Re: Natalee Case Discussion #788 12/31/08 -
« Reply #361 on: December 31, 2008, 06:00:38 PM »
Caps first post on the front page of SM from an Aruban IP:
Quote
CapslockWizard wrote:
ok, I have read all your comments and I was wondering…. If the boddy can not be found is because it is put where nobody should look for…
Wel the only answer that I can come up with is a cemetary among all the other deads in Aruba… but the question is which one.
I aruba when someone day they do not usually put their dead in the ground but in something called a Kelder… A Kelder is like a small place made form stone where the families will burried their loveones. Most of them are sealed but you can find one that is open and put a body in one and seal it with only 5 cement block and a coat of paint and no one will ever look there. becuase it is the cemetary.
So Nathally must be in a cemetary and thats why it can not be found and thats my logic.
Dec 20, 11:08 PM
A post a few days later from a different Aruban IP:
Quote
Capslockwizard wrote:
This is my analysis about the disappearing and the events on that day. There are two possible scenarios that will fit a logic question.
The Logic question is “Where would I hide a body so that nobody will find it and at the same time lose my shoes?”
Tools I have used are:
1. Goolge Earth with Aruba MAP and area location to pin possible scenarios.
2. Time Line Event of the case.
3. My logic and Strategic thinking on solving problems.
4. Ttime line from the website
http://members.aol.com/worldJOURNIER/NATALEE/NATALEEtimeline.htmlI believe there is a fundamental flaw the way the authorities see the case.
If the Investigators cannot find Nathalie is because they are searching and looking in the wrong places or they must know but would not come forward.
If you ask yourself this question: “Where would I hide a body so that nobody will find it and at the same time lose my shoes?”
The answers are a lot of places can be used, but for a logic thinker there is only one answer.
And form all the articles that I have read, nobody have suggested and even mention this place.
TEST LOGIG SENARIO 1:
In Aruba in when someone dies, they can be put to rest in two ways.
1. In the grounds. But this procedure has stop due to not enough cemetery.
2. In a Kelder. A Kelder is a place above ground with 4 or 6 rooms constructed out of brick and mortar inside a Cemetery. These Kelders belong to a Family and they buy these plots form the church in the cemetery and build the Kelders on it and leave it open for when the moment arrived you have a place to rest.
Both types of method funerals will take place only in a CEMETARY.
There are several (7) CEMETARY in Aruba and most of them have KELDERS and a lot are left OPEN for when he or she dies will be buried close in the Family plot. From those seven, three is close from my analysis and from those 3, the one in Noord is to visible and no high walls. The one in Ponton/ Oranjestad is in public site from the front but from the back it has possibilities. The one in Paradera has most likely and it has a wall but anybody with a pickup or can climb easy over the wall second it is no visible from public site.
The reason that no one can find her is that she must be among all the dead in the cemetery and who is going to search a cemetery for a body where there is already a lot of body in the place.
You will never find an open grave in the ground because when someone dies in Aruba and need to be buried in the ground, the Funeral home in charge of the body will give orders to dig a grave for this person in a district in accordance with the family wishes.
To dig a grave 6 feet deep and wide enough for a body will take a lot of time by hand. Beside the ground will look disturb by the cemetery keeper. So I believe that these 4 perps would not have the time to dig a grave.
But
If you have a dead body on your hand and you need to hide it fast, the only way is to put it in an open Kelder and with only five to 6 bricks and and a bucket of cement and you are done. And if you want to make it look professional, can even give it a coat of paint color white which is the mostly use.
This last process is very easy done with 3 or 4 person.
a. Move dead body to a cemetery,
b. Cemetery door closed, then jump the fence with the body.
c. Inside the cemetery look for an open Kelder or break one open.
d. Put body in it
e. Go and get 6 pieces of bricks or use bricks that are in the cemetery already.
f. Make cement in a bucket
g. Use the bricks to close the small walls of the Kelder.
h. Paint the wall
And you are done.
The flaws with this logic are that it do not account for a missing shoe.
And so this cannot be complete true and do not compute. But possible
TEST LOGIG SENARIO 2:
1. Normaly if one want to have sex in Aruba that comes from the clubs go to a place call WHITEHOUSE and not the LIGHTHOUSE and they sound almost identical (Here I think ether the Investigator hear it wrong and JoraN and K2 continue with the kakamenia storie about the LightHouse or it was plan-out between them.) The Whitehouse is an apartment Complex where one drive in with the car into an Apartment with automatic garage doors attached. One in the garage you are also in the apartment. These apartments are for some to go and have sex in and one pay 50.00 for a couple of hours use. If foul play was committed in one of these rooms or if she was overdosed in one of these rooms, nobody will see or hear. Add checkout time you just hop in your car in the garage and drive out to the gate and no one will notice anything as she could be asleep in the back seat. Now you have a dead body that you have to get rid of in your car… you could not bring a dead body to a hotel… you have to get rid of it…and here is my view of what next move will be.
2. The next move is to look for a place to dump the body and here is where the missing shoes come to play and also the story that they were driving around statement comes to play a role). It is dark, almost 3:00 am and in Aruba there are several murky water reservoirs that can be used to dump the body (see Google Earth – Aruba) in it and she would be gone. But the question is which one? Well looking at the map you can see that from the Whitehouse Building there several c that can be used and there is one behind the Whitehouse building. Once first instinct is to dump the body there since it is closely when you exit the Whitehouse building. Now here is where it gets interesting depending how many people you have to help you carry the body to the murky pool. And not knowing that the closer you get to one of these murky pools, your feet will sink into this thick mud and when you try to pull your feet out, it will not come out because the mud has a suction that seals around the plastic of the sneakers and the only way out is to pull your feet out of the sneakers and leave the sneakers behind.
Also when you are in a hurry to get rid of the body you will not think to go get your sneakers and it is dark in that area. And I believe that that’s why Joram was without a sneaker. Now there is still a question not answer, Was Joran alone or did he got help? Knowing what we know from all that has been written about the case and blog out there. We know that the Kalpoes came to help. I do believe that Joran is stronger and weight more and that he Dump the body in one of these reservoirs and that’s why he lost his shoes. Now Joran is bear feet walking? From where was he coming from?. One thing is sure he was going to papa and mama. But what happened to the helpers? Why they did not drive Joran home. Or was it that Joran acted alone and called the Kalpoes after all what has happened to him.
3. Other scenarios about putting the body in a crypt I do believe that this was done after they arrested the 2 black men that was blamed for the crime that they did not commit.
4. Here is where the Father with help of …????…..(to be filled in ) went back and make sure that the body will disappears forever. How? Depends on the two scenarios. A) if the body is in the murky water and in the mud they would try to get it back and buried it in a cemetery among the death and that will be a difficult task to open all the graves in Aruba. B) to make sure the body is deep in the murky water with the shoes of Joran so that it will not be found.
The Fathers logic thinking would be like this. Now nobody will find her because we hide it so well, nobody is going to look in a cemetery or in the Murky Waters of Aruba and if you are going to search where to begin and with time the longer the body stays in the mud, the deeper it will sink and these are fresh water reservoirs and not salt water and the body will not come up never. As for the cemetery theory, it will be difficult to search without disturbing the graves. and another drawback is that you need permission of the families to open all the Kelders.
My Review:
With Google Earth I was able to pinpoint the possible location where one can lose a shoe in the mud and also how far it is from the Whitehouse Location and keeping an eye on the time to do the job.
The story about dumping the body on the beach cannot be done because you have already a dead body on your hand and you can do that. The chance to be seen with a dead body to high and risky.
Finding someone to dump it in the ocean means more people involved and the chance to be snitch on will increase and the chance to be seen by the coast guard is high. Also body will float back if not tied down in on the bottom floor of the sea.. This requires a more depth knowledge of buoyancy and understanding of the ocean currents of Aruba and knowing that when the wind turn even sunken boats come back to shore. No this does not compute either.
Conclusion:
the only way the body can be found is to search for the shoes round the edges for the murky pools in Aruba and when the sneaker is found, the body will be there also.
The reason they got away is that there is not a body to link the crime to.
The Father of Joran stated clearly that if there is NOT A BODY there will be NO CASE.
So to make the above statement true, the perps must have make sure that the body cannot be found, but they forgot one thing, a Body will be decompose slowly in mud and it will be found with time. Ask Aruba to search the edged of all these murky water reservoirs and where you find the sneakers you will find the body
Its is like the OJ case “The Glove does not Fit then you must quit the case” but in this case we have a missing link that is the shoes of Joran V/D Sloot.
Please review and Let me know what you bloggers think of this
Best Regards
Casplockwizard@hotmail.comDec 23, 7:44 PM
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=4328.msg605914
