Natalee Case Discussion #802 2/21/09 - 2/25/09

[Anna]

Lifesong - that Earnings call IS fascinating!!!!

The lies being told are just mind boggling, in light of what we all now know of what was really going on.

Notice no mention in that call of their "humanitarian" effort that was just getting underway in Aruba?  

I looked for the Q2 call transcripts but haven't found them yet...

...and...

I don't see how Trahan makes that quote "We can't stop...etc."  - he wasn't even there after 12/30 according to Kyle!  Doesn't make any sense at all.

If the date on that quote is correct - he made it on Christmas Eve 2007 - just hours before they located the trap, according to Kyle.

ANY company that is in a money crunch is NOT going to commit their valuable resources to a "humanitarian" cause. Even if Schaefer was "donating" his personal money -- his equipment and crew during that period is not out making the company money!

With stockholders, it isn't even their to donate but would belong to the stockholders whose interest should be considered first.  I would think that is the way it works anyway.

Which is precisely why the stockholders are screaming!

And the SEC is issuing statements.  And I don't mean about football in this instance.  Normally, I would when referring to the only good conference in that sport.

 

[Anna]

Case 6:08-cv-00400
Document 1
Filed 03/25/2008
Page 1 of 24
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
WESTERN DISTRICT OF LOUISIANA
ELLEN BRODSKY, Individually and on
)
Behalf of All Others Similarly Situated,
)
Plaintiff,
)
vs.
)
SUPERIOR OFFSHORE INTERNATIONAL,
INC., LOUIS E. SCHAEFER, JR., JAMES J.
MERMIS, PATRICE CHEMIN, ROGER D.
BURKS, R. JOSHUA KOCH, JR., E.
DONALD TERRY, LEON CODRON,
THOMAS B. COLEMAN, JAMES L.
PERSKY, ERIC N. SMITH, MERRILL
LYNCH, PIERCE, FENNER & SMITH
INCORPORATED and J.P. MORGAN
SECURITIES INC.,
Defendants.
Civil Action No.
CLASS ACTION
DEMAND FOR JURY TRIAL
COMPLAINT FOR VIOLATION OF THE FEDERAL SECURITIES LAWS

BUMP

[jen3560]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

[jen3560]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

On the flip side.......

If the Aruban divers' view was NOT obscured, and if they did NOT surface when Trahan did....

Then WHY did they say "it's not case related" - yet, come back to collect items from it 8 days later?

Without the forensic dive team.

Without any divers from Persistence.

[Lifesong]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

There's an awful lot about that day that we don't know yet, imo.

I woke up thinking about the quote from Tim Miller on Greta Van Sustern's FoxNews show, On The Record on 2/26/08:

"Tim:  The report we got is the DNA that came back did not match Natalee's DNA..."

I'm still holding out hope that maybe, just maybe, they did grab a sample on the 30th and the two Tims took off to get that to the FBI labs here at home, and then Tim Miller went to Costa Rica.

Is that even still plausible?

[Anna]

Great find KTF

BUMP

[Anna]

Note the timing and also that this is not the global stock decline suffered by most all companies recently but is prior to that and would seem related to insider activities.

[Anna]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

There's an awful lot about that day that we don't know yet, imo.

I woke up thinking about the quote from Tim Miller on Greta Van Sustern's FoxNews show, On The Record on 2/26/08:

"Tim:  The report we got is the DNA that came back did not match Natalee's DNA..."

I'm still holding out hope that maybe, just maybe, they did grab a sample on the 30th and the two Tims took off to get that to the FBI labs here at home, and then Tim Miller went to Costa Rica.

Is that even still plausible?

Lifesong,
I don't know but we were led to believe that no one actually entered the trap on that first dive, just looked.

[jen3560]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

There's an awful lot about that day that we don't know yet, imo.

I woke up thinking about the quote from Tim Miller on Greta Van Sustern's FoxNews show, On The Record on 2/26/08:

"Tim:  The report we got is the DNA that came back did not match Natalee's DNA..."

I'm still holding out hope that maybe, just maybe, they did grab a sample on the 30th and the two Tims took off to get that to the FBI labs here at home, and then Tim Miller went to Costa Rica.

Is that even still plausible?

I really don't think so - and this is why.

When Beth was made aware of the full scope of things last September, she "needs time to digest it" and wanted to "share it with someone I trust".

That tells me the FBI never shared anything with her about DNA - positive or negative.

This was all news to her, and she was disturbed by it.

According to Kyle - the FBI said there were human remains in that cage.

I would have to presume that means the FBI did an analysis of the footage Kyle sent to them from the Dec 29th ROV dive, and came to that conclusion.

According to Kyle, there was nothing in the FBI report (that Mos read from in his presser) about DNA.

[jen3560]

oceanexploration posts:

Reply #743 on: March 18, 2008, 12:30:41 PM

Your frustration mirrors my own.  It's unanimous that Tim M. should never have told Dave and Beth anything about the trap until it's contents were forensically examined. 

After the diver visual inspection of the trap he was obligated to report what the Aruban divers reported because although limited, it's the only information he had and the family rightfully wanted answers.  It was a royal mess.  I took a lot of heat for telling Tim Miller anything about the trap that may have prompted him to making the calls to the family.  In my defence, I specifically told Tim not to tell anyone about the trap until the contents are analysed.  He couldn't wait.  He was very emotional, hopeful, and confident.  It was a crushing time for all. Most of all- for Tim Miller, Dave, and Beth.  This was Dec 30th
http://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366324#msg366324


Reply #794 on: March 18, 2008, 03:04:38 PM The "99.9%" came independantly from Tim Miller to Dave H. on Dec 29th, prior to the diver visual inspection of the trap.   I can't imagine what that must have felt like to be told and then completely retracted the next day.  I couldn't believe the information was prematurely leaked to the family before we knew what we were looking at.  My heart broke for Dave and Beth.

Personally, I fed off of Tim's inflated confidence and my own on the night of Dec 29th.  I did not sleep. Few of us did. The only person able to remain completely objective, much to his credit, was John Silvetti.  In hindsight, I am in awe of him for his wisdom(from past hard experiences) and strength. At the time, I thought he was nuts for not siding with the rest of us after the first dive. It was a crushing dissapointment the evening of Dec 30th, but not over.  The tactile inspection dive was coming. Dec 30th, 2007 will forever stand in my mind as one of the hardest single days of my lifehttp://scaredmonkeys.net/index.php?topic=2705.msg366386#msg366386

[Lifesong]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

There's an awful lot about that day that we don't know yet, imo.

I woke up thinking about the quote from Tim Miller on Greta Van Sustern's FoxNews show, On The Record on 2/26/08:

"Tim:  The report we got is the DNA that came back did not match Natalee's DNA..."

I'm still holding out hope that maybe, just maybe, they did grab a sample on the 30th and the two Tims took off to get that to the FBI labs here at home, and then Tim Miller went to Costa Rica.

Is that even still plausible?

I really don't think so - and this is why.

When Beth was made aware of the full scope of things last September, she "needs time to digest it" and wanted to "share it with someone I trust".

That tells me the FBI never shared anything with her about DNA - positive or negative.

This was all news to her, and she was disturbed by it.

According to Kyle - the FBI said there were human remains in that cage.

I would have to presume that means the FBI did an analysis of the footage Kyle sent to them from the Dec 29th ROV dive, and came to that conclusion.

According to Kyle, there was nothing in the FBI report (that Mos read from in his presser) about DNA.

See...that's what I thought.

Doesn't make sense that Tim is talking about DNA.  I just can't figure that out.

[klaasend]

O/T

http://www.fox30online.com/news/local/story/Plane-Crash-in-Amsterdam/1ls8otBGFEKDIohF1pLi7Q.cspx

Plane Crash in Amsterdam

Last Update: 8:41 am 

Print Story | Email Story     

 AMSTERDAM (AP) - A local mayor says 9 people have been killed in the crash of a Turkish Airlines plane in Amsterdam, Netherlands.

Officials say another 50 people were hurt when the plane crashed while attempting to land and broke into three pieces. There appears to have been no fire.

A Dutch reporter says the plane apeared to fall a couple of miles short of the runway of Amsterdam's main airport. The plane crashed in a field.

Turkish Airlines officials earlier said no one was killed among the 134 people aboard the plane, a Boeing 737-800.

There was no immediate word on what caused the crash, which happened in slightly misty weather with little wind.

 

[jen3560]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

There's an awful lot about that day that we don't know yet, imo.

I woke up thinking about the quote from Tim Miller on Greta Van Sustern's FoxNews show, On The Record on 2/26/08:

"Tim:  The report we got is the DNA that came back did not match Natalee's DNA..."

I'm still holding out hope that maybe, just maybe, they did grab a sample on the 30th and the two Tims took off to get that to the FBI labs here at home, and then Tim Miller went to Costa Rica.

Is that even still plausible?

I really don't think so - and this is why.

When Beth was made aware of the full scope of things last September, she "needs time to digest it" and wanted to "share it with someone I trust".

That tells me the FBI never shared anything with her about DNA - positive or negative.

This was all news to her, and she was disturbed by it.

According to Kyle - the FBI said there were human remains in that cage.

I would have to presume that means the FBI did an analysis of the footage Kyle sent to them from the Dec 29th ROV dive, and came to that conclusion.

According to Kyle, there was nothing in the FBI report (that Mos read from in his presser) about DNA.

See...that's what I thought.

Doesn't make sense that Tim is talking about DNA.  I just can't figure that out.

I can't either.  It would be helpful if we knew who told that to Tim.

[johan555]

O/T

http://www.fox30online.com/news/local/story/Plane-Crash-in-Amsterdam/1ls8otBGFEKDIohF1pLi7Q.cspx

Plane Crash in Amsterdam

Last Update: 8:41 am 

Print Story | Email Story     

 AMSTERDAM (AP) - A local mayor says 9 people have been killed in the crash of a Turkish Airlines plane in Amsterdam, Netherlands.

Officials say another 50 people were hurt when the plane crashed while attempting to land and broke into three pieces. There appears to have been no fire.

A Dutch reporter says the plane apeared to fall a couple of miles short of the runway of Amsterdam's main airport. The plane crashed in a field.

Turkish Airlines officials earlier said no one was killed among the 134 people aboard the plane, a Boeing 737-800.

There was no immediate word on what caused the crash, which happened in slightly misty weather with little wind.

 

[Lifesong]

I just know I will never believe that after all the excitement on that ship over the trap, and everyone knowing that Tim Miller had called Dave, there is no way in hell they dove on it only once and for less than a minute on Dec. 30th to get a visual.


 

[caesu]

Small scale no excuse for
corruption, says Bijleveld

THE HAGUE--The small scale of the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba is no excuse for corruption or lack of transparency. Members of government on the islands have a great responsibility in the area of good governance, legal security and safeguarding of fundamental human rights and freedom.

Dutch State Secretary of Kingdom Relations Ank Bijleveld-Schouten minced no words about it: Governments in the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba are not functioning well in a number of areas.

She sent a seven-page letter to the Second Chamber on Monday regarding the condition of the administrations in the Netherlands Antilles and Aruba. The Dutch Parliament had asked for this update in June 2008 in an effort to determine whether the islands could comply with the conditions of constitutional reform.

In the letter to the Second Chamber, the State Secretary substantiated her concerns about the current administrations on the islands. She focused on the weaknesses of small scale that can become even more prominent in the future countries Curaçao and St. Maarten, and explained what measures she was taking to contribute to a better quality of government and to contain corruption.

Several investigations and cases on the islands have confirmed that there are weak spots in the administrations. Bijleveld-Schouten specifically mentioned the fraud at the St. Maarten Immigration Service involving Police Chief Commissioner Derrick Holiday and Commissioner Louie Laveist, who is being prosecuted for corruption and fraud.

Corruption cases are being tackled, but only with major input from the Netherlands in the form of deploying judges, prosecutors, and through the Royal Marechaussees and the Kingdom Detective Cooperation Team RST.

Members of government also have a responsibility, said Bijleveld-Schouten, noting that this group should take a more pro-active role to prevent an appearance of a conflict of interest situation or lack of transparency that could cast a shadow on government’s integrity.

She mentioned “the St. Maarten Commissioner who with her husband was involved in a foundation that received subsidy from a government-owned company. The company resorted under the Commissioner and her husband was a member of the board.”

Members of government lead by example in what they say and what they do. If they don’t set the right example, they can’t expect their civil servants to have integrity, said the State Secretary.

The small scale aspect of islands and the fact that it concerns relatively young democracies is no excuse for corruption or lack of transparency in government. “That is why improvement of the quality of the administrations and the tackling of corruption are priorities in my policy,” said Bijleveld-Schouten.

She has a three-prong approach: by setting conditions in the constitutional process, by giving support, and by reminding members of government of their responsibilities. If she suspects wrongdoing on the part of the latter group, she informs the local Prosecutor’s Office.

http://www.thedailyherald.com/news/daily/l238/corruptl238.html

[Magnolia]

In addition to the very good points made regarding Tim Trahan and running out of air....

Does that also not lead to the questions:

What about the Aruban divers that were there?

Did they surface the same time as Trahan?

Was their view also limited by the large skate?

If yes - then WHY would Aruba have been so dead set in their stance of "it's not case related"?

And WHY would John Silvetti have bought into that - hook, line, and sinker?

How could ANYONE have known by an admittedly visually obscured, brief dive?

And yet - that's precisely what Aruba and Silvetti did.  Move on, nothing to see here folks.

There's an awful lot about that day that we don't know yet, imo.

I woke up thinking about the quote from Tim Miller on Greta Van Sustern's FoxNews show, On The Record on 2/26/08:

"Tim:  The report we got is the DNA that came back did not match Natalee's DNA..."

I'm still holding out hope that maybe, just maybe, they did grab a sample on the 30th and the two Tims took off to get that to the FBI labs here at home, and then Tim Miller went to Costa Rica.

Is that even still plausible?

I really don't think so - and this is why.

When Beth was made aware of the full scope of things last September, she "needs time to digest it" and wanted to "share it with someone I trust".

That tells me the FBI never shared anything with her about DNA - positive or negative.

This was all news to her, and she was disturbed by it.

According to Kyle - the FBI said there were human remains in that cage.

I would have to presume that means the FBI did an analysis of the footage Kyle sent to them from the Dec 29th ROV dive, and came to that conclusion.

According to Kyle, there was nothing in the FBI report (that Mos read from in his presser) about DNA.

See...that's what I thought.

Doesn't make sense that Tim is talking about DNA.  I just can't figure that out.

I can't either.  It would be helpful if we knew who told that to Tim.

I don't think anybody told Tim that there was DNA.  I heard him say it... and I think he
mis-spoke.  I think he meant to say remains.

[jen3560]

I just know I will never believe that after all the excitement on that ship over the trap, and everyone knowing that Tim Miller had called Dave, there is no way in hell they dove on it only once and for less than a minute on Dec. 30th to get a visual.


 

I agree!!!!!

Silvetti mentioned "several dives" Underwater Expeditions did with Aruban divers for inspection and collection of samples.

I just don't think any human remains were ever sent to the FBI.

[jen3560]

I don't think anybody told Tim that there was DNA.  I heard him say it... and I think he
mis-spoke.  I think he meant to say remains.

That's a very good possibility Magnolia.

Was he referring to the fabric, while thinking remains.........and it came out DNA?

Definitely a possibility.

[Magnolia]

I don't think anybody told Tim that there was DNA.  I heard him say it... and I think he
mis-spoke.  I think he meant to say remains.

That's a very good possibility Magnolia.

Was he referring to the fabric, while thinking remains.........and it came out DNA?

Definitely a possibility.

Yes!  DNA had not been mentioned before.  It was obvious confusion on Tim's part.
Confusion that is understandable.
At that point all that had been talked about was the fabric, I think.