Natalee Case Discussion #780 11/26/08 - 12/3/08

[MumInOhio]

Sorry if this was discussed, but came across it while looking for indication of dates for Tim being of the boat in the thread Blonde started…

Anyone have any info on the dates or time span, please.  TIA

From Kyle’s Log…I believe

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0

Sun 06-Jan 1635
The seas abated sufficiently to maintain our progress through the night and into the early morning hours. The Persistence arrived dockside around 0430 hrs this morning.
Snipped

Wed 09-Jan 1816 hrs
All Internet connectivity was lost for two days due to rough seas and equipment failure. The old adage "No news is good news" only applies on land. Offshore, the 'Law of the Sea' rules and no news usually just means "lost contact". The seas were 6-8ft with the occasional 12+ft swell. The past two nights were spent conducting a bathymetry-only survey of the new grid. The new grid more than doubles the original search area. If completed, the total area thoroughly searched will be 80% the size of Aruba. Currently, the seas are calm relative to what we've been experiencing. The four digits posted on the echo-sounder is a reminder of the limits being put to the test.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Just checked Fox On The Record site and they will be replaying Greta's latest interview w/Joran (Parts 1 & 2) tonight and Saturday night.

[Anna]

I am pretty sure Buckeye is correct that laws against human trafficking are likely still stuck in Parliament and have not actually been passed or acted upon. 

Unless something has happened in recent months, there are many laws awaiting to be formally adapted to the Aruban system.  I don't know how this effects things but suspect that it could be used to exonerate one of those charges until the laws are actually ratified.

Has Paulus researched this and knows Joran can't be charged with that because the laws are still pending ratification?  He was always big on things like that.  And jurisdiction.

[Dayhiker]

and....Guido..."heavy battery"....

Premeditation and heavy battery would not just get named without a reason, IMO.

What was known to add those charges? 

Yes, that's the one that sent us all reeling!  Why heavy battery and why this charge only for Guido if it was purely random and not based on actual information?

Damn right. Remember the lectures we got on the Dutch system and how they didn't need jack to bring them in and the charges were always trumped up?

Funny how a taped confession doesn't amount to shit, isn't it?

[Tylergal]

Original not available.

Charges pending for Aruba suspects - (did suspects destroy evidence while they were free?)
WASHINGTON TIMES INSIDER.COM ^ | JULY 2, 2005 | Peter Prengaman

Posted on Saturday, July 02, 2005 9:06:21 PM by CHARLITE

ORANJESTAD, Aruba -- Aruba's chief government spokesman said late yesterday that three young men detained in the disappearance of an Alabama teenager could be formally charged as soon as Monday.

Spokesman Reuben Trapenberg did not clarify what charges would be filed against the three.

Earlier, Aruba's attorney general, Karin Janssen, said the young men had been charged with murder since their arrest three weeks ago.

"The three have been charged with the murder of Natalee Holloway from the beginning" of their arrest 10 days after the young woman went missing May 30, she said in a recorded interview. "At the time, we didn't want to upset the family talking about murder while they searched."

The attorney general and other Aruba officials have said for weeks that no one has been charged in the 18-year-old's disappearance. Miss Janssen said authorities also withheld information about the charges in order not to compromise their investigation. Authorities have said they have no physical evidence suggesting Miss Holloway is dead.

Mr. Trapenberg called the Associated Press after the English-language interview with Miss Janssen. "This is a question of semantics, a problem since Day One," Mr. Trapenberg said. "The charging is a formal process that happens later on. It could happen as soon as Monday."

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1435525/posts


I'm with Frank.  Why the murder charges for everyone?  I agree, if they don't want to explain the reason for the murder charges, let them explain their lack of interest in the trafficking declaration.

And why the premeditated charges against Paulus.  They could have dragged Paulus in for any other charge related to this case but they charged him with "Premeditation".  It was so disturbing to me when I heard that.  That's when I was convinced she died in his home and he let her die.  I believe Natalee could have been saved that night if she was injured but Paulus thought it best to let her die. 

If I understand correctly, "premeditation" can occur in the blink of an eye.  Suppose, for example, Natalee was brought to the VDS home or anywhere  ... "something bad happened," from which it appeared she was not going to recover without medical help and Paulus could not risk medical help.  Why?  If Joran was out with a girl and she had a seizure, what is the problem?  Everyone knows that kids do XTC and have sex but why this time?  Was it because there was "all that shit," they would find, "your own father, unbelievable."  In that case, your thought is you must destroy any evidence because the DNA could be highly incriminating, not to mention the XTC that your son and his friends might be selling.  It was just prudent to destroy any evidence of that Natalee ever existed because any evidence that her body might produce could prevent a judge in training from becoming a full-fledged judge.  I suppose no one wants to know that Paulus, like his friend, Rudy Croes, is an old pervert and the reason his son, Joran, is dealing in  such perverted and illegal activity at such an early age.  Touche.  Shame on you, Anita.  You scandalous winch, you have wh*red your own family out.

[Dayhiker]

I am pretty sure Buckeye is correct that laws against human trafficking are likely still stuck in Parliament and have not actually been passed or acted upon. 

Unless something has happened in recent months, there are many laws awaiting to be formally adapted to the Aruban system.  I don't know how this effects things but suspect that it could be used to exonerate one of those charges until the laws are actually ratified.

Has Paulus researched this and knows Joran can't be charged with that because the laws are still pending ratification?  He was always big on things like that.  And jurisdiction.

Just another reason Joran would be better off rotting in a prison in Thailand, Anna. The Dutch and Arubans wouldn't do anything to him even if they did convict him.

[Anna]

That photo of Rudy Croes looks dreadful.  Gives me the creeps just to look at it.  I wonder if he is ill or something to be so ghastly pale.

[Dayhiker]

Was it because there was "all that shit," they would find, "your own father, unbelievable."  In that case, your thought is you must destroy any evidence because the DNA could be highly incriminating, not to mention the XTC that your son and his friends might be selling. It was just prudent to destroy any evidence of that Natalee ever existed because any evidence that her body might produce could prevent a judge in training from becoming a full-fledged judge.  

Not to mention what drugging and murdering an American tourist would do to their tourism economy, Tyler, which of course is why the government, law enforcement and Dutch judges piled on and backed the van der Sloots.

[Anna]

I wonder where the Russian subs are actually located in regard to Aruba.  We all know they are visiting Venezuela, including their pride the Peter the Great which is nuclear powered.

Aruba will be lucky if the junky thing doesn't malfunction and meltdown as they are so prone to do in the Russian fleet.

Betcha the Ruskies could provide a map of the ocean floor before taking this little excursion.

Also they are going to assist Chavez in obtaining "nuclear power" which we all know is their double speak for nuclear weapons just as they did Iran.  Right in our own back yard, sotaspeak.

Russia has the EU in a stranglehold with their natural gas line which they can always use as a leverage and do.  So Oduber thinks this would be a good thing for Aruba to have in dealing with Chavez.  Once they convert everything over, it will be too late to ever go back in this economy.

And yet we have that forward observation base in Aruba which does allow us very close range for eavesdropping on Chavez, something we are not in a position to risk at all.  The crazier Chavez becomes, the more vital the listening post and base.  I have been expecting them to ask us to leave all along.  As long as we need that and it is so vital to national security, they do have that huge leverage over us.

Remember Chernobyl?  Russia doesn't have the best track record with nuclear power to start with and Aruba is likely within range of any disaster.  Has any country that Russia has actually assisted in this manner used the technology to actually produce electricity?  Iran claims it will do so sometime next year but something tells me Israel may see that differently.

This is all just a slap in the face of the U.S. on the part of Russia and Chavez who grow more bold every day.

JMO

[blah]

That photo of Rudy Croes looks dreadful.  Gives me the creeps just to look at it.  I wonder if he is ill or something to be so ghastly pale.

How can someone who lives on such a sunny island always be so pale?

[Lala'sMom]

Do all of you realize that in Aruba you can earn $950 US dollars PER MONTH and still be able to buy a nice car??  I suppose all of Deepak's salary went to make his car payment. No wonder Joran had to buy drinks that night at CnC's.   

[texasmom]

11/28/2008 Awe Mainta Page 4



Papiamentu Translation:

mike eman at the netherlands will see the posibilidadnan cu aruba have for gas natural under we suelonan

leader of faction avp, mike eman, cu is at the netherlands at the momentonan here, owing to expresa cu during his visit at we madre country past will give much atencion also at the part of energy. one of the asuntonan cu owing to capta much atencion ultimamente is the desaroyo on level of energy alternative y at the same instant the buskeda at all part of world for recursonan of energy below ; own suelo. according eman, at aruba we owing to arrive of explora end for petroleum y the time ey cierto calculacionnan owing to wordo haci cu the not was rendabel. without embargo, ultimo time is hear again of one desaroyo new caminda cu is wordo talk of the posibilidad cu in we suelonan, or at least close of we, will can have gas. during his visit at the netherlands eman will talk cu the director of energy valley, cu is one of the institutonan cu is haci investigacion of energy for largo time for the netherlands. will talk cune on the posibilidad for see again kico is the posicion of aruba for cu all the fuentenan of energy y specialmente esun of gas. avp is considera important for come cu one study again on the territory here y see kico is the posibilidad of gas in suelonan of aruba y the institute energy valley is uno cu owing to concentra his self much on gas. the is ubica at groningen caminda cu majority of the minanan of gas of the netherlands is ubica. here mike eman will achieve one rondleiding also of the minanan of gas y hear of expertonan if they're see the posibilidad for come look at at aruba if we can have gas also. this will is one another fountain of energy enough clean cu if we self can sake can help for her retonan of energy for future also.

[Frank]

In the article just above the one with the picture of Rudy Croes, it mentions Sarah Palin in the same article as Joran van der sloot.

Does anyone know what it says?

[Anna]

That photo of Rudy Croes looks dreadful.  Gives me the creeps just to look at it.  I wonder if he is ill or something to be so ghastly pale.

How can someone who lives on such a sunny island always be so pale?

Hi, Blah,
Hope you are having a nice holiday weekend.

Yeah, Rudy must have some industrial grade sunscreen to remain so totally devoid of normal coloring.  Either that or he is a zombie?

[klaasend]

In the article just above the one with the picture of Rudy Croes, it mentions Sarah Palin in the same article as Joran van der sloot.

Does anyone know what it says?

I can guess

It probably says something like Greta took a short break from her Sarah Palin coverage to do a show on Joran.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Sorry if this was discussed, but came across it while looking for indication of dates for Tim being of the boat in the thread Blonde started…

Anyone have any info on the dates or time span, please.  TIA

From Kyle’s Log…I believe

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0

Sun 06-Jan 1635
The seas abated sufficiently to maintain our progress through the night and into the early morning hours. The Persistence arrived dockside around 0430 hrs this morning.
Snipped

Wed 09-Jan 1816 hrs
All Internet connectivity was lost for two days due to rough seas and equipment failure. The old adage "No news is good news" only applies on land. Offshore, the 'Law of the Sea' rules and no news usually just means "lost contact". The seas were 6-8ft with the occasional 12+ft swell. The past two nights were spent conducting a bathymetry-only survey of the new grid. The new grid more than doubles the original search area. If completed, the total area thoroughly searched will be 80% the size of Aruba. Currently, the seas are calm relative to what we've been experiencing. The four digits posted on the echo-sounder is a reminder of the limits being put to the test.

Mum, the question was asked, but I do not believe exact dates were confirmed.  Someone posted a screen shot from the Dateline program of an email Dave had from the contact in Nicaragua dated January 12, 2008 (don't recall who posted).  I just finished watching clips on YouTube of that show and again saw that email but the only thing said during the program was that Dave asked Tim to check out the lead sometime in January. 

There was also no date mentioned in the show after December 30, 2007 where the thumbs down signal was given.  Hanson only stated that the Aruban crew dove following to retrieve from the cage...no specific date mentioned, to my knowledge.

[Frank]

Or Joran took a break from trafficking to let us know that he sold Natalee and his father paid off two police officers.

Interesting way of looking at things by Rudy. These people are all savages.

[Keepthefaith]

Sorry if this was discussed, but came across it while looking for indication of dates for Tim being of the boat in the thread Blonde started…

Anyone have any info on the dates or time span, please.  TIA

From Kyle’s Log…I believe

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0

Sun 06-Jan 1635
The seas abated sufficiently to maintain our progress through the night and into the early morning hours. The Persistence arrived dockside around 0430 hrs this morning.
Snipped

Wed 09-Jan 1816 hrs
All Internet connectivity was lost for two days due to rough seas and equipment failure. The old adage "No news is good news" only applies on land. Offshore, the 'Law of the Sea' rules and no news usually just means "lost contact". The seas were 6-8ft with the occasional 12+ft swell. The past two nights were spent conducting a bathymetry-only survey of the new grid. The new grid more than doubles the original search area. If completed, the total area thoroughly searched will be 80% the size of Aruba. Currently, the seas are calm relative to what we've been experiencing. The four digits posted on the echo-sounder is a reminder of the limits being put to the test.

Where the contents of the removed?Where the pictures of the zip-lock bags not taken on Jan 7th???Mum??

[Keepthefaith]

Sorry if this was discussed, but came across it while looking for indication of dates for Tim being of the boat in the thread Blonde started…

Anyone have any info on the dates or time span, please.  TIA

From Kyle’s Log…I believe

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0

Sun 06-Jan 1635
The seas abated sufficiently to maintain our progress through the night and into the early morning hours. The Persistence arrived dockside around 0430 hrs this morning.
Snipped

Wed 09-Jan 1816 hrs
All Internet connectivity was lost for two days due to rough seas and equipment failure. The old adage "No news is good news" only applies on land. Offshore, the 'Law of the Sea' rules and no news usually just means "lost contact". The seas were 6-8ft with the occasional 12+ft swell. The past two nights were spent conducting a bathymetry-only survey of the new grid. The new grid more than doubles the original search area. If completed, the total area thoroughly searched will be 80% the size of Aruba. Currently, the seas are calm relative to what we've been experiencing. The four digits posted on the echo-sounder is a reminder of the limits being put to the test.

Where the contents of the removed?Where the pictures of the zip-lock bags not taken on Jan 7th???Mum??

Was eatin some pie so sorry for the terrible grammer.LOL.Were the contents of the cage removed on Jan 7th MuM??The pictures of the content of the cage were taken on Jan 7th correct??

[Keepthefaith]

Sorry if this was discussed, but came across it while looking for indication of dates for Tim being of the boat in the thread Blonde started…

Anyone have any info on the dates or time span, please.  TIA

From Kyle’s Log…I believe

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4145.0

Sun 06-Jan 1635
The seas abated sufficiently to maintain our progress through the night and into the early morning hours. The Persistence arrived dockside around 0430 hrs this morning.
Snipped

Wed 09-Jan 1816 hrs
All Internet connectivity was lost for two days due to rough seas and equipment failure. The old adage "No news is good news" only applies on land. Offshore, the 'Law of the Sea' rules and no news usually just means "lost contact". The seas were 6-8ft with the occasional 12+ft swell. The past two nights were spent conducting a bathymetry-only survey of the new grid. The new grid more than doubles the original search area. If completed, the total area thoroughly searched will be 80% the size of Aruba. Currently, the seas are calm relative to what we've been experiencing. The four digits posted on the echo-sounder is a reminder of the limits being put to the test.

Where the contents of the removed?Where the pictures of the zip-lock bags not taken on Jan 7th???Mum??

Was eatin some pie so sorry for the terrible grammer.LOL.Were the contents of the cage removed on Jan 7th MuM??The pictures of the content of the cage were taken on Jan 7th correct??

Hello Klass!Hope you had a wonderful Thanxgiving!Can you do  me a favor as i don't know how to bring the pictures of the cage with the zip-lock bags??From Mum's post Kyle said internet connectivity was down for 2 days on Jan 9th??Can you bring the picture's over,as well as post OE's(kyle) Log entry about the internet being down for 2 days.Make sense Klass?TIA.If the contents of the cage were removed on the 7th,as well as pictures taken is it still possible to dive in seas that bady???