am proud to say that I'm happy it will happen

over JUST ONE GIRL! 'Cuz that one girl that I am talking about,

is Natalee Holloway.

Natalee is everybody's girl.

[klaasend]

I'll move the posts 

[klaasend]

I'll move the posts 

Actually, i won't move the posts will leave them here and new posts can be made in the Feelings thread.

FYI - I have the cable guy coming out shortly to move my connection so I will be without internet for a while this evening.