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MsVada
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« on: September 18, 2008, 07:59:24 PM »

Dear Friends here at ScaredMonkeys

I've been here for a few years now and have recently run acrossed a situation that has really made me angry.  Maybe I'm wrong for feeling this way, and I would love to have some input from other Veterans here, maybe it would help me to understand the response I received from a letter that I sent.

If you could kindly take the time to read my letter and the response I received and then offer your point of view or input, I would be eternally grateful.  I have left my name on the letter as I am not ashamed of who I am and what I stand for. 

Klaas, if you feel this is in the wrong place, please put it where it should go, and if you feel I need to take my name off, please edit. 

Thanks,

MsVada
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MsVada
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« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2008, 08:00:39 PM »

Thursday, September 18, 2008, 1:32 PM


Good Afternoon
VFW Administration
 
I just had a comment about your VFW in Inverness Florida.
 
 I am in Maine and my Father just recently purchased a home in Inverness, Florida.  Sadly, he is lonely and finding it hard to make friends down there.  This shocks me as my Dad is usually the social butterfly, but honestly, he has tried several times to strike up a conversation  with people in public without much success.  People seem to not want to be social for whatever reason......
 
I suggested to him to join the local American Legion or VFW as he is a veteran.  I am appalled that he was rejected by your  Inverness VFW (and rudely so) because he didn't fight in a war!  What is this world coming to?  These veterans have to fight to get decent care in a reasonable amount of time at the local Veterans Hospital's acrossed the country.  I know this for a fact because my dear StepDad spent so much time in Vietnam that his lungs are burned and he has to sleep with a breathing machine to keep his lungs working.  He's never smoked a day in his life.  I can go join any American Legion I want to, just because my StepDad was a veteran, but my own Father a Veteran cannot join because there wasn't a war for him to fight?  That is absurd. 
 
I will definitely remember this the next time veterans affairs calls looking for my donation.  I proudly support the veterans in my family, even the ones that are still in Iraq.  Your rules are an embarrassment to Americans.  We are proud of ALL Veterans, whether they served in a war or not.  You should be ashamed of yourselves for such a rule. 

I want to also mention that I am sending this to both my Dad and my StepDad, I think they both should know how I feel about the VFW what it does to veterans, whether they served in a war or not.
 
Sincerely,
 
 
XXXXXXX
Daughter,StepDaughter,Granddaughter,Sister,Aunt,
Cousin, Sister-In-Law of an
American Veteran
« Last Edit: September 21, 2008, 01:45:38 PM by klaasend » Logged

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MsVada
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« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2008, 08:01:47 PM »

Dear Ms. BXXXX,
I understand how you feel and I apologize on behalf of the Commander if your father was treated with anything less than a spirit of respect and comradeship by the members of the Inverness post. However, you must understand that there is a principal difference between the Veterans of Foreign Wars and the American Legion or AMVETS.
 
That distinction is that in addition to being an American citizen and having earned an honorable discharge, every member of the VFW must have had overseas service entitling that veteran to the award of a recognized combat or campaign medal or hostile fire pay as set forth in the Congressional Charter. Ms. Boulette, please understand that our name defines our organization as well as our membership. We are all veterans who have served in combat or in hostile territory overseas. Our organization was chartered by Congress and our membership criteria are also defined by Congress.
You wrote of your step-father who served in Vietnam. I served there as well, possibly during the same time as your step-father. What we saw and what we experienced will stay with us to the ends of our lives and only those of us who experienced those horrors can understand others who went through it. It is for this reason that the Veterans of Foreign Wars was formed and it is for this reason that we are able to provide emotional support to other veterans who have lived through combat on foreign soil. Ms. Boulette, do you think that you are able to understand what it is like to take the life of another human being? Do you know what to say to a veteran who has lost not only two of his best friends, but also lost one of his eyes and an arm at the same time? Can you understand the anger and sorrow of a 21 year-old woman who is now a parapalegic because a 12 year old blew himself up next to her vehicle? You may not be able to Ms. Boulette, but we in the VFW can because we have lived it and it is that singularity that makes all the difference. My grandfather, who by the way was one of the founders of the American Legion, fought in France in WWI, my father and my uncles fought in Europe and the Pacific in WWII, and my uncles and father-in-law fought in Korea. Were they all alive today, they and I would tell you that our rules, as set for by Congress, may be an embarrassment to you, but not to my family of Americans, nor to the millions of other American veterans who served honorably in combat zones from Afghanistan to Yugoslavia and from Vietnam to Flanders fields.

 Although I am very sorry about the way you feel, I hope now that you understand why the Veterans of Foreign Wars of the United States sets these requirements for membership in our organization. I am sure that your father was an honorably discharged veteran who would be eligible for membership in the American Legion and/or the AMVETS and I would urge you him to apply for membership with our comrades in these organizations.

If I can be of assistance to you in the future, please do not hesitate to contact me again.

Respectfully,

David B. Dubin

Department of Florida Web Site Coordinator


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MsVada
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« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2008, 08:05:27 PM »

I guess I wouldn't be so hopping mad if there was a local American Legion for him to have joined.  I just really feel they segregate veterans.  Although my own Father didn't serve in a war, he sure and heck knows of the horrors of it as this guy wrote in his response.  Any family knows those horrors and the anguish injured veterans have to deal with,  we've had a few in my own family and very recently too.....

Whats next?  not only seperating them by whether they served in combat, but seperating them by their race and gender? 

Someone please help me to understand this. 

Thanks
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nonesuche
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« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2008, 10:33:08 PM »

Ms Vada-

I respect Mr Dubin's service equal to any other but what a short-sighted view his portrays. I actually find parts of his response patronizing which is completely unecessary.

I would be tempted to write him back that you thought our service corp was a true "community" that realizes that without the infrastructure or continuity of our services nationwide, we would never be prepared to go to war or to sustain it.

I would be sure to copy his superior too.

God bless your Father and tell him many of us appreciate his commitment to the service whether during war or during peace.
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I continue to stand with the girl.
MsVada
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« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2008, 09:10:08 AM »

Thanks Nonesuch

A great point you've made.  I have thought about responding to his email but haven't figured out what I should say.

Is this some type of "elite" club for special veterans?  IMHO,  ALL veterans are special.

Thanks again for taking the time to respond.
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nonesuche
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« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2008, 06:38:43 PM »

MsVada - you're welcome. I hope you will write him back, even if you can't change the rules then hopefully you will have made one person in leadership have to review another point of view.
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fatcatlurker
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« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2008, 02:25:37 PM »

MsVada,  I want to give mho to you on this matter.  First, I am a veteran of Operation Desert Storm, both brothers are veterans as well. I have a long family history of military service.  I know I have a family member in every war/police action you can think of in history. So I may agree to disagree with you on this and I would like to explain why.

In simple terms, both brothers have seen action on foreign soil, I have not.  My family is very close, just 3 siblings all with military history, all veterans.  Although I am trained as a medic there are still topics that are not on the table for discussion between us.  Sure we all know the military way of life and all the ugliness of battle, but its just not the same as having "confirmed kills"  or having seen it.  There is also certain education that soldiers get before going to battle in foreign land that some of us just wouldn't understand but our soldiers need this or they die.  I remember later reading booklets my brothers were given before shipping out and ease dropping on conversations I had alot of questions that to a soldier seem trivial, but to me deserved way more gravity.  When you are at battle there are only so many issues that the mind can deal with, the most important being survival.

Now having explained MO on that I will continue to say the military is a place where one still gets and feels all the respect and priviledge of moving up in rank and being in separate groups. I have not talked to a soldier yet who does not have pride in what they do or what there unit does.  The military is a strange place of segregation but togetherness that is complicated to explain to civilians, but it works and it deserves respect.  The way of life, rank, and respect for all the groups together is what makes our military so great.  These groups do not have a place for race or gender this is why you see females and black people in every job from pilot to boilermaker, black people no longer in the kitchen, women no longer hidden from battle, unlike the civilian world. 

So I hope you see from a veterans point of view that we are all in "elite groups" and we are all in "the elite group" and typically soldiers do not mind this, it is a matter of respect.  The hand may reach out to grab but so do all the fingers.  My brothers may join both the American Legion and the VFW's tho they chose to join neither, they have each other, there own group and I'm sure my cousin just getting home from Iraq will join there group if he fits there criteria of "seeing battle" ....criteria I do not have.   It's okay, if one day I happen to see "battle worthy horror" I will be accepted into there group until that day I will pray I do not.  I will keep going to my Am.Legion when I need military company, they understand. 

Mr. Dubin's letter was a little overboard and did not explain to you the differences very well IMO.  The civil war was the last war on our soil and I pray we never see it again.  Watching Death,Dying&Destruction on TV in no way can compare to reality and these people do need a special place to talk to each other just as parents of autistic children do or any other group.  I hope you understand.  JMO, Holly
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MsVada
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« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2008, 08:36:16 AM »

Thank you for your insight. 
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