Transcripts: November 08, - Mar 2009:No Discussion

[Blonde]

NANCY GRACE

Joran Van Der Sloot Taped in Thai Sex Trade Deal

Aired November 10, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the sudden disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway, missing off her high school senior trip to Aruba. Aruban police claim they can`t or won`t make a case against judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot. Even after a Dutch crime reporter taped months of high-tech secret surveillance proving what happened the night Holloway vanishes, Aruban courts let Van Der Sloot walk free.
But tonight, caught on tape, judge`s son Van Der Sloot is busted, preying on unsuspecting women, attempting to lure them into the sex trade between Thailand and his birthplace, the Netherlands. Van Der Sloot reported to make up to $13,000 per female recruit. Tonight, we have the photos. Will the prime suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway finally end up behind bars?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If it was an accident, I mean, I`m sure -- I really truthfully feel that he gave her some kind of drug, but -- and then, you know, if something happened to her, why not be a man and just say, Look, this happened and -- but I knew when they wouldn`t help us come look for her the next day and he goes out and starts hiring attorneys and everything that there was something bad.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A former suspect in the disappearance of Alabama teen Natalee Holloway has allegedly been caught on tape recruiting Thai women to work in the sex industry in Europe. A sting operation set up by crime reporter Peter De Vries allegedly shows Van Der Sloot attempting to arrange young women to come to the Netherlands. The sting was broadcast on Dutch TV and also reportedly showed Van Der Sloot receiving $1,000 cash for arranging the transaction. Van Der Sloot was confronted by De Vries and denied any wrongdoing. But he did make sure to thank the reporter for the $1,000 cash.

BETH TWITTY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S MOTHER: Talking about her like that, my gosh, he just -- you know, first you want to come through the TV and I want to kill him, I mean, pull the skin off his face. And I think of the utter disregard he had for Natalee. And look what he`s done to his friends. Look what he`s done to a country. Look what he`s done to everyone.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: And tonight, police desperately searching for a beautiful 3- year-old Florida girl, Caylee, after her grandparents report her missing, little Caylee now not seen 21 long weeks, last seen with her mother. So why didn`t Mommy call police?

Headlines tonight. Texas Equusearch, a team of bounty hunters from across the country and over 2,000 volunteers converge Orlando, the massive search by land, by air, by water zeroing in on heavily wooded areas near the Orlando airport and the Anthonys` home, the search locations based on mom Casey`s cell phone pings and the discovery of a suspicious beaded cross. Bones discovered during a search, but are they connected to the case? Grandparents George and Cindy Anthony show up at the search, angrily insisting little Caylee`s still alive. At the search head (ph), bounty hunters stay on searching for Caylee. And as mom Casey sits behind bars, another alleged sighting of the tot emerges. Tonight, where is Caylee?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Despite thousands of volunteers and extensive searches, Caylee Anthony still hasn`t been found, but bounty hunter Leonard Padilla is following his own leads.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Padilla says he has a feeling Caylee`s body is here because he says Equusearch volunteers found a beaded cross near here that matches beads Casey was stringing at home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Padilla claims there was a cross in Blanchard Park, Padilla hiring expert divers to search in the Little Econ River in Blanchard Park. Padilla thinks Caylee`s body may be in that very river, the California bounty hunter also announcing he`s holding a memorial service tomorrow morning. But not everyone`s happy with Padilla`s involvement. Just hours ago, Cindy Anthony confronted Padilla and told him she`s got a problem with Padilla holding a memorial service for her granddaughter.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Breaking news tonight in the disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway. Tonight, caught on tape, the prime suspect, judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot, preying on unsuspecting women to lure them into the sex trade between Thailand and the Netherlands. Will he finally go to jail? And how`s Daddy going to get him out of this one?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETER DE VRIES, DUTCH TELEVISION REPORTER: Until now, Joran always denied that Natalee died in his presence. And now he confessed that and he told what he did with the body, and he told how he came home, what he did with the shoes. It`s the complete story.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Joran Van Der Sloot, a former suspect in the case of missing teen Natalee Holloway, has allegedly been caught on tape arranging for Thai girls to come to Europe to work in the sex industry. Dutch crime reporter Peter De Vries set up a sting operation on Van Der Sloot. De Vries`s associates allegedly got to know Van Der Sloot and claimed they were interested in bringing Thai women to the Netherlands. Van Der Sloot is shown meeting with De Vries`s men at a hotel room in Bangkok, Thailand, along with two young Thai women. Later, Van Der Sloot was allegedly shown accepting a large cash advance from one of the men, reportedly in the range of $1,000. When confronted by De Vries, Van Der Sloot denied any wrongdoing.

DE VRIES: I was shocked by the way -- by the disrespect he talked about Natalee. He called her a (DELETED) and things like that.

GRACE: He called her a (DELETED). He called her a (DELETED) for absolutely no reason. This girl had a sterling reputation.

DE VRIES: Yes. And he`s showing no remorse at all. He`s telling that he didn`t -- didn`t lose one second of sleep.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Joining us right now, Deborah Pugatch with CNN affiliate WBMA. What`s the latest?

DEBORAH PUGATCH, WBMA PRODUCER: What`s the latest, Nancy? Well, I`ll tell you this. What I do know from a Dutch contact of mine who`s a reporter over there is that Joran Van Der Sloot says he did nothing wrong. But according to Peter De Vries, he says he caught him undercover, trying to get young Thai women to go to the Netherlands to go into the prostitution ring. That is illegal and -- according to Dutch prostitution law, that is illegal. Prostitution is legal in the Netherlands, but that is not.

GRACE: Out to Jossy Mansur, owner and director of "Diario" magazine. Jossy, it`s great to be with you again. What do you know about these latest charges against Joran Van Der Sloot?

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, "DIARIO": Well, what I understand is that he did violate the law, both in Thailand and the Dutch law, and that he can be prosecuted for that.

GRACE: To Rupa Mikkilineni, our producer. Rupa, exactly what is alleged happened?

RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Well, Nancy, Joran Van Der Sloot was caught on tape, on a videotape, secretly taped by a journalist, Peter De Vries. And he walked into a hotel room with two young Thai women to meet two of De Vries`s men, who were posing as Dutch sex trade bosses.

GRACE: Hold on. Here you are seeing the shot. There are many of them. Investigative reporter Peter De Vries hosts a program allegedly showing Van Der Sloot, suspect in the Holloway case, setting up a sex trade operation between Thailand and Europe. "Good Morning America" has purchased the rights to this video. Go ahead, Rupa.

MIKKILINENI: Well, as you see in this video -- it`s a very grainy video, and they`re sitting around and having drinks and they`re discussing potentially bringing these women somehow, illegally, legally, illegally -- it`s very confusing. He discusses a three-month visa, says he can, you know, formulate some type of false documents that could get these women into Holland to work temporarily. He offers $15,000 or some such amount to pay for these women. These women indicate, Look, we`re not sure. You know, We`re students. This is very tricky. What will we have to do? And then he says that all that it would require is dancing.

GRACE: I believe his words were, Shaking your" -- an expletive -- in front of men, talking to them, sitting down and having a drink with them, and as if they`re going to be models, having your photos taken while you`re dancing.

MANSUR: Yes. That`s correct.

GRACE: OK. Now, you said the women were students. What did he promise the women? What were they to get paid?

MIKKILINENI: Well, in the videotape, he indicates $15,000. He doesn`t say whether that`s for the entire three months, for what amount of work, but he does say that you`ll be working -- they`d be working from 5:00 PM to 5:00 AM. This is a 12-hour day. We`re talking six-day weeks, possibly.

GRACE: With me right now exclusively, Natalee Holloway`s father, Dave Holloway. Dave, it`s great to hear your voice again. Can you believe it? It`s like a bad penny turning up again.

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S FATHER: It`s absolutely disgusting that this guy is involved in something like this.

GRACE: When did you first learn of the charges?

HOLLOWAY: I learned of the potential video sometime last week, but I wasn`t aware of what the extent of it was.

GRACE: What do you make of it?

HOLLOWAY: I tell you what, I hope the Thailand police do their job and get this guy. He needs to be taken off the streets.

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining us tonight, international law attorney Theodore Simon out of Philadelphia, child advocate Susan Moss, Lauren Lake, defense attorney out of New York, Alex Sanchez also a veteran defense attorney out of New York.

To Susan Moss. Weigh in, Susan.

SUSAN MOSS, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: First, Natalee is dead and now he`s selling Thai women for bread, and it`s all on tape. Joran is a moron, and luckily, now he`s going to be brought down by his own hubris, his own greed and his own words.

GRACE: To Theodore Simon, international law attorney joining us from Philadelphia. Come on, we`re talking about Thailand. It is the capital of the sex trade business in the world. Like they`re going to bust Joran Van Der Sloot?

THEODORE SIMON, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY: Well, it`s hard to say. I mean, what we`ve seen briefly is a tape, only words. We haven`t seen any objective evidence. And the last time Mr. De Vries produced a tape, it was rejected by the Aruban courts when they failed to reopen his case...

GRACE: Theodore...

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Theodore, if these allegations...

SIMON: He, you can call me Ted.

GRACE: Mr. Simon, if these allegations are correct, will he be prosecuted in Thailand or not~!

SIMON: Well, it`s certainly possible, if the allegations are true. I think we`re a far cry from whether or not the allegations turn into any kind of objective proof.

GRACE: You know what? Before I throw a stone at Thailand, Eliot Spitzer got nothing and he is caught by the feds with hookers. So you know, I guess I shouldn`t trash Thailand too much. But what I`m trying to say, Mr. Simon, is if these allegations are true and it is true that he is preying on unsuspecting young women, students, as a matter of fact, promising them $15,000 to be models and they turn out to end up in the sex trade, stuck in another country with no way back home, will Thailand consider that a crime and prosecute him?

SIMON: Well, I think you`re adding many, many facts that may not be - - may only be fiction.

GRACE: OK, you know what? Maybe you didn`t hear the beginning of the question -- if the allegations are true. You`re the international lawyer.

SIMON: Right.

GRACE: Will that be a crime in Thailand? It`s a yes/no question!

SIMON: Well, you know, it`s a big if. If someone commits a crime, they`ll be prosecuted.

GRACE: Oy!

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DE VRIES: Oh, yes, I`m pretty convinced by that because it was not a slip of the tongue, what he did. He told -- he did a full confession on tape not once, not twice, but more than 10 times. And he did it -- there were some days between it. They were very detailed. And so I`m convinced that he told the truth. Until now, Joran always denied that Natalee died in his presence, and now he confessed that and he told what he did with the body, and he told how he came home, what he did with his shoes. It`s the complete story.

Patrick (ph) was asking him, How can you be so sure that Natalee was dead? And then he said, Well, I wasn`t. She was just not moving anymore. She wasn`t kicking anymore. And so I thought she must be dead. And then he dumped her into the ocean. And yes, that`s really shocking.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Well, he`s back. The prime suspect in the disappearance of Alabama beauty and honor student Natalee Holloway is allegedly right in the middle of the international sex trade -- that`s right, caught on grainy surveillance video actually trying to recruit, according to allegations, young students, female students, promising $15,000, I believe it was a week, to model back home in the Netherlands, his birthplace.

We are taking your calls. To Mary in California. Hi, Mary.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. How are you?

GRACE: I`m good, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Well, first I want to tell you my family thinks you`re wonderful and your babies are beautiful.

GRACE: Thank you very much. I am blessed. I am blessed.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, you are. My question is, does anybody know if Natalee`s mother is going to go to Thailand to look for her?

GRACE: Interesting question. To Dave Holloway. This is Natalee`s father. Is Beth or anyone else in the family going to Thailand? Is there any suggestion that Natalee could be alive in Thailand?

HOLLOWAY: No. The first tape that Peter De Vries did back in January had indicated that Joran Van Der Sloot disposed of her, or had some help disposing of her at sea. This part about the prostitution ring came up in that tape, where, apparently, Joran wanted to get involved in a -- another activity, and that activity was prostitution. So this was...

(CROSSTALK)

HOLLOWAY: ... he wanted to get involved in, and now he did.

GRACE: Let me get this straight. Everybody, with us exclusively tonight, Dave Holloway. This is Natalee`s father. Refresh my recollection, Dave. Are you saying, in the original Peter De Vries tape, that Joran Van Der Sloot -- this is hours and hours, taken over weeks of surveillance inside a high-end SUV of Joran Van Der Sloot -- he said at that time he wanted to get into another enterprise?

HOLLOWAY: Yes. The first one was the growing and selling of marijuana, and then the other was this prostitution-type ring, so there was two of those type of activities that he wanted to get into. And then as time went on, he had met a friend in Thailand or over there (INAUDIBLE) or whatever, and he approached this friend about making this enterprise come true.

GRACE: Enterprise. You mean prostitution.

HOLLOWAY: Prostitution.

GRACE: You know, in one of the articles, some of the research I was reading, they called it the Dutch sex industry entrepreneur. Translation in this country, a pimp. I wonder what his daddy has to say tonight, Dave Holloway.

HOLLOWAY: Yes, it`ll be hard for him to get him out of this one.

GRACE: The judge.

HOLLOWAY: That`s right. And in that TV show last night, there was one witness who also had implicated Paulus. His involvement was a lot more than what we had originally thought.

GRACE: And there`s the best shot of Paulus Van Der Sloot, the judge, running from questions about Natalee missing. I`ll never forget the shot of his backside running down a dark alley.

Back to Rupa Mikkilineni, our producer. Where is he believed to be now? I thought he was in college in the Netherlands. What happened to that?

MIKKILINENI: Well, Natalee (SIC), apparently, after he was studying in the Netherlands, Peter De Vries`s first videotape came out, and it caused such havoc with his life -- apparently, he was worried for his life -- and so he disappeared off the face of the earth for a while.

GRACE: Translation, dropped out of school?

MIKKILINENI: Yes.

GRACE: So he dropped out of school. Do we know if that`s his decision or did the school throw him out?

MIKKILINENI: We believe he dropped out. It`s a little bit uncertain, but he actually disappeared. He didn`t show up in Aruba. He wasn`t in Holland. We don`t know where he was. And then he suddenly turns up in Thailand a few months later.

GRACE: Thailand. Now, I wonder why Thailand? To Jossy Mansur, owner and managing director of "Diario" magazine. Jossy, what was he allegedly saying on the tape to the young women?

MANSUR: He was offering them a job as models in Holland, and in truth, he was trying to coax them into prostitution -- in other words, into the sex industries in Holland. That`s what I gather from the paper that I saw.

GRACE: Back to Deborah Pugatch from WBMA. Deborah, again, thank you for being with us. Has Van Der Sloot admitted to anyone else that we know of anything incriminating about Natalee Holloway?

PUGATCH: Well, what we do know is there is a new witness that was a part of Peter De Vries`s piece last night. The witness, who I`ve been told is named Celeste (ph), told Aruban authorities or Dutch authorities last week when they questioned her that Joran did tell her the same thing he told Peter (SIC) van der Eem in Peter De Vries`s first investigative report, that Natalee is nowhere, anyhow. I talked to Hans Mos, the chief Aruban prosecutor, and he confirmed that for me this afternoon.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TWITTY: When I hear Joran talking about her like that, my gosh, he just -- you know, first you want to come through the TV and I want to kill him, I mean, pull the skin off his face. And I think of the utter disregard he had for Natalee. And look what he`s done to his friends. Look what he`s done to a country. Look what he`s done to everyone. It`s just despicable what he has done.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s hurt us tremendously and other families tremendously, and some innocent people of Aruba. He has no remorse, no -- a total disregard for anyone else except for himself, even his own family. And it`s just shocking to me that someone can do this. It`s just -- I`m still reeling from it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We are taking your calls live. Out to Kathy in Tennessee. Hi, Kathy.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What I have wondered from the very beginning is when the party boat captain came forward and seemed to delay the investigation -- I have often thought how far out could that party boat have gone without lights on so as not to be noticed, so someone waiting out there could have taken Natalee off of that party boat.

GRACE: To Jossy Mansur with "Diario" magazine. What about it? How far could they have gotten?

MANSUR: I don`t (ph) think they could have gotten that far, or they should have gotten far enough so that the body couldn`t wash back into the beach. But the party boat has sufficient power, motor, to go as far as the currents will do the job that they had in mind (INAUDIBLE)

GRACE: And what would be the closest body of land to transport her?

MANSUR: It would be the beach right by the fisherman`s hut, by the Marriott Hotel.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just hope that he comes clean. He`s got an account to settle, and I hope he settles it on this earth at this time. If he doesn`t, you know, God bless him.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I gave already some investigations in the Natalee Holloway case in Aruba, and I was very intrigued by it and I thought, well, this was just terrible that this case is not solved yet. So then I said to myself, I have to do everything to solve this. That`s how it happened.

Yes. And he (INAUDIBLE) like that, because it was not a slip of the tongue what he did. He told -- he did a full confession on tape, not once, not twice, but more than 10 times. And he did it with some days between it. It was very detailed.

And -- so I`m convinced that he told the truth. Until now, Joran always denied that Natalee died in his presence and now he confessed that and he told what he did with the body and he told how he came home, what he did with the shoes. It`s -- the complete story.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that the police knew that she was not alive the second day. When he did the shaking thing in the video -- you know, they questioned Beth and I the first day, second day and then also question me two weeks later and they kept asking about the epileptic fits or, you know, that type stuff.

Well, you don`t ask that straight out of the box. I knew there was something funny. So they knew. I think Joran told them that probably something happened on the beach and she did this but Vonder Striden, you know, just probably wanted to cover his friend`s son`s butt and actually just got into it early on and then it just got deeper and deeper and snowballed and they just covered every track from then on so.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: We are taking your calls live. Headline tonight, Joran Van Der Sloot, the prime suspect in the disappearance of Alabama beauty and honor student, Natalee Holloway, has turned up again, this time on grainy surveillance video, reportedly soliciting young female students to become prostitutes, sending them back home to the Netherlands, basically, where they`d be stuck with no way back for about three months.

Again, we`re taking your calls live but right now take a look at the last time he was caught on tape. This is from ABC`s "20/20."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (Through translator): She`s just lying still?

JORAN VAN DER SLOOT (Through translator): Still, still. She`s not doing anything. He says, what happened? I said, I don`t know either, man.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did you try to resuscitate her?

VAN DER SLOOT: Of course. I tried everything, man. I tried to shake her. I was shaking the bitch. I was like, what`s wrong with you, man? I almost wanted to cry. What the (EXPLETIVE DELETED) happened? I said to him, this isn`t possible.

He took the body. He went far out, and he threw her over the side. Then he came back and docked his boat there. And he came by my house for a bit.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At night.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. Then we talked for a bit and he says to me, you know, it`s all good. She`s going to be missing. They`re going to search but they`re not going to know a thing.

PATRICK VAN DER EEM (through translator): How were you so sure she was dead, Joran? You can`t, you know, people can also go into coma.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, I wasn`t sure about that but it really scared me to death.

VAN DER EEM: No, but I understand that. I definitely understand that, that you were scared. She really (INAUDIBLE).

VAN DER SLOOT: No, no. But it didn`t look good.

VAN DER EEM: How didn`t it look good then?

VAN DER SLOOT: Just, you know, she had been shaking and stuff.

VAN DER EEM: What, really shaking?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. I don`t know. Yes. Pretty much.

VAN DER EEM: I`m asking you. How were you so (EXPLETIVE DELETED) sure she was dead, man?

VAN DER SLOOT: I wasn`t (EXPLETIVE DELETED) sure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: And even after that, still no arrest. That is video from ABC`s "20/20" of prime suspect Joran Van Der Sloot seemingly more concerned about his own fate than the death of the American teen, Natalee Holloway.

We are taking your calls live. And with me right now exclusively, Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway. When you hear that, does your blood still boil?

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S FATHER: Nancy, it -- does. You know, still -- it`s still tough even after three and a half years of hoping for the best and, you know, we see the worst. And it`s tough. It really is.

GRACE: Let`s unleash the lawyers. Theodore Simon out of Philadelphia, Susan Moss, child advocate in New York, Lauren Lake, defense attorney in New York, Alex Sanchez, also veteran defense attorney in New York.

So, Lauren Lake, on this latest alleged event, what`s your best defense?

LAUREN LAKE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, I`ll tell you what, Nancy. Even though we`re all sick of Joran, I mean, but for my defense attorney hat tonight I`m sick of him. The bottom line is not a lot of objective, incriminating evidence in this video and De Vries should know from the last try. We need more than that. OK. The taking of a thousand dollars...

GRACE: You mean more than somebody caught on tape?

LAKE: Yes. We need more than that. Look what happened the last time, Nancy. This guy is somehow eluding the law on every occasion. If they`re going to try to catch this guy they`ve got to nail him and right now I don`t think just this videotape and this thousand dollars is what we call nailing him.

GRACE: Speaking of catching the guy, Rupa, where is he?

RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: Great question. It looks like last time Joran was seen in Thailand in Bangkok was at a party on Friday night. De Vries` documentary aired over the weekend and he`s disappeared. We think he`s left the country.

GRACE: So he`s gone from the Netherlands to Thailand to the Lord only knows where.

To Alex Sanchez -- Alex, the guy is reportedly caught on tape, arranging having these girls go to the Netherlands to act as prostitutes, luring them under the guise of being models, taking money for it. He`s even caught on tape thanking his benefactor for the money.

ALEX SANCHEZ, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I`ll tell you, this guy De Vries is Joran Van Der Sloot`s worst nightmare.

GRACE: Tell it.

SANCHEZ: In terms of -- in terms of a defense in this case.

GRACE: Wait a minute. Whoa, whoa, whoa. I agree with you on that, Alex. But I don`t care who set him up. I don`t care how he was caught. He`s caught.

SANCHEZ: Well, that`s important. That`s important, though, because the person that set him up was De Vries.

GRACE: So?

SANCHEZ: And De Vries had set him up the first time around. And one begins to wonder whether De Vries has crossed the line and has gone overboard in trying to lure this kid into doing something that he did not intend on doing.

GRACE: You know what, Alex? Alex, if somebody came up to you and said, hey, I`ve got a plan. You talk young women, students into going overseas to be hookers and I`ll give you 15 thou per girl. You would run, run for the hills, as if you had seen a monster.

I mean, he`s not set up. He`s right there in it. And like Dave Holloway says, he`s caught on tape months before saying he wants to go into prostitution.

SANCHEZ: Then why, after speaking to De Vries, would he say thank you for the thousand dollars? It`s almost like he knew what was going on and he was out to trick De Vries who had previously tricked him.

GRACE: To Dr. Lisa Boesky, psychologist and author of "When to Worry," I`m not surprised that he made that smart comment when he was caught. What else could he say?

LISA BOESKY, PSYCHOLOGIST, AUTHOR OF "WHEN TO WORRY": Well, remember, this is an arrogant young man. This is one of the most dangerous kind of offenders that are out there. They don`t look like thugs. They don`t look like the strangers that people have warned us about.

This is a good looking, manipulative, charming young man who is cold, callous, and arrogant. It`s not that he thinks law enforcement is stupid. He just thinks he`s smarter than them and he can avoid getting caught.

GRACE: Which he has managed to do so far before he went on the lamb.

Back to Rupa Mikkilineni. Rupa, apparently he has made an incriminating comment to another young girl on a beach.

MIKKILINENI: Yes. That`s correct, Nancy. According to De Vries` documentary, which was mentioned, there is a witness, a young woman that might have been a girlfriend of sorts and he made a comment that indicated he knew how to get rid of corpses from a beach.

GRACE: Do we know what his words were?

MIKKILINENI: I think we do. It`s -- who knows? You may now be on the beach with someone who`s able to get rid of a corpse.

GRACE: OK. Alex Sanchez, thoughts?

SANCHEZ: I think that`s a very troubling statement but if that is true.

GRACE: Very troubling.

SANCHEZ: . then how come the authorities don`t go to the grand jury with the tapes made in that car as well as this witness.

GRACE: You know what?

SANCHEZ: And obtain an -- an indictment?

GRACE: Susan Moss, why don`t they?

SUSAN MOSS, CHILD ADVOCATE, FAMILY LAW ATTORNEY: I don`t know. This guy is a walking felony. You know, certainly the expectation is, is that because somebody is trying to protect this guy because of his father`s stature but I -- I don`t know why.

GRACE: On the line, Sue in Maryland. Hi, Sue.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi there, Nancy.

GRACE: What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: God bless you and your family. I hope they keep you safe from all these monsters out there.

GRACE: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is, isn`t it possible t to go to the Netherlands and find some of these girls and these prostitution rings that will also help?

GRACE: To John Lucich, former investigator and author of "Cyber Lies" what about it? Is that where we start this investigation?

JOHN LUCICH, INVESTIGATOR, AUTHOR OF "CYBER LIES": No. I don`t think so. It`s a needle in a hay stack when you try and go over to Thailand and try to find somebody like Natalee Holloway.

First of all, I believe, like Peter De Vries, and let me just say God bless Peter De Vries. People have said he tried to cross the line or he may have crossed the line. He did more than anybody to bringing this creature to light.

Everybody knows what -- he`s a serial predator, based on everything we know about him right now. There is nothing, and unfortunately Thailand is not going to do anything because they have a horrible track record, it`s crimes against children, and his own country is protecting him.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If it was an accident, I mean I`m sure -- I really truly feel that he gave her some kind of drug but -- and then, you know, if something happened to her, why not be a man and just say, look, this happened and -- but I knew when they wouldn`t help us come look for her the next day and he goes out and starts hiring attorneys and everything that there was something bad.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0811/10/ng.01.html

[Blonde]

Suspect in Holloway Case Allegedly Caught Arranging for Sex Workers
Dutch reporter Peter R. de Vries Sets Up Sting Operation Involving Joran van der Sloot
By SARAH NETTER, RICH MCHUGH and OLIVIA STERNS
Nov. 10, 2008—


The prime suspect in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway has been caught on camera apparently arranging to bring Thai sex workers to Europe, according to a Dutch television program.

Joran van der Sloot, the man last seen with Holloway in Aruba the night before she disappeared in 2005, was set up in a Bangkok hotel by Dutch crime reporter Peter R. de Vries, who made headlines earlier this year for releasing an undercover video of van der Sloot talking with a friend about taking the American teen's body out to the ocean.

The Dutch television program that aired last night detailed how men working for de Vries allegedly got to know van der Sloot, saying they were interested in bringing Thai women to the Netherlands. In e-mail conversations over several months, van der Sloot allegedly detailed how the women would be told they would get three-month visas to work as models but would actually be working as prostitutes once they got to the Netherlands, according to the Dutch broadcast.

In the grainy undercover video, shot at the Landmark Hotel in Bangkok, van der Sloot, once baby-faced but now heavier with scruffy facial hair, can be seen meeting with de Vries' men as he brings two young Thai women to a meeting in a hotel room. The meeting was recorded by hidden cameras. Later he is also caught on tape allegedly accepting a $1,000 cash advance for his services, the Dutch broadcast claimed.

De Vries later confronted van der Sloot on the phone and told him about the sting, prompting van der Sloot to angrily deny any wrongdoing, but he also thanked DeVries for the $1,000.

Dutch news reports said today that Thai authorities had requested a transcript of the de Vries video. The Dutch media claimed that van der Sloot had left Bangkok and his whereabouts were not known.


Admitting Guilt?
The Dutch reporter won an Emmy for his undercover work earlier this year in which van der Sloot appeared to admit he was present when Holloway died and that he had helped to dump her body in the ocean. De Vries said then that he is "totally convinced Joran is telling the truth" on the tape.

Holloway, 18, was last seen May 30, 2005, while visiting Aruba on her high school's senior class trip. Van der Sloot had been detained twice relating to Holloway's disappearance, but was released both times after law enforcement officials said there wasn't enough evidence to hold him.

Aruban investigators traveled to the Netherlands earlier this year to question van der Sloot after de Vries' explosive tape caused them to reopen the case.

"I am telling you honestly, I know what happened to that girl," van der Sloot told an associate of de Vries', Patrick Van der Eem, on the undercover video. He went on to say that Holloway died in his arms and that he called a friend to dispose of her body.

"Joran is telling the truth about what happened to Natalee," De Vries told "Good Morning America" in an exclusive interview in February, adding that "she died in his arms on the beach that night."


On the tape, van der Sloot told van der Eem that Holloway suffered a seizure during a romantic encounter between the pair, who had met hours before at a local nightclub.

At another point he told van der Eem, "I tried to shake her. I was shaking the bitch. I was like, 'What is wrong with you man?' I almost wanted to cry."

Van der Sloot said he felt lucky the police were not able to recover Holloway's body.

"I think I am incredibly lucky that she's never been found because if she had been found I would be in deep [excrement]," van der Sloot said on the tape.

De Vries dismissed van der Sloot's claim that he was lying on the tape or that drugs affected his statement, saying, "I don't buy these allegations."

Instead de Vries said the only question that remained was the identity of "Daury," the "really good friend" whom van der Sloot said he called from a pay phone and who he said helped him dispose of Holloway's body.

"Our insider was pushing him the next day [after the taped confession] a little bit on the name; and then he came up with 'Daury,' but the name he mentioned is not the Daury in the news," De Vries said.

Van der Sloot's attorney, Joe Tacopina, said there's evidence to suggest the pay phone call never happened. Tacopina said the Aruban Coast Guard checked the pay phone that Joran talked about on the tape and found no such call, which would apparently give credence to van der Sloot's claim that the story he told on the tape was a lie.

"The Aruban Coast Guard has already looked at that pay phone. There is no such call," Tacopina said.

But de Vries said Aruban investigators told him it was not possible to for them to determine if the call was placed.

"I don't know how [Tacopina] knows this, because I had a telephone call a couple of months ago; saying it's impossible to say," De Vries said. "Maybe he is the same like his client and made some things up."

Aruban investigators have yet to publicly weigh in on recent developments in the case.

Some say that De Vries' methods, namely the fact that he used van der Eem to gain van der Sloot's confidence and videotaped him unknowingly, crossed a journalistic line. But he said he had no regrets.

"We did what we had to do, and what we accomplished is that the investigation is reopened and that Joran is again a suspect for homicide. Before this Joran considered himself as a winner," De Vries said.


Investigation Reopened
If van der Sloot's own words are to be believed -- his fears about the body being found, and his calling a "really good friend" instead of an ambulance -- then his story raises questions about the identity of his friend with the boat, Daury, and the possibility of that pay phone call.

ABC News' Elizabeth Vargas caught up with Daury Rodriguez, a 21-year-old Aruban man and longtime friend of van der Sloot's, in Aruba in February. Rodriguez denied that van der Sloot had called him or that he was with van der Sloot on the beach the night Holloway disappeared.

"So when Joran Van der Sloot said he had a friend named Daury who was here on the beach May 29, 2005, it wasn't you?" Vargas asked him.

"No," Rodriguez replied. He also told Vargas that van der Sloot apologized and said in an online conversation that he'd lied.

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=6221163&page=1

[Blonde]

NANCY GRACE

Van Der Sloot Thailand Tape Released

Aired November 11, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the sudden disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway, missing off her high school senior trip, Aruba. Aruban police claim they can`t or won`t make a case against Van Der Sloot in the disappearance of Holloway, even after a Dutch crime reporter takes months of high-tech secret surveillance proving what happened the night the Alabama beauty vanished. Aruban courts let Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son, walk free.
But tonight, we have obtained the video and audiotape that may land judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot behind bars. That`s right, judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot busted, preying on unsuspecting young women, attempting to lure them into the sex trade between Thailand and his birth place, the Netherlands, Van Der Sloot reported to make up to $13,000 per female recruit. And now that Van Der Sloot is busted again, Aruban prosecutors say they`re back on the Holloway case, now deciding whether to re-arrest Van Der Sloot. But tonight, will Van Der Sloot, reportedly in hiding, finally land where he belong, behind bars? Somebody tell me how`s Daddy going to get him out of this one?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I like dancing.

JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: And he offering you $15,000 to dance. And I understand you tell me that you have school you have to finish. I understand. And you can tell me, OK, after your school, will we talk about it again?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. And how long I have to dance for, one hour, two hours?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, like, 10 hour a day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh! That`s too much!

VAN DER SLOOT: I don`t know.

(CROSSTALK)

VAN DER SLOOT: From 5:00 in the afternoon to 5:00 in the morning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That a lot!

VAN DER SLOOT: That`s a lot, yes, I know, but it`s not dance the whole time. You take break. You talk to the guys, you know, make them feel good, give them drink.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: Yes, he`s the man.

And tonight, the mystery surrounding a beautiful young mom of two vanishing into thin air straight out America`s heartland.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Searches resumed today in the case of missing 27- year-old mother of two Alisha Sidie. According to reports, Sidie left her home between 9:00 and 10:00 PM Friday night after an argument with her ex- husband. Over 150 volunteers are assisting in the search effort, with helicopters, canines and dive teams all scouring the area for the young mom. Alisha`s sister, Tracy, says there`s no way that Alisha would have left without her 2-year-old twin boys at her side. Police say there`s no evidence of foul play and will continue to search for Alisha, who was last seen wearing a long-sleeved white shirt and blue scrub pants.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is very unusual for her. I`ve known Alisha since she was a little baby. She`s like a sister to me. She`s like my daughter. She is -- this is very unusual for her, very unusual. She would never do this. Never.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Breaking news tonight in the disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway. We have obtained a video and audiotape that may land judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot behind bars.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me -- $15,000 is nothing for me.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, $15,000 is nothing for you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. No. Not much.

VAN DER SLOOT: $15,000 is nothing for her.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... but when we do overtime, yes, maybe we can do that, like (INAUDIBLE)

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, but look what you have to do for that. From here, you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do. If I could shake my ass for $15,000, I would shake my ass for $15,000.

(LAUGHTER)

VAN DER SLOOT: Today, all they want is just to see you, so you show them how beautiful you are...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... because you understand we have a club in Holland.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m interested to go abroad, but you know I cannot because I make the decision that I cannot leave my school.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK. Like, listen, baby, I`m from Holland and they from Holland also. And I go to the Holland embassy already and I look and for to get the paper to give to you right away. That`s not a problem.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No.

VAN DER SLOOT: So for -- go for, like, three months or something is very easy. It`s very easy. But for to get work permit, like, one year or two years, is more hard. And Holland very, very different than Bangkok. Holland is also very nice and very peaceful.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think you can get a lot of lady to go over there if you go to the government for looking people to find a job.

VAN DER SLOOT: The important thing is they want to do it good also. You don`t want to do it like paperwork good and that`s important for them also for the name and cannot do it like wrong. Just like no, no, no, they want to do it good. Real job is good also.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Is a real job even for the nice club.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Yes, he is the big man. That`s judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot, the prime suspect in the disappearance of Alabama honor grad Natalee Holloway. He managed to escape jail in her death, but now he`s busted again, this time trying to lure college students into the European sex trade. You just saw the videotape.

Out to Jossy Mansur, the owner and managing director of "Diario" magazine. Jossy, will there be charges?

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, "DIARIO": I think they have to introduce charges against him because the evidence is too much. I mean, it`s been recorded. I mean, we have all seen what was going on, how he tried to lure these girls, how he lied to them that it was going to be a modeling job, photo sessions, et cetera. But all the time, he had in mind a work time of 10 hours (INAUDIBLE)

GRACE: And in fact, he`s caught on videotape accepting payment, a down payment on luring young college co-eds into the sex trade, telling them they`d be models and ending up in a brothel in the Netherlands. That`s what Joran Van Der Sloot has been doing. In case you`ve been wondering whatever happened to Joran Van Der Sloot, now we know.

With -- reporter from WBMA, Deborah Pugatch -- what can you tell us, Deborah?

DEBORAH PUGATCH, WBMA PRODUCER: Well, what we do know is the first footage in the United States aired this morning. When it aired Sunday in the Netherlands, Thai authorities said, I want a transcript, to see if they had a case against Joran Van Der Sloot.

GRACE: Oh, blah, blah, Deborah! The said the same thing the last time Joran Van Der Sloot was caught on videotape talking about Natalee Holloway`s death. And what did they do? Let it slip through their fingers. OK, maybe the second bite of the apple will be different.

Take a look at Joran Van Der Sloot caught on videotape.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VAN DER SLOOT: Today, all they want is just to see you, so you show them how beautiful you are...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... because you understand we have a club in Holland.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m interested to go abroad, but you know I cannot because I make the decision that I cannot leave my school.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK. Like, listen, baby, I`m from Holland and they from Holland also. And I go to the Holland embassy already and I look and for to get the paper to give to you right away. That`s not a problem.

OK. Like, listen, I from Holland and they from Holland also. I go to the Holland embassy already. I look for them to give the paper they give to you right away. That`s not a problem.

To go for, like, three months or something is very easy. Very easy. For one year or two year is more hard. And Holland very, very different than Bangkok. Holland also very nice, very peaceful.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think you can get a lot of lady to go over there if the government for looking people for a job.

VAN DER SLOOT: The important thing is they want to do it good also. You don`t want to do it like paperwork good and that`s important for them also for the name and cannot do it like wrong. Just like no, no, no, they want to do it good. Is real job.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is real job even for the nice club.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: He is so busted! Yes, the Netherlands very nice, very peaceful -- for hookers! He didn`t finish the sentence. We are taking your calls live.

Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining me tonight, Ray Giudice, defense attorney out of the Atlanta jurisdiction, Michael Mazzariello, defense attorney and host of "Closing Arguments" on WGNY, and a special guest joining us tonight, international law and criminal defense attorney Michael Griffith. He is based in New York, travels all over the world handling cases.

Michael Griffith, if it were anywhere but Thailand or Aruba, I would say he`s busted. What about you?

MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY: Nancy, first, hi. It`s nice to see you. Nancy, I hate to burst everybody`s balloon. I`m a member of the criminal law committee of the international bar. I`m a member...

GRACE: "Burst your bubble." Go ahead.

GRIFFITH: All right. I`ve got the transcript here. There`s nothing in the transcripts that have been said except that these girls were going to go for dancing. Maybe that`s not true, but that`s what the tapes show. This Mr. De Vries really dropped the ball. If he wanted to get something out of this...

GRACE: Well, hold on. Hold on.

GRIFFITH: ... they should have -- Nancy, they should have...

GRACE: That`s a good point, Michael. That`s all we`ve heard so far. But hold on. Out to Peter Schouten, spokesperson for De Vries. He`s joining us from the Netherlands. Peter, isn`t it true that he is caught on tape going over the scheme where he represents to the young girls it`s a modeling job, but where he`s actually talking about it being prostitution?

PETER SCHOUTEN, SPOKESMAN FOR PETER DE VRIES: Yes. That is exactly correct, Nancy. And that is, of course, not the only thing. Joran also took the initiative to basically employ this kind of operation and he contacted people to work out a network for him in the Netherlands that he could trade the girls. So I disagree with the attorney there. There is a lot done (ph) to basically make this a criminal matter.

GRACE: So long story short -- with me is spokesperson for De Vries, Peter Schouten. Peter, he`s on tape talking about the young girls being prostitutes in the Netherlands. Yes, no.

SCHOUTEN: Yes. Correct. He is basically doing human trafficking to deliver girls to whorehouses, brothels and window (ph) prostitution.

GRACE: With me tonight exclusively joining us, Dave Holloway, Natalee Holloway`s father. Dave, thank you for being with us. We spoke briefly last night. Now that you`ve had time to digest all of this, now that you`ve seen the tapes yourself, what do you think?

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S FATHER: Thank you for having me, Nancy. It`s really unbelievable. But you know, talking to the experts in the past about his behavior, they pegged him right on it. They said he`d strike again in some form or other fashion, and he`s done that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was offering them a job as models in Holland.

VAN DER SLOOT: Look what you have to do for that. From here you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do. If I could shake my ass for $15,000, I would shake my ass for $15,000.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And in truth, he was trying to coax them into prostitution -- in other words, into the sex industries in Holland.

HOLLOWAY: It`s absolutely disgusting that this guy is involved in something like this. I hope the Thailand police do their job and get this guy. He needs to be taken off the streets.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me, $15,000 is nothing for me.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, $15,000 is nothing for you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. Not much.

VAN DER SLOOT: $15,000. Is nothing for her. $15,000 is nothing.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: The women you see, judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot snugged up in a hotel room with are college students there in Thailand. According to Peter De Vries, investigative reporter who`s responsible for this undercover video, he is trying to talk them into going to the Netherlands, his birth place, to be dancers and models. Translation, hookers.

We are taking your calls live. Out to Leah in Virginia. Hi, Leah.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. The children are beautiful. I was wondering what charges could he possibly be facing?

GRACE: Back to the lawyers. Joining us, international law and criminal defense attorney Michael Griffith, veteran trial lawyer Raymond Giudice out of Atlanta, Michael Mazzariello out of New York.

Ray, hit me. What could he be facing?

RAY GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, I want to switch the venue from Thailand to Holland. I think there`s two problems for this gentleman. One is, is he the front man for a group of clubs or organizations and he`s been sent over to bring these girls back, so there`s a big conspiracy? And secondly, is he attempting to defraud the Dutch immigration authorities? When you go to Europe, they want to know why you`re there, how long you`re going to stay, and if you`re working, it has to be for a legal and moral purpose.

GRACE: Ruh-roh! What about it, Mazzariello? He`s right about immigration, at least. I guess the feds aren`t going to pooh-pooh this.

MICHAEL MAZZARIELLO, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, that`s why I like Ray. He`s right on the money, Nancy. Throw in a couple of, you know, trafficking charges in there, get the tax people involved, and he could have real problems in Holland.

GRACE: Tax people? You think this guy`s ever held down a job? Are you kidding me?

MAZZARIELLO: Well, Nancy, that`s -- at least it`s what they could get the Thai government to get to hold him and to inquire further. I mean, just hold the guy and try to interrogate him.

GRACE: Michael?

GRIFFITH: Nancy, there`s been no crime committed here because, number one...

GRACE: He`s soliciting for prostitution!

GRIFFITH: Nancy, Nancy...

MAZZARIELLO: Not on tape.

GRIFFITH: Nancy, listen to Mike. Right now, there`s nothing on tape saying anything about prostitution.

GRACE: You`re making my jaw hurt.

GRIFFITH: No, just listen to me. This is what I do.

GRACE: Oh!

GRIFFITH: The second thing is, if they would have waited to have the false papers made out, help to pay for the airline tickets, bring the girls to Holland and then put them in prostitution -- by the way, where it`s legal there -- but then put them in...

GRACE: And wait until the girls get their first $20?

(CROSSTALK)

GRIFFITH: That`s how you make the sting. Nancy, that`s how you make the sting. De Vries, to get his 15 minutes of fame, messed things up. He jumped the gun.

GRACE: So you won`t be happy until a college student actually turns her first trick. Do I have that right, Griffith?

GRIFFITH: No. No. I said...

GRACE: Yes, I do.

GRIFFITH: ... you got to -- you have to have false papers, put them on the plane, send them to Holland...

GRACE: Listen...

GRIFFITH: ... and then you can make the arrest.

GRACE: Let me just break it down. To Mike Brooks. You know the deal, Brooks -- former fed with the FBI. Mike, when an undercover cop is doing a sting, a vice sting, they don`t actually do the deed. You go solicit a hooker, she gets in the car, says, Yes, I`ll turn a trick for X amount of money. Boom. That`s when the sting goes down, right there.

MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Usually, Nancy, to make a prostitution case, you need a place, a price and an act. Now, in this particular one, we`re talking, you know, college students that are, you know, allegedly college students...

GRACE: They`re college students.

BROOKS: Yes. OK. And there`s a the lot of college students working their way through school in Las Vegas also, Nancy.

GRACE: You`re right. Blame the victim. Go ahead.

BROOKS: No, I`m telling you. You know, I -- look, if you look at prostitution rings...

GRACE: Make your point, please. Please. Point.

BROOKS: Look. Bangkok, do you think that they really care? Because...

GRACE: No.

BROOKS: ... -do they want any -- do they want any attention into the sex industry in their country? Absolutely not. I think Raymond is absolutely right. You got to go back on the Dutch end of things and work it from there.

GRACE: They don`t care, either. The Netherlands don`t care.

BROOKS: Well, yes, the Dutch authorities screwed the Holloway investigation up from the very beginning, but...

GRACE: Yes, I mean, Dave Holloway, he`s got a point. With me exclusively tonight is Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway. Yes, he`s caught on tape again, but he`s been caught on tape before, describing Natalee`s death. Nothing happened. So we really think the Netherlands care about planning prostitution? Dave Holloway?

HOLLOWAY: Oh, I`m sorry?

GRACE: Go ahead, dear.

HOLLOWAY: You know, Nancy, I really don`t think that -- in my opinion, that they`ll probably do anything with this. It`s my hope and faith, and you know, just prayer that they will do something, but I`ve been down this road...

GRACE: How much more evidence do we have to hand them on a silver platter before they finally do something, Dave Holloway?

HOLLOWAY: You know, they`ve been handed the confession on a silver platter and they didn`t do anything. And that`s why I think in this case, you know, maybe I`m being a little bit negative on it, but...

GRACE: Well, I`m sure you don`t want to...

HOLLOWAY: ... you know, I know that...

GRACE: ... get your hopes up and then be dashed.

HOLLOWAY: I don`t want to get my hopes up high. You know, I think...

GRACE: Speaking of that tape, Dave...

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Go ahead. I`m sorry.

HOLLOWAY: I think they could probably charge him for preparation of human trafficking. I think they`ve probably got a good case there because I`ve seen some of the e-mail transmissions between he and his friend where they talk about it.

GRACE: We are taking your calls. To Linda in Texas. Hi, Linda.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I am calling -- first every all, Mr. Holloway, I would like to apologize for the loss of your daughter. And I hope we can somehow or another bring closure soon. My question is, since we`ve never actually found Natalee`s body, is it possible that the word could spread in Thailand, that maybe she might be there or maybe some of the girls that Joran Van Der Sloot has talked to has maybe mentioned her name and her whereabouts?

GRACE: What about that, too, Jossy Mansur, managing director and owner of "Diario" magazine? What about it, Jossy?

MANSUR: I think that`s very highly unlikely, Nancy. I don`t think that -- according to all the evidence we`ve seen from the beginning of this case, I don`t think she`s alive. I`m sorry to say that. I wish she were. But I think that in view of that and confirming it in the first program of De Vries, in Joran`s own voice, we heard him say that he was with her when she died.

GRACE: Well, actually, you know what? I`ve got that with me right now. Let`s roll that, Jossy. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): She just lying still?

VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): Still. Still. She`s not doing anything. He says, What happened? I said, I don`t know either, man.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): Did you try to resuscitate her?

VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): Of course. I tried everything, man. I tried to shake her. I was shaking the bitch. I was, like -- like, What`s wrong with you, man? I almost wanted to cry. What (DELETED) happened to me. I said to him, This is impossible.

He took the body. He went far out and he threw her over the side. Then he came back and he docked his boat there. And he came by my house for a bit.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): At night?

VAN DER SLOOT (through translator): Yes. Then we talked for a bit and he says to me, You know, it`s all good. She`s going to be missing. They`re going to search, but they`re not going to know a thing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: That is from ABC`s "20/20." It`s from Peter De Vries`s hidden camera interview of Joran Van Der Sloot describing what happened to Natalee Holloway the night she went missing.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: You are seeing secretly recorded video of Joran Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son, the prime suspect in the death and disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway. He is busted again.

Out to Peter Schouten, spokesperson for Peter De Vries. Peter, how was this set up?

SCHOUTEN: Well, Joran has a poker buddy, an on-line poker buddy, which he boasted a lot to after he moved to Thailand when we exposed him the first time, about how he was living like a king there. And then slowly, he started to ask this poker buddy if he could help him in setting up a network in the Netherlands for trafficking girls.

Now, what Joran didn`t know was that this buddy was actually a certified security guard. So of course, his moral standards were totally not the same like Joran`s. And he choose to contact Peter De Vries and tell him what was perspiring (SIC). So then we were getting involved in the case and decided to set up a sting.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me $15,000 is nothing for me.

JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: OK. $15,000 is nothing for you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. Not much.

VAN DER SLOOT: $15,000 is nothing for her. $15,000 is nothing for her.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: But when we do overtime, yes, maybe we can do that, right, at $15,000.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK. But look what you have to do for that. From here you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do. If I could shake my ass for $15,000, I shake my ass for $15,000.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I like dancing.

VAN DER SLOOT: And he offering you 15,000 baht to dance. And I understand you tell me that you have school.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: You have to finish. I understand. And you can tell me OK, after your school we talk about again?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: But.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And how long I have to dance for? One hour, two hour?

VAN DER SLOOT: No. Like 10 hour a day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s too much.

VAN DER SLOOT: No, no, no. I don`t know. I don`t know.

(CROSSTALK)

VAN DER SLOOT: From five to ten. Yes, from 5:00 in the afternoon to 5:00 in the morning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, that`s a lot.

VAN DER SLOOT: That`s a lot, yes, I know. But it`s not dance the whole time. You take break. You talk to the guys, you know, make them feel good. Give them drink.

Today all they want is to see you is to show them how beautiful you are.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because you understand we have a club in Holland.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m interested to go abroad but, you know, I know I cannot because I make the decision I cannot leave my school.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, like, listen, baby, I`m from Holland. And they`re from Holland also. And I go to Holland embassy already.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: And I look and for to get the paper to give to you right away. That`s not a problem. So for go for like three month or something is very easy. But for to get like work permit like one year or two year is more hard. And Holland, very, very different than Bangkok. Holland also very nice and very peaceful.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think you can get a lot of lady to go over there if you go to the government for looking people to find a job.

VAN DER SLOOT: Well, the important thing is you want to do it then they want to do it good also. Also you don`t want to do it like paperwork good and everything in order. Everything good. That`s important for them also for the name and cannot do like wrong, just like no, no, no, they want to do it good. Is real job is good also.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Is real job even for the nice club.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NANCY GRACE, HOST: And when you hear him offering, Joran Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son, the prime suspect in the death of Natalee Holloway, talking about $15,000. It`s not $15,000, it`s 15,000 baht which equals $428 for a month of prostitution. Yes, that`s a real deal.

We are taking your calls live.

To Dr. Marty Makary, physician and professor of public health, joining us from Johns Hopkins -- Dr. Makary, thank you for being with us. It`s now over three years since Natalee went missing.

What is the likelihood, if her remains are found now, that the Aruba authorities are interested in the case after seeing this? What would you expect to find, assume it`s under water?

DR. MARTY MAKARY, PHYSICIAN, PROF. OF PUBLIC HEALTH, JOHNS HOPKINS: Well, of course, the likelihood is very low. You know an entire merit case will rest on the forensic evidence from a body because it`s a gold mine of evidence.

And in this case they`ve searched the ocean. Salt is a natural detergent. The currents of the ocean floor are strong and accelerate decomposition. So it is highly unlikely that anything is going to come out of this.

You know crimes at sea are difficult for this reason. And you do not want to get on a boat with anybody that you don`t trust fully.

GRACE: To Patricia Saunders, clinical psychologist joining us in New York -- Dr. Saunders, you know, he came this close to an arrest in a murder case. Why didn`t he just lay low and mind his own business? What happened to going to college and going straight?

PATRICIA SAUNDERS, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST: Well, this guy is a predator and he`s obviously a parasite. He dropped out of college because he wants the easy way. Joran Van Der Sloot really looks like a sociopath, Nancy, no remorse, no empathy, thinks he is a lot smarter than he really is.

The only good news so far is if he doesn`t get caught this time he will continue doing it and he will get caught.

GRACE: Well, I guess you can view that as good news that he will continue to prey on other people and maybe get caught. And then there`s the big maybe whether authorities in Netherlands will do anything about it.

I want to go back to Peter Schouten, spokesperson for Peter De Vries.

Peter, it`s my understanding that he cannot be found. He`s gone in hiding under the name of Murphy Jenkins and maybe on an island off the Thai, Ko Samui. What do you know?

PETER SCHOUTEN, SPOKESMAN FOR PETER DE VRIES, EXECUTED STING OPERATION: Yes, it`s correct. He ran off and according to the rumors, he took a plane to Ko Samui together with his accomplice. So at this moment it`s difficult to find him.

We have people posting outside the house after Peter De Vries made this phone call to Joran. But suddenly (INAUDIBLE) at the house and he was (INAUDIBLE) in driving away and just went into hiding.

GRACE: There is Van Der Sloot at the airport believed to be traveling under the name, the pseudonym, Murphy Jenkins, last known to be boarding on a plane to Ko Samui.

Let`s see that map again.

Out to the line, Beth in Florida. Hi, Beth.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, Nancy. Love your show.

GRACE: Bless you. Thank you for calling in. What is your question, dear?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One, who is funding this guy? I mean who is actually paying for him?

GRACE: Excellent question.

Jossy Mansur with "Diario" magazine, is daddy still footing the bill, mommy and daddy?

JOSSY MANSUR, OWNER AND MANAGING DIRECTOR, "DIARIO": I think probably, because I -- I don`t see any other source of income that he has. He never worked in his life.

GRACE: What happened to school?

MANSUR: Well, I don`t know, but he`s not going to school anymore. He disappeared from Holland. And suddenly he is living in Thailand and now he disappears again. So I don`t know what his interest in school is.

GRACE: To Donny in South Carolina, hi, Donny.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I love your show and thank you so much for sharing the pictures of your adorable babies with us every week.

GRACE: Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Question is, if he is charged with human trafficking, what is the most amount of time he can get in jail? And also, can he be charged for evading the police since he is hiding under a new alias now?

GRACE: OK. Michael Griffith, try to answer that objectively. Go ahead.

NANCY GRIFFITH, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, I don`t know what the statute is in Holland, but if this were done correctly, since only maybe 11 people in Thailand know where Aruba is, and if they could have got this man and done this sting in the Netherlands, then they could have used the charges in the Netherlands to possibly make him cooperate with what happened in Aruba. But they didn`t do that. Mr. De Vries totally messed up things here.

GRACE: If it weren`t for De Vries we wouldn`t even have the knowledge that this is happening. What is with you and De Vries? You`ve never even met him.

GRIFFITH: He didn`t do this properly. He should have done this properly with the police.

GRACE: Yes, the police should have done it. The police should have done it. But guess what, they`re twiddling their thumbs. No, they`re sitting on their thumbs. And I won`t describe that any further.

Ray Giudice, what about it? What could he face?

RAY GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, certainly not running from law enforcement. There`s no charges.

GRACE: How do you know? He`s in hiding.

GIUDICE: Somebody should issue a warrant, put it through Interpol and let him get picked up. That`s how it happens. So until there`s a warrant, Nancy, or an investigation he`s not running from any.

GRACE: He`s not running. You`re absolutely correct.

Michael Mazzariello, agree or disagree?

MICHAEL MAZZARIELLO, DEFENSE ATTORNEY, HOST OF "CLOSING: Absolutely agree.

GRACE: Back to the lines, Julie in Indiana. Hi, Julie.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. You look great.

GRACE: Thank you, dear. What`s your question?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My question is they`ve found Natalee. Have they ever thought about looking for her in a brothel?

GRACE: I want to go back to Natalee`s dad with us exclusively tonight, Dave Holloway. That theory had been floated at the beginning. What do you make of it?

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S FATHER: Yes, it was. We had all kinds of theories in the very beginning. But as the investigation continued and this first Peter De Vries tape pretty much summarized what happened to Natalee.

I had a long in-depth conversation with Patrick, the person who was with Joran for six or seven months. And there`s a lot of things that he told me that was not on the videotape. And he assured me that Joran told him on many occasions what happened.

GRACE: What, what, what did he tell you?

HOLLOWAY: Well, he just basically said what was on the tape was the truth and that was confirmed by three other experts.

GRACE: Well, speaking of the tape, Dave, here it is.

Everybody, we are showing you the tape he`s talking about from ABC`s "20/20."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PATRICK VAN DER EEM (through translator): How were you so sure she was dead, Joran? You can`t, you know, people can also go into coma.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, I wasn`t sure about that but it really scared me to death.

VAN DER EEM: No, but I understand that. I definitely understand that, that you were scared. She really brought it to herself.

VAN DER SLOOT: No, no. But it didn`t look good.

VAN DER EEM: How didn`t it look good then?

VAN DER SLOOT: Just, you know, she had been shaking and stuff.

VAN DER EEM: What, really shaking?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. I don`t know. Yes. Pretty much.

VAN DER EEM: I`m asking you. How were you so (EXPLETIVE DELETED) sure she was dead, man?

VAN DER SLOOT: I wasn`t (EXPLETIVE DELETED) sure.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: That was from "20/20" from ABC. Joran Van Der Sloot seemingly concerned about his own fate as opposed to that of American teen Natalee Holloway.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWSBREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I like dancing.

VAN DER SLOOT: And he offering you 15,000 baht to dance. And I understand you tell me that you have school.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: You have to finish. I understand. And you can tell me OK, after your school we talk about again?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: But.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And how long I have to dance for? One hour, two hour?

VAN DER SLOOT: No. Like 10 hour a day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s too much.

VAN DER SLOOT: No, no, no. I don`t know. I don`t know.

(CROSSTALK)

VAN DER SLOOT: From five to ten. Yes, from 5:00 in the afternoon to 5:00 in the morning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, that`s a lot.

VAN DER SLOOT: That`s a lot, yes, I know. But it`s not dance the whole time. You take break. You talk to the guys, you know, make them feel good. Give them drink.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We`re about to take you to America`s heartland and a missing mom of two. But very quickly, back to Peter Schouten.

Peter, have the authorities in the Netherlands displayed the least bit interest in prosecuting Van Der Sloot?

SCHOUTEN: Well, they did and also in Thailand. The ambassador immediately asked for the tapes and translated them. Where Michael is wrong is that masterminding and flipping a crime like this is a criminal offense which can be prosecuted in both Thailand and the Netherlands.

GRACE: And.

SCHOUTEN: Joran produced the girls and he took the money as advance payment. And those are criminal (INAUDIBLE) and offenses.

GRACE: Absolutely. And to Deborah Pugatch of WBMA -- Deborah, what can you tell me about Ko Samui and the possibility he`s traveling under the name Murphy Jenkins?

DEBORAH PUGATCH, PRODUCER, CNN AFFILIATE WBMA, COVERING STORY: I did that -- tonight is the first time that I`ve actually heard about him traveling under an alias. I had not heard anything about that. All we know.

GRACE: What do you know about that island?

PUGATCH: I do not know much of anything about that Thai island either. This is the first time that I have heard that he has gone there or has been traveling under an alias.

GRACE: Peter, has it been confirmed that he is there at Ko Samui?

SCHOUTEN: No. It has not been not confirmed. It is a rumor.

GRACE: In the Dutch reports.

Everyone, we are staying on top of it. Joran Van Der Sloot may be finally be looking at the inside of a jail cell.

Quickly, shifting gears to a missing mom. Take a listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Nearly 100 volunteers combed the woods and waters of Hatfield, Wisconsin, searching for 27-year-old Alicia Sidie. She was sighted leaving her home Friday night allegedly after a fight with her husband.

She was alone and on foot. No one has seen or heard from her since. Canine has tracked her scent near the railroad tracks and (INAUDIBLE) in the southeast portion of town. But divers and searchers have come up empty handed.

Until Alicia is found, her family will hold on to hope.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: We contacted Alicia Sidie`s husband about her disappearance. And he seemed to be angry on the telephone and would not come on air to answer questions.

To Sheriff Duane Waldera, with the Jackson County Sheriff`s Department joining us, Black River Falls, Wisconsin -- Sheriff, thank you for being with us.

Sheriff, was there an argument with the husband just before she disappeared?

SHERIFF DUANE WALDERA, PIO, JACKSON COUNTY SHERIFF`S DEPT. ON THE CASE: Yes, there was.

GRACE: What was it over, Sheriff?

WALDERA: Apparently there is some problems in the past and they are talking about childcare issues. The specifics on the argument aren`t really -- we are trying to track down based on what we got from Doug right now. That`s all the information we have to work off of so.

GRACE: Back to Sheriff Duane Waldera, joining us from Jackson County Sheriff`s Department. Sheriff, what were the circumstances surrounding her disappearance? When did it go down?

WALDERA: Well, from what we have right now is that the initial argument or last time Alicia was seen was received by the husband Doug. And it was on November 7th, right around 9:00 p.m., between 9:00 and 10:00 p.m. we did not receive a report of a missing person until November 8th in the evening hours, around 6:00.

GRACE: 24 hours later?

WALDERA: Yes.

GRACE: OK. That doesn`t look good.

Out to Dan O`Donnell, reporter with 620 WTMJ.

Dan, thank you for being with us. Fill me in. What happened?

DAN O`DONNELL, REPORTER, 620 WTMJ COVERING STORY: Well, at about 9:00, Alicia came home from work. At some point shortly thereafter she got in an argument with her estranged and reconciled husband Doug.

And then according to the sheriff`s department, one of Alicia`s friends received a voice mail at about 9:19 and a local TV station is reporting that she sounded panicked and asked for help. And as the sheriff said, about 21 hours later at 6:00 p.m. on Saturday, her husband Doug first reported her missing.

GRACE: To Dr. Marty Makary with Johns Hopkins -- Doctor, if Alicia was somehow trapped outside in the Wisconsin cold, how long could she last?

MAKARY: Well, we know she was wearing a long-sleeved shirt and scrub- like pants, like the type worn in hospitals. After 24 to 48 hours, severe hypothermia will set in. My concern is you lose your orientation and just feel tired and you don`t know your way home.

GRACE: Unleash the lawyers, Ray Giudice, Michael Mazzariello.

Michael, I find it very unusual that the husband isn`t going all over the media begging for help finding his wife.

MAZZARIELLO: But I understand he`s looking for her and doing what he has to do at -- at the location, Nancy.

GRACE: Ray, would you address my question?

GIUDICE: Well, Nancy, the sheriff was just on and he didn`t give one scintilla of evidence that this gentleman is a suspect nor.

GRACE: That`s not why I asked you.

GIUDICE: Why should he do anything more? He`s cooperating with law enforcement. He doesn`t need to come on this show.

GRACE: You know what? You don`t have to do anything, right?

GIUDICE: He needs to cooperate with law enforcement.

GRACE: You`re right.

Dr. Patricia Saunders, you`re right. You can sit back on a recliner and eat popcorn and watch TV if you want to. But if somebody in my family were missing I would use every possible outlet to find them.

I mean we just saw Dave Holloway. You remember what they went through trying to find Natalee?

SAUNDERS: I sure do. This -- he waited 24 hours to report her. And if she did call someone because she was panicked and asked for help I think it`s interesting she called a friend and not her ex-husband.

GRACE: He is not a suspect.

Doctor -- excuse me, I`ve already gone to Dr. Makary.

I want to go to Mike Brooks, former fed with the FBI. Weigh in, Mike.

MIKE BROOKS, FMR. DC POLICE DETECTIVE SERVED ON FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: My questions are of the sheriff. What was the activity on her cell phone? Where were the different cell towers when that call was made? Was there any activity on her ATM? Was there a search warrant conducted? Where is the -- her computer taken? Who was she contacting 24 hours up to this? What was he doing also?

These are all questions that I would have and I`m sure the sheriff is working on that.

GRACE: The tip line 715-284-5357. 284-5357.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Tonight, to all of you who serve and served our country, on Veterans Day, we honor you.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The head stones are lined over these hallowed hills behind us, bear witness to the price our country has paid for our freedoms. They are testimony to the willingness to struggle and sacrifice for those freedoms.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: By heroic devotion of love of country, and sacrifice by the men and women who have served in the Armed Forces of the United States of America.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think I learned through my injuries early on that we`re not the sum of our parts, right? That I lost an arm and a leg but -- and a job, but that I gained a sense of self.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Let`s stop and remember Army Private First Class Corey Hicks, 22, Glendale, Arizona, killed Iraq. Loved animals, rodeo, Twizzlers, dreamed of restoring his truck after Iraq. Leaves behind parents, Dawn and Russell, stepdad Tim, brothers, two sisters.

Corey Hicks, American hero.

Thank you to all of our guests but especially to you for being with us. And tonight, a special good night from friends of the show, Susan, 12- year-old Eddie, he`s got a future on-air, and Martha Heller, the mother of my best friend from law school. She sent us chocolate chip cookies three straight years.

After helping her son make his dream come true with law school, she`s making her dream come true. Back to school and not just school. She is studying at Harvard. Living proof that dreams do come true.

I`ll see you tomorrow night, 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END

NANCY GRACE

Van Der Sloot Thailand Tape Released

Aired November 11, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


NANCY GRACE, HOST: Breaking news tonight in the sudden disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway, missing off her high school senior trip, Aruba. Aruban police claim they can`t or won`t make a case against Van Der Sloot in the disappearance of Holloway, even after a Dutch crime reporter takes months of high-tech secret surveillance proving what happened the night the Alabama beauty vanished. Aruban courts let Van Der Sloot, the judge`s son, walk free.
But tonight, we have obtained the video and audiotape that may land judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot behind bars. That`s right, judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot busted, preying on unsuspecting young women, attempting to lure them into the sex trade between Thailand and his birth place, the Netherlands, Van Der Sloot reported to make up to $13,000 per female recruit. And now that Van Der Sloot is busted again, Aruban prosecutors say they`re back on the Holloway case, now deciding whether to re-arrest Van Der Sloot. But tonight, will Van Der Sloot, reportedly in hiding, finally land where he belong, behind bars? Somebody tell me how`s Daddy going to get him out of this one?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I like dancing.

JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: And he offering you $15,000 to dance. And I understand you tell me that you have school you have to finish. I understand. And you can tell me, OK, after your school, will we talk about it again?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. And how long I have to dance for, one hour, two hours?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, like, 10 hour a day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh! That`s too much!

VAN DER SLOOT: I don`t know.

(CROSSTALK)

VAN DER SLOOT: From 5:00 in the afternoon to 5:00 in the morning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That a lot!

VAN DER SLOOT: That`s a lot, yes, I know, but it`s not dance the whole time. You take break. You talk to the guys, you know, make them feel good, give them drink.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GRACE: Yes, he`s the man.

And tonight, the mystery surrounding a beautiful young mom of two vanishing into thin air straight out America`s heartland.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Searches resumed today in the case of missing 27- year-old mother of two Alisha Sidie. According to reports, Sidie left her home between 9:00 and 10:00 PM Friday night after an argument with her ex- husband. Over 150 volunteers are assisting in the search effort, with helicopters, canines and dive teams all scouring the area for the young mom. Alisha`s sister, Tracy, says there`s no way that Alisha would have left without her 2-year-old twin boys at her side. Police say there`s no evidence of foul play and will continue to search for Alisha, who was last seen wearing a long-sleeved white shirt and blue scrub pants.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is very unusual for her. I`ve known Alisha since she was a little baby. She`s like a sister to me. She`s like my daughter. She is -- this is very unusual for her, very unusual. She would never do this. Never.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Good evening. I`m Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us. Breaking news tonight in the disappearance of Alabama beauty Natalee Holloway. We have obtained a video and audiotape that may land judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot behind bars.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me -- $15,000 is nothing for me.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, $15,000 is nothing for you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. No. Not much.

VAN DER SLOOT: $15,000 is nothing for her.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ... but when we do overtime, yes, maybe we can do that, like (INAUDIBLE)

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, but look what you have to do for that. From here, you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do. If I could shake my ass for $15,000, I would shake my ass for $15,000.

(LAUGHTER)

VAN DER SLOOT: Today, all they want is just to see you, so you show them how beautiful you are...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... because you understand we have a club in Holland.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m interested to go abroad, but you know I cannot because I make the decision that I cannot leave my school.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK. Like, listen, baby, I`m from Holland and they from Holland also. And I go to the Holland embassy already and I look and for to get the paper to give to you right away. That`s not a problem.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No.

VAN DER SLOOT: So for -- go for, like, three months or something is very easy. It`s very easy. But for to get work permit, like, one year or two years, is more hard. And Holland very, very different than Bangkok. Holland is also very nice and very peaceful.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think you can get a lot of lady to go over there if you go to the government for looking people to find a job.

VAN DER SLOOT: The important thing is they want to do it good also. You don`t want to do it like paperwork good and that`s important for them also for the name and cannot do it like wrong. Just like no, no, no, they want to do it good. Real job is good also.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes. Is a real job even for the nice club.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: Yes, he is the big man. That`s judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot, the prime suspect in the disappearance of Alabama honor grad Natalee Holloway. He managed to escape jail in her death, but now he`s busted again, this time trying to lure college students into the European sex trade. You just saw the videotape.

Out to Jossy Mansur, the owner and managing director of "Diario" magazine. Jossy, will there be charges?

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, "DIARIO": I think they have to introduce charges against him because the evidence is too much. I mean, it`s been recorded. I mean, we have all seen what was going on, how he tried to lure these girls, how he lied to them that it was going to be a modeling job, photo sessions, et cetera. But all the time, he had in mind a work time of 10 hours (INAUDIBLE)

GRACE: And in fact, he`s caught on videotape accepting payment, a down payment on luring young college co-eds into the sex trade, telling them they`d be models and ending up in a brothel in the Netherlands. That`s what Joran Van Der Sloot has been doing. In case you`ve been wondering whatever happened to Joran Van Der Sloot, now we know.

With -- reporter from WBMA, Deborah Pugatch -- what can you tell us, Deborah?

DEBORAH PUGATCH, WBMA PRODUCER: Well, what we do know is the first footage in the United States aired this morning. When it aired Sunday in the Netherlands, Thai authorities said, I want a transcript, to see if they had a case against Joran Van Der Sloot.

GRACE: Oh, blah, blah, Deborah! The said the same thing the last time Joran Van Der Sloot was caught on videotape talking about Natalee Holloway`s death. And what did they do? Let it slip through their fingers. OK, maybe the second bite of the apple will be different.

Take a look at Joran Van Der Sloot caught on videotape.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VAN DER SLOOT: Today, all they want is just to see you, so you show them how beautiful you are...

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ... because you understand we have a club in Holland.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m interested to go abroad, but you know I cannot because I make the decision that I cannot leave my school.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK. Like, listen, baby, I`m from Holland and they from Holland also. And I go to the Holland embassy already and I look and for to get the paper to give to you right away. That`s not a problem.

OK. Like, listen, I from Holland and they from Holland also. I go to the Holland embassy already. I look for them to give the paper they give to you right away. That`s not a problem.

To go for, like, three months or something is very easy. Very easy. For one year or two year is more hard. And Holland very, very different than Bangkok. Holland also very nice, very peaceful.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think you can get a lot of lady to go over there if the government for looking people for a job.

VAN DER SLOOT: The important thing is they want to do it good also. You don`t want to do it like paperwork good and that`s important for them also for the name and cannot do it like wrong. Just like no, no, no, they want to do it good. Is real job.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Is real job even for the nice club.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: He is so busted! Yes, the Netherlands very nice, very peaceful -- for hookers! He didn`t finish the sentence. We are taking your calls live.

Let`s unleash the lawyers. Joining me tonight, Ray Giudice, defense attorney out of the Atlanta jurisdiction, Michael Mazzariello, defense attorney and host of "Closing Arguments" on WGNY, and a special guest joining us tonight, international law and criminal defense attorney Michael Griffith. He is based in New York, travels all over the world handling cases.

Michael Griffith, if it were anywhere but Thailand or Aruba, I would say he`s busted. What about you?

MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY: Nancy, first, hi. It`s nice to see you. Nancy, I hate to burst everybody`s balloon. I`m a member of the criminal law committee of the international bar. I`m a member...

GRACE: "Burst your bubble." Go ahead.

GRIFFITH: All right. I`ve got the transcript here. There`s nothing in the transcripts that have been said except that these girls were going to go for dancing. Maybe that`s not true, but that`s what the tapes show. This Mr. De Vries really dropped the ball. If he wanted to get something out of this...

GRACE: Well, hold on. Hold on.

GRIFFITH: ... they should have -- Nancy, they should have...

GRACE: That`s a good point, Michael. That`s all we`ve heard so far. But hold on. Out to Peter Schouten, spokesperson for De Vries. He`s joining us from the Netherlands. Peter, isn`t it true that he is caught on tape going over the scheme where he represents to the young girls it`s a modeling job, but where he`s actually talking about it being prostitution?

PETER SCHOUTEN, SPOKESMAN FOR PETER DE VRIES: Yes. That is exactly correct, Nancy. And that is, of course, not the only thing. Joran also took the initiative to basically employ this kind of operation and he contacted people to work out a network for him in the Netherlands that he could trade the girls. So I disagree with the attorney there. There is a lot done (ph) to basically make this a criminal matter.

GRACE: So long story short -- with me is spokesperson for De Vries, Peter Schouten. Peter, he`s on tape talking about the young girls being prostitutes in the Netherlands. Yes, no.

SCHOUTEN: Yes. Correct. He is basically doing human trafficking to deliver girls to whorehouses, brothels and window (ph) prostitution.

GRACE: With me tonight exclusively joining us, Dave Holloway, Natalee Holloway`s father. Dave, thank you for being with us. We spoke briefly last night. Now that you`ve had time to digest all of this, now that you`ve seen the tapes yourself, what do you think?

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S FATHER: Thank you for having me, Nancy. It`s really unbelievable. But you know, talking to the experts in the past about his behavior, they pegged him right on it. They said he`d strike again in some form or other fashion, and he`s done that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was offering them a job as models in Holland.

VAN DER SLOOT: Look what you have to do for that. From here you have to shake your ass. That`s all you have to do. If I could shake my ass for $15,000, I would shake my ass for $15,000.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And in truth, he was trying to coax them into prostitution -- in other words, into the sex industries in Holland.

HOLLOWAY: It`s absolutely disgusting that this guy is involved in something like this. I hope the Thailand police do their job and get this guy. He needs to be taken off the streets.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: For me, $15,000 is nothing for me.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, $15,000 is nothing for you?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, no. Not much.

VAN DER SLOOT: $15,000. Is nothing for her. $15,000 is nothing.

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: The women you see, judge`s son Joran Van Der Sloot snugged up in a hotel room with are college students there in Thailand. According to Peter De Vries, investigative reporter who`s responsible for this undercover video, he is trying to talk them into going to the Netherlands, his birth place, to be dancers and models. Translation, hookers.

We are taking your calls live. Out to Leah in Virginia. Hi, Leah.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. The children are beautiful. I was wondering what charges could he possibly be facing?

GRACE: Back to the lawyers. Joining us, international law and criminal defense attorney Michael Griffith, veteran trial lawyer Raymond Giudice out of Atlanta, Michael Mazzariello out of New York.

Ray, hit me. What could he be facing?

RAY GIUDICE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, Nancy, I want to switch the venue from Thailand to Holland. I think there`s two problems for this gentleman. One is, is he the front man for a group of clubs or organizations and he`s been sent over to bring these girls back, so there`s a big conspiracy? And secondly, is he attempting to defraud the Dutch immigration authorities? When you go to Europe, they want to know why you`re there, how long you`re going to stay, and if you`re working, it has to be for a legal and moral purpose.

GRACE: Ruh-roh! What about it, Mazzariello? He`s right about immigration, at least. I guess the feds aren`t going to pooh-pooh this.

MICHAEL MAZZARIELLO, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, that`s why I like Ray. He`s right on the money, Nancy. Throw in a couple of, you know, trafficking charges in there, get the tax people involved, and he could have real problems in Holland.

GRACE: Tax people? You think this guy`s ever held down a job? Are you kidding me?

MAZZARIELLO: Well, Nancy, that`s -- at least it`s what they could get the Thai government to get to hold him and to inquire further. I mean, just hold the guy and try to interrogate him.

GRACE: Michael?

GRIFFITH: Nancy, there`s been no crime committed here because, number one...

GRACE: He`s soliciting for prostitution!

GRIFFITH: Nancy, Nancy...

MAZZARIELLO: Not on tape.

GRIFFITH: Nancy, listen to Mike. Right now, there`s nothing on tape saying anything about prostitution.

GRACE: You`re making my jaw hurt.

GRIFFITH: No, just listen to me. This is what I do.

GRACE: Oh!

GRIFFITH: The second thing is, if they would have waited to have the false papers made out, help to pay for the airline tickets, bring the girls to Holland and then put them in prostitution -- by the way, where it`s legal there -- but then put them in...

GRACE: And wait until the girls get their first $20?

(CROSSTALK)

GRIFFITH: That`s how you make the sting. Nancy, that`s how you make the sting. De Vries, to get his 15 minutes of fame, messed things up. He jumped the gun.

GRACE: So you won`t be happy until a college student actually turns her first trick. Do I have that right, Griffith?

GRIFFITH: No. No. I said...

GRACE: Yes, I do.

GRIFFITH: ... you got to -- you have to have false papers, put them on the plane, send them to Holland...

GRACE: Listen...

GRIFFITH: ... and then you can make the arrest.

GRACE: Let me just break it down. To Mike Brooks. You know the deal, Brooks -- former fed with the FBI. Mike, when an undercover cop is doing a sting, a vice sting, they don`t actually do the deed. You go solicit a hooker, she gets in the car, says, Yes, I`ll turn a trick for X amount of money. Boom. That`s when the sting goes down, right there.

MIKE BROOKS, FORMER D.C. POLICE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Usually, Nancy, to make a prostitution case, you need a place, a price and an act. Now, in this particular one, we`re talking, you know, college students that are, you know, allegedly college students...

GRACE: They`re college students.

BROOKS: Yes. OK. And there`s a the lot of college students working their way through school in Las Vegas also, Nancy.

GRACE: You`re right. Blame the victim. Go ahead.

BROOKS: No, I`m telling you. You know, I -- look, if you look at prostitution rings...

GRACE: Make your point, please. Please. Point.

BROOKS: Look. Bangkok, do you think that they really care? Because...

GRACE: No.

BROOKS: ... -do they want any -- do they want any attention into the sex industry in their country? Absolutely not. I think Raymond is absolutely right. You got to go back on the Dutch end of things and work it from there.

GRACE: They don`t care, either. The Netherlands don`t care.

BROOKS: Well, yes, the Dutch authorities screwed the Holloway investigation up from the very beginning, but...

GRACE: Yes, I mean, Dave Holloway, he`s got a point. With me exclusively tonight is Natalee`s father, Dave Holloway. Yes, he`s caught on tape again, but he`s been caught on tape before, describing Natalee`s death. Nothing happened. So we really think the Netherlands care about planning prostitution? Dave Holloway?

HOLLOWAY: Oh, I`m sorry?

GRACE: Go ahead, dear.

HOLLOWAY: You know, Nancy, I really don`t think that -- in my opinion, that they`ll probably do anything with this. It`s my hope and faith, and you know, just prayer that they will do something, but I`ve been down this road...

GRACE: How much more evidence do we have to hand them on a silver platter before they finally do something, Dave Holloway?

HOLLOWAY: You know, they`ve been handed the confession on a silver platter and they didn`t do anything. And that`s why I think in this case, you know, maybe I`m being a little bit negative on it, but...

GRACE: Well, I`m sure you don`t want to...

HOLLOWAY: ... you know, I know that...

GRACE: ... get your hopes up and then be dashed.

HOLLOWAY: I don`t want to get my hopes up high. You know, I think...

GRACE: Speaking of that tape, Dave...

(CROSSTALK)

GRACE: Go ahead. I`m sorry.

HOLLOWAY: I think they could probably charge him for preparation of human trafficking. I think they`ve probably got a good case there because I`ve seen some of the e-mail transmissions between he and his friend where they talk about it.

GRACE: We are taking your calls. To Linda in Texas. Hi, Linda.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi, Nancy. I am calling -- first every all, Mr. Holloway, I would like to apologize for the loss of your daughter. And I hope we can somehow or another bring closure soon. My question is, since we`ve never actually found Natalee`s body, is it possible that the word could spread in Thailand, that maybe she might be there or maybe some of the girls that Joran Van Der Sloot has talked to has maybe mentioned her name and her whereabouts?

GRACE: What about that, too, Jossy Ma

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NANCY GRACE
Aired November 12, 2008 - 20:00:00   ET

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I like dancing.

VAN DER SLOOT: And he offering you 15,000 baht to dance. And I understand you tell me that you have school.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: You have to finish. I understand. And you can tell me OK, after your school we talk about again?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: But.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And how long I have to dance for? One hour, two hour?

VAN DER SLOOT: No. Like 10 hour a day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s too much.

VAN DER SLOOT: No, no, no. I don`t know. I don`t know.

(CROSSTALK)

VAN DER SLOOT: From five to ten. Yes, from 5:00 in the afternoon to 5:00 in the morning.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, that is long.

VAN DER SLOOT: That`s a lot, yes, I know. But it`s not dance the whole time. You take break. You talk to the guys, you know, make them feel good. Give them drink.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GRACE: I can hardly even look at it.

(INAUDIBLE) Joran Van Der Sloot, caught in the act, reportedly, trying to ensnare young college students to become hookers. Of course, they thought they were going to be dancers and models.

To Art Harris, investigative journalist, unconfirmed reports as we go to air, that police have finally tracked down Joran Van Der Sloot. Yes, no.

ART HARRIS, INVESTIGATIVE JOURNALIST, COVERING STORY: That`s right, Nancy, on a small island off the coast of Thailand. A policeman who actually had his photon on his mobile phone spotted him and he`s now reportedly under arrest for -- you know, for this investigation.

I spoke to the Thai embassy today, Nancy, and if this is true, under Thai sex trafficking laws passed this June, he could face stiff prison term and a big fine.

GRACE: Oh boohoo.

Let`s go back to the lawyers, now joining me, along with Renee Rockwell, Atlanta, Alan Ripla, New York, international law attorney, Michael Griffith in New York.

Michael Griffith, you`re back for more.

MICHAEL GRIFFITH, INTERNATIONAL LAW ATTORNEY. CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Nancy, I love being here seeing you again.

GRACE: So what about this? Why is he hiding out in Ko Samui?

GRIFFITH: Well, you know, Nancy, after seeing this video again, you know, I believe there`s been a double scam here.

GRACE: Let me guess.

GRIFFITH: Listen to this.

GRACE: Van Der Sloot is the victim?

GRIFFITH: No, listen to this.

GRACE: Can you make it brief?

GRIFFITH: Nowhere has -- prostitution been mentioned on this video or in the transcript. Yesterday, the spokesperson said that prostitution was mentioned. It was mentioned, it would have been on your video.

I believe what happened was, Van De Vries, the reporter, took a film crew over there, spent thousands of dollars, was probably paid for to do a sting, they got a hotel, and no prostitution was mentioned. And now they`re pandering to the world that there was prostitution.

GRACE: So what is he doing trying to pay these college students $428 to get papers to go to the Netherlands?

GRIFFITH: First of all, there were no papers.

GRACE: We just heard him say that. What was he talking about, Griffith?

GRIFFITH: To dance. He`s a self-styled dance promoter, obviously.

GRACE: OK, you know what, I`m glad you said that.

GRIFFITH: He has nothing to do with prostitution.

GRACE: I`m going to save that clip for your (INAUDIBLE).

I want to go to Peter Schouten, spokesperson for De Vries. It is on the video, he is caught talking about prostitution, correct?

PETER SCHOUTEN, SPOKESMAN FOR PETER DE VRIES, EXECUTED STING OPERATION: Yes, hi, Nancy, that`s correct. And he has (INAUDIBLE), he represented himself clearly as a pimp. Michael is totally wrong.

Joran initiated this crime himself. He produced the girls, he made the deal, he took the money. He did human trafficking with the intent to exploit the girls, and that carries a maximum of eight years in jail.

GRACE: To Rupa Mikkilineni, our producer on this story -- Rupa, the offshoot of all of this is it has reignited the investigation into Natalee Hallow way`s death. Explain.

RUPA MIKKILINENI, NANCY GRACE PRODUCER: That`s correct, Nancy. Basically, the Aruban authorities -- I was on the phone with Hans Moss with yesterday, and essentially, De Vries, his original tape which was aired last year, at the end of last year, reignited the case. They were about to close the case last December.

Now let me just make this clear. They weren`t going to close the investigation in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. They were only going to close the investigation against Van Der Sloot.

GRACE: The new witness, the new witness, the new witness. Tell me.

MIKKILINENI: So they have a new witness that`s come out, and apparently this guy came forward before, but authorities didn`t take him seriously. They didn`t think he was credible. Now this witness was given polygraph tests, two polygraph tests that he did pass, and he says that the night that Natalee Holloway disappeared, he saw somebody looking like Joran Van Der Sloot and he does say that he recognizes Joran Van Der Sloot later on in the upcoming days.

GRACE: You know what, I`m interested, Rupa, that you said he`s passed two polygraphs.

Art Harris, what exactly does he say he saw the night Natalee went missing?

HARRIS: Two questions. He says that he saw Joran Van Der Sloot walking down a road at the time that Natalee was reportedly disappeared. Muddy, from the waist down, and later driving back in a red jeep, with a man he later recognized as Paul as his father.

GRACE: To Dave Holloway, joining us tonight exclusively. This is Natalee`s father. What do you make of this witness?

DAVE HOLLOWAY, NATALEE HOLLOWAY`S FATHER: You know, we knew about the witness probably eight or nine months ago. He identified himself to the boat captain, John Savati, and from there we proceeded to introduce him to the police department, so that they could take a witness statement.

And unfortunately, the police did not want to take him seriously. So we in turn provided him with an attorney. The attorney believed the witness. And we allowed him to talk to the prosecutor, and the prosecutor still discounted him. So the last resort was we.

GRACE: It`s ridiculous.

HOLLOWAY: We asked him to come to Houston, Texas, and we did a polygraph test, and guess what.

GRACE: He passed.

HOLLOWAY: He passed.

GRACE: Back to Art Harris, investigative journalist, he`s passed two polygraph tests. Tell me, how does daddy, daddy judge Van Der Sloot fit into this scenario?

HARRIS: Well, Nancy, he has told police that he woke up that morning at 7:00. So the worst case, this witness can only be used right now to show that father, the judge, is lying if he is believed. This is not enough to reopen a murder investigation.

GRACE: Says you. I`m sorry, I thought you were an investigative journalist.

(CROSSTALK)

HARRIS: Well, I`ve known you long enough, Nancy. But since he told - - Hans Mos told your producers that only if they found a witness who saw Natalee Holloway on the beach with Joran would they be able to make an arrest.

GRACE: To Rupa Mikkilineni, doesn`t the witness place the judge on the scene?

MIKKILINENI: Yes, the witness does place the judge on the scene. But the thing is we`re not sure where the scene of the crime is. We don`t know if Natalee died on the beach, we don`t know if she died in a pond.

GRACE: Well, that`s what he said on the videotape in the SUV. He says she died on the beach. And he got rid of the body, Rupa. Didn`t he?

MIKKILINENI: He does confess this or admit this in the tape, Nancy. But here`s the thing. We`ve got this witness that places him near a pond that his first.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GRACE: Speaking of miscarriage of justice, back to the lawyers. Michael Griffith, Renee Rockwell, Alan Ripka.

Renee Rockwell, I`ve never heard anything so ridiculous in my life that you`ve got to have a witness placing him there on the beach with her the night she died? That`s not true. You can make a case on circumstantial evidence. Plus he confessed on a -- in that SUV when he was being secretly recorded.

ROCKWELL: Nancy, I don`t know what else it`s going to take. I`ll say one thing. This deal with the pond and the slow walk and the dad following him, the best -- I have to agree with Art -- that you`re going to get out of that is perhaps some false swearing. Nothing near homicide.

GRACE: Says you.

To Dr. Joshua Perper -- Dr. Perper -- oh-oh, satellite down on Perper. Alan Ripka, weigh in.

RIPKA: Well, at the end of the day when you have an unsolved murder it`s amazing that they would discount a witness statement that placed the father and son together. I can`t believe that, Nancy. Certainly that shows that the father was lying. And that will continue an investigation because you know he`s got something to hide.

GRACE: Michael Griffith, I know what you`re going to say. So to Mike Brooks.

MIKE BROOKS, FMR. DC POLICE DETECTIVE SERVED ON FBI TERRORISM TASK FORCE: Well, Nancy, you know, if you recall back during the investigation, apparently they did pay attention to him a little bit, because if you recall, during the investigation in Aruba, they went back and they drained that pond that was right near the Marriott Hotel. Apparently they thought that some of his story was at least true.

GRACE: Joran Van Der Sloot. Apparently, police have caught up with him on an island off the Thai coast. We`ll keep you posted.

But let`s stop and remember Marine Corporal Miguel Guzman, 21, Norwalk, California, killed Iraq. Awarded the National Defense Service medal, Iraq Campaign medal, and Global War on Terrorism service medal.

Loved soccer, tennis, helping others. Dreamed of college. Leaves behind grieving parents Jose and Rosalba, brothers Jose Jr. and Ricky, also fiancee.

Miguel Guzman, American hero.

Thank you to our guests and especially for being with us. And happy birthday to Georgia friend of the show Joe Rickman Sr. And tonight a special good night from Florida friends of the show Joe and Tara.

Now, aren`t they a good looking couple?

Everybody, I`ll see you tomorrow night 8:00 sharp Eastern. And until then, good night, friend.

END

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0811/12/ng.01.html

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November 17th, 2008 10:56 AM Eastern
The latest
by Greta Van Susteren


Next week, if things go as planned, you will see some information we have obtained in the Natalee Holloway investigation.  The information is in the form of audio and video tapes and other.  The information is either the answer to what happened to Natalee Holloway or a wild goose chase. You will make your own judgment.

I am hoping that the Aruban prosecutor will use his subpoena power to investigate further…and I am hoping to at least shed light on a very big problem that our own State Department admits is a giant problem in the Aruba area.

Once we obtained this information months ago, our job has been twofold: to disprove or prove.  A good investigator chases down every lead and then works to both prove and disprove that lead.

I will tell you this: the new information fits the time line.  I will also tell you that JIm Hammer went to Aruba for us and when he confronted Joran Van der Sloot’s father it was, to say the least, “awkward.” It was so weird that Paulus Van der Sloot ripped a paper out of Hammer’s hand (a transcript) and ran into his office.  Note also that until we got this information, the Kalpoe brothers’ Aruban lawyer would always return my phone calls.  Now he will not…

Many of you have asked me in recent months what is the latest in this investigation.  I can only tell you that we have not given up — and as proof of our stamina and determination,  we have used weekends to work on this case and time during the week when we could fit between our other responsibilities.

http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/11/17/the-latest-2/

[Blonde]

NEW YORK (CNN) -- Authorities in Aruba say they're looking into new evidence that could lead to an arrest 3½ years after Alabama teenager Natalee Holloway disappeared on a senior class trip to the island.

Alabama teenager Natalee Holloway disappeared while on vacation in Aruba with classmates in 2005.
1 of 2

Aruban police are investigating two new tips they hope will provide the corroborating evidence they need to make an arrest, lead prosecutor Hans Mos told CNN.

He would not discuss details but said police again consider Dutch student Joran van der Sloot to be the prime suspect in Holloway's disappearance.

A new witness has emerged, authorities say, who can place van der Sloot and his father, Paulus van der Sloot, near a pond on the island at 4 a.m. on the day Holloway vanished.

The witness told authorities he saw a young man, wet from the chest down and wearing only one shoe, running along a road from the pond to a fast-food restaurant.

The witness said he saw the young man and an older man driving slowly down the road in a red Jeep about 10 minutes later. The pond was not among those searched in the early stages of the investigation, Mos said.

A second witness, a former girlfriend of Joran van der Sloot, also told police he made suspicious-sounding comments while they were on the beach. The witness, publicly known only as Celes, told police van der Sloot said: "Who knows? You may now be on the beach with someone who is able to get rid of a corpse."  Watch the latest developments in the case »

In addition, Mos said, two other witnesses have come forward. He declined to discuss those witnesses, other than to say he is hopeful the case can be solved.

"We are hoping to make a decision by the end of this year or early next year as to whether we will re-arrest [the younger] van der Sloot or not," Mos told CNN.

Also key to the investigation, Mos added, is a Dutch journalist Peter De Vries' videotaped interview with van der Sloot. In the interview, van der Sloot acknowledges a friend helped him get rid of her body. Read how van der Sloot "lost no sleep" over Holloway

Mos said he is confident that the tape, which he characterizes as a confession, is admissible in court. With the new tips and new witnesses whose testimony impeaches earlier statements by van der Sloot and his father, Mos said he might have enough evidence to solve the mystery of what happened to Holloway.

The elder van der Sloot has told police he was at home, asleep in bed until 7 a.m. on the night in question. And, Joran van der Sloot has never been able to explain what happened to his tennis shoes, Mos said.

Holloway's father, Dave, said the new developments caught him by surprise.

"Well, I really hope it's true, because they even have Joran on tape confessing, and I don't know what could be better than that," he said.

Van der Sloot's family and attorney did not return phone calls.

Natalee Holloway, 19, a senior at Mountain Brook High School in suburban Birmingham, Alabama, was a vibrant member of the school band's dance team, "The Dorians," which is similar to the "Rockettes." She was a straight-A student who planned to study pre-medicine at the University of Alabama.
Don't Miss
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She vanished in May 2005 while on her senior class trip to the island. She was last seen at the popular night club Carlos 'n Charlie's early on the morning her class was due to fly home.

Her disappearance became the subject of a high-profile search and a massive media frenzy. Holloway family members and friends organized volunteer search efforts in Aruba that went on for months.

Early missteps cost investigators valuable time and evidence. Police at first mistakenly arrested two men who had nothing to do with Holloway's disappearance. And, investigators initially ignored information from witnesses pointing to the three young men last seen with Holloway that night.

When Joran van der Sloot and brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe were arrested, they told conflicting stories. By that time, verifiable facts were hard to come by.

Van der Sloot is a member of a prominent Dutch family in Aruba. At the time of Holloway's disappearance, his father was a judge in training. Joran van der Sloot and the brothers Kalpoe were arrested and let go twice in connection with Holloway's disappearance.

While they were in jail, police and prosecutors sought corroborating evidence to piece together a motive and theory. They were not successful. Late last year, authorities closed the case without bringing any charges.

"We simply did not yet have the corroborating evidence to take this to trial and win a conviction," prosecutor Mos told CNN. "If we had a body even to determine cause of death, then we could piece some thing together."

In February, the videotape of van der Sloot's taped admission surfaced on Dutch television. De Vries, a famed Dutch journalist, set up a hidden camera capturing van der Sloot talking about Holloway's last moments and how her body was disposed of "like an old rag."

Since then, De Vries has set up another on-camera sting. It aired last week, showing van der Sloot meeting with undercover reporters who posed as Dutch sex industry bosses looking for Thai prostitutes to recruit to the Netherlands as sex slaves.

In the tape, van der Sloot allegedly promises to supply Thai girls for prostitution in Holland and accepts 1,000 Euros as advance payment for his services.



Apparently van der Sloot left the Netherlands late last year and has been living in Thailand for the last few months as a student.
His whereabouts right now are unknown, but Aruban authorities are grateful for the tips that the Dutch documentaries have generated. They hope the tips will bring them closer to a resolution in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/CRIME/11/18/grace.coldcase.holloway/

[Blonde]

http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/11/18/natalee-holloway-3/


Natalee Holloway
by Greta Van Susteren
See below….this is a new AP story about the Natalee Holloway case. I am told from a source that this AP information is "recycled" and not new.

We have some new information that we have been working on for 6 months that we will be airing beginning Monday. You will get to decide whether our information is credible or not. I want your input.
As an aside, our new information is NOT similar to what is written below and raises many issues — including why the prosecution in Aruba won't pursue certain things.
This has been a troubling investigation from the start. In the beginning (summer /fall of 2005) I was completely suspicious of Joran. Who wasn't? He was the last known person to be with her. At a later point, after interviewing van der Sloot, I said that I was "inclined" to believe Joran van der Sloot. I did not say I believed him. I was careful about my wording. I said I was inclined to believe him. (Of course until the disappearance is solved, everyone in my mind remains a suspect.) His March 06 story to me seemed possibly to be true since the one thing that always stuck in my mind is how short the time line was to murder her and then successfully get rid of her body. I have tried many murder cases and successfully getting rid of the body is not easy…you need time, and sometimes "luck." I knew the different theories — including that her body had been dumped in the sea by Joran and others — but I had also investigated the tides in the area which tended, with other information to make that theory suspect.

As time marched on, and as more information became available to me, my opinion changed again. I am no longer inclined to believe him. He is a liar. I don't believe he is innocent. He has told multiple stories and stories that are inconsistent with each other. But despite my view of him, we still need the facts. More importantly Natalee's mother and father and brother and step parents all deserve to know what happened. Will our program next week do that? I don't know…you will have to tell me…but I do know one thing, I would be ashamed if I were the prosecutor in Aruba.
By the way …and you may have an opinion about this…I offered to show the current prosecutor what we have since the investigation is open, and an important one. I was also seeking any way to prove or disprove what I have and figured he would be interested in doing the same. He said he could not come to DC (it would be too time consuming.) I said I would meet him half way in Miami. He said he could not take the time off from work. I then offered him my weekend and said I would use up my weekend to meet him in Miami to show him what we have. He said he does not work weekends and is planning to go on a vacation soon.
Here is the latest AP story which I am told is 're-cycled' —

Aruba police pursue new evidence in Holloway case
By MIKE MELIA – 11 minutes ago
SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico (AP) — A new witness has come forward in the 2005 disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway in Aruba, and prosecutors said Tuesday they are seeking more evidence against the only remaining suspect.
A woman told Dutch police this month that Joran van der Sloot confessed to her years ago that he was involved in Holloway's disappearance, according to Ann Angela, a spokeswoman for the Aruba Prosecutors' Office.
But the Dutch Caribbean island's chief prosecutor said authorities still lack proof they need to convict Van der Sloot, who has been arrested twice and released for lack of evidence.
"After three years of investigating, it is very, very difficult to find that evidence," prosecutor Hans Mos told The Associated Press. "We have to be realistic."
Holloway, an 18-year-old from Mountain Brook, Alabama, was last seen in May 2005 leaving a bar in the Aruban capital Oranjestad with Van der Sloot on the final night of a high school graduation trip to the island. Extensive searches have found no trace of her.
Investigators reopened the case earlier this year based on hidden-camera recordings made by a Dutch TV crime show. On the video, Van der Sloot says Holloway collapsed on the beach after they left the bar and that he called a friend to dump her body at sea.
The new witness, once a friend of Van der Sloot, confirmed that he gave her roughly the same account shortly after Holloway's disappearance. But Mos said her statement does not bring authorities any closer to resolving the case.
He also said the witness would lack credibility in court unless she explains why she waited so long to come forward.
Attorneys for Van der Sloot did not immediately respond to messages seeking comment and there was no answer at his parents' home in Aruba.
Van der Sloot was last known to be living in Thailand but his current whereabouts are a "mystery," Angela said.
Angela said Aruban authorities hope to decide by the end of this year whether to prosecute Van der Sloot or close the case for good.







http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/11/18/aruban-prosecutor-hans-mos/

Aruban Prosecutor Hans Mos
by Greta Van Susteren
Aruban prosecutor Hans Mos has responded to the latest in the Natalee Holloway case (and make sure you scroll down and read the blog entry preceding this one….pay attention to the part in orange text where I report about Mos.) Mos apparently agrees with what I wrote in the preceding blog about the AP story…but note the AP report is DIFFERENT from the information we will show you on Monday and NOTE that Mos has declined to review the material we have. Of course that is his right but if I were the prosecutor, I would want to consider any and all information in an open investigation.
From: Howard, Cory
Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2008 5:16 PM
To:
Cc: Van Susteren, Greta
Subject: sure you saw but just in case…
In urgent…
Per Hans Mos/Chief Prosecutor:
He calls the latest press calls regarding the wire pasted below "much ado about nothing". A girl who had a conversation with Joran van der Sloot in 2006 spoke to police in the Netherlands about 14 days ago. She told them Joran gave her some indications in which you might draw some conclusions he was involved. Nothing that can be investigated or proven. Mos called it, "just another statement coming from the mouth of Joran van der Sloot" who has given many different stories in the past. The police spoke with the girl in the Netherlands and what Joran told her is just another story about what might have happened but there's nothing concrete. Mos added that Joran is a master in giving little pieces of what might have happened.
Mos said that the line from the wire story which states- "The Prosecutors' Office says a new witness claims the only suspect in the case confessed to her that he was involved in dumping Holloway's body at sea".-is an incorrect statement, that the witness did not say that in her statement to police.
As for the status of the case, Mos said there is nothing new, no major developments and that they're still trying to investigate every last lead. They're trying to conclude the investigation against Joran. That doesn't mean they're closing the investigation in the disappearance of Natalee Holloway, that will remain open until we close the case. Also, even if and when they close the case against Joran van der Sloot if they get new information, it could potentially be reopened.

[Blonde]

The Prosecutor in Aruba is simply not telling the truth about following up on all leads!
by Greta Van Susteren

Next Monday, we will have a special ON THE RECORD where we will present new information we have learned on the disappearance of Natalee Holloway. This new information can be either a wild goose chase or pivotal to unlocking the answers in the case.

Last night, we looked at reports of a new witness who has emerged in the case. If you scroll back, you know about my feelings regarding the Aruba prosecution’s pursuit of the Holloway investigation … last night, Natalee’s mother, Beth, and our legal panel weighed in:
Video's at link
http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/11/19/the-natalee-holloway-case/

[Blonde]

Possible New Witness in Natalee Holloway Case
Wednesday, November 19, 2008
 
A new witness has come forward in the 2005 disappearance of American teenager Natalee Holloway, bringing a Dutch college student back into the spotlight as a prime suspect.

The Prosecutors' Office says the new witness claims the only suspect in the case, Joran van der Sloot, confessed to her that he was involved in dumping Holloway's body at sea.

But prosecutor Hans Mos said Tuesday that more evidence is needed to build a case against Dutch college student Van der Sloot.

Mos further told FOX News that wire reports about the new evidence were "much ado about nothing," since the new witness couldn't provide definitive evidence. And Mos noted that Van der Sloot already has given many different stories about what happened.

Click here for photos from the case.

Investigators reopened the case earlier this year based on similar admissions caught in hidden-camera recordings by a Dutch TV crime show. But in February, judges rejected an attempt to arrest Van der Sloot for a third time in Holloway's disappearance.

He had been released due to insufficient evidence the first two times he was arrested.
 

Aruban prosecutors had sought to detain him based on hidden-camera recordings in which Van der Sloot said Holloway collapsed on the beach after they left the bar. He then called a friend to dump her body at sea, according to the video shot by reporter Peter De Vries.

Van der Sloot's attorney, Joseph Tacopina, said in February that his client was not responsible for the Holloway's death and that the tapes did not amount to a confession.

"There was no confession, no admission of a crime by Joran on any of these tapes, which is very telling," Tacopina said on ABC's "Good Morning America."

Holloway, 18, of Mountain Brook, Alabama, was last seen in May 2005 leaving a bar with Van der Sloot on the final night of a high school graduation trip to the Dutch Caribbean island. She attended junior high in Clinton, Miss., and her father still lives in Meridian.

The Associated Press and FOXNews' Meredith Orban contributed to this report.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,454324,00.html

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Natalee Holloway's Mom: Aruba Investigators 'Not Following Up on Any Leads'

Wednesday, November 19, 2008

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," November 18, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: And tonight, Natalee Holloway, the American who vanished in Aruba in 2005. Her mysterious disappearance is back in the headlines. Now, the Associated Press is reporting that a new witness has come forward. Who is the witness? And where is Joran van der Sloot tonight

Joining us by phone from Aruba is Jossy Mansur, publishing -- publisher and managing editor of Diario newspaper. Good evening, Jossy. Jossy, the AP is reporting -- and I must say that it conflicts with the new information that we've been gathering in the last six months, but I mean -- in some ways. But what is the AP reporting about a new witness?

JOSSY MANSUR, MANAGING EDITOR, DIARIO: Well, they're referring to is this Salaf (ph) lady that was interviewed by [Paul] De Vries in the second program that he showed on TV. What they're referring to is that she was a friend of Joran, that two, or two-and-a-half years ago, she was with him, she went on the beach with him, that he asked her, What do you think if you suffered the same disappearance of Natalee Holloway? I think everyone is referring to this as new evidence. It really isn't. It was shown on the program of De Vries.
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VAN SUSTEREN: When did she come forward to talk to the authorities?

MANSUR: Well, as far as I know, if -- that she was interviewed by him -- I don't know whether she came to the authorities before. Apparently, the prosecution in Aruba is saying that, Why did she wait so long to come forward?

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, that's not all the prosecution is saying tonight, which leads me to the question (INAUDIBLE) prosecution. Are they doing anything to investigate this case, as far as you can see?

MANSUR: As far as we can see in Aruba, absolutely nothing. All they're saying is, and they're sticking to, is that by the end of the year, they will make a decision, a final decision whether to take the man to court or close the case forever.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, what -- they've issued a statement tonight, Hans Mos, the prosecutor, and it says, in part, that they're still trying to investigate every last lead, which, frankly, is a lie. And I'll talk about that in a second. But Jossy, is there any enthusiasm to investigate this case? I know the prosecutor doesn't -- I don't think the prosecutor's doing anything, but what about people on the island? Do they want this case buried or they want this solved?

MANSUR: No, they're indifferent to this case now because so much has gone on in three-and-a-half years and the people are busy with other things, other situations here. So the people of Aruba are not that interested anymore in the case.

VAN SUSTEREN: Where is Joran van der Sloot?

MANSUR: Well, we presume he was last seen in Thailand. After that presentation of the show of De Vries, he disappeared. No one knows where he is.

VAN SUSTEREN: How about Deepak and Satish Kalpoe?

MANSUR: You know, they have played their part extremely well by being so quiet and so silent. I mean, they don't give out any kind of statement, no interviews, nada.

VAN SUSTEREN: What about Paulus, van der Sloot, the father of Joran van der Sloot?

MANSUR: Well, he's practicing law in Aruba. He's representing some people that have confidence in him and he's -- we normally see him in court.

VAN SUSTEREN: Carlos and Charlie's still there, or is that under new management, change names?

MANSUR: Yes, it has a new management now, but it's still there.

VAN SUSTEREN: What do most people think happened to Natalee?

MANSUR: Most of us believe that what Joran said on the first program of De Vries is correct, that she died in his arms but not from seizure -- we don't know how she died -- that [he] called a friend and the friend dumped her in the ocean. That's what most people believe.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is there any suggestion that there was a boat there that night or any ability to dump her into the ocean?

MANSUR: Well, probably because there were some boats nearby, and especially the boat (INAUDIBLE) the tour (ph) ship, which is a tourist ship. There must have been other boats in the vicinity, as Joran would not have invented this with De Vries.

VAN SUSTEREN: In terms of boats, just so that we have some sort of idea of the geography, for people who need to be reminded, how far, for instance, is Aruba from Venezuela?

MANSUR: Fifteen nautical miles is the nearest point within Aruba and Venezuela.

VAN SUSTEREN: And do you know -- and in terms of boats that night, do you know if any thorough investigation, one that you would have confidence in? Has that been done?

MANSUR: No, it hasn't been done because that night, somebody in the police force told the people handling the radar that controls the boats in the vicinity on the coast of Aruba -- told them to put it off.

VAN SUSTEREN: Jossy, thank you.

MANSUR: Sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: Joining us by phone is Natalee Holloway's mother, Beth Holloway. Good evening, Beth.

BETH HOLLOWAY, MOTHER OF NATALEE HOLLOWAY: Yes. Hi, Greta.

VAN SUSTEREN: Beth, you know, people haven't heard from you in a long time. People -- but many of our viewers, you know, are anxious to get the answers, anxious for you to get the answers. And the question I get so many times is how are you doing?

HOLLOWAY: Well, I'm doing good. I'm trying to stay busy. And you know, when things like this come up, it's just -- it's -- it is hard. It's very difficult to balance everything and try to -- you know, you try feel your way through what's real and what's not real and -- but I mean, you just try to do it the best you can.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, I suppose I should tell the viewers that -- you know, they know now, at least if they read GretaWire, that we've been working on this case and working rather aggressively since -- something we started in June, and I've kept you aware of that and we're going to air it on Monday. But just sort of focusing on the report tonight from the Associated Press, which is different from the information that we've been working on, do you get a ton of phone calls the minute these things hit the wires?

HOLLOWAY: I do. I do. Sometimes it catches me off guard. Sometimes I'm not even aware of certain things that are, you know, surfacing in the news because, obviously, we're not kept very well informed from the prosecuting attorney. So it's -- you know, like I said, it's just hard to discriminate between what's real and what's not real.

VAN SUSTEREN: You bring up the prosecutor. The new prosecutor is Hans Mos, or he's been new for about three years. Has he ever called you, originated a phone call to you?

HOLLOWAY: No, never. No and I -- he would not. And you know, Greta, it would never be too late. I would love to get a call from him. I mean, I feel as if sometimes, we have this self-imposed timeline on justice. But you know, there's not a timeline. It would never be too late for justice for Natalee's case. And I would very much, you know, appreciate any kind of calls received from him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Karin Janssen was the original prosecutor and Hans Mos took over. When she left Aruba, did she call you and sort of tie up lose ends, or did she just sort of vanish from your radar screen?

HOLLOWAY: No, just absolutely vanished. I had no idea she was even leaving so quickly as she did. So you know, that's always been an issue, just no communication from the prosecuting attorney's office. And you know, it just leaves you wondering, you know, where are you? And you hear all this information coming them, saying that they're following up on every lead. Well, you know, that's just simply not true. They're not following up on any leads.

VAN SUSTEREN: Has there -- now, we said the two prosecutors. Have any of the police officers, anybody from Aruba at all contacted you and said we're doing anything on the case at all? Is there any reason for you to believe it's being investigated?

HOLLOWAY: No, absolutely none. No. Not at all. Not to any degree.

Photo Essay: The Natalee Holloway Case

VAN SUSTEREN: What -- I mean, how hard is this still? I mean, it's been -- you know, she disappeared in May, and I know that you have a broken heart, every parent I ever talked to. But what's it like day-to-day?

HOLLOWAY: Well, day-to-day -- if you try to -- like I said, you try to have a healthy balance of, you know, still trying to maintain some sense of normalcy in my life as far as -- still doing -- I do a lot of engagements. I was just in North Carolina last week for a women's leadership conference and -- you know, and still trying to get back into teaching and -- but it's hard when then -- when it is coming out to where, you know, we see the latest with Joran, when he's -- you know, now coming out in Bangkok and engaging in these activities and -- you know, and it -- and it comes out of nowhere and blindsides you and just totally sends you back, you know, to the very beginning. (INAUDIBLE) still haven't made any traction in -- in -- you know, the investigation of Joran.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, we -- you know, I told you that we pledged to try to get the information we could. You know because we've kept you abreast that we have a new lead. We have new information. It's either a wild goose chase or it is the answer. But we'll be doing all that, hopefully, on Monday. But Beth, thank you, and I know you'll be watching Monday.

HOLLOWAY: Yes. And Greta, I was just wanting to say that, you know, like I said, it's been a long time, but it's never too late for justice. And I'd be good with a "Midnight Express" prison anywhere for Joran.

VAN SUSTEREN: Beth, thank you.

HOLLOWAY: Thanks, Greta. Bye.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, now, there is some good news. The legal panel is back. Joining us live are criminal defense attorneys Michael Cardoza, Ted Williams and Bernie Grim. Where have you guys been?

(CROSSTALK)

BERNIE GRIMM, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: We've been campaigning.

(CROSSTALK)

TED WILLIAMS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: We're happy to be back.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Well, let's start with Hans Mos, who's the new prosecutor. And I'm hard on -- you know, hard on him tonight. I've called him anything from stupid, liar, anything. But let me tell you, he's -- the AP has this new story that they have a witness that's come forward. That's not -- that's not our new investigation. But in the course of his statement, Hans Mos says that they are still trying to investigate every lead.

Now let me tell you something. The new information we have, we have on videotape, in part, I have offered it to Hans Mos. I've offered -- he said he couldn't come to Washington to see it, so I said, I'll meet you halfway in Miami because I think it's something important. He said, I can't do that. I can't take off during the week. I said, I'll give you my weekend. I'll go down and meet you halfway weekend just so that you can use your subpoena power and try to corroborate it. And he says that he doesn't work weekends and that he's got a vacation coming up.

Your thought. This is a guy "following every lead."

GRIMM: Yes. I guess if I didn't work weekends, my family would be in the homeless shelter. But that's abysmal. I mean, you -- I mean, you listen to Beth Holloway. You exhaust and you check out every conceivable lead, no matter how idiotic because they've checked out some idiotic ones in this case, so -- it's just depressing. And Jossy, who, you know, you can take or leave, he used an interesting word. He said "indifference," and I think that's where things are now with people, so...


WILLIAMS: But you're telling me that you have offered to provide a prosecutor, who tells the world that this is an open case that he's investigating, information and he won't...

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: They're still investigating leads, is what they say. And I offered to use my own weekend to meet him halfway to show him what we have. It's either -- this either is the answer or a wild goose chase, but he should at least investigate it.

WILLIAMS: He should have at least -- look, even if he sent one of his underlings down to talk to you -- this is utterly ridiculous. It tells us just one thing. They don't give a damn about what happened in May of 2005 on that island, and they're not actively investigating...

VAN SUSTEREN: I think -- I think...

WILLIAMS: ... And (INAUDIBLE) by virtue of what you told us tonight proved that.

VAN SUSTEREN: I think it's worse than that they're indifferent. I think that they're actually trying to cover it up. Michael, you're a former prosecutor. If someone came to you and said, I have information, would you say, I don't work weekends, I'm on vacation, I don't have time?

MICHAEL CARDOZA, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Greta, I got to tell you, all you prosecutors out there listening to the show, quit throwing things at your television right now. Every one of them that's a good prosecutor would, after you hung up the phone, be on a plane to see you in D.C. to see what you had. That's what a real prosecutor would do.

It's time that they take Joran, a kid with no moral compass at all, and bring him to trial. What do they expect, evidence to fall out of the sky? They've got enough now to bring him to trial at least for disposing of a body. And put him in jail for something. At least it'd bring conclusion to this case. Just don't be apathetic about it. This is appalling.

VAN SUSTEREN: Apathetic -- it's even hard to say apathetic because -- and I will confess they I really want him to see the evidence because he has subpoena power, and he could corroborate, which is so important. But he just -- he -- to quote Ted, he doesn't give a damn. I offered to use my weekend to meet him halfway and to show him what we have, but no interest.

CARDOZA: That's shocking.

VAN SUSTEREN: Anyway, panel -- I know. I don't know any American prosecutor -- I've never met an American prosecutor who wouldn't jump at that, but anyway...

WILLIAMS: He would or he'd be fired.

CARDOZA: I'd be on a plane in 10 seconds.

VAN SUSTEREN: I know. We need to take a break. Panel, stand by.

Here we are more than three years since Natalee's disappearance in Aruba. Here's tonight's live vote. You'll enjoy this one. Go to Gretawire and answer this question. Do you think Aruba has done everything it can to investigate this case? Yes or no? We're going to read your results at the end of the hour.

And coming up: Hold onto your seat for this one. Wait until you hear what Rush Limbaugh is saying about Senator Hillary Clinton. We have the tape, so you will hear it.

And then President-elect Barack Obama is about to make a big announcement. This announcement will make history. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: The Natalee Holloway investigation is making headlines tonight. We have new information that we will show you on Monday night. But in the meantime, the Associated Press has a different story. The Associate Press is reporting that a new witness has come forward. This woman reportedly spoke to Joran van der Sloot about Natalee's disappearance in 2006, but then spoke with police only 14 days ago in the Netherlands. Could this woman be trouble for Van Der Sloot? Our legal panel is back.

Ted, I don't know. I'm sort of dismissive of this whole thought, anyone comes forward that late, and apparently, it's not that good of information, at least for the AP report.

WILLIAMS: Well, Greta, as we know, throughout the history of this so- called investigation, there have been witnesses upon top of witnesses who have come forward. This woman, if she had information in 2006, it's reasonable to believe that she would have come forward now, not 14 days -- I don't believe it. I don't think it's going to be of any value to the case.

VAN SUSTEREN: It's also the -- it's also evidence, Bernie, that you can't -- I mean, supposedly, she said that he made some statement about leaving her on the beach or something. It's nothing that can be corroborated, which again goes back to my frustration with -- with Hans Mos.

CARDOZA: Yes, it can.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, I mean, no, but the thing is, Michael, is the information that we have that we want to show Hans Mos that he has no interest in because he doesn't work weekends...

CARDOZA: Right.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... And he won't meet me halfway during the week...

(LAUGHTER)

VAN SUSTEREN: ... Is information that he could actually...

CARDOZA: This poor guy!

VAN SUSTEREN: No, but he could -- yes, poor -- I don't feel sorry for him. Not at all.

CARDOZA: I don't, either. I don't, either. You're spot on. I agree.

VAN SUSTEREN: Just so you know, I left on a Friday to go to Asia, flew 17 hours, hit the ground, no sleep, did the work with did on the ground with two producers and turned around and was back Monday morning and on the air Monday night.

CARDOZA: Greta, you care. You care about your job.

VAN SUSTEREN: I'm not the prosecutor!

CARDOZA: He obviously doesn't.

VAN SUSTEREN: I'm not...

(CROSSTALK)

CARDOZA: He doesn't care, obviously. He doesn't care.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, you know what? Shame on him and shame on Aruba, you know, because -- you know, I mean...

CARDOZA: Well, there's no question about it. Maybe this is -- maybe this is back at the United States for interfering for these type of things. They go, "Fine, you solve it, we're not."

VAN SUSTEREN: Interfering? Interfering?

CARDOZA: Well...

VAN SUSTEREN: Whoa!

CARDOZA: ... Maybe a bad choice of words. I'll give you that. Bad choice of words on my part.

(LAUGHTER)

CARDOZA: But they have enough to take him to trial now. They have enough.

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: I'll tell you what they do have, though, and...

CARDOZA: I think they do, not for murder. Not for murder.

VAN SUSTEREN: Oh, well, but I -- they have -- with what we have, if Hans Mos would dare to take the 44 minutes that he needs to look at this, if he had this, he could at least use his subpoena power and disprove it or prove it. Bernie, corroboration is always key in these (INAUDIBLE)

GRIMM: Yes, especially when your case is reliant on a defendant's own statement. At least, in most jurisdictions, you need some other evidence to corroborate it. Some other evidence to corroborate it. I don't know what the law is down there. I've lost any sort of hope. This kid, on the other hand, if you're him and you're innocent, this -- I think he's been arrested three times now. And this is very distressing. Michael raises a point, which is just unload both barrels, see what you got. You can get him on sort of tampering and perhaps obstruction if they have something similar...

VAN SUSTEREN: But you've got to care! I mean, it's, like...

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: In your wildest dreams, Bernie...

CARDOZA: But does anybody...

VAN SUSTEREN: ... Can you imagine turning down -- can you imagine -- I mean, I'm not going to...

(CROSSTALK)

GRIMM: If you called me and you said you had evidence in a case of mine, I'd be -- before you hung up the phone, I'd be at the front door.

WILLIAMS: I have a feeling that Hans...

CARDOZA: Does anybody...

WILLIAMS: ... Will be calling you in regard to this.

VAN SUSTEREN: I called him!

WILLIAMS: Well, I have a feeling...

VAN SUSTEREN: He has my number!

WILLIAMS: ... Now, after he sees this...

VAN SUSTEREN: He has my number!

WILLIAMS: (INAUDIBLE) And the minister out in Aruba sees it...

VAN SUSTEREN: I don't think that...

CARDOZA: Greta...

WILLIAMS: ... That he may very well...

VAN SUSTEREN: Yes, Michael?

WILLIAMS: ... Put a call in to you.

CARDOZA: Does anybody believe that Joran really killed her intentionally? I don't think any one of us believe that. Did he dispose of the body? Absolutely. May have given her drugs that led to her death?

VAN SUSTEREN: I think you ought to wait until Monday.

CARDOZA: Absolutely.

VAN SUSTEREN: Wait until Monday.

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Tune in Monday. And like I say, Monday, you know, it may be the answer or it may be a wild goose chase, but at least we have the decency to pursue the leads...

CARDOZA: Hear, hear.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... And all Hans Mos had to do was meet me halfway on a plane. He didn't have to do any of the heavy lifting, which we did. But anyway, panel, thank you. I'm sure you'll be watching Monday.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,454527,00.html

[Blonde]

November 20th, 2008 9:15 AM Eastern
SOMEONE IS LYING TO YOU - take your pick !

by Greta Van Susteren
Someone is a big fat liar — either I am the big fat liar or the Prosecutor in the Aruban Prosecutor’s office.  You take your pick!  Am I lying to you? or is the prosecutor in this release? See below…a press release from the Aruban prosecutor’s office….I think this press release below is  pre emptive (before we show you what we have Monday ) and an effort to cover one’s *********.


This Aruban press release confuses (deliberately?) 3 matters.  One is a Dutch journalist and his show, another is a recent AP report about a witness and then the third is OUR investigation which I have offered to show the prosecutor but there is no interest.

It is a BIG FAT LIE to write in this press release below: “….The investigation led by this Office has been ongoing and, as has been done all the time, this Office and the Police investigate every new lead in this case…” They have NOT investigated every new lead — in fact they REFUSE to investigate.  What are they afraid of? solving this?  is this about tourism on Aruba? or what?


If you watch ON THE RECORD at 10pm, you know that in the last two nights, as well as here on GretaWire, I have told you that we have NEW information.  It is not simply a witness.  I don’t know if our new information is the answer to this mystery or a wild goose chase — and I have repeatedly said that.  I do know that NO DECENT PROSECUTOR who has ANY INTEREST in solving the case would ignore what we have and I have OFFERED to show the Aruba prosecutor first.  He has subpoena power to check out leads.  This is a missing woman and this is not a matter to simply ignore.  Every effort should be made to solve this…and in this instance, we are serving up information to the prosecutor that he has zero interest in looking at.


I talked to the prosecutor TWO WEEKS ago (not July if the press release below is referring to me.) I offered to meet him 1/2 way…he said he does not have time during the week…I offered him MY weekend, ..he said he does not work weekends…and  he has a vacation coming up.  In my phone call to him two weeks ago I  offered to show him what we have NO STRINGS attached…I said I was NOT asking for anything in exchange…not even an interview from him. Go figure!

But here is your question: who is lying? take your pick…the prosecution in Aruba who says it is following up every lead? and this is an ongoing investigation? or am I lying when I say we offered new information to the prosecutor to follow up on and he simply refuses.  And yes, we will show you what we have on Monday and you can decide: should this be investigated?


http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/11/20/someone-is-lying-take-your-pick-you-who-want-to-believe/

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Video Link

Joran Van der Sloot Attorney Reacts to New Accusations Against His Client
Friday , November 21, 2008


 This is a rush transcript from "America's News HQ," November 20, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

JON SCOTT, HOST: A FOX News exclusive now: Joran Van der Sloot, the prime suspect in Natalee Holloway's disappearance, making news once again. Allegations of his involvement in some kind of a Thai sex trafficking ring.

Well, now there are reports of a witness in the case, Joran's legal team hadn't commented on those claims until now. Joran Van der Sloot's attorney, Joe Tacopina is joining us. You say, this is all much ado about nothing?

JOE TACOPINA, JORAN VAN DER SLOOT'S ATTORNEY: You know, I really had nothing to say about any of this, Jon, up until today when I received a press release from the Aruban prosecutors, who have certainly not been friends of Joran, or the defense team for that, matter, in this investigation.

• Video: Watch Jon Scott's interview

And what they have basically said is, it's more of the same. They basically have put out a press release saying there is a lot of stories going on, a lot of releases about new witnesses coming forward of value in this case. New allegations of another covert operation by this Dutch reporter, who seems to be making a living off of Joran; and really what they say in this press release, as I just showed you, is that it is much ado about nothing.

There have been no further leads of any value regarding the Natalee Holloway investigation. And really that is all I care to speak about. That is what I represent Joran on.

SCOTT: So you're take is that this is not a new witness. This is a witness who gave a statement to police, apparently sometime ago, and the story is just coming out now?

TACOPINA: I honestly don't know who these witnesses are. There have been plenty of witnesses, Jon, that have come forward in this case that have later proved to be either, you know, absolutely insane or just absolutely incredible. The prosecutors claim that this is not a new witness, the witness that we have heard about in the last week or so. That they have investigated the statement of that witness and to quote the prosecutor, it does not give the police further leads to investigate nor does it help in solving the case. And help is a very low standard. So if this statement doesn't help in solving the case, clearly it is not of any evidentiary value.

SCOTT: Where is Joran right now?

TACOPINA: Yes, you know, he's been tracked, I think in Thailand. He is in a school. He is trying to get on with his life. He is not doing well with it, obviously. He has made a lot of mistakes in the aftermath of this investigation. You know, those things I, quite frankly — you know, I'm not trying to make any excuses for some of his conduct, but it has nothing to do with the Natalee Holloway investigation. He has sort of become a lightning rod for people who want to try and pin things on him. He has given him fodder for that. I mean, they offer him money, you know, to speak, and so those aren't the things that credible journalists do, but anyway —

SCOTT: One of the reporters we were talking to in Aruba the other day, when this story first broke, that there was supposedly this new witness, said that authorities down there only have until next month, December, to charge him or the Natalee Holloway case goes away forever, is that the case?

TACOPINA: It goes away forever until there is new material evidence. I mean, they come up with a videotape of evidence of this crime or if they come up with something substantial, much more substantial than let's to continue to investigate until the cow's come home. They actually have to petition the court, a judge, to be able to reopen it. And there has to be some finality and some closure.

Look, if they come up with some real evidence, not these bits an pieces of things that may not be credible, or may not be truthful, even things coming from Joran's mouth, I mean, they really cannot pursue this. And I think that's all they're saying, because the notion that the Aruban prosecutors don't want to solve this is ludicrous. This has been such a dark cloud over that little island, and certainly that office. They have been mocked and ridiculed and sometimes rightfully so. But the fact of the matter is I think they'd love to solve this as much as anyone.

SCOTT: Well, and you have battled that tape when the Dutch TV show put it out there, the tape that purportedly showed him confessing to have taken her body out to sea, or something like that. If that isn't going to do it, if that isn't going to bring a prosecution or result in charges being brought against him, you must be saying that this latest doesn't amount to a hill of beans.

TACOPINA: Most of this latest stuff has nothing to do with this investigation. It is some new sort of trap they laid for us. Whether he bit or not, I really don't know. I quite frankly don't care. It has nothing to do with the Natalee Holloway case. That last tape, as we talked about, the last time around was proven to be absolutely incredible. And if you looked at the whole tape, not that snippet that they played or sold.

You know, he made five different sorts of statements that were all inconsistent and disprovable. It doesn't excuse his conduct. I'm not here to apologize, or ask for an excuse or understanding of his conduct. But I'm evaluating it as a lawyer, looking at the evidence at how it relates to this investigation, and does it further incriminate, implicate, or help resolve it, and the answer is simply no, John.

SCOTT: All right. Joe Tacopina, thank you.

TACOPINA: Thank you.

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Greta - 11/24/08 - transcribed by SAN (thanks San)

There are 3 conversations with Paulus recorded.  All from this year.  He recorded them from the cell phone with a record option.  He met a guy in February 3 years ago.  He was interested in him bringing a blonde girl.  I can't understand his name.  He seen him over a period over 1 1/2 years.  He spoke Dutch, Pap & English.  I can said how how he was 30-40.  He played blackjack with him. Again his said he wanted to see a blonde girl.  He offered Joran money and he said OK.  This guy was acting like a high roller.  He said he goes from Venezuela and Aruba.  He never said why he wanted a blonde girl.  Joran wasn't concered about his name.  He offered Joran money for it.  Greta is pressing him.  He said he only gave him $10,000.  Joran said he met Natalee on Sunday night.  He met the guy five days before.  Day he met Natalee he remembered what he said. 

Joran said there where never any hard plans.  He said he doesn't want to talk about if Satish and Deepak are in on it.  He wants to talk to Greta not on camera.  Greta said if you are telling the truth tell us we can't have wild goose chases.  You really have to make a decision that you trust us and lay it all out.  He is afraid if he says anything bad the Kalpoes might sue him.  Greta said not if you tell the truth.   He said the Kalpoes knew about the plan.  On the way back from CnC.

He said to the Kalpoes someone offered him $10,000 if they brought him somebody.  Greta said she reached out to the Kalpoes and their lawyers and they have not returned their call.

Greta said the most shocking truth to the story is coming at the end.  Watch Joran and what he says.

Greta said he had a conversation on the side with Deepak.  He zeroed in on Natalee because she was interested in him.  Talking about the guy again.  He said he didn't know what his exact intentions were.

He gets Natalee and they go to the car.  He said she said let's go to his house, etc.

Joran said he called this guy at like 1:00 am and he was in the car and was with the girl and some friends.  He said Natalee didn't say anything.  He spoke in Dutch.  Kalpoes understand Dutch not fluent in it but they understand it.  They were suppose to meet the guy in an hour.  The drove around and went to the lighthouse and drove around a little bit.  They went to the Marriott and he said they were making out and nothing else.  He said he saw a guy and he came and gabbed the girl and went on a boat with her.  He said Natalee said nothing and kept saying what's going on and she didn't struggle.  Guy gave him $10,000 and said he was a couple of hundred short.

He said he actually saw the boat drive away with her.  She didn't say anything.  He called Deepak to come pick him up and he sent Satish.  Joran said he gave them both a $1,000 a couple of days after when they were in his room and another friend was in there as well.

Joran said in the chip Paulus said it's a bad thing to sell somebody.

You can tell Joran is getting frustrated.

Greta said she is going to take the chip to his father and we need to get to the bottom of this.  She said you already outed your father.  You already included everybody in this.

Joran said Paulus found out a while after.  He was in jail at the time.

Greta said she needs him to say on camera he needs to tell his lawyer they can speak about this.

Joran is getting antsy.  Greta said if she is alive this is a big deal.  She said I know the chances are small and Joran said very small.

Joran said if he had a million dollars himself he would look into it.  Greta is talking about someone being paid off and it was BLEEPED OUT. 

Joran got up to leave.  Greta is trying to talk him out of it.  He is saying this is not what we agreed on.  Greta is talking about that they licensed the chip.  Greta has Joran by the you know what.

TWIST TO THE STORY COMING UP.  THIS COULD CHANG YOUR MIND.

Joran contines telling his story.

How deep does this alledged plot got.  Greta bleeped and name and two police officers were paid.  He mentioned ones name and he can't think of the others name.  They were paid off in the summer and were paid off.  They found out the story and she was taken to Venezuela.  Paulus paid them.  He paid them $50,000 and Greta said each or they split and he said he didn't know.  Paulus told him.  Greta asked if someone tried to shake him down and Joran said yeah it happened.  They keep bleeping the names.  Paulus told him it was serious and told him to keep his mouth shut.  Joran learned this while he was still in jail and he had private conversation way later.  He thinks there might be someone else was paid off.

She keeps saying "they" and how did they learn it.

"They" never interrogated him in jail.

The first person he told was the was a teacher from school and his lawyer.  The teacher told him to tell the truth and he can't think of the name and she said you know the name.  He told the teacher a couple of days later.  He told his lawyer in interrogation after he was arrested.  It was at a police station not KIA.

They did their own investigation and she spoke to the teacher and that will be on tomorrow show.

They guy gave him more money after the second time they got arrested.  He sent the money via Western Union.  He said he thinks he sent it because he didn't want him to talk.  Greta said how did he know where to send it and Joran said he gave him that information.  He gave Joran another $10,000 wired to Holland.  Joran said he had email contact with him.  Out of the blue he mailed Joran and said how you doing and for him to shut up and if he needed any money and Joran told him yeah.  Joran said he didn't think it was the guys real email address.

He said Paulus doesn't know about the money.

Joe Tacopina doesn't know about the salve.

No one else knows.  Joran is saying he doesn't talk to his parents.  Joran cut contact with them.  He stills emails Deepak and Satish and he called them onces.  He spoke with them about 3 montsh ago.  Talking about their lawsuit.  They told him if they won the lawsuit they would give him a $1,000,000.  He said as long as he doesn't share anything about what happened he will get a $1,000,000.

JORAN CONTACTED GRETA AGAIN AND GAVE A FINAL TWIST TO THE STORY AND IT IS UP NEXT.

He told them he has been lying during that interview and he told them he made the story up.

   

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From PRdV's site ( http://www.peterrdevries.nl/ )

Natalee IS SOLD BY Joran?

PETER: Outstanding DEFENSE STRATEGY

In an interview with Gretha Susteren of Fox news has Joran van der Sloot said that he Natalee Holloway on the beach of Aruba have been sold and that it is then shipped to Venezuela. This morning was with me the phone again red-hot media who wanted to know what my reaction is' breaking news'. Could it be that Natalee is alive? Joran speaks the truth?

- OLD, unbelievable INTERVIEW --

No, unfortunately not Joran speaks the truth, as is my conviction. I believe this is an old interview that Fox already about half years ago and that was not broadcast because the news itself was unbelievable. Now we just have to show that Joran is interested in women in Thailand - which is also in the U.S. has been on the tube - they reminded themselves with the old Fox interview and that was immediately dusted off.

- Better LEUGENAAR THAN Murderer --

The story itself is absolutely unbelievable and I believe that Joran is also intended that the world ingeslingerd. Joran realizes as well that he now tells some nonsense stories, the outside world the image of him that he will have a notorious fantasist and that it distracts attention from the truth, nowhere more so he can finally be settled. Joran state prefer to book as a pathological liar, as someone who is a young girl had disappeared and perhaps killed. In that sense it's all the defense tactic of someone who does not want in prison.

- SAND IN THE EYE Sprinkle --

When the police and official television interviews Joran silent or distancing his story that he knows that it does not hold, and thus also not be prosecuted. In that category is also the story that Natalee was sold. This total does not rhymes with the known facts and circumstances that night, but that is also Joran intention. It is not about to resolve the matter, or to the truth come to light, no, it is the people pulling the wool over the eyes to scatter. The only time that he is in my eyes is the truth when he was told Private waande with our infiltrator Patrick van der river Eem, when in the privacy of a car alleged conversations with each other. The body of Joran clearly shows that he is relieved that he has to share his story with someone at that moment that he fully trusts and regards as his best friend.

- "Credible and authentic '--

Four forensic experts have studied our tapes and subsequently declared that the continuing confessions of Joran in the car - on different days - "credible and authentic 'were.

Then in February of this year showed that he had walked into a trap, hurried Joran and his lawyer has to say but what he had called and gebluft. There was even the appearance that he was in a psychiatric clinic and was fully in the war. The story about the sale of Natalee fits in exactly the same strategy. Joran knows well that the story is so unbelievable that he police and justice has nothing to fear. An additional effect is that however credible confessions against Patrick van der river Eem it increasingly diluted, because this by many people in a lot of consideration with the other nonsense stories.

- Unscrupulous --

I would like to write that there is still a small chance that Natalee is alive, but I believe there is not total. Natalee's mother, Beth, are not. Natalee has died on the beach of Aruba. In the presence of Joran van der Sloot, who then her body has eliminated and there is now - in his attempts to stay out of jail - not even afraid to return for Natalee in his lies back to life to build and sell ... That is almost as as bad as her body removal. Loos conscience.
Peter R. de Vries

[klaasend]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,457144,00.html

Joran van der Sloot Goes 'On the Record' with New Natalee Holloway Story
Tuesday , November 25, 2008


This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," November 24, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: Tonight: Joran van der Sloot goes "On the Record," and he has a horrifying, shocking new story about what happened to Natalee Holloway the night she disappeared. Eighteen-year-old Natalee Holloway vanished on the island of Aruba on May 30, 2005. Now, since Natalee's disappearance, Van der Sloot has been arrested twice in connection to her disappearance but never charged with a crime.

Van der Sloot went "On the Record" with us in 2006, claiming he had left Natalee alone on a beach. Then in February of '08, Van der Sloot was shown on hidden tape saying that Natalee had collapsed on the beach and that he had disposed of her body.

Well, now his story changes again. Joran contacted us, claiming he wanted to tell us the truth about what happened that night. He produced as evidence three telephone conversations saved on a digital chip. Joran claims the recordings are conversations between his father and him. If authentic, the recording suggest that Joran told his father what happened to Natalee. On a weekend, we slipped away and we went halfway across the world to interview Joran van der Sloot.

Now, before you watch this interview, we need to warn you the greatest shock of all will come at the end of the hour, and you may or may not totally change your mind about this interview.

Now Joran van der Sloot goes "On the Record."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, Joran, here's what I need. We've licensed this chip from you and -- with some conversations. And when we took that chip and gave it to an expert, the expert was a little bit confused so I need to get the facts and circumstances around it so we can corroborate it so we can go out and investigate and do what you ultimately want and -- maybe I should ask you, what do you ultimately want out of this?

JORAN VAN DER SLOOT, SUSPECT IN NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S DISAPPEARANCE: Oh, I guess for it just all to be over, for it just -- yes, that's it, just for me to be able to get on with everything and feel OK. That's what I ultimately would want out of it. And I know if you guys look into this that you're going to find out, I think, definitely with everything I gave, if you really go and look into it, you're going to stumble across something that will get you more answers. I'm sure about it. I know it.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Now, the chip -- is it -- are there three separate conversations on this chip?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, three separate conversations.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did they occur, and with whom are the conversations?

VAN DER SLOOT: They occurred about a month ago, I think, maybe longer, two months ago -- longer. And yes, about -- actually, about the person that the conversation's with, I don't actually really want to talk about. But yes, that's just -- I was just giving that to you for -- you know, to corroborate that you could actually see and have something to show to go look into this. That was my...

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, from what I understand from our first conversation -- and you know, I've got to make sure I really tie this down because in order for my network to continue to -- you know, to continue to let us investigate this story, I've got to have it really straight and nailed down. And you have told us now something that is very different from what we understood to have happened. And from the chip, is that there's a conversation with your father recorded. Actually, there are three conversations with your father recorded, right?

VAN DER SLOOT: It's three conversations.

VAN SUSTEREN: One was in January, about?

VAN DER SLOOT: They were in -- I don't know. I don't remember the month they were in.

VAN SUSTEREN: But it was this year?

VAN DER SLOOT: It was this year, yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And how -- and he was in Aruba and you were where?

VAN DER SLOOT: I was in Holland, I think, one -- for one, and the other one I was here.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was it always -- did you use the same cell phone, did you use Skype? How did you do these -- how did you record these?

VAN DER SLOOT: On the cell phone, just on the cell phone with the record option.

VAN SUSTEREN: And was he using your hard line at home, do you think?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, I think he was calling from Skype, yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK. So he's on Skype and you're on a cell phone.

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. You met a guy in February of three years ago who said he was interested in something. What was he interested in?

VAN DER SLOOT: He was interested in me bringing him a blond girl.

VAN SUSTEREN: Where did you meet this guy?

VAN DER SLOOT: The casinos in Aruba.

VAN SUSTEREN: What's his name?

VAN DER SLOOT: Elher (ph) Andy (ph) Adamovich (ph). I don't even if know if it's his real name. That's the problem. I don't even know if it's his real name. I wasn't worried about that at the time. It was just more like casino going, there and having fun there, and he's one of the persons I saw there. I didn't hang out with him. I didn't do anything with him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you only see him one time in February?

VAN DER SLOOT: Oh, no more times, like two times or three times or -- I've seen him over a period of one-and-a-half years or something.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is he an Aruban?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't know. I don't know where he's from.

VAN SUSTEREN: What language did you speak with him?

VAN DER SLOOT: I spoke -- he spoke Dutch. He spoke Papiamento. And he gave -- he speaks English, too.

VAN SUSTEREN: About how old a man?

VAN DER SLOOT: An older man. I can't -- I can't say how old he was, 30, 40.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you sit at the same table with him?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. Yes. One time, I played poker with him. One time I played blackjack with him. But he usually played blackjack. That was the game he used to play.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK, so you met him in February of '05 at the casino. You know his first name. And he said he wanted what?

VAN DER SLOOT: He said he wanted to see a blond girl.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did you take that to mean?

VAN DER SLOOT: I didn't know -- I did not even want -- I wasn't even thinking about it, like, I did not know what he -- what he wanted at all with it.

VAN SUSTEREN: Anything offered in exchange for her?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, he offered me money.

VAN SUSTEREN: And what did you say?

VAN DER SLOOT: I said, OK, sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: And so February of '05, you have this conversation with him in a casino. And between February '05 and about May 30, '05, did you see him at all?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. Yes. Before that. He was -- like, before, he was telling me, like, he was just acting like a high roller there and spending money like (INAUDIBLE) nothing on blackjack. And then he was always talking about going out, doing (ph) stuff. I know he goes from Venezuela to Aruba. I know that. That's what he was telling me, at least. And -- yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he ever say what he wanted a blond girl for?

VAN DER SLOOT: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you have any sort of guess what it was? I mean, were you -- was it sort of the -- the code, you know, you speak in code, you sort of knew what he wanted?

VAN DER SLOOT: No. No. I wasn't -- wasn't really occupied with that at all. I had school going. I had other things. I had friends. I wasn't really -- like, I mean, like, I really wasn't even concerned about his name, to tell you the truth.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he offer you any money?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: (INAUDIBLE) a specific number?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, he offered me money.

VAN SUSTEREN: What was the number?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't really want to say, but he offered me money for it.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, I mean, come on. I mean, you -- look, we've come halfway across the world. You know, you want -- this is what you told us, Joran, that you -- you know, you want...

VAN DER SLOOT: OK.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... this investigated because everybody seems to think something happened, and you told us something very different happened. And there's a possibility that she's still alive.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: So I need to be able to get this information out of you so that I can, you know, get my company to continue to finance this. This is going to take us to Venezuela to find this guy. We got to look for him there. And...

VAN DER SLOOT: That's what I want.

VAN SUSTEREN: I know. That's why -- that's why you contacted me. At least, that's what you told me, is that you want that. If I get that information, we can track it down.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: So that's why I need to pull these facts out of it because that will corroborate the chip and will help me in the investigation.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK. Well, he only gave me $10,000.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK. No, but that's later. But during -- between February and May, did he ask you -- did he talk money with you, a specific number?

VAN DER SLOOT: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Natalee -- you know, what day of the week did you meet Natalee? What was -- it was the 30th, but what day? Was that a Sunday night?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. Yes, Sunday night.

VAN SUSTEREN: In the days prior to that Sunday night, did you have any conversation with this man?

VAN DER SLOOT: A week before, I think. Yes, a little before, couple days before, five days before.

VAN SUSTEREN: At a casino?

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you have his phone number?

VAN DER SLOOT: Did not have his phone number. It's only at the casino where I saw him. That's the only place I -- I ever saw him.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So what happened the day you met Natalee?

VAN DER SLOOT: Oh, the day I met Natalee, I remembered what he said. And as I was leaving the casino, to leave I went by the Radisson because (INAUDIBLE) he was there. I spoke with him, and he's, like, yes, you know. So then he -- when he asked me for, like, OK, all I want is to -- to -- you know, if you bring me a blond girl, let me know. Give me a call on this number right here. He gave me a phone number, and then he said to meet him at the beach by the -- by the Marriott if I ever got a girl and that we'd - - he would give me $10,000.

VAN SUSTEREN: This was on the day that you met Natalee?

VAN DER SLOOT: That was on the day or he day -- the day -- the day before.

VAN SUSTEREN: The day before you met Natalee?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, or two days before. Two days before.

VAN SUSTEREN: So the day you met Natalee, you met her at the Excelsior in the Holiday Inn in the afternoon. Or actually, you met her -- you met her with a group of people.

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh.

VAN SUSTEREN: And when you -- and about what time did you leave the Holiday Inn Excelsior on that afternoon?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't remember exactly. In the afternoon sometime.

VAN SUSTEREN: When you -- when you left in the afternoon, had you made plans to meet with Natalee and her friends at Carlos 'n Charlie's?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. She had asked me to go out and meet her and her friends there.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was it your intention at that time to contact the man who wanted to buy a white woman?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, but I had it in the back of my mind, yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. so you left the Holiday Inn. And then where did you go?

VAN DER SLOOT: Then I -- first I went to the Radisson.

VAN SUSTEREN: And talked to him.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. And I played a little poker there. And then I went to -- then I called a friend of mine, who didn't pick up his phone. And then I called other friends of mine, asked them if they wanted to go out and -- yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And the other friends were?

VAN DER SLOOT: Were Deepak and Satish.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So you -- so you -- so you went from the Radisson to home first?

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh.

VAN SUSTEREN: How did you get home?

VAN DER SLOOT: What do you mean home?

VAN SUSTEREN: You went from the Holiday Inn at the Excelsior to the Radisson. Then you went home, which is where Deepak picked you up.

VAN DER SLOOT: Then I called my dad, and he picked me up at the McDonald's.

VAN SUSTEREN: But that was from the Holiday Inn -- or from the Radisson.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, went from Holiday Inn -- I was only there, like, 20 minutes.

VAN SUSTEREN: So about what time would that be?

VAN DER SLOOT: Was at the evening. Evening.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK. You go home, and what do you do when you get home?

VAN DER SLOOT: Went and took a shower, went on the Internet. And I wasn't even sure if I still wanted to go out or not because I actually had school the next day. And then -- then Deepak called me, like, OK, we're going to come with you. We're ready, on my way now, because I knew Carlos 'n Charlie's close at 12:00, 12:00 o'clock, too, that night. So it's, like, 11:00 o'clock when we went. And -- yes. And the rest of these story is just like -- like we told it, except for the end of it.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Up next, Joran takes you minute by minute through his shocking story. Did he carry through his alleged plan to sell Natalee? You will hear the horrifying details of what Joran now says happened to Natalee that night.

Plus: Did Deepak and Satish Kalpoe know about Joran's alleged plot to sell Natalee? Were the brothers in on it? You will hear what Joran says.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran van der Sloot says he was offered money by a stranger in return for a blond girl. Joran continues the story about the night Natalee Holloway was last seen alive.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Where did you make the hard plans with this guy to pick up Natalee? At what point?

VAN DER SLOOT: Like -- like, not ever hard plans. It's just I told him that, OK, I have a girl with me. And he's, like, OK, come to the -- come to the Marriott Hotel.

VAN SUSTEREN: At what time?

VAN DER SLOOT: At 1:00 in the morning or something.

VAN SUSTEREN: I mean, it was just -- but I mean, that doesn't -- it just doesn't sound right to me because it's -- that the sort of loose plans. I mean, why is a guy going to go sit outside the Marriott at 1:00 o'clock in the morning?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't know, either. No, but he wasn't even in there. He wasn't even there when I came there.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Well, so OK. So you go -- so Deepak and Satish pick you up. Now, they're not in on this at all, right?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't really want to talk about them at all.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, but you know, if you -- if you want us to do this, Joran, if you want us to investigate this, you got to tell us because, you know -- you know, you've trusted us this far...

VAN DER SLOOT: Like, I do trust you guys. But it's just can I talk about you -- with you just about it one second just -- just about them...

VAN SUSTEREN: Yes.

VAN DER SLOOT: ... But not on camera (INAUDIBLE)

VAN SUSTEREN: No, no. Just tell -- you know what? Because you know what? We've gone so far down the road, is that we might -- this is your chance to tell us -- if you're telling the truth this time -- because you and I have spoken before. If you're telling the truth this time, you know, let's get it all out there, and we will pound the pavement to track -- to chase this down. And -- but we can't have wild goose chases because the minute we hit another wild goose chase, it's over.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: It's over. And you'll look like -- you know what you'll look like? You'll look like a liar because we've had one conversation with you. You've got that thing that -- with Patrick. I don't know what that is. You've got Patrick. Then you've got this. I mean, you really have to make a decision that -- you know, that you trust us, that you want us to -- you want us to investigate this fully and lay it all out.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, no, but what I -- what (INAUDIBLE) just wanted to ask you (INAUDIBLE) I don't want like -- maybe if I say something bad about them, they can sue me or whatever, or I don't know (INAUDIBLE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Look, they're not going to -- I can't say that...

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: They're not going to sue you. I mean, they're not -- look, these guys -- I mean, if you tell the truth, it doesn't hurt. If you lie, it does. So if you lie about them, yes, you're vulnerable. If you tell the truth, no.

VAN DER SLOOT: No, I agree. Yes. OK, well, then, they -- they knew about it also, but that's why (INAUDIBLE) yes, they knew about it also.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did they know about it? At what point?

VAN DER SLOOT: That night I told them.

VAN SUSTEREN: On the way to Carlos 'n Charlie's?

VAN DER SLOOT: On the way to Carlos -- no, on the way back, when we - - when we were getting a drink at Carlos 'n Charlie's.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK, explain it to me. They pick you up at your house.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And...

VAN DER SLOOT: I say -- I just told them -- all I told them is we're meeting a group of girls at Carlos 'n Charlie's who asked me to go out with them. And then when I was in the bar, she was all dancing on the bar, coming over to me and telling me to come dance with her. And that's the moment when I -- when I talked to them and said, like, OK, well, I can get -- someone offered me $10,000 just to bring them somebody. And what do you guys think about it, $10,000? OK. You know, that was -- that was the thought behind it.

VAN SUSTEREN: And what were -- were they -- did they get any money?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. I gave them money. Of course.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. So -- so had you -- was Natalee the one that you had identified as the American girl you were going to grab, or was there another one?

VAN DER SLOOT: Oh, I wasn't even thinking about that at all when I went over there. That's not -- wasn't my intention. It was actually my intention to go with -- like, I just -- I really liked a friend of hers. I thought she was very nice. She's the one that asked me to go out. It's that when I came there and her friend said, Natalee has shotgun (ph) on you, or that's -- yes, that's exactly what she said. And then that's when I started paying attention to her. Or not even really. I wasn't even that super-interested, but that's when I was -- yes.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Since our last interview with Joran van der Sloot, we have reached out to the Kalpoe brothers and their lawyers a number of times for their side of the story. We have not received an answer. The Kalpoe brothers and/or their attorneys are welcome here "On the Record" any time.

Up next, Joran tells you about a dark, secluded beach in Aruba. Joran says the last time he saw Natalee was on that beach. It's a chilling story involving a boat, a mysterious stranger and a bag full of cash. These details according to Joran are next.

Plus, the most shocking twist of all to this story is coming. Listen very carefully to what Joran says. We have information that may change the way you look at this interview. That's at the end of the hour.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran van der Sloot continues his story explaining what he says happened to Natalee Holloway. The last night Natalee was seen alive, earlier in the day, Van der Sloot met up with Natalee and her friends at the Excelsior casino in the Holiday Inn beach hotel. Later, he met the American girls at a bar called Carlos 'n Charlie's. Van Der Sloot was at the bar with two of his friends, brothers Deepak and Satish Kalpoe.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, I've been in Carlos 'n Charlie's, and it's very loud. So you -- what do you have, a conversation on the side with Deepak or Satish about doing this deal, or...

VAN DER SLOOT: Deepak. Deepak.

VAN SUSTEREN: Deepak?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And Deepak says, essentially, "I'm in"?

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you then zero in on Natalee because she's -- why, because she's drunk?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, because she was interested in me, I guess, because she was -- yes, she was coming up -- she was coming up, Come dance with me. And that's when I -- when I -- when I was remembering this guy. And he -- like, I think it was more than two days before that, even, he gave me his card with his phone number on it and -- yes. I thought he was just (INAUDIBLE) maybe looking to have a good time, go out. I don't know. I did not know 100 percent whatever his intentions were. I still don't know right now what his exact intentions were, so...

VAN SUSTEREN: OK. So explain what happened. You get Natalee and you head out to the car.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. She says...

VAN SUSTEREN: Tell me the whole story.

VAN DER SLOOT: She asks me first, Let's go to your -- let's go to your house. I want to go to your house. I want to see your house. I'm, like, No, let's go back to your hotel. It's right next to -- it was right next to the other (ph) where we had to be anyway. Thought we could go see there, see how it is there. But she didn't want to go back to her own hotel. So then that's when I told the guys, Just drop us off by the -- by the Marriott.

VAN SUSTEREN: And you hadn't, like, you know, hard-wired the appointment with this guy to meet -- you just assumed that he would be there?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, no. I called him on the way back (INAUDIBLE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Where -- at what point did you call him? I'm confused. When did you lock in the pick-up?

VAN DER SLOOT: At like, 1:00 o'clock.

VAN SUSTEREN: You called him then?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, or a little before.

VAN SUSTEREN: And said what?

VAN DER SLOOT: And I said that, you know, I'm in the car now and -- and with the girl and I'm with two friends. And, What are you doing? And he said, yes, I'm awake. And then he's, like, OK, can you be there in an hour? And I'm going to have someone there. And I'm, like, OK. Give you your money, so (INAUDIBLE) OK.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you made a call to this guy while Natalee's in the car with you?

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did Natalee say anything?

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-uh.

VAN SUSTEREN: What'd she do, just sit there as you made the phone call?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you speak in code or, I mean, like...

VAN SUSTEREN: No, I just spoke Dutch to him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Oh. And so she couldn't understand Dutch. All right. And Deepak and Satish, did they understand Dutch.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. They can understand -- they (INAUDIBLE) fluent in Dutch, but they understand Dutch.

VAN SUSTEREN: So the deal was to meet at what time? I mean, did you actually have a firm time at that point?

VAN DER SLOOT: We -- yes, no, he said an hour, be there in an hour.

VAN SUSTEREN: So what did you do for the hour?

VAN DER SLOOT: Just drove around. It wasn't like -- yes, just drove around. We went up to the lighthouse, we made (ph) a circle here, went back. We -- yes, we just drove around a little bit.

VAN SUSTEREN: And so then you drove to the Marriott, or at least a little bit north of the Marriott, or that parking lot are?

VAN DER SLOOT: The parking lot area.

VAN SUSTEREN: And tell me what happened.

VAN DER SLOOT: Then I got out, steppe out of the car. She was with me, went to the beach with her. And we just were making out. We never did anything else. And then -- at first, I didn't see anyone there, you know, anything. And I'm almost, like, OK. Whatever. You know, it's not going to happen. Then I saw a guy and he came, and he just handed me a bag, grabbed the girl by the arm and he went to the boat that he had in the water.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did Natalee say?

VAN DER SLOOT: She said nothing, nothing until she was on the boat. And then she was, like, Hey, you know, what's going on? You're not coming with me, or -- I don't know. She wasn't -- wasn't panicking or anything. And then (INAUDIBLE) on the boat and the boat went away, I still heard, like, you know, What's going on? I think she was pretty drunk. That's what the main thing was.

VAN SUSTEREN: But she didn't struggle with this guy to go to the boat?

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-uh.

VAN SUSTEREN: Didn't you think that was odd?

VAN DER SLOOT: No because I said we were going to go on a boat.

VAN SUSTEREN: You told her that.

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh. That's my story to go to the beach, that we were going to go on a boat.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did the guy give you?

VAN DER SLOOT: They gave me a bag of money.

VAN SUSTEREN: Ten thousand dollars?

VAN DER SLOOT: Wasn't even $10,000. It was less (INAUDIBLE)

VAN SUSTEREN: How much short?

VAN DER SLOOT: Oh, a couple hundred short. Probably took it for himself. I don't know.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Up next: What does Joran say about a boat pulling away from the beach with Natalee? He will tell you.

Plus, what happens during our interview that makes Joran take his microphone off and threaten to leave? You will hear next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran van der Sloot just described to you an awful alleged plot. Joran claims he sold Natalee Holloway on a beach in Aruba the night she disappeared. After being given a bag of cash, Joran says, he watched Natalee get pulled onto a boat with a stranger.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you actually see the boat drive away with Natalee?

VAN DER SLOOT: Uh-huh.

VAN SUSTEREN: And could you hear her say anything from the boat?

VAN DER SLOOT: I heard something, but I don't remember what it was. It wasn't screaming or anything like that, no.

VAN SUSTEREN: So what did you do next?

VAN DER SLOOT: Then I went home. I called -- I called Deepak up and he sent Satish to come pick me up.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why didn't he come, do you know?

VAN DER SLOOT: I think he was catting on the Internet with his girlfriend or something like that. I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: At what point did he get cash?

VAN DER SLOOT: I always gave him (INAUDIBLE) When we went out, one night I paid, other night he paid, and I gave them both $1,000. I didn't tell them how much I was given for it at first. Afterwards, I told them.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did you give them the $1,000?

VAN DER SLOOT: Like, a couple days after.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you give it to Deepak or Satish?

VAN DER SLOOT: To both of them when we were in my room. And another friend of mine was there, as well.

VAN SUSTEREN: When was the first time you told your -- you told your father this story, right?

VAN DER SLOOT: Not everything. No, it's not. We don't talk about it. No. We don't talk about it, actually.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did it ever come up with your father? Because in that chip, he talks about it, he says it's a bad -- you know, it's a bad thing to sell somebody. So your father knew about it before the conversation that on the chip you gave us.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: When was the first time you told him?

VAN DER SLOOT: Long time after that we were arrested. A while.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, in the conversation you and I had on the phone, you told me that you told your father -- that your father -- that Natalee Holloway's family showed up the next day and that they were making a big fuss. And so that your father took you to a lawyer. And that what you told me on the phone is that you told your lawyer and your father at that point.

VAN DER SLOOT: No, no. I lied to all of them.

VAN SUSTEREN: You lied -- but did -- so you lied to me when you told me that?

VAN DER SLOOT: Don't remember telling you that.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, I -- I mean, because -- I tell you, because that was -- that's an important element of it, is that, you know -- you know, is what did they know at that time?

VAN DER SLOOT: At that time, they didn't know anything. It's a little later that I told them.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did you tell them?

VAN DER SLOOT: Like, I don't know, a while after. But for me, that's not -- that's not the most important part anyway. The most important thing for me...

VAN SUSTEREN: Oh, it is.

VAN DER SLOOT: ... is that you guys look into...

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, but it is - but the thing is that -- I'll tell you why it's important. Because, on this tape, on this chip that you gave us, you father says selling girls or whatever, you know, is a serious crime.

I need your father's help. And so I want to take that to your father and say, you know, we need your help to get to the bottom of this. And you have already outed your father on this. You have already done it on the chip, so there is no sense in protecting him here.

And we get back to the same thing. It's like if you are doing this, and we're deep into this already, tell me the truth. Just, you know, I mean, you have already included everybody into this. So you are not helping you, yourself or anybody else at this point. It is out there.

VAN DER SLOOT: I know.

VAN SUSTEREN: So when did your father find out?

VAN DER SLOOT: A while after. Like I don't know exactly when.

VAN SUSTEREN: Were you in jail at the time?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. I was already arrested.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did your lawyer find out?

VAN DER SLOOT: I told him one time when I got to speak to him alone.

VAN SUSTEREN: At what point? And I'll tell you why that's important. You see, look, in order for me to believe you, because you have told other stories -- you and I have had so many conversations, but the problem is I have to think, like, when are you telling me the truth? Was it when we have spoken privately? Was it when we did the interview, or is it now?

So I need to take what you are telling me, and I need to go to your lawyer and say, look, he tells me that he told you this in the summer. Did he? And if the lawyer says yes, then I can say to my company, see, this is not crazy. This isn't Joran with another story.

So that is why I need it. I need for you to say on camera that your lawyer can freely speak to me about this and so we can corroborate it. This corroborates the chip, so I can go forward.

VAN DER SLOOT: I understand, but I actually don't think that I want to do this. I think -- I don't think so.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why? Just tell -- all we want -- I will investigate this until the cows come home.

VAN DER SLOOT: I know, but what we agreed on first is that I would not actually be in the picture, that was the actual point. But, as you are saying right now, it's already there. People already think so much about me, that now they think something else. So.

VAN SUSTEREN: No, but if you are telling the truth.

VAN DER SLOOT: Of course.

VAN SUSTEREN: Are you telling the truth this time?

VAN DER SLOOT: Of course.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, then help me understand it and corroborate it. If she is alive, Joran, this is our last chance. This is three years into it. And that is a big deal if this young woman is alive. I realize the chances are remote.

VAN DER SLOOT: Very small.

VAN SUSTEREN: Maybe they aren't, though. Because, you know, I have gone online, and, surprisingly, the State Department, U.S. State Department says there are something like 700,000 or 800,000 people sold into slavery every year, which is bizarre to me. But if what you say is true, that you sold her and that she went into some sort of slavery, or something--I realize it's remote, but maybe she is. This is our last chance.

And so, you can sort of cleanse yourself and be done with it, and we will eagerly investigate it. You can do what you want, but that at least gives us something to go on if she's alive.

VAN DER SLOOT: I understand, but..

VAN SUSTEREN: You want her alive, right?

VAN DER SLOOT: That would be the best thing in the world, I mean, anyway.

VAN SUSTEREN: You're the only one that can help.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. But there are different ways that you can look after things.

Like I said, if I had a million dollars, myself, I would look into it myself to find out what happened. But that's why it has to be someone like you that's going to look into it. The police won't look into it. No one else will look into it.

VAN SUSTEREN: And I will. I mean, you told me, one of the things you told me - this is - and what I want to do is use this with leverage is that (NAME DELETED) was paid off, and another police officer was paid off by your father.

VAN DER SLOOT: You know something, Greta, though, I don't really want to do this, actually. I don't. This is not actually what we agreed on.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, Joran, it can't -- I came halfway across the world - I came halfway across the world because you told me in conversations that you want this investigated. If you are going to bolt on me, I don't believe it.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, then you don't believe it.

VAN SUSTEREN: I mean, you know, I really want to investigate this.

VAN DER SLOOT: (INAUDIBLE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Why not?

VAN DER SLOOT: This is not what we agreed on. That's all.

VAN SUSTEREN: What we agreed on is that I would license the chip. The problem is the chip came with issues with it. And so now I am in the position where I've got to try to tell my company that this is a possibility that this happened. And they're going to say, well, if he won't even corroborate, then this is all just basically (expletive deleted).

And I don't know, what do I tell them?

VAN DER SLOOT: I guess you can tell them whatever you want, but I'm not going to go say all that.

VAN SUSTEREN: I want the truth only.

VAN DER SLOOT: I understand.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why won't you tell us the truth?

VAN DER SLOOT: Because the truth hurts.

VAN SUSTEREN: I understand that. I mean, that I get. OK? Sit down a second. Sit down.

VAN DER SLOOT: (INAUDIBLE). Maybe we can take a break now. Let's take a break for a second.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, but you know what, Joran, I understand the truth hurts.

VAN DER SLOOT: No, you don't.

VAN SUSTEREN: I understand that. I actually do.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Coming up, will Joran sit down and continue the interview, or did we get all the information we could from Joran van der Sloot? That's next.

Plus, a twist to the entire story. This could change your mind about everything you have heard so far tonight. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWS BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: You just saw Joran van der Sloot take his microphone off and threaten to end our interview with him. Joran eventually did put his microphone back on and continued telling his story.

Now, Joran told us that he sold Natalee Holloway the night that she vanished in Aruba. But how deep does this alleged plot go?

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, Joran, we've taken a bit of a break, and now we're back.

So let me pick up - let me hit some blunt topics. You told me in conversations that (NAME DELETED) was paid some money.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: There was another police officer with him who was also paid? Who was that?

VAN DER SLOOT: Two police officers. There was (NAME DELETED) and--I can't think of him right now.

VAN SUSTEREN: When were they paid off, and for what?

VAN DER SLOOT: They were paid off in the summer for not saying anything, because they found out - yes, they found out the story.

VAN SUSTEREN: When you say, "the story," what was the story they found out?

VAN DER SLOOT: They -- I think they got onto - they found out that she was taken to Venezuela.

VAN SUSTEREN: Who paid them?

VAN DER SLOOT: My father.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you know how much he paid them?

VAN DER SLOOT: Not exactly, no.

VAN SUSTEREN: What do you understand was the range that he paid them?

VAN DER SLOOT: $50,000.

VAN SUSTEREN: Each, or to split?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you know how the money was transferred? Was it done through the banking system, was it done through cash?

VAN DER SLOOT: I just heard that it happened, that's all. I think it was done through banking.

VAN SUSTEREN: How did you hear about this?

VAN DER SLOOT: From my dad.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did he tell you?

VAN DER SLOOT: In one of the conversations I had with him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did (NAME DELETED) shake him down? How did this happen?

VAN DER SLOOT: I think they tried to shake him down a little.

VAN SUSTEREN: Tell me what you know about it.

VAN DER SLOOT: I never spoke to -- this was not a topic that was spoken about. So I don't know the details on it. I just know that that happened.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why did your father tell you, do you think? How was the setting when he told you?

VAN DER SLOOT: More like, you know, that that's serious, and for me to shut up and keep my mouth closed.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was this an argument or discussion with your father?

VAN DER SLOOT: No. It was more I think just to emphasize, giving me reason not to talk to the police.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you learn this from your father when you were still in jail, or is this after you got out?

VAN DER SLOOT: I learned this while I was still in jail.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you had private conversations with your father?

VAN DER SLOOT: Way later, yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was anyone else paid off?

VAN DER SLOOT: Not that I know of, no.

VAN SUSTEREN: You hesitated a little. Were you thinking, or was there somebody else?

VAN DER SLOOT: I was thinking. I don't think so. I can't say, I don' want to say anything without me being sure about it.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you think there was another police officer?

VAN DER SLOOT: There could have been someone else that was paid off as well, but what I say now is what I know about it.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did (NAME DELETED) say to your father what they had learned? Were they specific at all?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. I think so. I don't know. The conversation I had was not that long, but I think they knew exactly what was going on, yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: How did they learn that, though?

VAN DER SLOOT: I didn't speak to them about it, so I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did they know the guy who you worked this deal with to sell Natalee? Did they know him?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't think so. I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: And they never said anything to you about it?

VAN DER SLOOT: No. I never spoke to (NAME DELETED) or this other guy.

VAN SUSTEREN: Ever? They never interrogated you in jail?

VAN DER SLOOT: Never. I spoke to one of them once.

VAN SUSTEREN: Who was the first person you told about selling Natalee?

VAN DER SLOOT: The first person I told? The first person I told was my lawyer, I think.

VAN SUSTEREN: That was before --

VAN DER SLOOT: No, the first person I told was a teacher of mine, and then the lawyer.

VAN SUSTEREN: The teacher is?

VAN DER SLOOT: The teacher -- it was a teacher from school.

VAN SUSTEREN: What's his name?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. It was a teacher from school, that I had as a teacher.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did he tell you to do?

VAN DER SLOOT: To tell the truth.

VAN SUSTEREN: And what was his name?

VAN DER SLOOT: I can't think of it right now.

VAN SUSTEREN: You know what, you do know it.

VAN DER SLOOT: I can't think of it right now.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is it the teacher who was there when you and I did the interview back in March of `06?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did you tell him in relation to Natalee's disappearance?

VAN DER SLOOT: I told him a couple of days after, at school, I think.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you have a special relationship with this teacher?

VAN DER SLOOT: I had a very good relationship with him, yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And so he was the first person. The second person you told was who?

VAN DER SLOOT: My lawyer.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was your father present?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, not when I told him the first time.

VAN SUSTEREN: And this was in the lawyer's office?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, this was at an interrogation.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK, so this was after you were arrested?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And where was this conversation with your lawyer, which facility?

VAN DER SLOOT: It was at a police station.

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, you were not allowed to go home after that one, were you? You went right off to..

VAN DER SLOOT: After that they took me to jail, yes, to Kiya (ph). So this was still in my pre-arrest.

VAN SUSTEREN: One of the things that is important to us is that we corroborate every bit of the story. Do you give your lawyer permission to verify that fact?

VAN DER SLOOT: How do you mean?

VAN SUSTEREN: You have an attorney-client privilege. He can't tell me anything about you unless you let give him the green light. Will you give him the green light to verify that you told him within days of Natalee's disappearance that you'd sold her?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, I give him the green light to do that.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: After this interview we went to Aruba. We confronted Joran's father and Joran's lawyer for their side of the story. So far, they have refused to go "On the Record." We will tell you more about that tomorrow night. They are all welcome here anytime.

You also just heard Joran van der Sloot claim that he confided to a teacher that he had sold Natalee Holloway. We did our own investigation and spoke to that teacher. More on that is coming up also tomorrow night.

Coming up, Joran says he sold Natalee Holloway to a mysterious stranger. But where is this man now, when was the last time Joran spoke to him, and is the man still paying Joran money for his alleged deed?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran van der Sloot just described how he allegedly sold Natalee Holloway the night that she disappeared. Joran says a man gave him a bag full of cash on a beach and then pulled Natalee onto a boat.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: After -- the guy that you sold her to, you don't know any more information about it than you have told us so far on camera, right?

VAN DER SLOOT: I know everything that I told you guys before. I don't know if that's - I don't think we have to discuss it all now.

VAN SUSTEREN: According to what you told is, is that when you turned Natalee over to the guy in the boat, it's not this guy, you got a bag of cash, which you later split up. But you were cheated--it was not $10,000, it wasn't a full $10,000. How much was missing?

VAN DER SLOOT: $400.

VAN SUSTEREN: And your assumption is that the boat driver took it?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: You don't know? But anyway. Now, have you ever gotten any more money from that guy?

VAN DER SLOOT: All the time.

VAN SUSTEREN: When?

VAN DER SLOOT: After the second time I got arrested.

VAN SUSTEREN: Which was when?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't know anymore. Not that the best of days (ph), now I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: How was the money transferred?

VAN DER SLOOT: He sent it through - by Western Union.

VAN SUSTEREN: To where?

VAN DER SLOOT: To me.

VAN SUSTEREN: Were you in Holland or Aruba?

VAN DER SLOOT: At that time I was in Holland. I wasn't anywhere there.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why did he send you more money if he'd already paid you?

VAN DER SLOOT: I don't think he - I think he didn't want me to talk.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you think it was to have you shut up.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, or to keep me happy. I don't know.

VAN SUSTEREN: How did he even think that you wouldn't be happy? Had you had any communication with him at all?

VAN DER SLOOT: None at all, none whatsoever.

VAN SUSTEREN: It was just out of the blue?

VAN DER SLOOT: Out of the blue completely.

VAN SUSTEREN: How did he know where to send it?

VAN DER SLOOT: That's when -- I gave him that. I gave him everything at that moment. Like he was telling me, where are you, what are you doing, all that stuff. Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: I don't understand. You get the $9,600 when Natalee disappears, and then we fast forward a couple of years, and then out of the blue when you get arrested the second time -- which was what, about six months ago.?

VAN DER SLOOT: Something like that.

VAN SUSTEREN: About six months ago. Is suddenly he gives you how much more?

VAN DER SLOOT: He gave me the same amount again.

VAN SUSTEREN: Ten grand or $9,600?

VAN DER SLOOT: Ten grand.

VAN DER SLOOT: OK, 10 grand. And he wires it to you in Holland. And you've actually given us the wire number.

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: You've given it to us. But there must have been some contact before, like by e-mail or conversation for you to give him the number...

VAN DER SLOOT: I had e-mail contact with him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Have you had email contact with him for the last couple of years?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, but I have it to him one time on a piece of paper. And I don't know if he was using a real e-mail address.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you just out of the blue e-mailed him first or he e-mailed you first?

VAN DER SLOOT: He e-mailed me. I do not have his email.

VAN SUSTEREN: He e-mailed you and said what?

VAN DER SLOOT: He said, like, how am I doing, and for me to shut up, and if I needed any money.

VAN SUSTEREN: So you then replied what?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And then what happened?

VAN DER SLOOT: Then he said, OK. And then at first I didn't hear anything for like a couple of weeks. So that's why I don't think it's his real email address. And then, he said, OK, well, here's a number. You can go pick it up at a Western Union.

VAN SUSTEREN: And you did?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And that's the last contact you've had with him?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: You're haven't tried to get more money out of him?

VAN DER SLOOT: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why not?

VAN DER SLOOT: I do not know how to find him, where he is. I've emailed him another time, but he didn't respond.

VAN SUSTEREN: Does your father know about the second money?

VAN DER SLOOT: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Who knows about that?

VAN DER SLOOT: No one.

VAN SUSTEREN: Does Joe Tacopina know about the slave?

VAN DER SLOOT: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Doesn't know a thing about it. You never told him?

VAN DER SLOOT: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: So the only lawyer who knows is Antonio Carlo, no other lawyer. And your father and the teacher. Does your mother know?

VAN DER SLOOT: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Does your mother know about the payoff to (NAME DELETED)?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, I don't think so. I don't speak to them anymore at all.

VAN SUSTEREN: Your parents. Why not?

VAN DER SLOOT: We don't have the best relations anymore.

VAN SUSTEREN: Why?

VAN DER SLOOT: I guess it was all a little bit too much, I guess.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was that your decision or their decision to cut contact?

VAN DER SLOOT: I guess mine.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you have any contact with Deepak and Satish?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: What kind of contact?

VAN DER SLOOT: I have e-mailed back and forth with them a couple of times, called once.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did you call?

VAN DER SLOOT: Something -- three months ago.

VAN SUSTEREN: What was the conversation?

VAN DER SLOOT: It was about they had a lawsuit going, and that's really the only thing we talk about.

VAN SUSTEREN: And is there -- why is the lawsuit of interest to you?

VAN DER SLOOT: They said that if they won the lawsuit, that they'd give me a million dollars.

VAN SUSTEREN: And is that Deepak saying that, or Satish?

VAN DER SLOOT: It's Deepak. I have it on paper too.

VAN SUSTEREN: Deepak wrote it, or in an e-mail?

VAN DER SLOOT: No, I got it - just my computer. Like it's typed up.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you know if his lawyer knows?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, for sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: What does it say on the paper? What's the deal?

VAN DER SLOOT: It's that if as long as I don't share anything that I know about the both of them with any money, and if they win the lawsuit, I will get a million dollars.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did that come from the lawyer or from Deepak?

VAN DER SLOOT: Both of them.

VAN SUSTEREN: Both the lawyer and Deepak?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes. It's an official paper.

VAN SUSTEREN: Will you show us a copy of it?

VAN DER SLOOT: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK. Anything else? I know this isn't easy for you.

VAN DER SLOOT: No. Just that I hope you guys go in and really look at it, find out everything, find out what happened. And hopefully then I can go on and everyone can go on.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Up next, you just heard Joran's unbelievable story in his own words, but it is not over yet. We have information next that will completely change the way you look at this interview. Joran contacted us again and gave a final surprising twist to the story. You need to hear it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: As we all know by now, Joran has changed his story a number of times, and now he has changed it again. Any good investigator is going to chase down every lead. Some leads are successful. Some go nowhere. We had spent so much time on this story that we wanted to go that extra mile and get whatever information we could. We also set out to attempt to prove or disprove what information we collected.

After we conducted this interview in Asia, Joran contacted us again. He told us he had been lying during that interview and that he had not sold Natalee Holloway to a stranger. Joran says he made the story up.

You can decide for yourself what to believe and what not to believe. We know for certain that Joran Van Der Sloot has lied about the night Natalee Holloway disappeared. The question now is whether he has ever told the truth. That is why our investigation continues.

After this interview with Joran, we contacted many of the people involved in the alleged plot as we could. We also went online to look at the State Department's Web site, which provides shocking information about worldwide human trafficking. Tomorrow night, you hear what we uncovered in an investigation spreading from the island of Aruba to Asia, and even to the city of Seattle.

[Blonde]

Fallout from Joran van der Sloot's 'On the Record' Interview

Wednesday, November 26, 2008

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," November 25, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: You heard Joran van der Sloot say on tape that he sold Natalee Holloway and that he told his father about it. Now, according to Joran, there is a recording of Joran and his father talking about it. Now, we have that recording. You will hear that recording shortly.

But first, what did Joran's father, Paulus, say? Did Joran really tell his father about this? We contacted Paulus van der Sloot multiple times, but he would not respond. We went down to Aruba with former prosecutor Jim Hammer to confront Paulus van der Sloot with this new information. We approached Paulus at his office, asking him to react to what Joran told us. How did Paulus react?

Jim Hammer joins us live. All right, Jim, what happened?

JIM HAMMER, FORMER ASSISTANT SAN FRANCISCO DA: Well, Greta, first of all finding Paulus is not the easiest thing. There was a lot of staking out that happens, and that tends to be just like watching the clock pass by. We went by his house, went by his office. Finally, after staking his office out one morning, there he came. I ran out to the front of his office and confronted him there. And he wanted to slip away right way, but then I said, I've got some tapes here. Joran says he's been talking to you about Natalee Holloway. That got him stopped him in his tracks, Greta.
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At that point -- and they can see it in the tape there -- I hold the transcript of the actual recordings up to him and I start reading to him. They say -- he says, "But if I come forward" -- this is Joran -- "I can end all of this." His father's listening at that point. And then his father says this. And I'll tell you, to this day, it really troubles me. His father says, "But what you've done is pretty bad. Human trafficking is a serious crime."

I mean, I'm still left with shivers when I hear that. He read it along with me, asked for a copy of it, walked to his office. And I said, you know, Will you help us? Joran says that she still could be alive. At that point, he went in. I knocked on the door for a bit longer. When he came out, I said, Listen, Joran says she may still be alive. Will you help us find her? And he closed the door on my face.

VAN SUSTEREN: How was his English? Because one of the things is that, you know, we've had a hard time communicating with him. He says he can't speak English. Did you have a hard time speaking with him?

HAMMER: He spoke fine English. And again, if he had any problems speaking English, he wouldn't have been reading the transcript along with me. And I read him piece by piece, the part where he says, "Human trafficking is a serious crime," where Joran says, "You know, I could be -- let go of this whole thing if they find her alive." He paid very close attention to what I was saying, and in perfect English said, May I have a copy of that, please?

At that point, I said, I want to talk to you more about it and he went into his office. Not one time, Greta, did he have any problem understanding what we were talking about.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he deny that he had spoken to his son and that that was a transcript of a conversation?

HAMMER: Not once. And again, it strikes me that if this were a complete fabrication or a complete off (ph), he had an opportunity to say, That's ridiculous, that never happened. He read along with me with very rapt attention, and I can't read his mind, but seemed somewhat startled by this whole thing and very intent on what I was showing him that day.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he act confused at all, like he didn't understand what you were showing him?

HAMMER: Not once, never asked me to repeat it. He didn't interrupt me. I read these key passages to him. And again, he read along with me, Greta, as though he could understand exactly what was happening, and then in perfect English said, May I have a copy of that? I handed it him and then started to follow him in. But again, no sense whatsoever, Greta, that he -- he either disagreed with this and/or didn't understand what I was talking with him about.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you get the copy back?

HAMMER: I didn't. I did after he made a photocopy inside the office. I left him the number where we were staying. I asked him to please call. We also talked to his law partner, who I think has represented the Kalpoe brothers, again, trying to get some verification a number of times. And polite secretaries but no phone call back.

VAN SUSTEREN: Jim, thank you. And always nice to see you.

HAMMER: Thanks, Greta. You, too.

VAN SUSTEREN: Coming up: Will this new development push the Aruban authorities into action? John Q. Kelly, the lawyer for Natalee's parents, joins us live. And later, you'll hear from Natalee's mother.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: More than three years after Natalee Holloway vanished on the island of Aruba, Joran Van Der Sloot has come forward to tell us that he sold Natalee Holloway for a bag full of cash to a mystery man on the beach. Then he contacted me to say it was all a lie.

John Q. Kelly, the lawyer for Natalee's parents, joins us live. John, just in talking to Jim Hammer, just as an aside, it occurred to me that assuming this conversation with his father was legitimate -- and we heard what John -- what Jim said about it -- this occurred in January of '08 that they're talking about trafficking. We did our interview about six months later in June, and he's talking about human trafficking. So there's a sense that that somehow -- you know, at least it's not a new story in June, if it's a lie.

Anyway, what's your thought on all this?

JOHN Q. KELLY, ATTORNEY FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY'S PARENTS: You know, the most logical explanation of how Natalee could disappear, absolutely vanish into air within a half hour of being dropped off at the beach with Joran is consistent with what he said. And all the other evidence points towards it, too, that she was led down to the fisherman's hut, she was led to the shore, you know, alive, well, and led onto a small sports utility vehicle, and you know, very willingly got on board and before she knew what was happening and Joran didn't get on board, you know, the boat took off and she was subdued eventually.

VAN SUSTEREN: Now, there is absolutely no forensic evidence of a homicide, and I mean, which is unusual...

KELLY: Right.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... Not necessarily dispositive of what happened. But that's -- I mean, for someone who's inexperienced to commit a murder and not leave a hair, a blood, or anything anyplace is extremely significant. Now, let me ask you this.

KELLY: Sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: Has the prosecutor followed up on everything? Because it's the prosecutor's job to prove or disprove. And I've got a real beef with this prosecutor. He won't look at this tape. But has he satisfied you that he's chased down every lead?

KELLY: Well, not at all, Greta. I mean, there are really simple things. I mean, there was the big issue about where are Joran's size 14 Swiss K shoes? I mean, if he led her down to the beach and she and Natalee -- he and Natalee were carrying their shoes, he would have helped her on, she'd put her sandals on, and if he just threw on his shoes but instead of getting on just pushed the boat off, you know, his shoes would be gone with Natalee and her sandals.

I mean, there have been all kinds of things. There are phone logs there. I've asked for the surveillance tapes from the casinos. I haven't gotten them. I've asked him to review them. He hasn't gotten back to me on those. I've asked for phone records. I haven't gotten those. I've asked for backup on witness interviews. I haven't gotten those.

And Greta, it's just -- it's almost too simple, when you step back and look at it, what probably happened that night. It's really scary.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, now, I would -- if I were the prosecutor, I'd want to look at wire transfers, both the ones -- we have a number of a wire transfer that he should investigate from January, but even to see whether or not -- Joran says there was a payoff of some police -- whether or not there was cash drawn down from Paulus van der Sloot's account. I'd get a subpoena on that. I'd get a subpoena on all his relatives to see if any money was (INAUDIBLE)

KELLY: Sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: Anything to sort of piece together to see whether or not this is true or not, the surveillance video -- what surveillance video do you want him to look at?

KELLY: Well, for starters, if you recall -- and it was sort of pushed aside by the law enforcement also, when Joran is sitting in the Excelsior casino with Natalee and her friends, there's a middle-aged Caucasian gentlemen sitting there who actually speaks to Natalee and the other girls. And I just want to know -- you know, he absolutely fits the description of the man Joran describes. He actually looks a lot like Paulus, too.

And I just want to see whether he had talked to that man before the girls arrived, whether he talked to that man after the girls left. And quite remarkably, Hans Mos told me they've never even identified who that man is to this day.

VAN SUSTEREN: Does Hans Mos want to help investigate Deepak and Satish and Paulus or not?

KELLY: No. In fact, the first call I made to him, he said -- he asked if this had anything to do with the Dr. Phil litigation, and if it did, he would not help me because he totally supports Satish and Deepak.

And the other thing is -- let me just add, Greta, you know, Aruba is a tourist island. Their commerce -- they can survive if the story is -- you know, is one aberrant act by a young man who got caught up and panicked on an accidental death of a young girl there. That they can live with. But you know, for several young men conspiring and plotting and putting someone into human trafficking, adults covering it up, law enforcement covering it up, government officials looking away, that's something Aruba can't survive.

And I think that's why when you go down there and you present them with things or ask them questions, they want to disprove everything you say or not listen to it, rather than go after it.

VAN SUSTEREN: Well, that's my rub, is they won't even investigate, you know, any of this that we have.

KELLY: Sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: You know, just investigate it. Prove it or disprove it, one or the other. John, thank you.

KELLY: Sure, Greta.

VAN SUSTEREN: Coming up: You heard Joran van der Sloot in an interview done in Thailand say he sold Natalee, but eight hours later, before we had even gotten out of Thailand, an e-mail flashed across my BlackBerry. Joran said he lied to us. Did Joran lie to us? And if so, when? When he said he sold Natalee or eight hours later, when he said it was not true? Joran's lawyer, Joe Tacopina, joins us next.

Plus, you will hear an audio recording. Joran says it is a conversation between his father and him. And two of the words mentioned on the recording that you need to pay close attention to are human trafficking. You have to hear this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran van der Sloot says he told his father Paulus that he sold Natalee Holloway to a man in Aruba. Joran says he recorded conversations between his father an him that refer to this sale and could possibly corroborate what he told us on tape.

In a moment you will hear one of those recordings that Joran says took place early in 2008. Now, we have repeatedly reached out to Joran's van der Sloot's father Paulus, but he has refused to respond.

We cannot verify whether if the voices on the tape are Joran and his father. The prosecutor in Aruba could do this with his subpoena power. And note, Joran says this is his father on the recording.

We had two different experts analyze if the recording was altered. One expert is confident it is not altered, while the other expert has concerns that the recording may have been modified. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

J. VAN DER SLOOT: Hi, dad, how are you?

P. VAN DER SLOOT: I'm all right, you?

J. VAN DER SLOOT: I'm sort of fed up. I can't stand it any longer.

P. VAN DER SLOOT: Joran, hang in there a bit longer. You must keep tough.

J. VAN DER SLOOT: I just want it to be over. I don't care what will happen to me.

P. VAN DER SLOOT: I understand, but too much has happened. You have to be strong.

J. VAN DER SLOOT: I do my best, but I really don't know. I feel rotten.

P. VAN DER SLOOT: Joran, you have no choice.

J. VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, I can come forward and end this.

P. VAN DER SLOOT: Yeah, not a good idea, I think. You have to think about us too.

J. VAN DER SLOOT: Yes, I will do that, but if they find the girl, there is at least proof I didn't hurt anybody.

P. VAN DER SLOOT: But what you have done is pretty bad. Human trafficking is a serious crime.

J. VAN DER SLOOT: I know, but how could I know where all this would lead to?

P. VAN DER SLOOT: Joran, it's a shame you made certain choices, but there has to be a moment it will stop. Okay? You cannot talk with anyone about this, do you understand?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran van der Sloot's lawyer, Joe Tacopina, joins us live. Joe, am I right, you still do represent Joran?

JOE TACOPINA, ATTORNEY FOR JORAN VAN DER SLOOT: I represent him, Greta, for the purpose of the Aruba investigation, which for all intents and purposes is over.

Quite frankly, when you asked me to come on last week or a few weeks ago, I hadn't seen this tape. Had I seen this first, I probably would have declined your invitation, Greta, because I just - we could do this - and look, obviously you paid him some money to either give him a tape recording or have him give you tapes or to submit to an interview.

VAN SUSTEREN: Stop there. Let me explain something.

TACOPINA: Please.

VAN SUSTEREN: Just so you get it right. He contacted us. He said he had a tape.

TACOPINA: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: I said we couldn't buy it, but we could license it. That's what the media does. You license photos, you license recordings, you license tape.

He gave us the tape. We've had it sent to someone to have it checked out if there were problems with it. I went to Thailand to find out what the story was on the tape to fill in the blanks to corroborate it.

TACOPINA: OK. So whatever I have - I mean, an email from one of your producers, Steph Watts, you know, to Joran, talking about the Western Union transaction. Greta, look --

VAN SUSTEREN: That is how the money is transferred. There's no secret. There's no secret.

TACOPINA: You paid him for a tape that he made and wound up getting an hour interview with him. And so be it, Greta. Great TV, great ratings- -

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you have a problem with that?

TACOPINA: Yes, I do have a problem with it, Greta, because if you offered Joran $10,000 tomorrow and ask him to tell you a fifth story, he would do it.

Clearly, he's a sick kid. Clearly, I have nothing to say in defense of his actions, Greta. OK?

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you deny...?

TACOPINA: But I still tell you, and I stand by the notion that the investigation regarding the disappearance of Natalee Holloway has not led to Joran. That's the bottom line.

No one expects anyone to believe anything this kid has to say anymore. Quite frankly, he's on the verge of sociopath and despicable, but--

VAN SUSTEREN: Explain something to me, Joe.

TACOPINA: Please.

VAN SUSTEREN: According to the timeline --I'm trying to figure this out, because I really want this investigated. That's why we're bringing this information in.

TACOPINA: Really?

VAN SUSTEREN: Now stop. There's has been resistance from Aruba. There has been resistance from you, which, of course, that's your job as the lawyer. I understand that and I have an appreciation for a defense lawyer.

TACOPINA: I know you do.

VAN SUSTEREN: But when he comes to us and says look, I have my father on tape saying about the human trafficking, this explains what happened. I'd like to find her alive is what he told us.

Of course, I didn't believe that it was true, that she could possibly be alive. But he said that he sold her.

So I said "What do you have?" And he came to us. We didn't go after him.

TACOPINA: Greta, that's fine. But look at the source. He's told so many different versions.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, but what about his father in - what - how do you justify what his father said on this tape? Is his father also telling us different versions?

TACOPINA: Oh, that tape--

VAN SUSTEREN: Skip Joran. What -- Is the tape made up?

TACOPINA: I spoke to Paulus last night as this was going on. I mean, talk about a guy-- you don't know Paulus. I do. Paulus is a simpleton.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is this tape made up? Is this tape just crazy?

TACOPINA: He absolutely denies ever having that conversation, ever. So yes, I believe that tape's false.

Think about it for a second--

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: So we can do a comparison, so we can check it out? I'm willing to check it out.

TACOPINA: Listen, Greta, Greta, just hold on a second. Think about the logic of this. Joran calls you and tape-recorded an incriminating conversation with his father. Why? For what purpose? So he could sell it to you? I mean, why would he have an incriminating tape recording of himself and his father?

VAN SUSTEREN: All I'm trying to do, Joe, all I want to do, Joe, is try to find out - stop.

(CROSSTALK)

TACOPINA: If that's the case, why in July did you have this interview, and why hasn't it not been turned over - why didn't you just send it to the authorities? How about the FBI? Did they get a copy of this?

VAN SUSTEREN: Because if you want to know the practical matter, no sooner than we had it done, we needed to corroborate it to make sure it wasn't lies, because he named a lot of people. In fact, if you notice, we bleeped out some names as we're trying to investigate.

Then we went into what you may have noticed was a presidential election. So we've been busy doing that.

TACOPINA: Oh, but you don't have to do this investigation, Greta. Give the tape to the FBI. They're not involved in the presidential election.

VAN SUSTEREN: The FBI has no jurisdiction, for god's sakes. You know that.

TACOPINA: Oh, they can't investigate? You know they investigated this case!

VAN SUSTEREN: Joe, let me find out one thing--if this is a made-up tape, give me a voice sampling from Paulus van der Sloot so that I can do a voice comparison analysis. There is a forensic way to do that. Get that for me, and if this turns out to be a lie, I'll say this tape is a lie.

TACOPINA: FOX News does not - as much as I respect you and this network, FOX News is not the end-all, be-all for investigative services. There is a law enforcement agency involved. So you don't just say, give you the power of attorney. Or give you a voice sample.

VAN SUSTEREN: If you're saying this tape is a fraud, I'm willing to investigate it, and I'm willing to say if it is a fraud, I'll say on the air we did this analysis of Paulus Van Der Sloot's voice to the tape, and it's wrong. I'm willing to do that. But if you come on and tell me it's not true, at least give me the ability to prove or disprove it.

TACOPINA: Let me just say this, let me say this -- I'm not saying it's true or not. I'm telling you what Paulus said. I wasn't there. I wasn't a witness to any of this.

VAN SUSTEREN: Call Paulus up right now and we'll go into the green room and say, Paulus, give them a voice sample, if this is a fraud.

TACOPINA: Greta, why was this tape not sent to the authorities, then? Why hold it until like November if you did this in July if you really think - because you said on the interview last night, you said to Joran when you were trying to get him to speak, you said what if she's still alive, Joran? I still think there is a chance Natalee could still be alive. Time is of the essence. Why? Because of the elections?

VAN SUSTEREN: Joe, because you know what, unlike you and the others, I've been spending my weekends actually working on this case. Do not criticize me for not working it. It's 2008.

TACOPINA: Don't be defensive, please, Greta. I'm not criticizing you for working. But send the tape to an authority. Send the tape to an authority. That's all I'm saying. I'm not saying you're not working on it.

VAN SUSTEREN: If they're willing to use their police powers, subpoena power to subpoena a voice exemplar from Joran van der Sloot, and our FBI doesn't have the authority, but the Aruban prosecutor does, he's got it. He can have it.

TACOPINA: So you have conditions on giving over possibly incriminating evidence?

VAN SUSTEREN: No.

TACOPINA: You have the tape, send them the tape right now.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do something, not sit on it. Not to just sit on it.

TACOPINA: I have no control over that, Greta. You know that. Ok? You know I have no control over it.

VAN SUSTEREN: You do have control over getting a voice sample from your client. Get it and you and I can both go to the forensic expert together. I'll go with you.

TACOPINA: Greta, I know for a fact, because you said it many times, "That doesn't make sense, Joran." That doesn't make sense. You don't believe a word he was saying on that interview last night, do you?

VAN SUSTEREN: You're dodging. You're dodging. Get me the voice sample.

(CROSSTALK)

TACOPINA: Listen, it's not my voice, OK!

VAN SUSTEREN: Get me the voice sample and you ... Joe, I got to go.

TACOPINA: Greta, send the tape to the investigators and I'll give you a voice sample. How about that?

VAN SUSTEREN: Right. They're real busy investigating. Joe, thank you.

TACOPINA: Bye.

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran says he traded Natalee Holloway for $10,000 but got shorted $400. Joran said he handed her off to a mystery man who took her on a boat.

This is completely different from what he was caught on tape in Holland saying earlier this year. And does she think Natalee is still alive? You will hear from Natalee Holloway's mother Beth, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWS BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Eighteen-year-old Natalee Holloway disappeared in Aruba on May 30, 2005. Joran van der Sloot has been arrested twice but never charged with a crime.

In 2006 Joran went "On the Record" saying he left her on the beach.

But then in February, '08, a hidden camera in Holland caught Joran saying that she had passed out and he had disposed of her body. And now Joran says he sold Natalee for thousands of dollars to a man who wanted a blonde girl.

Joran says Natalee was taken away onto a boat with this mystery man, and that she did not struggle. He then says he was lying.

And we spoke with Natalee Holloway's mother, Beth.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: What's sort of racing through your mind, your thoughts? We've obviously dropped a sort of 10-pound balloon on your head. I don't know whether it's true or it's not. We dragged you up here to New York, so you knew something was up. What are you thinking about?

BETH HOLLOWAY, NATALEE'S HOLLOWAY'S MOTHER: The main thing I go back to, I think about Joran in the car with Patrick. I can't -- it's hard for me to just discount that.

I feel like I'm trying to balance both, OK? So we've got two latest scenarios within `08, basically, coming out in 2008.

Like you said, keeping a lot of the elements are the same, a lot of the elements of the story are the same. Just changing, he just keeps changing some of the -- now he's saying, you know, she's alive, versus, you know, not alive.

It's a transaction versus, you know, a panic mode, because this was all evidently well thought out, planned, executed. He had to line it up, he had to grab a girl. I don't think it was Natalee in particular, I think it's just whoever he could get for that, whoever he could get. I think that's how it went down.

Natalee I think just happened to be the one he happened to get, not that she was sought out, picked out. I don't think that. He just got one.

But -- so it's changing quite a bit of elements from fully executed and planned to an accident. So it's just hard, you know, it's just hard with him, because he, boy, he can go off in some different directions pretty quickly.

And it's hard to deny that conversation with his father. And it was definitely a tight window. I know that. I know he had a tight window of that night of what he said he did. And if you have an accident, it sure is hard to think that quick on your feet. An hour and 20 minutes -- what did he have, an hour and 20 minutes?

VAN SUSTEREN: Not much time.

HOLLOWAY: It's pretty hard to think that quick on your feet in panic mode. You think that quick on your feet if you have something fully planned.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is this what you expected when I told you to come up here?

HOLLOWAY: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: What did you expect?

HOLLOWAY: What did I expect? I just wait until it unfolds. I try not to go there anymore. I just wait until I hear it, because you just got to think, I mean, I just want to be so careful and not--before we make a move, because, I mean you're the one who taught me once you go down a road, once you knock down that wall, you can't go back.

So I realize every step that's made we can't turn around and go back.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you think she's alive?

HOLLOWAY: I don't. I mean I'd love to be proven wrong, but no, I don't.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Coming up, Joran van der Sloot says the first person he told about selling Natalee Holloway was his teacher, a teacher he was close with. Is that the real story? We searched for Joran's teacher. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Joran says the first person he confided in about selling Natalee was one of his high school teachers. Joran says he and the teacher were close and the teacher told him to tell the truth. We promised you we will keep investigating, so we flew across America and tracked down one of Joran's teachers.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Steve, first of all, I guess there's no secret that we sort of just showed up on your doorstep.

STEVE SCHMUTZ: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And you're being a good sport about this. You know Joran van der Sloot?

SCHMUTZ: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: How did you meet him?

SCHMUTZ: I had him in class at the International School of Aruba.

VAN SUSTEREN: How long did you teach there?

SCHMUTZ: I taught there for two years, and I had him for one year as a student.

VAN SUSTEREN: The two years that you taught there, was that his junior and senior year, or was that his senior year and then the year since then?

SCHMUTZ: His senior year and the first year he was in college.

VAN SUSTEREN: I take it you've heard about Natalee Holloway.

SCHMUTZ: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: When did you first hear Natalee disappeared?

SCHMUTZ: Either Monday after school or Tuesday at school. I can't remember if it was Monday after school or if it was Tuesday at school. I'm not sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: When was the first time you saw Joran after hearing that information?

SCHMUTZ: I don't remember if it was at school on Tuesday, but either Tuesday or Wednesday after school at a health club was the first time I spoke with him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he come over to you or did you call him over? Or did he call you over?

SCHMUTZ: He came over and spoke with me. I was exercising at the time, and he came into the room and came over and told me what had happened.

VAN SUSTEREN: How do you characterize your relationship at that point? Were you a teacher who was close to him leading up to that, or he was just one of nine or 10 students?

SCHMUTZ: No. We got along well. I would say in the class, I got along well with all of the seniors. It was a pretty close group, close-knit group.

VAN SUSTEREN: When he told you what happened, what, to the best of your recollection, and I realize it's been three years, but what do you remember he told you when you talked to him at the health club?

SCHMUTZ: He told me a similar story to the one that he originally told the authorities, and that was he left Carlos and Charlie's with the Kalpoes and Natalee, and that they went to, as he said, see the sharks, that she wanted to see the sharks, and that he later dropped her off at her hotel.

VAN SUSTEREN: And that was the sum total? There was never any discussion about drugs, alcohol, anything like that?

SCHMUTZ: Not to my recollection. He might have said something that she was drunk or that she'd been drinking. Nothing that really stuck in my mind.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did you know who the Kalpoes were?

SCHMUTZ: No. Never knew who they were.

VAN SUSTEREN: Do you remember if he used their names?

SCHMUTZ: I think he might have said they're friends. Of course, it came up in the news right away, so we knew who they were by virtue of the media. But I had never come across them before.

VAN SUSTEREN: Have you ever met the Kalpoes?

SCHMUTZ: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: Did he ever mention anything about selling her?

SCHMUTZ: No.

VAN SUSTEREN: And is that something that would probably stand out in your mind?

SCHMUTZ: Oh, yes. And it's something that I probably would have mentioned to other people around that time, friends of mine that I worked with. We were talking about the story, we were following it on the news. We couldn't get away from it.

VAN SUSTEREN: Between the time that he was arrested on June 9th, his graduation day, and March, when I came to Aruba and had an interview with Joran and met you for the first time, did you have any communication with Joran at all?

SCHMUTZ: Not that I can recall, and I'm not even sure if, because he was a graduating senior, they took their finals early, if they were even in school that second week during the investigation. So I don't even know if I saw him.

VAN SUSTEREN: Was there talk at all at the school--have you ever heard any talk anywhere, including any rumors, about Natalee being sold? Has that ever crossed your radar screen?

SCHMUTZ: No. We basically followed the story through the media. Most of our information -- we didn't know anything that the media already knew or was telling us. So we didn't know anything unique.

VAN SUSTEREN: So people weren't -- you didn't have your ear to the ground and hear different things about it?

SCHMUTZ: Well, we went home for the summer right after his arrest. We left I think three days later. So I followed the story through your coverage.

VAN SUSTEREN: And then you went back in the fall?

SCHMUTZ: Then we went back in the fall. And within I don't know, a few weeks after our return, he was released. And then he went over to Holland to go to school.

And at that point, the story kind of slowed down. There were moments when it came back up again in the media, but we didn't talk about it, really.

VAN SUSTEREN: So his statement to us that he told you in the days after Natalee disappeared, that he sold Natalee, that's a lie?

SCHMUTZ: That's a conversation that I don't recall ever having with him. And whether it's a lie or he's associating me with somebody else that he had that conversation with, I don't know. I can't speak for Joran. But I never had that conversation with him.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN SUSTEREN: Now the catch. Could it have been a different teacher who Joran confided in and Joran tried to throw us off by pointing us to this teacher?

We have brand new information that it could be a different teacher. We will have that information for you on Monday.

And still ahead, what does the Aruban prosecutor Hans Mos say about what we have uncovered? We offered to fly and meet him to show him this tape. Does he think this tape is important and worth investigating? And what is next in the investigation? Stick around.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: More than three years after 18-year-old Natalee Holloway disappeared from Aruba, we have brand new information.

Joran van der Sloot, one of the last people spotted with Natalee Holloway on May 30, 2005, has come forward saying he sold Natalee for about $10,000. Joran says he took the cash and walked Natalee onto a mystery man's boat. We offered to meet with the Aruban prosecutor Hans Mos to show him the tapes of Joran's latest interview with us before we aired it. But the prosecutor declined our offer and said he does not feel the contents of the tape has any value as evidence.

But we urged Holland and the Aruban authorities to look into this latest information. Could Natalee Holloway still be alive? Could she really be in Venezuela? If there is even the smallest possibility, we urge the Aruban authorities to investigate.

Though Joran told us by email eight hours after our interview in Thailand that he was lying, we don't know if he was lying or telling the truth and later got cold feet. We do know there are significant clues the Aruban prosecutor can and should follow up upon.

If Aruba, with its subpoena and police power refuses to investigate, we'll do our best to keep investigating.

Thank you for being with us tonight. Good night.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,457715,00.html

[Blonde]

December 1st, 2008 4:09 PM Eastern
Trafficking - a REAL problem !
by Greta Van Susteren

As you know, unlike Aruba (or Holland), we are still trying to get information about what happened to Natalee Holloway. This American family should get answers..they deserve answers!  One theory - neither proved nor disproved - is that she was sold by Joran van der Sloot (that is what he recently told us on camera.)

What is interesting about this recent version of Joran is that the window of opportunity to having done something with her or to her is about 90 minutes.  It is easier to sell someone in 90 minutes, than it is to murder someone and successfully get rid of the body with NO forensic clues as to a murder.  It is not impossible to murder and get rid of the body in 90 minutes - but difficult (especially for a non planned murder.)  I have tried murder cases and investigated them, and it is not easy to kill someone and get rid of the body in a short period of time.

There are other interesting points - eg Joran and the Kalpoes were arrested June 9…and on June 29th, unknown to the 3, they were secretly taped in the backseat of a police car and they spoke of her as though she were alive.  If they had murdered her, why talk about her being alive 20 days after her suspected death?

And, of course, Joran gave us a taped conversation that he says is a conversation with his father in which his father talks about trafficking. Why was his father discussing trafficking? coincidence? fake tape?

Does trafficking REALLY happen? Below check out the cover letter by Secretary RIce on the State Department’s study of the problem.  In short, it is a GIANT and REAL problem (and we will have the Ambassador to the State Department who handles trafficking ON THE RECORD at 10pm tonight.) And yes, just because this is an GIANT and REAL problem does not mean that Natalee was sold as Joran now says….but it does suggest that Aruba and Holland should at least look at the possibility.

Holland and Aruba refuse to investigate.  They claim that they have already investigated…well, if that is true, why is the disappearance not solved? why give up?  Holland and Aruba want us all to ignore the disappearance of this American teen. Why? tourism? corruption?  I don’t know ..I would think they would want this disappearance solved.  I hope that anyone who has any power to push Holland into REALLY investigating to do so.  (As an aside, prostitution in Amsterdam is legal and the State Department report says that countries with legal prostitution have larger problems in trafficking than countries where it is not legal.)

If Aruba and Holland are so sure she was not sold, why not tell us the source of their certainty? All we want is information…evidence….we are not seeking to prove some crazy theory…we are just following every lead (which is what the Arubans and Dutch should be doing!)

ps - to the viewer who is complaining that I did not turn over the video of Joran to the Aruban police, let me tell you why: 1/ they have no interest in investigating this disappearance; 2/ Joran says that some were paid off and, if true, hardly the right ones to give the tape to 3/ I offered it to the prosecutor since he is a lawyer and I hoped that he, as an officer of the court, would be interested…

Now for Secretary Rice’s letter (and note, just because the problem exists worldwide does not mean Natalee was trafficked..but it does put a spotlight on the problem if we are talking about it..and that is a good thing)

http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/12/01/trafficking-a-real-problem/

   

[Blonde]

Will Holloway Suspect and Dad Be Arrested After 'On the Record' Interview?

Tuesday, December 02, 2008


The attorney for Natalee Holloway's family says Joran van der Sloot and his father should be arrested after Joran's most recent interview.

The attorney for Natalee Holloway's family says Joran van der Sloot and his father should be arrested after Joran's most recent interview.



This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," December 1, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: Joran van der Sloot told us on tape that he sold Natalee Holloway on a beach in Aruba for about $10,000. Well, Joran now says he was lying to us. Well, was he, or did he get cold feet having told us? One person wants action and wants it now, the Holloway family lawyer, John Q. Kelly.

In a letter to the Aruban prosecutor given to us by the family of Natalee Holloway, Kelly says, in part, "A newly released videotape of Joran van der Sloot making statements against penal interests (admitting to kidnapping, human trafficking, conspiracy and other crimes) to Greta Van Susteren is readily available ... and independently corroborated by the undisputed fact that he was the last person with Natalee when she vanished from the beach by the fisherman's huts. That, coupled with the fact that he initially fabricated demonstrably false accounts as to what happened to Natalee ... and was accused by the Kalpoes of engaging in criminal conduct in Natalee's disappearance ... in a June 29, 2005, surreptitiously recorded audiotape, all provide a more than sufficient legal basis for the immediate issuance of an arrest warrant for Joran van der Sloot." Kelly says there is enough evidence to arrest Paulus van der Sloot and Deepak and Satish Kalpoe.
Related
Column Archive
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President-elect Obama's Administration Shaping Up: A Closer Look
Letterman's Not-So-Arousing Joke About Gov. Palin: Is It Sexist?



Now, will the Aruban prosecutor agree? Let's ask your legal panel. Joining us, Jim Hammer, former assistant DA of San Francisco, and criminal defense attorneys Ted Williams and Bernie Grimm.

Jim, you also went down there and confronted Paulus for us with the tapes, or at least made available some of the information. What do you think -- knowing the standard in Aruba, which is less than here in the United States, what do you think about the John Q. Kelly letter that the family gave us?

JIM HAMMER, FORMER ASSISTANT SAN FRANCISCO DA: Well, I think even under their loose standard, you could lock up Joran, but I think there's nothing to hold him with in that. I don't think we can put any faith in anything he says. I think the most damning thing, though, is said by Paulus, his father, the one I confronted down there. At the end of that entire tape, he says, Listen, keep your mouth shut, essentially, Keep it secret, don't cooperate with the authorities. I think that's a clear case of conspiracy to obstruct justice, to keep the truth from the authorities. For a lawyer to do that, Greta, is damning, and he ought to be arrested.

VAN SUSTEREN: Bernie, the most peculiar aspect of this -- I mean, we set out to prove or disprove what Joran told us. We don't know if that -- when he told us -- he told us -- he made us a statement about sale, then eight hours later says that's a lie. We don't know if he got cold feet and suddenly wished he hadn't said it, or if, indeed, it was a lie.

Joran was arrested on June 9, '05. On June 29, '05, the letter that John Q. -- or the tape that John Q. Kelly refers to in this letter is the three are in the back of a police truck and don't know that they're being recorded, and they talk about her as though she were alive.

BERNIE GRIMM, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes, you know, you mentioned that before we started the show. And to me, the statements that are most damning -- and I think Jim Hammer would agree with me -- are statements that people naturally make when there is no motive to lie and there is...

HAMMER: Exactly.

Watch Greta's interview

GRIMM: ... They don't know they're being recorded and it's just said in a natural sort of element. That to me is compelling. Now, consider the fact that's not going to get him locked up, and this last statement that he made to you, it's -- I thought that it was a tremendous effort there, but I simply don't believe him because he's (INAUDIBLE) I mean, he could say Ted did it tomorrow, so...

VAN SUSTEREN: But I don't -- I don't -- but the thing is, it's not a question of whether you believe him or not believe him because that's not the issue. The issue is whether a prosecutor should go out and either attempt to prove or disprove what he has said. And one of the things that we supplied was a chip that Joran says is a conversation with his father, and which you talk about yourself is a conversation with his father, assuming it to be authentic -- and I have -- you know, I wish the prosecutor would either authenticate it or disprove it -- he didn't know that he was going to be taped. And they actually talk about trafficking and actually talk about it being a bad thing. And that's a perfect example.

TED WILLIAMS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: But Greta, there is a dichotomy between re-arresting somebody and corroborating evidence. I believe that everything that's in your interview needs to be corroborated. I think that the Aruban authorities need to follow up on the leads. But should there be a re-arrest right now? I do not believe that they would be able to hold Joran at this time and I don't believe in a re-arrest.

VAN SUSTEREN: I will tell you that here in the United States, they probably would not have enough. But they have a much lesser standard in Aruba when we were down there. And the one thing that needs to be done is that chip. If that chip that Joran van der Sloot gave us of his father, then that's a whole different story if that is, indeed, an authentic one.

WILLIAMS: Well, not only that, what about the Western Union calls? What about the cell phones? All of those things could be corroborated by the authorities down there if they will investigate it.

VAN SUSTEREN: I'm just saying that what they -- under the law in Aruba, to arrest someone, since the standard is ever so slight -- frankly, I don't agree with the standard being ever so slight. But Jim, if it turns out that that -- that that conversation was an authentic -- was a real one between Joran and his father, at a time when he wouldn't have known it was taped, and it is his father...

HAMMER: Boy...

VAN SUSTEREN: ... Then that's whole -- then there's problems for Paulus.

HAMMER: Then...

VAN SUSTEREN: If, if.

HAMMER: Then this -- if that's true and it's authenticated, Greta, this is the craziest case we've ever talked about. I mean, and the thing that still troubles me is, give me another scenario by which his father would have uttered the words "human trafficking." I mean, it is such a distinctive thing to come out of his father's mouth. But the last thing, Greta, rather than do an arrest right now, they ought to do the spade work, the hard work of corroboration. If those wire transfers could be proven, Greta, together with his story, then we've got a real, real dynamite piece of evidence here.

VAN SUSTEREN: And of course, but the thing is that you've got to have a willingness to either prove or disprove. And if you're not even going to bother to do either, you're never going to find out.

GRIMM: Yes, I know what your point is, which is, you know, let the cards fall where they may. He gets found guilty, not guilty, but at least do the legwork. And I think what Jim's saying -- you know, people think -- and a lot of our people think cases are made by the CSI stuff. It's not. It's out knocking on doors, doing the legwork, serving subpoenas, getting cell phone records, Western Union records, all this stuff...

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: If that chip is the real deal, that changes everything.

GRIMM: Wow.

VAN SUSTEREN: Everything completely. But you got to at least -- if, if it's the real deal. But that's -- Joran is telling us that it is. I don't know. Anyway, panel, stand by.

Up next: Two friends of the Holloway family give you important information about Natalee's disappearance. They spoke to Joran's former headmaster on Aruba. What might this headmaster know?

Then: Our interview with Joran van der Sloot is creating big waves tonight in Aruba. The Aruban minister of justice is paying attention, talking about the interview. He doesn't sound happy. Now, cross your fingers. This might be good news, but maybe not for the prosecutor. And your legal panel will return.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,460108,00.html

[2NJSons_Mom]

Holloway Cover-up By Aruban Law Enforcement?
Friday , December 05, 2008




This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," December 4, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: John Q. Kelly, you have a voicemail. Well, the lawyer for Natalee Holloway's family has been trying to get Aruban's chief prosecutor, Hans Mos. Well, Mos finally returned Mr. Kelly's call, and apparently left John Kelly a rather nasty voicemail. John Q. Kelly is with us.

John, let's get some timing, first of all. When did you send that letter asking to have the arrest? When was that sent?

JOHN Q. KELLY, ATTORNEY FOR HOLLOWAY FAMILY: Eight days ago. It would have been last Wednesday.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Get a response?

KELLY: No response to the letter. First phone call back was today, my cell phone.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. When did you get -- when did you last make a phone call to Hans Mos?

KELLY: Yesterday morning.

VAN SUSTEREN: Before -- yesterday morning?

KELLY: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: And I take it you said, Call me back, right?

KELLY: Yes.

VAN SUSTEREN: OK. So what was your voicemail that met you today? What'd you get?

KELLY: Oh, I wouldn't call it nasty. I would say it was curt. He was clearly angry. And it was just basically two things. One, he said it was unfortunate, what I said about him on your show the other night, which, whatever it was, I stand by it 100 percent. And the second thing was, basically, Don't hold your breath on the letter you wrote me.

But Greta, this is petty stuff. Let me tell you, there's incredible news out of Aruba and the Netherlands today. And I don't know if you're aware of it. The minister of justice, Rudy Croes, has now come out and publicly said that the police chief at the time in Aruba when Natalee Holloway disappeared, Jan van der Straaten, was clearly complicit with Paulus van der Sloot in covering up for Joran in the initial days after Natalee's disappearance. He's calling for a whole new investigation, and he's basically, by stating that, corroborating what Joran told you in talking to you.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. Well, I'm delighted that the minister of justice is finally doing that. But any clue why he waited three-and-a-half years, when the trail is really cold?

KELLY: Well, it's remarkable. None of this is about Natalee and a missing young women, and you know, parents without child. It's a bunch of ego stuff right now. It's Van der Straaten apparently criticized the police investigators, his own investigators, this week. Rudy Croes in turn then came out and said, “What's Van der Straaten talking about?” He's the one that covered up with Paulus van der Sloot. We have a whole trail of phone calls between Van der Straaten and Van der Sloot in terms of what happened in the days after Natalee's disappearance. Van der Straaten, he went on to say, used his second-rate investigation team to -- to check into Natalee's disappearance initially and just, you know, covered the whole thing up, deliberately hindered the prosecution and investigation into Natalee's disappearance.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right...

KELLY: Between Paulus van der Sloot and the chief of police...

VAN SUSTEREN: All right. You and I are having a nice, sort of calm-voice conversation, but the headline is the minister of justice in Aruba now admits there was a cover-up.

KELLY: Between the chief of police and Paulus van der Sloot, yes. For starters.

VAN SUSTEREN: And Hans Mos, his reaction to this is to leave you a voicemail saying he didn't like what you said on TV the other night and basically, “Don't hold your breath waiting for an answer.”

KELLY: Right. And now we have more new evidence. We have clear evidence of the cover-up between the chief of police and Paulus van der Sloot in addition to the damning admissions made by Joran van der Sloot of criminal conduct, the kidnapping and trafficking and the implication of others.

You know what, Greta? Just going back to your conversation with Joran on tape, everybody's saying, Well, why don't you get an exemplar of Paulus's voice, and things like that. You know what? Hey, Paulus, why don't you stick your head out the front door and say, That's not my voice and I didn't have that conversation with my son, and end all this?

Kalpoes have been dead silent. Joran certainly hasn't come to bat for his father or anybody else in this thing. I know he's tuned into all this. And you know, it's just unbelievable. You've got a 21-year-old woman who might be out there terrified, helpless, being told nobody cares, nobody's looking for you, and you have all these people over in Aruba pointing the finger at each other now and forgetting about what it's all about.

VAN SUSTEREN: And it's, like, Holland, where are you? What's Holland doing? This is part of their kingdom. They're doing nothing. The prosecutor's now worried about you saying something about him not returning phone calls, and you've got the minister of justice admitting that there is a cover-up. Paulus van der Sloot won't give an exemplar and stick his head out the door. So basically -- I don't know. Shoot me, John. It's just, like -- I cannot believe the -- the...

KELLY: Oh, it's unbelievable.

VAN SUSTEREN: ... Unbelievable cruelty on the part of all these people. Shame on them.

KELLY: And then, to end it all, Rudy Croes complained about the Netherlands not backing up Aruba, you know, with international moral support after he admits that his own police department was in a complicit cover-up.

VAN SUSTEREN: All right, John...

KELLY: Greta, last thing. This is a stain on Aruba, a horrible stain...

VAN SUSTEREN: A stain? It's worse than that!

KELLY: It's getting...

VAN SUSTEREN: A stain...

KELLY: ... Bigger. It's getting bigger darker. They're the only ones that can clean it up, and they'd better do something soon because it's only getting worse.

VAN SUSTEREN: John, thank you.

KELLY: Sure, Greta.

VAN SUSTEREN: Up next: As you heard, the justice minister of Aruba is admitting something disturbing, incredibly disturbing. He says there's a cover-up. Finally, this could blow the lid off this investigation if they'd ever get off their whatever and want to investigate. A live report from Aruba is next.

And then -- uh-oh! Nude photos of underage cheerleaders cause a huge controversy in Seattle. That's coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

VAN SUSTEREN: Finally, maybe, the Aruban Justice Minister is talking. It has been three and a half years. Joining by phone from Aruba is Jossy Mansur, publisher and managing editor of Diario Newspaper.

Jossy, what did the justice minister say, and does it have any impact whatsoever in Aruba?

JOSSY MANSUR, DIARIO NEWSPAPER IN ARUBA: He is saying a lot of important things that have a lot of impact in Aruba. He has openly and publicly accused the ex-chief of police that he refused to arrest Joran van der Sloot because he was the son of his best friend, Paulus.

VAN SUSTEREN: And does that make any difference to anybody in Aruba?

MANSUR: It does make a difference to many people here in Aruba, of course, because coming from the minister of justice, who was in charge of the police--he is the director of the police corps and (INAUDIBLE) that occupied themselves with the disappearance of Natalee. Of course it's important.

VAN SUSTEREN: Does he have any proof that the chief of police did this or that there was a cover-up?

MANSUR: He does not have any proof as such outside of other declarations(ph) of other people who have heard the same kind of statement before.

VAN SUSTEREN: Is our interview with Joran van der Sloot pushing any investigation further. Are they taking it at all seriously because they still haven't asked for it? They haven't asked for the records that we think could either prove or disprove. But is it having any impact whatsoever in Aruba?

MANSUR: I think it had a lot of impact worldwide. We saw this man lie again, lie his head off. He doesn't care if it's publicly or whatever. And I think that it has not stirred the prosecution to the degree that they should be after him by now.

VAN SUSTEREN: In the conversation that we had with Joran, he claims that the voice on the tape is his father. And obviously the prosecutor could prove that or disprove that. He could use subpoena power and do that. We can't get a first-generation tape from his father and do that.

Is it likely that the prosecutor will do that? Because, frankly, if it turns out that is his voice, his father under what he said is up to his eyeballs in something.

MANSUR: Of course. We know he was involved from the beginning. And after the new wave of things(ph), Mr. Herman, who saw Joran walking with his clothes all muddy. And then later he was saw him in the car with Paulus van der Sloot.

And we assume, and it has been certified by this man that the man who took Joran van der Sloot to his home that night after Natalee disappeared was his father. So he was involved from the beginning.

VAN SUSTEREN: Jossy, thank you, and we hope that there is a full, fair, and complete investigation some time. Thank you, Jossy.

MANSUR: OK.

VAN SUSTEREN: Let's bring in our panel. Joining us live are criminal defense attorneys Michael Cardoza, Ted Williams, and Bernie Grimm. Michael, do you want to start?

MICHAEL CARDOZA, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Sure. Does this surprise me that there is something of a cover-up? No. It is a small island. What the minister of defense is saying makes absolute sense to me.

And we have known this right from the get-go. We knew there was some sort of delay, cover-up. They wait 10 days before they arrest Joran.

What should they do now? The Dutch really should step in. I am a little bit suspect of the minister of justice, because he waits this long to come forward and say something. Why did he wait this long?

Everybody is pointing fingers now at each other, but somebody neutral has to come in and resolve this. They have enough to prosecute this case. And this kid is hateful(ph).

VAN SUSTEREN: Michael, earlier this morning on Gretawire I posted asking them to contact the Dutch embassy to finally get them to do something. And a lot of people have contacted the Dutch embassy. I have to go back and read the comments, but the Dutch embassy here in the United States does need to since this is part of the kingdom.

All right, Bernie, this is what slays me, that Hans Mos is more concerned about what John Q. Kelly says on TV about him then even to look at the tape, investigate any of this stuff. It is stunning to me.

BERNIE GRIMM, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: It would be as if Eric Holder got offended that somebody said something about a department of justice investigation, a civil rights investigation in Mississippi, and he called the person and said, "Do not leave those messages. You are upsetting me."

I do not know what to say. I can't say it even on FOX, this racy, classy network, that I want to say.

But either the Dutch or the FBI, someone with some level of competence needs to get involved instead of us just playing tennis from the baseline here.

TED WILLIAMS, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: I talked about the word "corroboration" in this investigation. Rudy Croes has come out, Greta, and represented that there was a cover-up with this Van der Straaten and Paulus.

Now, if you remember, a few nights ago, you interviewed someone who had gone down to Aruba who can corroborate, and this is what one of your viewers who came on this show said-Van der Straaten told us, he said, quote, "I do not think I could arrest my best friend's son. I am his godfather, and I honestly don't think he is guilty. He is a witness."

This was somebody independent of that island that you talked to on this show, and that person has now corroborated.

So there is some nexus, and I really believe that clearly there is a cover-up.

VAN SUSTEREN: Bernie, what it is? Why won't they do this? You would think they have a sense of decency. There is a lot of missing persons all over the world, but they are worried about being insulted on TV.

GRIMM: It seems that they've dug their heels in, and Natalee has become the non-issue in the case. And their position and self- righteousness and soapbox position with the media seems to be what they are obsessing about.

VAN SUSTEREN: Maybe that's now, but go back to June '05. This was the same way in June of '05 before they even met us. It is stunning.

GRIMM: It is troubling. From the outset, when Van der Sloot and his boy said, "Listen. The black guys did it," after that everything was downhill.

WILLIAMS: Bernie, there's a bottom line here. The Dutch need to get involved. The Netherlands need to have an independent investigation. They cannot police themselves on that island.

VAN SUSTEREN: Michael, you have 15 seconds and we have to go.

CARDOZA: You know what's so hateful about this-

VAN SUSTEREN: A lot.

CARDOZA: --Is that this kid says-a lot, you're right-but this kid says that she's dead it, she died in his arms. And then later, he says, "Oh, no. She is alive, and she is in Venezuela." Think how the parents feel here. They ought to--

VAN SUSTEREN: Stop right there, Michael, come on. Then 30 days later he is having a conversation that's taped, and he's talking about her as though she's alive. And this prosecutor would not do anything. The police would not do anything. The minister of justice would not do anything. They have been dragging their heels.

CARDOZA: Agreed.

VAN SUSTEREN: Holland is not doing anything. They're all doing nothing because they don't care and they want this to go away.

CARDOZA: They have enough to prosecute this case. They have enough to prosecute him now.

VAN SUSTEREN: They're worried about telephone calls -

(CROSSTALK)

VAN SUSTEREN: It's horrible.







Content and Programming Copyright 2008 FOX News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Transcription Copyright 2008 ASC LLC (www.ascllc.net), which takes sole responsibility for the accuracy of the transcription. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. No license is granted to the user of this material except for the user's personal or internal use and, in such case, only one copy may be printed, nor shall user use any material for commercial purposes or in any fashion that may infringe upon FOX News Network, LLC'S and ASC LLC's copyrights or other proprietary rights or interests in the material. This is not a legal transcript for purposes of litigation.










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http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,462349,00.html

[Blonde]

Holloway Attorney: Pleas for Arrest Met With 'Deafening Silence'

Wednesday, December 03, 2008



Holloway attorney John Q. Kelly says his requests for arrests after Joran van der Sloot's "On the Record" interview have been ignored.

This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," December 2, 2008. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: "Arrest them." That's what the lawyer for Natalee Holloway's family told the Aruban prosecutor. Joran van der Sloot told us "On the Record" that he sold Natalee Holloway on a beach in Aruba.

He also named names, including his own father.

Then Joran e-mailed us that he made the whole story up. Did he make it up, or did he send that email because he panicked after he realized what he told us on camera.

Now the Holloway family lawyer John Q. Kelly wants action. In a letter to Aruban Chief Prosecutor Hans Mos, Kelly calls for the arrest of Joran van der Sloot. Joran's father Paulus and the Kalpoe brothers are also included.

John Q. Kelly joins us. And John Q. Kelly, I hope you're not mad because we got the letter out of your client.

JOHN Q. KELLY, HOLLOWAY FAMILY ATTORNEY: That letter went out last Wednesday.
Related

VAN SUSTEREN: I know. I got my hands on it a day or two ago, or last week.

KELLY: Sure.

VAN SUSTEREN: It's your letter. What do you want from Hans Mos, and what have you heard from him?

KELLY: Nothing but deafening silence out of Aruba. No, I haven't heard from him.

The point of the letter was, and if you remember last year, Greta, with great fanfare and press releases, and, you know, just all kinds of dog and pony show, they arrested the Kalpoe brothers and Joran for absolutely no reason, no new evidence. Just picked them up and held them for a month.

And now they have new evidence. You have a damning confession by Joran as to serious criminal conduct he engaged in, implicates others. And they haven't done anything with it. And everything Joran has said is consistent with the facts as we know them right now.

VAN SUSTEREN: I go through this, and here are your options--that he had nothing to do with it, that it was an intentional murder, which is unlikely, because there doesn't seem to be any evidence of plans, there is no forensic evidence to show a murder--and I have handled murder cases, and so have you--that was an accidental thing, like a drug overdose or alcohol.

But then, why not leave her? You don't hide the body if you have nothing to do with it. Or he sold her.

KELLY: And in selling her, her just going off the island, vanishing, is most consistent with what he said. You don't intentionally murder someone with no forethought and be able to dispose of them when you're 17 years old and have probably have an hour timeframe there. If he panicked or if there was anything accidental, even if you do not admit it at the time, you realize you're in a mess after the facts, and you fess up.

But, Greta, people have to realize this is the first time he has directly implicated himself. The other times it has been an accident, someone else got rid of the body. It wasn't anything he did, it was everybody else.

Now he is saying, "It was me, it was the Kalpoes, it was my father." And those are damning, and it is not up to Hans Mos or the Aruban investigators to make a decision that they don't want to follow up on it-- judge his credibility and not look at the facts surrounding it and not follow through on it.

Watch Greta's interview

VAN SUSTEREN: He also at least represented to us that the tape that he gave us, or chip, whatever you want to call it, is a conversation with his father probably January of this year in which where his father talks about trafficking, talks about that he did a bad thing, assuming that it is his father.

But what I don't understand is why hasn't Hans Mos asked us or even asked you for that chip so that he can at least begin to authenticate it? And, instead, what you tell me is you have had silence.

KELLY: Great, I'd like to think that I can call Han Mos tomorrow morning and tell him to get ready to pack up everything you have and take a trip down to Aruba.

VAN SUSTEREN: This is the story. Either he has gone on vacation, which is always a possibility, or he is incompetent, or he is corrupt.

KELLY: I think incompetent would almost be kind. There are sinister things going on. They have just, you know, avoided too much, and they make every effort to disprove anything that inculpatory(ph) in this whole matter here.

And people talk about the timing of the tape, that it came out in November. But if you released the day after you had it, what would they have done differently that they are not doing now? It's total inaction.

VAN SUSTEREN: Can I tell you? We have been the only people investigating this. To turn that tape over when we got it to the Aruban police, we would be insane. These people have done nothing to investigate it.

It would be absolutely insane to turn it over to people that I think have been incompetent at best at investigation. That is the first thing.

The second thing is that if people only knew the behind-the-scenes efforts we have been doing to corroborate it. People can have all sorts of imagination that they want, but I can tell you and anyone will listen, is that we have this information. We are willing to turn it over to the Aruban prosecutor.

He does not want to see it. They do not want to solve this or make any attempt to either prove this or disproved this.

KELLY: Greta, anyone that thinks that Joran called you out of the blue and asked you to meet him in Bangkok to confess to this is being unrealistic.

I know that there were months of cat and mouse, investigative work, timing issues, all kinds of things that went into that taping. There were conversations beforehand.

And if I were Hans Mos, I would say, "Greta, how did this evolve? What conversations did you have? What planning went into this? How did you go about going over there and talking to him? Do you have other footage we haven't seen? Did you talk to them off of the record? Did you talk to him afterwards? Who else spoke to him? Is this the account given before?"

He is just ignoring the whole issue, and it is a shame. And, quite frankly, we are not going away.

VAN SUSTEREN: It's more than it's a shame. Come on. This is an American missing. This is a family that is entitled to better answers. I they will not investigate, at least if we are bringing it, they ought to have the guts or the courage to look at what we do.

But this is what I don't get-what is Holland problem? Holland has responsibility in this too. And Holland is just sitting up there I don't know how many thousands of miles away from Aruba looking the other way, refusing anyone just to look at this information.

I don't know if it is crazy or not, but we have it, and they will not do anything.

KELLY: I agree. And, as we say, we're not going away. Beth and Dave or any parent out there watching, to just think that if their child was missing, there was a one in one in a million chance that they could still be alive somewhere. And, believe me, there is no evidence to the contrary that Natalee Holloway is not possibly alive somewhere, to think for one second these parents would let go of this is just sorely mistaken.

VAN SUSTEREN: Based on the Aruban law, it does not take a lot to arrest someone--any new evidence. And my offer remains. I will be happy to meet Hans Mos halfway, show him everything we have. The offer remains.

I do not know how to get him to answer your telephone calls. I wish Beth would start calling her U.S. senators. I hope she raises holy hell with the state department for help or somebody just to look at it if nothing more.

KELLY: I will be making a phone call tomorrow morning, so we will take it from there.

VAN SUSTEREN: If you pick up the telephone and called Hans, does he take your call?

KELLY: He usually gets back to me at some point.

VAN SUSTEREN: What is "some point"?

KELLY: It takes a little while.

VAN SUSTEREN: Like a day or so?

KELLY: Sometimes it might be a couple of days, sometimes it might be a week. Sometimes you have to follow up with a fax letter, too, and rattle the cage a little bit to get an answer.

But, you know, he is comfortable saying that he talks to me. I beg to differ with the line of communication.

VAN SUSTEREN: I will tell you that every single prosecutor that is listening to this right now in the country is just shaking his or her head, because that is so insane. It is just appalling. This is not the way it is supposed to be done or is done.

Well, whatever. Anyway --

KELLY: They have got enough to arrest him again, no question.

VAN SUSTEREN: And that's what you've asked for. Who do you want arrested--Paulus and the Kalpoes and Joran?

KELLY: Yes. I think an arrest warrant issued for Joran because he is out of the country. We always have a pretty good idea of where he is and what he's doing. The Kalpoes are still there. Paulus is there. Pick him up like they did last year, for no reason. Now they have a reason.

VAN SUSTEREN: Now they have a reason. Plus, if you look at Gretawire.com, we got an e-mail from someone, and I do not know if it is true or not, but I posted it on gretawire.com, that Joran was seen last night at a casino in Manila.

John, thank you.

KELLY: OK, Greta.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,460908,00.html