Natalee Case Discussion #768 9/9 through 9/15/08

[BUCKSHOT]

Didn't Mos say that in order to prosecute the case he would
need a witness or a confession?

Hey, Hans Mos, you have had both a confession and a witness.
When you gonna prosecute?

Well to Mos they don't jive...the confession was on the beach and the witness saw him at a pond. So that is Mos excuse this time, I suppose.

So pick one.  He said either or.
Supposedly there is yet another confession out there that has not been made public.
Joran made another confession since he has been in Thailand.

Well, I will say this...if the reason they denied Paulus compensation was due to someone seeing Paulus at the ATM in the jeep and this witness says he saw him too..then that tome is corroborating evidence.  But Mos won't see it that way...as far as he is concerned Joran said he was on the beach and she died accidentally that night.

Never thought of that, very good point. Corroboration.

Red jeep observed by witness at approximately 4am.
Red jeep observed at McDonalds with Joran (and Natalee) at approximately 4am.

Sounds like the red jeep was busy that night.
The operator was definitley not soundly sleeping in his bed as reported.
He did not seem to remember a phone call in the middle of the night.

Passenger was definitely not home looking at porn @315am.
Passenger did not ride home in a Honda.

[SS]

Didn't Mos say that in order to prosecute the case he would
need a witness or a confession?

Hey, Hans Mos, you have had both a confession and a witness.
When you gonna prosecute?

Unfortunately I feel you have to fight fire with fire.  When someone decides to expose everyone in the video they made they will do anything not to make it public.  It will crush Aruba.  JMO

So who do you all think has the video made at the Apartment?  My guess would be the Kalpoes.

I always thought Deepak had a copy.  Paulus made a trip to Florida and we all think it was to retrieve the video.  So who ever he got the video from must have a copy.

SOMEONE WILL GET CAUGHT IN A CRIME AND THEY WILL OFFER THAT VIDEO UP.  IF THE FBI DOESN'T HAVE A COPY ALREADY.

I agree that eventually that tape will emerge, either intentionally or accidently.  I wouldn't be surprised if it's already being used for blackmail.  There are lots of people on that tape and from what we learned Natalee was not the only female.  There was "Mary and Mary who was not a virgin aka JR".  Could you imagine if the video turns up 75 years from now with a bunch of old junk in a garage sale on Aruba.

[BUCKSHOT]

Until the Kalpoes are squeezed we will never know what happened.

Makes ya wonder just how they fit in to this whole thing...

Drug administrator, present during expiration, OR self-employed as midnight coroners.

[SS]

Didn't Mos say that in order to prosecute the case he would
need a witness or a confession?

Hey, Hans Mos, you have had both a confession and a witness.
When you gonna prosecute?

Well to Mos they don't jive...the confession was on the beach and the witness saw him at a pond. So that is Mos excuse this time, I suppose.

So pick one.  He said either or.
Supposedly there is yet another confession out there that has not been made public.
Joran made another confession since he has been in Thailand.

Well, I will say this...if the reason they denied Paulus compensation was due to someone seeing Paulus at the ATM in the jeep and this witness says he saw him too..then that tome is corroborating evidence.  But Mos won't see it that way...as far as he is concerned Joran said he was on the beach and she died accidentally that night.

Never thought of that, very good point. Corroboration.

Red jeep observed by witness at approximately 4am.
Red jeep observed at McDonalds with Joran (and Natalee) at approximately 4am.

Sounds like the red jeep was busy that night.
The operator was definitley not soundly sleeping in his bed as reported.
He did not seem to remember a phone call in the middle of the night.

Passenger was definitely not home looking at porn @315am.
Passenger did not ride home in a Honda.

Someone saw Paulass at the ATM and I think some MB kids saw Paulass and Urine near McDonalds around 4 AM.  Paulass was definitely putting some mileage on the car that night.

[SS]

DaY Hiker


Johan, I don't think Paul had been there but 8 years but that was planty of time to gain powerful friemdships in Prosecutors office, the Judicialry, and Aruban Police Department. In fact we know he had close friends in each of these departments. He was very close friends with Jan van der Straten in ALE, who just happened to be assigned as lead detective on the case. He was very close friends with Ben Vocking who worked for Karin Jannsen in the prosecutor's office. And of course he worked with and was acquainted with all of the Dutch judges in the Netherland Antilles judicial system.

Joran had already has three rape charges leveled against him by underage girls before Natalee went missing and we know damn well he is a huge drug user. How did he afford his drug and gambling habits with no visible means of income?

Well said, Dayhiker!!!

Did I read somewhere that Jan van der Stratten is Godfather to the youngest Sloot?

There were rumors that Van der Straten was Joran's godfather, but the truth is if you're Dutch in Aruba everybody in the legal and judicial system is your godfather.

 

It might be worse than Sicily.

[memphis]

Are you all speculating about the film? Wht exactly did you find out about the matty apts, a film, etc.?

[Lala'sMom]

Any chance this will end up a human rights case in the Hague kinda like that Matthews guy?

Interesting you should say that...because Caps mentioned just that thing to me within the first month he was here. 

[BUCKSHOT]

Hans Mos' excuse will be this publicly...

We learned of a gardener. He was proved a liar.
We learned of a dump witness. He was proved a lair.
We learned of a car confession. It was proved a lie.
We learned of this witness. He, too, will be proved a liar.
We just can't arrest on each random tip that we receive.
We will have to investigate further. Blah, blah, blah...

The question is this...
Proved lies/liars by whom? THE ALE.

The gardener's story may not be so far-fetched after all. A car full of boys with a drugged Natalee slightly before Joran was spotted covered in mud. Were the witnesses (Kalpoes) of the crime paid a few bucks to help out, while keeping their mouths shut.

[Lala'sMom]

Didn't Mos say that in order to prosecute the case he would
need a witness or a confession?

Hey, Hans Mos, you have had both a confession and a witness.
When you gonna prosecute?

Well to Mos they don't jive...the confession was on the beach and the witness saw him at a pond. So that is Mos excuse this time, I suppose.

So pick one.  He said either or.
Supposedly there is yet another confession out there that has not been made public.
Joran made another confession since he has been in Thailand.

Well, I will say this...if the reason they denied Paulus compensation was due to someone seeing Paulus at the ATM in the jeep and this witness says he saw him too..then that tome is corroborating evidence.  But Mos won't see it that way...as far as he is concerned Joran said he was on the beach and she died accidentally that night.

Never thought of that, very good point. Corroboration.

Red jeep observed by witness at approximately 4am.
Red jeep observed at McDonalds with Joran (and Natalee) at approximately 4am.

Sounds like the red jeep was busy that night.
The operator was definitley not soundly sleeping in his bed as reported.
He did not seem to remember a phone call in the middle of the night.

Passenger was definitely not home looking at porn @315am.
Passenger did not ride home in a Honda.

Right.

[Buckeye]

IMO, something is up because Julia Renfro/Glenda, the one with the personal "she's not involved" letter, from Hans Mos, has been sent out to post again.  Either the island is concerned....or....she just got out of rehab again...and that explains her previous absence....

[BUCKSHOT]

Hans Mos' excuse will be this publicly...

We learned of a gardener. He was proved a liar.
(They bullied this witness right in front of our eyes. Did everything they could to discredit home. Even threatened and/or esecuted deportation papers. This guy probably has a death certificate by now. No one has heard of him since)
We learned of a dump witness. He was proved a lair.
We learned of a car confession. It was proved a lie.
We learned of this witness. He, too, will be proved a liar.
(Wonder if Paulus has driven by the street light, where Joran was spotted, so as to determine which home resident observed him, his vehicle, and Joran at such a late/early hour)
We just can't arrest on each random tip that we receive.
We will have to investigate further. Blah, blah, blah...

The question is this...
Proved lies/liars by whom? THE ALE.

The gardener's story may not be so far-fetched after all. A car full of boys with a drugged Natalee slightly before Joran was spotted covered in mud. Were the witnesses (Kalpoes) of the crime paid a few bucks to help out, while keeping their mouths shut.

[BUCKSHOT]

Hans Mos' excuse will be this publicly...

We learned of a gardener. He was proved a liar.
(They bullied this witness right in front of our eyes. Did everything they could to discredit him. Even threatened and/or esecuted deportation papers. This guy probably has a death certificate by now. No one has heard of him since)
We learned of a dump witness. He was proved a lair.
We learned of a car confession. It was proved a lie.
We learned of this witness. He, too, will be proved a liar.
(Wonder if Paulus has driven by the street light, where Joran was spotted, so as to determine which home resident observed him, his vehicle, and Joran at such a late/early hour. He, or associates of his, may want to visit this guy.)
We just can't arrest on each random tip that we receive.
We will have to investigate further. Blah, blah, blah...

The question is this...
Proved lies/liars by whom? THE ALE.

The gardener's story may not be so far-fetched after all. A car full of boys with a drugged Natalee slightly before Joran was spotted covered in mud. Were the witnesses (Kalpoes) of the crime paid a few bucks to help out, while keeping their mouths shut.

[Blue Moon]

Any chance this will end up a human rights case in the Hague kinda like that Matthews guy?

Interesting you should say that...because Caps mentioned just that thing to me within the first month he was here. 

At this point I don't see any other way to get Aruba's attention.

[Buckeye]

If young female American tourists were targets, I could see some sort of "hate crime" issue. Might rise to the international human rights level?? 

[BUCKSHOT]

Paulus was probably more important than Arubans led us to believe.
An awful lot of favors were called in, and executed, from a variety of people.
(Judge to block search warrant, detectives to sabotage evidence, more than one prosecutor seemingly unwilling to prosecute, a judge to make favorable rulings, etc..)

He was not some dumbass who could not pass the BAR exam.

Will the real Paulus please stand up...
(a) a drug dealer
(b) the father of a drug dealer
(c) a bribed offiical
(d) very good friends with high-ranking and fellow Dutch elitists
(e) money laundering expert
(f) a combination of (a)-(e)

If he was not important to them, somehow, he would have been taken down already. Aruba, as mentioned six million times, has gone to great lengths to abandon its legitimate source of income(tourism) by protecting those directly involved in the crime. Instead, more people became involved, purposefully, to protect a handful of people.

[BUCKSHOT]

Paulus and Hans Mos are devising a plan, as we speak, to paint his jeep blue, drive to Diario headquarters, and burn it down. When they are done, they will paint the jeep yellow. They have learned their lesson. No one will notice. Switcheroo.

[SS]

Paulus was probably more important than Arubans led us to believe.
An awful lot of favors were called in, and executed, from a variety of people.
(Judge to block search warrant, detectives to sabotage evidence, more than one prosecutor seemingly unwilling to prosecute, a judge to make favorable rulings, etc..)

He was not some dumbass who could not pass the BAR exam.

Will the real Paulus please stand up...
(a) a drug dealer
(b) the father of a drug dealer
(c) a bribed offiical
(d) very good friends with high-ranking and fellow Dutch elitists
(e) money laundering expert
(f) a combination of (a)-(e)

If he was not important to them, somehow, he would have been taken down already. Aruba, as mentioned six million times, has gone to great lengths to abandon its legitimate source of income(tourism) by protecting those directly involved in the crime. Instead, more people became involved, purposefully, to protect a handful of people.

Buckeye, I think you are correct.  Paulass had been sucking up and doing favors as a wanna be judge for years.  I also think that they are afraid to go after Paulass for fear that he will start singing and bring down a lot of other people with him.

[Altruist]

IMO, the USA would be able to take action itself against a corrupt government with the documentation that the same corrupt government was turning a blind's eye regarding the hunting, raping & we know of at least once the murdering of an American tourist, the USA does not need the Hague.  It may for some reason be decided that is an option.

IIRC, JVDS was identified by a HI staff member as identifying JVDS to Beth when located on the casino video, so in that instance it is not the Lorenzo that was being discussed at that time, it was JVDStoolscum.

All of my prayers that I have said for the lovely Natalee Holloway have included that ALL of the CORRUPT involved with keeping her from her family be brought to bear their responsibility, be stripped of their assets & never more have any influence to repeat their offenses.

What is really ironic when I think back on this horrible tragedy made worst with such corruption & lack of human decency is that MOST of those young adults that were stopped from going to this corrupt place by loving relatives, who may have even balked at their parents & relatives for denying them to go, WILL NEVER ALLOW THEIR CHILDREN in the future, so it is more than one or two decades that will keep their families far away from a place that deprives a family from knowing of their loved ones fate as well as hides the body, preventing the family from burying their loved one according to their religion for eternity & having a resting place to visit.  FOR AS LONG AS SUCH HUMAN INDECENCY IS KNOWN/CONTINUED & Natalee Holloway & her family are disrespected, there will be no forgiving of these actions that are absolutely, undeniably shown as corrupt & institutional corruption, these actions were not only taken against the Holloway family but to other American families as well & on both sexes.  American's are NOT SAFE, the have TARGETS on their backs on that vile island.

JMHO

[johan555]

ss


I think that you are right on the money.  Didn't Rob, Carpe, and a few others compare lots and lots of photographs and came to the conclusion that the Honda sent to Holland was not the actual Honda owned by Deepak?  It was a different car. 


i saw on the Google shot that there is a car junk yard just behind the Matt app and Lions Den
Maybe they change the car parts there or the whole car ?
I think they have a " Car" register on Aruba and know how many ,age etc there are on Aruba

[johan555]

Lorenzo has a house on the main road of Savaneta and also another one in Seroe Alejandro.

Were is that other house in Seroe Alejandro ?
it there a pic available ?