Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - 12/24/08

[finngirl]

What exactly is the property of vd Sloot?
The red or blue area?

Blue area only -- the Red area is the next door neighbor's property with "Niko" the monkey's cage in the backyard.

When I look at this picture, I think of all the ways someone could sneak out of the van der sloot compound.  IIRC, there was a gate next to the main living quarters with entry to the pool.  There are windows that face outside the compound.  There are all those roads and paths. 

I remember discussions early on that ALE had someone in front of the VDS house.  What good would that do?  So many ways to escape and drive a car up without being noticed.

Also, so easy to move a body and hide in the bushes of the surrounding properties.  Through the gate, window, or just over the fence.  It doesn't look like there is much lighting.

jmho

if that pic was wider (toward the right?)
I think we would see Freddy's then-residence

the condo/townhouse: 37 F or 39 F ...
which AG looked for but couldn't find
on the friday night Freddy was arrested

Hi Fin...Strange she couldn't find it, wasn't it?

Johan...Can you also add #62 as well.

I am not sure when they moved, I think the 2005 Chamber records have 62, but will have to check and it will take me forever to find it in my stuff, as last I check they had removed those records.

Thanks in Advance.

hey, Mum 

I'd like to see an aerial view of 39F and 232 Montanja
in relation to the vdS home at 19 Montanja

TIA to anyone who can provide that

_ _ _ _ _

august 26, 2005
4:55 pm
sunmoonstars: This press release came down from the prosecutors. This is the email from the prosecutor to MSNBC

They are in custody based on the same suspicions as before. They are suspected of the primary criminal act of together with other people committing premeditated murder.

Alternately, together with other people murdering somebody.

More alternately, rob a person of her liberty with fatal consequences.

Even more alternately, raping somebody.

Aside from these suspicions against these two brothers, there are new suspicions which at this point the prosecutor is not commenting on. To arrest the Kalpoe brothers, there had to be new facts and circumstances, that is the case!

5:10 pm
DT: The ex-girlfriend of Joran, Melody or whatever, is saying on RWV that the guy's name is Freddy Zedan.

5:11 pm
DT: Someone said that he was Joran's doubles partner in tennis.

5:16 pm
arubagirl: No person named zedan in the phone book, not that it means that he doesn't exist, just not in the phone book.

5:22 pm
DT: Jossy: We don't know that he was arrested in relation to this case, though he was questioned about it at the beginning. We have heard that he had alibi that said he was with Joran that night.

Dan Riehl said earlier that the Freddy guy is the same person who was staying at Joran's apartment that night.

5:24 pm
fluffy monkey: Geraldo said that this guy was a fake alibi and faked that he stayed with Joran that night.

5:24 pm
nancy drew: http://www.aeromodelers.sr.org/david/am28sep04.pdf  28 sept 2004
B-Doubles team Freddy Zedan/Joran van der Sloot beat Peter Villevoix/Lex Burgman in a surprise sweep

5:42 pm
HannieC: if there is a 4th person arrested than i think it`s significant that nobody seems to know who that person is nor his initials or name...Makes me wonder who that is.....(and then i`m not thinking of Paulus).BTW...

5:44 pm
bondia: Freddy Z.

Freddy's middle name is Alexander and it is customary to never use somebody’s last name in Aruba until they have been charged.

The rules were obviously broken in Natalee's case as it has been a free for all of accusations since the Beginning

6:00 pm
Port Valerie: New Greta Wire emailed at 5:41 PM:
What has caught my attention most is the timeline we have pieced together. From Satish's lawyer the other night on the show, we learned that someone was on the Internet at the Kalpoe residence from 2 a.m. to 3 a.m. Why did that person get off the Internet at 3 a.m.? Note that 3 a.m. is the exact time that Joran van der Sloot's second call went to Deepak's cell phone (the first was 2:40 a.m.)

Stay tuned. We will have more tonight.

6:01 pm
sunmoonstars: Catherine Crier/Friday

Crier: Can you tell me anything about this Freddy?

Jossy: We hear 2 versions: The official press release that the prosecution put out did not mention him at all

People are under the impression that his arrest may be related to another case

He was arrested in the beginning with relation to this same case

There is no mention from the police in regards to this third man

Third man is a friend of them, partied with them, many pics with him

He was questioned in the beginning in regards to the Natalee case

Do you have any info as to his whereabouts the night Natalee disappeared?

Jossy: I hear his alibi is that he was with Joran

6:02 pm
WonderWoman: ARAMBATZIS-RODRIGUEZ ALBERT, LILIAN REGINA, MONTANJA 39-F

6:02 pm
AZLady: I found an ARAMBATZIS-RODRIGUEZ, ALBERT and LILIAN REGINA who live in MONTANJA.

http://www.arubachamber.com/LC%20KLEIN%2005-06-2005.htm

6:05 pm
NativeLingo: MONTANJA 39-F is a neighbor of Joran's allright!

6:21 pm
bondia: As we have already told RED, SM usually knows what it going on before MSM and 99% of Aruba. Based on the Tennis match from AM Digital and the initials givin by the police F.A. (and usually most people in Aruba have at least 3 if not 4 initials in thier name) We were told that Joran has a friend named Freddy Alexander.

Since Jossy was the one who found the girls with the rape accusations, we are sure that he has the right Name since it is his find.

ARAMBATZIS in Montana sounds like a winner! Thanks for the Good work Monkeys.

6:25 pm
DT: Aruban attorney: I doubt that it is a coincidence this guy was arrested at the same time and lived near Joran.

6:31 pm
NativeLingo: DT, it wasn't a coincidence...

6:32 pm
nancy drew: They said it on Abrams...the part about Freddy knowing about the disposal of the body...

6:38 pm
Hat: Nancy, You mean Paulus recruited Freddy for the clean? Shades of Fagin.

6:42 pm
sandraK: Freddy Cuz..Lissette' ...lives..in Usa.... her Mom maybe is... Rebeca Zedan (Female, 52)

Location: Venezuela. his aunty?? or something?

6:43 pm
tcumom: Does anyone remember Geraldo's comments looooong time ago about porn stuff and pics? Think I'm remembering correctly.....just a comment.

6:45 pm
DT: Yeah I brought this up earlier, it would be insane if Geraldo turned out to be right. I can't think of one person who believed him when said this.

6:49 pm
sunmoonstars: Abrams Friday
Talking to Aruban attorney
A: What do you make of the arrest of this friend

Attorney: I agree with you that it is not coincidential. If you talk about separate charge, one of the separate charge is disposal of a body. Which is a separate crime. If this person who is a friend of Joran, I think the prosecution in the back of their mind want to crack him to see if he had something to do with the disposal of a body.

Abrams: Do you know that or speculating?

Attorney: No, there are many presumptions here.

6:51 pm
writenow: If Freddy has been brought in and Freddy, Joran & Jaime Carrasquilla were all best friends, is Jaime next to be arrested? BTW Satish is now calling himself the King of bling bling on his tickle site. Good grief. Maybe he's getting the bling bling from selling pics of naked girls.

7:01 pm
NativeLingo: No matter what, Aruba will always be the "One Happy Island". see you later......ciao

7:14 pm
OneSillyMonkey: My understanding of today's news is that Freddy was arrested, along with the Kalpoes, for the same crime (premeditated murder, disposal of body, etc). They must have more on him than just being in possession of and taking nude photos of underaged girls

7:17 pm
friend of monkey: but Vanderstraten does have a son jorans age? or not known?
 
7:18 pm
arubagirl: Just called Native, she's not mad, she had to go. I couldn't find the house, I'm sorry guys, I found 39, but not 39-K.

7:18 pm
HannieC: I believe his youngest son is 24 and the oldest 33 or 34

7:25 pm
HannieC: If I'm not mistaken it was 39 F ag,....

7:26 pm
arubagirl: I didn't find any house that had a letter behind a number 39, Hannie.

7:31 pm
sandrak: Rebeca Zedan (Female, 52) Location: Venezuela. Aunty ??

7:33 pm
bondia: WRITENOW said earlier that Jaime would be arrested! Are you part of the ALE or a clairvoyant of a Monkey PI. Who can spell his last name right?

7:37 pm
sandrak: Jaime Carrasquilla

7:39 pm
bondia: Good Try SANDRA K, but I have another spelling, but I have been wrong before. Rumors are strong that he will be picked up tomorrow.

7:43 pm
bondia: The Rumor on Aruba was that four were arrested today, but the police confirmed only 3, possibly another tomorrow. We spoke to Jaime and he thinks it is about some pictures that were taken in April, but they were deleted after the girl asked them to. He said they weren't illicit, but she didn't like them. They have all continued a friendship relationship since and he is surprised that she would be complaining now. Jaime also lives in Montana. To make it clear, he didn't even know that anyone has made a complaint, but that is the only thing he could think anyone could complain about. Since then, the girl has remained friends with all of them - even been to family parties at Joran's house.

7:53 pm
sandraK: bondia, Anyone with..."SA"..... as Nic?

7:55 pm
writenow: You're funny bondia. Monkey ALE PI clairvoyant. My new title. I posed it as a question not a fact.

You tell me -- are they going to arrest Jaime? he's tight with Freddy and Joran. Makes sense he's in this, too

7:56 pm
bondia: Hi SANDRAK

It was spelled out for us as Carasquia, but since he made his own tickle site, I will give him credit that he knows how to spell his own name, although...

As for SA - we would need more details.

8:00 pm
sandrak: Time will tell....

8:15 pm
writenow: Oh, one more thing.

Jaime lives on the same street as the van der Sloots. Jaime Carrasquilla/Carrasquilla, Acuna Omar/Montanja 232

8:48 pm
DT: Both Freddy and Jaime were present with the Van Der Sloots on Joran's 18th birthday at KIA

8:50 pm
I hear shango: DT....yes, they were and Koen was also there.

8:58 pm
mom2three: Father says the American media needs to lay off his son...told to Current Affair. He sort of threatened them to lay off. He told court that American media had invaded Joran's privacy by taping Joran. He helped the court set the $600K fine.

9:00 pm
bluebob: PVDS HELPED the court set the fine? He is involved at that level? This is really bad news.

9:01 pm
arubagirl: I highly doubt it. He probably demanded that sum and the court gave it to him, but it's not like he conferred with the judges and was like "yeah, one million, that's good, say that".

9:05 pm
I hear shango: Helen Lejuez said Freddy....physical evidence regarding the car......

9:06 pm
nancydrew: Hannity and Colmes....

Helen: says this is considered a gang rape...Freddy was brought in due to the car (which car???) .

Paul Reynolds: First time he's heard the term "gang rape"

H/C: Is this a homicide?

Paul Reynolds: Joran said Deepak raped, murdered Natalee

Helen...
60 Days now for the boys brought in today. The prosecutor told her this has to do with murder and rape. She has more info not from the prosecutor, and it is quite secure.

9:08 pm
arubagirl: So much for the gang-rape being 'secret', which my source told me it was.

9:10 pm
justinsmama: Is that what you were going to reveal around the 4th? Or part of it, anyway?

9:10
DT: Do you know anything more about this?

9:11 pm
arubagirl: no, this I heard today.

9:11 pm
little miss: Secret from who?

9:12 pm
arubagirl: No, nothing more, only about the gang-rape taking place.

9:13 pm
DT: Does this involve all of the boys, or just the three?

9:14 pm
friend of monkey: freddy lives behind jorans apartment...on FOX

9:14 pm
arubagirl: All of them.

9:32 pm
fluffymonkey: Larry King Live, Friday August 26, 2005

Dave Holloway : We were concerned about September 4 date coming up but now it looks like Joran is probably not going to be let go. FBI called and told us about Kalpoe brothers and Freddy. Prosecutor is very confident.

9:38 pm
I hear shango: polis chief was not overhead saying how can i do this to my best friend's son....he was on national tv saying it...I saw it with my own eyes.

9:45 pm
littletxlady: Geraldo told about the videos, gang rape and the best friend thing on the same night, in the very beginning of this case.

9:58 pm
sunmoonstars: Current Affair
We pulled several items off of Tickle.com

These three guys, particularly Joran described themselves as having pretty healthy sex drives
 
We learned of these before they were even arrested

Hooking up with women, it was explicit

They put their cellphones on the internet, we picked up the phone and called Joran in the very beginning

10:01 pm
friend of monkey: early on a gang bang tape w/ joran and a 14 yr old was mentioned here..

10:03 pm
kackylacky: yes by Geraldo...............and we all scoffed.

10:28 pm
crazybabyborg:  Anyone know what the nature of the alibi was that Freddy supplied for Joran?

10:30 pm
writergal: I think Freddie said he slept over at Joran's house on the relevant night

10:30 pm
DT: From what I understand, he said he stayed at Joran's apartment that night, which is something he and other friends often do. He claimed Joran got home at a certain time, and that he said he had met an American girl, but that nothing sexual had taken place.

10:41 pm
sleddogs: "At the beginning of the show they were talking about Freddy being linked somehow due to the car. Not sure which car...but, they referred to the info from the gardener... "

If I remember right a while back when they first brought the gardener in wasn't there a problem with him not being able to identify one of the K2's? Maybe that was because the other person in the car that night was later identified as Freddy.

10:42 pm
kackylacky: Jossy said on Abrams this afternoon, that freddy told ALE he was "with" joran that night...........and that was all that was said about it. The usual comments about that not being too smart was what followed.......no further detail. But I am thinking freddy may have tried to alibi joran for the time after the HI drop off.............which begs the question.........why did they arrest steve for giving deepak an alibi, but did not arrest freddy for doing the same for joran. Interesting.............

[Tibrogargan]

(snipped)

Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey!
You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were
hoping he was legit.

You are smart Magnolia and have a good memory.  I did call Mos a POS a few times didn't I 

San, I do remember you saying that maybe once or twice   

After following this case since the beginning I have to admit that anyone concerned with Aruba and the cover-up is "guilty until proven innocent" in my book

[Tamikosmom]

Kyle sent me this today


Kermit,
 
You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB.  Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted.  Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum.  The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case.
 
I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding:
I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired.  I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record.  Birmingham is not the office in charge.
 
The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee.
 
I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed.
 
I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited.  I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet.  Kermit doesn't matter".
So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case.  I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top.
 
Sincerely,
 
Kyle

Thanks Kermit.

The fact is ... confidentiality agreement of not ... the words of Kyle have been made public and ... those words expose that the Persistence undertaking was never about justice for Natalee Holloway and ... it was never about a measure of closure for her family.  It was all about John John Silvetti assisting the ALE in THE FINALE TO THE GREAT ARUBAN COVERUP.

Janet

________


JOHN SILVETTI

KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM

Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis

Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word

Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability.

Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again.

Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.

Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship.

Kyle: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap.


BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS

Private Eye: "If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy.  The effort was superb, but the game was fixed."

[San]

(snipped)

Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey!
You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were
hoping he was legit.

You are smart Magnolia and have a good memory.  I did call Mos a POS a few times didn't I 

San, I do remember you saying that maybe once or twice   

After following this case since the beginning I have to admit that anyone concerned with Aruba and the cover-up is "guilty until proven innocent" in my book

Hi Tibro nice to see you.

[Tibrogargan]

(snipped)

Well, San, you are smarter than the average monkey!
You even saw through Mos very early on, when most of us were
hoping he was legit.

You are smart Magnolia and have a good memory.  I did call Mos a POS a few times didn't I 

San, I do remember you saying that maybe once or twice   

After following this case since the beginning I have to admit that anyone concerned with Aruba and the cover-up is "guilty until proven innocent" in my book

Hi Tibro nice to see you.

Thanks San.  I am still around - mostly reading as a guest - waiting and hoping for answers and peace for Beth and Natalee's family.

[Tamikosmom]

PERHAPS KYLE VIOLATED THE COPYRIGHT HIMSELF

Kyle said: "She [BETH] needs to know exactly what we found in the proper timing. The way to do that would be through Tim Trahan and I. I can arrange any meeting with him. He represents the owner and the rights to the data, in this case, Louis S. I have everything but I don't want to go around him for chain of custody reasons, professional courtesy, and friendship."
 
The next step:
I will soon propose a meeting with Beth and other family members, myself, Tim Trahan, Peter DeVries, and whomever else necessary to go over the ROV video, contents, and case status. I would like a couple people very familiar with the case documents also present to help connect dots during the meeting. I would prefer meeting towards the end of April or mid-May to allow adequate time for things to shake themselves out if is going to. If necessary, I have an ABC (20/20) and CBS (early show) film crew ready and willing to take part in such a meeting should it require press coverage. I've already had a meeting with ABC about this and they are "definitely interested" at the executive level. We met in mid-Feb about this already. The question becomes timing, who needs to be there, and whether or not it's covered by the press. I prefer not, but it may be useful. DeVries doesn't need to be there in my opinion but he's good for ratings and helps ABC be cooperative if needed.


He certainly is a planner
[edited to protect the individual] needs to be called and ask to request the removal of the post by either her
or PI to Klaas. 

I agree.  I cannot comprehend why Kyle would be posting on a private site if he had a confidentiality agreement with Louis Schafer.  However ... I would have considered it honorable if Kyle had made the moral decision to shared with the FBI and/or John Q. Kelly and/or Natalee's family knowling that he faced a legal challenge from Schafer.

Kyle

it is not too late.  A measure of closure for the family of Natalee Holloway dictates that a hero must step up to the plate and reveal the happenings on board the Persistence endeavor ... the happenings that you know from first hand observation imply that Natalee Holloway's remains could have been in that trap/cage.  Think about it ... John Silvetti betrayed the hope of the family of Natalee Holloway and ... John Silvetti betrayed the trust of those who sacrificially donated to the endeavor.

Sincerely, Janet

[Magnolia]

In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying
Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage
and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say.

The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see
is beyond explanation and the fact that people would
continue to protect the responsible parties is more than
I can understand.

[Keepthefaith]

In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying
Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage
and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say.

The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see
is beyond explanation and the fact that people would
continue to protect the responsible parties is more than
I can understand.

I agree. It's the most inhumane,as well as dispicable thing i can think of!

[Anna]

On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such.

[Tamikosmom]

Kyle sent me this today


Kermit,
 
You and the others agreed to a statement of confidentiality and nondisclosure at FB.  Before I posted any information, I posted a copyright notice at the very start which disallowed ANY and ALL of my posts, intellectual property, or pictures to leave the spot they were posted.  Everyone, including yourself, acknowledged this affirmatively. A lawyer said that ownership of that posted material cannot be transferred by a general claim of copyright such as a claim made on the front page of a website, or even by verbal consent. Written agreement, meaning a signed agreement, is required for the post to be owned by the site owner. Without a signed agreement, the poster owns the post. I did not give you permission, which I have stated many times when you were in violation. While the rest agreed, you violated this legal agreement repeatedly. You have taken many of my posts, snipped what you wanted to put them into your context, and then shared them in a public forum.  The "public domain" notion only applies where someone has copyright ownership over the work in the first case and that ownership has lapsed. In that case, all posts can be freely reproduced by anyone, anywhere, without violating copyright law. However, this is clearly not the case.
 
I will state this with absolute clarity so there is no misunderstanding:
I have confirmed with the FBI on multiple instances that they have had possession of the ROV videos since very early on. I personally didn't send the ROV footage to them because another project lead had already at the first opportunity while we were still in Aruba. I sent all of the ROV screen shots directly to the FBI the day they were acquired.  I also got confirmation back in February by Tim Trahan who was in constant contact with Beth during the search that she indeed had all the information including the statements and has seen the ROV videos. I personally confirmed all of this with the senior FBI agent in charge of the investigation as well as given him my personal account of all that I witnessed and knew. They have this on record.  Birmingham is not the office in charge.
 
The information you have been spreading is not only inaccurate and a violation of a non-disclosure, it is slanderous and spreading misinformation. The damage it has done to my professional relationship with J. Silvetti is incalculable which has a direct effect on my ability to provide for my family, which includes my daughter named after Natalee.
 
I have neither publicly responded to your provocative antics, or retaliated with personal attacks in response to yours. I also have never threatened you as you publicly claimed.
 
I recently asked the senior FBI agent in charge how I should handle this situation which you have incited.  I thought his response was terrific. He replied: "Just sit back and keep quiet.  Kermit doesn't matter".
So this is exactly what I've done. I wrote this letter to you as a gesture of courtesy in hopes it would save you from further embarrassment from those who actually know something about this case.  I'm not referring to myself, rather the family and lead investigators who are out legitimately investigating this case in pursuit of justice right to the top.
 
Sincerely,
 
Kyle

Kyle

If the "lead investigator" you are referring to is not an FBI agent ... then the "investigation" into the contents of the cage/trap is for naught.  I do not think for one moment that either  Mos or Richardson is going to take the fall for the coverup in regards to Natalee's remains.

Sincerely, Janet
_______

KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM

kyle: Richardson was onboard the Persistence several times and attended the meetings on the boat. You may see a glimpse of him on the Dateline video in the survey room along with Mos standing over my shoulder


Postbus 1163, Oranjestad, Aruba
Havenstraat 2
Oranjestad
Aruba

To All media
From The Public Prosecutor’s Office
Date February 26, 2008

Pages 1

The Aruban Police requested the FBI Laboratory to process the cloth, because the Laboratory already had a sample of the exact match of the type of material of Natalee Holloway’s blouse. The FBI Laboratory received that material on the 22nd of January 2008.

On the 25th of February 2008, the Prosecutors’ Office received the official report from the FBI Laboratory that showed that the two materials were not a match.


THE ROV IMAGES

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 -
« Reply #408 on: November 24, 2008, 03:59:08 PM »

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555618#msg555618


THE FABRIC

KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM

Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap.

Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric.

Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs).

Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising.

Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.

[texasmom]

In all of this there are only two things that matter: bring Natalee home and to give peace and closure to her family. All this sue this person or that person or anything else cannot compare to the agony Beth must endure every waking moment. People who want justice for Natalee, if that's what they REALLY want and are not after personal glory for themselves, would not be threatening to me or anybody else. They'd just want the information to get into the right hands.

With that said.....
 

I agree 100% Kermit!   

[San]

In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying
Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage
and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say.

The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see
is beyond explanation and the fact that people would
continue to protect the responsible parties is more than
I can understand.

The only reason I can think of is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

People turn on their own for this.

My integridy means more to me than money.  So if someone were to offer me a boat load of cash to tell a lie I could not do it.

[Magnolia]

On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such.

I think you are right, Anna.

Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin
posted the first set of pictures to a "private site".

He knew what could happen.

[texasmom]

In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying
Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage
and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say.

The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see
is beyond explanation and the fact that people would
continue to protect the responsible parties is more than
I can understand.

I agree with you Magnolia.  It's just sickening!

[Tamikosmom]

On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such.

I do believe Kermit is right.  It is Kyle Kingman who is in violation of a copyright agreement with Louis Shafer by posting the ROV images as well as his concerns regarding the John Silvetti/ALE connectin.

Janet

[San]

On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such.

I think you are right, Anna.

Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin
posted the first set of pictures to a "private site".

He knew what could happen.

If Kyle is planning on suing a certain person then he better be planning on suing the forum that he posted this information.

When do I need Cyber Liability Insurance?

Anyone with a Web site now has the legal liabilities of a publisher.

The Internet - that technological wonder of worldwide communication - has spun a whole new “web” of liability exposures.

Creating a Web site is simple. The exposures that come with it are not. Privately owned companies that venture onto the World Wide Web face liability exposures that are emerging, evolving, and complex.

Commercial companies that disseminate information to the public via Web sites face the same legal exposures as publishers, yet most have little or no concept of their resulting legal responsibilities. Moreover, new legislation continues to create potential liabilities, particularly in the areas of user privacy and domain name infringement.

Why do I need Cyber Liability Insurance?

Traditional liability products do not address Internet exposures and the risks involved in Internet business have blossomed with the Net itself. That is why you need Cyber Liability Insurance from InsureNewMedia.

By disseminating information to the public via a website, commercial businesses now have some of the same exposures as publishers. These include conventional publishing exposures such as copyright infringement, defamation and invasion of privacy, as well as emerging exposures related to operating on the Web.

The universe of potential plaintiffs is staggering, given the number of people and organizations that are currently surfing the Net. A potential legal action from just one of them could be costly. In a 1999 case, a company improperly used a sports celebrity’s name and photograph on its web site, and the celebrity sued for the “fair market value” of his name, plus additional damages of $750,000. Clearly, the potential liability associated with web site content is already great, still growing, and rapidly evolving.

For a company operating in today's high tech world, your computer network will more than likely provide internal and external email. You will probably have your own web site providing information about your company, its products and services with even the possibility of e-commerce.

[San]

Yes I know he posted information here at SM but we are a public forum.  What he is claiming is that he posted specific information on a private forum that he didn't want made public.

[Tamikosmom]

In my opinion, ANYBODY who was complicit in denying
Natalee's family access to the contents of that cage
and the subsequent cover-up is a POS, as San would say.

The thought that that is Natalee's remains that we see
is beyond explanation and the fact that people would
continue to protect the responsible parties is more than
I can understand.

BINGO!!!

[San]

On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such.

I do believe Kermit is right.  It is Kyle Kingman who is in violation of a copyright agreement with Louis Shafer by posting the ROV images as well as his concerns regarding the John Silvetti/ALE connectin.

Janet

He is in deep doo doo.

[San]

On the internet as long as attribution is given, I don't believe there is anything actually "copyrighted" as such.

I think you are right, Anna.

Besides, Kyle had just seen what happened when Robin
posted the first set of pictures to a "private site".
He knew what could happen.

Exactly.  He was not dumb or naive.  He knew exactly what he was doing.

When you play with fire you get burnt.