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Author Topic: Lively Case Discussion #530 10/7 - 10/11/2006  (Read 119927 times)
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Shizaru
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« Reply #840 on: October 11, 2006, 10:37:45 AM »

Deepak said that when Joran called him he said he was walking home and in the vicinity of the McDonalds.  If he was as far as the McDonalds, and truly was walking, I think he must have left the beach around 10 minutes earlier at least? I was just reading in Dave's book that the Bird Sanctuary is right by the McDonalds and it would be easy to lose your shoes in there.  Is there a map showing relative locations of Marriott, McDonalds, and Bird Sanctuary?
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mrs. red
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« Reply #841 on: October 11, 2006, 10:42:09 AM »

NM... that's very interesting... thanks for bringing it up...
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« Reply #842 on: October 11, 2006, 10:48:56 AM »

Nativelingo posted on 6/15/2005:

Sometime last year, ther was an incident about a homemade porn movie involving a 14 year old….not a gang bang, but she did in fact have sex with different boys on the video/dvd….neither Joran or brothers were involved, but they may have copied and sold copies…ALOT of boys sold copies…..
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San
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« Reply #843 on: October 11, 2006, 10:53:19 AM »

Quote from: "mrs. red"
NM... that's very interesting... thanks for bringing it up...

It is very interesting.  Those posts prove that many many people knew what happened to Natalee.  It is not limited to only 5-6 people.  They knew where she was buried all the while.
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Anna
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« Reply #844 on: October 11, 2006, 11:01:28 AM »

Quote from: "NM"
Everyone ready for this.  I found these early FP posts. I started w/ the link that Sharron posted yesterday. Thanks Sharron.

These posts are regarding the unfair, horrible and corrupt way the "leaders" and ale treated the family and this case. Posts June 11, 2005 2PM when MSM was broadcasting the confession, the ale denying confession and MSM reporting Nat dead and body found.


http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2005/06/11/natalee-holloway-information-ix/

#242 NativeLingo posts: last night police had decoys pulling the press in all directions....they will avoid a media orgy at all costs....ia
#283 Leila posts: Indeed multiple efforts at the same time, decoy....
#323 Friend of Mickey John posts: ..... BHT....The poor woman prob had to be press decoy....

Also, on this thread there was an obnoxious poster named former sheriff's deputy
#139 NativeLingo asks if poster deputy is JACOB

(was she referring to Dennis Jacobs??)

Then on the next FP
http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2005/06/11/natalee-holloway-information-x/
#48  NativeLingo calls former sheriff's deputy OSAMA…how sick is that! you freak

(I could not find any earlier ref to osama then)

#56 former sheriff's deputy posts: I did not post under the osama name. I am a former sheriff's deputy. that is a fact. I predicted the outcome dys ago.



Good Morning, all,

NM, I remember hearing lots of things in the early days that I no longer am able to find as in transcripts, etc.  Once I heard a member of ALE laughing about giving the wrong information to the press.  I think he gave wrong information to Geraldo about something.  The ALE thought it would be funny and would some how discredit Geraldo instead of his lying self.

He seemed to think if Geraldo reported something wrong, we would all just tune out and not believe Geraldo about anything any more if he did this.

That is just how foolish they were early on.  Likely others here heard that as well.  Native Lingo supposedly popped in at the Dark Side recently discussing the killing of his own dog by Joran.  Funny how things change over time and she is no longer stating that as a fact as before.

I knew something was amiss when NL posted that it was a different M Posner in Aruba, not the known mob boss.  She may really have believed that.  Or not.  And Aruba girl posts on that sports gambling site so I wonder if that is their interest in presenting only a certain side to things.  Looking out for Posner?  Even if not directly involved, he is one of the biggest fish in that pond and anything that effects Aruba as a whole effects him as well, IMHO, just because of his large investment there if nothing else.

.
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All posts reflect my opinion only and are not shared by all forum members nor intended as statement of facts.  I am doing the best I can with the information available.

Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
nonesuche
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« Reply #845 on: October 11, 2006, 11:01:47 AM »

Hi All-

Call-out to Shellbell, I am so terribly sorry to hear of your loss. I did visit your myspace page and feel your pain, I wish you strength and support as you deal with such a tragedy. You will stay in our prayers daily.

NM & San-

If only every post like those had been catalogued in some huge spreadsheet to review, but who knew we were dealing with the underbelly of the devil at that point?

Hindsight is 20/20......some things never change.
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I continue to stand with the girl.
Anna
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« Reply #846 on: October 11, 2006, 11:13:10 AM »

Quote from: "klaasend"
Nativelingo posted on 6/15/2005:

Sometime last year, ther was an incident about a homemade porn movie involving a 14 year old….not a gang bang, but she did in fact have sex with different boys on the video/dvd….neither Joran or brothers were involved, but they may have copied and sold copies…ALOT of boys sold copies…..


Well, what exactly do you call having sex with different boys if not gangbang?  Excuuuuse me!  Guess my porn terminology is lacking but that is what I would call it.  Different boys = gang.  

I still think this was in the works for Natalee but something bad happened and probably prevented their little production.  Deepak stopping at nearby bar to let the others know the deal was a go, etc. Ask Freddy, he must tell the truth, the one arrested for prior activity.  But then all is just forgotten and Freddie released and nothing more said except by Anita claiming it was just a nice home video of a girl in a bikini.

They really are accustomed to some elitist Dutch telling them what to think in Aruba, aren't they.  Too bad it doesn't work for us as well, Anita.  We just think you are a big fat liar who wears see through blouses cause you would like to be a porn star yourself.   Evil or Very Mad
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All posts reflect my opinion only and are not shared by all forum members nor intended as statement of facts.  I am doing the best I can with the information available.

Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
sharon
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« Reply #847 on: October 11, 2006, 11:22:40 AM »

Quote from: "NM"
Everyone ready for this.  I found these early FP posts. I started w/ the link that Sharron posted yesterday. Thanks Sharron.



yw NM.

Very powerful stuff.

Back when there were some truths being dispersed amongst all the diversions.

Especially since there was never a way for a poster to 'edit' their posts on the FP.
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Ono
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« Reply #848 on: October 11, 2006, 11:39:48 AM »

Quote from: "Anna"
.
Again, they knew they could lie all they wanted because Natalee would never be there to contradict their little fantasy.  I do not see Joran even "helping" Ruth or any of the girls in the Casino.  I don't believe he did that and I don't believe anybody called him their Lucky Charm. At least not on this escapade, maybe one from the past, one of the twenty Joran brags about.   I have to see that from the person who said it and that would be Ruth?  But I have never read anywhere that she did.  I once read one of the other girls said it was Ruth he helped but was it really or did she mean Ruth was the one playing and if anybody was helped it would have to be her?

So with his IQ off the chart, but off the bottom--wrong end--Joran forgot the girlfriends could counter that claim.  But how cold blooded to try to work in something to enhance his lousy reputation as a card player into his lying about a girl who has disappeared.   Evil or Very Mad Natalee was not even playing and did not know how according to her friends.  How would any kid lose her father's money anyway?  Did she pick his pocket or rob her parents as Joran was fond of doing to his?

So they could lie about this knowing no one was alive who could call them on it.  Lie about the cards, lie about the sharks, lie about the slaves, lie about Natalee saying that about living on a plantation but evidently they had seen Gone With the Wind at some point in time, lie about Hitler's Sister's Daughter (for the Love of All that is Holy!!) and lie about one finger, lie about two fingers, lie about the lighthouse, lie about when  where and if Natalee was sleeping and what she did.  And lastly lie about dropping her off at the HI.

Deepak helped cook this up, Satish had no problem and did not even seem to wonder why they were lying.  But no one said Wait!  When Natalee returns, she is going to say that's a lie~ we better not say that nor make that claim.

So how did they know their lies were safe?  They knew, all three of them, that there was no Natalee to come back and call them on those lies.  Deepak even lied to some kid on IM about Natalee putting her hands in his pants.  How did he know she wouldn't turn up next day and call him a big skinny liar?  How did any of them know this?  They knew what happened to her and that she was never going to show up and do anything ever again.   Evil or Very Mad  Sad  Evil or Very Mad

And Paulus and Anita know this.  They live with and appear to condone it in their oldest son.  Anita says Natalee should never have gotten in that car like that.  Why?  Does she know her son is not an honorable person?  Sure sounds that way to me.

Now this is a rant.   Very Happy

IMHO~Anna


Now this is a GREAT post and bears repeating !! Sums it all up. Kudos.
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lili
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« Reply #849 on: October 11, 2006, 11:50:50 AM »

Do you have an email address that I can email?
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Ono
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« Reply #850 on: October 11, 2006, 11:51:05 AM »

Quote from: "Shellbell"
I know many of you may not remember me but I was wanting for yall to keep me in your prayers.  My boyfriend of 6 years was killed in a car accident Sat morning.  I know this is not the place, but his pic and stuff is on my website.  www.myspace.com/michelesworld


Am so sorry  Crying or Very sad ~ That is a nice website. He looks like a lovely person.
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klaasend
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« Reply #851 on: October 11, 2006, 11:52:39 AM »

Quote from: "lili"
Do you have an email address that I can email?

Hi Lili - who are you wanting to email?

You can email me at:  smklaasend@hotmail.com

That's a temporary email address I've set up.
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NM
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« Reply #852 on: October 11, 2006, 12:05:04 PM »

Quote from: "klaasend"
Nativelingo posted on 6/15/2005:

Sometime last year, ther was an incident about a homemade porn movie involving a 14 year old….not a gang bang, but she did in fact have sex with different boys on the video/dvd….neither Joran or brothers were involved, but they may have copied and sold copies…ALOT of boys sold copies…..

Hey Klaas and Anna,
This story I believe from intuition and based on other info we've expirienced. Diario articles on sex vids in hotel rooms, and gang rape at a school, jurin's tickle site, etc.  

Geraldo reported this back in early June 2005.  I respect Geraldo from his coverage on Nat. He might seem like a PIA, but he is aggressive in getting info. And IMO

I bet that whole decoy thing was set up so that the ale and all of aruba could use that as a defense to claim that even found facts were just decoys.  More lies and confusion. It seems like an island way of life.
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Glenda wrote: "aruba's job was not to babysit Beth's daughter. Beth sent her daughter to swim with the sharks, she is responsible for what ever happened to Natalee." = there is no homicide in aruba, only SUICIDE.  Don't go to aruba if you value your life.
NM
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« Reply #853 on: October 11, 2006, 12:20:29 PM »

Quote from: "San"
Quote from: "mrs. red"
NM... that's very interesting... thanks for bringing it up...

It is very interesting.  Those posts prove that many many people knew what happened to Natalee.  It is not limited to only 5-6 people.  They knew where she was buried all the while.

Hey San!
Re-reading the FP from hours before the confession thru the next day, and w/ what we know now, you can't help but see that many, many were invovled. pvds and friends were flying by the seat of their pants, pulling in people. Then once anything was covered-up they had more leverage to cover-up more, and more and more.

Hi None!  I agree. There are so many posts to re-evaluate, it would be great if they could be organized. It woild be great "evidence" to support what we all know and knew of the quality of those people and that island.
I can't wait to return the "kindess" and "support" to them.
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Glenda wrote: "aruba's job was not to babysit Beth's daughter. Beth sent her daughter to swim with the sharks, she is responsible for what ever happened to Natalee." = there is no homicide in aruba, only SUICIDE.  Don't go to aruba if you value your life.
Anna
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« Reply #854 on: October 11, 2006, 12:22:05 PM »

NM, Sharon and All,

Would you post more about what you perceive these decoys to be like who did them or who ordered them be done, how were they done, why, etc.?

I find the whole concept so horribly dishonest I just can't imagine why they were into this kind of thing right from the start like this.  Is it cultural or what the heck???  Distract the media for what reasons?  Just to lie and trick us or defend the goons?

The whole idea of decoys just reeks, doesn't it?   Shocked Imagine the police in this country, Canada, the UK, anywhere normal doing "decoys" like this!  They'd be fired on the spot I do believe for deception at the least.

.
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All posts reflect my opinion only and are not shared by all forum members nor intended as statement of facts.  I am doing the best I can with the information available.

Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
NM
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« Reply #855 on: October 11, 2006, 12:44:32 PM »

Quote from: "Anna"
NM, Sharon and All,

Would you post more about what you perceive these decoys to be like who did them or who ordered them be done, how were they done, why, etc.?

I find the whole concept so horribly dishonest I just can't imagine why they were into this kind of thing right from the start like this.  Is it cultural or what the heck???  Distract the media for what reasons?  Just to lie and trick us or defend the goons?

The whole idea of decoys just reeks, doesn't it?   Shocked Imagine the police in this country, Canada, the UK, anywhere normal doing "decoys" like this!  They'd be fired on the spot I do believe for deception at the least.

.

Anna, great idea!  I'll be going back to where I left off yesterday and bring back more FP posts, and I'll get an eye out for anything pertaining to decoys.

I mean, how caring, professional, and compasionate of them.  Are they all mutants, some earlier form of un-evolved human?

aruba decoy island.
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Glenda wrote: "aruba's job was not to babysit Beth's daughter. Beth sent her daughter to swim with the sharks, she is responsible for what ever happened to Natalee." = there is no homicide in aruba, only SUICIDE.  Don't go to aruba if you value your life.
LilPuma
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« Reply #856 on: October 11, 2006, 12:48:09 PM »

Shellbell:  I'm sorry for you loss.  {{{{shellbell}}}}  


Re:  1006's post.  I agree there was a grudge involved.  I believe that Joran didn't like the MB kids, had a grudge because of GVC and his own minor run-in.  That's how Joran's mind works - they don't like the American kids, Joran thinks he is superior to everyone, is used to getting his way, not being stood up to.  How dare those MB kids act that way towards him.  I think Natalee was targeted because of GVC or whoever it was she rebuffed.  

Shizaru mentioned Joran saying Natalee wanted to look at the stars.  Shelby of New Jersey said that Joran had a list of 10 romantic things he wanted to do - one of them was sit and look at the stars.  We know that Joran attributes his own desires and motives to others, this is one example that isn't just our "profile" of the guy.  "She wanted me, wanted to see my house, wanted to come with me, didn't want to go back to her hotel" etc.  When asked why the Kalpoes would drive Joran around he fumbled looking for an answer.  His thinking is simply that he deserves this and people like his parents, the Kalpoes and others should do things for him - what's so odd?  He needs to be knocked off his self-made pedestal for good.  

Looking forward to SM Radio!  

Have a great day monkeys!
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Anna
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« Reply #857 on: October 11, 2006, 12:49:08 PM »

Some of our current Front Page posters need to see the kinds of deals being offered to try to get some tourism drummed up for Aruba.

Here is one example

>>Sample 4-night air/hotel package Boston to Aruba from $670 based on travel 11/9 through 11/13. Sample prices based on double occupancy and vary by dates of travel, availability, and departure city. Shop for your travel dates and departure city below.   Select travel dates to see rates<<

Note that price includes air fare and is available through ShermansTravel.  I think they need a copy of the Murder and Crime summary.   Confused

.
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Murder & Crime on Aruba Summary http://tinyurl.com/2nus7c
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« Reply #858 on: October 11, 2006, 12:50:30 PM »

LilPuma,
Thanks for mentioning SM radio... I am so excited about it myself!!
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sharon
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« Reply #859 on: October 11, 2006, 12:54:21 PM »

Anna -- I sure will. Until I figure out what I need to do to copy FP posts, my contributions will be limited, though.

klaas -- if you are around, or NM if you can copy from the FP;

http://www.scaredmonkeys.com/2005/06/11/breaking/

#416 from Gabriel Leo


I find Gabriel's first comment on the legal system very interesting -- in light of d's comment to j in the car; you will get 15 years.

 Shocked  Shocked  Shocked
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"Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world.  Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has!" Margaret Mead
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