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Author Topic: Natalee Case Discussion #792 1/9/09 - 1/13/09  (Read 204335 times)
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jen3560
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« Reply #760 on: January 12, 2009, 05:17:01 PM »



Do we know who Jossy was getting his information from?Caps?

Keep in mind - by this time, this witness had all of this in the form of a written statement. 

He had met with Silvetti, and........was it Helen Lejuez or Vinda DeSousa?  I don't remember which one.

Right.

klaas told us that she put CAPS in touch with Lala's and Hotshot.

Hotshot told us she put CAPS in touch with Silvetti.

HOW did she know Silvetti???


 

Excellent question Sharon!

And yet our birdie consorting with the "caps in crowd" said that it was DAVE HOLLOWAY who put Caps in touch with Silvetti, via Tim Miller (who was LONG GONE from the boat by that time, btw - so that couldn't have worked).

Who was lying to whom?  And all of these people are on the same message board together right now - and it just kills me that they are all believing each other - when it's obvious some of them are lying/being lied to.
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jen3560
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« Reply #761 on: January 12, 2009, 05:19:12 PM »



And why send Caps to Silvetti?

That also is an excellent question!

Everyone/anyone who lives on Aruba KNOWS that pond dries up on its on in their dry season.  It has been dry twice (that we know of) between May 2005 and February 2008.

So why pick THAT pond - knowing that story wouldn't hold any water? (no pun intended).
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Keepthefaith
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« Reply #762 on: January 12, 2009, 05:20:09 PM »



Do we know who Jossy was getting his information from?Caps?

Keep in mind - by this time, this witness had all of this in the form of a written statement. 

He had met with Silvetti, and........was it Helen Lejuez or Vinda DeSousa?  I don't remember which one.

Right.

klaas told us that she put CAPS in touch with Lala's and Hotshot.

Hotshot told us she put CAPS in touch with Silvetti.

HOW did she know Silvetti???


 

Excellent question Sharon!

And yet our birdie consorting with the "caps in crowd" said that it was DAVE HOLLOWAY who put Caps in touch with Silvetti, via Tim Miller (who was LONG GONE from the boat by that time, btw - so that couldn't have worked).

Who was lying to whom?  And all of these people are on the same message board together right now - and it just kills me that they are all believing each other - when it's obvious some of them are lying/being lied to.

I got a sense that they continue to Lurk here on a steady rotation! JMOO
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« Reply #763 on: January 12, 2009, 05:20:14 PM »



Do we know who Jossy was getting his information from?Caps?

Keep in mind - by this time, this witness had all of this in the form of a written statement. 

He had met with Silvetti, and........was it Helen Lejuez or Vinda DeSousa?  I don't remember which one.

Right.

klaas told us that she put CAPS in touch with Lala's and Hotshot.

Hotshot told us she put CAPS in touch with Silvetti.

HOW did she know Silvetti???

Dave may have given her contact to Silvetti.  Some people find a way to interject themselves into these cases.
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jen3560
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« Reply #764 on: January 12, 2009, 05:23:40 PM »

klaas - that's certainly a possibility.

I guess I don't understand why the need to go the route thru HotShot, since Caps and Dave were emailing each other?
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sharon
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« Reply #765 on: January 12, 2009, 05:25:16 PM »



Do we know who Jossy was getting his information from?Caps?

Keep in mind - by this time, this witness had all of this in the form of a written statement. 

He had met with Silvetti, and........was it Helen Lejuez or Vinda DeSousa?  I don't remember which one.

Right.

klaas told us that she put CAPS in touch with Lala's and Hotshot.

Hotshot told us she put CAPS in touch with Silvetti.

HOW did she know Silvetti???

Dave may have given her contact to Silvetti.  Some people find a way to interject themselves into these cases.

Thanks klaas!

So I've come full cirlce 

I'm still trying to figure out who brokered the Dave/Schaeffer,Silvetti deal.

 
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jen3560
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« Reply #766 on: January 12, 2009, 05:28:05 PM »



Thanks klaas!

So I've come full cirlce 

I'm still trying to figure out who brokered the Dave/Schaeffer,Silvetti deal.

 

I think the only question is - who put Shaefer and Dave in touch with each other?

Shaefer brought Silvetti on board - remember, at first there were 2 completely different ships that were going to be used.

Then VERY last minute - it changed to the Persistence.
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Magnolia
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« Reply #767 on: January 12, 2009, 05:28:19 PM »

I think Hotshot is a nut that likes to insert herself into details of
this case, but I do not think she would intentionly divert the
investigation.  She makes really dumb choices like buying the
ticket to Aruba while boycotting the travel show....says she has
to go and get the DNA off the rocks.
She could have conspired to "create" evidence in the form of
a witness, but I do not think she would knowingly divert the
investigation from Natalee's remains.  She may have been duped.
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« Reply #768 on: January 12, 2009, 05:32:59 PM »



Thanks klaas!

So I've come full cirlce 

I'm still trying to figure out who brokered the Dave/Schaeffer,Silvetti deal.

 

I think the only question is - who put Shaefer and Dave in touch with each other?

Shaefer brought Silvetti on board - remember, at first there were 2 completely different ships that were going to be used.

Then VERY last minute - it changed to the Persistence.

Why?
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« Reply #769 on: January 12, 2009, 05:36:44 PM »

klaas - that's certainly a possibility.

I guess I don't understand why the need to go the route thru HotShot, since Caps and Dave were emailing each other?

1.  Caps started posting on the front page of SM 12/20/07 and he asked how he could join the forum. I emailed and told him.  He then joined the SM forum on 12/20/07.  I thought it might be helpful to have an Aruban posting again.

2.  Caps talked about solving the Shango/Simian riddle.  He wanted to contact Dave or Beth.  I arranged for him to contact via email people I knew had direct contact with either Beth or Dave (I do not).  So I facilitated Caps getting ahold of both Hotshot and Lala's.    Now, if there was some kind of sneaky behind the scenes going on already between Hotshot and Caps I wouldn't know about it and I don't think that was the case.

3.  It is my understanding that it was Hotshot that did get Caps in touch with Silvetti.  Dave probably didn't have the time or inclination to deal with Caps and so Hotshot handled it.

I do not know Caps motives.  I believe I do know who he really is.  He did say he knows or is friends with Clyde Burke (that bothers me). 
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jen3560
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« Reply #770 on: January 12, 2009, 05:36:58 PM »

ktf - I don't know.  I sure wish we did.

Remember - folks at cng are stating that Jug Twitty KNEW the Persistence's MAIN goal for that trip was oil related.

True?
False?

If it is true - then that shows Shaefer and Silvetti both to be two of the biggest opportunists I've heard of!

To capitalize a pre-planned oil trip by stating it was a humanitarian mission to find and bring home Natlaee Holloway would be one of the more disgusting things those two have done.
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Magnolia
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« Reply #771 on: January 12, 2009, 05:38:33 PM »



Thanks klaas!

So I've come full cirlce 

I'm still trying to figure out who brokered the Dave/Schaeffer,Silvetti deal.

 

I think the only question is - who put Shaefer and Dave in touch with each other?

Shaefer brought Silvetti on board - remember, at first there were 2 completely different ships that were going to be used.

Then VERY last minute - it changed to the Persistence.

Why?

Schaffer sold the larger of the two ships to the Dutch
before he ever took possession of it.  That was due to
money porblems.  Don't know about the smaller ship.
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« Reply #772 on: January 12, 2009, 05:38:52 PM »



Thanks klaas!

So I've come full cirlce 

I'm still trying to figure out who brokered the Dave/Schaeffer,Silvetti deal.

 

I think the only question is - who put Shaefer and Dave in touch with each other?

Shaefer brought Silvetti on board - remember, at first there were 2 completely different ships that were going to be used.

Then VERY last minute - it changed to the Persistence.

Alot of thing changed at the last minute including the Dateline access.  Tim Miller was going to give us (SM) daily updates on the search.  That ended when Dateline got involved as I'm sure the wanted exclusive rights (except for what Kyle was allowed to post on his blog).
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jen3560
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« Reply #773 on: January 12, 2009, 05:39:53 PM »

klaas - that's certainly a possibility.

I guess I don't understand why the need to go the route thru HotShot, since Caps and Dave were emailing each other?

1.  Caps started posting on the front page of SM 12/20/07 and he asked how he could join the forum. I emailed and told him.  He then joined the SM forum on 12/20/07.  I thought it might be helpful to have an Aruban posting again.

2.  Caps talked about solving the Shango/Simian riddle.  He wanted to contact Dave or Beth.  I arranged for him to contact via email people I knew had direct contact with either Beth or Dave (I do not).  So I facilitated Caps getting ahold of both Hotshot and Lala's.    Now, if there was some kind of sneaky behind the scenes going on already between Hotshot and Caps I wouldn't know about it and I don't think that was the case.

3.  It is my understanding that it was Hotshot that did get Caps in touch with Silvetti.  Dave probably didn't have the time or inclination to deal with Caps and so Hotshot handled it.

I do not know Caps motives.  I believe I do know who he really is.  He did say he knows or is friends with Clyde Burke (that bothers me). 

Thanks Klaas - I understand better now.

I believe we also know who caps really is.  And I agree - very troublesome that he has a connection with Clyde Burke - considering what we've all learned about him.
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« Reply #774 on: January 12, 2009, 05:41:13 PM »



Thanks klaas!

So I've come full cirlce 

I'm still trying to figure out who brokered the Dave/Schaeffer,Silvetti deal.

 

I think the only question is - who put Shaefer and Dave in touch with each other?

Shaefer brought Silvetti on board - remember, at first there were 2 completely different ships that were going to be used.

Then VERY last minute - it changed to the Persistence.

Why?

Schaffer sold the larger of the two ships to the Dutch
before he ever took possession of it.  That was due to
money porblems.  Don't know about the smaller ship.

Sold a ship to the Dutch?Oh man.Silvetti goes into business with the Dutch.Correct!Seems Shaeffer and Silvetti are all too cozy with the Dutch!
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jen3560
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« Reply #775 on: January 12, 2009, 05:42:30 PM »



Alot of thing changed at the last minute including the Dateline access.  Tim Miller was going to give us (SM) daily updates on the search.  That ended when Dateline got involved as I'm sure the wanted exclusive rights (except for what Kyle was allowed to post on his blog).

I remember Kyle told us that the Dateline thing was supposed to be centered on TES - not this case, per se.

That when they found the cage and Dateline happened to be on board, that's when the Dateline show became all about this case...........and Silvetti was..................well...............unhappy to say the very least.

That's really too bad that Tim was no longer able to give you guys daily updates.  That would have been invaluable.
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jen3560
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« Reply #776 on: January 12, 2009, 05:48:14 PM »



Thanks klaas!

So I've come full cirlce 

I'm still trying to figure out who brokered the Dave/Schaeffer,Silvetti deal.

 

I think the only question is - who put Shaefer and Dave in touch with each other?

Shaefer brought Silvetti on board - remember, at first there were 2 completely different ships that were going to be used.

Then VERY last minute - it changed to the Persistence.

Why?

Schaffer sold the larger of the two ships to the Dutch
before he ever took possession of it.  That was due to
money porblems.  Don't know about the smaller ship.

Here's some more info on that:

APACHE WAS THE FIRST SHIP,,,,,,THEN LOOKS LIKE IT STILL WORKED FOR SHAEFER LATER

SUPERIOR OFFSHORE INTERNATIONAL INC. - DEEP Current report filing ... The Gulmar Falcon, a DP II DSV, returned to service in October 2007 on a saturation diving project in the U.S. Gulf of Mexico and began generating revenues ...
sec.edgar-online.com/2007/ 11/15/0000950134-07-024064/Section6.asp


this is same boat, read the next paragraph

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

The M/V Apache has been involved in operations with the DP DSV Falcon from 2-25-07 to 3-15-07. The Apache has been working in a support role with the Falcon transferring both supplies and personnel to the vessel. The Apache has been maintained in a state of readiness with a full crew ready to perform tasks as needed. The crew of the Apache has performed in a professional manner and displayed a safety

OE posted:
  First, WOW I haven't heard anything about two ships, or ships of that size being used in the search. I don't know where this information came from.  The Persistence was the right boat for the job.  Let me explain over kill.  Over kill was when we were finished using the capabilities intrinsic to the Persistence.  This includes a geophysical suite, namely side scan sonar, magnetometer, and bathymetric mapping abilities.  Once this portion of the work was complete, we no longer needed these capabilities. The information that came out early on about these tw boats you mentioned... I have not seen... and I was involved in the planning.

There was a re-direct in which ship would be used before the Persistence.  I'm unsure of the boat that was to be used, but it withdrew at the last minute during mobilization if I'm not mistaken.  If memory serves, it was a similar size to the Persistence.  I'm sure someone here within minutes of the posting will correct me and post all the information on the boat.  It may have been the Apache.  Not sure.  Either way, the Persistence was just right for the job.  However, it isn't a ROV boat even though we used a small inspection class ROV with it.  It also lacks a dynamic positioning system enabling it to "hover" over a fixed position using bow and stern thrusters.   
-----------------

What do you receive by choosing Apache Boat Co.?

-The M/V Apache is a clean and comfortable vessel. She was refitted during the winter of 2006/2007. Her captain Jim Reeks, is owner/operator, and will see that your expectations are exceeded. The crew of the M/V Apache is well seasoned, courteous and clean.

 -Captain Reeks started working on vessels in the Gulf of Mexico in 1966 at age 14. As time passed he wanted to broaden his knowledge. He started commercial diving in 1971, and studied marine archeology at Southern Methodist University. He was also owner/operator of a compressor company and a commercial diving company. He has worked in the Gulf extensively since 1998. In 2006 he formed Apache Boat Co., Inc. Captain Reeks has experience working production, construction, commercial diving, survey, and serving the shipping industry. He understands his customers needs and will deliver quality service in a safe and timely manner.

Our Mission Statement

- We are committed to providing the best possible service in the Gulf of Mexico. Our company is constantly moving forward to meet and exceed our customer¢s expectations  in the future.

Our Values

Safety

-          safety in all activities

-          safeguard our environment

-          correct potential hazards

Honesty and Integrity

-          Treat our customers and employees with honesty and Integrity and expect the same in return.

-          Our employees and customers come first

Our Employees

-          recognize individual contributions

-          provide training and development opportunities

-          promote employee achievement and  accountability

Customer Satisfaction

-          build strong customer relations through integrity, hard work and satisfaction

-          keep our commitments

-          provide value to or customers

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

SUPERIOR OFFSHORE INTERNATIONAL INC. - DEEP Current report filing ... The Gulmar Falcon, a DP II DSV, returned to service in October 2007 on a saturation diving project in the U.S. Gulf of Mexico and began generating revenues ...
sec.edgar-online.com/2007/ 11/15/0000950134-07-024064/Section6.asp


The M/V Apache has been involved in operations with the DP DSV Falcon from 2-25-07 to 3-15-07. The Apache has been working in a support role with the Falcon transferring both supplies and personnel to the vessel. The Apache has been maintained in a state of readiness with a full crew ready to perform tasks as needed. The crew of the Apache has performed in a professional manner and displayed a safety conscious attitude. The captain and crew have displayed a very positive can do attitude and a willingness to provide the Falcon with the best possible service. In short I would recommend this vessel for a wide range of offshore support operations. "

Scott Mcauley
Superintendent - DSV Gulmar Falcon
Superior Offshore International


http://apacheboatco.com/index.htm
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ARUBA: It's all about Natalee...we won't give up!


« Reply #777 on: January 12, 2009, 05:50:19 PM »

These are links and posts that will help with what Hotshot has said about how she knows certain people being discussed.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4246.msg588902#msg588902

Hotshot's Post:

Quote
I know john only in speaking with him twice about the case.  No I did not get him in touch with Dave, Schafer did that i do believe.  Some of the Monkeys have all the right in believing what they want to believe, however, I refuse to believe that they are bad guys.  I have a theory, i have stated it, and i dont want to get into it again.  For people to pounce on kyle for something that wasnt even his job to do, is very poor.  I have explained that also.  I have talked with Kyle for quite some time now, and believe when he tells me that words were taken
out of context.  i believe in Tim miller whole heartedly, and can't fathom him being involved with anyone who wouldnt want to find natalee.  Silvetti is now working on the gulf cost with Tim, are people going to say now that he is scanning for oil there too? We all have a reason for being here, and doing what we do, just because it doesn't fit in some peoples agendas, doesnt mean we are not here for natalee.  we wouldnt be here if we were not here for natalee.  Everything that pops up doesnt have to be a diversion.  I sent Caps out to find Silvetti, and I have said that before.  Why???  Caps needed help with the pond. I cant say for sure why Silvetti would call Tim a liability, but I am pretty sure Tim wanted to see for himself what was in the trap, as he didnt believe it wasn't a skull.......I dont think Tim got the chance to see for himself, and thats too bad.  i think that was a chance of a lifetime.  Mansure was on the boat, why?  I dont know, that what I was told by his dad.....He did NOT do the dive...
I am off to sleep now.  the new job has me wanting my pillow..GN all.

http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4186.msg566913#msg566913

Hotshot's post:

Quote
snip:  I personally have met with Tim, and Schafer way back in Jan of 2006 back when they were trying to get things going with the Persistence, and getting the OK to go to Aruban waters.  It was several of us that met with them.  So its not like they lost their monies back in 2006 and waited till almost 2008 to scan for oil, etc....  They were waiting to get the OK from Aruba.  And we all know how long they can take.  Schafer is a Seaman, John is not.  Tim is not, he helps in anyway he can to search for the missing, and if that means on a ship, then so be it.  Either way here, it all comes down to one girl, and that is Natalee, they all came together for Natalee.  Not themselves.  There is always one bad apple in a group, I am not saying that "there was", but IF pics were truly going to be sold for his own purpose "other then the film crew that were on the boat", then shame on him.  I just really don't want to think that is true. 
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I stand with the girl, Natalee Holloway.

"I can look back over the past 10 years and there were no steps wasted, and there are no regrets,'' she said. "I did all I knew to do and I think that gives me greater peace now." "I've lived every parent's worst nightmare and I'm the parent that nobody wants to be," she said.

Beth Holloway, 2015 interview with Greta van Susteren
jen3560
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« Reply #778 on: January 12, 2009, 05:54:37 PM »

Now this one is very interesting................shows HotShot knew Shaefer way back when.

But - we know part of this is incorrect - it was never the Persistence until last minute -and certainly not back in 2006


HotShot:

Hotshot's post:


Quote
snip:  I personally have met with Tim, and Schafer way back in Jan of 2006 back when they were trying to get things going with the Persistence, and getting the OK to go to Aruban waters.  It was several of us that met with them.  So its not like they lost their monies back in 2006 and waited till almost 2008 to scan for oil, etc....  They were waiting to get the OK from Aruba.  And we all know how long they can take.  Schafer is a Seaman, John is not.  Tim is not, he helps in anyway he can to search for the missing, and if that means on a ship, then so be it.  Either way here, it all comes down to one girl, and that is Natalee, they all came together for Natalee.  Not themselves.  There is always one bad apple in a group, I am not saying that "there was", but IF pics were truly going to be sold for his own purpose "other then the film crew that were on the boat", then shame on him.  I just really don't want to think that is true. 
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« Reply #779 on: January 12, 2009, 05:57:32 PM »

Now this one is very interesting................shows HotShot knew Shaefer way back when.

But - we know part of this is incorrect - it was never the Persistence until last minute -and certainly not back in 2006


HotShot:

Hotshot's post:


Quote
snip:  I personally have met with Tim, and Schafer way back in Jan of 2006 back when they were trying to get things going with the Persistence, and getting the OK to go to Aruban waters.  It was several of us that met with them.  So its not like they lost their monies back in 2006 and waited till almost 2008 to scan for oil, etc....  They were waiting to get the OK from Aruba.  And we all know how long they can take.  Schafer is a Seaman, John is not.  Tim is not, he helps in anyway he can to search for the missing, and if that means on a ship, then so be it.  Either way here, it all comes down to one girl, and that is Natalee, they all came together for Natalee.  Not themselves.  There is always one bad apple in a group, I am not saying that "there was", but IF pics were truly going to be sold for his own purpose "other then the film crew that were on the boat", then shame on him.  I just really don't want to think that is true. 

Also.Who where those several people.Now that would be interesting..
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"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history."

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