Natalee Case Discussion #798 2/1/09 - 2/5/09

[Anna]

I logged on but didn't sign in.  Just reading all the way back since the end of the game and trying not to post anything controversial, lol.

And also not to keep answwering the same questions that have been asked and answered repeatedly.

[billb's daughter]

JEN

ktf, I think you misunderstood nimrod.  I think maybe nimrod meant that we will probably never get to the bottom of what happened with the cage, and it would be a shame for us to be accusing the Americans on the Persistence of a coverup, if that is not true.    As far as we know, the family is very appreciative of Schaefer and Silvetti for the search, and consider them heroes.  The search would likely never would have happened without them.  There can't be that many vessels, and that many people with access to the equipment who would do something like this.  I think they deserve the benefit of the doubt.  They gave their time and money and maybe they tried their best and they just didn't succeed and there is no coverup.

Got rid of the majority of posts...so I'm not accused of being a stackaholic...
iris..I think you missed the point..
As far as we know, the family is very appreciative of Schaefer and Silvetti for the search, and consider them heroes. we don't know..that is the point.
The search would likely never would have happened without them. disagree...there most likely would be another group to come along; even if not... That is why it is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to not dismiss the perception that louis/john took ADVANTAGE of the situation to USE the search for NATALEE (while mapping the ocean floor around aruba in search of oil) as a way to get CONTRIBUTIONS UNDER FALSE PRETENSIONS!

[hotping]

What...am I here by myself???
Where is...Keepthefaith, Icehawk, klaasend, thecuz, Magnolia, hotping, San, Lifesong, texasmom, Blue Moon, cubbeegirl, A's Fever, ospainter, Mere, cp405, iris44, truthseeker2, 2NJSons_Mom, cajun miracle and 17 Guests are viewing this topic.

Don't make me say goodnight before I get a response...Hay...the Cardinals lost....(they were robbed by the ref crew)....But it is OVER...Let's get back to Justice for Natalee....
come across...

I'm here billb..I'm like Magnolia..I'm trying to be quiet tonight..I'm Glad to hear about Robots and Carpe..Maybe They will come into the cage soon and say Hello!  How about them Cardinals..They Played a Good Game!

[billb's daughter]

What...am I here by myself???
Where is...Keepthefaith, Icehawk, klaasend, thecuz, Magnolia, hotping, San, Lifesong, texasmom, Blue Moon, cubbeegirl, A's Fever, ospainter, Mere, cp405, iris44, truthseeker2, 2NJSons_Mom, cajun miracle and 17 Guests are viewing this topic.

Don't make me say goodnight before I get a response...Hay...the Cardinals lost....(they were robbed by the ref crew)....But it is OVER...Let's get back to Justice for Natalee....
come across...

I'm here BillB.No worries..
You the man...ktf...(hope I didn't give your ID away...

[iris44]

"Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation)."

By who's request Iris44?

Of course I have a theory on this, too. I could be wrong but I think this has gotten kind of twisted around from Kermit asking Beth if it was OK to post this to this newer version of Beth asking for it to be posted.  My impression of Beth is that she wants any and all information to come out, so her telling Kermit to post it is just her blanket response, and that it was not a unique response to Kermit's specific information.  I've always got the sense that she doesn't want anyone to hold back any information, even if it is disturbing to her.  She is very brave.

[Magnolia]

Iris, the COVER-UP was by the Aruban police and dive team that was allowed to happen under the Persistence's watch.  JMO

That, I can believe.  I believe Schaefer, Silvetti and maybe even Tim Miller just lost control of the situation due to the on the ship presence of MOS and ALE. 

No one, to my recollection, has yet been able to sufficiently explain how there are evidence bags containing what certainly appear to be bones, (but obviously evidence, nonetheless) sitting in the very same cage that ALE dived on for the specific purpose of collecting that evidence; this being the very same cage that Tim Trehan gave a thumbs down on and said "nothing" referring to what was there; and the 2 dives on this very same cage were the ONLY human dives performed the entire 4 months.

That doesn't sound like losing control to me.

It sounds hinky.

Too bad we can't get more clear pictures of the contents of the bags.  I can't really make out what anything is.

It's evidence.  They dove for it.  Why did they even bother to dive on the cage when Trehan looked in it and said there was nothing there?  They didn't dive anywhere else.  Why did they dive from and return to their own boat and speed off with the evidence w/out allowing anyone else to even see it?
All from a cage that had "nothing"?

ALE thought it was Natalee too.  Why else would they send a sample
of denim to the FBI to compare to her "blouse".  That was a case of
CYA in my opinion.

[Keepthefaith]

Iris, the COVER-UP was by the Aruban police and dive team that was allowed to happen under the Persistence's watch.  JMO

That, I can believe.  I believe Schaefer, Silvetti and maybe even Tim Miller just lost control of the situation due to the on the ship presence of MOS and ALE. 

No one, to my recollection, has yet been able to sufficiently explain how there are evidence bags containing what certainly appear to be bones, (but obviously evidence, nonetheless) sitting in the very same cage that ALE dived on for the specific purpose of collecting that evidence; this being the very same cage that Tim Trehan gave a thumbs down on and said "nothing" referring to what was there; and the 2 dives on this very same cage were the ONLY human dives performed the entire 4 months.

That doesn't sound like losing control to me.

It sounds hinky.

Too bad we can't get more clear pictures of the contents of the bags.  I can't really make out what anything is.

It's evidence.  They dove for it.  Why did they even bother to dive on the cage when Trehan looked in it and said there was nothing there?  They didn't dive anywhere else.  Why did they dive from and return to their own boat and speed off with the evidence w/out allowing anyone else to even see it?
All from a cage that had "nothing"?

Why would Tim Trehan give the thumbs down and then they go dive on it.What transpired between the thumbs down dive and the dive on the 7th?Something occured obviously between Silvettti and whomever he was communicating with on Aruba.Mos or Richardson?What was the dialogue between Silvetti and Trehan regarding that dive?

[Anna]

BTW, I do hear from robots from time to time.  Remember he did hold his breathe when I didn't post and we have stayed loosely in touch.  He was fine last time I heard.

I think this site loads slowly for him and he gets lots and lots of popups which always annoy robots.

I have asked him several times to post and told him when he was mentioned and missed.  Like the rest of us, I know he cares deeply about what happened to Natalee but does have real life responsibilities.

[Magnolia]

"Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation)."

By who's request Iris44?

Of course I have a theory on this, too. I could be wrong but I think this has gotten kind of twisted around from Kermit asking Beth if it was OK to post this to this newer version of Beth asking for it to be posted.  My impression of Beth is that she wants any and all information to come out, so her telling Kermit to post it is just her blanket response, and that it was not a unique response to Kermit's specific information.  I've always got the sense that she doesn't want anyone to hold back any information, even if it is disturbing to her.  She is very brave.

Gee, Iris, we are so fortunate to have you here to explain things to us.

[billb's daughter]

Iris, the COVER-UP was by the Aruban police and dive team that was allowed to happen under the Persistence's watch.  JMO

That, I can believe.  I believe Schaefer, Silvetti and maybe even Tim Miller just lost control of the situation due to the on the ship presence of MOS and ALE. 

Schaefer..didn't lose control..he rigged the game..
Silvetti was in command...he was in charge and removed Tim Miller when he became a liability...

Kyle observed all...made the chose btwn Justice for Natalee...or personal gain...seems he took the latter route.....

BillB.Very well said!

Why would Tim Miller still be working with Silvetti if he had an experience like that with him on the Perstistence, that he was "removed" from the ship?  Doesn't make any sense to me.

Strange bedfellows...the bigger picture is that Tim is playing the cards dealt....doesn't mean that he is in total agreement with what went down off the coast of aruba...time will write that history...in the mean time....there are still missing persons too find...jmo

[Anna]

It's hard for me to see an attack on me personally filled with nothing but lies, straight out of the blue, as merely a difference of opinion.

Guess I need to work on that.

[always 1]

Iris, the COVER-UP was by the Aruban police and dive team that was allowed to happen under the Persistence's watch.  JMO

That, I can believe.  I believe Schaefer, Silvetti and maybe even Tim Miller just lost control of the situation due to the on the ship presence of MOS and ALE. 

Schaefer..didn't lose control..he rigged the game..
Silvetti was in command...he was in charge and removed Tim Miller when he became a liability...

Kyle observed all...made the chose btwn Justice for Natalee...or personal gain...seems he took the latter route.....

BillB.Very well said!

Why would Tim Miller still be working with Silvetti if he had an experience like that with him on the Perstistence, that he was "removed" from the ship?  Doesn't make any sense to me.

Strange bedfellows...the bigger picture is that Tim is playing the cards dealt....doesn't mean that he is in total agreement with what went down off the coast of aruba...time will write that history...in the mean time....there are still missing persons too find...jmo

You didnt answer me, Bilb.......

[Keepthefaith]

"Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation)."

By who's request Iris44?

Of course I have a theory on this, too. I could be wrong but I think this has gotten kind of twisted around from Kermit asking Beth if it was OK to post this to this newer version of Beth asking for it to be posted.  My impression of Beth is that she wants any and all information to come out, so her telling Kermit to post it is just her blanket response, and that it was not a unique response to Kermit's specific information.  I've always got the sense that she doesn't want anyone to hold back any information, even if it is disturbing to her.  She is very brave.

Iris44.They sent a compilation of their research to Beth Holloway.From what i understand it is not a generalization,and or a blanket statement.They sent her the information.She talked to someone she trusted.She then gave the OK.That's my understanding from posts made here!Not a unique response after they sent her the research?How is that a logical assesment??

[billb's daughter]

What...am I here by myself???
Where is...Keepthefaith, Icehawk, klaasend, thecuz, Magnolia, hotping, San, Lifesong, texasmom, Blue Moon, cubbeegirl, A's Fever, ospainter, Mere, cp405, iris44, truthseeker2, 2NJSons_Mom, cajun miracle and 17 Guests are viewing this topic.

Don't make me say goodnight before I get a response...Hay...the Cardinals lost....(they were robbed by the ref crew)....But it is OVER...Let's get back to Justice for Natalee....
come across...

You forgot me!!!!  But if all of that is true and you believe that was Natalee ( I dont) then the story of NH is over.  All that is left is the punishment stage.  That has been taken away from us.  What kind of punishment would you recommend for Kyle???? 

always 1...punishment is a long way ahead....
first, kyle needs to tell the truth about what he knows/observed while on the persistence..then, based on those results..the next step should become obvious...

[billb's daughter]

What...am I here by myself???
Where is...Keepthefaith, Icehawk, klaasend, thecuz, Magnolia, hotping, San, Lifesong, texasmom, Blue Moon, cubbeegirl, A's Fever, ospainter, Mere, cp405, iris44, truthseeker2, 2NJSons_Mom, cajun miracle and 17 Guests are viewing this topic.

Don't make me say goodnight before I get a response...Hay...the Cardinals lost....(they were robbed by the ref crew)....But it is OVER...Let's get back to Justice for Natalee....
come across...

Hey billb,  I have tried to be quiet and polite today.  It has been
very taxing.  I was so glad to hear news of robots and Carpe.
Glad you are here too.

Thanks Mags.....I am glad we are here too....

[Anna]

Good grief!  Tim Miller has to be in good graces with ALE to ever set foot on that island again.  Remember he did search for Jose Tromp as well as Natalee.  Tim did not openly support a boycott, said he had nothing bad to say about Aruba, etc. because otherwise, he would not be allowed to search.

With all that has happened in his life in the past year from taking a direct hit from hurricane to the disaster that the search for Caylee was for TES, did anyone ever think he just might have not picked up on every detail in any of this?  Like the fact that only ALE had access to the trap?

And after all they did to him, Tim was trying to return to Orlando for George Anthony's recent problems. 

He is the ultimate uniter, never judgmental and seeking retirement.  He manages to get alone with all parties from all sides.  With possibly one exception, lol.

[iris44]

JEN

ktf, I think you misunderstood nimrod.  I think maybe nimrod meant that we will probably never get to the bottom of what happened with the cage, and it would be a shame for us to be accusing the Americans on the Persistence of a coverup, if that is not true.    As far as we know, the family is very appreciative of Schaefer and Silvetti for the search, and consider them heroes.  The search would likely never would have happened without them.  There can't be that many vessels, and that many people with access to the equipment who would do something like this.  I think they deserve the benefit of the doubt.  They gave their time and money and maybe they tried their best and they just didn't succeed and there is no coverup.

Got rid of the majority of posts...so I'm not accused of being a stackaholic...
iris..I think you missed the point..
As far as we know, the family is very appreciative of Schaefer and Silvetti for the search, and consider them heroes. we don't know..that is the point.
The search would likely never would have happened without them. disagree...there most likely would be another group to come along; even if not... That is why it is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT to not dismiss the perception that louis/john took ADVANTAGE of the situation to USE the search for NATALEE (while mapping the ocean floor around aruba in search of oil) as a way to get CONTRIBUTIONS UNDER FALSE PRETENSIONS!

US C corporations are only allowed to deduct 10% of their net income for contribution expense in any given year.  The rest of it can be carried forward to future years, but still can only take the 10% of net income each year.  Which, could be a substantial deduction if they have income.   I'm sure all the companies involved took every deduction possible, just like all businesses do.  I read a quote from Tim Miller and he said the search would have never happened without them.  If it was my daughter I would not care if they were mapping the floor for oil at the same time. 

I have also read and seen interviews with both Dave and Beth saying how grateful they are to Schaefer, Silvetti and the crew.

"The IRS has imposed restrictions in the amount that a C Corporation may deduct for Charitable contributions made to a Charitable Foundation. In general, the corporations have no restrictions on the amount of charitable contributions that they make. However, obtaining a current year tax deduction is another matter.

The IRS rules state the the Corporation is entitled to deduct up to a maximum of 10% of a Corporations net taxable income without consideration of NOL and Charitable contribution. In other words, calculate the taxable income without deduction of charitable contribution, and a maximum limit is 10% of this taxable income.

Assuming a Corporation has no taxable income, then that Corporation would not be able to deduct charitable contributions for that calendar year, instead it will simply carry this deduction over to the future years subject to the normal charitable deductions limitations."
 

[Monkey Mia]

Iris, the COVER-UP was by the Aruban police and dive team that was allowed to happen under the Persistence's watch.  JMO

That, I can believe.  I believe Schaefer, Silvetti and maybe even Tim Miller just lost control of the situation due to the on the ship presence of MOS and ALE. 

No one, to my recollection, has yet been able to sufficiently explain how there are evidence bags containing what certainly appear to be bones, (but obviously evidence, nonetheless) sitting in the very same cage that ALE dived on for the specific purpose of collecting that evidence; this being the very same cage that Tim Trehan gave a thumbs down on and said "nothing" referring to what was there; and the 2 dives on this very same cage were the ONLY human dives performed the entire 4 months.

That doesn't sound like losing control to me.

It sounds hinky.

Lifesong, I am no expert and it would be difficult to give a complete explanation or analysis from what I have seen on the internet, but I believe the ziplock bags were photoshopped.

[Lifesong]

It's hard for me to see an attack on me personally filled with nothing but lies, straight out of the blue, as merely a difference of opinion.

Guess I need to work on that.

I feel for you on that, Anna.  You certainly don't need my help, but I expect we'll eventually get to the bottom of that - probably sooner rather than later.

That one particularly rubbed me raw too, I've watched you post here for years and if he/she/they would do it you then they'd do it to any of us. 

I'll be owing to have your back on that, come across.

[Magnolia]

What...am I here by myself???
Where is...Keepthefaith, Icehawk, klaasend, thecuz, Magnolia, hotping, San, Lifesong, texasmom, Blue Moon, cubbeegirl, A's Fever, ospainter, Mere, cp405, iris44, truthseeker2, 2NJSons_Mom, cajun miracle and 17 Guests are viewing this topic.

Don't make me say goodnight before I get a response...Hay...the Cardinals lost....(they were robbed by the ref crew)....But it is OVER...Let's get back to Justice for Natalee....
come across...

Hey billb,  I have tried to be quiet and polite today.  It has been
very taxing.  I was so glad to hear news of robots and Carpe.
Glad you are here too.

Thanks Mags.....I am glad we are here too....

I tried to cheat to be first on the new thread like Robots used to do.
San was going to help me, but Hotping beat me anyway.