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Author Topic: Caylee Marie Anthony #107 2/17/09 - 2/19/09  (Read 404718 times)
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TURBOTHINK
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« Reply #1420 on: February 19, 2009, 12:41:10 AM »

What you see from the Rev,you see through natural eyes.What I see,I see through spiritual eyes and his words do not line up with the Bibles words.I am not the only one in this forum that thinks the Rev is out of line.He loved Caylee so much that he jumped Casey about abusing he and his wife over childcare.Yep,he loved her that much! As far as I'm concerned,he is nothing more than a self serving person that wants alittle spotlight for himself and has taken great strides in making it happen.I'm sorry if you don't like what I've said,call me judgemental,whatever,but if you ever want to rightly divide the truth about what the Bible really says,let me know...

Tater, I think you are confusing Christianity with being a door mat. Just because you are a born again Christian does not mean that you let people take advantage of you, as in constantly babysitting!!! Or standing back and letting people take pot shots at your family! He is being a good husband and father. I would hope that if I had a husband, he would take take steps to protect me in this devastating situation. You have seen what these people can do! They would take your innocent child and gladly see them carted off to jail for the rest of their lives, while they SIT ON THEIR ASS PROTECTING KC!! They knew KC was capable of this, they destroyed evidence and wouldn't cross the road to protect you or your family. Walk a fricking mile in his shoes before you start throwing stones!!! THIS IS MY VERY STRONG OPINION!!!

The Grunds did exactly what they should have done. It is not christian to allow a person who is neglecting and most likely abusing their child as they obviously felt KC was to continue without confronting them.  That is called co-dependency when one turns a blind eye and goes into denial of the truth of the situation. Rev. Grund did what the Bible tells one to do in such a situation. He did not take it far enough though as he should have gone to others when he received no response. In the back of my mind, I believe they may have gone to the Anthonys, but we all know how that would have gone.

In my opinion the Anthonys are EVIL. They are all "PEOPLE OF THE LIE", and those type of people turn their children into sociopaths for self protection. KC became what she became because she was desperate for love and protection. She knew subconsciously they would destroy her if she did not destroy them. Killing Caylee was a way to try to destroy them.  The end result always is EVIL KILLS !  The stronger evil will destroy a lesser evil, so KC because the stronger one, but turned on the weakest one in the family instead of the EVIL ONES. I do believe she planned to kill them next.
casey told anny that JG has a copy of her car's key....can be possible that casey when went to JG house planted evidence (key)

Yeah, I am sure he would "plant" Caylee's body there since he had not been around her for months. He never had a key - that was just another one of Cindy & Casey's lies.  KC also told that "zanny" had a key to the house, but we all know there is no zanny.
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Where you find a generational evil, you find chaos, lies and many family secrets.

There is a DEEP GENERATIONAL EVIL in the Anthony family.
TURBOTHINK
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« Reply #1421 on: February 19, 2009, 12:44:51 AM »


Hello monkeys,  I have been reading the documents and the forum all day.  It is so hard to see little Caylee's bones listed one by one.

I have never had any reason to fear or disrespect the law, my father in law was an Oregon State Police Captain.  I do however, after reading how long and time consuming it was to find every piece of little Caylee, have new respect and admiration for them.

Monkeys, I know it is hard to read and accept some of the fact of this case but I really wish we could agree to disagree without fighting.  This cage has become my place for sanity and friendship in an otherwise crazy world and an even crazier case.  I have always heard the phrase, never discuss religion or politics, in even the most polite company...........

The only thing we all really can agree on, is the need for justice and the missing found.

Hugs,  Magic

I so agree, Magic.  And you have a sweet heart.

Yes, it was very upsetting:  "ulna"  "vertebra" --  First, shock, seeing it in print.  Then, I cried.  Then felt sick.  Then just heartbroken and sad.  What a dedicated effort that was on the part of LE...  Crime scene folks must have had a hard time with it, too, but they were doing it for our Caylee, bless them.



I was just thinking as I read through those documents today what a thorough job they had done from the beginning of this tragedy. They documented every little thing, and took so many precautions to preserve the integrity of the evidence and the chain of evidence. They have to be one of the best investigative units in the U.S. If more sheriff's departments were so precise, there would be a lot more criminals off the streets.
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Where you find a generational evil, you find chaos, lies and many family secrets.

There is a DEEP GENERATIONAL EVIL in the Anthony family.
TURBOTHINK
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« Reply #1422 on: February 19, 2009, 12:47:14 AM »

Did anyone else notice the "paver" they found near the body was the same as the ones at the Anthony house?

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/3374B%20TO%203463B%20REDO.pdf

Page 48.
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Where you find a generational evil, you find chaos, lies and many family secrets.

There is a DEEP GENERATIONAL EVIL in the Anthony family.
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« Reply #1423 on: February 19, 2009, 12:47:47 AM »

Quote from: TURBOTHINK
(First paragraph *snipped* by Desi...)

In my opinion the Anthonys are EVIL. They are all "PEOPLE OF THE LIE", and those type of people turn their children into sociopaths for self protection. KC became what she became because she was desperate for love and protection. She knew subconsciously they would destroy her if she did not destroy them. Killing Caylee was a way to try to destroy them.  The end result always is EVIL KILLS !  The stronger evil will destroy a lesser evil, so KC because the stronger one, but turned on the weakest one in the family instead of the EVIL ONES. I do believe she planned to kill them next.

Turbo, when you talk about this topic, it always REALLY creeps me out.  I don't want any of it to be true, because it is just so awful.

But I believe you know whereof you speak.  I think you are *shudder* exactly on target with your theories here... Ugly... the truth is sometimes so ugly we don't want to let our minds even go there... but that doesn't change what is real.

Thank you for saying what we don't always want to hear...

Turbo, did you ever read the book, The People of the Lie?  I posted this the night before Caylee's remains were found.  We all only talked about the miracle and sadness of finding Caylee for days.  My post was never commented on, so I am going to re-post it now.

This is a quote about the book, The People of the Lie.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Scott_Peck

Most of his conclusions about the psychiatric condition he designates "evil" are derived from his close study of one patient he names Charlene. Although Charlene is not dangerous, she is ultimately unable to have empathy for others in any way. According to Scott Peck, people like her see others as play things or tools to be manipulated for their uses or entertainment. Scott Peck claims that these people are rarely seen by psychiatrists and have never been treated successfully.

He gives some identifying characteristics for evil persons. Discussed below are Scott Peck's views.

Evil is described by Peck as "militant ignorance". In this it is close to the original Judeo-Christian concept of "sin" as a consistent process that leads to failure to reach one's true goals.

An evil person:

Projects his or her evils and sins onto others and tries to remove them from others
Maintains a high level of respectability and lies incessantly in order to do so
Is consistent in his or her sins. Evil persons are characterized not so much by the magnitude of their sins, but by their consistency
Is unable to think from other people's viewpoints.
Most evil people realize the evil deep within themselves but are unable to tolerate the pain of introspection or admit to themselves that they are evil. Thus, they constantly run away from their evil by putting themselves in a position of moral superiority and putting the locus of evil on others. Evil is an extreme form of what Scott Peck, in The Road Less Traveled, calls a character disorder.


My thoughts.......

Although this amazing author, M. Scott Peck died in 2005, it seems as if he met Casey before he passed.  If you didn't know better you would think it is someone talking about this case and Casey Anthony.  He seems to know her so well.  I have heard her called evil and have even called her evil myself but I never really thought about it as being a "diagonsis".  This author, doctor, has seen more than one Casey in his lifetime and writes of knowing many. 

I think we have only seen a taste of her, "wicked evilness".  It makes you wonder what else she has done and to whom?  Did Caylee really live this happy "Disney" existence or was she made to suffer from the hands of her evil mother?  Are Cindy, George and Lee as truly evil as Casey is?  I don't have one bit of sympathy left for any of them but it does make you wonder. Can a whole family be truly evil at the same time?  What was little Caylee's short life like?  Like another monkey said all we ever see is a staged snapshot of Caylee dressed up like a belonging, to show off.  Why are there no "real' photos?  No family gatherings, no vacations, no other children? 

Makes you wonder if the only "real" photo we ever saw of Caylee was the one where she has been obviously crying for a long time.  I hope Caylee was truly loved by someone, I really need to believe this.  I even want to believe that Cindy and George and Lee did love her and have just been made evil by Casey.  As much as I want that, I will doubt it for the rest of my life.  None of this will ever make any sense to me and I am somewhat relieved by that. I thought I knew all about sociopaths because of my sister, I was wrong.  I think sociopaths come in all sizes and shapes, different circumstances lead to different life situations.  Who knows what takes a person from being a sociopath, psychopath or any "path" to becoming an evil human being.  I don't think all sociopaths are truly evil but I think all evil peole are sociopaths. They just take it that one step further than anyone could ever imagine.

That was my post, way back then.  I would love to know your thoughts on it.  Do you think the whole family is evil and it is the other way around?  That they made Casey evil?

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Hugs, Magic 

"Dear God." she cried out, "look at all the suffering and injustice in the world. Why don't you send help?" God responded,"I did send help, I sent you."
Monkeys will never give up on justice. an angelic monkey
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« Reply #1424 on: February 19, 2009, 12:48:14 AM »

things are so seldom black and white. except who murdered caylee.

i wouldnt wish what has happened to the anthonys on my worst enemy. i also would hope and pray that i would never be defined by how i acted during the single darkest time in my life. it seems pretty simple, and yet...

there are so many hours of cindy talking, talking as in speaking (im only going by what i have actually watched all the way thru, like the fbi and le interviews and talk and news show appearances ), that i cant help react to her as a person. i dont like her. i dont like the way she talks nonstop, literally. i dont like how she tries to mold the truth to suit herself, i dont like how she doesnt let anyone get a word in edgewise, i dont like how self absorbed she is, i dont like how bossy she is, i dont like the blatant ingratitude shes exhibited for all those trying to help and i dont like her voice. i could go on but i think you get the idea.

how did she get that way? well, she is the youngest of 4 children and she is the only girl. was she spoiled and/or indulged? i would guess so. did her parents make excuses for her at times? probably. are her parents soley responsible for how she turned out? doubtful. do her family interactions seem not ideal at times? well ya. do i blame not liking her on her parents? course not, shes not the two year old ( even tho she may act like one at times ).

do i blame her mother, father, brothers, for her omitting to tell le and the fbi everything that she knew happened? no, its her id like to smack for making them have to waste a single second finding out themselves, thereby taking away time that could have been focused on caylee. do i blame them for her having the strained and competitive relationship she has with her own daughter? no, while ive known a sociopath, i didnt have to interact with them in the bounds of such a powerful and intimate bond as there is between mother and child.

the last sentence may seem strange given her daughter is charged with murdering her own baby. shes a sociopath, and the problem with that is so many of us look for reasons as to why, cause it needs to be something rational and acceptable, it just cant be for basically nothing. that kind of evil is hard to willingly accept, the woman basically looks normal...it cant be someone like us, its too scary.

its true however. thats what i prefer to focus on. the peripheral, ever expanding cast of strange characters, has all the attention of a worldwide three ring circus, and while interesting at times, it has nothing to do with what im concerned about, that caylees murderer gets prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. and rots her life away in jail.



Peanut, I find your post interesting. 

I'd especially like to remark re. the part re us being frightened by the prospect that evil walks among us.  Sorry I don't yet know how to "snip".

Over the years, I've strived to "train" my older teen to spot superfreaks.  It hasn't been easy, since they are chamelions.  And what kid listens to their mom... 

Not all sociopathic types kill their own offspring (obviously).  I think those individuals are a law unto themselves.  I'd kind of like to revisit Susan Smith ( ) a bit since I think she and alleged perp share that common denominator of thinking they'd be more desirable/snag the love of their life if they weren't bogged down w/the responsibility of being a responsible, caring parent.

Ironic ain't it? Some superfreaks want love and are willing to smoke the ones who love 'em to get some other folks to love them? 

I'm so confused by the superfreaks.     

Foggy

 
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Desdemona
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« Reply #1425 on: February 19, 2009, 12:52:06 AM »

^^^^^looks like it could be a blankie?  perhaps one of Caylees favorites?

Hi cookie!!   

Well, I don't know what to think. It's folded, but measures 7x7 approx. when folded......... 
Trying to think what measures 14x14 unfolded...I'm guessing napkin (in which case, they're may have been others at the A's home).

My guess is:

A men's "pocket square" --
ranging from 12" to 14" square, made to match a patterned silk tie, worn in the pocket of a suit jacket.

Link to a couple of examples:   http://www.sierratradingpostaffiliates.com/store/altea/

Maybe?
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« Reply #1426 on: February 19, 2009, 12:52:52 AM »

Monkeys still awake? Did you vote today?

http://incoldblogger.blogspot.com/

Is the voting over?  Can't find the post to vote.
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« Reply #1427 on: February 19, 2009, 12:53:36 AM »


The Glitter Hearts look exactly like it!

Klaas,

I don't have a photobucket.  Could you or some other smart monkey do a comparison with the crime scene heart?

Thanks!
Looks the same to me.



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« Reply #1428 on: February 19, 2009, 12:54:59 AM »

Monkeys still awake? Did you vote today?

http://incoldblogger.blogspot.com/

Is the voting over?  Can't find the post to vote.

You have to scroll down a ways then there is a dropdown where you choose.  Before you click on the drop down arrow it automatically has BeaconHell there (alpha). 
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Desdemona
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« Reply #1429 on: February 19, 2009, 12:56:10 AM »

Monkeys still awake? Did you vote today?

http://incoldblogger.blogspot.com/


Thank you Scatty!  I was looking for that link... and it magically appeared thanks to you.
Monkeys Rule!
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« Reply #1430 on: February 19, 2009, 01:06:20 AM »

Did anyone else notice the "paver" they found near the body was the same as the ones at the Anthony house?

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/3374B%20TO%203463B%20REDO.pdf

Page 48.

ooh, ooh, yay Turbo, I forgot to mention that.  It did seem quite significant; investigators seemed to think so too, judging from the way it was documented.

I noticed -- I think -- that the docs didn't specify "concrete" or "paver" -->
something like "large white stone."

Site photos showed a white paver AND a big white rock together, so I wasn't sure which they were emphasizing in the pic.  Too tired to go searching through Anthony home/yard pics to try to find the right rock or paver, though. 

 

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« Reply #1431 on: February 19, 2009, 01:09:29 AM »

I've been reading and lurking all day and I'm worn out big time.  Out of all the "talking heads" which appeared today, I did hear one fact of which I was not aware, and this has to do with the Death Penalty, which we all keep talking about.  The potential for a case to draw the death penalty must be formally requested or motioned with the court within 45 days of arraignment.  Otherwise, the maximum sentence is LWOP.  In this particular case, the death penalty was in place on a murder 1 arraignment; however, it was taken "off the table" with the plea bargain offer prior to the remains being found.  Apparently none of the prosecutors ever thought to re-file the motion or get it reinstated.  This attorney indicated that with the amount of time since arraignment, the death penalty cannot be re-introduced in this case.  I don't know if I understood this right or not, but if it is true it is a shame......no one ever deserved it more.
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« Reply #1432 on: February 19, 2009, 01:15:51 AM »

Did anyone else notice the "paver" they found near the body was the same as the ones at the Anthony house?

http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/3374B%20TO%203463B%20REDO.pdf

Page 48.

ooh, ooh, yay Turbo, I forgot to mention that.  It did seem quite significant; investigators seemed to think so too, judging from the way it was documented.

I noticed -- I think -- that the docs didn't specify "concrete" or "paver" -->
something like "large white stone."

Site photos showed a white paver AND a big white rock together, so I wasn't sure which they were emphasizing in the pic.  Too tired to go searching through Anthony home/yard pics to try to find the right rock or paver, though. 

 



Ah-HA!

Page 43:  "Large white SQUARE stone."

Page 43
:  "appeared to be consistent with stoned found at the Anthony home."

Great catch.
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« Reply #1433 on: February 19, 2009, 01:16:01 AM »

I am catching up some.  The two girls saying that Casey was upset, on the verge of a breakdown and expressed a desire to be committed and "get help" are very, very important.  So is the fact that Casey supposedly told one of them she did not think she was a good mother to Caylee.  Also the fact that Cindy constantly called Casey whenever Casey went out.  I think the best defense for Baez to pursue is that Casey had mental and/or emotional issues that went untreated and that Cindy intervened too much in her life, causing her to be constantly on edge.  The whole love/hate relationship between Cindy and Casey is the root of this problem.  Whether Casey will go along with that defense or not is the big question.  If she wants to possibly save herself from life in prison or even the death penalty, she will have to.  It will not be hard to paint Cindy as a dragon lady.  I know some people sympathize with Cindy and I am sure she did not want Casey to kill Caylee, but I am just being objective here and saying that is the best defense.  Casey could conceivably get time in a mental institution instead of a prison.  But only if they go the mentally and emotionally unstable route.

One of the more important items IMO was that it was disclosed that Casey hyperventilated when she heard remains had been found on Suburban.  The reason it's important is that Casey never showed any emotion any of the other times there might have been some kind of find AND that she didn't hear Caylee's remains were found (we didn't know that until much later).

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« Reply #1434 on: February 19, 2009, 01:17:00 AM »

er...  Did I say "stoned?"   

heh heh, uh, "stones," that is...

 
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« Reply #1435 on: February 19, 2009, 01:20:35 AM »

Monkeys still awake? Did you vote today?

http://incoldblogger.blogspot.com/

Is the voting over?  Can't find the post to vote.

You have to scroll down a ways then there is a dropdown where you choose.  Before you click on the drop down arrow it automatically has BeaconHell there (alpha). 
WOW - really far down there!  I got spoiled with it being the first article for so long!  Thanks guys!
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« Reply #1436 on: February 19, 2009, 01:21:42 AM »

I finally have the time to sit and read the doc dump and I gotta say as the mom of a toddler all of this just makes me so sad. I just want to pick up my baby and hug her and never let go. I know that it is not Christian of me to hate but I hate CA. What a selfish batch. This case has really gotten to me. I ask myself how could someone do this to a precious, innocent child? The only peace that I can find knowing that Caylee is with Jesus and is forever happy. I hope CA rots and the image of Caylee never leaves her mind. Sorry for the rant ya'll I am just disgusted right now.
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« Reply #1437 on: February 19, 2009, 01:21:54 AM »

I am not sure that Casey would fit the definition of "legally insane" which is different from being diagnosed as insane by a doctor.  The legal definition is much more strict.  But she does not have to claim insanity.  She can claim some sort of temporary disconnect with reality or emotional issue.  Temporary insanity is different from being legally nuts.  Baez may try to say that for a certain amount of time, Casey was struggling to keep her head above water mentally and/or emotionally and falling deeper and deeper into a kind of altered state of reality in which getting rid of Casey seemed the only way to end her pain.  The comments about her feeling happier after Caylee was gone would be helpful to him.  It may not work, but it just might cause some jurors to sympathize and decide she needs help not incarceration. 

Casey tells people she does not want to disappoint her mother and yet it appears she pretended to have another pregnancy and a miscarriage which upset Cindy terribly.  Casey tells the cops that her main source of stress is her mother.  Casey tells friends that Cindy wants to control her life and wants to take Caylee away from her.  Some of this is obviously true.  Some may not be true.

But we do seem to know this for a fact.  Cindy theatened to get custody of Caylee.  At the same time, Cindy says that Casey was a loving and devoted mother.  Now those two things do not mesh.  Either Casey was such a bad mother that Cindy feared for the child's safety or Casey was a good mother who liked to go out and could not keep a job.  Which is it?



Temporary insanity - as in huge fight, mom threatened to take my baby and mom tried to strangle me?  Wouldn't it be necessary for Casey to take the stand and testify to that?  Plausible, but I really can't see her doing that because (1) she would have to admit that she cause harm to Caylee and (2) she would be subject to interrogation by the prosecutor.

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« Reply #1438 on: February 19, 2009, 01:24:28 AM »

I've been reading and lurking all day and I'm worn out big time.  Out of all the "talking heads" which appeared today, I did hear one fact of which I was not aware, and this has to do with the Death Penalty, which we all keep talking about.  The potential for a case to draw the death penalty must be formally requested or motioned with the court within 45 days of arraignment.  Otherwise, the maximum sentence is LWOP.  In this particular case, the death penalty was in place on a murder 1 arraignment; however, it was taken "off the table" with the plea bargain offer prior to the remains being found.  Apparently none of the prosecutors ever thought to re-file the motion or get it reinstated.  This attorney indicated that with the amount of time since arraignment, the death penalty cannot be re-introduced in this case.  I don't know if I understood this right or not, but if it is true it is a shame......no one ever deserved it more.

Oh dear.  I had not heard about this!

Do you know if the SAO originally announced they were seeking the death penalty?  Not that this is a valid source, but one poster at a blog I checked out said they have 45 days to reinstate the death penalty if it has previously been announced and withdrawn.

Anybody know the laws on this?  Or whether they originally announced they were seeking the DP?

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« Reply #1439 on: February 19, 2009, 01:26:27 AM »

I've been reading and lurking all day and I'm worn out big time.  Out of all the "talking heads" which appeared today, I did hear one fact of which I was not aware, and this has to do with the Death Penalty, which we all keep talking about.  The potential for a case to draw the death penalty must be formally requested or motioned with the court within 45 days of arraignment.  Otherwise, the maximum sentence is LWOP.  In this particular case, the death penalty was in place on a murder 1 arraignment; however, it was taken "off the table" with the plea bargain offer prior to the remains being found.  Apparently none of the prosecutors ever thought to re-file the motion or get it reinstated.  This attorney indicated that with the amount of time since arraignment, the death penalty cannot be re-introduced in this case.  I don't know if I understood this right or not, but if it is true it is a shame......no one ever deserved it more.

Oh dear.  I had not heard about this!

Do you know if the SAO originally announced they were seeking the death penalty?  Not that this is a valid source, but one poster at a blog I checked out said they have 45 days to reinstate the death penalty if it has previously been announced and withdrawn.

Anybody know the laws on this?  Or whether they originally announced they were seeking the DP?



I heard this too I think it was on JVM.
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