Caylee Marie Anthony #98 1/24/09 - 1/26/09

[crazybabyborg]

This admission to the Psych unit is not going to get GA a disability check. First, I'm sure the primary diagnosis is depression.....lots of modifiers to that diagnosis; with or without psychosis, etc., but the onset was clearly circumstantial. That's going to be in the record.

That's a very treatable diagnosis, with a good outcome prognosis and by nature and statistics, when the circumstances are lessened, so is the depression, particularly if there is treatment intervention. The Social Security Administration keeps up with this stuff, and there's no way this is going to give GA a disability check. It simply cannot be demonstrated that this is a chronic, untreatable condition for George.

I respectfully disagree with you. There may be other events in George's past that may be entered into his current record by a psychiatrist who records his history. What the doctor documents is vital to the outcome of a person's claim. It seems to me that he can very well claim a long history of depression based on health, injury, family and self esteem issues. While there are certainly extrinsic causes of his depression, we do not know the intrinsic factors...and the family history

I don't think we do disagree. If there's stuff out there that neither of us know about, then I agree that anything is possible. Part of the criteria is to be able to demonstrate that the condition is chronic, untreatable, and in the opinion of licensed qualified physicians and providers, not going to improve even with treatment intervention. This admission will not do that. That is my point. Perhaps I didn't state it clearly. Sorry.

[janetruth]

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=430036753

The A-Team fights back.

Disclaimer:  I have no idea whose Myspace this is, just the the URL was mentioned in a comment below NYKatie's newest blog post.

[Hudsunn]

Very good points, CBB.  You added a lot to my post.  It is absolutely true that the family may be willing to do almost anything to get Casey out of this jam. 

Andrea Yates drowned her precious children and now she is in a mental institution, not a jail.  I believe she clearly suffered from a mental illness and had for years.  That is not so evident with Casey.

But Baez has to be considering that he can use some kind of diminished capacity defense.

A mental or emotional condition is the only thing that could cover all the bases.  It could explain her odd behavior, her compulsive lying, her willingness to steal from family and friends, her wild stories, her ability to party after her child is missing for days or weeks. 

But he would have to have some psychologists or psychiatrists who paint a pretty bleak picture of her mental and emotional state.

[flamom]

Searching, your personal story is a lovely one and speaks to your own courage, emotional stability, and capacity to love.  Not everyone has those character traits.  Imagine if you had been a selfish, emotionally immature person without the capacity to love a child as fully as you did.  Many women cannot get over a rape, whether or not it produces a child.  Even people who appose abortion often say that they favor it in cases of rape.  Your situation is inspiring and unique, but it may not apply to everyone who goes through that situation.

I do not automatically accept that Casey was ever raped just because she said it.  She is a chronic liar and nothing she says can be fully trusted or believed.  Nor do I automatically accept that either Lee or George molested her.  Those are her claims, and they may be totally untrue.

But Baez might go in that direction as part of a defense.  His avenues of defense are very limited, as far as we know, so he may try the traumatization or abuse excuses.

So true Hudsunn..
Searching, my heartfelt kudos to you for being able to rise above the terrible wrong done to you and turn it around to a blessing.. you are a special person..

[Sdb]

I respectfully disagree that suicide invalidates life insurance. If you have had the policy for a long enough period of time, the cause of death doesn't matter. I can say this based on the fact that my brother committed suicide and his life insurance did pay. It was a policy that was about 10 years old. I believe, correct me if I am wrong, that with a standard life insurance policy, the suicide clause is void after 2 years.

That is not entirely true.  Suicide and insurance pay out is based completely on the insurance company wether they wish to pay out or not.  Some pay nothing, regardless of the length of time the policy was in place, some pay after a period of 2-5 years, and some pay right away. 
(I am basing this on the knowledge I received from my mother when her brother took a shotgun to the mouth in front of my aunt.  Not only were they left to clean up the mess, but also pay for the funeral as the insurance did not pay out at the time.  The reason above was given, and to this day I have always thought it was ridiculous...the need of the family left behind is still there, and that was the entire purpose of a life insurance policy to begin with.)

morning dolce >->> I agree, as I have had three uncles kill them selves.. One at home, one in the woods under his fav tree, and one hung himself in a hotel room.. No insurances were paid out for any of them. The family was left to deal with everything alone....mio

I apoligize, I was just going based on my own experience and thinking about it, the pay out may have been because my father was the attorney for the insurance agent. Maybe some strings were pulled. Plus it was a small policy, $5,000, which barely covered the funeral expences. I'm sorry for everybodies loses.

I apologize as well,

Insurance is regulated by each states' laws. In Virginia the two year rule is mandated by Virginia Code
§ 38.2-3106. Suicide and execution not grounds of defense; exception.

A. Except as provided in subsection B of this section, the fact that an insured committed suicide, or was executed under law, shall not be a defense in any action, motion or other proceeding on a life insurance policy that (i) was issued to any person residing in this Commonwealth at the time of issuance, or (ii) is otherwise subject to the laws of this Commonwealth, to recover for the death of that person.

B. An express provision in the body of the policy limiting the liability of the insurer to an insured who, whether sane or insane, dies by his own act within two years from the date of the policy shall be valid but the insurer shall be obligated to return or pay at the least the amount of the premium paid for the policy.

(Code 1950, § 38-365; 1952, c. 317, § 38.1-437; 1986, c. 562.)


That probably explains why there have been so many different experiences with this. Most national companies issue policies with the two year rule now so they don't have to submit a different policy to each state for approval. New York and California are the most restrictive to insurance companies so they will submit separate policies to these two states for approval.

[no rose colored glasses]

Searching, your personal story is a lovely one and speaks to your own courage, emotional stability, and capacity to love.  Not everyone has those character traits.  Imagine if you had been a selfish, emotionally immature person without the capacity to love a child as fully as you did.  Many women cannot get over a rape, whether or not it produces a child.  Even people who appose abortion often say that they favor it in cases of rape.  Your situation is inspiring and unique, but it may not apply to everyone who goes through that situation.

I do not automatically accept that Casey was ever raped just because she said it.  She is a chronic liar and nothing she says can be fully trusted or believed.  Nor do I automatically accept that either Lee or George molested her.  Those are her claims, and they may be totally untrue.

But Baez might go in that direction as part of a defense.  His avenues of defense are very limited, as far as we know, so he may try the traumatization or abuse excuses.

So true Hudsunn..
Searching, my heartfelt kudos to you for being able to rise above the terrible wrong done to you and turn it around to a blessing.. you are a special person..

Thank-you for sharing, I am sure your daughter is a beautiful, loving woman, and she certainly has a very special mother.

[Ono]

LIGHTBULB moment
George now qualifies for SSDI based on a pysch disability... 
He will have income soon.. maybe Conway will help him get it

No offense, but this is impossible. First of all, SSDI takes a year or more to get, IF you get it. But more importantly, it takes a LOT more than one little failed suicide attempt to establish disability. You need a psychiatric diagnosis. You need documented proof that your condition keeps you from working.

And if you have more than $6,000 yr coming into your home from any source, for any reason, you WILL NOT GET one dime. EVER.  Take it from one who knows from experience.

This is true Fuzzball - I knew someone who was turned down several times but his attorney kept re-applying on his behalf.  He finally was awarded the SSDI but it was a very long drawn-out affair.  Many give up as it is so tedious.  It is a Federal monthly stipend for life.

I guess I live in a parallel universe because I have assisted dozens of people over the years in filling out the disability papers, attaching medical records and referrals to their doctors and finally getting thier benefits within 1 yr. Sure it isn't easy to get it, but good documentation from someone's health care provider is vital. Yet I have seen a friend left with only 1 lung running on 30% capacity get turned down several times. (he finally got it but it took 2 yrs) IMO a psych disability is easier to obtain.

Hi !  I don't know the length of the time period he had to endire, but he was denied several times, however his attorney kept pursuing.  His attorney advised that it wasn't unusual to be turned down and if you are turned down, and of course have legitimate papers, etc., just keep pursuing.  [ My friend had had a severe physical injury. ]

[no rose colored glasses]

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=430036753

The A-Team fights back.

Disclaimer:  I have no idea whose Myspace this is, just the the URL was mentioned in a comment below NYKatie's newest blog post.

Their wall of shame is interesting, I wonder whose myspace that is?

[Ono]

LIGHTBULB moment
George now qualifies for SSDI based on a pysch disability... 
He will have income soon.. maybe Conway will help him get it

No offense, but this is impossible. First of all, SSDI takes a year or more to get, IF you get it. But more importantly, it takes a LOT more than one little failed suicide attempt to establish disability. You need a psychiatric diagnosis. You need documented proof that your condition keeps you from working.

And if you have more than $6,000 yr coming into your home from any source, for any reason, you WILL NOT GET one dime. EVER.  Take it from one who knows from experience.

This is true Fuzzball - I knew someone who was turned down several times but his attorney kept re-applying on his behalf.  He finally was awarded the SSDI but it was a very long drawn-out affair.  Many give up as it is so tedious.  It is a Federal monthly stipend for life.

I guess I live in a parallel universe because I have assisted dozens of people over the years in filling out the disability papers, attaching medical records and referrals to their doctors and finally getting thier benefits within 1 yr. Sure it isn't easy to get it, but good documentation from someone's health care provider is vital. Yet I have seen a friend left with only 1 lung running on 30% capacity get turned down several times. (he finally got it but it took 2 yrs) IMO a psych disability is easier to obtain.

Hi !  I don't know the length of the time period he had to endire, but he was denied several times, however his attorney kept pursuing.  His attorney advised that it wasn't unusual to be turned down and if you are turned down, and of course have legitimate papers, etc., just keep pursuing.  [ My friend had had a severe physical injury. ]

Ooops!  I meant " endure"...not endire - Lol.  Sorry for the typo.   

[Hudsunn]

That -Team website is not very impressive and will not do the Anthonys any good at all.  It seems more about personal vendettas for being banned than about defending the Anthonys. 

If they really want to help the Anthonys, they should offer honest, reasonable and straight-forward rebuttals of things that they consider to be untrue.

Getting down into the gutter is not going to help the Anthony family.

I think people on this forum try to be fair, most of the time.  For instance, I am quick to say that there is no proof that Lee or George ever molested Casey in any way.  Just because she made those claims does not make them true.

Likewise, I try to keep my criticism of the Anthonys to areas where it seems quite clear they have changed their stories or appear to be misrepresenting the facts.

Although I did make fun of Cindy's haircut a few times, I try to keep away from personal attacks about appearance, etc.

But it must be said that the Anthonys have turned themselves into public figures and went on every talk show and came outside their house to speak to reporters and confront protesters and deliver their messages.  Only after the body was found did they seek privacy.

When you put yourself out there in such a flagrant manner, you can expect criticism, and when you change your story, people are going to notice and comment. 

[Monken]

I have a lot of confidence in jurors as I think they take their responsibility very seriously.  This will be a heart wrenching case for the jurors.
They take an oath to consider only the evidence presented to them. 

Are you feeling better today Dolce?  Hope so. 

I understand the oath, and I would do my best if a juror to uphold it, but it would still plague my mind and thoughts.  I would not make a very good unbiased juror.

Yes feeling much better thank you!  Getting ready to go to lunch with family.

I pray that the jurors follow instructions.  I have been in too many jury rooms where one individual will keep coming back to something he/she had heard on tv, or read in the papers.  This informatin, of course, is not part of the evidence.  But they get stuck on it.  Days of eleven jurors trying to move one juror back to the facts is a hard thing to do if the one juror is stuck on reasonable doubt evidence that never made it into the court room.

Sorry this is late, but in Florida jury trials only a MAJORITY DECISION is required not unanimous! Going to lunch, BBL!  http://www.floridasupremecourt.org/decisions/2005/sc04-802.pdf LOOK ON PAGE 20!!!

[Kat_Gram]

Searching, your personal story is a lovely one and speaks to your own courage, emotional stability, and capacity to love.  Not everyone has those character traits.  Imagine if you had been a selfish, emotionally immature person without the capacity to love a child as fully as you did.  Many women cannot get over a rape, whether or not it produces a child.  Even people who appose abortion often say that they favor it in cases of rape.  Your situation is inspiring and unique, but it may not apply to everyone who goes through that situation.

I do not automatically accept that Casey was ever raped just because she said it.  She is a chronic liar and nothing she says can be fully trusted or believed.  Nor do I automatically accept that either Lee or George molested her.  Those are her claims, and they may be totally untrue.

But Baez might go in that direction as part of a defense.  His avenues of defense are very limited, as far as we know, so he may try the traumatization or abuse excuses.

Where did R word come from ? You have quoted the NE as your source.
Tony never said it in his police statments. Jesse never said it in his police statments.
The NE took those two tiny threads and made a garment out of it. THEY said rape.
..
Unless Casey herself takes the stand, this is never going to come up in a trial.
She has friends who say she was a good Mummas to Caylee. No one saw her being abusive.
Inattentive ( Jesse ). Wanting to go out rather than be at home with the kid, everyone, including herself. There are pictures of her and Caylee, everyone is smiling. Caylee was well nourished, well clothed, slept in a nice room when on Hopespring. Never sick except for a cold in the spring. Even though it wasn't Casey who provided the care, the little girl was well cared for under Casey's watch. Even Princess Di left her kids with other people when they were very young to go on trips for long periods of time. Baez can use that if it gets to the sentencing.     

[stephersmbucks]

Here are my thoughts on the "rape defense"....

I think it would be very stupid for Jose to go this route. Rape is a very hard thing to prove especially if it was a few years prior. It's one persons word against another. If Jose goes this route then it becomes fair game for the prosecutors to dig up any and all past sexual partners to show that Casey was, how do I put this without being too harsh, a whore. Think about it, just in the time around Caylee's disapperance, Casey was with Tony L, Ricardo, Anthony the cop, and possible others. Plus, if you add the fact that Casey is a proven liar, the jury would never buy that she was raped.

I know that rape is a hard topic for some and I truely hope I didn't offend anyone that actually lived through this horrific act. 

[JuJu]

LIGHTBULB moment
George now qualifies for SSDI based on a pysch disability... 
He will have income soon.. maybe Conway will help him get it

No offense, but this is impossible. First of all, SSDI takes a year or more to get, IF you get it. But more importantly, it takes a LOT more than one little failed suicide attempt to establish disability. You need a psychiatric diagnosis. You need documented proof that your condition keeps you from working.

And if you have more than $6,000 yr coming into your home from any source, for any reason, you WILL NOT GET one dime. EVER.  Take it from one who knows from experience.

This is true Fuzzball - I knew someone who was turned down several times but his attorney kept re-applying on his behalf.  He finally was awarded the SSDI but it was a very long drawn-out affair.  Many give up as it is so tedious.  It is a Federal monthly stipend for life.

I guess I live in a parallel universe because I have assisted dozens of people over the years in filling out the disability papers, attaching medical records and referrals to their doctors and finally getting thier benefits within 1 yr. Sure it isn't easy to get it, but good documentation from someone's health care provider is vital. Yet I have seen a friend left with only 1 lung running on 30% capacity get turned down several times. (he finally got it but it took 2 yrs) IMO a psych disability is easier to obtain.

Hi !  I don't know the length of the time period he had to endire, but he was denied several times, however his attorney kept pursuing.  His attorney advised that it wasn't unusual to be turned down and if you are turned down, and of course have legitimate papers, etc., just keep pursuing.  [ My friend had had a severe physical injury. ]

when and if the SSDI is finally awarded the person receives a lump sum back from the first time they applied..as do any minor children they have

[KarmaRoundUp]

Steel Monkey...that's what I keep wondering, what will the defense be? The nanny defense would be insane to go with, and now it looks like Baez might attempt to make Morales the fall guy. I'm still thinking it will be some mental defect strategy, I don't think it will work, but I don't know what else they could go with.

I am curious with you NRCG.  I think though Baez would be even more of a dumbass if he tried the mental capacity defense as he already proclaimed that she was not mental when the first DP attorney had been brought in.  The first DP attorney wanted her to undergo a psych eval and testing, Baez said no way as she was perfectly sain and healthy.  If he were to renig on that for sure the prosecution would be all over it with a recording of his original claim of her sanity being intact.  Then again, he is just that stupid, so you could be right on target with this.  The man has a head full of hot air.

IMO if Jose was planning on a mental defect defense he would have had her seeing doctors for that while in jail.So far no doctors are visiting her(or would they transport her to the doc's offices?)going by her visitor logs.IF Jose is going for this type of defense,he better get cracking to establish it.

Okay so then the only defense perhaps will be go after LE. Evidence has been tainted, LE after her immediately, try to dig something up on some of the detectives, etc.

I really think that Jose will hang on to this case as long as possible,to get to the actual court trial date,then Casey will confess.The longer this case drags on,the better off Jose has it.Free advertising,his name in the media constantly.I really don't think it matters to Casey how long this drags on,she knows already she is going down.May as well help her"savior"in the process.

[BooMonkey]

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewProfile&friendID=430036753

The A-Team fights back.

Disclaimer:  I have no idea whose Myspace this is, just the the URL was mentioned in a comment below NYKatie's newest blog post.

OMG they obviously have had this space since Nov 25th and they still only have 8 friends and one of them is Tom!! Tom, boy, you need to get better friends!!  One of the friends is called Oops! I've been naughty! Well, hmmmm, sounds like Kc!!

[KarmaRoundUp]

About GA's letter! Last I heard, LE had the letter & it had not been turned over to anyone. And since it seems as though George & Cindy have distanced themselves from Baez, I doubt that he would have it to give to Geraldo. Conway is strictly, all about the Anthony's, Baez is all about Casey. IMO


AND GOOD MORNING ALL! Granddaughters are here so it's a wild morning, I'll be in & out i'm sure! 

I hear what you are saying, but what is interesting is late Friday afternoon Baez filed a motion to get more info on R Morales, could it be possible he is one of Casey's friends that George was mentioning in his note.

IMO Jose filed to get that info on Ricardo because of the last doc dump.In there is the info about Ricardo's 2nd LE interview,about the LE search on his computer.Apparently before Ricardo handed over his computer,he tried to erase some stuff but LE investigated what he erased and determined that it had nothing to do with this case.I guess Jose wants to know what info was erased to see for himself.

Ricardo has also taken and passed a polygraph.

Oh!Thanks Klaas,I didn't know that.So now what....Jose will want Ricardo to take a poly by one of his people because Lord knows Jose doesn't trust anything from LE....FBI.

[KarmaRoundUp]

Steel Monkey...that's what I keep wondering, what will the defense be? The nanny defense would be insane to go with, and now it looks like Baez might attempt to make Morales the fall guy. I'm still thinking it will be some mental defect strategy, I don't think it will work, but I don't know what else they could go with.

I am curious with you NRCG.  I think though Baez would be even more of a dumbass if he tried the mental capacity defense as he already proclaimed that she was not mental when the first DP attorney had been brought in.  The first DP attorney wanted her to undergo a psych eval and testing, Baez said no way as she was perfectly sain and healthy.  If he were to renig on that for sure the prosecution would be all over it with a recording of his original claim of her sanity being intact.  Then again, he is just that stupid, so you could be right on target with this.  The man has a head full of hot air.

IMO if Jose was planning on a mental defect defense he would have had her seeing doctors for that while in jail.So far no doctors are visiting her(or would they transport her to the doc's offices?)going by her visitor logs.IF Jose is going for this type of defense,he better get cracking to establish it.

Okay so then the only defense perhaps will be go after LE. Evidence has been tainted, LE after her immediately, try to dig something up on some of the detectives, etc.

I can't see that they have any choice other than to tear down each piece presented, try to create shadows about anyone in any way connected, and in the end try to argue that there simply isn't enough to be 100% sure Casey did it. They'll try to define reasonable doubt as being 100% sure.

They'll also do everything possible to show that LE did not thorougly investigate anyone or anything else but Casey, so who knows what an equal effort elsewhere would have shown.

JMO.

Yes,I agree,they will try all of that but IMO there is no getting around the evidence,the 31 day wait to report Caylee missing and Casey's activities during that 31 days.IMO Casey is going down no matter what Jose does.

[higherhopes]

If the supposingly rape issue is brought up in court, then unless the person responsible comes to the courthouse and gets up on the stand and Says Yes I did it, then this is not gonna work. I just cant imagine Baez trying this old worn out excuse in this paticular case.  Dont get me wrong I know rape is a big deal, a very big deal, but with Casey and all her lies and everything she has done, I dont see it working, I think the prosicution will be able to show that Rape is not the reason for her actions, especially if they can prove that she has acted like this her entire life, even before Caylee was conceived and born.

 

[flamom]

CBB, no need to ever apologize 
I guess we areon the same page