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Author Topic: Natalee Case Discussion #798 2/1/09 - 2/5/09  (Read 175550 times)
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klaasend
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« Reply #320 on: February 02, 2009, 11:03:23 AM »

Magnolia - do you have any photos?   
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« Reply #321 on: February 02, 2009, 11:03:59 AM »

This Discussion this morning brought this to mind..Could this be why She fit in the trap...Just a Thought...

Monkeys, I tried to go to sleep, because i waana get up tomorrow and see what we hear. Something kept me awake though. It was a post on the internet From March 2006. I know we discussed it here long ago, and I also brought it back here to the forum On December 9th. But now I really DO believe that someone who knew what happened was trying to tell us . I wonder if this is what we will hear tommorow?    I give you the post again....Left on a blog called    Joranvandersloot.com, in the comments........................

8:41 pm  anonymous said...
It was high tide and sea water covering the beach slope, Koen's boat stayed out at a distance in the water and he didn't want the boat got stuck in the beach sand dunes. Joran didn't want his shoes get wet and he took them off. He and Deepak together carried Natalee's body and walking through the water towards Koen's boat where Koen kept the boat's motor running and positioning, it was high tide and high wind, the sea waves were strong and rough. For some unknown reasons Joran got some blood into his shoes when the suspects were trying to fit Natalee's body into the
crap cage. They might have to do some cuttings of the body in order to get all the body parts into the cage. The cage was not a coffin shape, it was square in shape, not long enough to fit a body of 5'4. So Joran put his bloody shoes into the square crab cage as well. Together the suspects dropped cage to the deepsea bottom and got rid of the forensic evidence.[b/] If Tim Miller can locate the crab cage, Joran's shoes are there. Joran is the murderer.

Hotping, if they were trying to get her into a small trap that would fit Koen's boat, why is Kyle saying she is in a large commercial trap that is probably 7' and 700 pounds?
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« Reply #322 on: February 02, 2009, 11:04:32 AM »

Monkey Mia...thank you for bringing the material regarding underwater photography (which I don't understand...lol) and the pictures of the crabbing operations and really nice shots of the crab pots.  If you scroll down to the section called "The Crabbing", you see a man going in to the trap to re-bait it...."Baiting the Crabpot"....my question....are these crabpots wide open like? 
It seems it would be easy to accomodate a person in the whole trap.

http://www.fishex.com/galleries/king-crab-fishing/photo-gallery.html
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« Reply #323 on: February 02, 2009, 11:05:20 AM »

This Discussion this morning brought this to mind..Could this be why She fit in the trap...Just a Thought...

Monkeys, I tried to go to sleep, because i waana get up tomorrow and see what we hear. Something kept me awake though. It was a post on the internet From March 2006. I know we discussed it here long ago, and I also brought it back here to the forum On December 9th. But now I really DO believe that someone who knew what happened was trying to tell us . I wonder if this is what we will hear tommorow?    I give you the post again....Left on a blog called    Joranvandersloot.com, in the comments........................

8:41 pm  anonymous said...
It was high tide and sea water covering the beach slope, Koen's boat stayed out at a distance in the water and he didn't want the boat got stuck in the beach sand dunes. Joran didn't want his shoes get wet and he took them off. He and Deepak together carried Natalee's body and walking through the water towards Koen's boat where Koen kept the boat's motor running and positioning, it was high tide and high wind, the sea waves were strong and rough. For some unknown reasons Joran got some blood into his shoes when the suspects were trying to fit Natalee's body into the
crap cage. They might have to do some cuttings of the body in order to get all the body parts into the cage. The cage was not a coffin shape, it was square in shape, not long enough to fit a body of 5'4. So Joran put his bloody shoes into the square crab cage as well. Together the suspects dropped cage to the deepsea bottom and got rid of the forensic evidence.[b/] If Tim Miller can locate the crab cage, Joran's shoes are there. Joran is the murderer.

Thanks Hotping, I had forgotten about this post.  Always made me wonder.  There were alot of interresting posts on that blog. 
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« Reply #324 on: February 02, 2009, 11:11:05 AM »

Monkey Mia...thank you for bringing the material regarding underwater photography (which I don't understand...lol) and the pictures of the crabbing operations and really nice shots of the crab pots.  If you scroll down to the section called "The Crabbing", you see a man going in to the trap to re-bait it...."Baiting the Crabpot"....my question....are these crabpots wide open like? 
It seems it would be easy to accomodate a person in the whole trap.

http://www.fishex.com/galleries/king-crab-fishing/photo-gallery.html

Yes Mere I agree.  In a large commercial trap like the ones the divers are next to in the screenshot, a body has plenty of room.  But the remains that Kyle has supperimposed NAH's image over only cover one diagonal half of one grid.  I am proposing that that area is not big enough for what Kyle wants to put in there. 

Where the crabman is entering the cage to bait the trap is the bottom that they open to release the catch.
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« Reply #325 on: February 02, 2009, 11:16:28 AM »

This Discussion this morning brought this to mind..Could this be why She fit in the trap...Just a Thought...

Monkeys, I tried to go to sleep, because i waana get up tomorrow and see what we hear. Something kept me awake though. It was a post on the internet From March 2006. I know we discussed it here long ago, and I also brought it back here to the forum On December 9th. But now I really DO believe that someone who knew what happened was trying to tell us . I wonder if this is what we will hear tommorow?    I give you the post again....Left on a blog called    Joranvandersloot.com, in the comments........................

8:41 pm  anonymous said...
It was high tide and sea water covering the beach slope, Koen's boat stayed out at a distance in the water and he didn't want the boat got stuck in the beach sand dunes. Joran didn't want his shoes get wet and he took them off. He and Deepak together carried Natalee's body and walking through the water towards Koen's boat where Koen kept the boat's motor running and positioning, it was high tide and high wind, the sea waves were strong and rough. For some unknown reasons Joran got some blood into his shoes when the suspects were trying to fit Natalee's body into the
crap cage. They might have to do some cuttings of the body in order to get all the body parts into the cage. The cage was not a coffin shape, it was square in shape, not long enough to fit a body of 5'4. So Joran put his bloody shoes into the square crab cage as well. Together the suspects dropped cage to the deepsea bottom and got rid of the forensic evidence.[b/] If Tim Miller can locate the crab cage, Joran's shoes are there. Joran is the murderer.

Hotping, if they were trying to get her into a small trap that would fit Koen's boat, why is Kyle saying she is in a large commercial trap that is probably 7' and 700 pounds?
I believe that Natalee was moved around several times...I think that it is possible that Her skeleton remains were put in the larger trap at some time...maybe years after She died..She could have possibly been in the smaller one then moved out further into deeper water and placed in the larger one... I believe that there is a remark by Paulus where He says I had no idea that the ocean could be searched like that meaning by ROV..Anybody else remember this comment by Paulus? 
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May 2010 Bring Natalee Home to Rest In Peace!
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« Reply #326 on: February 02, 2009, 11:18:41 AM »

Monkey Mia...thank you for bringing the material regarding underwater photography (which I don't understand...lol) and the pictures of the crabbing operations and really nice shots of the crab pots.  If you scroll down to the section called "The Crabbing", you see a man going in to the trap to re-bait it...."Baiting the Crabpot"....my question....are these crabpots wide open like? 
It seems it would be easy to accomodate a person in the whole trap.

http://www.fishex.com/galleries/king-crab-fishing/photo-gallery.html

Yes Mere I agree.  In a large commercial trap like the ones the divers are next to in the screenshot, a body has plenty of room.  But the remains that Kyle has supperimposed NAH's image over only cover one diagonal half of one grid.  I am proposing that that area is not big enough for what Kyle wants to put in there. 

Where the crabman is entering the cage to bait the trap is the bottom that they open to release the catch.

If this makes sense....a body that is first put into a cage would require a much larger space....the remains after a few years would not require that space and could have shifted into a much smaller space....perhaps the size that is the small area shown in the photograph.

The bags, however, do not seem to be at all normal.
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« Reply #327 on: February 02, 2009, 11:20:28 AM »

This Discussion this morning brought this to mind..Could this be why She fit in the trap...Just a Thought...

Monkeys, I tried to go to sleep, because i waana get up tomorrow and see what we hear. Something kept me awake though. It was a post on the internet From March 2006. I know we discussed it here long ago, and I also brought it back here to the forum On December 9th. But now I really DO believe that someone who knew what happened was trying to tell us . I wonder if this is what we will hear tommorow?    I give you the post again....Left on a blog called    Joranvandersloot.com, in the comments........................

8:41 pm  anonymous said...
It was high tide and sea water covering the beach slope, Koen's boat stayed out at a distance in the water and he didn't want the boat got stuck in the beach sand dunes. Joran didn't want his shoes get wet and he took them off. He and Deepak together carried Natalee's body and walking through the water towards Koen's boat where Koen kept the boat's motor running and positioning, it was high tide and high wind, the sea waves were strong and rough. For some unknown reasons Joran got some blood into his shoes when the suspects were trying to fit Natalee's body into the
crap cage. They might have to do some cuttings of the body in order to get all the body parts into the cage. The cage was not a coffin shape, it was square in shape, not long enough to fit a body of 5'4. So Joran put his bloody shoes into the square crab cage as well. Together the suspects dropped cage to the deepsea bottom and got rid of the forensic evidence.[b/] If Tim Miller can locate the crab cage, Joran's shoes are there. Joran is the murderer.

Hotping, if they were trying to get her into a small trap that would fit Koen's boat, why is Kyle saying she is in a large commercial trap that is probably 7' and 700 pounds?
I believe that Natalee was moved around several times...I think that it is possible that Her skeleton remains were put in the larger trap at some time...maybe years after She died..She could have possibly been in the smaller one then moved out further into deeper water and placed in the larger one... I believe that there is a remark by Paulus where He says I had no idea that the ocean could be searched like that meaning by ROV..Anybody else remember this comment by Paulus? 

What condition and what position would those skeletal remains be in?
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« Reply #328 on: February 02, 2009, 11:25:17 AM »

Monkey Mia...thank you for bringing the material regarding underwater photography (which I don't understand...lol) and the pictures of the crabbing operations and really nice shots of the crab pots.  If you scroll down to the section called "The Crabbing", you see a man going in to the trap to re-bait it...."Baiting the Crabpot"....my question....are these crabpots wide open like? 
It seems it would be easy to accomodate a person in the whole trap.

http://www.fishex.com/galleries/king-crab-fishing/photo-gallery.html

Yes Mere I agree.  In a large commercial trap like the ones the divers are next to in the screenshot, a body has plenty of room.  But the remains that Kyle has supperimposed NAH's image over only cover one diagonal half of one grid.  I am proposing that that area is not big enough for what Kyle wants to put in there. 

Where the crabman is entering the cage to bait the trap is the bottom that they open to release the catch.

If this makes sense....a body that is first put into a cage would require a much larger space....the remains after a few years would not require that space and could have shifted into a much smaller space....perhaps the size that is the small area shown in the photograph.

The bags, however, do not seem to be at all normal.

That is why we would have to know what the currents are in that area.  There are just too many factors to consider and get answers for before saying it is NAH.  Was the body wrapped was it in a bag?  If in the open, what kept it all confined?  Why didn't things get scattered?  I have a million questions.
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« Reply #329 on: February 02, 2009, 11:29:16 AM »

I have enjoyed the discussion.  Thank you everyone.  Now I need to get some things done.
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« Reply #330 on: February 02, 2009, 11:30:07 AM »

I found a blog that discusses ROV photography.  It's about 1/3 down, titled VideoRay Underwater Video ROV.  It describes a small ROV and there is a video showing it in action.  Since Monkey Mia posted the photography site & mentioned lighting, I wanted to note the lights on the mini-ROV if you watch the video:

http://www.navagear.com/category/photography/
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« Reply #331 on: February 02, 2009, 11:30:54 AM »

Isn't that a fish trap and not a crab trap? 
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« Reply #332 on: February 02, 2009, 11:31:08 AM »

This Discussion this morning brought this to mind..Could this be why She fit in the trap...Just a Thought...

Monkeys, I tried to go to sleep, because i waana get up tomorrow and see what we hear. Something kept me awake though. It was a post on the internet From March 2006. I know we discussed it here long ago, and I also brought it back here to the forum On December 9th. But now I really DO believe that someone who knew what happened was trying to tell us . I wonder if this is what we will hear tommorow?    I give you the post again....Left on a blog called    Joranvandersloot.com, in the comments........................

8:41 pm  anonymous said...
It was high tide and sea water covering the beach slope, Koen's boat stayed out at a distance in the water and he didn't want the boat got stuck in the beach sand dunes. Joran didn't want his shoes get wet and he took them off. He and Deepak together carried Natalee's body and walking through the water towards Koen's boat where Koen kept the boat's motor running and positioning, it was high tide and high wind, the sea waves were strong and rough. For some unknown reasons Joran got some blood into his shoes when the suspects were trying to fit Natalee's body into the
crap cage. They might have to do some cuttings of the body in order to get all the body parts into the cage. The cage was not a coffin shape, it was square in shape, not long enough to fit a body of 5'4. So Joran put his bloody shoes into the square crab cage as well. Together the suspects dropped cage to the deepsea bottom and got rid of the forensic evidence.[b/] If Tim Miller can locate the crab cage, Joran's shoes are there. Joran is the murderer.

Hotping, if they were trying to get her into a small trap that would fit Koen's boat, why is Kyle saying she is in a large commercial trap that is probably 7' and 700 pounds?
I believe that Natalee was moved around several times...I think that it is possible that Her skeleton remains were put in the larger trap at some time...maybe years after She died..She could have possibly been in the smaller one then moved out further into deeper water and placed in the larger one... I believe that there is a remark by Paulus where He says I had no idea that the ocean could be searched like that meaning by ROV..Anybody else remember this comment by Paulus? 

What condition and what position would those skeletal remains be in?
It seems to Me that the remains being underwater would definitely move around and would not be in the same position as when first put there...as far as condition of the remains I don't know... 
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« Reply #333 on: February 02, 2009, 11:34:07 AM »



+++++


KYLE KINGMAN - IN HIS OWN WORDS

<snip> [I'm sorry, Janet

Kyle:  I will soon propose a meeting with Beth and other family members, myself, Tim Trahan, Peter DeVries, and whomever else necessary to go over the ROV video, contents, and case status. I would like a couple people very familiar with the case documents also present to help connect dots during the meeting. I would prefer meeting towards the end of April or mid-May to allow adequate time for things to shake themselves out if is going to. If necessary, I have an ABC (20/20) and CBS (early show) film crew ready and willing to take part in such a meeting should it require press coverage. I've already had a meeting with ABC about this and they are "definitely interested" at the executive level. We met in mid-Feb about this already. The question becomes timing, who needs to be there, and whether or not it's covered by the press. I prefer not, but it may be useful. DeVries doesn't need to be there in my opinion but he's good for ratings and helps ABC be cooperative if needed.

<snip>



This quote is just amazing to me. 

Kyle Kingman....what on earth were you thinking when you typed these words?  You are talking about showing a mother, who for the last 4 years has agonized over what happened to her daughter, previously unseen footage from an underwater search for her daughter's remains.  Kyle, you are discussing all the media arrangements you have ready and the meetings you have already had with ABC behind her back.

Film crews?  Really, Kyle?

You're talking about Beth Holloway!  The film crews she could summon with a phone call could wipe the floor with yours.  Or were you trying to make sure you weren't "cut out of the action", Kyle?  Didn't you say your invoices were paid?

I just lost any illusion I might have had about this being a charitable endeavor.

And I have a really bad taste in my mouth.



EXACTLY!!!

Janet
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« Reply #334 on: February 02, 2009, 11:35:20 AM »

Magnolia - do you have any photos?   

   I wish I did.   It has been a funny sight.
The dog thinks we are playing a big game.
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« Reply #335 on: February 02, 2009, 11:35:45 AM »

I found a blog that discusses ROV photography.  It's about 1/3 down, titled VideoRay Underwater Video ROV.  It describes a small ROV and there is a video showing it in action.  Since Monkey Mia posted the photography site & mentioned lighting, I wanted to note the lights on the mini-ROV if you watch the video:

http://www.navagear.com/category/photography/

Nice video from the link above - thanks 2NJ

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/r5cc7mTNnS8&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/v/r5cc7mTNnS8&amp;hl=en&amp;fs=1</a>
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« Reply #336 on: February 02, 2009, 11:36:32 AM »

#314 on: Today at 09:37:03 AM   monkey mia

A 90' dive is a dive for advanced divers.  Wetsuit is required and possibly decompression time.  The amount of air you use depends on the individual diver but you have to consider the time to get down to the bottom, the amount of exertion, and the time to get back to the surface and any decompression time you need before you get to the surface.  A prudent diver would take that all into consideration before making such a dive.  We might assume drug dealers don't care about that though
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4466.300


This shows many reefs where scuba divers typically go 90 feet with no problem it is just part of the normal dive..... deep dives half down the page
http://www.mexicotravelnet.com/cozumel/scubadiving.htm
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« Reply #337 on: February 02, 2009, 11:36:43 AM »

Magnolia - do you have any photos?   

   I wish I did.   It has been a funny sight.
The dog thinks we are playing a big game.

That's what my dogs think everytime I try to do situps around them, LOL 

Need to run to the store real quick, brb
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« Reply #338 on: February 02, 2009, 11:37:31 AM »

Reply #682 on: March 18, 2008, 09:28:45 AM

Approx. 7.5 x 7.5 x 2.5ft, and 200-300lbs, hundreds of feet of rope complete with 4-point rigging.  http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366260#msg366260
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« Reply #339 on: February 02, 2009, 11:39:17 AM »

As to Kyle photoshopping images to bring to Natalee's Freebirds - I keep one simple fact in mind.

Kyle knew there was a family member at our forum prior to him joining it.

I doubt that Kyle would have perpetuated the type of scam being alluded to right smack in the face of a member of Natalee's family.
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