Caylee Marie Anthony #90 1/12/09 - 1/14/09

[Fuzzball]

I never said, nor did I even imply, that TM was in it for money. I said he was in it for personal reasons having nothing to do with Caylee. Last I checked his daughter's name was Laura, not Caylee. I respect the work he does and think it's very admirable.  I'm not trying to "rag" on him, by saying that it's not all about Caylee for him. It's about Laura.  Always has been, probably always will be.

As for LE, it's a job. Probably they care about Caylee, but odds are very good that if they weren't being paid they'd be doing something else. However much a person cares about a client, a patient, or a student they serve, they're not gonna do it without the paycheck. Same with LE.

I don't think it's a putdown to say that these people are motivated by professionalism and a dedication to justice in general.

[Brandi]

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/crime/2009/01/13/ng.secret.tape.cnn


Did D. Casey know where body was?

Basically, he did....he was on the phone with someone...he found the pavers and said (according to Belich) that it should be here.  Someone was telling him where and what to look for.  That's why portions of the video has been released WITHOUT SOUND.  You can see that D. Casey is almost frantically looking for the bag.  There is something "really wrong" with all of this.  Someone knew exactly where that bag was and was relaying that information either directly to D. Casey or to someone else who then relayed it to D. Casey.

What if Caylee's remains were originally where DC was searching..then with the amount of rain that fell during Fay, the bag (which was sealed and contained some air) floated to the location that it was found in December.  So when DC went searching, based on info given to him by someone who only knew the original location, he couldn't find the bag and called his contact saying things like..."found the pavers" (which wouldn't float) "It should be here" ...

would that be feasible considering the amount of rain that had fallen ?? any Florida people ??

Good thinking!

SS, I am not a Floridian, but your theory sounds good to me.

[OriginalKat]

No nanners HH! Unless you're hungry!

I got a little lost at the end, but just wanted to reply. You think LP thought he was searching in the right area (having pi's search for him) but they were just off by the 150ft? He thought they didn't find her because LE already did? Just trying to get my monkey brain right here! I mean I wouldn't be 100% shocked if LP were somehow tied into this. I know he really wanted her found, but I would be shocked if the A's pi's would work with LP. Unless, in a backwords sorta way they asked the pi's to work with him. Nah, probably not!! <snipped>

   No Im not saying the A's knew that the PI's were doing anything with LP.....these people are money hungry and we all know LP has the money and so who's to say that its wasnt these buffoons that was the source of all os LP's clues to begin with, you heard them say the A's would be mad if they knew they were out there searching, but they were there for some reason and I can answer one question that has been asked several time today....WHAT would they have done if they had found the body.......tell LP thats what, and then watch him put together another search of this area on National TV and he would have been the one holding up the little skull for all to see...a national hero, just like he told Tim!!!     whatever!!!!!

Hope I am not repeating if someone has said this but LP made the comment about maybe LE had body on 12/9 NG, body found 12/11,  LP said that he was shown the Hoover film 12/16/or 17 so I think on his comment about LE maybe having the body was just that...his own comment and I don't think he had the knowledge of the video before that. LP is the only one besides some of Casey's friends who was and is willing to take a lie detector test when asked. I don't think LP worked with A's pi's but I do think the 10 days he and his people were there he learned alot that was going on and maybe it is more believable to me he has worked with LE.

[kitkat53]

Mr. Morgan went to the house were "Zenaida" lived and said the current owner has lived there 8 years, but said maybe before him. He said "Keep em coming". So that being said and the fact that I'm still sick as hell. Has there been any updates or new stuff regarding Zenaida stuff that I should send him? Can a monkey bring it forward for me to copy and paste? Thanks in advance!!! 

Maybe, just maybe, after she left Caylee there in the woods she did searching on the computer (like we did), could have even done it on someone elses computer, about who lived in the houses where she left the body. It's probably a long shot, but it's possible. Maybe she got the Zenaida name just like we did. She had 31 days to do all this stuff!! Think up her stories, ya never know!!!

exactly.

Boo Monkey so you are saying there is no Zenida living at that address? Then someone added it to whitepages.com. I wonder who did it.

It matches phonebook.com too.  A Zanaida may have listed that as her address at one time for some nefarious reason and Casey did the same thing we did to find the name of the people at 4709 and 4701.  She "left her between 9 and 1" is obvious now, as I always thought that was hinky.

I would know what time I dropped my daughter off. Maybe not down to the minute and second. But I would not give a 4 hour window as to when I could have possibly dropped her off. So to here her tell it it could have been in the morning or in the afternoon.  WTH? How could you not know at least if it was in the morning or in the afternoon.

[BooMonkey]

What is this between 9 and 1 stuff? Could someone tell me so I don't have to search for it. I will send it on to Tim Morgan.

[luckycharmsprincess]

Timer55 Video

Go to 3:30 and you will hear Cindy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5LaDizrpjs&feature=channel_page

[QuietMonkey]

Hello monkeys. I am new here so hope I am posting correctly. I have had a question for quite awhile, but havent had the guts to just get on here and ask. So... I was wondering if I heard correctly that they said that they knew that the skeleton had been there (where it was found) since June because there was vegetation growing through skull? I guess if that were the case I am a bit confused because the meter reader said that the skull fell out of bag correct? So how could vegetation grow through? Sorry if I'm not making alot of sense. I know what I'm trying to ask, but not too good typing it out.

OK, I'll try to post here if it'll let me! Anyway, I'm not positive they said the skull, I do remember hearing the bones/skeleton. The way the bones are, there are many other bones they could grow through (like hip bones, and shoulder blades, etc. If they did say skull it's possible if a very long vine grew through it, it could have still rolled while the vine were still through it. I hate to think about this stuff, but it's the only way to answer the question. Of course, I could be totally wrong. Just my guessing.

[Fuzzball]

Sh*t I got locked out trying to post to Island monkey.

Island if you read this, I replied to your post thanking you for donating your proceeds to TM. I will not say what else I was gonna say because I have been trying to be good.

Ok, I don't like it when monkeys dog TM. He is a saint and no one has any reason to say less. Let them live in his shoes and do what he does. That's my rant I drank a beer and 1/2 and need to shut up now. JSM

Nobody's "dogging" TM.  I didn't say he was in it for the $$. He's in it for Laura and her memory.  He's a man whose obsession with his daughter's murder and the way it was mishandled by LE has led him to do very praiseworthy and exceptional things. Can't that be enough?

Do we have to think he's a saint and that every breath he takes is about Caylee? Nobody could live up to that!

[kitkat53]

What is this between 9 and 1 stuff? Could someone tell me so I don't have to search for it. I will send it on to Tim Morgan.

http://cayleeanthony.wordpress.com/2008/08/29/statement-given-to-police-by-casey-anthony-on-71608/

[Foggy Dew]

Hello monkeys. I am new here so hope I am posting correctly. I have had a question for quite awhile, but havent had the guts to just get on here and ask. So... I was wondering if I heard correctly that they said that they knew that the skeleton had been there (where it was found) since June because there was vegetation growing through skull? I guess if that were the case I am a bit confused because the meter reader said that the skull fell out of bag correct? So how could vegetation grow through? Sorry if I'm not making alot of sense. I know what I'm trying to ask, but not too good typing it out.

Welcome Big Sky.  I'm new here too so we can hold hands and swing through the tree tops together ha ha.

As to the plastic bag:  as you may know some bags hold up way longer than others due to lack of uv rays and such.  Now imagine that the bag was mostly intact but had deteriorated underneath.  If there was veg growing on that part of the body, there you go--veg had gotten hold.  I've seen this a million times when the wind carries a bag to a hedgerow and I'm too lazy to go get it.  Then some months later when I go to finally dispose of it, it's all entangled in new growth.

Not to be maudlin, but was vegetation growing through the skull?  I can't recall.  I was just thinking it was throughout the other parts of the remains. 

[Fuzzball]

Hello monkeys. I am new here so hope I am posting correctly. I have had a question for quite awhile, but havent had the guts to just get on here and ask. So... I was wondering if I heard correctly that they said that they knew that the skeleton had been there (where it was found) since June because there was vegetation growing through skull? I guess if that were the case I am a bit confused because the meter reader said that the skull fell out of bag correct? So how could vegetation grow through? Sorry if I'm not making alot of sense. I know what I'm trying to ask, but not too good typing it out.

OK, I'll try to post here if it'll let me! Anyway, I'm not positive they said the skull, I do remember hearing the bones/skeleton. The way the bones are, there are many other bones they could grow through (like hip bones, and shoulder blades, etc. If they did say skull it's possible if a very long vine grew through it, it could have still rolled while the vine were still through it. I hate to think about this stuff, but it's the only way to answer the question. Of course, I could be totally wrong. Just my guessing.

Grass and vines aren't the only vegetation. There's also algae and moss and lichens that could have grown even inside the bag.  Plus the bag was probably torn, and if so, then vines and grass and other kinds of plants could have grown right through the hole.

[bigskygal]

Thank you all for trying to answer my question. I know its hard to think about this stuff. Theres just sooo much information that gets thrown out there everyday with the news and all, I tend to get a bit confused sometimes about exact wordings. You are all so kind too, making a new person feel welcome here.

[trimmonthelake]

Welcome Bigskygal. 

[Hudsunn]

VERY INTERESTING points being made about the 9 to 1 remark, which always sounded weird, since that is a pretty big timespan and other tidbits of truth Casey might have spoken.  I recall in the JonBenet Ramsey case, the ransom note and other writings were examined by a forensic linguist named Andrew Hodge who maintains that people ALWAYS tell the truth, even when they attempt to lie, because their minds cannot stop the truth from bubbling to the surface.  He made a pretty good case for that.  I wish he would examine some of Casey's statements.  He said you have to read between the lines to figure out where the truth is, but that it can be done.  Some of you are doing that with the statements she has made and coming up with some good possibilities.

Here are a few things that occurred to me.  Both Cindy and one of the detectives said that Casey tells some truth in everything she says, no matter how preposterous, often by borrowing from books, tv shows, friends' experiences, etc.  Cindy swore that as much as Casey lied, she always told the truth eventually and some of the truth was hidden in even her worst lies.

  1.  Casey said at first, or led Cindy to believe, that Zenaida took Caylee because she loved her so much.  Therefore, she was not worried about Caylee being hurt, because Zanny loved her and would take good care of her.  Was this an outright lie to excuse her partying and not reporting Caylee as missing?  Or is there some truth in what she is saying?  We know Zanny is not real, so is Casey saying that Caylee is no longer in danger and that she is with someone who loves her...i.e., in Heaven?  Mothers who kill often justify their actions and their lack of remorse by telling themselves that the child is better off or in a better place.  Casey obviously feels no great remorse over what happened, so she must have convinced herself that it was all for the best.

  2.  In her little poem, "Everyone lies.  Everyone dies." Casey offers a big excuse for her actions.  If everybody lies, then the fact that she lies is not such a big deal.  Who can judge her if they all lie too, even her parents and LE.  Likewise, we all die eventually, so the fact that Caylee died is not that big a deal.  She would have died sooner or later.  Death is natural, so what Casey did is not so wrong in her mind.  Everybody dies, so death is something we all have in common.

  3.  I think he post about "On the worst of worst days, remember the words spoken." is a direct reference to Cindy and what Cindy said to her in their big blow up before she took Caylee and left.  I think those words were not spoken by some philosopher or poet but by her own mother.  In a way, she is saying, "When you find out that Caylee is dead or you realize she is gone from you forever, remember the words you spoke to me.  That is why Caylee is dead.  You are the cause, mom.  It is not my fault, it is yours."  Cindy said something, IMO, that not only cut Casey like a knife but made her furious and determined to see that she got even.  It may have been a threat to take custody of Caylee.  It may have been an admission to loving Caylee more.  It may have been a blanket criticism of Casey as a person and a parent.  I really think that is what is meant in that first line.

  4.  A really obvious example of her telling the truth even when lying is the way she says several times in the visits, "I cannot tell you anymore at this time" or "I cannot talk about that," from which Cindy ran with the notion that the whole family was in jeopardy and Casey was protecting not just Caylee but them all from harm.  But Casey was being truthful there.  If she told what happened, she would be admitting to her own guilt and putting herself in danger.  She truly could not say more without implicating herself. 

  5.  Finally, Casey has a pattern of casting herself as either the victim or the hero.  In her stories, she is sometimes abused, as when she says both her dad and Lee had sexually used her, or overwhelmed, as in her story about Zenaida and her sister forcing her to the ground and taking Caylee.  In both cases, the situation was out of her hands and she was the helpless little maiden.  But other times, she is a rock of support.  In her Zanny in the hospital story, she stays with Zanny and comforts her after a bad car wreck.  In another story, she cannot go with Amy because her poor dad has had a "mini-stroke" and she must be with him.  And of course, she was willing to go to jail forever to protect Caylee and her parents from the "people" who were holding Caylee. 

It is really very interesting to figure out how her mind works.  It seems stored with dates, names, incidents, ideas, etc. that she plucks out whenever she needs them.  Since the body was literally in an area that was kind of between the 9 and the 1 in the house numbers, you do have to wonder if she was sending out, knowingly or unknowingly, signals to her parents and Lee about where the body could be found.

If she was doing that, the implication is clear -- find the body and do something to help me.  Put it somewhere else or cover it up better where it is.  I don't think she was signalling them to inform the police that the body was in that location.  It was more "Clean this up for me so I can get out of here, and then we will just forget it ever happened."

[GramaMonkey]

Hello monkeys. I am new here so hope I am posting correctly. I have had a question for quite awhile, but havent had the guts to just get on here and ask. So... I was wondering if I heard correctly that they said that they knew that the skeleton had been there (where it was found) since June because there was vegetation growing through skull? I guess if that were the case I am a bit confused because the meter reader said that the skull fell out of bag correct? So how could vegetation grow through? Sorry if I'm not making alot of sense. I know what I'm trying to ask, but not too good typing it out.

First off, bigsky,



The way I heard it, they stated that there was vegatation growing in the "skeleton" not in any specific bones, like the skull, etc. But yes, that is one way that they were determining how long the body had been at the site.

Again, welcome to the cage and don't be afraid to post! You did just fine.

Hello Monkeys!

bigskygal ~ That has always been a question that I had as well.  The only thing that I have come up with.....in my thoughts, is that there must have been a hole in one of the bags for the plant to enter, and being in the bag acted like a greenhouse, and continued growing.  Other than that, I cannot come up with a view....of the plants growing thru the remains.

[no rose colored glasses]

Timer55 Video

Go to 3:30 and you will hear Cindy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5LaDizrpjs&feature=channel_page

Thank-you, your pup is such a cutie.

[Tamikosmom]

ON THE RECORD - JANUARY 12, 2009

New Video Surfaces in Caylee Anthony Case
Tuesday, January 13, 2009

GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS HOST: Tonight, a new tape surfaces in the Caylee Anthony murder case. And here's the important question. What was this man doing at the scene, taping weeks before little Caylee's skull and other remains were found? Now, look at this video. A private investigator for the Anthony family captured on tape searching and ramming a metal rod into the ground in the very wooded area where little Caylee's remains were found. This video was shot over two days, November 15th and 16th, nearly a month before Caylee's body was found by a meter reader on December 11th.

WOFL reporter Holly Bristow joins us live. Holly, first of all, whose video is this? And I know there's a controversy over that ...

Transcript:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,479750,00.html


Caught on Tape

Video:
http://www.foxnews.com/video2/video08.html?maven_referralObject=3440674&maven_referralPlaylistId=&sRevUrl=http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,479750,00.html

[Russ]

What is this between 9 and 1 stuff? Could someone tell me so I don't have to search for it. I will send it on to Tim Morgan.

Someone here remembered, and I can't find the original post, but originally Casey said she dropped Caylee off between 9 and 1 with Zanaida Gonzalez with LE.  The homes are 4701 and 4709.  Just another clue, a BIG ONE!  If she followed that up with a reverse lookup at phonebook.com or whitepages.com she would have found the name Zenaida and the name Gonzalez at those two addresses like people here did.

[Foggy Dew]

Hello monkeys. I am new here so hope I am posting correctly. I have had a question for quite awhile, but havent had the guts to just get on here and ask. So... I was wondering if I heard correctly that they said that they knew that the skeleton had been there (where it was found) since June because there was vegetation growing through skull? I guess if that were the case I am a bit confused because the meter reader said that the skull fell out of bag correct? So how could vegetation grow through? Sorry if I'm not making alot of sense. I know what I'm trying to ask, but not too good typing it out.

Put another way,  if one put a strawberry pot in a plastic bag and left in a flooded area for some time, I can guarantee that sediment would gather in it and either aquatic and/or terrestrial veg seeds would eventually sprout in it

[Russ]

VERY INTERESTING points being made about the 9 to 1 remark, which always sounded weird, since that is a pretty big timespan and other tidbits of truth Casey might have spoken.  I recall in the JonBenet Ramsey case, the ransom note and other writings were examined by a forensic linguist named Andrew Hodge who maintains that people ALWAYS tell the truth, even when they attempt to lie, because their minds cannot stop the truth from bubbling to the surface.  He made a pretty good case for that.  I wish he would examine some of Casey's statements.  He said you have to read between the lines to figure out where the truth is, but that it can be done.  Some of you are doing that with the statements she has made and coming up with some good possibilities.

Here are a few things that occurred to me.  Both Cindy and one of the detectives said that Casey tells some truth in everything she says, no matter how preposterous, often by borrowing from books, tv shows, friends' experiences, etc.  Cindy swore that as much as Casey lied, she always told the truth eventually and some of the truth was hidden in even her worst lies.

  1.  Casey said at first, or led Cindy to believe, that Zenaida took Caylee because she loved her so much.  Therefore, she was not worried about Caylee being hurt, because Zanny loved her and would take good care of her.  Was this an outright lie to excuse her partying and not reporting Caylee as missing?  Or is there some truth in what she is saying?  We know Zanny is not real, so is Casey saying that Caylee is no longer in danger and that she is with someone who loves her...i.e., in Heaven?  Mothers who kill often justify their actions and their lack of remorse by telling themselves that the child is better off or in a better place.  Casey obviously feels no great remorse over what happened, so she must have convinced herself that it was all for the best.

  2.  In her little poem, "Everyone lies.  Everyone dies." Casey offers a big excuse for her actions.  If everybody lies, then the fact that she lies is not such a big deal.  Who can judge her if they all lie too, even her parents and LE.  Likewise, we all die eventually, so the fact that Caylee died is not that big a deal.  She would have died sooner or later.  Death is natural, so what Casey did is not so wrong in her mind.  Everybody dies, so death is something we all have in common.

  3.  I think he post about "On the worst of worst days, remember the words spoken." is a direct reference to Cindy and what Cindy said to her in their big blow up before she took Caylee and left.  I think those words were not spoken by some philosopher or poet but by her own mother.  In a way, she is saying, "When you find out that Caylee is dead or you realize she is gone from you forever, remember the words you spoke to me.  That is why Caylee is dead.  You are the cause, mom.  It is not my fault, it is yours."  Cindy said something, IMO, that not only cut Casey like a knife but made her furious and determined to see that she got even.  It may have been a threat to take custody of Caylee.  It may have been an admission to loving Caylee more.  It may have been a blanket criticism of Casey as a person and a parent.  I really think that is what is meant in that first line.

  4.  A really obvious example of her telling the truth even when lying is the way she says several times in the visits, "I cannot tell you anymore at this time" or "I cannot talk about that," from which Cindy ran with the notion that the whole family was in jeopardy and Casey was protecting not just Caylee but them all from harm.  But Casey was being truthful there.  If she told what happened, she would be admitting to her own guilt and putting herself in danger.  She truly could not say more without implicating herself. 

  5.  Finally, Casey has a pattern of casting herself as either the victim or the hero.  In her stories, she is sometimes abused, as when she says both her dad and Lee had sexually used her, or overwhelmed, as in her story about Zenaida and her sister forcing her to the ground and taking Caylee.  In both cases, the situation was out of her hands and she was the helpless little maiden.  But other times, she is a rock of support.  In her Zanny in the hospital story, she stays with Zanny and comforts her after a bad car wreck.  In another story, she cannot go with Amy because her poor dad has had a "mini-stroke" and she must be with him.  And of course, she was willing to go to jail forever to protect Caylee and her parents from the "people" who were holding Caylee. 

It is really very interesting to figure out how her mind works.  It seems stored with dates, names, incidents, ideas, etc. that she plucks out whenever she needs them.  Since the body was literally in an area that was kind of between the 9 and the 1 in the house numbers, you do have to wonder if she was sending out, knowingly or unknowingly, signals to her parents and Lee about where the body could be found.

If she was doing that, the implication is clear -- find the body and do something to help me.  Put it somewhere else or cover it up better where it is.  I don't think she was signalling them to inform the police that the body was in that location.  It was more "Clean this up for me so I can get out of here, and then we will just forget it ever happened."

Love your post!