Natalee Case Discussion #788 12/31/08 - 1/01/09

[jen3560]

I don't believe for one second that Tim Miller was removed from the Persistence because he was an emotional liability.  Yea that's what I was told.  pppfffttt.

Really? 

[snoopy]

Happy New Year's Monkeys !!

Happy New Year Johan. 

Hopefully 2009 will bring Natalee home to Alabama soil.  I believe Aruba can make that happen.  I'm with Magnolia in that they have Natalee's remains.

[truthseeker2]

Happy New Year's Monkeys !!

AND MAY 2009 FIND JUSTICE FOR NATALEE!

[snoopy]

I don't believe for one second that Tim Miller was removed from the Persistence because he was an emotional liability.  Yea that's what I was told.  pppfffttt.

Really? 

Yep and at that time I kept telling myself that this was not right and that the messenger was being mis-lead.  I kept hoping that she would see that but didn't.

[ldstlou]

come across........

Snoops I was waving at you in the last thread and didn't realize I was locked out!

Lisa I hope you saw my last post to you....but just in case you didn't I am bring in here

Quote from: ldstlou on Today at 11:08:36 AM
Quote from: SunnyinTX on Today at 11:04:30 AM
I don't post on the Natalee thread anymore because I do not feel I have anything to offer....however I do read and try to keep up, except for the past month or so... this morning I had  time to get caught up and now I wish I didn't.  I think I know why many of us no longer post here. MY GOD!  I have never seen monkeys at each others throat like this. I don't give a damn who you are...or how close you feel you are to 'the family' if you think the family is going to tell you everything...get REAL!!  You post on a public forum...........the family is not stupid. I am really sickened to read a lot of what is on here.....just because someone, 'in the know' tells you something doesn't mean it is TRUE or factual. I am not taking sides with anyone...........but I sure wish some of you would step back....go back and read what you write..............when I read a post that starts out with 'you people' I immediately think Oh F..here we go again!!!  OK...back to lurking........Happy New Year to everyone. Klaas  and Mods...Bless your hearts

I take it that was directed at me. I am surprised that you don't have a problem with the conspiracy theory Kermit has come up with. Lives are disrupted and careers and relationships are being destoyed and thats ok?

Lisa.....I didn't direct anything at you...please don't put words in my mouth.  You know me well enough to know that if I was directing this at you I would have said so. I am not known for being 'politically correct'.  I had an opportunity to read this entire thread this morning and I posted what I felt after reading it.  I don't know who I believe..I don't know what I believe...and reading this thread did nothing to help me.

Sorry Sunny, I was finishing up an online exam...and sorry for jumping the gun...feeling a bit ganged up on lately and a bit sensitive!!
Sorry I misread you post!!

[Tamikosmom]

ldstlou
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #787 12/24/08 -
« Reply #968 on: Today at 03:06:07 PM »

... I have copied and posted to Jug all of Kermits "evidence" and it hasn't changed his opinion, so I am assuming he does not feel he was duped my Kyle or the members of the persistence.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4269.960

+++++++++++


Lou

Has Jug Twitty been privy to the following compilation of Kyle's own words?

Yes.  No.

Janet

_______

KYLE KINGMAN - PRIVATE FORUM

Kyle: I have not given anything to the FBI since the pictures and statements from Dec 29th

Kyle: None of us gave any statements to the authorities after the 29th. It's possible John Silvetti did, because he was the only one conversing with them after Jan 7th.

Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal.

Kyle: In case it isn't clear.. notice the blue denim-like fabric

Kyle: The Aruban divers were on the police boat, dove from their boat, and returned to their boat.

Kyle: They were immediately whisked away by the Aruban police and not seen of again by us on the 7th

Kyle: John stood back and waited and worked with the Aruban Polis

Kyle: John definitely believed the Arubans at their every word

Kyle: John didn't want Tim Miller on board the Persistence because he said Tim wasn't necessary any more and was a liability

Kyle: John told me then he didn't want to hear me ever mention the trap again.

Kyle: Schafer is sue crazy.

Kyle: I did not feel the same and we had a major difference in opinion. He [John Silvetti] was the one who never pressed ALE to be completely open with us with the trap evidence. I would have forced them to. However, John was the one paying my invoices so I was forced to sit back and hope for the best.

Kyle: We all know it wasn't a blouse, but I believe they were sent some piece of fabric other than the fabric found inside the trap.

Kyle: I've talked with Peter Shouten numerous times back in February. He hasn't seen anything but knows about the blue fabrics. DeVries and Endemol was interested in purchasing the ROV footage and I was working between them, ABC, and CBS to strike a deal.

Kyle: Louis is currently working with someone who I do not know to put together some documentary on the case, the way it was handled, and what happened during the search. I learned this from Tim T. yesterday. Louis was sold on the idea that it will make him a lot of money.

Kyle: The portion of the discolored blue fabric was presumably on the bottom of the fabric. In my opinion this discoloration is not another type of fabric, but rather biological staining or discoloration from biological growth caused from a high organic carbon content and decay. Basically, during decay a biological mat will form around the organics from remains. This is what I believe it is on the bottom of the fabric.

Kyle: John Silvetti told me today that he may be returning to Aruba very soon for a few days.

Kyle: I couldn't get the logs from the Persistence. All things "Holloway" were stripped from the boat once it got back to Louisiana

Kyle: He's [John Silvetti] seriously making plans to open an Aruba office so he can conduct business easier in S. America and that would allow him to do that.

Kyle: It was confirmed by the FBI that they received a fabric sample send by Richardson and that it wasn't a match to Natalee's blouse. I think the video can prove or disprove whatever the FBI was sent was the same object or not. I strongly believe it's blue denim. Everyone I show thinks the same thing without being prompted (including senior ABC execs).

Klye: We're being fed misinformation to keep us searching and out of their way while they cover their asses, destroy evidence, cover their tracks, and keep us out at sea and away from the trap.

Kyle: neither Dave, Robin, or Beth has seen any of the ROV footage aside from what was broadcasted on Dateline or the pictures leaked from the FBI to Dave (and Robin H.). Beth has seen nothing in my knowledge.

Kyle: John is not a believer in the trap. He took ALE's word as gospel that it wasn't case related, yet never studied the videos or bothered to inquire further. He had plans on doing business with Aruba and in S. America and he didn't want to hurt any feelings by talks hinting at lack of complete trust and friendship.

Kyle: Notice the end of the skirt is an identical match to the 90 degree angle in the sand. I believe her left arm was outstretched with her legs slightly bent. I did not edit the legs. I believe the tarp was placed over her and tucked around her, or perhaps tied down. I believe there are several rocks laying on the sand which were placed on the tarp, or inside the tarp over her body which explains their unusual location. Either way, the proportions appear promising.

Kyle: I took the proportions of the body form from the head, to shoulder, to a 90 degree angle which I believed to be the hem line of Natalee's skirt. I then took those proportions and matched them to the photo of Natalee with what she was last seen wearing. The proportions matched within an inch from head, to shoulder, to skirt line. Based on this comparison and with what we believed we saw in the Dec 29th video, Tim Miller contacted the family and told them the 99.9% comment. I told Tim not to do anything until we have forensic results back after the site is processed. Jan 7th we sampled the contents and in my opinion we found the skirt under the sand along with the other items The blue fabric was found right where the skirt is pictured. If it isn't her, it will forever haunt me as a major cosmic WTF.

kyle: Richardson was onboard the Persistence several times and attended the meetings on the boat. You may see a glimpse of him on the Dateline video in the survey room along with Mos standing over my shoulder.

Kyle: The bags were removed just after the ROV got out of the way when the divers took the samples to their boat.... and took off

Kyle: We're close to finding the Dirty Hand and a major leak plaguing the investigation. I believe they're linked. I'm assuming Caps isn't deep inside ALE, but do we know that he isn't? We need to figure out who Cap's source is and what he does.  Can we confirm Destiny's source is a Dairio reporter? If so, do we know who this would be? Could it be Eduardo Mansur???

Kyle: THis is what I'm trying to figure out now. I need to know the leak! I believe Caps is only one step away from DirtyHand

Kyle: I need to know what we know about Caps and Destiny. I need their names if possible.

Klye:  I did not give the information to the FBI and I'm unaware of anyone relaying the possibility to them.

Klye: I havn't spoken to Beth and don't plan to personally.


KYLE KINGMAN - SCARED MONKEYS

JANUARY 26, 2008

oceanexploration
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #715 1/25 -
« Reply #103 on: January 26, 2008, 12:38:25 PM »

Thought you all may find this interesting if you're willing to accept it-

To date, the Aruban police and dive team has been a tremendous help.  They've honestly done a great job. Over the last month we've established a very good working relationship based on openness and trust.  Most of the relationship success was due to getting the media out of the way and working together shoulder to shoulder over time.  We've helped each other however and whenever we can.  They've treated us with decency and respect and we have treated them as friends and allies, which they are. Most of the police and divers are new since this case started and both eager and careful to do things right.  I wish we had a month ahead of the project just to establish the relationships and trust. I know many of you would likely doubt this view, but it's based on the experiences in the field of the entire search team. I too was extremely worried, paranoid, and suspecting in the beginning.  Now, it's clear we're all working towards a common goal.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2539.msg332457;topicseen#msg332457
 

MARCH 19, 2008

oceanexploration
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #744 3/19 -
« Reply #201 on: March 19, 2008, 08:21:47 PM »

We had little option other than to have the Aruban dive division recover the samples and bring them back under their care.  Remember we are Americans working in Aruban waters, subject to their laws, invitation, and blessing.  Our hands are tied for the most part. I personally was extremely uncomfortable with the chain of custody, being that we weren't a part of it, but I was powerless to do anything about it.   The samples were photographed in detail by one Aruban diver and the other two investigated the contents of the trap, the dimensions, the rigging, and what surrounded the trap.  From the video, it looked like they did a diligent and careful job with the samples and the underwater photography.  I don't know who has these pictures, but I must assume ALE.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2721.msg366857;topicseen#msg366857

 
BROTHER OF BETH HOLLOWAY - SCARED MONKEYS FORUM

private eye
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #746 4/4
« Reply #499 on: April 09, 2008, 12:39:50 AM »

If I understood Kyle correctly, and that would be that the Arubans retrieved and possessed all finds, not sharing anything with the crew, then that effort was a waste of time and effort. The only thing it could have accomplished was to locate additional evidence for the Arubans to destroy. I am not sure if that was the protocol out of Aruba's waters though. The effort was superb, but the game was fixed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2769.msg372245;topicseen#msg372245


THE ROV IMAGES

Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 -
« Reply #408 on: November 24, 2008, 03:59:08 PM »

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555618#msg555618
 
 
Re: Natalee Case Discussion #778 11/23/08 -
« Reply #410 on: November 24, 2008, 04:01:55 PM »

Photos given to the FBI sent to Dave and Robin posted on the internet are NOT the
photos posted above.  These were not given to the FBI until recently.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4173.msg555621#msg555621
 
++++++++++
 
Kyle Kingman
Senior Geophysical Project Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc.
Greater New York City Area

Current
Senior Geophysical Operations Manager at Alpine Ocean Seismic Survey Inc.
 
Past
Manager at Kingman Geophysical Solutions
 
Education
Rutgers, The State University of New Jersey-New Brunswick
 
Industry
Oil & Energy

[ldstlou]

ldstlou.Did Kyle turn over all pertinent information over to the Holloway family as well as the FBI in a timely manner?Yes or No?

See that's not specific enough, I want to know precisely WHEN KYLE turned over the information he thought he had to Beth/Jug and the FBI.  I would also want to know why KYLE was negotiating with the networks to gain financially from this prior to turning over what he thought he had to the family and FBI.

I understand Klaas.Ldstlou?WHEN did Kyle turn all pertinent information over to the FBI as well as the Holloway family?

I'm sorry guys - she's not going to be able to answer that, because it never happened.

I would like to see the creative dates that she may try and come back with though.    And see just how they correspond with what/when/how we (including Kyle) know transpired.

Thanx Jen.That is the point!If Kyle didn't turn information over in a timely manner and has mislead people.Why defend him?Let him speak for himself!

ok...in one post you ask me questions about when and what was turned over and in the next you say don't answer for him.

[snoopy]

ldstlou I wish you would re-think everything you have been told.  Search members for Kermit, Kyle, Tamikosmom, wingnut, jen3560.  Read all their posts.  They are not lying.  JMHO  you have been mis-lead.

[Keepthefaith]

ldstlou.Did Kyle turn over all pertinent information over to the Holloway family as well as the FBI in a timely manner?Yes or No?

See that's not specific enough, I want to know precisely WHEN KYLE turned over the information he thought he had to Beth/Jug and the FBI.  I would also want to know why KYLE was negotiating with the networks to gain financially from this prior to turning over what he thought he had to the family and FBI.

Ld stlou??

[MumInOhio]

I am 10 pages back in the other thread, and forgive me if I am wrong, But Muffy and 2NJS are you saying I am a mole?
What the heck has got in to some of you?

 As for a flyby...I only just caught up and Kermit posted. My post from last night has been posted about before since November. Did either of you see the posts?

I asked Kermit questions which she did not answer after she was here 2 visits ago. She did not acknowledge my questions on her next questions.

She cut and pasted bits of posts from Shango for her posts. I checked and posted on this. More than once. She cheated to make her her point.

I joined a Private forum, because of the constant talk about this trap. Other things were happening we have been told  over and over to focus on the trap. No matter what else I posted about I very seldom got a response. As well as if you don't buy what some here are saying they treat you ugly.

Yesterday you welcomed 2 Newbies with open arms from a Private forum...But this is different...How!

I don't know what their motives for joining SM after all this time was, but as far as I am concerned I don't know either of them from a bar of soap...so they will both have to any respect from me!

[Buckeye]

buckeye:

I do have a little question.  JQK seemed to want to run with the trafficking story.  I just wonder if that is to bring the case to a level of international involvement.  This could permit an international investigation.  The investigation may come to the conclusion that there was no trafficking and the remains were hidden in a cage.  Is it important to "believe" in a bigger theory to legally involve more than internet posters and hidey hole sleuths??

truthseeker2:

I wondered the exact same thing when JQK was talking to Greta.  I even posted questions about it here at SM...but not many were interested in discussing it at that time.  If JQK can move this story or theory, I think it could get more international attention and put more pressure on Aruba to get to the truth.  At the very worst it could put a spotlight on this huge problem even if the truth about Natalee does not surface.

 

[2NJSons_Mom]

ldstlou.Did Kyle turn over all pertinent information over to the Holloway family as well as the FBI in a timely manner?Yes or No?

See that's not specific enough, I want to know precisely WHEN KYLE turned over the information he thought he had to Beth/Jug and the FBI.  I would also want to know why KYLE was negotiating with the networks to gain financially from this prior to turning over what he thought he had to the family and FBI.

I understand Klaas.Ldstlou?WHEN did Kyle turn all pertinent information over to the FBI as well as the Holloway family?

I'm sorry guys - she's not going to be able to answer that, because it never happened.

I would like to see the creative dates that she may try and come back with though.    And see just how they correspond with what/when/how we (including Kyle) know transpired.

Thanx Jen.That is the point!If Kyle didn't turn information over in a timely manner and has mislead people.Why defend him?Let him speak for himself!

ok...in one post you ask me questions about when and what was turned over and in the next you say don't answer for him.

I don't remember you posting a response with a date and what was turned over.  In essence, you have not answered for Kyle with respect to that.  jmo

[Tamikosmom]

Sent to me by Natalee's Freebirds:

Please feel free (if you'd like) to post this at your board.
 
During the journey of the Persistence to Aruba, Kyle reached out and emailed with us.  During that time, one of the questions posed to him was regarding protocol if/when Natalee's remains were found.
 
Kyle's response was that he was unsure, but felt that would be settled before the search began.
 
The cautions were given to him about the lack of integrity on the part of Aruba's law enforcement, prosecutor's office, and its judiciary.
 
Contact with Kyle continued throughout the duration of the search by the Persistence.
 
Once back home, Kyle asked us for our help.  He was very concerned about the activities that transpired during their search - specifically surrounding the find of the fishing cage and its contents.  Kyle wanted our help in presenting this information in a factual way, to then be given to Natalee's family. 
 
This was March 18, 2008.  At that time, Kyle assured us he had just recently sent the images from the Dec 30th and Jan 7th dives to the FBI, but had never received a response from them.
 
We later found that to be false.
 
Also at that time, Beth's brother saw the images Kyle had shared with us - but none of the detail he shared later.

We compiled the images Kyle presented us, along with his opinions and the facts surrounding the sequence of events regarding that fishing cage.  Kyle stated he would be getting in touch with Beth Holloway.
 
We later found out that never happened.

At this time, Kyle shared with us the broadcast networks he had approached in February, in an attempt to sell these images to the highest bidder.
 
This didn't concern us greatly at that time - as we were under the impression US law enforcement and Natalee's family had already been made aware of their find.
 
Approximately May 2008 Kyle began dodging questions for details (we had asked for names of Aruban police and divers to be included in our documentation of these events), hedging on moving forward with this, and then he completely disappeared from our board.
 
During that time, we learned Kyle had never contacted Beth, or Dave, or the FBI with this information.
 
We put our original plan into motion - that of presenting this information in a clear and concise manner, and we sent it to Beth Holloway.
 
Beth was disturbed, needed time to digest the information, and wanted to share it with someone she trusts.
 
When Tim Miller was returning to Aruba this past fall, Beth gave us permission to release this information publicly.
 
At that point, we gave it to John Kelly, Carmen Adams with the FBI, and got it ready for public consumption.
 
The next step was to publish this information at our blog.
 
One of our members felt we were betraying Kyle in doing so, contacted him, and he re-surfaced at our site with threats of litigation against us - stating this was his "intellectual property" and we could not use it.
 
That of course concerned us greatly - as none of us could afford to be sued.
 
He also stated at that time, Luis Shaefer had just recently sold the rights of the video of these images to a broadcast company for the purposes of a documentary.
 
We contacted legal counsel and were advised to keep our distance from any Persistence crew member, in the face of potential obstruction/accessory charges.
 
At this point, one of our members decided to brace for the possibility of civil litigation, resigned from our membership to protect it from same, and posted what he knows to be factual at SM.
 
Kyle did tell us human remains were found in that fish cage.
 
Kyle did tell us about John Silvetti's intent to open an office on the island of Aruba, to enable him ease in conducting business in South America, and Aruba.
 
Kyle also told us of John's absolute refusal to give that fish cage and its contents any credence - before even it was inspected on Jan 7th.
 
Kyle told us in no uncertain terms that Tim Miller and Dateline were abruptly removed from the Persistence on Dec 30, resulting in only Persistence crew being aboard between that date and the Jan 7 dive of the Arubans.
 
Nothing that was posted at SM by kermit was incorrect, out of context, or in any way false.
 
Regards,
 
Former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator
Natalee and her family deserve justice - and we will not let up until they have it!

[ldstlou]

ldstlou.Did Kyle turn over all pertinent information over to the Holloway family as well as the FBI in a timely manner?Yes or No?

See that's not specific enough, I want to know precisely WHEN KYLE turned over the information he thought he had to Beth/Jug and the FBI.  I would also want to know why KYLE was negotiating with the networks to gain financially from this prior to turning over what he thought he had to the family and FBI.

I understand Klaas.Ldstlou?WHEN did Kyle turn all pertinent information over to the FBI as well as the Holloway family?

I'm sorry guys - she's not going to be able to answer that, because it never happened.

I would like to see the creative dates that she may try and come back with though.    And see just how they correspond with what/when/how we (including Kyle) know transpired.

Thanx Jen.That is the point!If Kyle didn't turn information over in a timely manner and has mislead people.Why defend him?Let him speak for himself!

ok...in one post you ask me questions about when and what was turned over and in the next you say don't answer for him.

My bottom line is I am not involved in any conspiracy as stated my kermit yesterday, neither is Lalas.

I feel from the bottom of my heart that the members of the Persistence did a heroic deed in their search for Natalee at great expense to their time, and personal resources..and now at the expense of friendships and careers.To take what they did and turn it into a conspiracy to hide evidence and transfer bones and shoes etc to a pond in order to facilitate the conspiracy...I think it is just wrong.

I am not trying to brag about who I know or don't know, I simply sought out more answers when this came up, from Jug and from Kyle. I am satisfied with their answers.

I have said all along there are posters here who know Tim Miller and could ask his opinion on the matters, why won't anyone do that?

Others know the Holloway family...why not ask them? I would if I knew them.

[Keepthefaith]

ldstlou.Did Kyle turn over all pertinent information over to the Holloway family as well as the FBI in a timely manner?Yes or No?

See that's not specific enough, I want to know precisely WHEN KYLE turned over the information he thought he had to Beth/Jug and the FBI.  I would also want to know why KYLE was negotiating with the networks to gain financially from this prior to turning over what he thought he had to the family and FBI.

I understand Klaas.Ldstlou?WHEN did Kyle turn all pertinent information over to the FBI as well as the Holloway family?

I'm sorry guys - she's not going to be able to answer that, because it never happened.

I would like to see the creative dates that she may try and come back with though.    And see just how they correspond with what/when/how we (including Kyle) know transpired.

Thanx Jen.That is the point!If Kyle didn't turn information over in a timely manner and has mislead people.Why defend him?Let him speak for himself!

ok...in one post you ask me questions about when and what was turned over and in the next you say don't answer for him.

I don't remember you posting a response with a date and what was turned over.  In essence, you have not answered for Kyle with respect to that.  jmo

[ldstlou]

ldstlou I wish you would re-think everything you have been told.  Search members for Kermit, Kyle, Tamikosmom, wingnut, jen3560.  Read all their posts.  They are not lying.  JMHO  you have been mis-lead.

Snoopy I have read the posts. The posts are copied and pasted from the Freebird's forum...taken out of context. I know what they are and I know what they all say by now. Because they were taken out of context, I went straight to the source and asked for an explanation. He responded openly and honestly in my opinion. I am not an idiot and don't believe I have been mislead.

However...when Kermit starts posting shoes and skulls being moved by John Silvetti from the cage to the pond and Lalas and me being a part of the grand conspiracy and "bubbles being burst" and single handily exposing the cover-up...THAT is suspicious to me.

[jen3560]

I don't believe for one second that Tim Miller was removed from the Persistence because he was an emotional liability.  Yea that's what I was told.  pppfffttt.

Really? 

Yep and at that time I kept telling myself that this was not right and that the messenger was being mis-lead.  I kept hoping that she would see that but didn't.

Oh good crimeny sakes! 

Here is a post from private eye on Dec 30 of last year.  Interesting reading of his posts from that day and the 31st.

Have to believe that was the result of a phone call from Tim Miller to Beth (just like he called Dave), only for Tim to then be given the heave-ho from the boat - and lord only knows what happened to the items recovered from that trap on Jan7th.  Oh -and before any confusion arises - no, her family does not have them. 


private eye wrote on December 30, 2007:

This may be an old subject, and if it is please forgive me.

What would you do if you were Beth and a body in a crab trap is found?

Turn it over to the Aruban authorities?

Turn it over to the FBI?

Closure vs Risk of magically turning blood into chocolate

[Keepthefaith]

ldstlou I wish you would re-think everything you have been told.  Search members for Kermit, Kyle, Tamikosmom, wingnut, jen3560.  Read all their posts.  They are not lying.  JMHO  you have been mis-lead.

Snoopy I have read the posts. The posts are copied and pasted from the Freebird's forum...taken out of context. I know what they are and I know what they all say by now. Because they were taken out of context, I went straight to the source and asked for an explanation. He responded openly and honestly in my opinion. I am not an idiot and don't believe I have been mislead.

However...when Kermit starts posting shoes and skulls being moved by John Silvetti from the cage to the pond and Lalas and me being a part of the grand conspiracy and "bubbles being burst" and single handily exposing the cover-up...THAT is suspicious to me.

Was Kyle not BANNED from Freebirds?Why?

[klaasend]

buckeye:

I do have a little question.  JQK seemed to want to run with the trafficking story.  I just wonder if that is to bring the case to a level of international involvement.  This could permit an international investigation.  The investigation may come to the conclusion that there was no trafficking and the remains were hidden in a cage.  Is it important to "believe" in a bigger theory to legally involve more than internet posters and hidey hole sleuths??

truthseeker2:

I wondered the exact same thing when JQK was talking to Greta.  I even posted questions about it here at SM...but not many were interested in discussing it at that time.  If JQK can move this story or theory, I think it could get more international attention and put more pressure on Aruba to get to the truth.  At the very worst it could put a spotlight on this huge problem even if the truth about Natalee does not surface.

 

That is the only reason why I can think of JQK acting as if he believes Joran's latest BS story and I did mention it at the time.  I have said many times that I don't believe for one minute that JQK or Beth believe what Joran said in his last interview to Greta. 

[SunnyinTX]

wingnut and jen3560 thank you for coming here and talking to us.  It means a lot.  And I hope you know that I have always appreciated the Freebirds work.

Ditto for me......we all want the same thing...the truth....