Natalee Case Discussion #798 2/1/09 - 2/5/09

[snoopy]

Howdy monkeys!!

From now on everything I say here in this special place will be said with the understanding that Natalee's family reads here.

I will chose my words more carefully, and will not acknowledge drive-bys whose attempt is to distract us from our goal. 

Justice for Natalee. 

Natalee was "carved out" by Joran, Deepak, and Satish .  Their intentions were not honorable.  Natalee died.  I want to know who was involved in the cover-up of the crimes committed against her.  From the time she left Carlos and Charlies through the search of the Persistence and the months thereafter.  I will not leave until I know, and justice is served to all those responsible.

I believe what Kermit and the Freebirds have told us, and anyone else who comes here to try and distract me from the truth will be scrolled on by.  Everyone has a right to their opinion, but some or either too lazy to read the entire conversation, too thickheaded to try and understand the truth in front of their eyes, or they are trying to deceive us.  I'm done with that.

Stay focused

Do not be disheartened
Do not be discouraged
Justice is coming     

Rock On!!   

Very well said Snoopy.Those that do the drive-by's,as well as distract from the task at hand should definitely understand that as well.I'm still having difficulty defining my feelings regarding those that go to the shows to boycott(which is wonderful),as well as do the drive-by posting(which is sad,to say the least).What to feel?I don't know.Anger,sadness,contempt.I'll try to continue to lean towards forgiveness,but it is becoming increasingly difficult with each post!As for the CnG crowd.I will stand FIRM.If you are a member there,and or are affiliated with and aware of what they are doing.If you are member's at both sites you are aware!YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR BEHAVIOUR!!!!THIS IS JUST MY OPINION!!

                                      JUSTICE FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY

                GOD BLESS BETH,DAVE,JUG,ROBIN,AS WELL THE MONKEY CAGE

                                                 KEEPTHEFAITH

I think what you consider DISTRACTIONS are just opinions different from your own.  Either the board welcomes all opinions or it does not.  But you cannot say you welcome other positions, but then call them DRIVE-BYS or DISTRACTIONS.  You can't have it both ways. 

Sorry if you took it that way.  I do not mind differing opinions.  Many wonderful people here have different opinions of what they think happened to Natalee and the cover-up and her final resting place.

What I consider drivebys are people whose goal is to distract from the monkey's search for justice.

This wonderful place would not be what it is if everyone agreed on everything.

Kermit and the Freebirds came here with what I believe to be the truth because they have backed up everything they have said.  I have not seen any other opinions backup up.  Especially in regard to CAPs, etc.  Doesn't mean that they are not legitimate, but at this point I'm not taking anyones word for anything unless it can be backed up.

And it's time to tell what is known.  At this point anything shared will not prevent justice from happening.  And this can be done without "outing" someones identity.  That should never be done unless they are obstructing justice.  Then the gloves should come off.  I have no mercy for those.   

[wreck]

Klaasand,

Would it be possible to start a separate thread for the in-fighting?  This is spiralling out of control and very difficult to get any real discussion started with all the fighting.  And very time consuming scrolling past all the fighting looking for real discussion.  Is that all considered on topic?  Thanks, Iris.

It is NOT merely a "difference of opinion". Not one of these posters has yet to give ANY actual opinion backed up with WHY they disagree. They come on merely to bash posters individually -- not their opinions.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Klaasand,

Would it be possible to start a separate thread for the in-fighting?  This is spiralling out of control and very difficult to get any real discussion started with all the fighting.  And very time consuming scrolling past all the fighting looking for real discussion.  Is that all considered on topic?  Thanks, Iris.

I am not Klaasend, but wanted to point out that someone asked for a separate thread a short while ago.  I said at that time that it can easily be done, but my thought was that the disagreements would still carry over and continue here. 

As San has noted, Klaasend will respond when she returns. 

The Super Bowl starts around 6:30pm ET, and it may or may not have an effect on discussions here.  (although I will be leaving within the hour and will have to catch up much later when the game is over.)

[klaasend]

1.  No, I will not start a new thread for people to disagree

2.  The drivebys will stop and if not they will be banned

3.  The discussion will return to Natalee, the suspects and the corruption in Aruba. 

[klaasend]

Klaasand,

Would it be possible to start a separate thread for the in-fighting?  This is spiralling out of control and very difficult to get any real discussion started with all the fighting.  And very time consuming scrolling past all the fighting looking for real discussion.  Is that all considered on topic?  Thanks, Iris.

I am not Klaasend, but wanted to point out that someone asked for a separate thread a short while ago.  I said at that time that it can easily be done, but my thought was that the disagreements would still carry over and continue here. 

As San has noted, Klaasend will respond when she returns. 

The Super Bowl starts around 6:30pm ET, and it may or may not have an effect on discussions here.  (although I will be leaving within the hour and will have to catch up much later when the game is over.)

People can start a thread if they want, they don't need our blessing.  From past experience that will not stop disagreements or drivebys in THIS thread.

[Lifesong]

Thank you, CBB!   

I loves my Valentine's Day "clothes"!
 

[nimrod]

JEN

Hello Monekys,

Thank you Klaas for approving my membership.

I am the former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator.

To answer ldstlou - NO, I am not disgruntled.  No, I am no longer a member at that forum.  I resigned today.

That is an outstanding group of people, with hearts of gold.  I admire and respect each and every one of them.

It was merely time for me to move on.  I felt that we had achieved all we could there over the past 2 1/2 years, and all of the Freebirds - former and current - will always be in my heart.

Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation).

I just simply couldn't stand by any longer and watch the continued confusion perpetrated by two particular posters here.  Whether it's been unintentional or deliberate - it really needs to stop now.

Wingnut made an excellent point - and I feel it's one that's been largely overlooked - pressure needs to be applied to get the answers as to what happened to the human remains Aruba recovered from that fishing cage.

Monkeys - you all are stellar at banding together and getting action.

The FBI can only do so much - with their limited jurisdiction.  They can speak to and subpoena from the members of the Persistence their statements and video to ascertain what was found.

Then it becomes an international issue.  Our State Department is where the encouragement is needed - to put pressure on the Hague to get to the bottom of this.

But something must be done.  Natalee's family has been through enough, and that they (and Natalee) were treated so shabbily by the one resource they felt they could trust is utterly heart wrenching.

Thank you Monkeys for allowing me to be here - let's help Natalee's family get some

KTF, On your question IMO, no.

Thanx Nimrod!

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Either Beth gave the OK to release the information or she didn't.All i can do is trust what i've been told.I believe she was fully aware.Do you?Yes or No."

NIMROD

"KTF, On your question IMO, no."

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Then i think it is fair to surmise from your opinion you DO NOT believe either Kermit,and or the FREEBIRDS?"Is that your opinion?

You surmised wrong. I believe everything that Kermit said that Kyle said is correct. Also, I believe what Jen said was sincere. My only disagreement with them was their unilateral decison to bring it to this board. IMO Kyle was probably the 3rd 0r maybe the fourth person on the food chain of the Persistence. I question Kyle's position in the food chain in his statement that the FBI told HIM there were human remains in the cage.  I personally don't believe there was human remains. Also, after all is said and done about this "theory" the results will probably be that three or four Americans will have been discredited, Auba will be laughing and happy for the diversion and NATALEE WILL STILL BE MISSING. No big deal, What's done is done.

[2NJSons_Mom]

Klaasand,

Would it be possible to start a separate thread for the in-fighting?  This is spiralling out of control and very difficult to get any real discussion started with all the fighting.  And very time consuming scrolling past all the fighting looking for real discussion.  Is that all considered on topic?  Thanks, Iris.

I am not Klaasend, but wanted to point out that someone asked for a separate thread a short while ago.  I said at that time that it can easily be done, but my thought was that the disagreements would still carry over and continue here. 

As San has noted, Klaasend will respond when she returns. 

The Super Bowl starts around 6:30pm ET, and it may or may not have an effect on discussions here.  (although I will be leaving within the hour and will have to catch up much later when the game is over.)

People can start a thread if they want, they don't need our blessing.  From past experience that will not stop disagreements or drivebys in THIS thread.

Exactly....Thank you, Klaas. 

[Keepthefaith]

JEN

Hello Monekys,

Thank you Klaas for approving my membership.

I am the former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator.

To answer ldstlou - NO, I am not disgruntled.  No, I am no longer a member at that forum.  I resigned today.

That is an outstanding group of people, with hearts of gold.  I admire and respect each and every one of them.

It was merely time for me to move on.  I felt that we had achieved all we could there over the past 2 1/2 years, and all of the Freebirds - former and current - will always be in my heart.

Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation).

I just simply couldn't stand by any longer and watch the continued confusion perpetrated by two particular posters here.  Whether it's been unintentional or deliberate - it really needs to stop now.

Wingnut made an excellent point - and I feel it's one that's been largely overlooked - pressure needs to be applied to get the answers as to what happened to the human remains Aruba recovered from that fishing cage.

Monkeys - you all are stellar at banding together and getting action.

The FBI can only do so much - with their limited jurisdiction.  They can speak to and subpoena from the members of the Persistence their statements and video to ascertain what was found.

Then it becomes an international issue.  Our State Department is where the encouragement is needed - to put pressure on the Hague to get to the bottom of this.

But something must be done.  Natalee's family has been through enough, and that they (and Natalee) were treated so shabbily by the one resource they felt they could trust is utterly heart wrenching.

Thank you Monkeys for allowing me to be here - let's help Natalee's family get some

KTF, On your question IMO, no.

Thanx Nimrod!

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Either Beth gave the OK to release the information or she didn't.All i can do is trust what i've been told.I believe she was fully aware.Do you?Yes or No."

NIMROD

"KTF, On your question IMO, no."

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Then i think it is fair to surmise from your opinion you DO NOT believe either Kermit,and or the FREEBIRDS?"Is that your opinion?

You surmised wrong. I believe everything that Kermit said that Kyle said is correct. Also, I believe what Jen said was sincere. My only disagreement with them was their unilateral decison to bring it to this board. IMO Kyle was probably the 3rd 0r maybe the fourth person on the food chain of the Persistence. I question Kyle's position in the food chain in his statement that the FBI told HIM there were human remains in the cage.  I personally don't believe there was human remains. Also, after all is said and done about this "theory" the results will probably be that three or four Americans will have been discredited, Auba will be laughing and happy for the diversion and NATALEE WILL STILL BE MISSING. No big deal, What's done is done.

"Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request"

So you think the cage is a diversion.That's fair and your opinion.

[Keepthefaith]

Howdy monkeys!!

From now on everything I say here in this special place will be said with the understanding that Natalee's family reads here.

I will chose my words more carefully, and will not acknowledge drive-bys whose attempt is to distract us from our goal. 

Justice for Natalee. 

Natalee was "carved out" by Joran, Deepak, and Satish .  Their intentions were not honorable.  Natalee died.  I want to know who was involved in the cover-up of the crimes committed against her.  From the time she left Carlos and Charlies through the search of the Persistence and the months thereafter.  I will not leave until I know, and justice is served to all those responsible.

I believe what Kermit and the Freebirds have told us, and anyone else who comes here to try and distract me from the truth will be scrolled on by.  Everyone has a right to their opinion, but some or either too lazy to read the entire conversation, too thickheaded to try and understand the truth in front of their eyes, or they are trying to deceive us.  I'm done with that.

Stay focused

Do not be disheartened
Do not be discouraged
Justice is coming     

Rock On!!   

Very well said Snoopy.Those that do the drive-by's,as well as distract from the task at hand should definitely understand that as well.I'm still having difficulty defining my feelings regarding those that go to the shows to boycott(which is wonderful),as well as do the drive-by posting(which is sad,to say the least).What to feel?I don't know.Anger,sadness,contempt.I'll try to continue to lean towards forgiveness,but it is becoming increasingly difficult with each post!As for the CnG crowd.I will stand FIRM.If you are a member there,and or are affiliated with and aware of what they are doing.If you are member's at both sites you are aware!YOU SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR BEHAVIOUR!!!!THIS IS JUST MY OPINION!!

                                      JUSTICE FOR NATALEE HOLLOWAY

                GOD BLESS BETH,DAVE,JUG,ROBIN,AS WELL THE MONKEY CAGE

                                                 KEEPTHEFAITH

I think what you consider DISTRACTIONS are just opinions different from your own.  Either the board welcomes all opinions or it does not.  But you cannot say you welcome other positions, but then call them DRIVE-BYS or DISTRACTIONS.  You can't have it both ways. 

1.There is a difference between a distraction,drive-by,and having your own opinion and backing it up!Period.
2.Let the Mods do there Job.You do not control the information.That's what hidey-holes are for!
3.As this is a open forum feel free to discuss anything you like.If poster's choose to respond or not is up to them!I will continue to voice my opinion!
4.I will continue to call it like i see it!
5.God Bless Scared Monkey's and the Mod's.You do an impossible Job extremely well!

                     GOD BLESS BETH,DAVE,JUG,ROBIN,AS WELL AS THE MONKEY'S

                                              JUSTICE FOR NATALEE

[nimrod]

JEN

Hello Monekys,

Thank you Klaas for approving my membership.

I am the former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator.

To answer ldstlou - NO, I am not disgruntled.  No, I am no longer a member at that forum.  I resigned today.

That is an outstanding group of people, with hearts of gold.  I admire and respect each and every one of them.

It was merely time for me to move on.  I felt that we had achieved all we could there over the past 2 1/2 years, and all of the Freebirds - former and current - will always be in my heart.

Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation).

I just simply couldn't stand by any longer and watch the continued confusion perpetrated by two particular posters here.  Whether it's been unintentional or deliberate - it really needs to stop now.

Wingnut made an excellent point - and I feel it's one that's been largely overlooked - pressure needs to be applied to get the answers as to what happened to the human remains Aruba recovered from that fishing cage.

Monkeys - you all are stellar at banding together and getting action.

The FBI can only do so much - with their limited jurisdiction.  They can speak to and subpoena from the members of the Persistence their statements and video to ascertain what was found.

Then it becomes an international issue.  Our State Department is where the encouragement is needed - to put pressure on the Hague to get to the bottom of this.

But something must be done.  Natalee's family has been through enough, and that they (and Natalee) were treated so shabbily by the one resource they felt they could trust is utterly heart wrenching.

Thank you Monkeys for allowing me to be here - let's help Natalee's family get some

KTF, On your question IMO, no.

Thanx Nimrod!

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Either Beth gave the OK to release the information or she didn't.All i can do is trust what i've been told.I believe she was fully aware.Do you?Yes or No."

NIMROD

"KTF, On your question IMO, no."

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Then i think it is fair to surmise from your opinion you DO NOT believe either Kermit,and or the FREEBIRDS?"Is that your opinion?

You surmised wrong. I believe everything that Kermit said that Kyle said is correct. Also, I believe what Jen said was sincere. My only disagreement with them was their unilateral decison to bring it to this board. IMO Kyle was probably the 3rd 0r maybe the fourth person on the food chain of the Persistence. I question Kyle's position in the food chain in his statement that the FBI told HIM there were human remains in the cage.  I personally don't believe there was human remains. Also, after all is said and done about this "theory" the results will probably be that three or four Americans will have been discredited, Auba will be laughing and happy for the diversion and NATALEE WILL STILL BE MISSING. No big deal, What's done is done.

"Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request"

So you think the cage is a diversion.That's fair and your opinion.

See, you took my opinion out of context. You forgot to say "after all is said and done"
and "probably". I don't mean to start a word game with you. LOL If i'm right it's a diversion. If I'm wrong, it won't be the first time.

[klaasend]

Thank you, CBB!   

I loves my Valentine's Day "clothes"!
 

OMG you're so cute!

[Keepthefaith]

JEN

Hello Monekys,

Thank you Klaas for approving my membership.

I am the former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator.

To answer ldstlou - NO, I am not disgruntled.  No, I am no longer a member at that forum.  I resigned today.

That is an outstanding group of people, with hearts of gold.  I admire and respect each and every one of them.

It was merely time for me to move on.  I felt that we had achieved all we could there over the past 2 1/2 years, and all of the Freebirds - former and current - will always be in my heart.

Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation).

I just simply couldn't stand by any longer and watch the continued confusion perpetrated by two particular posters here.  Whether it's been unintentional or deliberate - it really needs to stop now.

Wingnut made an excellent point - and I feel it's one that's been largely overlooked - pressure needs to be applied to get the answers as to what happened to the human remains Aruba recovered from that fishing cage.

Monkeys - you all are stellar at banding together and getting action.

The FBI can only do so much - with their limited jurisdiction.  They can speak to and subpoena from the members of the Persistence their statements and video to ascertain what was found.

Then it becomes an international issue.  Our State Department is where the encouragement is needed - to put pressure on the Hague to get to the bottom of this.

But something must be done.  Natalee's family has been through enough, and that they (and Natalee) were treated so shabbily by the one resource they felt they could trust is utterly heart wrenching.

Thank you Monkeys for allowing me to be here - let's help Natalee's family get some

KTF, On your question IMO, no.

Thanx Nimrod!

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Either Beth gave the OK to release the information or she didn't.All i can do is trust what i've been told.I believe she was fully aware.Do you?Yes or No."

NIMROD

"KTF, On your question IMO, no."

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Then i think it is fair to surmise from your opinion you DO NOT believe either Kermit,and or the FREEBIRDS?"Is that your opinion?

You surmised wrong. I believe everything that Kermit said that Kyle said is correct. Also, I believe what Jen said was sincere. My only disagreement with them was their unilateral decison to bring it to this board. IMO Kyle was probably the 3rd 0r maybe the fourth person on the food chain of the Persistence. I question Kyle's position in the food chain in his statement that the FBI told HIM there were human remains in the cage.  I personally don't believe there was human remains. Also, after all is said and done about this "theory" the results will probably be that three or four Americans will have been discredited, Auba will be laughing and happy for the diversion and NATALEE WILL STILL BE MISSING. No big deal, What's done is done.

"Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request"

So you think the cage is a diversion.That's fair and your opinion.

See, you took my opinion out of context. You forgot to say "after all is said and done"
and "probably". I don't mean to start a word game with you. LOL If i'm right it's a diversion. If I'm wrong, it won't be the first time.

You said it not me!

[texasmom]

Hi pdh3, I hope you are doing well! 

[bastibro]

I`m calling it a night here, as you say

Good night Monkeys, have fun with the Football game

[always 1]

I`m calling it a night here, as you say

Good night Monkeys, have fun with the Football game

Good nite!

[casa]

JEN

Hello Monekys,

Thank you Klaas for approving my membership.

I am the former Natalee's Freebirds Administrator.

To answer ldstlou - NO, I am not disgruntled.  No, I am no longer a member at that forum.  I resigned today.

That is an outstanding group of people, with hearts of gold.  I admire and respect each and every one of them.

It was merely time for me to move on.  I felt that we had achieved all we could there over the past 2 1/2 years, and all of the Freebirds - former and current - will always be in my heart.

Kermit did the right thing by making this information public at Beth Holloway's request (albeit 2 months after she asked us to do so thanks to the need to avoid litigation).

I just simply couldn't stand by any longer and watch the continued confusion perpetrated by two particular posters here.  Whether it's been unintentional or deliberate - it really needs to stop now.

Wingnut made an excellent point - and I feel it's one that's been largely overlooked - pressure needs to be applied to get the answers as to what happened to the human remains Aruba recovered from that fishing cage.

Monkeys - you all are stellar at banding together and getting action.

The FBI can only do so much - with their limited jurisdiction.  They can speak to and subpoena from the members of the Persistence their statements and video to ascertain what was found.

Then it becomes an international issue.  Our State Department is where the encouragement is needed - to put pressure on the Hague to get to the bottom of this.

But something must be done.  Natalee's family has been through enough, and that they (and Natalee) were treated so shabbily by the one resource they felt they could trust is utterly heart wrenching.

Thank you Monkeys for allowing me to be here - let's help Natalee's family get some

KTF, On your question IMO, no.

Thanx Nimrod!

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Either Beth gave the OK to release the information or she didn't.All i can do is trust what i've been told.I believe she was fully aware.Do you?Yes or No."

NIMROD

"KTF, On your question IMO, no."

KEEPTHEFAITH

"Then i think it is fair to surmise from your opinion you DO NOT believe either Kermit,and or the FREEBIRDS?"Is that your opinion?

You surmised wrong. I believe everything that Kermit said that Kyle said is correct. Also, I believe what Jen said was sincere. My only disagreement with them was their unilateral decison to bring it to this board. IMO Kyle was probably the 3rd 0r maybe the fourth person on the food chain of the Persistence. I question Kyle's position in the food chain in his statement that the FBI told HIM there were human remains in the cage.  I personally don't believe there was human remains. Also, after all is said and done about this "theory" the results will probably be that three or four Americans will have been discredited, Auba will be laughing and happy for the diversion and NATALEE WILL STILL BE MISSING. No big deal, What's done is done.

Wow, minrod, I totally agree with you!  In my opinion you hit the nail on the head!  I have always questioned why Kyle had the time to blog, post and email so many places when he was supposed to be helping on the Perisitance.  I also don't believe there was any human remains. Have never believed it.  Until the family tells me there was I will not believe it.  Also I have a daughter who knows someone who lives in south Louisiana and was acquainted with Silvetti and when the search was in the beginning stages he stated to me what a good person Silvetti is. This is not from me but someone who knows him.  All this fighting is sad and serves no purpose in finding Natalee.  All the name calling and attacking on both sides is bad and I am surprised it has been allowed.  Natalee should be the focus and not who knows what and who brought what here!  Some may disagree but this is my opinon which may be worth nothing to anyone but me! I do know that some family members don't read here anymore.  Cannot say for all of them.  I only know what some have told me.  God bless Natalee and her family who have to go through each day without her in their lives! 

[always 1]

Edward, I dont see you up there right now, but thank you so much for your post to me this morning.  I may not say much, but I do read and study everything.  Again, thank you, no one else responded to me.!!!!!

[Keepthefaith]

Interesting night, it's a shame hotshot won't stay and take the heat she and bastibro stirred up? Not surprising now is it?

I have a couple of things to say here and I don't say much often, so I hope some of you will indulge me. I'm not a true 'insider' as hotshot and ldstlou claim to be but I can tell you this much, the family is TIRED of watching what's happening on this thread. That I do know on good authority.

Also, this is for hotshot. I recall who began the first acting out against SM way back at the beginning of this and it was you and Ringo. Some of us foolishly let you plant half-truth's in our heads and/or make us doubt the intent of some who never deserved that. You have one outrageous audacity to state it's SM creating all of the issues now.

Some of us remember the history and I would think after four years of you inserting yourself as the super sleuth above all others to the degree that Dave won't even give you his phone number, that you could buy a clue !

I will repeat, the family is not happy to see all of these drive-by attacks and if you respect them, you will respect their feelings and the intent of this forum to support Natalee above all else.

[Keepthefaith]

NONESUCHE

Interesting night, it's a shame hotshot won't stay and take the heat she and bastibro stirred up? Not surprising now is it?

I have a couple of things to say here and I don't say much often, so I hope some of you will indulge me. I'm not a true 'insider' as hotshot and ldstlou claim to be but I can tell you this much, the family is TIRED of watching what's happening on this thread. That I do know on good authority.

Also, this is for hotshot. I recall who began the first acting out against SM way back at the beginning of this and it was you and Ringo. Some of us foolishly let you plant half-truth's in our heads and/or make us doubt the intent of some who never deserved that. You have one outrageous audacity to state it's SM creating all of the issues now.

Some of us remember the history and I would think after four years of you inserting yourself as the super sleuth above all others to the degree that Dave won't even give you his phone number, that you could buy a clue !

I will repeat, the family is not happy to see all of these drive-by attacks and if you respect them, you will respect their feelings and the intent of this forum to support Natalee above all else.

Again.Thank You.Nonesuche!