Caylee Marie Anthony, 2, FL Missing since June 16-just reported by mother #80

[da sparkenator]

Even though you knew Caylee was dead, didn't you feel like you were sucker punched when it was announced?

Yes, Bearly, absolutely.   And for me it was particularly unreal.  I had taken the day off from work and was on dial up at my boyfriend's house.  I was trying to catch up on the boards and was making my usual flippant remarks on the previous thread.  Two hours later I found out and skipped ahead on the boards.

I never doubted for a minute that Caylee was no longer with us, but the news came so quietly (reading it on the web)  that it seems unreal.  It's not like in the movies when things follow according to script and there is appropriate clues and music, you know what I mean?

I feel sort of a depression like women might feel after having a baby or when you have been totally involved in a project and it's over.  (Although I realize this investigation and the trial that will follow is far from over.)

As to the speculation that Casey might have gotten Caylee involved in child pornography, I have a hard time accepting that.  I think though that maybe Casey was running in crowds where it could have eventually happened and therefore maybe someone suggested to her to use drugs to subdue her when she/Casey was trying to party.  I don't think it quite got to the point where Caylee was sexually abused.

I do think it is much more likely that Casey was involved in some kind of sex parties or amateur porno.  I don't think she was a call girl, she didn't have enough money and didn't have enough opportunity.  (She was always on the phone and how can you be a call girl when your child is often with you?)

I do want to ask something of you and other monkeys, however.  Did you notice how fresh and beautiful Caylee was early on and later she did not look so well?  To me, she didn't look her beautiful self when she was in the car seat holding her dollie.  Instead of thriving as she got older, the opposite seemed to be true.


The hardest thing to accept is that we will probably never know what really happened.

I was also on a roller coaster about the meter reader and all that speculation but I have come to one conclusion and that is he saw a bag that wasn't related and his interest came from the foul smell in the woods.  I'm quessing he kept calling cause there was no indication that his lead was being followed up on or he got an attitude from the people he reported his concerns to.

Because of my faith in God and my understanding of God's timing, I see the discovery of the body as a miracle and a blessing.  Just a couple of weeks ago I though we would never find her body at all.

I am praying for the sick dysfunctional people that didn't give Caylee the life she deserved.  The alternative would be to be consumed by hate.

Thanks for "listening".

Karen

[Bearlyhere]

Hello ....well I bought the enquirer today just to read what Kiomarie had to say................I think she's kinda weird...wonder how much they payed her for that interview!

Hi HiHo!!!

[Bearlyhere]

But you know, she cant get away with it.  There is no other person who would have wrapped the baby in her own blanket, put her book in there, placed her so close to home, no one but her mother.

IMO and yours.  What about a jury?

[higherhopes]

Hello ....well I bought the enquirer today just to read what Kiomarie had to say................I think she's kinda weird...wonder how much they payed her for that interview!

Hi HiHo!!!

Hello, how are you today?

[Fuzzball]

At this point, I truly think the Anthony's are damned if they do and damned it they don't.  But they brought this on themselves and I have no sympathy for them!! JMO

oooppssss I got locked outta the last cage...cooking cookies and they needed attention!  AS far as sympathy....WHY?  these people have known Caylee was deceased as long, if not longer, than we have. When the results of the hair in the trunk with the death band, coupled with all the other indication...THEY KNEW!! Had they not coddled Caset in jail and at home...had they gotten tough, had they not carried on with her lies...had they told her THEY KNEW...perhaps, just perhaps she might have admitted it or at least got mad and said something that would have led to recovering Caylee's body. I blame them, in part, for Caylee laying in the field for all those months.

I so agree!  Never did we hear them ask her "Casey, I need the truth, I need to know!"  They just helped Casey perpetuate her lies.  Actually, I think Casey told them exactly what they wanted to hear.  In a way, I think Casey continued her lies to appease Cindy.

I still have to wonder how different, if any,  it was when she got home after her first bail was posted. 

Casey would not have told the truth just because Cindy "needed to know." She wasn't just appeasing Cindy with her lies, she was controlling her. Sociopaths don't care if their parents get angry. They don't care if their parents are hurting or crying. They don't care what others want or need, including living and breathing.

It is all but impossible to discipline such a child, because they feel no guilt, no remorse, and never feel responsible for anything, and so anything you do to them, is nothing but a reason for them to get even with you. Casey would not have told her parents anything unless it suited her purpose to do so. There really is nothing they could have done, to get the info from her.

They might even have been advised by a counsellor about how to talk to Casey to get the most cooperation from her: never tell a sociopath you "need" anything. Never expect them to care about you or how you feel. Always act as if you think their feelings are the most important thing. This is the only way to keep their trust. Feed their egos and pretend it's all about them, and they will trust you and drop their guard eventually. If you show disapproval, even a little bit, you become the enemy.

Never let them know you don't believe their lies, or they'll get paranoid. The way Cindy talks to Casey, looks to me very much as if she's been coached by an expert. JMO. And she did admit she was seeing a counselor to figure out how to deal with Casey, and the counselor had advised her to try to get custody.

Fuzzball I think you hit it on the head here. 

I agree, Casey is a sociopath.  But CA just kept feeding her lies!!  I would still have asked her! I would have to!  They could have used her bail as bait but chose to keep it all going!!  I don't think they were coached by anone except maybe Baez!! JMO

I disagree. Cindy WAS seeing a counselor. She didn't even know Baez when she was first asking Casey questions about Caylee's disappearance. It is hard, exhausting work talking to a real narcissist, and when you know they're going to lie to you anyway, really you pick your battles and you don't waste your time and energy trying to achieve the impossible.

Mytime, you say you would have asked her, and of course you would have, because you hadn't just spent 22 years coping with her. When you have spent 20+ years dealing with a sociopath you might feel differently. Cindy knows that Casey won't care if she cries, yells, etc....Cindy has very little bargaining power with Casey, and the one time she used what little power she had, she lost Caylee.

Her grand, short experiment with "tough love" cost her everything.

[mytime]

I am sorry to say I am no fan of Wendy Murphy!  Yes, she says what's on her mind - and I admire that but her opinions on certain things are just wrong, IMO.  I hate when she talks about the Ramseys.  I followed that case, and no one will ever convince me that they played a role in the killing of Jon Benet!!

I disagree on Jon Benet. 

Nothing would surprise me in the Caylee case.  Casey was capable of anything, imo.

No one will ever know with that case as the investigation and evidence was so botched.

However, if it happened today and a little girl was found dead in the parents home, evidence was found on the duct tape to the mom and both parents refused lie detector tests and did not cooperate with the police imagine what we all would be saying?

I am just saying. Apply those same principles to this case and forget the personalities. In covering cases for over 3 years now I have come to one conclusion ... people are capable of anything, especially parents with crimes on this children. One of the saddest and most heart wrenching cases I was ever covered and was involved with was the Marcus Fiesel.

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2007/02/21/liz-carroll-mother-of-3-year-old-murdered-fotser-child-marcus-fiesel-found-guity/

I was actually emailed and comments posted on SM regarding our coverage of this case and how terrible we were by the mother. Actually she made threats and called me every name in the book The next day she was arrested for the murder of her son.

Unfortunately the Jon Benet case is one that will never be solved.

I remember this case very well!  Foster care parents need to be supervised far more than they are.  Foster care case workers need to be better trained.  As a former child abuse investigator, I met so many foster care parents I wouldn't leave my dog with!!  I couldn't believe someone actually certified some of these poeple!!   

[Shell]

Hey Monkeys, I have been having a bad day today. I lost my grandmother year ago. I don't know if it is Caylee being found or my sadness of not going to my grandmother's funeral that has put me in a funk. I had to go to London for a Led Zepplin concert when my Grandma passed, so that is pretty crappy on my end and I am feeling really gulity today because I didn't go to her funeral. 

I HOPE and PRAY Casey feels 1 million times the guilt because she doesn't go to Caylee's funeral.

I hope this isn't too off topic, but I have been crying all day.

I'm sorry about your grandmother. Sounds like that was a long time ago, but you're a good person and you still feel guilty. Casey isn't capable of feeling guilt. If she were, she would have confessed to the murder long long ago. for that matter, she probably would not have committed the murder.

You being there did not make a tinkers dang in the kingdom of heaven, I feel confident your Grandmother made it and would probably have been delighted you made the concert. Please do not put regrets on yourself. We all usually have them when we lose someone close but there is really no reason. We do what we can at the time. I had some regrets at some of my losses but you know what? ...it respects them more to remember the good times with them rather than our own loss. Time can not go back, only forward. Try to live with the good memories and your energy focused on the moving forward. However, we feel what we feel, and I wish you peace.

[Wyks]

I read with interest the discussion on living life with seperate realities.  It's a really deep process to understand, hard to explain, certainly can't explain it fully in a forum such as this. 

Basically tho, what happens is that a person can actually live with two or more realities.  One reality is what actually occurred in their life.  A second reality is what the person *would like* their life to be like.  A third reality is their current day to day life, which they've managed to fashion for themselves.  Sometimes working on a fourth reality because they aren't happy with their current reality, perhaps blending some of their second reality in. 

A person doing this isn't necessarily 'delusional' or 'psychotic', even if they may act like it at times.  They may pick and choose which reality they are living at the moment.  Living with a person like this can be a nightmare, on the other hand, some have it so under control hardly anyone notices. 

Problems begin for this person when their realities collide.  I think this is, in part, what has happened with Casey and Cindy.  (Both of whom seem to live their own seperate realities, as well as having at least one in common).  I believe that at least a few of their seperate realities have been on a collision course for quite some time, and when they crashed, Caylee was the casualty.   

I don't know that any of this makes sense to anyone else.  Could just be one of my current realities.   

It does make sense and sounds very much like Casey to me and maybe Cindy. 

Wyks - what is your background?  If I may ask.  Do they know they are doing this and can it be stopped??

Social Work, I'm an LCSW, have worked mainly with abuse survivors.    

This is the kind of thing that can go either way, some are consciously aware of what they do, others may have some degree of awareness, while others haven't a clue.  I do believe the answer is in helping a person to become aware of what their belief systems and realities are, how it is or isn't helping them to function in healthy ways, and to make changes as needed to face life living one current reality. 

 

[BluesyGram]

And Casey has always lied to her family and her friends, and they have either believed it or didnt care enough to dispute her word, but the courts will not be like that.  They will not accept the lies.

She had no idea. for some reason, that they would actually check her story out.  Imagine!!!!  Going to Universal, walking down the halls...left, right, left , right...turn around...I lied...I don't work here....Unfathomable!!!!  Did she think they were going to stop her and say...Oh, guess you do work here, nevermind.

[cecilita]

TO ALL MONKEYS:
I wish everybody a wonderfull time this coming holidays I will not be able to see you guys for awhile I am going to my country to see my family Merry Christmas my friends

[Bearlyhere]

Why Do the Anthony's always say Caylee was 3 years Old??????? She never had the chance to be 3!!!!! Thanks to that whole crazy family. I don't know why that bothers me so bad but it REALLY, REALLY DOES!!!!!

Because she was only 2 months away from her 3rd birthday when she died. She was over 3 1/2 feet tall and over 35 lbs.  If you say she was 2, people picture a baby like she was in her pictures over a year ago. She looked like a 3-year-old, not a 2-year-old. IMO saying she was 3 gives a much more accurate picture of what she looked and acted like.

I understand.

I feel that Caylee was robbed of her third birthday and by saying she is three, the Ants make it seem like that theft never happened.  Her third birthday and the rest of her life was stolen from her.

[Bearlyhere]

I read with interest the discussion on living life with seperate realities.  It's a really deep process to understand, hard to explain, certainly can't explain it fully in a forum such as this. 

Basically tho, what happens is that a person can actually live with two or more realities.  One reality is what actually occurred in their life.  A second reality is what the person *would like* their life to be like.  A third reality is their current day to day life, which they've managed to fashion for themselves.  Sometimes working on a fourth reality because they aren't happy with their current reality, perhaps blending some of their second reality in. 

A person doing this isn't necessarily 'delusional' or 'psychotic', even if they may act like it at times.  They may pick and choose which reality they are living at the moment.  Living with a person like this can be a nightmare, on the other hand, some have it so under control hardly anyone notices. 

Problems begin for this person when their realities collide.  I think this is, in part, what has happened with Casey and Cindy.  (Both of whom seem to live their own seperate realities, as well as having at least one in common).  I believe that at least a few of their seperate realities have been on a collision course for quite some time, and when they crashed, Caylee was the casualty.   

I don't know that any of this makes sense to anyone else.  Could just be one of my current realities.   

It does make sense and sounds very much like Casey to me and maybe Cindy. 

I think Cindy does it also.  Notice how she always says Casey is just like her.  And look how Cindy can change her stories on a dime.  I was thought I was gonna get whiplash.

 

I like the way you put that Blue1.

[Lucinda]

TO ALL MONKEYS:
I wish everybody a wonderfull time this coming holidays I will not be able to see you guys for awhile I am going to my country to see my family Merry Christmas my friends

Merry Christmas to you too, cecilita, have a great time with your family!!!!!

[Bearlyhere]

They had the Jon Benet case on that Haunting thing and I watched it last night.................

   The Anthony's have always known something wasnt right with Casey.......always, and I think they were just to busy trying to make her into something she wasnt....They needed to realize there was nothing they could do about Casey and consintrate on Caylee. They should have never said a word to casey, used her past behavior in their favor and taken steps to have Caylee's custody put in their hands.

KC's behavioral disorder needed to be addressed a long time ago.  Ignoring something does not make it go away.  Notice the same beginning in ignore as the word ignorant.

[mytime]

Fuzzball, I completely agree with what you are saying about Casey.  No doubt, she is a true sociopath.  However, were I differ from you is CA. 

I know CA saw a counselor - don't know haw many times though!  IMO, I hardly think that CA was going to have someone else tell her how to handle her own daughter.  She always knows best!!  She may have used custody of Caylee to threaten Casey but still never acted on it.

I truly believe CA has some kind of personality disorder as well.  She couldn't even take advise from her free experienced lawyer - Nejames.

If she truly knows Casey was a sociopath then why perpetuate the fraud!!  To gain Casey trust??  I just don't think so.  Just my opinion!!

[Bearlyhere]

Hiyas, has the ME said the time of death, could that be determined?
Im interested to hear what wanda Weary has to say for herself, after claiming she saw and spoke to Caylee getting that flight to Atlanta.  Her storys been blown right outta the water now, hope they charge her.  I mentioned this before, but Im so behind. 

I thought Australia was ahead of us, not behind!

How are you today?

[mytime]

TO ALL MONKEYS:
I wish everybody a wonderfull time this coming holidays I will not be able to see you guys for awhile I am going to my country to see my family Merry Christmas my friends

Thank You Cecilita,  Have a safe and happy holiday!! 

[Lucinda]

Hiyas, has the ME said the time of death, could that be determined?
Im interested to hear what wanda Weary has to say for herself, after claiming she saw and spoke to Caylee getting that flight to Atlanta.  Her storys been blown right outta the water now, hope they charge her.  I mentioned this before, but Im so behind. 

I thought Australia was ahead of us, not behind!

How are you today?

Hello Bear, yes we are ahead of USA, but "Im" behind 
Getting over a tummy virus I caught off DH 

[Bearlyhere]

Even though you knew Caylee was dead, didn't you feel like you were sucker punched when it was announced?

Yes, Bearly, absolutely.   And for me it was particularly unreal.  I had taken the day off from work and was on dial up at my boyfriend's house.  I was trying to catch up on the boards and was making my usual flippant remarks on the previous thread.  Two hours later I found out and skipped ahead on the boards.

I never doubted for a minute that Caylee was no longer with us, but the news came so quietly (reading it on the web)  that it seems unreal.  It's not like in the movies when things follow according to script and there is appropriate clues and music, you know what I mean?

I feel sort of a depression like women might feel after having a baby or when you have been totally involved in a project and it's over.  (Although I realize this investigation and the trial that will follow is far from over.)

As to the speculation that Casey might have gotten Caylee involved in child pornography, I have a hard time accepting that.  I think though that maybe Casey was running in crowds where it could have eventually happened and therefore maybe someone suggested to her to use drugs to subdue her when she/Casey was trying to party.  I don't think it quite got to the point where Caylee was sexually abused.

I do think it is much more likely that Casey was involved in some kind of sex parties or amateur porno.  I don't think she was a call girl, she didn't have enough money and didn't have enough opportunity.  (She was always on the phone and how can you be a call girl when your child is often with you?)

I do want to ask something of you and other monkeys, however.  Did you notice how fresh and beautiful Caylee was early on and later she did not look so well?  To me, she didn't look her beautiful self when she was in the car seat holding her dollie.  Instead of thriving as she got older, the opposite seemed to be true.


The hardest thing to accept is that we will probably never know what really happened.

I was also on a roller coaster about the meter reader and all that speculation but I have come to one conclusion and that is he saw a bag that wasn't related and his interest came from the foul smell in the woods.  I'm quessing he kept calling cause there was no indication that his lead was being followed up on or he got an attitude from the people he reported his concerns to.

Because of my faith in God and my understanding of God's timing, I see the discovery of the body as a miracle and a blessing.  Just a couple of weeks ago I though we would never find her body at all.

I am praying for the sick dysfunctional people that didn't give Caylee the life she deserved.  The alternative would be to be consumed by hate.

Thanks for "listening".

Karen

Thanks, Karen.  There was a lot of good thoughts in your post.

I did notice how Caylee looked confused and scared toward the end.  It did not escape me that it appeared Lee enjoyed torturing her also.  Wonder what that was about.  Was he jealous?  We have gone over the 'maybe Lee is the father' thing many times.  Can we think of another reason?

[mytime]

Bearly, It may just be a simple as Lee was a big tease?  Or it may not!  Did that you any??