Lively Case Discussion #479 6/25/2006

[Tylergal]

AZLady, Yes I think Joran could get her out pretty far at that time of night after exerting himself all evening and fatigued. I am pretty sure of that.

It is amazing what an adrenalin rush will do.

[AZLady]

Did it seem odd to you that the witness first said the male was light haired, and then, later, identified Joran as the male?

[klaasend]

Hello Klaas!
What do you tthink are the chances we have something in this witness?
From what I read his account is cannot be disproven by known facts.

One of two things.  We either actually have something with this witness or he's going to be the fallguy.

[mrs. red]

I just don't understand this. If the witness caused evidence to be produced, why hasn't anyone asked Beth to ID whatever it is that was supposedly Natalee's? If the condom is credible evidence, why hasn't anyone been arrested..............they arrest people all the time, why would they hold off now? If this guy is telling the truth, that answers why ALE is handling this so differently. It's taking them longer than usual to discredit him. Jossy talked to this guy first, so it makes it harder to "disappear" things.

If memory serves, Beth was asked to send identical clothing to Aruba for the enactment, or was it for the enactment?  She was asked to get a blouse identical to the one Natalee was wearing the night she disappeared, but I do not recall the actress wearing that blouse.  This does not mean that Beth identified the garment, but someone might have made the match.  Capiche.

OK.. now I am fully back to they want the witness to take the fall...

[Tylergal]

Ok... I have listened and now have flipped what I think... I do think that the ALE will try and pin this on the witness.. and that Julia has already floated the idea...

I saw her floating that idea.  What goes up. must come down.  Will leather sink or does it just dry up and blow away?

[AZLady]

With all the small boats available on that island, why would they swim her body out to sea?  That just seems very strange to me.

[mrs. red]

Ok... I have listened and now have flipped what I think... I do think that the ALE will try and pin this on the witness.. and that Julia has already floated the idea...

I saw her floating that idea.  What goes up. must come down.  Will leather sink or does it just dry up and blow away?[/quote

 all I know about leather is that it got expensive when the cows started getting mad cow disease....  

[Hat]

At 17 years old I could drink a half gallon of Red Mountain with friends, stay up 48 hours, go see Hendrix, walk the Sunset Strip and swim at Malibu that night.

[Tylergal]

Hello Klaas!
What do you tthink are the chances we have something in this witness?
From what I read his account is cannot be disproven by known facts.

One of two things.  We either actually have something with this witness or he's going to be the fallguy.

My sentiments exactly.

[SunFreak2]

If memory serves, Beth was asked to send identical clothing to Aruba for the enactment, or was it for the enactment?  She was asked to get a blouse identical to the one Natalee was wearing the night she disappeared, but I do not recall the actress wearing that blouse.  This does not mean that Beth identified the garment, but someone might have made the match.  Capiche.

There are plenty of pictures of Natalee in that top.

[Jacqueline]

Hat, do you find it credible that Joran would strip nearly naked at 3 am on the beach (after being at the casino and the bar and drinking and raping all night), and then swim far out to sea with a 110 pound weight (more if weighted down), and then swim back to shore?  Does this sound like the Joran we know who doesn't like to walk on the island but is driven by Deepak?  The Joran who spends his nights in casinos?  The Joran whose "sport" of choice is tennis?  Sorry, but this sort of swim would require a stamina and energy that this sporter doesn't usually exhibit and I doubt it happened at 3 am!

I don't think Joran was at all drunk himself. He did not get to C'n C's until the last 30 minutes. He is young, in shape, and a large kid. I have no doubt at all he was physically/mentally able to swim that night. Throw in his adrenalin pumping to the max -- no problem at all.

I don't think so.

He may be young, but does not appear to me at least to be in all that good of shape.

And I don't think he could dispose of a dead body that he presumably murdered and done so in an expert fashion with no evidence left behind.

"
at least not that way.

I'm thinking it was a boat.  Always thought so.

[klaasend]

Van Der Sloot's dark colored car:

[Tylergal]

Ok... I have listened and now have flipped what I think... I do think that the ALE will try and pin this on the witness.. and that Julia has already floated the idea...

I saw her floating that idea.  What goes up. must come down.  Will leather sink or does it just dry up and blow away?[/quote

 all I know about leather is that it got expensive when the cows started getting mad cow disease....  

.  Prices are cheap on old allready-mad cows.

[crazybabyborg]

I just don't understand this. If the witness caused evidence to be produced, why hasn't anyone asked Beth to ID whatever it is that was supposedly Natalee's? If the condom is credible evidence, why hasn't anyone been arrested..............they arrest people all the time, why would they hold off now? If this guy is telling the truth, that answers why ALE is handling this so differently. It's taking them longer than usual to discredit him. Jossy talked to this guy first, so it makes it harder to "disappear" things.

If memory serves, Beth was asked to send identical clothing to Aruba for the enactment, or was it for the enactment?  She was asked to get a blouse identical to the one Natalee was wearing the night she disappeared, but I do not recall the actress wearing that blouse.  This does not mean that Beth identified the garment, but someone might have made the match.  Capiche.

OK.. now I am fully back to they want the witness to take the fall...

Well, obviously the witness is a "nobody" as far as influence goes, so, if he really saw something, then they could kill 2 birds with one stone: take care of evidence backed eye witness, and offer up to the world full of tourists, a resolved case.

[Hotshot]

The car was dark colored.  Who had a dark car that Joran could have borrowed?

Jamie has a dark blue civic

[Tylergal]

If memory serves, Beth was asked to send identical clothing to Aruba for the enactment, or was it for the enactment?  She was asked to get a blouse identical to the one Natalee was wearing the night she disappeared, but I do not recall the actress wearing that blouse.  This does not mean that Beth identified the garment, but someone might have made the match.  Capiche.

There are plenty of pictures of Natalee in that top.

The point was that the fabric to be matched identically, they would need another top identical to match it, unless Beth identified it.  Beth said at that point in time, she WOULD NOT GO BACK TO ARUBA out of fear for her life.  If Beth was able to get a top like that, they would be able to match it without her return trip.

[Hat]

With all the small boats available on that island, why would they swim her body out to sea?  That just seems very strange to me.

I suppose he could have met a friend with a boat a little way out in the water. Could have been as simple as just getting her out some short distance by himself though. The tennis club sighting always sounded like waiting for a rendezvous to me.

[klaasend]

The car was dark colored.  Who had a dark car that Joran could have borrowed?

Jamie has a dark blue civic

Is it dark blue or black (not that it matters)

[crazybabyborg]

Klaas..........you are awesome, really! A Van derSloot dark car makes sense.

[klaasend]

With all the small boats available on that island, why would they swim her body out to sea?  That just seems very strange to me.

I suppose he could have met a friend with a boat a little way out in the water. Could have been as simple as just getting her out some short distance by himself though. The tennis club sighting always sounded like waiting for a rendezvous to me.

Like Koen's boat?