Natalee Case Discussion #786 12/17/08 - 12/24/08

[Tamikosmom]

Did Kermit breach this "confidentiality and nondisclosure" agreement?  Might that be a problem for the FB Kermit?  The SM Kermit?

Yes ... I believe there might be some legal fallout for Kermit.

However ... I do believe that Kyle ... a young man who held a responsible position on the Persistence ...  may have breach a confidentiality agreement with Louis Shaefer when he posted the ROV images and shared inside information regarding the Persistence undertaking at a private site.

I do not know the legal ramifications encompassing Kermit breaking with a confidentiality agreement he made with a poster on an internet forum but ...

1.  How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle was about to reveal images and information that implied the Persistence undertaking to recover Natalee's remains was a fraud?  It was not about justice for Natalee Holloway.  It was not about closure for the family.  It was all about John Silvetti's self-serving motives.  It was all about scamming unsuspecting donors.

2.  How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle was about to reveal info that implied that there was a real possibility that Natalee Holloway's remains were in that trap/cage and were retrieved and taken custody by the Aubans without a challenge from John Silvetti.

3.  How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks.

I am thankful that Kermit went out on a limb fully aware that there could be consequences ... went out on a limb to expose John Silvetti's betrayal to the family ... John Silvetti's betrayal to the donors ... when he assisted in THE FINALE' TO THE ARUBAN COVERUP.

In other words ... Justice for Natalee Holloway and ... closure for her family were Kermit's priority.  Doing right is never wrong even if there is a personal price to pay.

Janet

+++++++++

JOHN SILVETTI

KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM

Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis

Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word

Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability.

Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again.

Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.

Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship.

Kyle: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap.


THE FABRIC

KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM

Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap.

Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric.

Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs).

Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising.

Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.


DEAL WITH THE NETWORKS

KYLE KINGMAN'S POSTS TO A PRIVATE FORUM

Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal.

[WhiskeyGirl]

'I wish this was true , ' Alfonso Caruana answered when the judge showed him a article claiming the Cuntrera-Caruana clan possessed 60 per cent of Aruba.Most observers agree the clan never owned that much of the island.Certainly , the records of the Chamber of Commerce fail to confirm such an allegation.On the other hand company-ownership or real estate property could well be hidden through the construction of Aruban off-shore limited liability companies offering strong secrecy provisions.With a chain of such companies on different Caribbean islands , it is almost impossible to track anything.In the Caribbean , the most insignificant island-states tend to compete with each other , offering the most unwarranted , unverifiable legal constructions of companies , trusts and off-shore banking regulations.

60% = Alfonso Caruana?

http://www.zoominfo.com/people/Caruana_Alfonso_21479360.aspx

In 1993 the Italian daily Corriere della Sera reported that the Cuntrera-Caruana clan owned 60 per cent of the Caribbean island Aruba, part of the Kingdom of the Netherlands. The first independent mafia state was born, according to the newspaper. That claim proved to be exaggerated, however.[1][13]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuntrera-Caruana_Mafia_family

[Tamikosmom]

San ... please edit my post.


3.  How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks.

Thanks

Janet

[San]

San ... please edit my post.


3.  How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks.

Thanks

Janet

Done.

[Tamikosmom]

San ... please edit my post.


3.  How was Kermit to know when he made the agreement that Kyle would negate on his initial intentions of turning the images and his concerns regardng certain happenings on board the Persistence over to the family/FBI as well as the ROV images and ... seek out deals with major networks.

Thanks

Janet

Done.

Thanks San.

Janet

[texasmom]

Another hanging suicide in Aruba, can't see pockets.

http://www.24ora.com/content/view/6845/8/

[2NJSons_Mom]

Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum.  It can't work both ways.  Were lies uncovered.

His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed.  I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar.  Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. 

[texasmom]

http://www.amigoe.com/artman/publish/artikel_50696.php

Google translation:

Finger-pointing democracy
19 Dec, 2008, 15:01 (GMT -04:00)

  Email this article
  Print this article
 
AFTER THE ROADS OF voiced criticism on the police force, our Minister of Justice, Rudy Croes, Thursday, December 4, 2008, indicated that Van der Straten aware the investigation into the Natalee Holloway case has frustrated. That these allegations are true is recommended.
Our Minister of Justice points the finger to the ex-Police, but argues it is not innocent. The Staff and the State scheme do not the ministers responsible for nothing. Especially when it comes to matters of which the Minister himself has indicated on the extent of it. If leader is now Rudy Croes once responsible for his officers.
Even if it is established that these allegations are untrue, the minister accountable for his careless remarks. Whether he realizes that by itself is not the wide publicity surrounding his statements the international reputation of Aruba is affected, which could have adverse consequences for international trade and relations with other countries?
Codified this principle of ministerial responsibility in Aruba problematic: only through the control of the parliament a minister can be held responsible. And everyone knows that the majority of the Aruban parliament not verify, but according purports. This is harmful for the truth, harms the public debate and damaging to democracy.
Meanwhile, in theory, the full political responsibility of ministers. The ground looks more like a finger-pointing democracy, which is blamed everyone except the ultimate responsibility itself: the Minister. Our Minister of Justice is doing so well with its disapproval of the finger at the mirror to itself and a bottle of ministerial responsibility before uncorking old and new.

JUAN DAVID IRAUSQUIN
Vvoorzit

[Magnolia]

Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum.  It can't work both ways.  Were lies uncovered.

His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed.  I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar.  Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. 

Potty mouth!

[texasmom]

I wish Private Eye would come by and tell us his thoughts. 

[KYcat]

HELLO MONKEYS!  I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE????  CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS?  NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. 

THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE.

 

[San]

Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum.  It can't work both ways.  Were lies uncovered.

His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed.  I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar.  Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. 

Potty mouth!

I couldn't think what it was until you said that    Then a light bulb went off.

[MuffyBee]

HELLO MONKEYS!  I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE????  CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS?  NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. 

THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE.

 

Hi KYcat    I see you.  And I hear you, loud and clear.   

Some post at Scared Monkeys and also at private forums.

[Magnolia]

HELLO MONKEYS!  I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE????  CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS?  NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. 

THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE.

 

KYcat, I guess San or 2NJ better tell you. 

[Tamikosmom]

Well, I hate to sound like a broken record but how will we ever know if that was Natalee's remains in the fish trap or not?

Considering the revelation of the ROV images that the Arubans had no idea existed and ... considering it was an American endeavor that located the cage/images ... I believe the FBI should have some authority to put some pressure on Aruba to reveal what was retrieved.

Also ... if Kyle Kingman were willing to step up to the plate and reveal to the FBI what he posted on a private site and the SM site regarding the events encompassing the chain of custody of the contents over to the enemy ... regarding John S.'s Aruban conflict of interest ... maybe ... just maybe ...

I really don't know but ... I believe with all my heart that Persistence endeavor need to be exposed for it was ... a scam to assist the Aruban is the final coverup.

Janet

+++++

BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY'S POST TO THE SCARED MONKEYS FORUM

Private Eye: "If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy.  The effort was superb, but the game was fixed."

[texasmom]

HELLO MONKEYS!  I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE????  CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS?  NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. 

THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE.

 

Hi KYCat! Good to see you!!!!!

[KYcat]

Okay.  Thank You Muffy and Magnolia!!  I guess It is sorta not a good idea to talk about so I won't. 

But a GREAT BIG THANK YOU for my hello!

 

[2NJSons_Mom]

Kyle wanted to post stuff on this forum with the same members who post on a private forum.  It can't work both ways.  Were lies uncovered.

His radar went up when PI posted about the 'denim' and it was so obvious that one would question why he was so disturbed.  I would have said this in another manner but it would have been a remark that was not my norm, and I'd have to don my original avitar.  Those who have been here from the start will know....and I might have to put it back on shortly. 

Potty mouth!

   Not so very potty but I did raise two sons, and I would have used one of their Dad's statements.......

[KYcat]

HELLO MONKEYS!  I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE????  CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS?  NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. 

THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE.

 

Hi KYCat! Good to see you!!!!!

THANK YOU  ... Good to see everyone.  We won't give up on Natalee. 

 

[San]

HELLO MONKEYS!  I AM HOPING SOMEONE WILL ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE MY PRESENCE HERE????  CAN SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT IS GOING ON WITH PRIVATE FORUMS?  NOT TRYING TO STIR STINK, JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT IS GOING ON. 

THANKS FOR ANY RESPONSE.

 

KYcat, I guess San or 2NJ better tell you. 

I can't I said I was going to be good for the rest of the night.