Natalee Case Discussion #785 12/13/08 - 12/17/08

[COLOMBO]

Thanks EuRobert...I am still looking at Paulus' bosses before 2002. Looks like Ruud Rosingh.  What about the Dutch golden boy Zwinkels? Was he the one before Rosingh? Thanks!

I just want to know how Paulus got to have so much clout!

Was Paulus in charge of contracts on Aruba when Posner got
his casino contract?

Not sure, Magnolia. I have been trying to figure out what he did and when.

The Casino is under Posner's son's name...On my other computer, so I would have to track down the date of that...will look for it.

is Posner "kept hidden"

excerpt:
Parties at the Wyndham are always generous, and the food on the buffet was exceptional: mini lamb chops, giant shrimp cooked in cream and Pernod, crab cakes and beautiful canapés. Free flowing drinks from the bar made the event ever so easier to handle. General Manager Rob Smith and Director of Operations Joe Najjar greeted their guests and mingled with other general managers from the strip among them Jeff Lesker from the Radisson and Barry Kaplan from the Hyatt.
http://www.visitaruba.com/facts/newsdesk/backissues/newsletter55.html#story9

excerpt:  Free flowing drinks from the bar made the event ever so easier to handle.

[Miss Scarlet]

Remkes: When the request of the Arubaanse Minister (Croes) arrived some weeks ago, I asked myself the question: if we are sending people for indepth investigation, are we then not 'opening up old wounds'? But the consideration that with this investigation done so publically - also to the outside world - to show everything has been done to solve the case, that als has been tried to bring everything to the surface, was the deciding factor.

http://www.nu.nl/algemeen/816335/nederland-gaat-holloway-onderzoek-leiden.html

not wanting to open old wounds = not wanting to pull old cows out of the ditch

show to the world that everything is done to solve the case = PR-stunt.

but even beforehand (in the same interview) Remkes said the investigation was likely going to take weeks, not months.

That being the case, we really haven't given them adequate credit for their true level of ignorance.

By the time all is said and done, Aruba will NEVER recover - EVER.

WoW !  Talk about being a glutton for punishment!

AMAZING!

[johan555]

Remkes talking in September 2006 about the KLPD taking over the investigation.
http://cgi.omroep.nl/cgi-bin/streams?/rnw/smac/2004/car_remkes_op_aruba_20060902.wma (in Dutch) (Windows Media Player)

http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/aruba/car20060209_remkes.html

he met with Oduber in Oranjestad. Croes was not there. there was speculation of 'friction' between Remkes and Croes.
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/09/06/no-friction-between-croes-and-remkes-all-is-well-in-aruban-paradise/

http://www.minbzk.nl/actueel/nieuws--en/99463/minister_remkes

Het bezoek staat in het teken van veiligheid en rechtshandhaving op de eilanden. De gesprekken op Aruba richten zich voornamelijk op de samenwerking met het Korps Politie Aruba en de bestrijding van zware en grensoverschrijdende (drugs)criminaliteit.

Een gesprek met minister Croes van Justitie kan helaas niet plaatsvinden omdat deze uitlandig zal zijn.

Aruba asked for Dutch help in the investigation.
pre-condition of Remkes was that the KLPD (Dutch National Police) was in full charge of the investigation.
Remkes as Interior / Home Affairs Minister was Manager of the KLPD.

caesu
Atzo Nicolaï (Delft, 22 februari 1960) is een Nederlandse politicus. Hij is lid van de VVD en was tussen 7 juli 2006 en 22 februari 2007 Minister voor Bestuurlijke vernieuwing en Koninkrijksrelaties (BVK)

http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atzo_Nicolaï

[johan555]

Nicolaï positive about assistance in Holloway case
ORANGE CITY (26-08-06) - Minister of Administrative Reform and Kingdom Relations Atzo Nicolaï (VVD) has welcomed the request from Aruba to deliver agents for further investigation into the Natalee Holloway disappeared. Aruba wants that the Netherlands will give direction to the investigation. Nicolaï closed Thursday his acquaintance visit to the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba off. On his last day he said, in Aruba, sympathetic to the request from Aruba to assist, if the reports Amigoe.

"But there must still be investigated under what agreements we just go to work." The request was made by the Aruban Justice Minister Rudy Croes (MEP).

The Ministry of Home Affairs confirmed a request from Aruba to have been given and that Minister Johan Remkes (VVD) of Home Affairs here next week during his visit to Aruba wants to talk about.

Aruba is already more than a year in her stomach with the case disappearance of Natalee Holloway. The 18-year-old American girl disappeared after an evening steps on May 30, 2005 with three boys in the night. She then was never found. Aruba has since the disappearance ten people arrested, but now everyone is released. From the United States has criticized the hard way the Aruban public prosecutor has addressed the matter.

The Netherlands has already helped in the investigation by the deployment of F16 fighter jets and-detection dogs. The current request of Croes goes much further. The Dutch detection agents would gain power in Aruba, a private location and weapons may also contribute. Croes wants the National Police Services (KLPD) the direction the investigation takes. (Source Amigoe)

dutch

Nicolaï positief over bijstand in Holloway-zaak        
ORANJESTAD (26-08-06) - Minister van Bestuurlijke Vernieuwing en Koninkrijksrelaties Atzo Nicolaï (VVD) staat positief tegenover het verzoek van Aruba om agenten te leveren voor nader onderzoek naar de verdwenen Natalee Holloway. Aruba wil dat Nederland leiding gaat geven aan het opsporingsonderzoek. Nicolaï sloot donderdag zijn kennismakingsbezoek aan de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba af. Op zijn laatste dag zei hij, op Aruba, welwillend tegenover het verzoek van Aruba te staan, zo meldt de Amigoe.

'Maar er moet nog wel onderzocht worden onder welke afspraken we precies gaan werken.' Het verzoek is gedaan door de Arubaanse Justitie-minister Rudy Croes (MEP).

Het ministerie van Binnenlandse Zaken bevestigt een dergelijk verzoek van Aruba te hebben gekregen en stelt dat minister Johan Remkes (VVD) van Binnenlandse Zaken hier volgende week tijdens zijn bezoek aan Aruba over wil praten.

Aruba zit al meer dan een jaar in haar maag met de verdwijningszaak van Natalee Holloway. Het 18-jarige Amerikaanse meisje verdween na een avondje stappen op 30 mei 2005 met drie jongens de nacht in. Ze werd daarna nooit meer teruggevonden. Aruba heeft sinds de verdwijning tien mensen gearresteerd, maar inmiddels is iedereen weer vrijgelaten. Vanuit de Verenigde Staten is er harde kritiek geleverd op de manier waarop het Arubaanse Openbaar Ministerie de zaak heeft aangepakt.

Nederland heeft al eerder geholpen bij het onderzoek door de inzet van F16-straaljagers en opsporingshonden. Het huidige verzoek van Croes gaat veel verder. De Nederlandse agenten zouden opsporingsbevoegdheid op Aruba krijgen, een eigen locatie en ook wapens mogen dragen. Croes wil dat het Korps Landelijke Politie Diensten (KLPD) de leiding over het onderzoek neemt.(bron Amigoe)

[caesu]

Remkes talking in September 2006 about the KLPD taking over the investigation.
http://cgi.omroep.nl/cgi-bin/streams?/rnw/smac/2004/car_remkes_op_aruba_20060902.wma (in Dutch) (Windows Media Player)

http://antilliaans.caribiana.nl/aruba/car20060209_remkes.html

he met with Oduber in Oranjestad. Croes was not there. there was speculation of 'friction' between Remkes and Croes.
http://scaredmonkeys.com/2006/09/06/no-friction-between-croes-and-remkes-all-is-well-in-aruban-paradise/

http://www.minbzk.nl/actueel/nieuws--en/99463/minister_remkes

Het bezoek staat in het teken van veiligheid en rechtshandhaving op de eilanden. De gesprekken op Aruba richten zich voornamelijk op de samenwerking met het Korps Politie Aruba en de bestrijding van zware en grensoverschrijdende (drugs)criminaliteit.

Een gesprek met minister Croes van Justitie kan helaas niet plaatsvinden omdat deze uitlandig zal zijn.

Aruba asked for Dutch help in the investigation.
pre-condition of Remkes was that the KLPD (Dutch National Police) was in full charge of the investigation.
Remkes as Interior / Home Affairs Minister was Manager of the KLPD.

caesu
Atzo Nicolaï (Delft, 22 februari 1960) is een Nederlandse politicus. Hij is lid van de VVD en was tussen 7 juli 2006 en 22 februari 2007 Minister voor Bestuurlijke vernieuwing en Koninkrijksrelaties (BVK)

http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atzo_Nicolaï

yes, a Minister without portfolio

Minister voor Bestuurlijke vernieuwing en Koninkrijksrelaties

De Minister voor Bestuurlijke vernieuwing en Koninkrijksrelaties was een Nederlands minister verbonden aan het Ministerie van Binnenlandse Zaken en Koninkrijksrelaties. In 2003 is, op verzoek van D66, deze minister in het leven geroepen. Het betreft hier een minister zonder portefeuille, dat wil zeggen zonder eigen begroting.

Thom de Graaf was de eerste minister van Bestuurlijke vernieuwing. Nadat zijn wetsvoorstel voor een gekozen burgemeester door de Eerste Kamer werd verworpen trad hij af. Alexander Pechtold heeft vervolgens, tot de val van Balkenende II, deze functie overgenomen. Bij het aantreden van Balkenende III werd Atzo Nicolaï de opvolger van Pechtold. Echter, van bestuurlijke venieuwing was geen sprake meer, en daardoor werd hij veelal minister van Koninkrijksrelaties genoemd.

Hoewel D66 zijn zin kreeg voor dit ministerie, is alom bekend dat premier Balkenende niet zoveel op had met Bestuurlijke Vernieuwingen. Hij heeft daarom Alexander Pechtold ooit een minister van 'Spek-en-bonen' genoemd.

Netherlands

A Minister without Portfolio in the Netherlands is a minister that does not head a specific ministry, but assumes the same power and responsibilities as a minister that does. The minister is responsible for a specific part of another minister's policy field. The minister for development cooperation has always been a minister without portfolio. In the second Balkenende cabinet there were three ministers without portfolio: Agnes van Ardenne (Development Cooperation), Rita Verdonk (Integration and Immigration) and Alexander Pechtold (Government Reform and Kingdom Relations).

http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minister_zonder_portefeuille
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minister_without_portfolio#Netherlands

Minister without budget, resorting under Ministry of Home Affairs (Remkes)

[johan555]

caesu
 
The current request of Croes goes much further. The Dutch detection agents would gain power in Aruba, a private location and weapons may also contribute. Croes wants the National Police Services (KLPD) the direction the investigation takes.

[texasmom]

http://www.diarioaruba.com/diabierna/noticia/news5.html


August 25, 2006

Papiamento translation:


according minister atzo nicolai, gobierno of aruba have to is dispuesto for work together cu the netherlands hour is necesario oranjestad(aan): diabierna daily paper owing to interview minister dutch atzo nicolai, of relacionnan in kingdom y reforma of gobierno, that is at aruba actualmente. the minister owing to splica cu past owing to visit all the another islands antillano end y now aruba. past owing to tell cu aruba have one posicion unique in kingdom cu his status aparte, while cu on the another islands have several person cu is dispuesto for arrive at cierto good acuerdonan. aruba have his status autonomo end, while cu st maarten y corsow wanted arrive at this also. at aruba the is one exito much big, sinembargo corsow y st maarten have to as cuenta cu have to organiza some asunto much good, as maneho financiero, where cu have to girl debenan externo, control, banco central, seguridad, ministerio publico y criminalidad. at aruba on much sharp the status aparte owing to bay good, sinembargo on maneho financiero, disciplina of presupuesto y debenan of the country, have to come one mehoracion. this according nicolai, that owing to follow tell cu have to come mehoracion in apparatus of husticia y assure seguridad, after of the caso holloway. the minster owing to follow tell cu will bay work acuerdonan cu the another islands, sinembargo is good for aruba is wordo envolvi also in this. daily paper owing to ask about the minister if we autonomia is at danger y the minister owing to tell cu not.el owing to splica cu the or is bay touch cu status aparte. according the mandatario, if do you genuinely wanted is boss of you country for atende cu do you problemanan, do you have to can work more together on some asunto. at europa do you looking at same, where cu much dutch do not desea for remainder of europa dicidi for they, but according nicolai, if is necesario for coopera, for regulation some asunto mihor in do you country, do you have to hasie. come across

[johan555]

Minister Nicolaï brengt negendaags bezoek aan Aruba en de Nederlandse Antillen  (voor 9 dagen )

14 augustus 2006

================
Minister Remkes bezoekt Aruba

29 augustus 2006

[johan555]

Minister Nicolaï brengt negendaags bezoek aan Aruba en de Nederlandse Antillen  (voor 9 dagen )

14 augustus 2006

================
Minister Remkes bezoekt Aruba

29 augustus 2006

Minister Nicolaï brings nine day visit to Aruba and Netherlands Antilles (for 9 days)

14 August, 2006

================
Minister Remkes visit Aruba

29 Aug., 2006

http://www.minbzk.nl/vertegenwoordiging-aruba/persberichten?Zoe=&ZoeWay=&index_year=2006&index_month=&Van=&pager_page=1

[johan555]

Nicolaï Minister for Administrative Renewal and Kingdom Relations
July 7, 2006



Atzo Nicolaï on July 7, 2006 appointed Minister for Administrative Renewal and Kingdom Relations (Industry Association) of cabinet Balkenende III. He is the successor of former Minister Alexander Pechtold, who has submitted his resignation after the Second Kamerfractie of D66 confidence in the Cabinet had denounced. On July 3, 2006 to the former minister honorably discharged.

Atzo Nicolaï (1960) was in the Cabinet Balkenende I and II State Secretary at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. He was focused on European Affairs. He was a member of the Lower House for the VVD and he has been involved in various functions with the kunstbeleid, inter alia by the Council for Arts and Culture Council.

Allocation portfolios

Minister Johan Remkes and his new colleague this afternoon Atzo Nicolaï have put their signatures under the protocol that governs the distribution of their duties at the Ministry of Interior Affairs and Kingdom Relations. The tasks corresponding to the division in the cabinet Balkenende II.

Broadly remains Remkes Minister responsible for Security, Public Administration and Government Personnel, while Minister Nicolaï concerns Kingdom, Democratic Renewal, Other Government, Urban, Constitutional Affairs, ICT + government, as well as personal data and travel documents.

[caesu]

caesu
 
The current request of Croes goes much further. The Dutch detection agents would gain power in Aruba, a private location and weapons may also contribute. Croes wants the National Police Services (KLPD) the direction the investigation takes.

yes, that's pretty extraordinary that Croes would go that far.
and still he was trashing the Dutch involvement and lack of support beginning this month.

did the KLPD really want to go to the bottom of the case in September 2006?
or did they refuse to do this when the KLPD saw that the Dutchies were mostly the bad ones (with links to The Netherlands?).
apparently Croes doesn't think so now, else he wouldn't start this new probe and insult a Dutch Minister.
explains why Remkes said the investigation would 'likely take weeks, not months' before the KLPD even had started and why he finds Croes 'an unreliable source of inspiration'.

[truthseeker2]

caesu
 
The current request of Croes goes much further. The Dutch detection agents would gain power in Aruba, a private location and weapons may also contribute. Croes wants the National Police Services (KLPD) the direction the investigation takes.

Would this be a precedent?  If so, would it have long range implications for The Netherlands and Aruba in terms of Aruba's independence?  The reason I ask is because I'm wondering if it does have long term ramifications can other polticians in The Netherlands keep it from happening?

[johan555]

caesu
 
The current request of Croes goes much further. The Dutch detection agents would gain power in Aruba, a private location and weapons may also contribute. Croes wants the National Police Services (KLPD) the direction the investigation takes.

yes, that's pretty extraordinary that Croes would go that far.
and still he was trashing the Dutch involvement and lack of support beginning this month.

did the KLPD really want to go to the bottom of the case in September 2006?
or did they refuse to do this when the KLPD saw that the Dutchies were mostly the bad ones (with links to The Netherlands?).
apparently Croes doesn't think so now, else he wouldn't start this new probe and insult a Dutch Minister.
explains why Remkes said the investigation would 'likely take weeks, not months' before the KLPD even had started and why he finds Croes 'an unreliable source of inspiration'.

and this caesu

Minister Nicolaï brings nine day visit to Aruba and Netherlands Antilles (for 9 days) 14 August, 2006
Minister Remkes visit Aruba 29 Aug., 2006

this stinks

[johan555]

there was also another problem

Yet meeting Nicolaï and Oduber
ORANGE CITY (24-10-06) - The Dutch Minister for Kingdom Relations, Atzo Nicolaï (VVD), today visited Aruba. Despite the tense relations between the Netherlands and Aruba, was a conversation between Nicolaï including Prime Minister Nel Oduber (MEP) on the program. "It has a lot of trouble, but I'm glad that the two sides talking again anyway," said Rens Knegt, the Representative of the Netherlands in Aruba, reports the Amigoe.

Late last week showed Oduber still know that Nicolaï no longer have to come back if the Netherlands attitude towards the financial loans from Aruba does not change. This afternoon, however, took place a call between the two leaders. Also Minister Nilo Swaen (MEP) of Finance and Economic Affairs would be of the party.

Prior to the consultations, there was a meeting with Governor Fredis Refunjol. Depending on the outcome of the talks with Prime Minister Oduber, Nicolaï leave tonight (back) to Curacao, where he arrived yesterday.

The relations between the Netherlands and Aruba are sharp, since Aruba wants to borrow 50 million dollars from Deutsche Bank. The bank refuses to provide the loan, however, after Canada had registered objections. Netherlands wants the terms of Article 29 of the Kingdom of Staff to cover any loans that Aruba is concerned. At this moment those conditions apply only for financial loans that Aruba outside the Kingdom shutdown. By the attitude of the Netherlands continued Prime Minister Oduber stop all negotiations, including negotiations on further cooperation between the kingdom islands after the disintegration of the Netherlands Antilles.

====================
Toch ontmoeting Nicolaï en Oduber        
ORANJESTAD (24-10-06) - De Nederlandse minister voor Koninkrijksrelaties, Atzo Nicolaï (VVD), bezoekt vandaag Aruba. Ondanks de gespannen verhoudingen tussen Nederland en Aruba, stond een gesprek tussen Nicolaï met onder meer premier Nel Oduber (MEP) op het programma. 'Het heeft veel moeite gekost, maar ik ben blij dat de twee partijen toch weer praten', aldus Rens Knegt, de Vertegenwoordiger van Nederland op Aruba, zo meldt de Amigoe.

Eind vorige week liet Oduber nog weten dat Nicolaï niet meer terug hoefde te komen, indien Nederland zijn houding ten aanzien van de financiële leningen van Aruba niet wijzigt. Vanmiddag vond echter toch een gesprek plaats tussen de twee bewindslieden. Ook minister Nilo Swaen (MEP), van Financiën en Economische Zaken zou daarbij van de partij zijn.

Voorafgaande aan het overleg was er een ontmoeting met gouverneur Fredis Refunjol. Afhankelijk van de uitkomsten van het gesprek met premier Oduber, vertrekt Nicolaï vanavond (terug) naar Curaçao, waar hij gisteren arriveerden.

De verhoudingen tussen Nederland en Aruba staan op scherp, sinds Aruba 50 miljoen dollar wil lenen van de Deutsche Bank. De bank weigert de lening echter te verstrekken nadat Nederland bezwaar had aangetekend. Nederland wil dat de voorwaarden uit artikel 29 van het Koninkrijkstatuut gaan gelden voor alle leningen die Aruba aangaat. Op dit moment gelden die voorwaarden alleen nog voor financiële leningen die Aruba buiten het Koninkrijk afsluit. Door de houding van Nederland zette premier Oduber alle onderhandelingen stop, ook de onderhandelingen over meer samenwerking tussen de koninkrijkseilanden na het uiteenvallen van de Nederlandse Antill

[johan555]

The Holloway case remains a lingering issue. Will there ever come final end to this tragedy? Aruba has now asked for reinforcement from the Netherlands. They want even that we get the lead on the investigation. That will be nice and fall in America ... There are already so criminal about our country to speak ...


Minister of Government Reform and Kingdom Relations Atzo Nicolaï welcomes the request from Aruba to deliver agents for further investigation into the Natalee Holloway disappeared. Aruba wants that the Netherlands will give direction to the investigation.


Nicolaï closed Thursday his acquaintance visit to the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba off. On his last day he said, in Aruba, sympathetic to the request from Aruba to stand. "But there must still be investigated under what agreements we just go to work." The request was made by the Aruban Minister Rudy Croes (Justice).


Aruba is already more than a year in her stomach with the case disappearance of Natalee Holloway. The 18-year-old American girl disappeared after an evening steps on May 30, 2005 with three boys in the night. She then was never found. Aruba has since the disappearance ten people arrested, but now everyone is released. From the United States has criticized the hard way the Aruban public prosecutor has addressed the matter.


The Netherlands has already helped in the investigation by the deployment of F16 fighter jets and-detection dogs. The current request of Croes goes much further. The Dutch detection agents would gain power in Aruba, a private location and weapons may also contribute. Croes wants the National Police Services (KLPD) the direction the investigation takes.


The Ministry of Home Affairs confirmed a request from Aruba to have been given and that of Interior Minister Remkes here next week during his visit to Aruba wants to talk about.


Perhaps this is our chance again in a better light to come to America. If the Dutch managed to find her ... But yes, that is what we aspire? Find her to the sharp criticism to come? I've said it before, but I think that the case be disproportionately addressed. In itself, this intensive approach, but grab important than any other similar cases so on. How many parents of missing children would sign for 5% of the attention given to Natalee? It is again waiting for more development so.

===================
De zaak Holloway blijft een slepende kwestie. Zal er ooit een ontnkoping aan dit drama komen? Aruba heeft momenteel verzocht om versterking vanuit Nederland. Ze willen zelfs dat we de leiding krijgen over het onderzoek. Dat zal lekker vallen in Amerika… Daar zijn ze al zo over ons criminele land te spreken…


Minister van Bestuurlijke Vernieuwing en Koninkrijksrelaties Atzo Nicolaï staat positief tegenover het verzoek van Aruba om agenten te leveren voor nader onderzoek naar de verdwenen Natalee Holloway. Aruba wil dat Nederland leiding gaat geven aan het opsporingsonderzoek.


Nicolaï sloot donderdag zijn kennismakingsbezoek aan de Nederlandse Antillen en Aruba af. Op zijn laatste dag zei hij, op Aruba, welwillend tegenover het verzoek van Aruba te staan. ‘Maar er moet nog wel onderzocht worden onder welke afspraken we precies gaan werken.’ Het verzoek is gedaan door de Arubaanse minister Rudy Croes (Justitie).


Aruba zit al meer dan een jaar in haar maag met de verdwijningszaak van Natalee Holloway. Het 18-jarige Amerikaanse meisje verdween na een avondje stappen op 30 mei 2005 met drie jongens de nacht in. Ze werd daarna nooit meer teruggevonden. Aruba heeft sinds de verdwijning tien mensen gearresteerd, maar inmiddels is iedereen weer vrijgelaten. Vanuit de Verenigde Staten is er harde kritiek geleverd op de manier waarop het Arubaanse Openbaar Ministerie de zaak heeft aangepakt.


Nederland heeft al eerder geholpen bij het onderzoek door de inzet van F16-straaljagers en opsporingshonden. Het huidige verzoek van Croes gaat veel verder. De Nederlandse agenten zouden opsporingsbevoegdheid op Aruba krijgen, een eigen locatie en ook wapens mogen dragen. Croes wil dat het Korps Landelijke Politie Diensten (KLPD) de leiding over het onderzoek neemt.


Het ministerie van Binnenlandse Zaken bevestigt een dergelijk verzoek van Aruba te hebben gekregen en stelt dat minister Remkes van Binnenlandse Zaken hier volgende week tijdens zijn bezoek aan Aruba over wil praten.


Misschien is dat wel onze kans weer in een beter daglicht bij Amerika te komen. Als de Nederlanders haar wel weten te vinden… Maar ja, is dat dan wat we nastreven? Haar vinden om van de forse kritieken af te komen? Ik heb het al eerder gezegd, maar ik vind dat de zaak buitenproportioneel wordt aangepakt. Op zich is zo’n intensieve aanpak prima, maar pak dan al die andere soortgelijke zaken ook zo aan. Hoeveel ouders van vermiste kinderen zouden tekenen voor 5% van de aandacht die er wordt gegeven aan Natalee? Het is weer wachten op meer ontwikkeling dus.

[Lifesong]

It is beyond my comprehension why so many Monkeys are getting on that Aruban/Dutch roller coaster again ... optimistic that justice for Natalee Holloway is going to come from the Aruban Administration and or ... the Dutch Administration yet ... disregarding the troubling happenings encompassing the Persistence undertaking and ... the chain of custody of the contents of that cage/trap.  Kyle Kingman held an official position on board that ship and what he has shared ... regarding his concerns on a private site as well as the Scared Monkey's site ... is for the most part not taken seriously by Monkeys.

As Beth would say ... "Greta ... I think this is huge".

Natalee Holloway's remains could be in the hand of those who have denied her justice from the getgo.

Think about it.

In 2005, Rudy Croes made it known that there was a Jan Vander Sloot/Paulus van der Sloot connection.

In 2006 Rudy Croes requested a Dutch investigation of the Natalee Holloway case under the control of Netherlands' Internal Affairs Minister Johan Remkes ... a Minister with a Paulus van der Sloot connection.  On January 1, 2003 ... Johan Remkes endorsed the the appointment of Paulus van der Sloot to "deputy member of the common Court of Justice of the Netherlands antilles and Aruba".

The Dutch investigation of 2006 encompassed the search of the van der Sloot residence and ... it encompassed pouring through the Natalee Holloway case file yet ... in over two years since ... there has been no accountability of those involved in the happenings of the morning and ... there has been no accountability of those in the Dutch/Aruban administration who participated in the coverup.

The latest developments are not developments at all.  They are flashbacks to 2005 and 2006.

I suspect that the Aruban/Dutch administrations have two agendas ...

1.  an agenda to create a distraction away from the contents of the trap/cage discovered and turned over unchallenged to the ALE by John Silvetti of the Persistence

2.  an agenda to close the Natalee Holloway case and ... in an attempt to pacify the family ...  a sacrificial lamb has been selected to take the fall.  In other words ... accountability for a compromised investigation will starts and ends with Jan Vander Straaten?

Janet

+++++

Janet,

I mostly agree.  I see no difference between this new investigation and the previous KLPD attempt, which produced activity, but no results.

I do not agree that Van der Straaten will absorb any blame, as I find it more likely that the new investigation will find that Croes was wrong in his comments.  Then, they will close the case again.

In my opinion there were human remains in the trap.  Quite likely, Natalee's remains, though I'm not yet convinced of that.

I believe those remains are gone forever, not being held somewhere so that if the truth comes out they can be returned.

For whoever those remains are, and that person's family - that is a tragedy and an injustice that can never be righted on this earth.

I take the cage contents issue very seriously, but like everything else in this case it seems there is no accountability. 

How do you force someone to tell the truth?

If we knew that, we could go straight to Joran and put an end to all of this. 


JMO

[truthseeker2]

Prior to the consultations, there was a meeting with Governor Fredis Refunjol.

What functions of government fall under the Governor on Aruba?  He seemed almost invisible with regard to the Holloway case.  Does he have any political power to move an investigation?

[johan555]

Nicolaï positive about assistance in Holloway case

A few days later  Remkes in Aruba

Is it a friend of vd Sloot ?

Has Remkes Croes's request rejected ?

[caesu]

caesu
 
The current request of Croes goes much further. The Dutch detection agents would gain power in Aruba, a private location and weapons may also contribute. Croes wants the National Police Services (KLPD) the direction the investigation takes.

Would this be a precedent?  If so, would it have long range implications for The Netherlands and Aruba in terms of Aruba's independence?  The reason I ask is because I'm wondering if it does have long term ramifications can other politicians in The Netherlands keep it from happening?

this was 2006.

i am speculating here.
because i am having a hard time giving Rudy Croes the benefit of the doubt.
but for the sake looking at this from all sides and not ruling out anything.

it might be that Rudy Croes realized that his OM was too much infected with corrupt Dutchies.
he couldn't request his PG Croes-Fernandes to order a Internal Investigation (Landsrecherche) because the one managing the investigation would be a public-prosecutor from the same corrupt OM.
(and Jan van der Straten of all people was at the time the Landsrecherche Commissioner - not 100% about this)

so Rudy Croes hoped the KLPD would be able to uncover all conflicts of interests and solve the case.
that's why he made the extraordinary decision to let the KLPD head the investigation.
but the KLPD failed to do this (because of too many links to the Dutch Justice System itself? or because Remkes appointed  van der Sloot? < i have my doubts about this, any Minister would have appointed Van der Sloot, Remkes most likely was just acting on a recommendation from Aruba).

maybe now (2008-2009) Rudy Croes is going to give it a 2nd try.
but Rudy would only do this if he is sure this time it will lead to something.

again this is of course a theory. might all be a smokescreen again.

[caesu]

Prior to the consultations, there was a meeting with Governor Fredis Refunjol.

What functions of government fall under the Governor on Aruba?  He seemed almost invisible with regard to the Holloway case.  Does he have any political power to move an investigation?

Governor has no power. same as the Queen also has no power. only ceremonial.
only when a new coalition government is formed there is some minor involvement.