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Author Topic: Natalee Case Discussion #766 7/22 - 8/5/08  (Read 241614 times)
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Buckeye
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« Reply #620 on: July 30, 2008, 05:58:38 PM »

Robert, on the front page, explained the Dutch "naming" order.  I think he said the fourth name, before the surname, is the godfather.  Made me think that Joran perhaps was not baptized because I never saw a fourth name.  Maybe there is no "official" godfather. 
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CapsLockWizard
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« Reply #621 on: July 30, 2008, 05:59:29 PM »

WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT ANTONIO CARLO:

1- He is, and always has been, Joran's main attorney.
2- He sat on the Board Selection Committee for AHATA at the time Natalee went missing and during the investigation
3- He would have had an influential position with AHATA and another board selection committee member, Marlene Purcell.
4- Marlene Purcell was AHATA's internet expert.
5- His position on AHATA's board could have influenced AHATA's media and internet campaign to trash Natalee's reputation and accuse Beth of things such as insurance fraud.
6- He is Paulus Van der Sloot's business partner.


WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT BEN VOCKING:

1- He is by his own admission a very close friend of the Van der Sloot family, particularly Paulus.
2- He worked in Prosecutor Karin Jannsen's office at the time Natalee went missing.
3- He took a leave of absence from his job in the Prosecutor's right after Natalee went missing.
4- He took his leave of absence by his own admission to help his friend Paulus in his time of need, a clear conflict of interest in any case, particularly bad in a murder case where his friend's son was known to be involved.
5- He was at the Van der Sloot house with Dutch Judge Bob Wit when the Prosecutor and Aruban Police were blocked by the judge's order from searching the main residence and surrounding property.
6- He was verbally reprimanded for his obvious conflict of interest by Karin Jannsen but no penalties were ever given for his indisgressions.
7- He had worked in other powerful Aruba government offices, including KIA.


FEEL FREE TO ADD.


all of them worked for the interest of the governent. The Real Proseucter that has a lot to say in youth issue is Frans Duetekom.
Frans Duetekom is the real person that had what to say in the case. and this is a fact from internal source.


 
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Buckeye
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« Reply #622 on: July 30, 2008, 06:04:43 PM »

I am open to anyone covering up or disposing of Natalee.  What I want to know is why they felt they needed to do that.  What did they do to her that would have such repercussions that they would dispose of her?  Accident and/or innocence does not equate with the action.
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« Reply #623 on: July 30, 2008, 06:04:57 PM »

CAPS how can we watch that movie, and can Natalee's body be recovered in  your opinion??
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« Reply #624 on: July 30, 2008, 06:07:08 PM »

CAPS, you mean that Joran is innocent of killing Natalee, but why did she die then?  And why did they have to get rid of her body?  Do you know where the body is now?  Can it be recovered??

Yes the body is recoverable but the Maze has many walkways. Trying to figure out which one.

I hope I have not open my self for problems.... I know we are beeing watched by HM.

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« Reply #625 on: July 30, 2008, 06:09:29 PM »

Thank you CAPS, please be careful!!! Have to go now.  Thanks for your replys.  A-1
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« Reply #626 on: July 30, 2008, 06:19:13 PM »

in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Caps..Respectfully…From what we have learnt about Simian/Merian/Armin…he was full of it, himself as well. He posted from work, during work days, both as Simian and Merian. He was paid to post….MOO

Of course you can read what you want from his posts…

But, knowing this, I now take them all with a bag of salt...
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CapsLockWizard
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« Reply #627 on: July 30, 2008, 06:43:21 PM »

in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Caps..Respectfully…From what we have learnt about Simian/Merian/Armin…he was full of it, himself as well. He posted from work, during work days, both as Simian and Merian. He was paid to post….MOO

Of course you can read what you want from his posts…

But, knowing this, I now take them all with a bag of salt...



The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.
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« Reply #628 on: July 30, 2008, 06:46:34 PM »

CAPS, I dont know the answer to your question, can I ask you one more??  An older monkey feels her body could be under a building, am I close???
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« Reply #629 on: July 30, 2008, 06:48:21 PM »



I have a question also please...not Shango/Simean related though...

Does anyone remember anything about the bartender that was working at C&C's when Natalee was there...Clive Van der Linde I believe his name was....the way I understand it is he left Aruba 2 weeks after Natalee went missing....my question:  Was he ever questioned?....TIA....
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Nut44x4
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RIP Grumpy Cat :( I will miss you.


« Reply #630 on: July 30, 2008, 06:51:02 PM »

Somewhere here we have a list of the dead after Natalee went missing...not sure where to locate that, will look.
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« Reply #631 on: July 30, 2008, 06:51:20 PM »

I think Caps is on to that "damning evidence" we have all thought/hoped is really out there. That said, I still believe that Joran is THE responsible perp of Natalee's demise (although Carlo et al won't ever come out and say it in these "filmed" revelations.)

If these filmed revelations exist and Caps has seen them -- I still have the gut feeling our FBI has seen them as well  -- they know!

I will repeat again.................. it has been awfully, eerily quiet from all involved since about March. JMO
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RIP Grumpy Cat :( I will miss you.


« Reply #632 on: July 30, 2008, 06:53:01 PM »

This may help.... http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2805.0
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« Reply #633 on: July 30, 2008, 06:57:28 PM »

There may be more in our Murder and Crime on Aruba thread, but I seemed to have forgotten where that is.....ughh. 
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« Reply #634 on: July 30, 2008, 06:58:08 PM »



I have a question also please...not Shango/Simean related though...

Does anyone remember anything about the bartender that was working at C&C's when Natalee was there...Clive Van der Linde I believe his name was....the way I understand it is he left Aruba 2 weeks after Natalee went missing....my question:  Was he ever questioned?....TIA....

As far as I know he was not questioned.  I know for a fact information regarding Clive was sent to the family investigators so hopefully someone has tracked him down by now.
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RIP Grumpy Cat :( I will miss you.


« Reply #635 on: July 30, 2008, 07:00:45 PM »

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=188.0
Topic: Murder and Crime Rate In Aruba  (Read 76178 times)
There it is....the thread is huge 
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« Reply #636 on: July 30, 2008, 07:15:07 PM »

TONIGHT ON DANA PRETZER:

The Dana Pretzer Show On Scared Monkeys Radio - Listen LIVE TONIGHT at 9PM
Eastern - Guests Include Drew Peterson, Joel Brodsky and Robin Sax

Dana delivers a huge show this week with the following guests and topics:

    * Drew Peterson (husband of missing Stacy Ann Peterson) and his
attorney Joel Brodsky ask, “Is Len Wawczak Drew Peterson’s Mark
Fuhrman?” With the recent revelations regarding apparent undercover
recordings made of Drew Peterson, will the media’s coverage of this hurt
or help Drew Peterson?
    * Robin Sax, LA County District Attorney, will join us to analyze the
discussion immediately afterwards.

LISTEN LIVE TONIGHT - HERE - AT 9PM EASTERN



www.scaredmonkeysradio.com
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Rob
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« Reply #637 on: July 30, 2008, 07:39:28 PM »

I have been told that Joran's godfather was Comemencia.  So who it it?


STom:
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 4:13 pm Post subject:

Most likely since years back, private and public tourism authorities and law enforcement officials had an underlying agreement not to report crimes against tourists because they were detrimental to their image of pure, safe and uncorrupted island paradise. This unwritten law was easy to implement because incidents were so infrequent, that they could report them as missing persons. From 1996 through 2002, they had three disappearances reported. Not bad. An average of one disappearance every 24 months.

When Natalee’s incident occurred, Joran told Paulus about the “accident” and Paulus immediately thought of the island team in charge of “missing” people cases. Paulus had worked a few years back for the prosecutors office, as Antonio Carlo’s subordinate and had learned how Arubian authorities initiated these patriotic techniques, to preserve both, the island's economic sovereignty and the aspirational image of its criminals, which are portrayed as selective for going after illegal immigrants and locals only, not tourists.

Paulus was not totally frank about the incident. He just called his compadre Edwin -Papito- Commemencia and reported the case. Papito called the “missing” squad and they got rid of Natalee. They assumed this was just going to be one more case where Police authorities give the family of the victim the runaround; they give up and go home to light candles. They weren’t counting on Beth’s obsessive, unrelentless, persistent, annoying character.

The media started coming to Aruba and the news began spreading. What to do … that was the big question. The police, ATA and AHATA met. They agreed that they were going to show the family and the US that they care and are willing to do everything to find their missing daughter. “ Hey”, they said, “Maybe this will be good for us. All these cameras will put our island in the forefront”. The craziness begins and Arubian arrivistes show their faces in front of the spotlight.

When one week later the authorities figured out that the threesome was responsible for the crime and they envisioned the consequences of having an international coverage of the case and the investigation, it’s already too late. They can’t go back and undo what they have done, because the “missing” scheme would be revealed and that would mean the definite end of existence of the thriving Arubian tourism industry. Since then on, the madness and the lies have not stopped.

As Dompig stated in the Vanity Fair interview, they thought they were dealing with a normal family. By that he meant families like those of Richard Henríquez, Gary Makings and Willard Larson, all missing in Aruba never to be found.

Igsigs:
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 9:02 pm Post subject:

STom

Edwin Commemencia

That is a name that is rarely brought up in this case. What do you know about him

STom
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2006 11:10 pm Post subject:

igsigs

At the beginning of the investigation Papito Comemencia was very active as police spokesperson. I understand he is the officer that Joran considers his Godfather and uncle, not van der Straaten. He is -or at least was- very close to the van der Sloots.

Dompig was in charge of the interrogations back then. If you recall, he is the one that got the “confession” out of Joran on the 10th or 11th of June 2005, but it could not be admitted because the time duration of the interrogation exceeded the limit allowed for a minor.

A few weeks into the case, both Comemencia and Dompig sort of vanished and all focus turn to Jan van der Straaten. Most likely this was an Arubian strategy to point the finger at the Dutch, and steer the blame away from them.

Some of Comemencia’s key moments include reporting the different and dive searches, reporting beforehand that Paulus would request the court to allow permission to see Joran in jail, informing that nothing was found on the van der Sloot’s property search, telling Beth that blood had been found on the Kalpoe’s car, insinuating that more people were involved and in general, creating confusion and false expectations.

He is supposed to be Papi the Butterfly, the person that Simian/Merian Webster supposedly stated could unravel this whole mess. This is what I recall reading, but I guess an SM T&S lover could confirm this or not.

More by STom:

Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 11:31 am Post subject:

Rocky:

Comemencia could have bvery well alerted ahead of time about searches, but I don't know if he did or not. What matters is that he is the one that has the personal relationship with the van der Sloots and not van der Straaten, he is the one that Joran considers his uncle and Godfather, he is the one that was very present until they passed the ball to the Chief of Police, and he is the one that distorted information to confuse the public opinion as far as the investigation was concerned.

One example is telling Beth about blood in the Kalpoe’s car. Most likely he did it to handle Beth, in order to shift her vision of primary responsibility from Joran to the brothers. Just guessing, though.

Also, Comemencia often stated or implied that the FBI was involved in the investigative process, when that was not the case.

Quote:
Police and FBI agents searched for Holloway for a ninth day today, but a lack of any solid leads was hindering progress, they said. The FBI was asked to bring in dogs trained to search for people, police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said.

Quote:
Two divers among the eight FBI agents in Aruba have been searching the waters surrounding the island, police spokesman Edwin Comemencia said.

I believe Comemencia's comments about FBI’s participation was part of a predefined strategy to imply that the FBI was involved, so ALE probably used the FBI initially to fit its purposes.


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« Reply #638 on: July 30, 2008, 07:41:36 PM »

in meriam hernerst post, it was mention the Fathers, but I think what she ment was the god Father

Los Padrinos = the Godfather
Los Padres is what we have come up with but I do believe it is "los padrinos" depend with Morse phonetic you use.


The people that despose of the body where the Lawyers, Joran himslef was home becuase he was driven home. Joran do know till the shaking and where Natalee got sick but then he went to call for help. he did not call the police but his Godfather who is a Lawyer. Here is still a problem on how he got hold of him. but the person that came to help was the godfather supported by Ben king.

They despose of the Body. Mean while Joran went Home. Joran spend only 2 half hour only with her. 

Now about the lies. When some one lie he will not remeber the same verse exactly. But when someone is telling a truth, this is when you know the facts exactly of what has happend.  The desposal of in the Ocean is a speculation because he did not know what has happend. The issue of his father given him a phone in KIA is correct because he remeber in datail how it was done. When they question Paules on this issue, he denied. Also Paules was reading all the statments of all withness and who was interogated, and pass it to Joran in Jail, Joran had know exaclty what and who said what on him about the case. This is  becuase Ben King was the Assistant of the Chief Prosecuter and passed all the info to Paules who has free access to visit his Son.








Caps..Respectfully…From what we have learnt about Simian/Merian/Armin…he was full of it, himself as well. He posted from work, during work days, both as Simian and Merian. He was paid to post….MOO

Of course you can read what you want from his posts…

But, knowing this, I now take them all with a bag of salt...



The only person that could have give me an answer on "the seven Level of Inferno" was an old priest.

I have a question

Who else died in the week of Natalee went Missing. There must have been.



Caps, are you alluding to the fact that there may be more than 1 body in a burial container or that bodies were switched?
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« Reply #639 on: July 30, 2008, 07:46:15 PM »



I have a question also please...not Shango/Simean related though...

Does anyone remember anything about the bartender that was working at C&C's when Natalee was there...Clive Van der Linde I believe his name was....the way I understand it is he left Aruba 2 weeks after Natalee went missing....my question:  Was he ever questioned?....TIA....

As far as I know he was not questioned.  I know for a fact information regarding Clive was sent to the family investigators so hopefully someone has tracked him down by now.

Thanks Klaasend...sure wish they would let us in on some of their "little" secrets....it would be interesting to read what he had to say....thanks again....
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