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Author Topic: Natalee Case Discussion #775 11/16/08 thru 11/19/08  (Read 259684 times)
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« Reply #220 on: November 17, 2008, 04:33:20 PM »

Hmmm, on second glance, maybe not.

It looks like the same guy to me.  The only difference is that he needed a hair cut.
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« Reply #221 on: November 17, 2008, 04:36:41 PM »

What does Joran's shirt say???  World Without......................?????

Stranglers! 
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« Reply #222 on: November 17, 2008, 04:44:00 PM »

A volunteer works for Dolph van Stapele

Mambo Beach

I am now another two weeks in Curacao, time seems to go fast. It is still very quiet at Fisheye Media Productions, the company where I work placement course. The buses run on time, fortunately, almost always as good as well as directly to my destination, Mambo Beach. If the wheather permits within a quarter of an hour I am on my work, running is a little more than half hour I treasure.

My tutor and co-owner of Fisheye, Dolph van Stapele , is an ex-Marine to his hobby his work has made. He is already more than a decade video productions, including approximately seven years really professional. A nice to know that he is in France training for the jungle commands at the Foreign Legion has done and completed. Once in a while he is here on the island with a friend of him to a shooting there loads bullets to fire with weapons from the extensive arsenal of his friend.



++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Mambo Beach

Ik ben inmiddels alweer twee weken op Curacao, de tijd lijkt snel te gaan. Het is nog steeds erg rustig bij Fisheye Media Productions, het bedrijf waar ik stage loop. De bussen rijden gelukkig bijna altijd op tijd en ook zo goed als rechtstreeks naar mijn bestemming; Mambo Beach. Als het meezit ben ik binnen een kwartiertje op mijn werk, lopend is het iets meer dan een half uur schat ik.

Mijn stagebegeleider en mede-eigenaar van Fisheye, Dolph van Stapele, is een ex-marinier die van zijn hobbie z'n werk heeft gemaakt. Hij maakt al meer dan tien jaar videoproducties waarvan ongeveer zeven jaar echt professioneel. Een leuk weetje is dat hij in Frankrijk de jungletraining voor commando's bij het Vreemdelingenlegioen heeft gedaan, en voltooid. Eens in de zoveel tijd gaat hij hier op het eiland met een vriend van hem naar een schietterrein om daar ladingen kogels af te vuren met wapens uit het uitgebreide arsenaal van zijn vriend.
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« Reply #223 on: November 17, 2008, 04:46:11 PM »

Hmmm, on second glance, maybe not.

It looks like the same guy to me.  The only difference is that he needed a hair cut.

Pics were taken the same day, wearing the same clothes


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« Reply #224 on: November 17, 2008, 04:58:17 PM »

Hmmm, on second glance, maybe not.

It looks like the same guy to me.  The only difference is that he needed a hair cut.

Pics were taken the same day, wearing the same clothes




Gielen`s van Stapele

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« Reply #225 on: November 17, 2008, 04:59:24 PM »

Hmmm, on second glance, maybe not.

It looks like the same guy to me.  The only difference is that he needed a hair cut.

Pics were taken the same day, wearing the same clothes




stapele and gielen is a team 

That story is told to tv-producer Renée Gielen (known for his three documentaries about the Bon Futuro prison on Curaçao) and camera man Dolph van Stapele, who from the start had his suspicions about the case and consequently flew to neighbouring eiland Aruba on several occasions, in search of the truth. Until they managed to make certain persons talk, who’ve been able to shed a different light on what could possibly be the most talked about disappearance ever.

http://blog.360.yahoo.com/blog-u8kQff45YrR3e2EFtBzh_wEK
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« Reply #226 on: November 17, 2008, 05:05:05 PM »

Gielen , Dolph van Stapele, Peter Ranzijn, Michel Drente en Suzanne Jansen.

That c*** Americans had even called for a boycott on tourism Aruba, while she was junkie .
Is she really gone? Or has she taken an overdose and they bring her body secretly by the yanks brought to the States?
Die kut Amerikanen hadden zelfs opgeroepen om een toeristische boycott op
Aruba, terwijl die griet gewoon een djunkie was/is.
Is ze wel echt verdwenen? Of heeft ze een overdosis genomen en is haar lijk
stiekem door de yanks naar de States gebracht?



http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.netherlands/browse_thread/thread/8fbd7c74d1b74746
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« Reply #227 on: November 17, 2008, 05:15:21 PM »

Gielen , Dolph van Stapele, Peter Ranzijn, Michel Drente en Suzanne Jansen.

That c*** Americans had even called for a boycott on tourism Aruba, while she was junkie .
Is she really gone? Or has she taken an overdose and they bring her body secretly by the yanks brought to the States?
Die kut Amerikanen hadden zelfs opgeroepen om een toeristische boycott op
Aruba, terwijl die griet gewoon een djunkie was/is.
Is ze wel echt verdwenen? Of heeft ze een overdosis genomen en is haar lijk
stiekem door de yanks naar de States gebracht?



http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.netherlands/browse_thread/thread/8fbd7c74d1b74746

Peter Ranzijn
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email      peter.ranzijn@hotmail.com
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #228 on: November 17, 2008, 05:22:13 PM »

Comment by Greta Van Susteren
November 17th, 2008 at 11:03 am
i spoke to the prosecutor and offered to show him what we have but he said he wants to see it but does not work weekends…how do you like THAT?

http://gretawire.foxnews.com/2008/11/17/the-latest-2/comment-page-1/#comments

 

When it comes to Natalee's case they don't work at all!!!

I agree Mum unless something regarding the coverup needs work such as new witnesses etc.


Hi TM...I do not ever remember Caps posting anything bad about Jossy, do you?

Little intrigued here as to why Edward keeps referring to Jossy and Luis.

Still looking for those initials,as well...I didn't get a clue to them from Kermit's posts!

No, I don't recall anything bad about Jossy.  
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
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« Reply #229 on: November 17, 2008, 05:32:17 PM »

Jacqueline on "ko v dijk" verteld also a troll
also a troll
DVD’tje gereserveerd 

Eefje…eerst zien dan commentaar. Het OM op Aruba deelt zoveel feiten niet.
Dat er verborgen feiten zijn is een feit. Punt uit


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« Reply #230 on: November 17, 2008, 05:35:07 PM »

Dr. Hodges of forensic thoughtprints weighs in on the fish trap and search with Persistence.  Lots of pictures.  Click on the pictures, they grow and there is a text explanation.  Lots of good stuff there.

January 13, 2008
Aruba Journal: Trips to Aruba Linked to Search for Body
(between 12/18/07 and 1/2/08)

Quote
As we left the beach we drove across the main highway one block away onto another dirt road and there, from directly behind the huts, we could see the lights from the Racquet Club. This was on the same road where a gardener said he saw the three suspects shortly after 2 a.m. on the night Natalee disappeared.


How handy that the Fishermans huts are so close.

Quote
On the next morning (December 19), I boarded The Persistence along with Louis Schaffer and Tim Miller and remained aboard for the next 24 hours as they continued to scan the ocean floor. The staff was impressive—capable, bright, and extremely motivated. They worked virtually through the entire night. Clearly this was going to be one quality search effort.

(snip)

We had several interesting discussions both on deck and in the relatively small galley. At one point, the boat-owner, Capt. John Silvetti (of the J.D. Silvetti Group), expressed his frustration about the lack of an exact description of the missing "crab cage" in which Natalee was likely enclosed. He'd been requesting one for several weeks, and Louis had expressed the identical frustration to me earlier.


Quote
...The search team commissioned the construction of a model cage and planned to drop it underwater to obtain as accurate a scan signature as possible to enable quicker identification of the actual cage.


Quote
Indeed, it's a relatively short walk going right past the nearby marina between the Holiday Inn and Marriott where the Gottenbos boat had been moored on May 30, 2005. (Gottenbos family members had been friends with the van der Sloots.)


Quote
Little did I know that my casual stroll along the white sand beach would soon help fill in the blanks for The Persistence crew about the exact nature of the fishing cage.

...Each small building consists of four individual units very small in size approximately 9 feet by 15 feet. As I approached the first of the three tiny Fisherman's Huts buildings, I soon learned that this was the one in which the 2005 break-in occurred. There a lone fisherman was cleaning out his fishing boat on the beach next to the first of the three Fisherman's Huts. ...

Rather quickly it emerged that he was The Fisherman who had discovered the break-in to the units on the morning of May 30, 2005. He related the following story.

He had been at this hut at 6 am that Monday morning May 30, 2005. Before long, he noticed that someone had broken into the first three of the four units in this particular group, from north to south, prying off the padlocks with something like a tire iron or a crowbar. He showed me the still-visible marks of the break-in on each unit. He described in detail the contents of each unit and the nature of the break-in.

Facing the first of the Fisherman's Huts from left to right (north to south): unit 1 contained a valuable stove, cooler and other equipment but nothing went missing; unit 2 had the lock pried off but was seemingly unopened because the door was stuck (and nothing was later reported missing); unit 3 also had its lock pried off with the only missing item being a brand new, large fishing knife (no rope was taken as had originally been reported, he said); finally unit 4 remained untouched. Clearly it seemed the perpetrator(s) had broken into the units in an orderly fashion until they found the specific item they were seeking—the knife. Indeed it struck the fisherman as odd that nothing else of value was taken.

(snip)

The Cage
The fisherman also noticed that a large fishing cage stored behind the first of the three Fisherman's Huts at the southern-most corner was missing. The cage had been there approximately a month since about Good Friday, March 25, 2005. The cage belonged to another fisherman who kept his boat next to these four huts. The boat was still there. But the cage was missing.

The fisherman described the cage as made of 3/8-inch iron (such as that used in concrete reinforcing—"rebar") with a frame size approximately 5 ½ feet by 4 feet by 17 inches. He described it as a large fishing cage with its frame wrapped in chicken wire with its familiar hexagonal openings but with an opening in one panel which allowed them to trap fish. He believed that, given its size and weight, it would take two men to manage the cage. Once aboard, it would lay low on the floor of the nearby fishing boat.

The day the cage went missing, the fisherman observed an iron stain in the grass on the south side of the huts. Only sometime the next day, Tuesday, May 31, did the fisherman learn of Natalee's disappearance. Slowly he began to consider possible connections between the case of the missing American girl and the missing knife and cage. His suspicions rose when a rumor made its way around the island that Natalee had been disposed of in a container. (In retrospect, the missing knife could be explained by the suspects' need to cut a larger flap in the cage in order to fit the body into it.)


Quote
Certainly rigor mortis would have set in at 24 hours and they would not have been able to manipulate the body into the cage at that point. And the knife and the fishing cage were stolen on the night of May 29-30, 2005, not on May 31.

Quote
From the boat they emailed a new copy of the model cage to the person constructing an actual model of the cage, and picked it up the following morning upon returning to shore. By December 21, the search team had an accurate model cage and was able to drop it into the water and obtain a sonar signature of the cage.

Quote
One afternoon as I stood at the Fisherman's Huts where the break-in occurred, a family in a small speedboat (approximately 14 feet) launched their craft into the water from right next to the huts. The family of two adults and four children easily made their way into the water, out 100 feet or more where you could see other bathers standing waist-deep in the water. One of the adults on the boat told me he had a larger, 20-foot craft which he often launched there. That simple observation confirmed for me that this key area was easily accessible for boats and the most convenient place to quickly and secretly load a dead girl's body into such a vessel. It seemed to be the first place along this section of the beach (north from the Holiday Inn) suitable for launching watercraft.


http://forensicthoughtprints.com/default.aspx

If the original fish trap was made with chicken wire, would it have rusted away in the water?  did the cage in the video Tim saw look like it was made with chicken wire?  Would the chicken wire have rusted away after two years in salt water?  The rebar?

The trap in the pictures released looked more like a heavy small animal cage unit, not like one homemade with chicken wire and rebar.

IIRC, from BFN chats/other blogs that John Silvetti and others spent a lot of time tracking down information and tips.  I was under the impression that they left due to running out of money.  This was when the price of fuel was skyrocketing.

I also remember comments that the Dutch and other Europeans were sure they were mapping for oil.  IIRC, the Europeans/Dutch wanted the data to update their maps.  I believe the data belongs to Louis Schaffer.  Why did no one look there before for oil?  The Dutch?  Hugo?

I also seem to recall that the search was extended to search father out, and in deeper waters.  John Silvetti indicated they would like to go back and needed a larger ROV, one the size of a Yugo, for deeper water.  It would be a more targeted search, based on things already identified.

Was the cage with 'skull'  & 'shoe' really at some point?  Perhaps that and the pond draining was to distract from further water searches?  Use up what ever time Persistence had remaining on Aruba?  Disappoint people and ensure that no future searches were funded?  Make it look like a coverup?

I believe an accurate model of the cage may have provided to many clues for the comfort of some on the island.

I have to wonder if the cage and remains are still out there, in the deeper water.  I believe John Silvetti is a man of honor and sincerely wanted to find and return Natalee to her family. 

just my humble opinions

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« Reply #231 on: November 17, 2008, 05:44:50 PM »

Another troll

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Alles wat Peter R dus niet vertelde, en ons niet wilde laten zien

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« Reply #232 on: November 17, 2008, 05:48:56 PM »

There is a lot of interesting stuff on the Hodges site.  imho

Quote
downloadingdaddy on January 19th, 2008 12:06 am
Update from the persistence;

Friday, January 18, 2008
XIII. Stay the Course

SPECIAL UPDATE: Fri 18-Jan 2335 hrs

We would like to specifically address one comment left on the blog which likely represents the sentiments of many.
“You guys have been out there for quite a long time now… I was really hoping for results by now. I can’t help but begin to think she won’t be found” -Overwhelming_Sadness

Quoting John Silvetti- Fri 18-Jan 2300 hrs
“It is easy to lose heart if one confuses expectations with hopes and desires. The nature of a marine search, especially one in which the method and disposition of the item you are searching for is unknown, requires a painstakingly slow and methodical disqualification process. The logic is no different than trying to find your car keys. The methodology is: you look where you were recently. We look where it is believed to be, based on evidence or reports. When you and I do not locate what we are looking for in the most logical place, we move on to the next logical place. Ultimately, we both confirm the old saying, “It is always in the last place you look”.
Unknown topography and terrain, combined with large seas have slowed us down but it has not stopped us. We have surveyed and investigated a large area, disqualified most of it, and moved on to an even larger area. At times our progress has been exceedingly fast and slow at other times. We do however, “STAY THE COURSE”….PERSISTENCE.

Our hopes and desires also were to find Natalee before Christmas so we could help bring closure to the Holloway family as our gift to them. Then, we could return home to our families to enjoy the holiday season and hug our children a little tighter… but, it was not meant to be that easy…and we understand.
–John Silvetti.”

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2008/01/18/carnival-in-aruba-police-want-night-clubs-closed-early-to-prevent-violence-like-after-tourchlight-parade/

I feel very sad that another holiday season is here and Natalee has not been returned home.   

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« Reply #233 on: November 17, 2008, 05:49:19 PM »

troll Nadine

http://www.nano.web-log.nl/

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« Reply #234 on: November 17, 2008, 05:53:13 PM »

Another troll

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Alles wat Peter R dus niet vertelde, en ons niet wilde laten zien

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that disgusting, crazy psychic
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« Reply #235 on: November 17, 2008, 05:56:04 PM »

Lala's - De Vries didn't drop the ball.  He always sets Urine up within 90% of a conviction and then it falls apart.  This ensures that he can produce another money making episode and possibly win another Emmy.

Bastibro - Greta most likely went to Seattle for lunch in the Space Needle.  I lived in Seattle for a time and the restaurant up there is really very good.

"awkward" - means he soiled his undergarments.

Dayhiker - Aruba might be feeling the economic crunch right now, but if Silvetti's geological surveys indicated an off shore oil field, crappy island will be a boom town.
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« Reply #236 on: November 17, 2008, 05:56:58 PM »

Quote
John Silvetti said his company became involved in the search after he was contacted by Louis Schaefer...Schaefer had been approached by Texas Equusearch...

Schaefer asked Silvetti if he could provide the survey personnel and the geophysical equipment required for the search. After spending a weekend with Schaefer and Pam and Dave Holloway, Silvetti agreed.

“It ripped my heart out to hear them say that right now all they’re looking for is to have a funeral in Alabama,” Silvetti said. “What do you say to someone like that?”

Silvetti agreed to provide his equipment and primary survey vessel at well below cost, with Schaefer covering all out-of-pocket expenses. Silvetti said his staff volunteered its services for the project as well.

“They said ‘You don’t even have to pay me. I just want to help,’” Silvetti said. “That just tells me we’ve got the right people on board.”

Marc Broussard, project manager for the Silvetti Group, said the company normally performs surveys looking for oil rigs and downed helicopters. Now, it will be using its high-resolution SONAR equipment to look for a body.

Quote
To upgrade its systems for the terrain in Aruba, Broussard said the Silvetti Group looked to its vendors, two of which are based in New Iberia.

Seatronics, located at the Port of Iberia, agreed to donate some of its high-tech electronic equipment to scan the ocean floor.

Quote
“Nothing is being done to gain name recognition. This is to help these people,” Silvetti said. “Most of us have watched this on television, and I can only imagine the horror any parent would go through searching for their child in a foreign country.”


http://www.iberianet.com/articles/2007/11/29/news/news/news00.txt

J.D. Silvetti web site -
http://www.jdsilvetti.com/
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« Reply #237 on: November 17, 2008, 05:58:24 PM »

Another troll

trol Michael zegt:

Alles wat Peter R dus niet vertelde, en ons niet wilde laten zien

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that disgusting, crazy psychic

yes a whole network jerks   Bastibro
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« Reply #238 on: November 17, 2008, 06:00:49 PM »

Have we made any progress with the Monkey and the Monkey's Uncle?  I took the clue from Kermit to mean that they were American.  She spelled Polis when she referred to an Aruban.
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« Reply #239 on: November 17, 2008, 06:04:14 PM »

super troll gielen

Gielen
Function   Statutory director
Title description   Managing Director
Name   Renee Marie Louise Gielen
Address   Alexanderlaan 8
Curacao
Netherlands Antilles
Date of birth   November 21, 1949 
Place of birth   Eindhoven
Country of birth   The Netherlands
Nationality   Dutch

Business address   Jan Haayenweg 2  next to the Lions club 

Object categories of the business   Management Company(8612), Administrative/managerial office(8429), Organization and Coordination of Congresses, Seminars and Conventions(8495), Audio-visual productions(9565)

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