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Author Topic: Needs a History lesson - Obama warns of turning a 'crisis into a catastrophe'  (Read 6390 times)
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #20 on: February 09, 2009, 08:29:56 AM »

International Loan Sharks - rethinking the debt

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The prospect of the United States defaulting on its debt is not just likely. It's inevitable, and imminent.

The regulatory black holes into which sanity and reason disappear on a daily basis are soon to collapse under the mass of their sheer size. The circle jerk going on among G7 governments has to end – the steady advance of gold, even in the face of a managed price, exposes the real value of the U.S. dollar, as opposed to its apparent value expressed in the dollar index.

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Is 2009 the year that the United States formally defaults? And with that, will the dollar collapse be rolled back ten for one or more?

There are a lot of reasons to support that theory. To Wall Street economists, such an event is heresy and therefore unthinkable. Yet Wall Street is the very La-la-land that bred the idea of a perpetually indebted nation in the first place.

Number one among the indicators favoring this scenario is what is happening in the U.S. Treasuries auction market.

Last Thursday, an $30 billion auction in five-year notes failed to stir the interest of traditional primary dealers. The auction itself was saved by an anonymous “indirect” bid.

Buyers are discouraged by the prospect of what is expected to amount to $2 trillion total issuance for the full year of 2009. The further out the maturities on notes, the more bearish the sentiment towards them. The only way to entice buyers is through the increase in yields.

But with yields at 1.82 per cent, five-year notes were met with a demand for 1.98 times the amount offered - the lowest bid-to-cover ratio since September. A sell-off in treasuries began in earnest upon the conclusion of that auction.

Sounds like future generations of Americans will have to deal with loan shark type borrowing - always paying the juice, never paying the principle, someone will come and break your legs, and if you're lucky they'll just kill you.

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So what is the catalyzing event that will precipitate outright capitulation?

I think the spin-controlled version of events will make the collapse of the derivatives market the red herring that facilitates the aw-shucks-we-have-no-choice shoe-gazing moment possible, and that’s exactly the parachute the government needs to retain a veneer of credibility - at least in its own delusional mirror.


I think that is what they are going for...continued borrowing with no intention to EVER pay it back, some would call that STEALING. 

Credibility?  NOT

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The announcement that the CFTC was about to become the target of a regulatory overhaul supports this theory. Consistent with his unfortunate proclivity to hiring foxes to guard chickens, Barack Obama’s choice for CFTC commissioner Gary Gensler was the undersecretary of the U.S. Treasury when the Commodity Futures Modernization Act of 2000 was passed, and is one of its architects. This was the piece of legislation that was put forth to appease the opposition to “dark market” trading in certain OTC derivatives first noisily derided by CFTC commissioner Brooksley Born in 1998.

Ignoring Born’s admonishments with this act, it exempted credit default swaps (CDO’s) from regulation, resulting in the somewhere between 58 and 300 trillion dollars in value presently under threat if the positions were to be unwound. Because of their unregulated status, counterparties in the largest transactions can simply “roll forward” contracts, instead of the losing party in the transaction covering their loss with a transfer of money. It is this massive “nominal” value that could be the Achilles heel of what’s left of the U.S. banking system, and by extension, the U.S. dollar.

The banking system, the big banks at least are broken and beyond repair.  Why isn't the government focus on the banks that remail solvent?  Why aren't they focusing on rebuilding? 

All I see with this spending and bailouts are attempts to dig the hole deeper.  The hole that will take generations to recover from.  Some, will never recover from the collapse of the currency, loss of all their savings and wealth.  Attempt to ruin the wealth of a nation?  Yes, I suspect it is.

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Don’t think for a minute such drastic events are outside the realm of possibility. If somebody had told you in 1998 that a bunch of angry crazy pseudo-Muslims were going to fly jetliners into the World Trade Center, what would you have said?

http://seekingalpha.com/article/118103-u-s-debt-default-dollar-collapse-altogether-likely?source=article_sb_popular

Just my humble opinions.
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2009, 08:46:13 AM »

I watched the Obama speech last night and was disappointed.

Whatever happened to everyone being equal and having the same opportunities? 

Obama would limit the pay of Wall Street and bailout executives, those tired policies don't work.

What about the tired policies of the healthcare industry?  The doctors, lawyers, hospitals, and supply executives that make over $500,000/yr when Americans can't afford to pay for basic healthcare?

Anyone compare the salaries of these folks before the widespread impact of government programs and group insurance?  There was a time when even small communities could afford a decent hospital and care for everyone.  It wasn't fancy, but affordable.  What happened?  Takeover by a few large players and the draining of an economy, and no coverage for everyone?

Whatever happened to treating people with dignity and as individuals?  Why are the rich targets in the Obama speeches?  Are all the rich the same?  I'm sure there are some that are selfish and self-absorbed.  There are some that give freely of what the good Lord has given to them.  They continue to be individuals.

What of Willie Horton?  Does he represent all African Americans?  A symbol of what is best of that category of people?  John Wayne Gacy? 

Why doesn't Obama target the unemployed and poor and suggest they have more time on their hands to give, and should be volunteering 40-50 hours a week?  With so much to be done and all?

I keep reading about how African Americans and minorities are impacted by all this bad economic news and bad schools.  What happened to treating everyone the same?  What happened to the dreams of all races and ethic groups standing side by side?  Is this the new inclusion? 

Why not elevate the prospects of all poor people?  All students that are falling behind?

Obama conquered the nation in November, and now he divides the spoils to his special interests?  Divides the nation according to his world view?  Tired policies continue.

Are we individuals worthy of best?  Or just groups and categories in the grand scheme of the Obama vision of the future? 

Whatever happened to dreams?

jmho
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #22 on: February 10, 2009, 09:24:17 AM »

I feel as though some, have highjacked the best dream of others, for their own personal agenda.

It isn't about making a better world for everyone, it's about dictatorship, paternalism, and the best parts of slavery all rolled into one. 

imho
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nonesuche
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« Reply #23 on: February 10, 2009, 11:54:19 AM »

WhiskeyGirl, the honeymoon is definitely over and now our President is raising his voice to try to drive his agenda? The media was not giving him a break last night either.

If you run on a platform of transparency and change, then you cannot complain if your rhetoric and staff are not supporting that and questions are being asked, answers soon will be demanded.

It appears FOX NEWS is also involved in a new lawsuit against the new administration related to documentation related to the transparency promises?

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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #24 on: February 10, 2009, 05:57:46 PM »

Quote
February 10th, 2009 3:09 PM Eastern

No Stimulus Can Save Us From This Economy

By Richard Miller
Author, “In Words and Deeds: Battle Speeches in History”

As I write, the equity markets have already judged the Senate’s stimulus plan, and by extension, the bills put forth by the House and the White House as well. The Dow is down 360 points, here, the judgment of millions of people is substituted for a relative handful of party hacks, earmark addicts, a White House dimly viewing a situation it barely understands, and all the others who would spin on their behalf.

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Months ago, I declared in this space that we are deflating, and that there is little that our elected representatives can do about it. I repeat that assertion now. In the months since I first made that declaration, I have come to believe that inflation may follow but is probably several years off. I have also come to believe that understanding our current situation in terms of the past (recession/depression) is a trap. We are in a new state of economic affairs, one for which no name has yet been created.

Fight a war the politicians cannot win.

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The stimulus bill, insofar as it might have done something, will achieve less than nothing. The political establishment has forfeited its own political capital in plundering the capital of others. The Senate bill is a monument to Democratic Party fecklessness and Republican Party pusillanimity.

We elected them, and as I have also insisted in this space, it is ultimately our fault, and our grandchildren’s bill to pay.

Those big new words must equate to something simple, I'll have to look them up.

http://foxforum.blogs.foxnews.com/2009/02/10/miller_stimulus_economy/

jmho

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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #25 on: February 15, 2009, 08:24:19 PM »

Quote
Worst recession in 100 years?

GLOBAL TREND
BY MARTIN KHOR

Last week, a minister and close confidante of British premier Gordon Brown warned that the current recession is worse than the 1930s Great Depression, while the US Congress passed a US$787bil (RM2.83tril) stimulus package containing a strong protectionist element.

Quote
Speaking at a Labour Party conference, Balls said: “The reality is that this is becoming the most serious global recession for, I’m sure, over 100 years, as it will turn out.”

He warned that events worldwide were moving at a “speed, pace and ferocity which none of us have seen before” and banks were losing cash on a “scale that nobody believed possible”.

Quote
“I think this is a financial crisis more extreme and more serious than that of the 1930s, and we all remember how the politics of that era were shaped by the economy.”

Balls’ comments caused quite a lot of alarm because Brown had been trying to give the impression the government had things under control, even as bad news was emerging about big losses in banks, the latest being Lloyds.

There is speculation that Balls has inside information on how very bad the situation is, which the British government has not yet made known to the public.

Executive pay is a distraction in the bailout bill...these are scary times we live in.

http://thestar.com.my/columnists/story.asp?file=/2009/2/16/columnists/globaltrends/3275609&sec=globaltrends

mo
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2009, 08:04:41 PM »

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"This historic step won't be the end of what we do to turn our economy around, but rather the beginning," said Obama, who is expected to sign the bill tomorrow in Denver. "The problems that led us into this crisis are deep and widespread, and our response must be equal to the task."

What does that mean for those that are not highly educated?  A lifetime of welfare?

If becoming independent of oil imports in ten years is important, why do we continue to export jobs, and increase our trade imbalance?  Why not reduce as many imports as possible in ten years?

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Recovery to take3 time?? Try a few years. Save the auto industry? Their share of the market is under 50% and falling. What is to save? We have exported and squandered way too much of our wealth. People buying foreign goods and the need for foreign oil has drained trillions. Government refusal to develop atomic power and prevent development of our own oil keeping those trillions in our own economy are a major portion of the problem. Developing solar power andincreasing gas milege in our cars sounds good but will make no measurable difference for many years. It's a small thing but keeping 15 million illegas is a serious problem and NO ONE even wants to talk about it. Putting a trillion new paper dollars into the economy is a temporary small flush but can have no long term effect because that paper does not represent new wealth. The people voted for a promise to share the wealth but what wealth? Lots of lluck guys. I'm 80 and am not sure my eight figures will last till I die.
Gunut by gnnut February 16, 5:27 PM Report Abuse


Quote
Last week the Messiah said there would be a "catastrophe" if the bill wasn't passed right away. So the bill gets passed Friday night, and where is he? In Chicago. The bill signing will have to wait until Tuesday. In Denver. So much for the catastrophe. And is it really necessary for him to go to Denver? How many thousands of tons of greenhouse gases are going to be put into the atmosphere by that trip? Soon the Messiah will be running around screaming of the coming catastrophe of global warming. Like all leftists, of course, he'll make sure that the costs of the "fix" will be borne by others, not by him or his ilk. by yomamax February 16, 6:00 PM Report Abuse


http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2009/02/16/speedy_recovery_is_called_unlikely/
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LouiseVargas
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« Reply #27 on: February 16, 2009, 11:33:36 PM »

I just want to remind you, because you may have forgotten, that Obama inherited the terrible economic situation from GW Bush.
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #28 on: February 17, 2009, 07:43:07 AM »

I just want to remind you, because you may have forgotten, that Obama inherited the terrible economic situation from GW Bush.

The history lesson for Obama is that much of the problem is shared.  The deregulation seems to have started in the Reagan and Clinton eras.  The unsuccessful push for reform happened during Bush 43 and the Democratic controlled congress. 

So, I believe he inherited the unreformed mess from the Democratic Congress, of which he was a member.  Seems like Democrats had the opportunity to reform this along with Republicans.  IIRC, Barney Frank was against reform.  The problem didn't happen overnight. 

Also, another history lesson, Rahm Emanuel was part of Freddie/Fannie when the twins were red flagged all over the place for irregular accounting.  Some of our nations leading Democrats are among the top recipients of campaign contributions from the same Freddie/Fannie.

Seems to me that leading Democrats had to know that there were problems with Freddie/Fannie and Wall Street for years.  What is troubling is that they failed to make good efforts at reform - after all they controlled Congress during the latter half of the Bush 43 administration and could have worked with Republicans at reform.  Why?

How does it profit these Democrats to see the nation's financial and real estate business fail?  To continue to watch America's wealth and jobs go offshore through through the imbalance of trade that continues to grow?

While the nation is collapsing around us, the Obamas jet to Chicago for the weekend, Pelosi and others to Italy...

Obama, Emanuel, Frank, Pelosi and others...could have been part of the solution YEARS ago...

jmho
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #29 on: February 17, 2009, 08:05:24 AM »

I just want to remind you, because you may have forgotten, that Obama inherited the terrible economic situation from GW Bush.

Another way of looking at this...

Obama, Emanuel, Frank, Pelosi, and others helped create this tsuname of debt, an inheritance that will be passed down to many generations of Americans.  A debt so great, and growing, it will suck the life out of any future prosperity and opportunity for everyone (except those special interest groups).

Smart people raised many red flags for years...


With all the lawyers in Congress and government, I have to wonder why there isn't/wasn't a chorus of "The big company executives (Congress) knew for years that their were creating this public menace/fire trap/toxic cesspool and did nothing to protect Americans."  "My clients deserve trillions from those that have abused the public trust and ignored the welfare of millions."

Those that profited from this mess don't seem to be targets - Congress and the NEW president just keep throwing money at them.


imho
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #30 on: February 17, 2009, 08:06:37 AM »

What kind of history is Obama creating today?  A history of a Congress that votes FOR a bill they did not read?
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #31 on: February 17, 2009, 08:31:43 AM »

I think that long term history, void of political influence, will show the Bush administration in a much more favorable light.

In today's Obama speak, Bush wanted a reform bill for Fannie/Freddie and Congress let him down - including Emanuel, Obama, Frank, and Pelosi.  Was it partisan politics?  Ignorance?  Stupidity? 

Today, we are all reaping the rewards of the FAILURE of Congress to act on reforming the financial sectors.

What rewards will we reap from the 'success' of the 'stimulus' bill Obama is expected to sign today?  Ignorance?  Stupidity?

It seems like giant carpet bagger corporations control our nation's best interest through the rally cry of "free trade".  The cost to Americans?  Increasing taxes for jobless benefits, healthcare, increasing job losses, and just living on imports on a daily basis.

If it's in the best interest of the nation to be free of imported oil in ten years, why not be free of as many imported goods and services to?

imho

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nonesuche
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« Reply #32 on: February 17, 2009, 09:17:32 AM »

I just want to remind you, because you may have forgotten, that Obama inherited the terrible economic situation from GW Bush.

Just as Jimmy Carter created much of the issues in the middle east that resulted in 9/11. So we can lay the cost of the Iraq war at his and the Democrat's feet should we choose to? Obama has just driven through the largest appropriations bill ever, not a stimulus bill but pure appropriations. Just another nail in our coffin thanks to Nancy Pelosi and friends.

As Obama signs his fine bill today we will need to seek a TRILLION dollars in new debt from other countries, used to we could borrow from Japan Louise, but as of this week Japan's economy is contracting at a rate of 12%. Some analysts are clearly stating Japan is in a depression now. There isn't even clarity on who we'll borrow this trillion from?????

Look at the DOW today as Obama flies all the way to Colorado to sign this irresponsible bill. Why should we pay for Air Force One's cost for him to sign it anywhere but DC?





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caesu
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« Reply #33 on: February 17, 2009, 10:43:38 AM »

indeed no borrowing anymore from Japan.

more borrowing from China and especially the Middle-East.
because they've got the money from when the oil prices were sky high.
but they are going to set conditions, like banning islam-critical politicians from travelling...

better get independent from Middle-East oil ASAP and learn to conserve energy.
maybe the Kyoto protocols are a good idea now.
i hope Obama is going to sign up on this soon.
of course with massive protests from the oil-lobby.

but then remember that next time there won't be money to borrow from the Middle-East.
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« Reply #34 on: February 17, 2009, 06:47:37 PM »

caesu, yes all reasons why we should be borrowing as little capital debt as possible.

Did you hear about this new auto? www.aptera.com

Amazing, it was developed without government subsidy.......yet GM and Chyrsler want another 20+ Billion ???????????????????

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caesu
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« Reply #35 on: February 17, 2009, 08:12:47 PM »

too big to fail is too big to exist i heard someone say.

now these companies can hold a country hostage because failing would be a disaster.
and all competition is gone, because the other 2 car companies are going to want more money too.

maybe nationalize them. then break them up in dozens of smaller car companies.
and then let them compete with eachother. some of them will fail.
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WhiskeyGirl
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« Reply #36 on: February 17, 2009, 09:13:26 PM »

caesu, yes all reasons why we should be borrowing as little capital debt as possible.

Did you hear about this new auto? www.aptera.com

Amazing, it was developed without government subsidy.......yet GM and Chyrsler want another 20+ Billion ???????????????????

If a little person can make and market a new concept car, what's wrong with Detroit?  Maybe they didn't offshore soon enough?  I read an article that they pay people in Mexico like $6 a day and they have laid off many and idled plants.  At $6 a day, they still struggle?

There are also some Asian transplants that manage to make money on about half of what Detroit pays, and I wonder why Detroit has so many problems.

I always wondered why they didn't join the corporate slogan of the month club.  There was one I always liked "continuous improvement".   Many of the other slogans didn't really have much sticking power - no real investment by management.

Imagine what life would be like if those big dinovees got like 100/mpg or were completely electric?  They sold so many and the focus was on luxury and not improving the MPG or powerplant.

Where are the customers?  If they aren't selling enough to stay in business, how many cars will they need to continue building?  How many lots can they fill up with cars that aren't selling?  Which welfare is cheaper? 

Why not invest in the newcomer?  Build some power stations and plug-in capable parking lots.

There is no money tree.  Cash is king in a depression.  Debt is a noose that prevents and strangles recovery.

imho
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It doesn't do any good to hate anyone,
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