Natalee Case Discussion #768 9/9 through 9/15/08

[ala_gunslinger]

btw - hey moonshine monkey!!! 

What's up old friend?

[Rob]

think about this - if Joran's stories are not real and not believable by the prosecutor, ask yourselves why?

is it because they have known for three + years the real story?

I think most of us think they have known since shortly after Natalee went missing...we just don't know for sure what they know...perhaps we may find out...

nut - if she is in a crypt and it is discovered as so... that will be the final nail for Aruba... it will prove the conspiracy and it will wipe out Aruba forever.

I don't think it should take as long as the ocean search to find out if this is correct. It should hopefully be just days.

[Rob]

btw - hey moonshine monkey!!! 

What's up old friend?

same as you GS, praying that this is all about to be over.

[MumInOhio]

If someone has answered -- I missed it! WHO is spear-heading this latest effort? Who asked Tim to return to Aruba? Is OUR Government/FBI involved?

LOL...wreck...I don't think you missed it, don't think it has been answered...I don't know, sure would like to though...

[Blonde]

The day that Renfro created the big diversion and led everyone on the wild goose chase wasn't June 6th, was it?

I think it was the 9th maybe even the 10-11

It may have been the 6th that van der Straten made some sort of announcment. I know he made a few, but I was thinking it was the one about Natalee no longer being alive. There is something sticking in my mind about the 6th.

Friday, July 01, 2005
What Does van der Straten Know About Natalee Holloway?

h/t to Hasibokus - read more there.

In a Dutch interview Aruban Police Superintendent Jan van der Straten told the reporter that he doesn’t believe that Natalee is still alive.

With regard to Natalee’s status, van der Straaten gave the following statement to a Dutch reporter:

Translation:

Rep: Any hopes for a positive outcome?

Jan: You always have to be hopeful, but I don’t believe anymore that we will find Natalee alive.

Rep: Why not?

Jan: Because I know the details of the investigation and you don't!

Update: Apparently the translation was first provided by reader repo.

Update2 from a reader:

The correct translation of what Mr. Van der Straten said, i.e., Omdat ik het
onderzoek ken en u niet, is: "Because I am an investigator (a policeman) and you
are not." 

It is not, as earlier reported, "Because I know the details and you don't."

Friday, July 01, 2005 at 03:09 PM in Natalee Holloway | Permalink

http://www.riehlworldview.com/carnivorous_conservative/2005/07/what_does_van_d.html

[klaasend]

If someone has answered -- I missed it! WHO is spear-heading this latest effort? Who asked Tim to return to Aruba? Is OUR Government/FBI involved?

I'm not sure WHO in the USA is involved.  My personal opinion is none of this would be happening right now if it weren't for Capslockwizard.

[BUCKSHOT]

think about this - if Joran's stories are not real and not believable by the prosecutor, ask yourselves why?

is it because they have known for three + years the real story?

I think most of us think they have known since shortly after Natalee went missing...we just don't know for sure what they know...perhaps we may find out...

nut - if she is in a crypt and it is discovered as so... that will be the final nail for Aruba... it will prove the conspiracy and it will wipe out Aruba forever.

I don't think it should take as long as the ocean search to find out if this is correct. It should hopefully be just days.

If she was placed in a crypt...

I am sure they have already visited the crypt, had her removed, and transported the body to another secret location.

Unlike most other crimes, law enforcement needs to lock up law enforcement to solve this case. That may necer happen, unfortunately.

Additionally, Aruba knows that the body can never be discovered as it would signify the proverbial "nail in the coffin." Those, who allegedly seek to find the body, are doubled as those responsible for hiding it from the world.

[wreck]

If someone has answered -- I missed it! WHO is spear-heading this latest effort? Who asked Tim to return to Aruba? Is OUR Government/FBI involved?

I'm not sure WHO in the USA is involved.  My personal opinion is none of this would be happening right now if it weren't for Capslockwizard.

Thank-you! I know you can't tell us who "Caps" is -- but can you give us a hint of his "stature" or profession in Aruba?

[ala_gunslinger]

Klaas, would you mind sending Destiny my email please?

Thanks!

[Patriot]

think about this - if Joran's stories are not real and not believable by the prosecutor, ask yourselves why?

is it because they have known for three + years the real story?

I think most of us think they have known since shortly after Natalee went missing...we just don't know for sure what they know...perhaps we may find out...

nut - if she is in a crypt and it is discovered as so... that will be the final nail for Aruba... it will prove the conspiracy and it will wipe out Aruba forever.

I don't think it should take as long as the ocean search to find out if this is correct. It should hopefully be just days.

If she was placed in a crypt...

I am sure they have already visited the crypt, had her removed, and transported the body to another secret location.

Unlike most other crimes, law enforcement needs to lock up law enforcement to solve this case. That may necer happen, unfortunately.

Additionally, Aruba knows that the body can never be discovered as it would signify the proverbial "nail in the coffin." Those, who allegedly seek to find the body, are doubled as those responsible for hiding it from the world.

BINGO! My Thoughts Exactly

[BUCKSHOT]

ALE: What happened, Joran?

Joran: Well, we drugged her, then we raped her. While we were doing it, she accidentally died so we took it upon ourselves to bury her body along with my Dad's help.

ALE: Quit making up stories, Joran, you are probably stoned. The story you just gave me is complete bullshit. Matter of fact, I am going to throw away the tapes from this interrogation due to your story being so far-fetched.

Joran: But I am telling the truth, sir...

ALE: I've had enough...Eight more days in jail for you...

Eight days later, extensive coaching, cell phone conversations from jail...

ALE: OK, Joran, are you ready to tell me the truth now?

Joran: Yes. We gave her a ride home from CnC to her hotel, the Holiday Inn, and two BLACK security guards took it from there. Maybe she was kidnapped.

ALE: Much better, Joran. You are free to go home. We have to go arrest those son-of-a-bitch security guards. Have a nice day...Tell your dad that we said hello.

[wreck]

IF Natalee is/was in a crypt -- they should have searched FIRST before running a story in Diario and confronting Mos. I would still like to believe they have already recovered at least some part of Natalee -- they have been waiting for the "break" of a rock solid case to go public.

[Rob]

no 'r00ba trolls yet either

so they either don't knows what's happening - or are about to find out.

the onslaught this time should be good fer a few chuckles.

[wreck]

Did part II run in diario today?

[ala_gunslinger]

no 'r00ba trolls yet either

so they either don't knows what's happening - or are about to find out.

the onslaught this time should be good fer a few chuckles.

Have you ever tried to boil a frog?

If you toss a frog into a pot of boiling water, it will jump out.

If you put a frog in a pot of room temperature water and slowly bring it to boil, the frog will stay in the pot.

[wreck]

no 'r00ba trolls yet either

so they either don't knows what's happening - or are about to find out.

the onslaught this time should be good fer a few chuckles.

Have you ever tried to boil a frog?

If you toss a frog into a pot of boiling water, it will jump out.

If you put a frog in a pot of room temperature water and slowly bring it to boil, the frog will stay in the pot.

I don't think Kermit is going to appreciate that post! 

[Destiny]

Hey all ya'll!   Sounds like some 'news' from ruba?

What happened to the Shango thread?

Hey Guns....Good to C-Ya...btw, do you have my email?...if so, pls email me...TIA...Des

Hi Des!  I'm sorry, but I don't have your email.

S'all right...just some of that *feelings* stuff you asked about a long time ago on the feelings thread...saw you had posted...will go through my 10,000+ emails and find your addy...Des

[ala_gunslinger]

Hey all ya'll!   Sounds like some 'news' from ruba?

What happened to the Shango thread?

Hey Guns....Good to C-Ya...btw, do you have my email?...if so, pls email me...TIA...Des

Hi Des!  I'm sorry, but I don't have your email.

S'all right...just some of that *feelings* stuff you asked about a long time ago on the feelings thread...saw you had posted...will go through my 10,000+ emails and find your addy...Des

Des, you have mail

[johan555]

OM: Dam Monserat previously investigated
September 11, 2008, 15:30 (GMT -04:00)


ORANJESTAD - The investigation into the missing teenager Natalee Holloway has not shown that her body in the dam of Monserat. "The dam is twice examined in the investigation of Holloway and recently in the vermissingzaak Vincenzo Tromp," said Ann Angela, spokesman for the Public Prosecutor (OM)

According to the PPS, it is not true that a special investigation team from the Netherlands, as yesterday morning newspaper Diario reported to the barrier further. Angela: "During the investigations into Holloway and Tromp is no indication that found in the dam a cadaver or something else burdensome."
The morning newspaper announces that finally proved that what an Aruban witness has stated, is the the truth .
 This would witness a leugendetectortest (liedetector)in the United States have undergone and have been successful.
According to the newspaper, the man stated that he on the night of May 30, 2005, about four hours, was awakened by the barking of dogs. When he looked out the window, he saw a person under a lamppost in the direction of his house ran. This person came from the direction of the field of soccer club Nacional (North), near the dam of Monserat.
According to the witness was a white man, who wore a shoe and wet with mud besmeurde clothes on. Diario writes that this witness is afraid to provide further details to explain because he knows that Paul van der Sloot, the father of suspect Joran, still has good connections with the gouvernment and OM. However, now by the judiciary in the Netherlands and FBI action be taken now witnessing the leugendetectortest has achieved, says the newspaper, in reporting again the capacities of Chief Hans Mos questionable.
In response Angela says that the OM has a suspect whom this witness can be. "Certainly we do not know because the identity of the witness is not known. It is not that the barrier now under examination. "

The investigation into the missing American teenager is still underway. At the end of this year, the criminal investigation and decide whether Justice suspect Joran van der Sloot is prosecuted or not.

---------------------
dutch

OM: Dam Monserat al eerder onderzocht
11 Sep, 2008, 15:30 (GMT -04:00)

ORANJESTAD — Uit het onderzoek naar de verdwenen tiener Natalee Holloway is nergens gebleken, dat haar lichaam zich in de dam van Monserat bevindt. “ De dam is bovendien twee keer onderzocht; in het onderzoek van Holloway en recentelijk in de vermissingzaak Vincenzo Tromp”, aldus Ann Angela, woordvoerder van het Openbaar Ministerie (OM)

Volgens het OM is het niet waar dat een speciaal onderzoeksteam uit Nederland komt, zoals ochtendkrant Diario gisteren berichtte, om de dam verder te onderzoeken. Angela:“Tijdens de onderzoeken naar Holloway en Tromp is geen enkele aanwijzing gevonden dat in de dam een stoffelijk overschot of iets anders belastend ligt.”
De ochtendkrant meldt ook dat eindelijk bewezen is dat wat een Arubaanse getuige heeft verklaard, de waarheid blijkt te zijn. Deze getuige zou namelijk een leugendetectortest in de Verenigde Staten hebben ondergaan en daarvoor zijn geslaagd.
Volgens de krant heeft de man verklaard dat hij in de nacht van 30 mei 2005, omstreeks vier uur, wakker werd door het geblaf van honden. Toen hij uit het raam keek, zag hij onder een lantaarnpaal een persoon die in de richting van zijn huis liep. Deze persoon kwam van de richting van het veld van voetbalclub Nacional (Noord), vlakbij de dam van Monserat.
Volgens de getuige ging het om een blanke man, die één schoen droeg en natte met modder besmeurde kleren aan had. Diario schrijft dat deze getuige bang is om nadere details te verklaren omdat hij weet dat Paul van der Sloot, de vader van verdachte Joran, nog steeds goede connecties heeft met het OM. Toch zou nu door justitie in Nederland en FBI actie worden ondernomen nu de getuige de leugendetectortest heeft gehaald, aldus de krant, die in de berichtgeving wederom de capaciteiten van hoofdofficier Hans Mos betwijfeld.
In een reactie zegt Angela dat het OM een vermoeden heeft wie deze getuige kan zijn. “Zeker weten we het niet omdat de identiteit van de getuige niet bekend is gemaakt. Het is in ieder geval niet zo dat de dam nu weer wordt onderzocht.”

Het onderzoek naar de verdwenen Amerikaanse tiener is nog steeds gaande. Eind van dit jaar wordt het strafrechtelijk onderzoek afgesloten en beslist justitie of verdachte Joran van der Sloot wordt vervolgd of niet.

[Destiny]

Haven't seen this posted yet...but one *one* of my phone calls to Aruba today....not too long ago...was told that MOS is stalling meeting with Tim/TES today...Tim has to have the paperwork to search Monserat Pond....Mos must issue it b'cuz this is an ongoing case.....email from this am below....they phone call I made was this afternoon....Tim still not able to get into a meeting with MOS....Des

EMAIL 9:02 this AM...


    Hallo xxxxxx;
     
    I don't know if the witness has met with Paulus van der Sloot, but that is the other declaration that the witness has done with the polygraphic test.
    But today in the newspaper we published that Tim Miller want to meet with Fiscal Mos to have an aprobation to search the ponds of Monserat.
    I let you know as soon I have more information.
     
    Have a nice day
xxxxxx