Lively Case Discussion #533 10/18 - 10/20/2006

[klaasend]

This according to MF at RU in reference to the translation Sandy did of the Diario article:

Of course not.... the translation of the Papiamento documents was just wrong again. There was not even mention of a cold case or that the investigation don't have a clue if it will be solved or not.

If I am not mistaken the translation came from SM.

Corrections in Red:

INVESTIGADORNAN HULANDES PA CASO NATALEE YA A REGRESA TERA FRIEU
Dutch Investigators for the Natalee Case have already gone to COLD LAND (=HOLLAND)

BAD: Holland investigators call Natalee case a cold file


ORANJESTAD (AAN); E investigadornan Hulandes cu a bin check e caso di Natalee Holloway, a bishita Aruba te cu nan a regresa Hulanda caba!

The Dutch Investigators that came back in the Natalee case, were on Aruba and already departed to Holland.

BAD: The holland investigators that came to aruba to check on the Natalee Holloway case have returned to Holland . Done or ended.

Manera ta conoci cu un grupo di investigadornan relaciona cu e caso Natalee cual ainda no a weita luz di dia ta sigui bao di investigacion. Recientemente manera a worde acorda entre Gobiernonan Hulandes y Aruba relaciona cu e caso di e hoben Mericano, kende a desaparece... no ta den doof pot manera hopi ta kere.                                                                                                              
As it is already known, there is a group of investigators in the Natalee case that has not yet seen the light of day (solution) is still under investigation. Recently, as was accorded by the governments of Aruba and Holland, in relation to this case of disappeared young American... which is not in the dark like many think.

BAD: The investigators in relation to the case of Natalee are unsure if this case will ever see the light of day or if the investigation will continue, this recent statement by the holland govenor about the dissapearance of the American. There doesnt seem to be any( ? )hope in this case. my note : unsure of this phrase or its meaning when translated.

[blah]

ok, now i'm confused.  Is someone playing games with us?

So the Dutch havent really said the case is cold or anything like that?

Is my bloodpressure off the scale for no reason?

[Anna]

Have we seen anywhere else where it is posted that Holland has declared this case "toast"?  This is so disheartening.  I cannot believe for a minute you could review this case and come to the conclusion that these 3 idiots aren't guilty... what drugs are all of these people on?

Jurisprudence is not a matter of thinking someone is guilty of a crime, it has to be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt.  And the Dutch system doesn't allow juries to be swayed with emotion & exposure to the media.  Their judges are very liberal and hold all the power.  Hence Paulus' "no body, no case."  I do believe there were some of ALE who believed J2K to be guilty, but with the cover-up and destruction/altering of evidence, the crime can never be proven to their liberal judges who can dismiss or discredit evidence or declarations on a whim.

It's truly sad.  I've always held out hope for Natalee and her loved ones.  I still do.  I think that one day we will know the truth.  It may not be in a timely manner, but it will happen in God's time.

But their system doesn't have juries, swayed or otherwise.  And in order to prove it they had to be trying which they obviously were trying to do the opposite.  Starting with the concept of how can we prove these PIMPS are innocent and working that way or so it seems to me.  And not even any punishment for the failed attempt to frame innocents for this.  

In order to find evidence, you first have to be looking for it.  They just never were but in fact were looking for a way out right from the speech by Oduber that this must not be allowed to happen.  Sure enough, next thing we know, it basically didn't according to ALE.

As Arlene said, Natalee just "disappeared"!  That just doesn't happen.  Their magical thinking have made it appear as though that is possible when it isn't.

Aruba thinks itself to be invincible and that they are just so wildly popular no one can do anything to harm them no matter what they do.  They imagine they can get away with literally murder in this case.  Sadly the perps appear to have done just that so far but collectively, they can all pay the price for their inaction.

.

[mrs. red]

Thanks ANNA!

[klaasend]

ok, now i'm confused.  Is someone playing games with us?

So the Dutch havent really said the case is cold or anything like that?

Is my bloodpressure off the scale for no reason?

Sandy Leiva does her best translating but her language is Spanish and not Pap.  She does the best she can to help out and I appreciate her trying to translate these for us.  Pap is very difficult to translate.

[Ono]

I believe that if the HI drop off story hadn't fallen apart, Mickey and Abraham would now be serving time in KIA for murder and Natalee's body would have been given to the family last June 2005.

Once the HI story fell apart, the huge coverup began.

I agree about Mickey & Abraham being used as the fall guys and they would be serving time, but wouldn't Natalee's body have DNA, etc. evidence which would incriminate the real perps ?

I'm sure they had an explanation for that.  Remember in the very begining one of them admitted that they all had sex with her.  Then we were told he never said that.  They weren't too concerned with the DNA part because they tested their lie "it was consensual".  It's how she died they were concerned about.  I believe once they recovered her body they knew lights out for Joran.

We've been conveniently flooded with too many stories just for the sake of mudding all waters, I think.  I have even wondered if they targeted her just for the sake of beating her up...maybe no sex at all...just to batter her...the mind goes in all directions.

[Ono]

I believe that if the HI drop off story hadn't fallen apart, Mickey and Abraham would now be serving time in KIA for murder and Natalee's body would have been given to the family last June 2005.

Once the HI story fell apart, the huge coverup began.

I agree about Mickey & Abraham being used as the fall guys and they would be serving time, but wouldn't Natalee's body have DNA, etc. evidence which would incriminate the real perps ?

Maybe, not sure how much of that kind of evidence can be destroyed.

If they had handed over her body, I am convinced that Beth would insist on having her own autopsy to be done by a competent person from the States..I know I would. Beth is so intelligent and thorough by nature.

[Angiex911dsptchr]

ok, now i'm confused.  Is someone playing games with us?

So the Dutch havent really said the case is cold or anything like that?

Is my bloodpressure off the scale for no reason?

 Dont feel bad. I was confused  too..

[Ono]

Found a site with lots of pics.  Bird Sanctuary and Spanish Lagoon, LaCabana.  Click on picture links.

http://www.orrin.org/aruba/photos/

Thanks Buckeye...Lots of pictures is right..I've often wondered if she was placed inside of some small cave, under a ledge, off the beaten path.

[Anna]

So MF is saying instead of going to a cold case, it has gone to a cold land?  Who talks like that!  

[Angiex911dsptchr]

So MF is saying instead of going to a cold case, it has gone to a cold land?  Who talks like that!  

Anna.. I am trying to make sense of this all too.
Great to see you..  Love all your cute pics you post!

[blah]

ok, now i'm confused.  Is someone playing games with us?

So the Dutch havent really said the case is cold or anything like that?

Is my bloodpressure off the scale for no reason?

 Dont feel bad. I was confused  too..

well I still am

[Angiex911dsptchr]

ok, now i'm confused.  Is someone playing games with us?

So the Dutch havent really said the case is cold or anything like that?

Is my bloodpressure off the scale for no reason?

 Dont feel bad. I was confused  too..

well I still am

 Umm.. I have to admit Blah,.. So am I..

[klaasend]

So MF is saying instead of going to a cold case, it has gone to a cold land?  Who talks like that!  

MF is saying that Cold land s/b Holland.

[Ono]

ok, now i'm confused.  Is someone playing games with us?

So the Dutch havent really said the case is cold or anything like that?

Is my bloodpressure off the scale for no reason?

LOL!! I'm a basketcase now myself! And people have been playing games with us from the getgo! I see the name Aruba and I automatically cringe. It's not a good thing.

[Anna]

[
If they had handed over her body, I am convinced that Beth would insist on having her own autopsy to be done by a competent person from the States..I know I would. Beth is so intelligent and thorough by nature.

In April 2006 Aruba listed as natural causes the death of the man who died on a boat and yet the family's autopsy came back strangulation so they still thought in April they could fool people.

I can no longer even guess what they will try.

.

[klaasend]

This posted at RU:

Peter R. de Vries is going to do a tv show about this case.

As it seems the Dutch reporter Peter R. de Vries is going to do a program about the disappearance of Natalee Holloway.

He is very known over here, and is someone who keeps digging for the truth even though it takes him years. (he even made a show that caused problems for the Dutch Royal family, he does a lot of shows that even causes the politicians to take action).
I am not saying here that I admire him, since in all honesty I don't.

He has been in contact with Beth, and since many ppl in Holland are not aware that there is another side to this case, I wonder if he is aware of so many things "known" pointing (imo) into other directions then J2K.

He aks for info (according to other boards), and I have send him an email in Dutch to inform him that there is more to this case then as has been reported on the US tv shows.

It is impossible to even write a summary, so I did not do that, I did include some things though that might trigger him to look into other directions.

[Angiex911dsptchr]

So MF is saying instead of going to a cold case, it has gone to a cold land?  Who talks like that!  

MF is saying that Cold land s/b Holland.

Klaas..  Umm whats s/b?  sorry

[Ono]

So MF is saying instead of going to a cold case, it has gone to a cold land?  Who talks like that!  

Who is MF anyway ????

[Ono]

[
If they had handed over her body, I am convinced that Beth would insist on having her own autopsy to be done by a competent person from the States..I know I would. Beth is so intelligent and thorough by nature.

In April 2006 Aruba listed as natural causes the death of the man who died on a boat and yet the family's autopsy came back strangulation so they still thought in April they could fool people.

I can no longer even guess what they will try.

.

Me either...never before have I ever seen human specimans such as these.